COVID-19 vaccine discussion

My nearly 13 year old son got his first dose today. There haven’t been any side effects yet, but he did say it hurt more and his arm is more sore than after a flu shot.

1 minute ago, Hate said:

My nearly 13 year old son got his first dose today. There haven’t been any side effects yet, but he did say it hurt more and his arm is more sore than after a flu shot.

How's his cell reception?

45 minutes ago, hornmpa96 said:

So, how worried do I need to be about Delta?

Entire family is vaccinated and my vaccinated 80 year old FIL cancer survivor lives with us. Prior to this latest flare up, we had returned to normal as I was going back to the office most days, having lunches and dinners with clients and colleagues and not wearing a mask anywhere.

I’m starting to worry that I need to shut things back down again. I’ve started masking up in common spaces at the office and will go back to only getting groceries via curbside. Eating at restaurants is likely out as well.

What’s the latest in breakthrough infections in the not so healthy elderly?

My wife is a cancer survivor and, as a result, has a weakened immune system from chemo.  It's better than it once was, but it's still a concern.  Combine that with age (in your FIL's case), and if I were in your shoes, I'd do what you're doing, i.e., masks, curbside, takeout over dine in.  Basically, what we did before the vaccine.  In my case, because she is younger and nearly seven years cancer free, we are just wearing masks in crowded indoor settings and avoiding really crowded settings like concerts.  I have a mother in assisted living, who is vaccinated, which also encourages these slight precautions on our parts.  But when it comes to being around other people who I know are vaccinated, I don't bother masking up at this point.  But with school starting, I'm going to encourage my vaccinated kids to mask up for the short term.  Unlike a lot of adults I have encountered, they're unlikely to care about having to do it, particularly if it means that they don't have to quarantine for two weeks if they test positive like we had to last December. 

Edited August 3, 2021 by dcbc

43 minutes ago, hornmpa96 said:

So, how worried do I need to be about Delta?

Entire family is vaccinated and my vaccinated 80 year old FIL cancer survivor lives with us. Prior to this latest flare up, we had returned to normal as I was going back to the office most days, having lunches and dinners with clients and colleagues and not wearing a mask anywhere.

I’m starting to worry that I need to shut things back down again. I’ve started masking up in common spaces at the office and will go back to only getting groceries via curbside. Eating at restaurants is likely out as well.

What’s the latest in breakthrough infections in the not so healthy elderly?

I think that's a definite personal choice.  NO one is going to begrudge you for shutting things down while delta rages to protect your FIL.  

15 minutes ago, Hate said:

My nearly 13 year old son got his first dose today. There haven’t been any side effects yet, but he did say it hurt more and his arm is more sore than after a flu shot.

My 12 year old never had any side effect other than a sore arm.  My 15 year old, who already has had COVID (late last year) was knocked down for the count for a few days, but otherwise was fine.

2 minutes ago, midtown said:

I think that's a definite personal choice.  NO one is going to begrudge you for shutting things down while delta rages to protect your FIL.  

and if they do, fuck 'em

2 minutes ago, JesusSweatDuck said:

and if they do, fuck 'em

But wear a mask, among other things, as you do so.

 
He means well but he just doesn't know any better. Slorch is full of terrible ideas that he mistakes as wisdom but he is genuine when he is attempting to impart the wisdom of Slorch. Like a toddler offering you a mushy cookie that has already been chewed on.
 
 
 

Look, we need Slorch. If for no other reason than to have the embodiment of what NOT to be like serve as a concrete example - “Son, read this thread slowly, and promise me you’ll never think or speak like that!”

5 hours ago, Captainant said:

Lol so you think that masks are only for performative purposes and have nothing to do with literally blocking the spread of virus containing droplets? 

SLORCH'D

Are you telling me that the way people wear the mask in public make you feel safe? Because I don’t feel safer. Not even remotely close… Whether it's the chinstrap, the mouth breather, the nose angler, whatever...  you witness all sorts of iterations besides the proper way to wear the masks.

now, do you want to talk about cleanliness  and sanitizing things and I will agree 100%. Throw in social distancing, yup, it helps. The masks, as currently implemented,  are a waste of fucking time.

