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Celery Man

By Celery Man
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hullabelew

hullabelew 3730

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On 7/4/2022 at 10:17 PM, tbone_ said:


Fair.

But it would be cool to be able to play one of those things.

On simple songs, it is easy to add in chords and stay out of the way and sound very good.   I'm going to practice at home for a month, then take it up to a local open mic night, set it up and sit in with everyone who will let me.  I figure that is the best way to get better.    Any I-IV-V song is easy.  I was worried about all the pedals and levers.   3 pedals, volume pedal and 4 knee levers.   

My lesson was "Find the root on the 8th string.   Pick these three string or these three.  Push down the two left pedals at the same spot.  That's the IV, Move up two frets with the pedals still down.  That's the V.    To make a minor, find the note on 8th string and use the first pedal.  Good luck."

I asked him what the 1 and 10th string did.  He said, "They are bad.  Stay away".  

Now, to get really good would take a TON of work.  I'm not sure I have that much time left on earth, but I haven't been this excited about music since I got my Shaggy Screamer.  

 

 

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Chad Fuck

Chad Fuck 18135

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8 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

Man, jealous and interested in hearing about your progress. As I’m sure I’ve talked about, pedal steel is an aspiration if mine. One I’ve done almost nothing about, but one I think about.

 

Me too.  I own one and it looks real pretty in my music room.  That's about it.

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Paul Wesley

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2 hours ago, hullabelew said:

On simple songs, it is easy to add in chords and stay out of the way and sound very good.   I'm going to practice at home for a month, then take it up to a local open mic night, set it up and sit in with everyone who will let me.  I figure that is the best way to get better.    Any I-IV-V song is easy.  I was worried about all the pedals and levers.   3 pedals, volume pedal and 4 knee levers.   

My lesson was "Find the root on the 8th string.   Pick these three string or these three.  Push down the two left pedals at the same spot.  That's the IV, Move up two frets with the pedals still down.  That's the V.    To make a minor, find the note on 8th string and use the first pedal.  Good luck."

I asked him what the 1 and 10th string did.  He said, "They are bad.  Stay away".  

Now, to get really good would take a TON of work.  I'm not sure I have that much time left on earth, but I haven't been this excited about music since I got my Shaggy Screamer.  

 

 

Props to you, hulla.

A couple years ago, my wife - who is very supportive of anything I do musically - wanted to buy me a pedal steel as a gift.  I had to tell her that I appreciated her confidence in my ability to pick up another instrument, but those have a pretty steep learning curve, and I'm not sure I had the grit or the hundreds (?thousands) of hours it would take for me to become proficient.  

I'm glad to see you taking the plunge.  Bravo.

 

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AnotherUTFan

AnotherUTFan 9990

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Agreed hula, good on you. A beautiful instrument that I've long been intimidated by. Ill almost always stick around to check out a band if I see a pedal steel set up and I've rarely been disappointed. Good move on the blues jam, it is the best way to get better fast. There's a fantastic bluegrass jam within waking distance of me very Sunday that I've intended to bring one of my Martins to for a while for the same purpose.

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Chad Fuck

Chad Fuck 18135

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11 minutes ago, hullabelew said:

I'm obviously way too excited about this. Already looking at steel amps and those cool pack seats and learning all of this steel lingo and acronyms.

I'm currently reclaiming space in the former DMZ of our basement from my wife.

^I'm definitely interested in all this.  I kind of wanted a vintage Fender Pro with the 15 so you could get those cool low notes.

But all the modern players are saying you need a solid state for ultra clean steel sounds.  

Not sure where I fall.  Why not both?

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hullabelew

hullabelew 3730

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They have caused the price of those old 80s Peavey amps to skyrocket.   Several of the guys on the Steel Guitar Forum and YT say the Boss Katana 100 makes a great practice amp but I'm just going to use my Blues Jr until I'm sure I can play this thing without poking my eyes out or stabbing myself in the leg with one of those knee levers.  Ultimately, I like the SS idea just because of the weight.  But again, Why not both. 

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dcbc

dcbc 14644

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, hullabelew said:

I'm obviously way too excited about this. Already looking at steel amps and those cool pack seats and learning all of this steel lingo and acronyms.

I'm currently reclaiming space in the former DMZ of our basement from my wife.

Keep an eye out for a late 70s Twin Reverb, the ultra linear models.  They tend to be way cheaper than any other Twin Reverb because they're loud as hell and never break up.  Six stringers tend to avoid them.  But for pedal steel, they're amazing.  But good grief, are they heavy.  I picked up one for a friend of mine locally.  I think it was $500.  Almost tore something getting it in the house. 

Edited by dcbc
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Chad Fuck

Chad Fuck 18135

Posted
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6 minutes ago, dcbc said:

For pedal steel, keep an eye out for a late 70s Twin Reverb, the ultra linear models.  They tend to be way cheaper than any other Twin Reverb because they're loud as hell and never break up.  Six stringers tend to avoid them.  But for pedal steel, they're amazing.  But good grief, are they heavy.  I picked up one for a friend of mine locally.  I think it was $500.  Almost tore something getting it in the house. 

