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Jason Isbell, Sturgill Simpson, Chris Stapleton, and Other Good Stuff

Seasick Sailor

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Buzzrock
Buzzrock

This is blowing up today.

tbone_
tbone_

Not sure if this is the right thread or not but any Billy Strings fans? Kid is fantastic.

strangulation!
strangulation!

getting real close to wearing an outfit

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Al_4_ISU

Al_4_ISU 12485

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king of oklahoma is just fantastic.  i can't stop listening to it.

We were on vacation late last week, and I was waiting for her to get finished getting ready. Usually this means I found a nearby bar. She calls me from the hotel room on Saturday and goes “where are you?”

I respond “sitting in the car listening to King of Oklahoma again”.

Her “Jesus, Al”.
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Celery Man

Celery Man 20996

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alright I've completed the first listen through. not trying to actively or critically listen, just driving and experiencing the music. really enjoying it. early favorites are Oklahoma, We Were Close, Early in the Morning. Oklahoma and We Were Close i feel some connection to, "Early in the Morning" is just a nice beachy song whose vibe stands out, I'm sure it will settle in the mix somewhere when I get more familiar with the whole album. But also, Miles is interesting.

I've criticized Isbell studio recordings a lot of times for sounding neutered, flat, boring, sterile, that kind of thing. I'd have to go through and listen through again to defend the position but I feel like on an album like Southeastern, the more stripped down acoustic songs maybe even have more energy than the full band songs. Stockholm is a great song, probably great performances, but the recording is still flat - it's the same volume the whole way through, which I would describe as "6". I think specifically a thing I've said is that I'd love a record of Isbell songs that sounded like a Sturgill record.

But, I'm not an engineer or a producer. I have some experience fucking around in a studio and listening to people who know what they are doing talk but I don't pay that much attention typically. I hate it when someone points out a snare that sounds like ass because I never notice it before and can never not hear it afterwards.

Anyways, I feel like this album has some dynamics and interesting stuff going on, but also some of that same kinda flatness. I was thinking about that listening to Miles, which is very interesting - I can't put a pen to all the influences I'm hearing in the extended breakdown but it feels like a different thing than either "acoustic jason" or "country rock jason" (or "hawaiian shirt blues rock jason"). Some cool stuff going on, but I still wish there was something more to it that made it sound louder, and I wish I had the expertise to even know what I'm talking about. Is it that there are quiet sounding parts that are right up in the mix with the big "soaring" guitar parts? Do they need room mics? Are the drums not big enough, the vocals too big? Is it just that everything is the same volume? Maybe it's just in my head.

 

for reference, i was trying to think of a song that sounded big and loud and this came to mind. never mind if he's a creep

maybe it's just a performance thing.

long way around of saying though that... there's a lot of interesting stuff going on in this album, I'm digging it.

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sidis

sidis 9832

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On 6/10/2023 at 6:47 PM, The Ace of Aces said:

I’m too music dumb to even articulate but Save the World just seems different. It’s not bad at all-just seems off to me for some reason. I’m sure it’s me. 

a big part of it is that it is uptempo at 160 bpm which is just jarring when you are expecting an jason isbell song.  also, the overwhelming majority of his songs...particularly his popular ones...are in g.  also a and d.  save the world is in e.  but i will say his voice is noticeably more compressed in save the world than most other tracks.  there's not as much depth and color on the tone...and that's a lot of his signature.  it is much more of pop music expression of his vox.

 

2 hours ago, Celery Man said:

Anyways, I feel like this album has some dynamics and interesting stuff going on, but also some of that same kinda flatness. I was thinking about that listening to Miles, which is very interesting - I can't put a pen to all the influences I'm hearing in the extended breakdown but it feels like a different thing than either "acoustic jason" or "country rock jason" (or "hawaiian shirt blues rock jason"). Some cool stuff going on, but I still wish there was something more to it that made it sound louder, and I wish I had the expertise to even know what I'm talking about. Is it that there are quiet sounding parts that are right up in the mix with the big "soaring" guitar parts? Do they need room mics? Are the drums not big enough, the vocals too big? Is it just that everything is the same volume? Maybe it's just in my head.

also a result of master buss compression i suspect.  what you are talking about is dynamic range/expression. 

fwiw, in the liner notes, he says the approach was what would happen if neil young was fronting a paul mccartney song when he was with wings...tying small pieces together to come to a crazy song in sum.  he was treading new ground here and i don't think he wanted to seem like he was devaluing the first half of it by overpowering the refrain.