Edited August 3, 2021 by slorch

10 minutes ago, dcbc said:

But wear a mask, among other things, as you do so.

Gov Cuomo? Is that you?

https://babylonbee.com/news/experts-warn-of-new-cuomo-variant-that-is-dangerous-to-young-women-fatal-to-elderly

Just now, JesusSweatDuck said:

Gov Cuomo? Is that you?

https://babylonbee.com/news/experts-warn-of-new-cuomo-variant-that-is-dangerous-to-young-women-fatal-to-elderly

Er, huh, no.

Man I wish we had more of an ETA on <12 vax.  My kids start kindergarten this year and I'm worried.  

26 minutes ago, Post Oak said:

Man I wish we had more of an ETA on <12 vax.  My kids start kindergarten this year and I'm worried.  

Why? Your kids will be fine

3 hours ago, JesusSweatDuck said:

Wait, this is happening?

 

He's also promoting Scott Gottlieb's book.

 

Also below... ignore that Derrick Booze mo-ron

 

 

 

Edited August 3, 2021 by texasdago

58 minutes ago, Post Oak said:

Man I wish we had more of an ETA on <12 vax.  My kids start kindergarten this year and I'm worried.  

I'd wager Nov/Dec timeframe.

Vinay has some interesting ideas. He’s a carrot more than a stick guy. 

• Tie vaccination to binding legislation that we can never reinstitute restrictions again. Pass a bill that says if 70% of the population gets vaccinated, governments cannot institute mask mandates for a 5-year period or businesses cannot be closed if local vaccination rates exceed 75%. Pick the percentages, and times, and make it binding. It's worth the risk of losing one tool, and like all agreements, renegotiation may be possible if needed.
• Last call for vaccines. Announce that at the end of the month we are going to ship all the vaccines to India, Brazil, and Argentina, and make good on that promise. If you don't get it now, you can never get it. A deadline can be a powerful incentive.
   

22 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

Vinay has some interesting ideas. He’s a carrot more than a stick guy. 

• Tie vaccination to binding legislation that we can never reinstitute restrictions again. Pass a bill that says if 70% of the population gets vaccinated, governments cannot institute mask mandates for a 5-year period or businesses cannot be closed if local vaccination rates exceed 75%. Pick the percentages, and times, and make it binding. It's worth the risk of losing one tool, and like all agreements, renegotiation may be possible if needed.
• Last call for vaccines. Announce that at the end of the month we are going to ship all the vaccines to India, Brazil, and Argentina, and make good on that promise. If you don't get it now, you can never get it. A deadline can be a powerful incentive.
   

For the first item on agreeing to no mask mandates if a certain % get vaccinated, why would we agree to that. Imagine a new variant with a very high death rate pops up and the vaccine is ineffective, we would just shrug our shoulders in regards to masks. "Oh well, we agreed to no mask mandate so many of you will just die. Sorry that we made a bad deal."

Besides most of us are in Texas. Abbott has decided to go the other direction by outlawing mandates.

For the second, it would be a complete bluff especially in a soon-to-be world of booster shots. Besides our health care ethics doesn't put ultimatums on people. This guy's a doctor?

Yeah, those suggestions seem really dumb. 

Vinay has some interesting ideas. He’s a carrot more than a stick guy. 

• Tie vaccination to binding legislation that we can never reinstitute restrictions again. Pass a bill that says if 70% of the population gets vaccinated, governments cannot institute mask mandates for a 5-year period or businesses cannot be closed if local vaccination rates exceed 75%. Pick the percentages, and times, and make it binding. It's worth the risk of losing one tool, and like all agreements, renegotiation may be possible if needed.
• Last call for vaccines. Announce that at the end of the month we are going to ship all the vaccines to India, Brazil, and Argentina, and make good on that promise. If you don't get it now, you can never get it. A deadline can be a powerful incentive.
   

Stahp GR

From the weekly Texas DSHS Covid task force call a friend sits in on…Texas cases up 95% compared to 64% nationwide. Pfizer said September is the vaccine release target for ages 5-11.

Honestly, just give a $2000 tax credit to everyone vaccinated in a household. Dad’s will be carpooling their kids to get it and will even lie about their age if their ineligible.

