Chuckie Finster

Can’t remember if this graph has been posted on here, but it should be pinned to the top of every page. People are globally unhappy with the state of the economy. That’s what determined this election, period. There are many things the Democratic Party can and should do to correct its messaging, which I’ve detailed in the Jamie Harrison thread, but it would not have made a substantial difference this year. Anyone, on here or otherwise, trying to convince you that there is something uniquely wrong with the American Democratic Party or the specific candidate chosen is merely gaslighting you while taking a victory lap.

Not a single comment from any of them to this.

To be very clear, nobody mocks you for your values. They mock you because you are clearly insane.

He's right. This map is a "we want change" map, not a referendum on a specific candidate.

Likewise I’m sure the wise GOP will be introspective enough to realize that they benefitted greatly from the state of the economy more than anything, and not double down on many of their largely unpopular social policies.

Humbly suggest that we add “2024 Democratic Party Post-Mortem” to the title of this thread, because it’s a discussion worth having and the problems extend far beyond Mr. Harrison. Why this year feels different than any other election for the last 20 years is that Democrats lost the popular vote. Every other year, the party could go back and say “America as a whole agrees with us, it’s the system that’s broken.” America gave that a huge middle finger on Tuesday. Now, first and foremost, I think the Democrats biggest problem was being in power during a period of inflation. Point blank. Looking at how elections have gone globally over the last few years, I think many of us (purposefully?) ignored what was happening to incumbents in this climate. That doesn’t mean there aren’t areas to improve, but I honestly don’t think a different candidate, focus on certain issues, etc. would have moved the needle enough to overcome inflation. That being said, there are a few giant alarm bells ringing that need to be addressed. 1) Illegal immigration is an issue that the American people really, really care about. It’s okay to oppose Republican policies (because many of them are very bad!) but it cannot stop at “because that’s racist.” Explain how financially, a wall is an ineffective waste of taxpayer funds that doesn’t stop the majority of illegal immigrants. Make the argument that Republicans are ineffective at curbing the problem, not that the problem doesn’t exist. (Kamala, I believe, had the correct tone here generally… but the damage was already done.) 2) Progressive ideas when it comes to jobs are widely popular. Progressive ideas when it comes to social issues are less so. Understand this, and don’t let the next primary turn into an oppo factory for the Republicans. 3) I have no fucking idea how to handle the trans issue, but it’s clear that it REALLY triggers folks despite the fact that 99.9% of the population will never have to deal with it. I guess just be careful about wording and don’t provide easily usable soundbites in commercials? 4) Go after the white male vote again. Get onto podcasts, be like Pete and go on Fox News, seek out college aged voices that look like they can bench more than 100 lbs. A lot of them suck but most of them are just normal people who want to feel heard. You probably won’t win the demographic, but at least make an effort and stop letting your enemy define you. For better or worse, white males are the “symbol” of the average American and abandoning that voting block feeds into the “Democrats don’t care about the average American” stereotype. It was not “cool” at all to be Republican in 2015 and they’ve managed to change that in less than a decade. Democrats need to reverse this. 5) Do NOT abandon abortion. This will continue to be a real-life issue and only get worse. It is not the reason for the loss this year. 6) This one hurts to write, but do not nominate a woman again until the Republicans do. I am a firm believer (although I talked myself out of it) that the first woman president will have to be a Republican. The “weak” attacks are too much to overcome for many, despite the fact that they are obvious bullshit. My initial thoughts after a couple sleeps. Happy to hear what others think as well.

Yeah no shit, Balcones is trolling.

I had numerous conversations with people where they expressed concerns about a draft and I genuinely had no idea what they were talking about. Guess it makes sense now.

He still doesn’t know, per the article he just posted 7 minutes ago.

Not meaning to point you out specifically but I think in general, little things like lumping Rogan and Tate together explains the trouble currently facing Democrats. Andrew Tate is a bad dude that actively preaches harmful ideas that the majority of us on this board, regardless of political views, would reject. I'm not sure he honestly believes everything he says, but who cares as long as it gets him attention. Joe Rogan is a stereotypical "bro." He can be easily influenced at times by certain ideology some of us may reject, but at his core I believe that he respects women, tries to contribute positively to society, etc. Lumping everyone who might lean towards right wing ideas into one bucket is how you radicalize center-right men.

The vast majority of this thread is legitimate discussion as to why the Democratic party has alienated young men, i.e. the exact same thing you guys have been screaming for a while. But instead of contributing, you feel the need to say batshit like "liberal women are unattractive and annoying and probably not married." Just fucking bullshit that has no purpose other than trolling.

Jesus Christ, we are trying to have a sincere fucking conversation here and get bullshit like this thrown into the mix.

I know many on here disagreed about my insistence that she do it, but the Joe Rogan interview is a good summation. The goal was never to "win" the interview, it was to show young men that you are at least attempting to reach out to them. It's obvious that it wouldn't have mattered in the long run, but "Kamala had time for SNL but not for Rogan" is a hell of a confirmation for what a lot of them currently think about the Democratic party.

Your points contradict themselves. The three biggest issues would have plagued ANY candidate the Dems put forward. I get it’s fun to dunk on Kamala specifically right now, but there is nothing she - or any other candidate - could have done to overcome the current perception of the Democratic Party in this county.

Correct, but there are tens of millions of people like yourself who were voting red no matter what this year, and retroactively trying to reconcile that with candidate choice is a waste of time for everyone involved.

There is nothing she could have done that would have won your vote.

This was my original conclusion, although I’ve inadvertently let myself get away from it. Look around the map: Democratic candidates of all types were trounced last night. Much like the rest of the world, this is a bad time for the party in power. 2008 Obama would have lost last night.

Ignoring the actual voting habits of the American electorate is how we got here. Or we can run Rashida Tlaib in 2028 and try to lose all 50 states!

The issue is that Trump gives them what they want because they flatter him. Vance gives them what they want because he’s one of them and a true believer. There’s a big difference.

It’s the party of JD Vance now. He’s cleaned up a lot of the awkwardness that plagued him at first. He’ll step in and carry the torch without missing a beat.

Absolutely. But until we do, “let’s run a qualified female candidate and surely the American people will come to their senses” can no longer be the strategy for a Party that wants to win.

1) don’t be the party in power when inflation hits 2) don’t run a woman again, ever The only soul searching needed, the rest is noise.

People loathe the democrats because they’re the party expected to be the adults in the room, so when things go wrong it’s obviously their fault. Trump is about to have the Senate, House, and a popular vote mandate yet he will still blame Democrats anytime anything bad happens, and everyone in this thread currently lecturing the Democrats about personal responsibility will go along with it.

This is such a complete and total rebuke that there’s no point in analyzing specific things that the Dems may or may not have done wrong. It’s like criticizing specific play calls when asking why Colorado State wasn’t able to keep the game closer against us. The electorate wanted to vote red this cycle, period. In hindsight, nothing else mattered.

In 2016, I was shocked that he won but instantly became more plugged into politics and there was an underlying desire to fight against Trump and his policies. I get that it’s still fresh, but this time I just kind of want to unplug and get away. What’s the point?