Texas O-line talk

[Burt Macklin 19,038]

52 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

Texas needed a LT in the portal and that was not easy to find. That is going to be a hole until someone is developed. Hope Banks or Cam surprises. Texas has a shit load of Guards and swing guys, but so few OT have been recruited.

Your keep saying we only need a LT, which makes absolutely no sense.
 

Right now, we don’t have a single good tackle. If we added one, whether it’s at LT or RT, then you can focus on helping the other side more with chips, TEs, H-backs, slides, etc. and scheme ways to negate that weakness. But if you have two bad tackles, then it’s pretty impossible to help both sides and still run your offense. This OL would’ve been helped drastically by getting a solid starter at either LT or RT. It really doesn’t matter that much which one it is. 

[Codaxx 5,806]

Just now, Burt Macklin said:

Your keep saying we only need a LT, which makes absolutely no sense.
 

Right now, we don’t have a single good tackle. If we added one, whether it’s at LT or RT, then you can focus on helping the other side more with chips, TEs, H-backs, slides, etc. and scheme ways to negate that weakness. But if you have two bad tackles, then it’s pretty impossible to help both sides and still run your offense. This OL would’ve been helped drastically by getting a solid starter at either LT or RT. It really doesn’t matter that much which one it is. 

Because RT and LT are different, I think everyone would agree on that. Pretending the positions are the same is kind of a crazy to me. A weak LT can actually be a very good RT, a weak RT is useless. You can hide 1 tackle. That is correct, but usually that is the RT. The LT is almost always a better pass protector. OU game illustrated that. "Oh you want to help to Jones, we move people around and attack Kerstetter". Kerstetter, Jones, and Karic were all in the bottom 4 of offensive grades for OU. In order to fix the tackle issue, you need to find 1 tackle you can leave on a island. Texas didnt have 1 last year and you dont find RT's that are capable of that in the portal. 

[GoldAppleCorps 619]

For a right-handed QB, LT is his blind side. This guy cannot just whiff. Yes, he's going to be involved in pulling playside, but his overarching value is in letting the QB settle his feet and square his shoulders.

Keep in mind that not much growth typically occurs for OL during the season. There's just too much to do in installing game plans to get "nuts and bolts" technical with footwork (an OL's bedrock) and hand placement. I say this because Kyle Flood is still the best in the business at teaching OL. He didn't have much time last year. There's every reason to believe that he can transform potential during the spring, summer and fall.

Karic isn't long term Tackle. However, he's got the personality to keep the QB upright at LT until a better candidate is ready, at which point he'll be a natural guard. Someone's got to play the position, and tasking a true freshman with the job isn't a recipe for success. The incoming talent is legendary, and it just might work, but that's not the way to hope.

Until the OL is attacked by a hostile defense (that is, one that doesn't care if the QB dies or not), then the Texas OL is still the grabastic mess we saw last season. They're the weak point, like a cracked engine block, that will keep the team from functioning.

[Codaxx 5,806]

14 minutes ago, GoldAppleCorps said:

For a right-handed QB, LT is his blind side. This guy cannot just whiff. Yes, he's going to be involved in pulling playside, but his overarching value is in letting the QB settle his feet and square his shoulders.

Keep in mind that not much growth typically occurs for OL during the season. There's just too much to do in installing game plans to get "nuts and bolts" technical with footwork (an OL's bedrock) and hand placement. I say this because Kyle Flood is still the best in the business at teaching OL. He didn't have much time last year. There's every reason to believe that he can transform potential during the spring, summer and fall.

Karic isn't long term Tackle. However, he's got the personality to keep the QB upright at LT until a better candidate is ready, at which point he'll be a natural guard. Someone's got to play the position, and tasking a true freshman with the job isn't a recipe for success. The incoming talent is legendary, and it just might work, but that's not the way to hope.

Until the OL is attacked by a hostile defense (that is, one that doesn't care if the QB dies or not), then the Texas OL is still the grabastic mess we saw last season. They're the weak point, like a cracked engine block, that will keep the team from functioning.

now that is aggressive

[Burt Macklin 19,038]

2 hours ago, Codaxx said:

Because RT and LT are different, I think everyone would agree on that. Pretending the positions are the same is kind of a crazy to me. A weak LT can actually be a very good RT, a weak RT is useless. You can hide 1 tackle. That is correct, but usually that is the RT. The LT is almost always a better pass protector. OU game illustrated that. "Oh you want to help to Jones, we move people around and attack Kerstetter". Kerstetter, Jones, and Karic were all in the bottom 4 of offensive grades for OU. In order to fix the tackle issue, you need to find 1 tackle you can leave on a island. Texas didnt have 1 last year and you dont find RT's that are capable of that in the portal. 