The solution is simple, but politicians are too dumb to figure it out.

Honestly, just give a $2000 tax credit to everyone vaccinated in a household. Dad’s will be carpooling their kids to get it and will even lie about their age if their ineligible.
The solution is simple, but politicians are too dumb to figure it out.

And a corresponding $2000/person in the household tax for the unvaccinated to assist with your inevitable medical costs.

Just saw some Arkansas regards at. press conf with pig governor, yelling at him that nobody can tell them to get vaccinated, and if the mds gave hydroxycloroquin there would not have issues. Also, guy yelling “you can’t inject me unless I can inject you!”

That’s common sense. I mean, you can’t x-ray me or take blood for labs unless I can x-ray or draw blood from YOU! Don’t ask how I’m feeling - HIPAA VIOLATION!!

Vinay has some interesting ideas. He’s a carrot more than a stick guy. 

• Tie vaccination to binding legislation that we can never reinstitute restrictions again. Pass a bill that says if 70% of the population gets vaccinated, governments cannot institute mask mandates for a 5-year period or businesses cannot be closed if local vaccination rates exceed 75%. Pick the percentages, and times, and make it binding. It's worth the risk of losing one tool, and like all agreements, renegotiation may be possible if needed.
• Last call for vaccines. Announce that at the end of the month we are going to ship all the vaccines to India, Brazil, and Argentina, and make good on that promise. If you don't get it now, you can never get it. A deadline can be a powerful incentive.
   

So - fight stupid with stupid?




Better idea

Honestly, just give a $2000 tax credit to everyone vaccinated in a household. Dad’s will be carpooling their kids to get it and will even lie about their age if their ineligible.
The solution is simple, but politicians are too dumb to figure it out.

And each month that goes by and you're not vaccinated, the credit amount reduces.

So out of all the people in the ICU right now with covid, what % is fully vaccinated?

11 minutes ago, XYZ said:

So out of all the people in the ICU right now with covid, what % is fully vaccinated?

I haven’t seen the numbers tracked daily, but every time I’ve seen it reported the numbers are incredibly low. So low that if you are vaccinated and don’t have other reasons to be concerned, you need dig your balls back out and quit being a quivering pussy. If you aren’t vaccinated, you need to quit being a fucking idiot  

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/07/31/health/fully-vaccinated-people-breakthrough-hospitalization-death/index.html

Divide those severe breakthrough cases by the total fully vaccinated population for the result: less than 0.004% of fully vaccinated people had a breakthrough case that led to hospitalization and less than 0.001% of fully vaccinated people died from a breakthrough Covid-19 case.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/US/vast-majority-icu-patients-covid-19-unvaccinated-abc/story%3fid=79128401

Of the 271 total COVID patients in the surveyed ICUs, 255 patients, or approximately 94%, were unvaccinated against COVID-19 in ABC News' snapshot in time.

 

• Almost all (more than 9 in 10) COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations, and deaths have occurred among people who are unvaccinated or not yet fully vaccinated, in those states reporting breakthrough data (see Figure 2).
  • The reported share of COVID-19 cases among those not fully vaccinated ranged from 94.1% in Arizona to 99.85% Connecticut.
  • The share of hospitalizations among those with COVID-19 who are not fully vaccinated ranged from in 95.02% in Alaska to 99.93% in New Jersey. (Note: Hospitalization may or may not have been due to COVID-19.)
  • The share of deaths among people with COVID-19 who are not fully vaccinated ranged from to 96.91% in Montana to 99.91% in New Jersey. (Note: Deaths may or may not have been due to COVID-19.) 

https://www.kff.org/policy-watch/covid-19-vaccine-breakthrough-cases-data-from-the-states/

 

Edited August 4, 2021 by CooterBrown

18 minutes ago, CooterBrown said:

• Almost all (more than 9 in 10) COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations, and deaths have occurred among people who are unvaccinated or not yet fully vaccinated, in those states reporting breakthrough data (see Figure 2).
  • The reported share of COVID-19 cases among those not fully vaccinated ranged from 94.1% in Arizona to 99.85% Connecticut.
  • The share of hospitalizations among those with COVID-19 who are not fully vaccinated ranged from in 95.02% in Alaska to 99.93% in New Jersey. (Note: Hospitalization may or may not have been due to COVID-19.)
  • The share of deaths among people with COVID-19 who are not fully vaccinated ranged from to 96.91% in Montana to 99.91% in New Jersey. (Note: Deaths may or may not have been due to COVID-19.) 

