GW Hayduke

This thread is dumb

This is good. We should shift almost all of our energy and policies into economic issues and put culture war on the back burner. The hurdle though is that culture war is a winning issue for the GOP, they have dark money and twitter, etc. to keep it at the top of everyone's social media feed, and the people in our society most affected by the proposed economic policies (higher taxes on the wealthy) are the ones feeding the dark money propaganda that give the GOP their culture war power. I'm not saying we shouldn't do it, but the more we double down on "tax the rich" the more the rich will feed the GOP propaganda machine. Hopefully it isn't too late - but I think somehow we will need fix the playing field and address things like campaign finance, citizens united, misinformation, a fairness doctrine for the digital age. There should be no way that a political actor like Elon can control a social media site. There should be no way that single billionaire can contribute $50 million to elect someone in the US. We would need a new supreme court to make it happen though. It feels like there are too many hurdles.

That is why the GOP fights the fight in the culture war arena and not the economic arena. Guns, gods, and gays allows the undereducated and non-wealthy to vote against their economic interests. The democrats need to leave the culture war arena and make the fight in the economic arena - affordable healthcare, affordable childcare, affordable housing, access to higher education, and tax the rich. Identity politics is loser politics when the economic policies are on your side.

I don't believe facts or anything real controlled the outcome of this election. The things that seems to matter these days are people's perception of reality, their feelings and vibes, and messaging. It isn't about policies or what actually happened in the past. It is about what people feel happened in the past and people's vibes on a candidate. Maybe that has always been true to a certain extent, but today's propaganda tools have turned it up to 11. Elections these days are controlled by the billions in dark money unleashed by Citizens United and the use of that money to maximize the effectiveness of algorithms and AI to target voters to craft alternative realties and nudge voting blocks in various directions - to turn up at the polls or to suppress turnout. There is a reason Elon purchased twitter. It wasn't so he could turn a profit. It was to exert power within our democracy. Hopefully, democrats aren't too far behind in being able to exert influence within all the information bubbles out there. The fact that inflation was working so hard against Harris gives me some hope. The notion that Trump somehow is a generational con man and when he is gone MAGA will die, gives me a glimmer of hope. But when I look at how buffoonish Trump is, at how obviously corrupt he is, and how morally bankrupt MAGA is, and the fact Dems couldn't use all of that effectively to win, makes me think Dems might be too far behind to catch up.

I don’t know what Dems should do either. I just know the GOP used it to totally fuck Dems. The potential exists that it might not matter what the actual policies or issues are. The possibility exists that the GOP has perfected the use of social media targeting tools and combined it with billions of dollars in dark money and now have the whole population control thing perfected with AI or something. I’m looking for answers

This is bigger than what just Kamala did. This is about the what the democratic party needs to do.

One idea is for the Dems to move away from culture war and identity politics and stick to winning positions like - affordable chidlcare, affordable healthcare, affordable access to higher education, tax the rich, worker's rights, consumer's rights - stick to winning economic issues and drop all culture war issues.

It was a cornerstone of the GOP campaign ads. Campaign ads that contributed to capaign that dominated. Why would you think the cornerstone of the GOP's campaign ads didn't contribute to the outcome of the election? Trans issues are political losers for the dems. It sucks, but that is reality.

I haven't been keeping up with this thread. The economoist's data guy thinks Trump is leading. "Our presidential forecast currently gives Donald Trump a 56% chance to win the presidential election. That’s about a ten percentage point shift from where we were last week when it was Harris who was nearly a 5545 favourite. So you could still say that the race is pretty close to a coin toss, but it’s gone from one that was slightly weighted towards Harris to one that is slightly weighted towards Trump, and a ten percentage point move is meaningful." https://www.economist.com/podcasts/2024/10/24/the-economists-election-model-puts-trump-in-the-lead

Probably because no one told the secret service about the guy on the roof. I'm not sure why there is confusion.

No way we are gonna fall for the old Hillary’s emails in a tailpipe trick again. This is why Elon purchased Twitter. The really shitty thing is seeing the times and cnn partake.

What a dumbass. A middling no-name senator fucks up and says some stupid shit in a closed door setting and then goes on TV trying to fix and then and says some more stupid shit. I'm often amazed how someone with such incompetence becomes a US senator.