I never said RT and LT are the same. It would obviously be best to find a LT, but you’re the one who keeps saying we only need a LT, which is flat out wrong. If we found a solid RT, then Sark can focus on scheming to help the LT, and our pass pro issues immediately become much more manageable. 
 

It’s not that complicated. When a team has 0 good tackles, saying they only need a LT is just dumb. 

[Codaxx 5,806]

20 minutes ago, Burt Macklin said:

I never said RT and LT are the same. It would obviously be best to find a LT, but you’re the one who keeps saying we only need a LT, which is flat out wrong. If we found a solid RT, then Sark can focus on scheming to help the LT, and our pass pro issues immediately become much more manageable. 
 

It’s not that complicated. When a team has 0 good tackles, saying they only need a LT is just dumb. 

You need a tackle that you can leave 1 on 1. RTs in college aren’t those guys, if they were they would be at LT.  There are some unicorns, but it’s rare. On passing downs defense will move people around. They are not going to keep their second or 3rd best pass rusher on your RT and let their best pass rusher face the LT with help. I wish it were that simple. 
2nd- you really don’t know how many RTs Texas has, you do know they don’t have a quality LT. There is difference between knowing and speculating. Karic or Jones might be fine at RT and a disaster at LT. I would speculate that one of them could probably give conference level or better play there. You seem to acknowledge that initially, when you admitted the positions are not the same, but than moved to the need any tackle dogma.  I continue to say LT, because finding/developing a RT is much easier than finding/developing a LT. I think there are options at RT, but I don’t see anything outside of lottery ticket recruit coming in at LT. I don’t think that is dumb, but each to their narcissistic own. 

Edited April 5, 2022 by Codaxx

[Reese Bennett 3,615]

I would not be surprised to see Connor start the season at LT. If all of your possibilities have flaws, a good option is to go with the one who will make the fewest mental errors.

[gmr548 16,590]

On 4/5/2022 at 12:30 PM, Laxtonto said:

So we are seeing Karic, Angilau, Majors, Conner and Jones left to right on the OL in spring practice.

 

Am I the only one thinking we either see a FR jump into the fight at RG and LT?

I would love to see Karic just become serviceable at LT and let Jones be a solid RT. Jones just never seemed to be able to get “it” as far as being left on an island on the blindside and might benefit from having one of the monster FR to slide over to help on the inside. He has the “feet” to hopefully deal with the speed rush and if we can play the 3 v2 game on the right with them Karic and Angilau doing 2 v 2, I expect us to be better than the flaming dog shit we dealt with last year.

 

I Karric can’t be average or one of the FR can’t either we are going to get wrecked…

If Banks is as advertised, he comes in and starts at LT day 1. Whoever Flood likes more between Jones and Karic, I assume Jones ultimately getting the nod, at RT. Tackle just isn't going to get fixed this year, at this point. Better get the ball out quick.

Controversial opinion, I don't think you see another true freshman starter all year unless it's forced by injury. 

[JBJ 3,663]

26 minutes ago, gmr548 said:

If Banks is as advertised, he comes in and starts at LT day 1. Whoever Flood likes more between Jones and Karic, I assume Jones ultimately getting the nod, at RT. Tackle just isn't going to get fixed this year, at this point. Better get the ball out quick.

Controversial opinion, I don't think you see another true freshman starter all year unless it's forced by injury. 

My theory is that Flood wants his RT locked in with Jones, so that any and all freshman can be a part of the LT Hunger Games in fall camp.

[LTtxfan 49,318]

On 4/1/2022 at 11:17 AM, LTtxfan said:

Just seems like UH or UTSA might kick the tires here...

 

 

Yup... H-Town it is.  Great place for him to work on his music production skills

 

[Codaxx 5,806]

On 4/11/2022 at 4:35 PM, JBJ said:

My theory is that Flood wants his RT locked in with Jones, so that any and all freshman can be a part of the LT Hunger Games in fall camp.