https://www.kff.org/policy-watch/covid-19-vaccine-breakthrough-cases-data-from-the-states/

 

Good info and points. We don't have perfect info regarding vaccination status because it's not an universally tracked metric. It can also get into a gray area since how do you classify someone that only had 1 of the 2 shot regimen. But regardless of imperfect info, there is zero doubt that the vaccine protects people from being hospitalized and dying. 

I can't imagine someone playing number games in terms of getting the vaccine because the unvaccinated may make up 90% as opposed to 95% of the hospitalizations. 

Here’s some potentially reassuring data for those that are worried about their unvaccinated kids and school. 

Symptoms reported by parents. Only 4% of kids still experiencing symptoms at 4 weeks. 2% at 8 weeks. Most common symptoms fatigue, headache, loss of smell. 
 

This is a marked improvement over the 10-30% long covid numbers I’ve seen thrown around here. 

21 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

Here’s some potentially reassuring data for those that are worried about their unvaccinated kids and school. 

Symptoms reported by parents. Only 4% of kids still experiencing symptoms at 4 weeks. 2% at 8 weeks. Most common symptoms fatigue, headache, loss of smell. 
 

This is a marked improvement over the 10-30% long covid numbers I’ve seen thrown around here. 

So long-term health issues aren't known in the study? I'll mention it again, my niece is an elite soccer player at 14/15. She had carditis when she caught COVID and had it again after vaccination. She probably wouldn't have known she had an issue after 4-8 weeks except that she s an elite athlete and knew she didn't have the stamina that she had prior to COVID. Just as important, it is unknown how she will be later in life. Signs/tests point to it being transient, but we will see.

1 hour ago, XYZ said:

So out of all the people in the ICU right now with covid, what % is fully vaccinated?

In Austin, from 7/19 to 8/1, fully vaccinated in hospital is 16.55%

Doesn’t break it down further into ICU

28 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

In Austin, from 7/19 to 8/1, fully vaccinated in hospital is 16.55%

Doesn’t break it down further into ICU

That's definitely higher than I would have expected.  Where did those numbers come from?  Last time I looked, I couldn't find a breakdown for vax/unvax hopspitalizations in Austin/Travis.

38 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

In Austin, from 7/19 to 8/1, fully vaccinated in hospital is 16.55%

Doesn’t break it down further into ICU

Do you have a link to that number?  That is shockingly high.

It's in here: https://www.kxan.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/40/2021/08/APH-COVID-19-Briefing-TCCC-8-3-21.pdf

 

@jimmyjazz shared it on the other thread. 

I'm still waiting for the numbers to shake out as we have more data points, but I'm not that surprised it's hovering around there right now.  Austin had a large vaccine uptake relatively early.  I bet if we saw detailed numbers those breakthrough hospitalizations would lean super old and in Austin area proper, with relatively early vax dates.

One of the docs or somebody posted some early antibody data on one of the covid threads a few days back, basically the olds (that had first vax priority) have a slightly more muted antibody response, and then those antibody numbers start to fall faster than younger individuals with better immune systems as time passes.  Hence the thought that we'll have a need for boosters, even without Delta and similar popping up.

12 minutes ago, drt said:

I'm still waiting for the numbers to shake out as we have more data points, but I'm not that surprised it's hovering around there right now.  Austin had a large vaccine uptake relatively early.  I bet if we saw detailed numbers those breakthrough hospitalizations would lean super old and in Austin area proper, with relatively early vax dates.

One of the docs or somebody posted some early antibody data on one of the covid threads a few days back, basically the olds (that had first vax priority) have a slightly more muted antibody response, and then those antibody numbers start to fall faster than younger individuals with better immune systems as time passes.  Hence the thought that we'll have a need for boosters, even without Delta and similar popping up.

