COVID-19 vaccine discussion

2 hours ago, Deej said:

The anti-vaxx folks who really make me rage are the ones who claim they've done all the research themselves and know that it's not safe. 

What fucking research have you personally done? Surfing conspiracy websites and talking with your moron friends does not constitute research. These people need to be taken out back and given the Old Yeller treatment. 

Here’s a study released from Kentucky today. 

Not surprising vaccine would add protection. 

The absolute numbers were as follows. Of the 269,378 confirmed cases Kentucky in 2020, there were 246 reinfections in May and June of 2021. 179 were in unvaccinated, 67 in fully or partially vaccinated.  

seems like the statistical analysis of that KY tweet are way off, particularly because it is a trump tard state with low vaccination rates.

UAL now requiring all employees to be vaccinated. The pilot group was already at 90 percent because they threw money at them to go do it. Good luck 10 percent trumplican hold outs.

How about they make all the passengers be vaccinated.

9 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

Here’s a study released from Kentucky today. 

Not surprising vaccine would add protection. 

The absolute numbers were as follows. Of the 269,378 confirmed cases Kentucky in 2020, there were 246 reinfections in May and June of 2021. 179 were in unvaccinated, 67 in fully or partially vaccinated.  

weren't you cheerleading for people not to get vaxxed if they had been previously infected? I recall that being the tenor of this thread in early July.

1 minute ago, Captainant said:

weren't you cheerleading for people not to get vaxxed if they had been previously infected? I recall that being the tenor of this thread in early July.

Yes that was me. I’m not surprised that vaccines can boost immunity in those with existing natural immunity.
 

Of course the way they state the results is to maximize effect. The absolute numbers are not as impressive. If you have roughly a 1% chance of getting re-infected then adding a vaccine would lower it to about 0.4%, if this study is reproducible. 
 

IMO the benefit doesn’t justify mandating vaccination in that population. 

1 minute ago, Muy Frio said:

IMO the benefit doesn’t justify mandating vaccination in that population. 

We already mandate vaccinations in the population to deal with endemic diseases. Why would COVID be any different?

Just now, Captainant said:

We already mandate vaccinations in the population to deal with endemic diseases. Why would COVID be any different?

Is people’s movement and participation in society affected? Hardly. Not what is being pushed now. 

15 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

Yes that was me. I’m not surprised that vaccines can boost immunity in those with existing natural immunity.
 

Of course the way they state the results is to maximize effect. The absolute numbers are not as impressive. If you have roughly a 1% chance of getting re-infected then adding a vaccine would lower it to about 0.4%, if this study is reproducible. 
 

IMO the benefit doesn’t justify mandating vaccination in that population. 

You don't think a 60% reduction in re-infection probability is worth taking 20 minutes and spending $0 to get vaxxed? Lol. 

3 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

Is people’s movement and participation in society affected? Hardly. Not what is being pushed now. 

I honestly don't know 100%, but since you're the person claiming that what's happening now is so different from past pandemic response - I challenge YOU to support your claim rather than putting the onus on me to prove your negative.

I do know the US previously had an analog "vaccine passport" while we dealt with smallpox - and we indeed would restrict "movement and participating in society" because it put everyone else at risk. And wouldn't you know it - back then there were antivaxxers and "MUH LIBURTEE" people who stood in opposition to those public health measures.

Hell, there were even shitty physicians who would sell fake vaccine passports to the "poor, ignorant and credulous", subverting those public health measures (NYT archive from 1904). Sounds familiar...

14 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

Yes that was me. I’m not surprised that vaccines can boost immunity in those with existing natural immunity.
 

Of course the way they state the results is to maximize effect. The absolute numbers are not as impressive. If you have roughly a 1% chance of getting re-infected then adding a vaccine would lower it to about 0.4%, if this study is reproducible. 
 

IMO the benefit doesn’t justify mandating vaccination in that population. 

25 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

You don't think a 60% reduction in re-infection probability is worth taking 20 minutes and spending $0 to get vaxxed? Lol. 

That’s a strawman fallacy.

On 8/3/2021 at 9:16 PM, DDD Dad said:

Stahp GR

These are all dumb ideas - the people that are dragging their feet will not be convinced if you say we're shipping it to India. 

You want to be a part of society, show your vaccine card. Or sit home and eat horse paste. It's a free country. 

(edit - sorry, meant to reply to the original post from Twitter)

Edited August 6, 2021 by Txzen

21 minutes ago, XYZ said:

That’s a strawman fallacy.