This what I think happens. I believe Majors, Angilau, and Conner are locked in. Jones at RT sounds highly likely. Basically every freshmen starts at LT and let the best man win. An alternative could be Conner at RT, if Jones struggles there 

[Atticus 3,978]

3 hours ago, Codaxx said:

This what I think happens. I believe Majors, Angilau, and Conner are locked in. Jones at RT sounds highly likely. Basically every freshmen starts at LT and let the best man win. An alternative could be Conner at RT, if Jones struggles there 

They are moving guys around now to give the best 5 the chance to play together once the freshmen get on campus

[LTtxfan 49,318]

 

[Hpara759 1,780]

8 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

 

 

[LTtxfan 49,318]

Posting this to add to conversations on this thread

 

On another fansite, they're arguing about Texas O-line.  Here's a detailed post... 

Quote

The line will be a major concern but won’t be as big of an issue this year as last year. I am not saying the OL will be better than last year, because I don’t believe they will. But their glaring deficiencies will not be as noticeable.

Reason being that teams will have to defend the whole field and not just load the box against Bijan and shift coverages towards Xavier Worthy. The addition of all the fire power and a QB who can sling it 50+ accurately makes defenses play more conservatively on the back end. The OL will simply need to do their jobs. I am confident that they will at the very least get to their assignment. The OL may not win their battle, but getting to the right guy is 75% of the battle.

The biggest question is really at the tackle positions. We have enough interior options to make it work:

C/G types:
- Devon Campbell
- Hayden Connor
- Neto Umeozulu
- Logan Parr
- Jake Majors
- Junior Angilau
- Cole Hutson
- Isaiah Hookfin
- Connor Robertson

At Tackle, we are significantly more thin and pretty uninspiring.

T types:
- Christian Jones
- Jaylen Garth
- Malik Agbo
- Andrej Karic
- Kelvin Banks
- Cameron Williams
- Hayden Connor (C/G type preferably)

Really, Kelvin Banks is going to have to show up 100% ready to go day 1. I’m not saying plugging in day 1, because there’s 0% chance of any college OL Coach worth their salt doing that’s. But, Banks will have to be ready. What has me worried is that reports out of the all star game were pretty bad. They said he looked uninspired and didn’t have the success expected of him (if I am remembering correctly). DE / Edge guys are significantly stronger, faster, meaner, and more intelligent than he is used to dealing with. On top of that he will be learning a college level playbook for the first time in his life. On the OL that can be an enormous challenge.

I guess what I’m trying to say is Banks better be what we hope of him. Otherwise our Tackle position looks mighty frail. BUT, the OL should be able to perform above their capabilities only because defenses will have more threats to account for than just X and Bijan.

Fingers crossed brothers

EDIT:

You can watch the Under Armour All American game on YouTube. Kelvin Banks was playing RT. Had a pretty rough day overall. He tries to jump set most every edge and gets caught lookin. Problem he seemed to be having was just not realizing the talent differences. In high school jump setting each DE is an easy W against subpar competition because you can just clamp and hang. Against UA All American level competition he got eaten up in pass pro.

I’m confident that Coach Flood will be able to fix the issue. The bigger question is if Kelvin will take the coaching. Sometimes big name recruits get to campus and believe they have the talent to win their battles without actually applying the coaching. It’s all very much so a wait and see game with him. I would say, however, that he could easily be a fantastic interior player. Jump setting inside is much easier to get away with. The space and pace of playing Tackle is a much less smooth transition.

It will be an interesting ride to watch nonetheless

 

 

Edited April 20, 2022 by LTtxfan

[Eggo 3,978]

Kinda wish I hadn't watched those UA AA reps now

[Codaxx 5,806]

1 hour ago, LTtxfan said:

Posting this to add to conversations on this thread

 

On another fansite, they're arguing about Texas O-line.  Here's a detailed post... 

 

 

I think his positional breakdown is a bit odd. There are a lot less legit LT options in the program than he listed. A few guys like Campbell and Neto that are certainly athletic enough to RT and more athletic than some of his tackle candidates. 

[LTtxfan 49,318]

2 hours ago, Eggo said:

Kinda wish I hadn't watched those UA AA reps now

Pretty sure that UA AA had too many left tackles, and Banks was one of the few who volunteered to play at right tackle.  Some players are only good on one side of the offensive line...

