Dismantling the warriors

And..............

 

 

35 minutes ago, d2o said:

This thread is a disaster.

GSW will be fine with a healthy Klay and Dray along with Steph, Wiseman and whatever high pick they get next summer.  Although they might be better off trying to couple that pick with Wiggins and maybe talk Beal into a S&T.   Regardless, shit changes pretty quickly in the league so with a move or two they can be right back in it.    Giving up Steph and Klay will only be done if they ask out.

Simple question- do you think Steph wins another title as a warrior? I say no. Do with that what you wish as to what golden state should do from there. 
I will even go so far as to say I don’t think they will be another serious threat for a title while he’s there. 

Just now, Wulaw Horn said:

Simple question- do you think Steph wins another title as a warrior? I say no. Do with that what you wish as to what golden state should do from there. 
I will even go so far as to say I don’t think they will be another serious threat for a title while he’s there. 

Meh, maybe but it takes a whole lot of things to win a title and that isn't the only thing there is.     That franchise hadnt won for 40 yrs before he helped get them there. I think doing right by the guys that got you somewhere you hadnt been in multiple generations is way more important to the long term well being of the franchise.   If he asks out that's another thing.    Dumping him for possibles isnt a good plan.  Its not like trading him would guarantee them a title or even guarantee them to be in contention.

36 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

I’m not saying Denver would do it- I’m saying they might consider it if they thought pairing  Steph and joker could win them a title. 
Also I’m not saying Washington would do it but maybe Beal wants out and something like that is the best offer. 
It’s interesting though that you are arguing not enough from golden state and others are arguing “Wulaw’s proposed new team is dogshit horrible”.   I’m more of the opinion you are correct and not the other side arguing the dubs aren’t getting enough here. 
Of course it’s fan fiction- everything we do here is mental masterbation. If the warriors did trade off their pieces it looks nothing like what I suggested I’m sure- I was just kicking shit around I’m my head. 

It's a fair point that most sports threads on the site are fan fiction, but most of the stuff we discuss is at least rooted in some sense of legitimate reporting.  Whether it be Woj, Shams, Stein, or some beat writer, there's generally some reason to tie two teams together or some trade scenarios.  I don't see that here so it's hard to take seriously.  The Wizards trade especially is pretty silly and 99.9% not going to happen so why discuss it?  It's like saying..... "what if Anthony Davis gets pissed Lebron made a joke about his eyebrows and decides he wants to get traded before the deadline, what about this?".  Could it happen?  Sure, but it's so farfetched it's not really worth speculating about. 

FWIW, I do agree with you that a dispassionate evaluator who had no ties to the organization or players would strongly consider trading either Klay, Steph, or both.  Old Branch Rickey theory, trade them one year early than late.  But I don't think this is the situation and Myers, Kerr and company have real emotional and personal ties to these guys, as well as..... they sell out (or would in a post COVID world).  However, if you want to play this game, what do you think Klay Thompson could realistically garner in a trade?  Do we think that next year's Minny pick or Wiseman would have to be attached to find a taker for that contract and to get anything of value?  Who has a year to burn?  Who wants a 30 something coming off not only ACL but Achilles surgery?  There's probably someone out there, but who and why and what would they consider moving?

I don't think Washington is giving Beal for Klay and declining Draymond.  Frankly, the salary cap space would be more valuable for such a team.  Maybe a team like Sacramento who isn't close but needs to excite a fanbase with a built in known quantity in California?  Who wants a soon to be 33 year old aging all-time superstar?  Could a team like Cleveland consider a Klay?  Maybe some sort of Love for Klay/1st swap?  Dallas?  What do they got?  Miami?  Herro, Robinson, Precious, draft picks and filler for Curry?  I don't know and these seem far fetched but at least speculate in something which may make some sense.  Teams aren't giving up young stars for Draymond or probably even Klay anymore.