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Foosters

Foosters 17888

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I'm on probably my 3rd listen all the way through by now. I think it's his best album, top to bottom, since Southeastern. I've already come around on songs that I was neutral on at the first listen, in ways that I still haven't on Dreamsicle and others. Some headshakingly good songwriting in many of these songs 

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Celery Man

Celery Man 20996

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Continuing on my thing about some of his recordings being boring and this being a step towards less of that - his vocals on This Ain’t It are interesting. From a … little bit of mic distortion perspective. 
 

Obviously just tones upon tones from the guitars.

 

Just some dad shit but every night my daughter demands to say goodnight to the “tartars” (the gretsches hanging on the wall and the goldtop Les Paul gets a kiss), and she has worked goodnight to the “dinosaurs” into the mix.

IMG_2835.thumb.jpeg.dcc9e44dc4f572ade90c0c93927f2a41.jpeg

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Al_4_ISU

Al_4_ISU 12485

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I texted a good friend/fellow music nerd who's been a big Isbell fan in the past (but like me had gotten pretty down on the recent output) what his thoughts on Weathervanes were.

His response "I haven't listened yet.  I hated the first single so much that I just moved on."  I go on to tell him I think it's a pretty major return to form and a few of these songs are among his best work.

3 hours later, I get a text back.  "Ok, it's insane how good some of these songs are".

Edited by Al_4_ISU
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Kennythetiger

Kennythetiger 9460

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8 hours ago, Celery Man said:

Continuing on my thing about some of his recordings being boring and this being a step towards less of that - his vocals on This Ain’t It are interesting. From a … little bit of mic distortion perspective. 
 

Obviously just tones upon tones from the guitars.

 

Just some dad shit but every night my daughter demands to say goodnight to the “tartars” (the gretsches hanging on the wall and the goldtop Les Paul gets a kiss), and she has worked goodnight to the “dinosaurs” into the mix.

IMG_2835.thumb.jpeg.dcc9e44dc4f572ade90c0c93927f2a41.jpeg

She’s just trying to avoid going to bed. 😊

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Buzzrock

Buzzrock 14941

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alright I've completed the first listen through. not trying to actively or critically listen, just driving and experiencing the music. really enjoying it. early favorites are Oklahoma, We Were Close, Early in the Morning. Oklahoma and We Were Close i feel some connection to, "Early in the Morning" is just a nice beachy song whose vibe stands out, I'm sure it will settle in the mix somewhere when I get more familiar with the whole album. But also, Miles is interesting.
I've criticized Isbell studio recordings a lot of times for sounding neutered, flat, boring, sterile, that kind of thing. I'd have to go through and listen through again to defend the position but I feel like on an album like Southeastern, the more stripped down acoustic songs maybe even have more energy than the full band songs. Stockholm is a great song, probably great performances, but the recording is still flat - it's the same volume the whole way through, which I would describe as "6". I think specifically a thing I've said is that I'd love a record of Isbell songs that sounded like a Sturgill record.
But, I'm not an engineer or a producer. I have some experience fucking around in a studio and listening to people who know what they are doing talk but I don't pay that much attention typically. I hate it when someone points out a snare that sounds like ass because I never notice it before and can never not hear it afterwards.
Anyways, I feel like this album has some dynamics and interesting stuff going on, but also some of that same kinda flatness. I was thinking about that listening to Miles, which is very interesting - I can't put a pen to all the influences I'm hearing in the extended breakdown but it feels like a different thing than either "acoustic jason" or "country rock jason" (or "hawaiian shirt blues rock jason"). Some cool stuff going on, but I still wish there was something more to it that made it sound louder, and I wish I had the expertise to even know what I'm talking about. Is it that there are quiet sounding parts that are right up in the mix with the big "soaring" guitar parts? Do they need room mics? Are the drums not big enough, the vocals too big? Is it just that everything is the same volume? Maybe it's just in my head.
[/url]  
for reference, i was trying to think of a song that sounded big and loud and this came to mind. never mind if he's a creep
 maybe it's just a performance thing.
long way around of saying though that... there's a lot of interesting stuff going on in this album, I'm digging it.


Isbell is an artist who is night and day between recorded and live. I’m guessing you’ve seen him live by now but if not you should fix that.