Not sure if serious, but he posted that he didn't think a drop from 1% to 0.4% (a 60% drop) "justifies vaccination in [the pre-infected] population." If you are mocking his proposed response, carry on, and I apologize for my obtusity.

NYT The Daily podcast has an episode about unvaccinated people.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-daily/id1200361736?i=1000531193097

They interviewed a few people and the reasons for not vaccinating were pretty much what you would expect:

-I’m not an early adopter of anything so I’m waiting to see how this plays out.
-Waiting for a more effective vaccine that will prevent infection from all future variants.
-I don’t like any vaccines and my child is unvaccinated and I plan to keep him that way.
-I don’t trust the government putting something in my body.
-It’s still experimental and hasn’t been fully tested or FDA approved.
-Vaccinated people can still get sick so what’s the point?
-Vaccinated people still have to wear masks so what’s the point?

I'm trying to pretend people are telling me about half of those with relation to getting MMR or polio vaccinations before school.  And I'm laughing.  Not in a good way.  

Also, we're coming up in about a month to the confluence of the vaccine having been available to the public (admittedly in waves to HCW first for a couple months) than the Covid-19 has actually been in the U.S.  So by their outstanding rationale, they would have wanted to see polio vaccines working safely and effectively for 60 years to make up for the 1895-1955 polio rampage.  Meaning they would have taken it finally in 2015.  Whoah!  What other famous vaccination expert would come onto the American Scene in that same year?  Mind blown.  

I also like the "Waiting for full FDA" approval.  When the fuck did these folks become experts on emergency use trial protocols?  
"The CDC is lying to us!"

"Fauci and the NIH are frauds!"  

"The FDA's procedural bureaucracy is here to protect us!  We must be patient as their administrative machine slowly wields an otherwise cosmetic status label (pun intended).  Trust the process"!!!!!!!!!

7 hours ago, midtown said:

It's 100% made up FB rumor.   My guess is her infertility has more to do with the gang bangs she does.  NTTIAWWT

Rumor is based on some loose interpretations of some paper that was published on placental protein synthesis or lack thereof. The paper was not all that sound to begin with and the interpretations are even less so.

Many vaccines have the same theoretical issue but have never caused any problems.  No issues amongst the trial group and no issues thus far with vaccinated. 

10 mins into my 15 & 12 getting their first dose. There is a legit 5 person line of people to get their first. Middle aged adults. You fucks have been eligible for months.

2 hours ago, hobbes2702 said:

You are correct sir. 

1 hour ago, wild_turkey said:

NYT The Daily podcast has an episode about unvaccinated people.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-daily/id1200361736?i=1000531193097

They interviewed a few people and the reasons for not vaccinating were pretty much what you would expect:

-I’m not an early adopter of anything so I’m waiting to see how this plays out.
-Waiting for a more effective vaccine that will prevent infection from all future variants.
-I don’t like any vaccines and my child is unvaccinated and I plan to keep him that way.
-I don’t trust the government putting something in my body.
-It’s still experimental and hasn’t been fully tested or FDA approved.
-Vaccinated people can still get sick so what’s the point?
-Vaccinated people still have to wear masks so what’s the point?

Another one I see a lot on social media is “why do I need a vaccine for a virus with a 99% survival rate?” I’ve also more recently seen people blaming the vaccine for the current wave by claiming us vaccinated folks are “super spreaders” or even that the delta variant was somehow created by a mutation caused by the vaccines.

The delta variant is just a hoax pushed by big mask and big hand sanitizer.  All you sheep just watch how it will suddenly disappear as all that surplus is finally sold off to you saps. 

4 minutes ago, midtown said:

The delta variant is just a hoax pushed by big mask and big hand sanitizer.  All you sheep just watch how it will suddenly disappear as all that surplus is finally sold off to you saps. 

Wait, you guys were using that on your hands?  

2 hours ago, midtown said:

10 mins into my 15 & 12 getting their first dose. There is a legit 5 person line of people to get their first. Middle aged adults. You fucks have been eligible for months.

3rd shot bros. 

5 minutes ago, midtown said:

The delta variant is just a hoax pushed by big mask and big hand sanitizer.  All you sheep just watch how it will suddenly disappear as all that surplus is finally sold off to you saps. 

“Big hand sanitizer” is a euphemism.  You know that, right?

3rd shot bros. 