 

5 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

It's a fair point that most sports threads on the site are fan fiction, but most of the stuff we discuss is at least rooted in some sense of legitimate reporting.  Whether it be Woj, Shams, Stein, or some beat writer, there's generally some reason to tie two teams together or some trade scenarios.  I don't see that here so it's hard to take seriously.  The Wizards trade especially is pretty silly and 99.9% not going to happen so why discuss it?  It's like saying..... "what if Anthony Davis gets pissed Lebron made a joke about his eyebrows and decides he wants to get traded before the deadline, what about this?".  Could it happen?  Sure, but it's so farfetched it's not really worth speculating about. 

FWIW, I do agree with you that a dispassionate evaluator who had no ties to the organization or players would strongly consider trading either Klay, Steph, or both.  Old Branch Rickey theory, trade them one year early than late.  But I don't think this is the situation and Myers, Kerr and company have real emotional and personal ties to these guys, as well as..... they sell out (or would in a post COVID world).  However, if you want to play this game, what do you think Klay Thompson could realistically garner in a trade?  Do we think that next year's Minny pick or Wiseman would have to be attached to find a taker for that contract and to get anything of value?  Who has a year to burn?  Who wants a 30 something coming off not only ACL but Achilles surgery?  There's probably someone out there, but who and why and what would they consider moving?

I don't think Washington is giving Beal for Klay and declining Draymond.  Frankly, the salary cap space would be more valuable for such a team.  Maybe a team like Sacramento who isn't close but needs to excite a fanbase with a built in known quantity in California?  Who wants a soon to be 33 year old aging all-time superstar?  Could a team like Cleveland consider a Klay?  Maybe some sort of Love for Klay/1st swap?  Dallas?  What do they got?  Miami?  Herro, Robinson, Precious, draft picks and filler for Curry?  I don't know and these seem far fetched but at least speculate in something which may make some sense.  Teams aren't giving up young stars for Draymond or probably even Klay anymore.

 

Dray, Westbrook and Klay might get you a 4 seed in Washington and that’s about the best they’ve ever been in 40 years would be my argument for that. 

Sacto probably makes more sense but

you are right- the play is for some mid to lower market team who wants to garner a 5 or 6 seed to trade for them because that’s their version of “winning.”  But for it to make sense for

Golden State you’d have to get a star back. Or someone else really good. I don’t have any real idea, obviously, but I don’t know- maybe something like Kyrie from Brooklyn next year I’d say the rockets traded harden there and then they couldn’t coexist. It’s have to be a weird situation where another team had a superfluous star and they thought those guys skills and Pedigree could get them over the top, or a place that’s totally cool with being a 5 or 6 seed. Washington struck me as that type of team is all. 
mans yeah- I think you are right about Myers and Kerr, but I don’t get the feeling that ownership is wired that way- and they sign the checks, so... my call to dismantle the warriors. 
I’m not going to keep after this all year but will check back to see how things look at the midpoint and again after the year is over. 

I definitely cannot imagine Lacob would force Myers/Kerr's hand to dump them.    

2 minutes ago, d2o said:

I definitely cannot imagine Lacob would force Myers/Kerr's hand to dump them.    

I think his arrogance know zero bounds. I think anything is in play with him 

5 hours ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Murray

Beale

Wiggins

MPjr

Wiseman. 

2 high lotto picks in 2021. 

Thats a group that could compete for a title for years and years and years

They could definitely win a conference title if they were in the SEC or Pac 12. But they're going to run into trouble when they face ACC or Big 10 teams in the tournament.

 

1 hour ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Simple question- do you think Steph wins another title as a warrior? I say no. Do with that what you wish as to what golden state should do from there. 
I will even go so far as to say I don’t think they will be another serious threat for a title while he’s there. 

But you are right about this, unless something drastic happens.

2 minutes ago, HornOnTheBayou said:

They could definitely win a conference title if they were in the SEC or Pac 12. But they're going to run into trouble when they face ACC or Big 10 teams in the tournament.

 

But you are right about this, unless something drastic happens.

