COVID-19 vaccine discussion

6 hours ago, DDD Dad said:

You misspelled Five Man Electrical Band.

Thanks and fuck google for hiding the original behind the remake.

4 hours ago, Hmbre97 said:

I plan on getting the shot once my employer gets their allotment (I'm in IT but for a healthcare company so we still qualify in 1A). With that said, I can understand why some would pass on getting it. There is a big difference in the fuckheads who refuse to get ANY vaccines because autism/bill gates microchips/etc and those who are skeptical in a vaccine that has gone from not existing to being used by the general masses in less than a year.  My mother who is now a semi-retired nurse used to work in the research dept for a company to track data and treat patients in studies. There is an extreme level of detail that goes into the testing phases of treatments/medicines. I know we can't afford that level of detail here because of the circumstances but I get it why medical professionals would be hesitant. It's not like they're refusing a flu vac that has been around forever.

Well said. As I stated earlier, I have been vaccinated and I am very well aware of the science behind the vaccine. And I think long-term that the safety profile will prove to be better than live or attenuated whole virus vaccines. However, there are concerns with anything that goes through an expedited process. Just off the cuff... Long-term data isn't available for things like safety during pregnancy. Use of mRNA as a standard vaccine and its long-term effect on the immune system. Single protein region vaccines and their effect on viral mutations and long-term immunity from the virus. As a middle-aged provider, there is no doubt that the benefits far outweigh the concerns. But, I can see why some on the FDA panel thought that it wasn't wise to approve it for healthy 16 year olds at this point in time.

5 hours ago, Hmbre97 said:

I plan on getting the shot once my employer gets their allotment (I'm in IT but for a healthcare company so we still qualify in 1A). With that said, I can understand why some would pass on getting it. There is a big difference in the fuckheads who refuse to get ANY vaccines because autism/bill gates microchips/etc and those who are skeptical in a vaccine that has gone from not existing to being used by the general masses in less than a year.  My mother who is now a semi-retired nurse used to work in the research dept for a company to track data and treat patients in studies. There is an extreme level of detail that goes into the testing phases of treatments/medicines. I know we can't afford that level of detail here because of the circumstances but I get it why medical professionals would be hesitant. It's not like they're refusing a flu vac that has been around forever.

When you state that you know that we couldn’t afford the extreme level of detail in testing this vaccine, can you offer more background on that? That’s a fairly strong statement that I haven’t heard mentioned before.

PSA. City of Houston offering vaccines to pubic today. I can only imagine the line but this is what we need to get the vaccine to a wider group.

 

31 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

PSA. City of Houston offering vaccines to pubic today. I can only imagine the line but this is what we need to get the vaccine to a wider group.

 

I'm sure the public will make it a cluster but glad to see a city health department getting it together.  There was a major coordination gap between federal, state and local efforts to roll out this vaccine. And we had months to plan. SMH.

46 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

PSA. City of Houston offering vaccines to pubic today. I can only imagine the line but this is what we need to get the vaccine to a wider group.

 

We already have “vaccines to pubic”.  It’s called marriage.

Edited January 2, 2021 by Judge Roybeanbag

13 hours ago, naija said:

well, among surgeons, they do quite a bit.

well, among QBs, Colt punted quite a bit.

 

Most ENTs I know look to cut and if it can't be done they refer to the Neurology clinic.

City of Houston has been overwhelmed with people calling to get the vaccine. While that sucks for people trying to get through, that’s a positive that we have so many people that are beating down doors to get vaccinated.

3 hours ago, MoJames said:

well, among QBs, Colt punted quite a bit.

 

Most ENTs I know look to cut and if it can't be done they refer to the Neurology clinic.

ENTs seem to be trying to focus these days: At one time, it was eyes, ears, nose and throat. A guy I know pretty well advertises in Houston and mainly treats sinusitis. Sleep centers, allergy centers, rhinoplasties, hearing centers, oral cancers... I could see otolaryngology splitting into more disciplines in the future. 

 

7 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

When you state that you know that we couldn’t afford the extreme level of detail in testing this vaccine, can you offer more background on that? That’s a fairly strong statement that I haven’t heard mentioned before.

I'm just saying we can't afford to go through the normal multi-year trial phases before getting the final approval because of the pandemic/death/economic impact it's creating. I'm sure these companies will continue to monitor and research the vaccine for years to come.

Edited January 2, 2021 by Hmbre97

Well said. As I stated earlier, I have been vaccinated and I am very well aware of the science behind the vaccine. And I think long-term that the safety profile will prove to be better than live or attenuated whole virus vaccines. However, there are concerns with anything that goes through an expedited process. Just off the cuff... Long-term data isn't available for things like safety during pregnancy. Use of mRNA as a standard vaccine and its long-term effect on the immune system. Single protein region vaccines and their effect on viral mutations and long-term immunity from the virus. As a middle-aged provider, there is no doubt that the benefits far outweigh the concerns. But, I can see why some on the FDA panel thought that it wasn't wise to approve it for healthy 16 year olds at this point in time.