There are detailed numbers in the link posted by Anastasia. 70+ year old group makes up 46% of the vaccinated hospitalized. 50-70 year olds make up 37%

 

edit - not detailed to age and date of Vax. However, being that we’re only talking about n=54 to start with, I think we’d be flogging the crap out of the data to reach much more detailed conclusions. It probably just boils down to what it has since the beginning - the older you are the more at risk you are. 

Edited August 4, 2021 by UT_OB1

Well there you go.

4 hours ago, NoRagrets said:

Honestly, just give a $2000 tax credit to everyone vaccinated in a household. Dad’s will be carpooling their kids to get it and will even lie about their age if their ineligible.

The solution is simple, but politicians are too dumb to figure it out.

It's not that they can't figure out how to do it - they just cant figure out how to grift from it, yet.

I wouldn't get caught up in a potential that the hospitalized # for vaccinated is as high as 15%. First off, a fair number of people, included vaccinated, are only discovering they have COVID when they're being admitted for something else. They're still counted as COVID positive in hospitalization #s even if they're asymptomatic.

Hospitals are also discovering that some people because of their chronic conditions are taking medicine that may have prevented the vaccine from ever taking hold. I've read about some transplant patients that are fully vaccinated but may have low/zero protection for COVID. 

A friend in Florida is in the hospital going on 4 days now.   Late 40's maybe early 50's/   He admitted in a group chat that he was unvaxed.  He's used to live in Texas and is a complete homo-phobe and racist.   Not surprised he's unvaxed.  He tried to play it off by claiming that the nurses told him 75% of hospitalizations are vaccinated.   BULLL SHIIIIITTTT

Edited August 4, 2021 by midtown

No  political points in this one.  Just pointing out what should be obvious--get vaccinated even if you think your fitness levels will somehow protect you.

Quote

 

A “fit and healthy” 42-year-old who loved climbing mountains and lifting weights has died of Covid-19 after refusing to get vaccinated, leaving his twin sister and mother heartbroken.

The two women warned others not to think they are invulnerable to the dangers of the virus.

The father of one, John Eyers, a construction expert from Southport in Merseyside, was described by his sister Jenny McCann as “the fittest, healthiest person I know”.

She added that her brother had been climbing Welsh mountains and camping in the wild four weeks before his death.

But he was left in intensive care after catching coronavirus, and told his consultant before he was ventilated that he wished he had been vaccinated. His twin said his death was “a tragedy”.

“He thought if he contracted Covid-19 he would be OK. He thought he would have a mild illness. He didn’t want to put a vaccine in his body. His was pumped full of every drug in the hospital. They threw everything at him,” McCann said on Twitter.

“It should not have happened. He leaves a mum and a dad, a sister (me), and a 19-year-old daughter. My two children have lost their fun uncle. The uncle who would always play with them.”

McCann said her brother had dressed up as Father Christmas for her children. “My mum has lost her baby boy. My niece, her much-loved and needed dad. This shouldn’t have happened. My mum wants people to know about John. For his story to save someone’s life. For the pain and loss to drive people to get a vaccine.”

Tributes also poured in from Eyers’ friends, with many describing him as “incredibly fit” and “one of the most active and fit people” they knew.

One friend wrote: “He had a huge love for sport and fitness, competing in bodybuilding, triathlons, rock climbing and much more.

“He helped me a few years back when I was competing as I was struggling with my prep and he was the support and extra guidance I needed to push me through my show.

“He wasn’t my coach. He helped me in his spare time and from the goodness of his heart, as fitness was such a huge passion of his. I can never thank him enough for his support.”

He added: “John sadly was lost to Covid without any underlying health conditions. His family wants this sharing for others to see and make them re-think some of their decisions surrounding Covid, which I think is absolutely incredible.”

However, McCann said her brother had asthma in an earlier tweet on 3 July.

Healthcare workers and Covid patients have increasingly spoken out about feeling a sense of regret about being unvaccinated once they fall seriously ill.

Dr Samantha Batt-Rawden, a senior intensive care registrar, said she had come across only one patient in critical care who had received both vaccination doses, and that the “vast majority” of people she was seeing were “completely unvaccinated”.

Batt-Rawden said it was difficult to witness the look of regret on patients’ faces when they became unwell and needed to go on a ventilator.