I’m a big picture ideas guy. Someone smarter than me can execute. 
but I seriously think y’all are underestimating that team in 2 or 3 years with improvement from Porter, Wiseman and picking high twice in the 21 draft. 

Edited December 27, 2020 by Wulaw Horn

55 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

I’m a big picture ideas guy. Someone smarter than me can execute. 
but I seriously think y’all are underestimating that team in 2 or 3 years with improvement from Porter, Wiseman and picking high twice in the 21 draft. 

So they would be Sacramento?  Sign me up for that.

Edited December 27, 2020 by conVINCEd

5 hours ago, Wulaw Horn said:

I’m not saying Denver would do it- I’m saying they might consider it if they thought pairing  Steph and joker could win them a title. 
Also I’m not saying Washington would do it but maybe Beal wants out and something like that is the best offer. 
[b]It’s interesting though that you are arguing not enough from golden state and others are arguing “Wulaw’s proposed new team is dogshit horrible”.   I’m more of the opinion you are correct and not the other side arguing the dubs aren’t getting enough here. [/b]
Of course it’s fan fiction- everything we do here is mental masterbation. If the warriors did trade off their pieces it looks nothing like what I suggested I’m sure- I was just kicking shit around I’m my head. 

Both of those things can be and are true. 

 

Saw that on SC this morning. 

Hard to believe the Warriors are so bad but happened to Spurs too.  

56 minutes ago, Horn80 said:

Hard to believe the Warriors are so bad but happened to Spurs too.  

Hey, we’re 2-0 goddamnit!

1 hour ago, Horn80 said:

Hard to believe the Warriors are so bad but happened to Spurs too.  

Glad you brought up the spurs. The reason the spurs made the playoffs 22 straight years is because they never blew it up and gave up their championship core even as they were aging and declining. Around 2008 they stopped vet chasing and started adding younger pieces to the mix. And mind you they were doing this at the bottom of the first round and not in the top 5. They ended up with George Hill who begat Kawhi and if not for him being a huge twat, they would have gone on about a 32 year playoff run. This is the path for the warriors. Let the young guys invigorate the vets and take some of the heavy lifting while the vets teach them the culture and how to act and be champions. Getting rid of any of their big 3 would be monumentally stupid. 

17 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Glad you brought up the spurs. The reason the spurs made the playoffs 22 straight years is because they never blew it up and gave up their championship core even as they were aging and declining. Around 2008 they stopped vet chasing and started adding younger pieces to the mix. And mind you they were doing this at the bottom of the first round and not in the top 5. They ended up with George Hill who begat Kawhi and if not for him being a huge twat, they would have gone on about a 32 year playoff run. This is the path for the warriors. Let the young guys invigorate the vets and take some of the heavy lifting while the vets teach them the culture and how to act and be champions. Getting rid of any of their big 3 would be monumentally stupid. 

Bingo!  They already have a great young piece in Wiseman and should be able to add another with the MIN pick.   Add them in and let them learn from the greats while they are still great.    Then the young guys can take over as they start to wane.   That is how you bridge to the future.   Blowing up and tanking cheats your fans and there isnt even a guarantee that it works.

I agree, but would not include Draymond in the protected group. He has been key to their success and his brash style plays well when he can back it up on the court. But he is going to become a liability as his abilities start to fade. Both on the court and in the locker room IMO. He was largely responsible for losing KD.

I would try to trade him for a more skilled version of himself that is also good in the locker room. Like an Al Horford or Brook Lopez or Serge Ibaka. Or trade him and a draft pick to get a younger player. Maybe Myles Turner.

Draymond falling from DPOY / All-Defense level has been a huge reason why GS is slipping.

6 minutes ago, HookEm said:

I agree, but would not include Draymond in the protected group. He has been key to their success and his brash style plays well when he can back it up on the court. But he is going to become a liability as his abilities start to fade. Both on the court and in the locker room IMO. He was largely responsible for losing KD.

I would try to trade him for a more skilled version of himself that is also good in the locker room. Like an Al Horford or Brook Lopez or Serge Ibaka. Or trade him and a draft pick to get a younger player. Maybe Myles Turner.

