I've listened to every episode of the jocko podcast and I still don't know. The answer is neither, and both. There's this weird overlapping group that includes Rogan, Jocko, and Jordan Peterson that I don't really understand and makes me a little skeptical. Jocko has a particular worldview that's fairly transparent but also a little hard to nail down. He started a podcast shortly after he did Rogan's and Tim Ferris' podcast so I think he pulled his original listener group from there. The jocko/rogan overlap came through jiu jitsu/MMA. He has some fantastic guests if you're interested in military history with a heavy lean towards seals and the wars since 2001. The focus is somewhat mixed between great stories and leadership lessons. I have a healthy appreciation for the leadership/discipline stuff. His fanbase does seem a little nutty on social media and he's turned his leadership consultant company, podcast and books into some kind of a movement. Fair warning, his "cohost" is blah and it takes a minute before the podcast hits a decent stride.