(Had a player on my football team that was a good right cornerback, but sucked when he tried to play left cornerback -- Coach said to him, "Get your ass back to the right side !!! ")

 

Edited April 20, 2022 by LTtxfan
Brain fart

[BurntOrange&White 39,934]

2 hours ago, Eggo said:

Kinda wish I hadn't watched those UA AA reps now

He played right tackle and was the only player to volunteer to do so. The best analogy I saw at the time was trying to wipe your ass with your left hand when you’re right handed. 

[LTtxfan 49,318]

 

[victory88 5,669]

Yeah, Banks volunteered because none of the other tackles at the all-star game could play RT.  Banks himself doesn't play RT.  I would not look at that performance as a bench mark of his talent.  

[LTtxfan 49,318]

 

[LTtxfan 49,318]

 

[futureman 22,510]

it’ll be nice when we don’t hear about guys like Hutson until their second or third year in the program. 

[LTtxfan 49,318]

Nice Bijan picture !!!

 

 

      Baldwin Bruins Football     @BaldwinBruinsFB
 

Thank you Coach Sarkisian and the entire UT football staff for allowing us to visit!

3:46 PM · Apr 21, 2022·Twitter for iPhone

 

 

[OB3 3,629]

1 minute ago, LTtxfan said:

Nice Bijan picture !!!

 

 

      Baldwin Bruins Football     @BaldwinBruinsFB
 

Thank you Coach Sarkisian and the entire UT football staff for allowing us to visit!

3:46 PM · Apr 21, 2022·Twitter for iPhone

 

 

Don’t you mean D’shawn?

[LTtxfan 49,318]

Orange White Game...   Thx for tweet @Radical Larry

 

[victory88 5,669]

So burnt ends has a video with the OL clips from the spring game.  Conner didn’t look all that bad on the film.  He’s a massive guy and held his own.  Looked way better than Christian Jones at RT.   He can be serviceable.  If I’m Flood, you’re hoping that Banks and Campbell can be physically ready bc our best lineup would be:
 

Banks- Angilau - Majors - Campbell- Conner

 

Karic is a liability and Christian Jones just isn’t all that great.  He looks mediocre at best at RT and was probably our most penalized lineman last year.  He’s huge and athletic but he can never get over that hump it seems like.   Our coaches really need to emphasize to Banks and Campbell that they will play and need to show up to camp ready.

[Atticus 3,978]

1 hour ago, victory88 said:

So burnt ends has a video with the OL clips from the spring game.  Conner didn’t look all that bad on the film.  He’s a massive guy and held his own.  Looked way better than Christian Jones at RT.   He can be serviceable.  If I’m Flood, you’re hoping that Banks and Campbell can be physically ready bc our best lineup would be:
 

Banks- Angilau - Majors - Campbell- Conner

 

Karic is a liability and Christian Jones just isn’t all that great.  He looks mediocre at best at RT and was probably our most penalized lineman last year.  He’s huge and athletic but he can never get over that hump it seems like.   Our coaches really need to emphasize to Banks and Campbell that they will play and need to show up to camp ready.

Where is this video?

[BurntOrange&White 39,934]

I wouldn’t be surprised if Angilau ends up at center to get more talent/skill on the field at the OL positions. 

[Coach pop a bitch 5,487]

 

[Bevo14 8,355]

18 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

I wouldn’t be surprised if Angilau ends up at center to get more talent/skill on the field at the OL positions. 

Well I was pitchin 3 freshmen starting after signing day, so I'm going with Banks-Angilau-Hutson-Campbell-Conner

[Codaxx 5,806]

Maybe I missed it, but I didn’t see any issues with Jones in the scrimmage. Keep in mind he wasn’t taking on great pass rushers. Only beat I remember was an inside move from Dorbah that Card took off on.. Garth had himself a rough day. I will say the Rushes from the DEs were really undisciplined. Lot of ducking inside and giving up contain. Do wish the defense was less vanilla. Would have liked to see the OL try to pick up some stunts 

[Hookem2147 21,345]

Jones definitely looks more comfortable on the right side. Should be close to the same level of run blocker as Kerstetter. 
 

I think something would have to go really south to force Majors out of the lineup. They seem to find value in his ability to make all the checks and calls and he’s pretty good in the outside zone game. He’ll always struggle the two times a year we play Baylor and Iowa State with the gigantic nose tackles but just something we have to live with.

[Hookem2147 21,345]

Jones played RT in 2020 right? Opposite of Cosmi? I remember him having some struggles but it seemed like the thought was he would be solid once he had a year or two under his belt and got further away from learning from Hand.