Draymond falling from DPOY / All-Defense level has been a huge reason why GS is slipping.

A more skilled version of Draymond?  I’ll take two if they’re available.

5 minutes ago, HookEm said:

I agree, but would not include Draymond in the protected group. He has been key to their success and his brash style plays well when he can back it up on the court. But he is going to become a liability as his abilities start to fade. Both on the court and in the locker room IMO. He was largely responsible for losing KD.

I would try to trade him for a more skilled version of himself that is also good in the locker room. Like an Al Horford or Brook Lopez or Serge Ibaka. Or trade him and a draft pick to get a younger player. Maybe Myles Turner.

Draymond falling from DPOY / All-Defense level has been a huge reason why GS is slipping.

Meh, he barely played last yr and hasnt yet this yr.     I have HATED his on court whining but I actually think he would be a very good mentor for Wiseman.   I wouldn't say he should be untouchable but you better be right on his replacement as he was a HUGE reason they were successful.

Glad you brought up the spurs. The reason the spurs made the playoffs 22 straight years is because they never blew it up and gave up their championship core even as they were aging and declining. Around 2008 they stopped vet chasing and started adding younger pieces to the mix. And mind you they were doing this at the bottom of the first round and not in the top 5. They ended up with George Hill who begat Kawhi and if not for him being a huge twat, they would have gone on about a 32 year playoff run. This is the path for the warriors. Let the young guys invigorate the vets and take some of the heavy lifting while the vets teach them the culture and how to act and be champions. Getting rid of any of their big 3 would be monumentally stupid. 

And it's pretty obvious that strategy has paid off as the undefeated first place Spurs are clearly the best team in the league.

Who knows, maybe Draymond will age like fine wine. He is a great passer for sure and he has a very high basketball IQ.

But... last year he shot 39% from the floor. That is horrid for a big guy. His rebounding has slipped from almost 10 a game to 6 last year. His steals + blocks are down from 3.4 at his peak to 2.2 last year. His offensive boards are 1/3 what they were at his peak. His VORP has slipped from 5.3 in his prime to 0.6 last year.

And it wasn’t like a sudden drop. Every year has been worse than the previous one in just about every category. And he is barely 30. What will he be like at 34?

Kevin Love would be an interesting trade and could give you boards and assists with much better scoring and efficiency. Defense would clearly be a step down.

2 hours ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Glad you brought up the spurs. The reason the spurs made the playoffs 22 straight years is because they never blew it up and gave up their championship core even as they were aging and declining. Around 2008 they stopped vet chasing and started adding younger pieces to the mix. And mind you they were doing this at the bottom of the first round and not in the top 5. They ended up with George Hill who begat Kawhi and if not for him being a huge twat, they would have gone on about a 32 year playoff run. This is the path for the warriors. Let the young guys invigorate the vets and take some of the heavy lifting while the vets teach them the culture and how to act and be champions. Getting rid of any of their big 3 would be monumentally stupid. 

I think getting rid of Dray would be wise but other than that I agree 100%

Again- none of this would be about draft picks for me- it would be about getting younger. 
maybe I’m wrong but my take is Steph has hung his last banner as a warrior. Proceed how you wish with that. 

1 hour ago, HookEm said:

Who knows, maybe Draymond will age like fine wine. He is a great passer for sure and he has a very high basketball IQ.

But... last year he shot 39% from the floor. That is horrid for a big guy. His rebounding has slipped from almost 10 a game to 6 last year. His steals + blocks are down from 3.4 at his peak to 2.2 last year. His offensive boards are 1/3 what they were at his peak. His VORP has slipped from 5.3 in his prime to 0.6 last year.

And it wasn’t like a sudden drop. Every year has been worse than the previous one in just about every category. And he is barely 30. What will he be like at 34?

Kevin Love would be an interesting trade and could give you boards and assists with much better scoring and efficiency. Defense would clearly be a step down.