The use of mRNA is not in chartered territory though. It’s been in the works for years and has already had published data related to its use for about 3 or 4 vaccines already.

1 hour ago, scottsins said:

The use of mRNA is not in chartered territory though. It’s been in the works for years and has already had published data related to its use for about 3 or 4 vaccines already.

I think you mean uncharted territory.  If so, you're spot on.

So is Austin just sitting on its hands or what.  The bigger cities have setup mass vaccination events.  Hell, Arlington was giving out vaccines at their convention center starting last Wednesday.  You had to live in Arlington though.

Took my mom yesterday to get her first shot at the Brookshire Bros. in Somerville (dad is scheduled for Thursday at the one in Giddings.)

They did not schedule my mom's 2nd shot and said they should be getting more from the state soon and will schedule her second shot then.  Looks like they gave out all 100 doses they had for first injections.

Not sure if this is Brookshire Bros. policy or just this particular location.  This makes me a little nervous, but I guess we have 4 weeks to figure it out.

21 minutes ago, HalfSack Horn said:

So is Austin just sitting on its hands or what.  The bigger cities have setup mass vaccination events.  Hell, Arlington was giving out vaccines at their convention center starting last Wednesday.  You had to live in Arlington though.

let them get through vaccinating the homeless camps, then they will start giving them out to you other folks

Has the allotment/shipments of the vaccine been published by Texas health services for this week? If so, anybody got a link? Can’t find it anywhere.

1 hour ago, Borachio said:

Took my mom yesterday to get her first shot at the Brookshire Bros. in Somerville (dad is scheduled for Thursday at the one in Giddings.)

They did not schedule my mom's 2nd shot and said they should be getting more from the state soon and will schedule her second shot then.  Looks like they gave out all 100 doses they had for first injections.

Not sure if this is Brookshire Bros. policy or just this particular location.  This makes me a little nervous, but I guess we have 4 weeks to figure it out.

Just to ease your fears, the second dose could be delivered a few months down the road and will likely not impact protective immunity.  In fact, it could strengthen it.

The only reason for the 21 days (Pfizer) and 28 days (Moderna) is that this is timeframe gap each designed into their trials, hence that is what was used to determine efficacy.  There's going to be more study, but I've heard and read that delaying the second inoculation could not only not be risky, but could layer in additional benefit.

let them get through vaccinating the homeless camps, then they will start giving them out to you other folks

Considering a large percentage of them fall within the 1B category I could think of worse things.

 

2 hours ago, pearlandhorn said:

Has the allotment/shipments of the vaccine been published by Texas health services for this week? If so, anybody got a link? Can’t find it anywhere.

Not yet.  Watch this page:

https://www.dshs.state.tx.us/coronavirus/immunize/vaccine.aspx

For the first three weeks, the URL has been consistent, something like:

https://www.dshs.state.tx.us/news/updates/COVIDVaccineAllocation-Week3.pdf

They published weeks 1 & 2 on a Friday, then skipped to Monday for the week after Christmas.  Since Friday was a holiday, I would expect they will publish week 4 tomorrow if they follow the pattern.

3 hours ago, HalfSack Horn said:

So is Austin just sitting on its hands or what.  The bigger cities have setup mass vaccination events.  Hell, Arlington was giving out vaccines at their convention center starting last Wednesday.  You had to live in Arlington though.

I'm not sure they have the vaccine to give.  City of Austin / Travis Co is not prominent on the lists of places that have received vaccine in Travis County.  Most of it is going to hospitals, with some smaller amounts going to pharmacies and clinics.  CoA has received some for public safety but the large quantities are going elsewhere.

UT could do it on their own.  They have Dell Med next door to the Erwin Center and super cold storage to handle the Pfizer vax.  Plenty of parking and bus routes.  I remember adds and drops at the Erwin Center in the 1980s and they were pretty good at managing the flow through the building.  If they can handle gameday they can handle a vax center.

Austin Public Health has claimed the role of information distribution, but not vaccine distribution -- except for possibly underserved populations, but I don't see a plan for that.  IMHO, they are not doing much.

Travis County handles early voting sites pretty well.  It seems logical to follow their lead and do something similar, but I don't think we'll get it.

5 hours ago, HalfSack Horn said:

So is Austin just sitting on its hands or what.  The bigger cities have setup mass vaccination events.  Hell, Arlington was giving out vaccines at their convention center starting last Wednesday.  You had to live in Arlington though.

It’s the weekend/week between Christmas and new year’s.

we’ll get around to it next week when everyone is back from visiting their family in California.