He just needs to make it past election night. He has built a huge apparatus that will continue to run no matter what happens to him - no matter if Kamala takes over. They will continue to appoint judges, help Ukraine, implement policies like drug reform and education, and depending what the legislative branch does - hopefully pass some legislation. That will all continue if elected. If he loses - we get the dismantling of our government and democracy.

Biden's cognition is fine - no matter what a couple statements at a single debate when he had the cold shown over and over on ticktock/twitter tells you. His cognition is so fine that he was able to build and manage the best white house administration this country has seen in 50 years. That is the metric of cognition that matters. Everything else is just twitter BS.

In case you are unaware: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_Democratic_Party_presidential_primaries

Yeah. Definitely not the ideal situation. But it is the one we have in front of us. Trump is a dangerous mother fucker. He would dismantle our government and democracy. That is why every needs to quite the bickering and support the democratic candidate - even if that candidate changes.

I know it would probably suck to hear all of that if you were a Bernie Bro. But it doesn't matter what you think about Kamala or Pete or whoever. Joe is our candidate. There isn't anything you can do about it. There was a process. We held a primary. The people voted. Joe won. Then it was up to Joe whether he stays in. He has said he is staying in. That is that. Joe is the Democratic candidate to beat Trump. Get with the program. Get on board.

You might be right, but that's exactly what Trump would like to see. Joe is our best bet to minimize the probability Trump wins.

Yep. Biden gives us the best shot IMO. It isn't Kamala who was like 6th or 7th in the 2020 primary and couldn't make it to the first caucus. It isn't Bernie who was second in the 2020 dem primary. He is 82 years old and all the ageists have told us what that means. It isn't Pete, Warren, or Klobuchar. The Bernie Bros ditched Clinton and gave the white house to Trump because they felt cheated even though Bernie lost the popular vote as well as the electors. Imagine how they will react when the nominee actually lost the primary. It is ride or die with Joe. Maybe we make a switch. I'll support that person 100%. But it will be like when Charlie Strong lost to Kansas.

The poll was taken immediately after the debate. It is far from over. It has the be. There isn't a viable alternative. - Biden does need to show much better during his public showings - hit the campaign trail, get on TV, drop the cold meds, kick ass at the next debate, etc. - The media and Dem talking heads needs to get their acts together. The NYT and other mainstream outlets (CNN) pushing horserace BS is fucking shit up. NYT constantly trying to put trump back in the white house is weird as fuck.

A few musings on our current situation. - The goal should be to maximize the probability Trump and the current version of the GOP do not take the white house. - Biden beat Trump once. He has a lot to run on - has been the best president in the last 50 years, has passed a ton of meaningful legislation, has been a moral and decent individual, fixed the economy, fixed our relationships with our allies, and is standing with Ukraine against Russia. - Biden does need to show much better during his public showings - hit the campaign trail, get on TV, drop the cold meds, kick ass at the next debate, etc. - I don't see how there can be another viable replacement. Some see Kamala as the obvious choice to replace Biden, but she couldn't make it to the first caucus in the Democratic Primary in 2020. She was like 7th or 8th in the field of democrats. Plus, being VP doesn't make you the best candidate - it just means you were willing to take the VP job, that you had the identity to help shore up particular demographics, and that you complimented the president. Being VP doesn't mean you are better than Bernie, Pete, or Elizabeth. Plus, remember all the Bernie bros who felt cheated in 2016 and refused to vote for Hillary helping put Trump in the white house even though Bernie lost the popular count and the delegate count. Now imagine what will happen when we choose someone who literally didn't win the primary - Imagine who all would be staying home under that scenario. - The media and Dem talking heads needs to get their acts together. The NYT and other mainstream outlets pushing horserace BS is fucking shit up. NYT constantly trying to put trump back in the white house is weird as fuck. The bottom line is that we need Joe. I see him as the only viable candidate to beat trump. However, he needs to step up in a big way, Dems need to rally around him, and the media needs to stop fucking around and do their jobs - push felon, rape, project 2025, supreme court, etc. instead of Biden drama.

Makes sense. Your standard is vibes and feelings and doesn't consider the effectiveness of government to make the lives of US citizens better or to increase our standing on the world stage.