Lloyd Christmas

They got in because they were already #3. if Ou was #5 going into the final rankings, they likely do not get because they had no CCG to play. I even have history to back me up. Ohio state was #5 before their CCG in 2014 put them in to the playoffs. This was of course after TCU, not having played a CCG, dropped two spots to #5. Michigan state was #5 before their CCG in 2015 put them in to the playoffs. Tell me this, has there ever been a team ranked outside the top 4 actually make it in without a CCG? I dont think so. That would definitely support your position though. There seems to be more data to support my position than yours. My feelings about this conference have nothing to do with OU or the playoffs. OU will be fine no matter what. So of course you dont get it if you assume it's all about OU. It's not, it's about so much more than just my team.

I said it DOES matter. Not sure where your " So if it doesn't matter why say it?" comes into play here. Anyone with a brain has been wanting to leave this dumpster fire of a conference for a while now. I'm glad OU leadership has been spearheading that.

Except that it's not. They a have more teams ranked (meaning the collective opinion of many people agree with me). A hell of a lot more nfl draft picks, both overall and average per team (So nfl scouts agree with me). They have had much more success in the playoffs since it's inception, 4 different sec teams have won the natty since 2007 so on the field results agree with me. This has caused perceptions to shift and now they are getting all the best talent (as indicated by recruiting rankings, which indicates who the recruits want to play for, so the recruits agree too). We can change the perception but it stars with talent and we arent getting all the best talent like we used to. And that creates its own feedback loop where they just all go and recruit the best talent, win trophies and send them to the nfl. Kids see that and it's affecting everyone elses ability to be competitive. Luckily for us Ou and Texas have the juice to keep going and do something any given year but the others really dont. Our 2nd tier teams and their 2nd tier teams are IMO far apart.

I never suggested you cant get in without it. Obviously you can. I suggested having it makes it more likely that we do get a team in. It sure helped that OU was ranked as the #3 team going into Championship saturday. And they still dropped a spot to 4th and barely got in. Lets say they were ranked 5 or 6 going into championship saturday with no game to play. Do they get in? It's MUCH LESS likely they move up a spot despite not playing. And to use 2015 as an example, Michigan state with the same 11-1 record as OU was ranked 5th going into the final weekend. They play and win their CCG and get propelled to #3 and a trip to the playoffs. It really goes both ways. Again, what's more likely, the Big 12 favorite losing or winning? Winning. And i think history shows us that the favorite wins more often than not. Therefore giving us a better chance to get a team in the playoffs. Can you refute with facts or more opinion?

Huh? I was saying they play better competition in the sec than we do in the Big 12. How is that even up for debate? And yes sec teams neg recruit Big 12 schools and all they have to do is compare schedules. OU does just fine recruiting.

Not sure what you mean. When did I cry about anything? And when have I ever mentioned playing ISU for anything at all? You must be thinking of someone else. Maybe, but the results speak for themselves. They are getting the beset talent, and that talent is translating to the nfl. And we are left on the outside looking in. We have to get better.

I think most seasons, that extra game would be more likely to strengthen the Big 12's best team's viability in the playoffs than to weaken it. Assuming of course the favorite wins, that would always be the case. Obviously if the favorite loses, they wont be getting in. But you seem to only be looking at the potential downside (while possible, is also unlikely) of the underdog winning. However there are two sides to that coin and the other side is a significant improvement in the likelihood of the Big 12 getting a team in the playoffs. For example, when all the other conferences are playing a CCG on Championship Saturday and if the Big 12 favorite is ranked outside the top 4, we would likely need that CCG victory to propel them into the top 4. Obviously other factors would have to come into play here, but I dont see how this would NOT be good if the Big 12 favorite isnt a top 4 team going into the final rankings. I can easily see how a 11 win Texas or Oklahoma would get snubbed for a 12 win champ of any other conference. But it's a lot harder to snub a 12 win big 12 champ. Just looking at liklihoods and chances. I think most times, the favorite will win the CCG and worth the risk of the underdog winning. Dont we have stats on this? how often the fav has won vs the underdog in the Big 12 ccg? Not a straw man. I am not saying they play them every year, but those are their conference mates, that's most of who they will be playing during their time at whatever school they choose. The rotations change and they know who they'll be playing over their 4 years. And it's better competition than we have in the big 12 currently. which is something that matters to kids who want to go to the nfl, and they see how the Big 12 fares every draft (hint, not all that good compared to others).

Baseball is a whole different ballgame. 'Scuse the pun. Most prospects are in the farm system for 4-6 years before being called up so it changes how you draft. Since there's 40 rounds to the MLB draft, and the avg pick is not expected to be MLB ready for 4-6 years, they have a lot of leeway to draft on potential. All that said, since it takes time to develop they draft often on where they think a person will be in a few years. Maybe in the first round they expect to see more out of them sooner than 4 years. So in Murray's case, he had a pretty dismal .122 batting average last year but in 2018 he's up to .296 and has shown power too. So project his improvements over the next 2-4 years to go along with his undeniable athleticism and that's not getting into his fielding. I dont envy the jobs of a baseball scout though.