Issue with trading Dray is his contract.  Green was fantastic in his prime but the way he played, most understood he wouldn't have a long prime.  He just played so hard and his limited athleticism would be tested.  Regardless, you'd have to attach an asset to him to move him at this stage or you have to hope he comes back and hope he balls out like a mofo.  The risk is his play continues to decline.  So you have two players who probably need assets attached to them just to move them and Steph.  You can always move a bad contract for a bad contract (Westy/Paul - Westy/Wall -etc), but the Warriors already pay tax.  "Dismantling the Warriors" isn't as easy as put forth.  Ultimately, I think they probably need patience and get Klay back along with another probable lottery pick and see where they are next year.  Dray will only have 2 years left on his contract and more easily moved, especially if he can play well this year.  This year is gonna suck and my question is Steph done being a top 10-15 player in the league?  Looks like it, but it's early.

 

Draymond would have some value for a young team needing veteran championship leadership to get over the hump. Miami or Dallas. Maybe Atlanta.

Golden State could trade him for Tim Hardaway, who
would come off the books next year. It would help them tank this year for another good draft pick and also give them cap flexibility next year.

2 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Issue with trading Dray is his contract.  Green was fantastic in his prime but the way he played, most understood he wouldn't have a long prime.  He just played so hard and his limited athleticism would be tested.  Regardless, you'd have to attach an asset to him to move him at this stage or you have to hope he comes back and hope he balls out like a mofo.  The risk is his play continues to decline.  So you have two players who probably need assets attached to them just to move them and Steph.  You can always move a bad contract for a bad contract (Westy/Paul - Westy/Wall -etc), but the Warriors already pay tax.  "Dismantling the Warriors" isn't as easy as put forth.  Ultimately, I think they probably need patience and get Klay back along with another probable lottery pick and see where they are next year.  Dray will only have 2 years left on his contract and more easily moved, especially if he can play well this year.  This year is gonna suck and my question is Steph done being a top 10-15 player in the league?  Looks like it, but it's early.

 

I don’t think he’s done as a top 10-15 guy in the league- I think he just can’t carry a team but in the right spot he’d still shine. 

2 hours ago, HookEm said:

Draymond would have some value for a young team needing veteran championship leadership to get over the hump. Miami or Dallas. Maybe Atlanta.

Golden State could trade him for Tim Hardaway, who
would come off the books next year. It would help them tank this year for another good draft pick and also give them cap flexibility next year.

Dray is owed 100 million.  Ain't nobody gonna take on that for veteran leadership.  You can get that from a guy making 8-10m.  At 25m AAV, he needs to produce and produce well, especially with 4 years left.  Dallas would be epically stupid to take on 4 years for vet leadership.  You only trade for Green if you think he's got juice in the tank and can back towards (not at) is previous levels.

Quote

I don’t think he’s done as a top 10-15 guy in the league- I think he just can’t carry a team but in the right spot he’d still shine. 

Those guys can carry teams to playoff relevance.  If he can't carry a team to at least an 8 seed with the pieces around him presently (including Green eventually), then he ain't top 10.

Edited December 27, 2020 by Patrick Bateman

2 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Dray is owed 100 million.  Ain't nobody gonna take on that for veteran leadership.  You can get that from a guy making 8-10m.  At 25m AAV, he needs to produce and produce well, especially with 4 years left.  Dallas would be epically stupid to take on 4 years for vet leadership.  You only trade for Green if you think he's got juice in the tank and can back towards (not at) is previous levels.

Those guys can carry teams to playoff relevance.  If he can't carry a team to at least an 8 seed with the pieces around him presently (including Green eventually), then he ain't top 10.

What if he can’t do that but he’s the difference in winning and losing in the third of 4th round?  Like people said in the Xmas day thread he’s a ceiling raiser not a floor raiser. 
I still might consider that a top 10 guy. But I get where you are coming from and wouldn’t say you are wrong. 

10 hours ago, Kermit said:

Hey, we’re 2-0 goddamnit!