7 hours ago, HalfSack Horn said:

So is Austin just sitting on its hands or what.  The bigger cities have setup mass vaccination events.  Hell, Arlington was giving out vaccines at their convention center starting last Wednesday.  You had to live in Arlington though.

A look inside Arlington's vaccination center.  They started off with fire/EMS vaccinations but moved to Phase 1B when the state announced the change.  They have vaccinated 3000 folks so far.

 

4 hours ago, Don Johnson said:

 

Someone tell me why it matters which strain is predominant at any given time.  My understanding was that the new strain is no more virulent than the other, just more contagious. 

It’s the weekend/week between Christmas and new year’s.
we’ll get around to it next week when everyone is back from visiting their family in California.

No worries, Covid took the week off, too.

38 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Someone tell me why it matters which strain is predominant at any given time.  My understanding was that the new strain is no more virulent than the other, just more contagious. 

I assume his concern is that the pace of infection will spread even more rapidly than it already has with the new strain becoming more widespread, and we aren't moving fast enough to achieve herd immunity with the vaccines to get out in front of that.

I also would note that, while Dr. Gottlieb unquestionably is a brilliant doctor, his negative waves have gotten really old.  His pundit persona is to push the worst possible scenario at every step of the pandemic.  The vaccine roll out has not been perfect, but there was nothing that could have been done to satisfy Gottlieb.  He's the Satya of the medical world.  I'd like to see him take a few months off from the speaker fee circuit, get his ass on the ground helping to administer vaccines, and stop bitching constantly.

So the vaccine requires two doses.  My question is each dose the exact same product at the exact same rate?  Or are they two different things?

So the vaccine requires two doses.  My question is each dose the exact same product at the exact same rate?  Or are they two different things?

Each dose is the same. The first gets you to 50 the second the +90.

I assume his concern is that the pace of infection will spread even more rapidly than it already has with the new strain becoming more widespread, and we aren't moving fast enough to achieve herd immunity with the vaccines to get out in front of that.
I also would note that, while Dr. Gottlieb unquestionably is a brilliant doctor, his negative waves have gotten really old.  His pundit persona is to push the worst possible scenario at every step of the pandemic.  The vaccine roll out has not been perfect, but there was nothing that could have been done to satisfy Gottlieb.  He's the Satya of the medical world.  I'd like to see him take a few months off from the speaker fee circuit, get his ass on the ground helping to administer vaccines, and stop bitching constantly.

Sounds like he most likely also spends his time posting on Surly.

26 minutes ago, midtown said:

47 minutes ago, Parliament said:

So the vaccine requires two doses.  My question is each dose the exact same product at the exact same rate?  Or are they two different things?

Each dose is the same. The first gets you to 50 the second the +90.

You have to convert some of those redzone opportunities 

48 minutes ago, Parliament said:

So the vaccine requires two doses.  My question is each dose the exact same product at the exact same rate?  Or are they two different things?

They only put the microchip in the first dose otherwise they are the same.

2 minutes ago, Newdoc said:

They only put the microchip in the first dose otherwise they are the same.

Which one has the Bill Gates microchip and which one has the 5G antenna?   I'm thinking I want the Bill Gates microchip but I'm still not 100% decided.

1 hour ago, Surly Bevo said:

Which one has the Bill Gates microchip and which one has the 5G antenna?   I'm thinking I want the Bill Gates microchip but I'm still not 100% decided.

Pfizer has the 5G antenna.  Moderna has the tracking chip.  I got Pfizer, and my reception and download speed is killer.

On 1/2/2021 at 4:30 PM, scottsins said:

The use of mRNA is not in chartered territory though. It’s been in the works for years and has already had published data related to its use for about 3 or 4 vaccines already.

As someone upthread said, I think you intended to type "..not in uncharted territory..."

I'm not sure what "3 or 4 vaccines" you are referring to, but mRNA technology has never been approved for a drug or vaccine before these two Covid-19 ones.  Any data that was published would have been for a something that never made it out of trials.  Where long term studies done on any of those trial drugs? 

 

2 hours ago, dcbc said:

Pfizer has the 5G antenna.  Moderna has the tracking chip.  I got Pfizer, and my reception and download speed is killer.

Which one gives me access to the tv remote?

35 minutes ago, 0xdeadbeef said:

As someone upthread said, I think you intended to type "..not in uncharted territory..."

I'm not sure what "3 or 4 vaccines" you are referring to, but mRNA technology has never been approved for a drug or vaccine before these two Covid-19 ones.  Any data that was published would have been for a something that never made it out of trials.  Where long term studies done on any of those trial drugs? 