Edited April 25, 2022 by Hookem2147

[victory88 5,669]

1 hour ago, Atticus said:

Where is this video?

Found it on YouTube.

 

 

[Codaxx 5,806]

13 minutes ago, victory88 said:

Found it on YouTube.

 

 

Only bust he had in protection was the TD by Card. The sack was on Garth (77), who struggled all game 

[MuellerHorn 4,256]

Connor is already much better at LT than Jones.

[Codaxx 5,806]

8 minutes ago, MuellerHorn said:

Connor is already much better at LT than Jones.

He gave up 1 pressure.  One when he was pushed into Ewers and Ewers stepped up and was sacked. Ewers would have taken a shot on another. He also got some help with the RB. I like his run blocking. Definitely could play RT, not sure LT is a bet a want to make 

[victory88 5,669]

23 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

Only bust he had in protection was the TD by Card. The sack was on Garth (77), who struggled all game 

Gotcha, my apologizes to Christian Jones.  Hard to tell with the numbers

[Coach pop a bitch 5,487]

Thought Hutson looked solid. 

[MuellerHorn 4,256]

9 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

He gave up 1 pressure.  One when he was pushed into Ewers and Ewers stepped up and was sacked. Ewers would have taken a shot on another. He also got some help with the RB. I like his run blocking. Definitely could play RT, not sure LT is a bet a want to make 

No, I don't prefer that Connor play LT, especially when Banks arrives. However, he's much more technically sound than Jones. That's all I was trying to assert.

[Codaxx 5,806]

8 minutes ago, victory88 said:

Gotcha, my apologizes to Christian Jones.  Hard to tell with the numbers

There were 2 sacks. One by Garth and one created by Conner. I still think it is hard to get too excited, because they are not playing anyone particularly adept at rushing the passer.. I am somewhat curious as to all the inside moves by the edge guys. Lot of them were not stunts and contain was a disaster. That could come back to haunt the defense vs any QB with even decent mobility (Card TD was one of them, watch Garth in the scrimmage and you will see guys jumping inside a lot. Garth gets a lot depth on his kick back)

[Codaxx 5,806]

17 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

There were 2 sacks. One by Garth and one created by Conner. I still think it is hard to get too excited, because they are not playing anyone particularly adept at rushing the passer.. I am somewhat curious as to all the inside moves by the edge guys. Lot of them were not stunts and contain was a disaster. That could come back to haunt the defense vs any QB with even decent mobility (Card TD was one of them, watch Garth in the scrimmage and you will see guys jumping inside a lot. Garth gets a lot depth on his kick back)

3 sacks. I forgot that Garth gave one up to Harris on an outside move 

[Burt Macklin 19,038]

11 hours ago, victory88 said:

Found it on YouTube.

 

 

My biggest takeaway is how good Hutson and Helm looked. Hutson would probably struggle against better athletes right now, but long term is very encouraging. 

Helm absolutely owned Finkley on that first drive and generally looked very good blocking. 

 

[JBJ 3,663]

11 hours ago, Codaxx said:

3 sacks. I forgot that Garth gave one up to Harris on an outside move 

That was a solid rush.  Good punch to the chest.

The other one Garth gave up seemed to be a blown protection call because Garth's steps don't make sense otherwise (I think it's on Garth still, but it was a mental issue.)

Edited April 25, 2022 by JBJ

[Hookem2147 21,345]

If someone like Hutson is already making an impact and showing he can hold this own, the 2022 offensive line class is going to be on another planet. Hutson might be the 5th best OL we signed.

[JBJ 3,663]

8 minutes ago, JBJ said:

That was a solid rush.  Good punch to the chest.

The other one Garth gave up seemed to be a blown protection call because Garth's steps don't make sense otherwise (I think it's on Garth still, but it was a mental issue.)

Actually I think it's on the guard (Hutson?)  The entire line looks like it's blocking right, with the two backs protecting the left side.

[futureman 22,510]

Just now, Hookem2147 said:

If someone like Hutson is already making an impact and showing he can hold this own, the 2022 offensive line class is going to be on another planet. Hutson might be the 5th best OL we signed.

he also might be the best. that remains to be seen. 

[Poe It Up 126]

It’s times like these where it would be nice to scrimmage other teams. I can’t put any stock into what I saw since we’re lacking any true pass rushers. We did it in high school and you found out if you measured up real quick.