Just to let you know, you're my favorite basketball poster on this board. I can only wonder how much more fun you would be if you were a Rockets fan.

34 minutes ago, UDontKnow said:

Just to let you know, you're my favorite basketball poster on this board. I can only wonder how much more fun you would be if you were a Rockets fan.

Thanks man. I appreciate it. 

Just a reminder that Steph, Klay, and Dray are something stupid like 45-5 in the last 50ish games that they've played together without KD. Most of those were with the Kevon Looney and Patrick McCaws of the world as teammates. Their last game together was Game 6 of the NBA Finals, one they probably would have won had Klay not jacked up his knee.

Obviously, they've gotten older (none of them are "old" by today's standards though) and other teams have passed them by as they currently stand (even if they were healthy), but just pointing out how monumentally stupid it would be to break them apart before giving them a chance to play together again.*

*Unless it's just abundantly clear that Dray is washed physically.

 

Edited December 28, 2020 by aggie08

Also, jesus fucking christ with Steph no longer being a top 10ish player in the league. Find me a single GM who would take Dame, Paul George, or Jimmy Butler over him. It's a handful of games over two years with a combination of shit and or young/new teammates. He's a rhythm player who has barely played in 18 months. He'll be just fine

 

Edited December 28, 2020 by aggie08

23 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Also, jesus fucking christ with Steph no longer being a top 10ish player in the league. Find me a single GM who would take Dame, Paul George, or Jimmy Butler over him. It's a handful of games over two years with a combination of shit and or young/new teammates. He's a rhythm player who has barely played in 18 months. He'll be just fine

 

People constantly fail to understand the gravity he has on the floor and how important that is specifically if you have other shooters

Fuck Dray.

Kelly Oubre, Jr. is 7-40 and 0-17 on 3's since joining the Warriors. When you factor in his luxury tax hit, he might be a tougher pill to swallow than Wiggins.

Is it just me, or do the Warriors not suck suck? I mean they still kinda suck and will have to scrap and claw to make the playoffs in a loaded West, but they have some fun young pieces, and Steph is Steph again. Dray looks pretty awful and is legit the worst shooter in the league, but is still good for 7 assists a game and some heady defense. Hopefully he rounds into shape, and is only one step slow instead of two and half. If they had Klay, there's no way that you could convince me that they wouldn't be battling for "best of the rest" after LAL, Milwaukee, and Brooklyn by year's end. They may be an interesting darkhorse next season with a year of chemistry and maturation building under their belt.*

*As much as the fucking Golden State Warriors can be a darkhorse.

Edited January 22, 2021 by aggie08

39 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Is it just me, or do the Warriors not suck suck? I mean they still kinda suck and will have to scrap and claw to make the playoffs in a loaded West, but they have some fun young pieces, and Steph is Steph again. Dray looks pretty awful and is legit the worst shooter in the league, but is still good for 7 assists a game and some heady defense. Hopefully he rounds into shape, and is only one step slow instead of two and half. If they had Klay, there's no way that you could convince me that they wouldn't be battling for "best of the rest" after LAL, Milwaukee, and Brooklyn by year's end. They may be an interesting darkhorse next season with a year of chemistry and maturation building under their belt.*

*As much as the fucking Golden State Warriors can be a darkhorse.

Agreed. I think this team (even with Klay back) still doesn’t profile as a championship team so I’d still blow it up, I think, but they can make the play on tourney as a 7-10 seed this year and be a 3-6 type next year I’d bet. 

They need to ship green to somebody desperate while he still has some value. He's a net negative for them right now

18 hours ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Agreed. I think this team (even with Klay back) still doesn’t profile as a championship team so I’d still blow it up, I think, but they can make the play on tourney as a 7-10 seed this year and be a 3-6 type next year I’d bet. 

I think the Warriors are a top three seed next year if Klay is healthy and Wiseman develops well (AKA isn't a bust). I don't see any reason they wouldn't be. Even in 2021 nobody in the West will be close to them offensively and their defense will be average enough to win a lot of games.