“You can see it dawn on them that they potentially made the biggest mistake of their lives [in not getting the vaccine], which is really hard,” she said, adding that she had overheard people telling family members about their remorse.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/aug/04/fit-and-healthy-man-42-from-southport-who-rejected-vaccine-dies-of-covid?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

Edited August 4, 2021 by MC Fresh Breath

I have a question for you guys that are balls deep into this shit, what ever happened to the freezers and keeping the vaccines cold. They spent like $2B on special freezers and storage at one point? Did they just say "fuck it" and forget about all this?

https://www.sciencenews.org/article/coronavirus-covid-19-why-vaccines-cold-freeze-pfizer-moderna

Pfizer is racing to get approval for its COVID-19 vaccine, applying for emergency use authorization from the U.S. Food and Drug Administration on November 20. But the pharmaceutical giant faces a huge challenge in distributing its vaccine, which has to be kept an ultrafrosty –70° Celsius, requiring special storage freezers and shipping containers.

A similar vaccine developed by Moderna and the U.S. National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases also requires freezing. But it survives at a balmier –20° C, so can be kept in a standard freezer, and can even be stored at refrigerator temperatures for up to a month. 

Accidentally posted in the Texas COVID thread earlier, meant for it to be here

 

 

I have a question for people that post text that looks like this bullshit. What in the goddamn fuck is wrong with you?

6 minutes ago, StruggleBus said:

I have a question for people that post text that looks like this bullshit. What in the goddamn fuck is wrong with you?

Great answer!

I guess they did some studies saying it actually wouldn't need to be kept at -70 deg C, but I've yet to see that. I thought it was a pretty big deal when the vaccines were first coming out and now seems like an afterthought. 

3 hours ago, Bevo said:

So long-term health issues aren't known in the study? I'll mention it again, my niece is an elite soccer player at 14/15. She had carditis when she caught COVID and had it again after vaccination. She probably wouldn't have known she had an issue after 4-8 weeks except that she s an elite athlete and knew she didn't have the stamina that she had prior to COVID. Just as important, it is unknown how she will be later in life. Signs/tests point to it being transient, but we will see.

 

Regarding your point on long term effects, I would guess that your niece is a very rare case. Probably a “mild” case if she didn’t experience fatigue at rest or on mild exertion. I think there will be a small number of patients that have zero symptoms at 2 months and then pop up with something more long term. So the long term number shouldn’t be much higher than the 2% at 8 weeks in this study. 
 

Just curious, how much has she been affected? Did she get an echo?

16 minutes ago, Harrison Bergeron said:

Shouldn't we just make vaccination a requirement to vote (legitimate medical reasons excluded). Kills two bird with one stone: increases vaccination rate and gets MAGAts out of the voting pool?

yikes I guess daily texan = cloak room

Oh well

Just now, Zeus said:

yikes I guess daily texan = cloak room

Oh well

The funny thing is, between @Muy Frio, @Harrison Bergeron, and @William Wallace, you'd think @GRHorn would have fucked off by now. He keeps making new sockpuppet accounts and farming posts and rep in hobby threads and then shits all over the DT and CR boards before getting crowdsourced.

Good to have a hobby, I guess.

5 minutes ago, Captainant said:

The funny thing is, between @Muy Frio, @Harrison Bergeron, and @William Wallace, you'd think @GRHorn would have fucked off by now. He keeps making new sockpuppet accounts and farming posts and rep in hobby threads and then shits all over the DT and CR boards before getting crowdsourced.

Good to have a hobby, I guess.

My only handles have been GR and this one. I don’t know anything about those other ones. 

On 7/21/2021 at 5:25 PM, Nice Guy Eddie said:

There isn't any system that validates whether you've already had a shot or not. The place where you received the original shot(s) are maintaining those records just in case you need to prove you're vaccinated. The state or the feds don't have that record by name.

I think pretty much anyone can walk into a random vaccine center and get another vaccine even if you're already vaccinated. Make sure you somewhat know what you're doing before taking that path.

Since I believe that we will almost certainly have booster shots by the end of year with the same formula, I've thought about going for a 3rd Pfizer.

 

Spoiler