My dad has one of those but he had it backdated to a black face circuit.  He stopped playing it years ago because he got tired of hauling it around.  Too damn heavy.  

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dcbc

dcbc 14644

Posted
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Just now, Chad Fuck said:

My dad has one of those but he had it backdated to a black face circuit.  He stopped playing it years ago because he got tired of hauling it around.  Too damn heavy.  

The Pro seems to be the sweet spot where light weight meets big speaker lows.  I wonder how a low power tweed twin would do.  I have one of the Fender C/S reissues and it can do piano type lows.  It's not light, but with that pine cab, at around 55 lbs, it's way lighter than the UL Twin Reverb by a long stretch.

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Chad Fuck

Chad Fuck 18135

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1 minute ago, dcbc said:

The Pro seems to be the sweet spot where light weight meets big speaker lows.  I wonder how a low power tweed twin would do.  I have one of the Fender C/S reissues and it can do piano type lows.  It's not light, but with that pine cab, at around 55 lbs, it's way lighter than the UL Twin Reverb by a long stretch.

Fender did the 15 Twin for a while in the early 2000s.

https://reverb.com/p/fender-65-twin-custom-15-85w-guitar-combo-amp

vled730laajvp9bdsn7q.jpg

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dcbc

dcbc 14644

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I love this song.  The fact that Garcia was self taught just a bit ahead of the time they recorded all of this just amazes me.  I had a friend locally, who was a pretty accomplished pedal steel player.  Always had a spot at the bluegrass jams and always has a band to sit in with whenever he wants.  I spent a few minutes sitting in front of the thing with him trying to show me the basics and felt like I'd never played a stringed instrument before. 

 

The dude's Vans working the pedals in this video are as entertaining as any of it.

 

 

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dcbc

dcbc 14644

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Chad Fuck said:

I've heard good things about the Steel King as well, but they're pretty hard to come by:

https://reverb.com/p/fender-steel-king-200-watt-1x15-solid-state-guitar-combo-2004-2008

taz5kf6cg0xspba1zcro.png

 

Don't you have a Showman amp head?  If that memory is correct, open back pine cab with a Weber or Eminence 15" speaker and a good reverb pedal.  Certainly a portable solution.

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Chad Fuck

Chad Fuck 18135

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3 minutes ago, dcbc said:

 

Don't you have a Showman amp head?  If that memory is correct, open back pine cab with a Weber or Eminence 15" speaker and a good reverb pedal.  Certainly a portable solution.

I don't, but I considered it for this purpose.  I have a 66 Black Face Twin.  You may be thinking about that.  It hardly ever gets used because I need an attenuator.  It's loud as fuck even at "low" volume.

I did a deep dive on all the possible permutations of Fender amps hooked up with 15s back when I first got my pedal steel as a gift.  All of the above are acceptable options.

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dcbc

dcbc 14644

Posted
Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Chad Fuck said:

I don't, but I considered it for this purpose.  I have a 66 Black Face Twin.  You may be thinking about that.  It hardly ever gets used because I need an attenuator.  It's loud as fuck even at "low" volume.

I did a deep dive on all the possible permutations of Fender amps hooked up with 15s back when I first got my pedal steel as a gift.  All of the above are acceptable options.

I'm thinking of tbone, who has the Showman. 

 

All of the above are loud.  That Vibrosonic is 100 watts.  But it has a MV, which obviously, yours doesn't.  Sounds like a tweed Pro for you!  But honestly, I wonder if it's the circuit or the speaker.  I have the same circuit in my tweed Super and it will break up at a certain volume.  If I were in your shoes, I'd find a 4 ohm 15" speaker and get a pine cabinet for it on ebay or one from Mather.  Keep your eye out for an old Bandmaster.  They stay pretty clean too.

 

Of course, Mather also will make a combo cabinet for the bandmaster head.  Bet he'd do one that would accommodate a 15.  Of course, that begs the question, does a Weber reproduction of a 12" JBL get you low enough so you don't have to worry with a 15?

 

 

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Superhero

Superhero 9026

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I mentioned 3-4 pages ago that the neck PU on the LP is MUCH LOUDER than the bridge pickup. Any idea on why this is?

I'm taking it to a repair shop tomorrow. Hopefully it's just a loose wire in there, but my guess it's a pot that's busted. All the pots in the LP Classic are the push/pull type and there's a circuit board in there instead of just a bunch of wires.

I'll ask the luthier tomorrow whether he can split the coils instead of just tap them - because I wouldn't mind a single-coil sound in the LP, and also because the coil taps aren't any quieter than turning them on all the day.

 

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hullabelew

hullabelew 3730

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18 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

I don't even practice my 6-strings nearly enough.  I sure don't need another distraction.

Eager to hear about your progress, hulla.