4 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

I think the Warriors are a top three seed next year if Klay is healthy and Wiseman develops well (AKA isn't a bust). I don't see any reason they wouldn't be. Even in 2021 nobody in the West will be close to them offensively and their defense will be average enough to win a lot of games.

I'm not going to argue really strongly with you since I had 3-6.  I don't think they are as good as either of the LA teams.  I'd put them in a group with Denver, Dallas and Utah.  That's why I said 3-6.  Hell, maybe Phoenix- but I think that's probably hoping to squeeze a little too much juice out of Chris Paul, but maybe Ayton and Booker keep getting better and they get another piece somewhere along the line.  Yeah- 3 could happen but it's a hard cap for me. It's almost as likely in my mind that they finish 6th and maybe 7th.  I don't see any way they beat the clippers, Lakers and Nets 3 series in a row to win the title.  Never say never- but that is something I'd gamble a lot of money against happening.  

6 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

I don't see any way they beat the clippers, Lakers and Nets 3 series in a row to win the title

You'd probably need 6-8 white-hot games from Steph or Klay to win 16 playoff games. 

There is definitely a way. It's Steph and Klay.

Edited January 22, 2021 by BradInATX

7 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

You'd probably need 6-8 white-hot games from Steph or Klay to win 16 playoff games. 

There is definitely a way. It's Steph and Klay.

That’s asking a lot. Possible not really probable I’d think. Depends on just how cooked Draymond is. I think the answer to that is VERY

Don't forget that Golden State has Minnesota's 2021 draft pick (top-3 protected).  While Minnesota is currently in the bottom 3, anything can happen. 

It is easily possible that Golden State could wind up with the #4 pick in this class.  That means they could be adding a Jalen Suggs, Jonathan Kuminga, Evan Mobley, Cade Cunningham or Jalen Green to the mix.  Plus they will have their own pick which will probably be in the 15-20 range.  I have seen our own Greg Brown projected to them on one board. 

Let's assume for this discussion that they get Evan Mobley and Greg Brown.  For next year that gives them:

PG - Steph Curry - 33

SG - Klay Thompson - 31

SF - Andrew Wiggins - 26

PF - Draymond Green - 31

C - Andrew Wiseman - 20

Bench

PF - Evan Mobley - 19 - Elite rebounder and defender would get decent minutes

SF - Greg Brown - 19 - Versatile scorer, elite rebounder, upside

SG - Kelly Oubre - 26 - Will go from 28 to more like 18 mpg

PF - Eric Paschall - 25 - meh

SG - Damion Lee - 29 - meh

Plus we will see how Jordan Poole and Nico Mannion develop. Maybe they start getting minutes.

8 hours ago, HookEm said:

Don't forget that Golden State has Minnesota's 2021 draft pick (top-3 protected).  While Minnesota is currently in the bottom 3, anything can happen. 

It is easily possible that Golden State could wind up with the #4 pick in this class.  That means they could be adding a Jalen Suggs, Jonathan Kuminga, Evan Mobley, Cade Cunningham or Jalen Green to the mix.  Plus they will have their own pick which will probably be in the 15-20 range.  I have seen our own Greg Brown projected to them on one board. 

Let's assume for this discussion that they get Evan Mobley and Greg Brown.  For next year that gives them:

PG - Steph Curry - 33

SG - Klay Thompson - 31

SF - Andrew Wiggins - 26

PF - Draymond Green - 31

C - Andrew Wiseman - 20

Bench

PF - Evan Mobley - 19 - Elite rebounder and defender would get decent minutes

SF - Greg Brown - 19 - Versatile scorer, elite rebounder, upside

SG - Kelly Oubre - 26 - Will go from 28 to more like 18 mpg

PF - Eric Paschall - 25 - meh

SG - Damion Lee - 29 - meh

Plus we will see how Jordan Poole and Nico Mannion develop. Maybe they start getting minutes.