No. They were taking to each other about being afraid of the dealing with the possible side effects

1 minute ago, midtown said:

21 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

3rd shot bros. 

No. They were taking to each other about being afraid of the dealing with the possible side effects

Yea the side effect of being less of a dumb fucking selfish asshole is really difficult for some to fight through.  

2 minutes ago, midtown said:

22 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

3rd shot bros. 

No. They were taking to each other about being afraid of the dealing with the possible side effects

These dumbfucks never had a hangover?

10 mins into my 15 & 12 getting their first dose. There is a legit 5 person line of people to get their first. Middle aged adults. You fucks have been eligible for months.

Your kids have been eligible for months too

Your kids have been eligible for months too

Ha. I was just thinking that. Unfortunately I had to counter a hesitant ex and covid clearly not a big issue for kids.

20 minutes ago, midtown said:

22 minutes ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

Your kids have been eligible for months too

Ha. I was just thinking that. Unfortunately I had to counter a hesitant ex and covid clearly not a big issue for kids.

We had our kids waiting for the pharmacy to open like we were waiting for Stones tickets back in the day.  (15 & 12).  Not really.  But we got them the first day they were eligible.  No line. 

Glad yours got their jabs.

Edited August 6, 2021 by dcbc

4 hours ago, Captainant said:

I honestly don't know 100%, but since you're the person claiming that what's happening now is so different from past pandemic response - I challenge YOU to support your claim rather than putting the onus on me to prove your negative.

I do know the US previously had an analog "vaccine passport" while we dealt with smallpox - and we indeed would restrict "movement and participating in society" because it put everyone else at risk. And wouldn't you know it - back then there were antivaxxers and "MUH LIBURTEE" people who stood in opposition to those public health measures.

Hell, there were even shitty physicians who would sell fake vaccine passports to the "poor, ignorant and credulous", subverting those public health measures (NYT archive from 1904). Sounds familiar...

The smallpox example is always brought up but that disease had a 30% mortality rate. A different animal entirely. Also, eradication was seen as a goal. Not so for covid. It has an animal reservoir in deer. 

Also, did people lose their jobs or livelihood then? 
 

2 hours ago, GTX Horn said:

 or even that the delta variant was somehow created by a mutation caused by the vaccines.

I doubt the delta variant was “caused by the vaccines”. But I think the worry about super variants that will evade vaccines developing in unvaccinated countries is misplaced. If a variant emerges that evades vaccines then it makes sense it will arise from a population that is highly vaccinated. 
 

4 hours ago, TXSooner518 said:

You don't think a 60% reduction in re-infection probability is worth taking 20 minutes and spending $0 to get vaxxed? Lol. 

I’ve covered this before in the thread, but from that absolute number of 1%? No. I’m not worried about it. Once you’ve had it and it’s been mild like most cases you’re not really scared of it. The 1% of the time that reinfections happen should be less severe just the like numbers in vaccinated people that everyone is touting now. 
 

Since you bring up the cost of it, how much would it cost for me to miss a day or work because I have covid symptoms with the shots? Not an inconsequential amount and people that have had covid appear to have worse symptoms with the shots. 

15 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

I doubt the delta variant was “caused by the vaccines”. But I think the worry about super variants that will evade vaccines developing in unvaccinated countries is misplaced. If a variant emerges that evades vaccines then it makes sense it will arise from a population that is highly vaccinated. 

I get the feeling that the crowd that thinks vaccinated populations are driving mutations believe that the virus is sentient enough to be changing itself, looking for ways to defeat the immunity bestowed by vaccinations. 
as opposed to random replication errors that are either beneficial and proliferate or not and die off. 
maybe that’s just the cynic in me, but to be fair I’ve read some of the stuff being espoused and if you told me that some people thought groups of covid were coordinating as a team to outmaneuver Treg cells using an elaborate pincer movement initiated from behind the cover of a pile of red blood cells, I wouldn’t dismiss it out of hand. 

44 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

I get the feeling that the crowd that thinks vaccinated populations are driving mutations believe that the virus is sentient enough to be changing itself, looking for ways to defeat the immunity bestowed by vaccinations. 
as opposed to random replication errors that are either beneficial and proliferate or not and die off. 
maybe that’s just the cynic in me, but to be fair I’ve read some of the stuff being espoused and if you told me that some people thought groups of covid were coordinating as a team to outmaneuver Treg cells using an elaborate pincer movement initiated from behind the cover of a pile of red blood cells, I wouldn’t dismiss it out of hand. 