Thanks for the optimism.   :)

I will have to have a guitar handy while learning this as I try to translate some stuff and I'm hoping that the steel (those steel guys call them PSG for pedal steel guitars) will improve my guitar playing by helping me better visualize which notes are changing to actually change from say a C to a C7.  I know that change isn't that difficult but when you can change a I to a IV by just changing 2 notes (using two pedals), it is already helping my understanding of the guitar.  (I wish I has taken piano when I was a kid)

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Celery Man

Celery Man 21098

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14 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

At one point, I was in a band where I played a Marshall half stack, the other guitarist played a Fender Twin, and the bassist played an Ampeg 8x10 refrigerator.

That band sucked.

dd0.jpg

10 hours ago, tbone_ said:

fcd32358a0f994a731187a85eb09b190.jpg
New drummer showed up at open mic tonight.

top shelf

 

on the LP with the mismatched pup volume - any idea if one of the pickups became loud vs one of the pickups became quiet?  I'm shit at guitar maintenance and have no idea, just thinking through it from a "identify the source of the problem" perspective.

 

do steel guys ever use a Roland JC120? For an SS amp, maybe you want even.... more wattage than that? I'm probably not thinking through with a steel guy's refined tone palate but I bet you could find powerful SS amp with a decent clean tone for not a ton. Whenever I (all too rarely) play with my lap steel i just run through the matchless, but i bet the 100 watt OG Line6 Flextone that I handed off to handcruser before skipping town a few years back would have made a decent steel amp.

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hullabelew

hullabelew 3730

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Posted

Roland amps are uses a lot.    I haven't seen those Line 6s mentioned but they are a 1/2 to 1/3 of a lot cheaper than the Peaveys are.  
Roland Cubes are touted as a good practice amp and a lot apparently play them live.  

This is a Vega 400 for really cheap, but they are cheap because they are fucking heavy.  

https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=382527

 

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Celery Man

Celery Man 21098

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35 minutes ago, AnotherUTFan said:

I saw this someplace else, but I went to Fender's site and, sure enough, its posted there. Maybe they'll catch Gibson.

https://www.fender.com/en-US/electric-guitars/telecaster/vintera-50s-telecaster/0149852340.html
FB_IMG_1657292021304.jpg0149852340_neck.jpg

I feel like there was some similar jankiness on one of my Mexican fenders, but I can't remember which one. I wonder if they are all like this (the tuners don't quite fit and they said fuck it) or if this is some poor QC on both this particular guitar and the part of the people putting together the media for the website.

Either way.... yeah it's a $1000 guitar, but if you reframed the question as "is this acceptable on a MIM Fender" I'd say that this kind of QC miss, in addition to some cheaper parts, is exactly the difference between the mid range Fenders and the professional ones. That is ugly though.

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Chad Fuck

Chad Fuck 18135

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3 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

I feel like there was some similar jankiness on one of my Mexican fenders, but I can't remember which one. I wonder if they are all like this (the tuners don't quite fit and they said fuck it) or if this is some poor QC on both this particular guitar and the part of the people putting together the media for the website.

Either way.... yeah it's a $1000 guitar, but if you reframed the question as "is this acceptable on a MIM Fender" I'd say that this kind of QC miss, in addition to some cheaper parts, is exactly the difference between the mid range Fenders and the professional ones. That is ugly though.

I agree, I'd expect cheaper parts.  But damn man, lining up tuner should be something you just can't miss.  It's not like there haven't been guides for this since at least 1950 on Teles.  

Huge miss for the media and marketing team though.  

Looks like a fail from build to presentation.

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Deej

Deej 77839

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Posted
7 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

I feel like there was some similar jankiness on one of my Mexican fenders, but I can't remember which one. I wonder if they are all like this (the tuners don't quite fit and they said fuck it) or if this is some poor QC on both this particular guitar and the part of the people putting together the media for the website.

Either way.... yeah it's a $1000 guitar, but if you reframed the question as "is this acceptable on a MIM Fender" I'd say that this kind of QC miss, in addition to some cheaper parts, is exactly the difference between the mid range Fenders and the professional ones. That is ugly though.

I've got three MIM Fenders and the fit and finish on all of them is perfect. 

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 47218

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Posted

I co-founded and helped bring a company to market that sold very large electromechanical products.  Think "refrigerator sized".  The cabinets were framed with DIN rail and skinned with sheet metal.  

At one point we realized that one of our assembly techs, who had worked for the company for years, had started routing cable harnesses OVER an upper DIN rail and down to its landing point, such that when the top and side skins were bolted on, the harness in question was pinched between the skins and the frame.  It was an incredibly stupid thing to do.  Of course, the harnesses started to fail in final test, at which point we discovered his ad hoc routing technique.  We fired that guy.

The point is, shit happens in manufacturing, and you can't catch everything.  Toyota developed the gold standard for quality control, but not everyone follows their processes, and even a Toyota can come off the line with a bad fit/finished part or two.

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