Oubre's on an expiring.  I wouldn't be shocked if they traded him at the deadline.  The Warriors are in the tax and with Klay hurt and Draymond looking spent, I could see them looking towards next year if they're around .500 at the deadline.  Paschall's actually pretty decent and you could make a case he's been the Warriors 2nd best player (leader off the bench).  

Good news is Steph looks like he can still fill it up when he's on and he's playing a good amount of minutes, the most in 5-6 years.  Bad news is his trademark efficiency is slipping.  Lowest PER in 9 years.  Lowest BPM and WS/48 in 10 years (I'm not counting last year).  Lowest TS% in 7 years.  Now, some of this could be SSS, another explanation could be without Klay to take some of the opponent's focus defensively, Steph is really trying to do this all alone and I think there is some truth there.  Draymond can't shoot anymore and all of his other glue gifts have started to evaporate.  He has a PER of 8.8; a negative BPM; a TOV% almost equal with his AST%. It's still early and he was injured so maybe he's working himself into basketball shape?  Damn, the Warriors better hope so.  Wiseman is a rookie and not ready but you can see the potential.  Wiggins still sucks.  A below average volume scorer.  Oubre has really struggled although started to turn it around.  Again, Paschall has been their 2nd best player.  With the Rockets imploding with Harden's departure and Denver's lackadaisical start, a playoff spot is there for the Warriors to take, but do they have enough fire power???  I don't know and is getting drug out to dry in the first round worth cashing in some chips for next year and saving some tax???  No idea, I guess we'll see.  Still really enjoy Steph run around and bomb though.

 

 

I will be really curious if Minnesota tries to tank to keep their top 3 pick or if they try to win some games and escape the basement. They suck either way.

2 hours ago, HookEm said:

I will be really curious if Minnesota tries to tank to keep their top 3 pick or if they try to win some games and escape the basement. They suck either way.

I was going to ask, "Will anyone be able to tell the difference?"

1 hour ago, aggie08 said:

I was going to ask, "Will anyone be able to tell the difference?"

I know you follow the Dubs so you are probably aware, but I just read their starting lineup is like a -16 net rating and like 3rd worst in the league. WTF is going on there? 

9 hours ago, HookEm said:

I will be really curious if Minnesota tries to tank to keep their top 3 pick or if they try to win some games and escape the basement. They suck either way.

That's such a tough call because at some point, KAT's going to ask to leave with so much losing.  Is he onboard for another tank, shitty season?  If I'm in, I'm forcing myself out.  They've made the playoffs once the last 16 years and they want him to tank again?  They may reactionary moves and seem to always draft wrong.  Edwards is young and he hasn't played but 15 games so far but he's been terrible.  Maybe he just needs minutes and time but beyond him, KAT and some hustle bench pieces like Naz Reid or Beasley, they are bad.  Vanderbilt looks like he can play I guess.  He may end up being a capable starter.  That's a team who may end up "rebuilding" again.  So back to the question, it probably makes logical sense to tank and try and keep the asset, but damn, I think that forces KAT to say, Fuck This.

 

 

So..... 50 games in and they're 23-17 and clinging to the 10th seed and play-in game.  Steph had been out but has come back and the frustration is real.

I think most folks aren't shocked they're in a dogfight for a playoff position, but with Houston dying early and Pelicans again being just aight, I think there was some hope they that the Warriors could have been in the 6/7 conversation.  Maybe they can if they go on a big roll but it's looking like an exciting offseason for the W's.  Will Minny hold onto their draft pick (top 3 protected) or will it convey to GSW?  Do the Warriors let Oubre go?  Can they move Wiggins?  Where and who may they draft with their pick?  What is going on with Wiseman, who has been...... disappointing?  Just a transition year?  

So many things could go right for them to make a big splash but they could also just be the same cast with Klay back and a late lottery pick.  That Minny pick is crucial.  Steph has been really good offensively this year, especially scoring but Draymond is still bleh.  Wiseman has struggled.  Oubre has disappointed and Wiggins is well.... Wiggins.  Going to need more than Klay to be a true contender again, IMO.