I can understand that they believe a virus is more intelligent than they are. 

Uh yeah. Delta came out of India which had almost zero vaccinated.

48 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

I get the feeling that the crowd that thinks vaccinated populations are driving mutations believe that the virus is sentient enough to be changing itself, looking for ways to defeat the immunity bestowed by vaccinations. 
as opposed to random replication errors that are either beneficial and proliferate or not and die off. 
maybe that’s just the cynic in me, but to be fair I’ve read some of the stuff being espoused and if you told me that some people thought groups of covid were coordinating as a team to outmaneuver Treg cells using an elaborate pincer movement initiated from behind the cover of a pile of red blood cells, I wouldn’t dismiss it out of hand. 

I don’t believe vaccine are driving mutations like delta or lambda worldwide, but it’s not hard to see how a virus that is 80% effective or whatever against infections is going to self select for a virus that evades the same vaccines eventually.  

6 minutes ago, midtown said:

Uh yeah. Delta came out of India which had almost zero vaccinated.

Exactly. And it’s getting mostly the unvaccinated sick.
 

It seems to me that the breakthrough infections now have less to do with delta being some special variant than it’s the time since vaccinations and the immunity is waning slightly. I feel like I’ve seen studies that suggest that, but I’m drinking by the pool so i Don’t feel like cross checking that. I’ll circle back as some people say.  
 

 

 

Edited August 7, 2021 by Muy Frio

They made us wear masks again at my job and some lady quit because of it. She’s the typical anti-vax, mah freedoms, etc.

I believe that before 2030 with the Pandemic long since behind us, the "wear a mask in common spaces in the office" exercise will replace the Trust Fall at most corporate team building exercises.  I also believe paint-ball will be replaced by a game of "Give Karen in HR your germs, one way or another."  It may get ugly.  

They made us wear masks again at my job and some lady quit because of it. She’s the typical anti-vax, mah freedoms, etc.

.

1 hour ago, Jersey Man10 said:

They made us wear masks again at my job and some lady quit because of it. She’s the typical anti-vax, mah freedoms, etc.

They made us wear masks again at my job and some lady quit because of it. She’s the typical anti-vax, mah freedoms, etc.

I don’t know her and all but I’m betting she pronounces it “muh freedumbzzzz”

Losing a source of income to own tha libz

On 8/4/2021 at 4:27 PM, Gil Bang said:

Yeah, CA's system seems to be pretty good.  For example, I got my Pfizer (COVID, not Viagra) at one of the public supervax sites, in my case at a Cal State Campus.  I get my health insurance through Kaiser.  I was surprised to see that the vax is on my medical record on the Kaiser app, and I didn't tell anybody at Kaiser. 

Think about it… does Kaiser know if you got a flu shot at work? I think not.

They only know because the chip inside of you already told them. 

17 hours ago, TXSooner518 said:

You don't think a 60% reduction in re-infection probability is worth taking 20 minutes and spending $0 to get vaxxed? Lol. 

Although I do suspect there is some benefit, these critiques of the study do make sense. 
 

 

 

26 minutes ago, midtown said:

 

Had the talk with my FIL last night (80+). He got PFE in first wave.  Told him that a 3rd shot not a bad idea given his medical conditions, although he is in relatively great shape. Told him that he would either have to lie at the pharmacy or call his cardiologist and see if he was on board with giving him a 3rd shot.

 

The FDA and CDC have and will continue to be weeks and months behind the evidence during the course of the entire roll out. 

1 hour ago, midtown said:

 

From the “News stories that remind you of Surly” file.

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

Had the talk with my FIL last night (80+). He got PFE in first wave.  Told him that a 3rd shot not a bad idea given his medical conditions, although he is in relatively great shape. Told him that he would either have to lie at the pharmacy or call his cardiologist and see if he was on board with giving him a 3rd shot.

 

The FDA and CDC have and will continue to be weeks and months behind the evidence during the course of the entire roll out. 

My belief is that we have a relatively small window right now to get a 3rd shot. My guess is that the pharmacies, vaccine centers and govt and going to recognize the lying is starting to get out of hand, and put a stop to it. Then everyone will have to wait until the govt accepts the 3rd shot which may be next year. And you will have to deal with 50% of the population wanting the 3rd shot all at once. The 3rd decision may be this week or next year.

In a weird twist of fate I’m not so happy to have gotten my second shot in early March all of a sudden.