Nope, just a football fan who isn't a blind homer and who wants the Big 12 to be better. i can recognize a thing for what it is without my fanhood getting in the way. Conference perception means a hell of a lot to them. Not always for Ou and Texas but the sec has been getting kids that should be on one of our rosters. And if the other 8 teams dont get better, that will make it harder to convince elite nfl bound athletes to come to either of our programs. After OU and Texas, the next best class in 2018 was TCU at 25. Sec teams ahead of them: S. carolina, tennessee, aggy, lsu, florida, auburn, georgia and alabama. The f8cking sec has 8 of the top 20 classes in the country. And 4 of them arent good and definitely below TCU for the past few years. The aggy program is a shiny turd of dog shit and they currently have the #2 class in '19. And guess what? The f8cking sec has 9 of the top 20 in 2019 too! And we have 3, again. We are battling a perception problem and they are showing these recruits the nfl draft results too. Winning will help no doubt about it, but we have to change this perception because all the best talent in the country had been overlooking the big 12 for a while.

I can appreciate that- but i think it matters to teh recruits too. They look at sec schedules for example and they see alabama, auburn, lsu, georgia, florida on the schedule. The same players being recruited by Ou and Tx and we got iowa state, kansas state, baylor. I can see how negging the big 12 is helping. Sure Texas and OU has the stones to schedule big time OOC matchups but that's once a year, and the rest of the schedule looks like pop warner football. But hey at least the AD raked in 187 million last year.

They've never not made money. Money has never been an issue. They are making shitloads of it and this is the result. Who cares about how much more money a program is bringing in if it's not helping anything other than make an incredibly rich athletic dept who makes 100 million a year even richer? Its like it's great n all, glad you can pay your bills. But all this money is coming indirectly from the fans and we're not getting much out of that investment. So i can't see why i should care that big whoop, 30 teams made 100 million last year.

Well I never once at all ever suggested that the conference lost some of its luster because of any teams that have left. That never even crossed my mind for a second. Conference lost its luster because other conferences were winning championships, and putting players into the NFL At a higher rate. Not just more overall because of more teams but at a higher rate per team. And because no one else other than Oklahoma was doing anything. And because of that and other factors, other conferences have leap frogged us and we have lost a ton of ground. I’m not arguing against the Big 12 still being a strong conference when Texas becomes good again, but they’ll still be behind the other two conferences. I don’t think Texas being good would make the difference and overcome that deficit is what I mean. Not until we are both consistently top five top 10, and a couple other teams continue to pull their weight. The thing about the SEC and the big 10, is that they too possess two top-flight programs at the top who will be highly competitive and they have others who will be mainstays in the top 15 top 20. Is the best maybe we can do is hope to get a equal reputation. It won’t happen overnight

Damn it sucks when mom won’t let you out of the basement doesn’t it?

I don’t know what the hell you’re talking about here, it’s really too early in the day to be tripping on acid man. And yes The qualifier most people is indeed very relevant here, and the results speak for themselves. Don’t have to be an SEC homer to realize the truth

Umm I went to OU. And it’s true that we (the big 12) had been much more relevant ten years ago compared to now. How is the even in doubt? The recruits know it! Just look at recruiting rankings. Sec has 9 teams in the top 25 of class rankings. We have 3. The nfl knows it. 53 draft picks and we only had 20, the worst of all P5 conferences. The next worse was 30. Even the all American conference has 18. We have to do much better if we want to be a viable influential conference because the recruits that are the lifeblood of a program are all looking at sec. he’ll just nabbing a commit from a kid with a Bama offer is a victory anymore. Even those losers in college station have the best class in Texas

Missouri is soft. And yeah their whole conference is just a bunch of stragglers and Alabama

Yes they have been mainstays as good teams recently, but you referenced seasons before 2009, and OSU was not consistent before that. If they can stay consistently good in Texas can pull their weight then yeah the big 12 will have a great reputation again. I am just saying he will definitely take more than a resurgence of Texas to bring the big 12 back to the front

What do I care how much texas earns in football revenue every year? Congrats, they do less with more resources than anyone else. And what does aggy have to do with anything? I am not a fan of that school. I do not care about them. I am simply expressing my opinion which is shared by most people about the SEC’s dominance in college football, and how the big 12 has lost a lot of its luster. And yes absolutely perception does matter because we have to live with the fact that humans determine the rankings. We also have a perception issue with recruits, and it showing on the recruiting trail, which is showing on the field, which is also showing results in the NFL draft. And the big 12 trophy case isn’t looking at stacked as it used to. It’s a big ole cycle and we have found ourselves on the outside of it, when we used to drive that bus.

Right on, thank you for your astute assessment.

Well We do have occasional help from teams like Missouri and Texas Tech and Oklahoma State. Even KSU and even Kansas in 07. Not every year of course but occasionally those teams did rise pretty far. I think the real difference though is in the Second tier teams in the big 12 compared to the second tier teams in the SEC.

Yes but, that’s really more a reflection of how they felt about Alabama. Plus they have a bad loss to another team who was in the playoffs as well. But if you recall Ohio State got in in the same manner and won a championship a few years ago too. It’s true that the SEC has had a good track record before that, but in 2008 The Big 12 and SEC were pretty much considered equal at that point but SEC was trending and now we are where we’re at. Remember in 2008 the big 12 south had 3 teams in the top 5 deep into November. Then both OU and TX were down from that

I see you respect them more than I do, good for you.

Tiny is relative. The pictures I sent you were supposed to be private

You think I’m an Aggie? Lol

Blame the iPhone.