 

I thought the sars or mers vaccines were mRNA. 

https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news/coronavirus-pandemic-vaccine-updates-01-04-21/h_d4dfdf7e69b584eadf2ee395bffe3a27

Quote

The US Food and Drug Administration will meet this week to consider giving half-doses of Moderna’s Covid-19 vaccine to people aged 18 to 55.

The move could make the vaccine available to twice as many people in this age group, according to Moncef Slaoui, chief scientific adviser of Operation Warp Speed, the US government's vaccine program. 

Slaoui told CNN Chief Medical Correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta that the decision to cut the current 100-microgram dose in half, with another half-dose 28 days later, ultimately rests in the hands of the FDA.

Quote

Earlier data showed that binding and neutralizing antibody responses were similar among participants under 55 who received either 100-microgram or 50-microgram doses, Slaoui said. While an FDA briefing document last month also references these “comparable” immune responses from Moderna’s phase 2 study, the full data have not yet been published.

Slaoui said he’s “not sure it holds for Pfizer,” whose dose contains 30 micrograms. But that’s a conversation that has yet to happen, he added.

 

 

Planning on calling my asthma/allergy doc tomorrow, but was wondering my qualifications for 1B with the news that Texas is allowing 1B.

Late 40s, had asthma/allergies since birth, highly allergic to tree nuts. Carry EpiPen due to those and other allergic reactions I've tested for over the years, stings, etc.

Also overweight and take a low dose HBP pill.  I've had flu shot many times, without adverse reactions.

As far as I know, I haven't had the rona, no tests but also no obvious symptoms. 

have been fairly good to avoid the big crowds, bars, protests, Karens, etc.

 

As someone upthread said, I think you intended to type "..not in uncharted territory..."
I'm not sure what "3 or 4 vaccines" you are referring to, but mRNA technology has never been approved for a drug or vaccine before these two Covid-19 ones.  Any data that was published would have been for a something that never made it out of trials.  Where long term studies done on any of those trial drugs? 
 

He could be discussing siRNA approaches which a very similar to mRNA.

Here is a good article explaining the difference.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7250668/

How do they land on whether a vaccine will require 1, 2 or more doses? I assume there are trials that measure the effectiveness of each # but it also has the feeling of guessing that is best especially in an relatively quick trial period. 

Or was this based on previous mRNA vaccine trials that 2 offers the most effectiveness but 3 or more has high diminishing returns?

6 hours ago, Pablo said:

Planning on calling my asthma/allergy doc tomorrow, but was wondering my qualifications for 1B with the news that Texas is allowing 1B.

Late 40s, had asthma/allergies since birth, highly allergic to tree nuts. Carry EpiPen due to those and other allergic reactions I've tested for over the years, stings, etc.

Also overweight and take a low dose HBP pill.  I've had flu shot many times, without adverse reactions.

As far as I know, I haven't had the rona, no tests but also no obvious symptoms. 

have been fairly good to avoid the big crowds, bars, protests, Karens, etc.

 

One answer is that you just have to find the right doctor to approve it. Another answer is that I don't believe it requires a doctors script or a list. You can probably just claim to be 1B and wait in the line.

Long  line for the vaccine this morning.  There was another line coming from the other direction around the corner.

 

Talk about a super spreader event

Edited January 4, 2021 by midtown

6 minutes ago, midtown said:

Talk about a super spreader event

What does happen if you get the first shot right after you sucked in some covid from the dude next to there? 

7 minutes ago, midtown said:

Talk about a super spreader event

Joking aside, this is basically my primary fear about getting the vaccine right now.  I have avoided large gatherings for 10 months.  Voted by drive-thru.  Not going to stand in a 3-plus-hour line in a hallway and get COVID waiting on the vaccine.

What does happen if you get the first shot right after you sucked in some covid from the dude next to there? 

I’m not sure you can get Covid that way, but I’m not a doctor.

So, phrasing?

I actually am curious about that because I"m trying to figure out how to get my elderly parents in and they can't stand in line. 

14 minutes ago, Liquor and Poker said:

Joking aside, this is basically my primary fear about getting the vaccine right now.  I have avoided large gatherings for 10 months.  Voted by drive-thru.  Not going to stand in a 3-plus-hour line in a hallway and get COVID waiting on the vaccine.

Why we have not figured out a way to do drive through vaccinations amazes me. Apply online, they send you a confirmation, go to the nearest place and get the damn vaccine while listening to your favorite music. My father and MiL (who has stage 4 cancer) are very hesitant about going anywhere to get the vaccine.   

1 minute ago, InkaUtexas said:

Why we have not figured out a way to do drive through vaccinations amazes me. Apply online, they send you a confirmation, go to the nearest place and get the damn vaccine while listening to your favorite music. My father and MiL (who has stage 4 cancer) are very hesitant about going anywhere to get the vaccine.   

"Figuring out" requires someone first "trying to figure it out."  That's the part that hasn't happened here.