Check out the version of Children of Children on the Spotify Sessions vs the album version. I kind of gloss over the album version when it comes up on my playlist but that live version is crackling.

In other news, I’ve got my favorite Isbell shirt on and about to go partying in Alabama.
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Celery Man

Celery Man 20996

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32 minutes ago, Buzzrock said:

 


Isbell is an artist who is night and day between recorded and live. I’m guessing you’ve seen him live by now but if not you should fix that.

Check out the version of Children of Children on the Spotify Sessions vs the album version. I kind of gloss over the album version when it comes up on my playlist but that live version is crackling.

In other news, I’ve got my favorite Isbell shirt on and about to go partying in Alabama.

 

Oh I need to listen to Spotify sessions. My favorite Isbell record is Live from Alabama. Didn’t see him until his recent shows in Austin but yeah, it was big and loud.

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Pescado_Rojo

Pescado_Rojo 19428

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2 hours ago, Celery Man said:

Another full listen today. Fuckin great album. White Beretta is the only one I don’t have much of an impression of yet and Change the World is the only one I want to skip, and that’s just because it is a fucking bummer (but… not therapeutically so).

White Beretta feels like a companion piece to "The Problem", the duet he did with Amanda that was on one of her records, but from the guy's perspective and several years later. 

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Celery Man

Celery Man 20996

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To be clear I think Beretta is a victim of track placement for me so far. Just haven’t paid close attention to it yet.

As a little girl dad a thing I sometimes ponder over is the notion of actually being mad at some future version of my daughter, or somehow not talking to her and wanting to be involved in her life. Obviously she drives me crazy all the time and I want her to just be normal and relax and stop pretending to eat the berries from that bush and no this is not your swing this is the park’s swing etc, but I just can’t fathom “my daughter and I don’t speak” and that would be a tremendous tragedy. I’ll never allow that to happen but of course I know that the dynamic will change as she gets older and we may have issues. But Cast Iron Skillet brings up a lot of feelings, fuck that guy.

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Celery Man

Celery Man 20996

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Really it is the sequence of emotions - fuck this guy for being a racist piece of shit, fuck this guy for loving hate more than he loves love, for turning away from his daughter out of ignorance and hate, and fuck this guy for having the gall to go on living and laughing after having done so. And then the lyrics of "seems like just a week ago she was sitting on your shoulders watching fireworks in the sky" god damn. Still fuck that guy, still utter sadness for the daughter, but the connection with that moment and the fear that something could ever happen that could turn me into any version of that guy, that could ever harm the love between the little girl on my shoulders and I. You can hear her laughing and screaming.

I guess the first verse is also about something sweet and innocent that turned into hate and evil. And the chorus, little aphorisms that we all heard growing up (specifically in the south). And the thing about not washing the cast iron skillet is actually bullshit, and I think he said as much in an interview. Still stitching the meaning together but that father-daughter verse kills me.

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Foosters

Foosters 17888

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2 hours ago, Celery Man said:

Really it is the sequence of emotions - fuck this guy for being a racist piece of shit, fuck this guy for loving hate more than he loves love, for turning away from his daughter out of ignorance and hate, and fuck this guy for having the gall to go on living and laughing after having done so. And then the lyrics of "seems like just a week ago she was sitting on your shoulders watching fireworks in the sky" god damn. Still fuck that guy, still utter sadness for the daughter, but the connection with that moment and the fear that something could ever happen that could turn me into any version of that guy, that could ever harm the love between the little girl on my shoulders and I. You can hear her laughing and screaming.

I guess the first verse is also about something sweet and innocent that turned into hate and evil. And the chorus, little aphorisms that we all heard growing up (specifically in the south). And the thing about not washing the cast iron skillet is actually bullshit, and I think he said as much in an interview. Still stitching the meaning together but that father-daughter verse kills me.

May have already been touched on, but the part in Miles where's he sings about the daughter not wanting to let go of his hand and asking if the little carnival is "just like Disneyland" fuuuuucks me up.

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NWBuck

NWBuck 8586

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15 minutes ago, Foosters said:

May have already been touched on, but the part in Miles where's he sings about the daughter not wanting to let go of his hand and asking if the little carnival is "just like Disneyland" fuuuuucks me up.

"As she leaves, I'll tell her don't get hurt and don't get pregnant, but she won't acknowledge me at all". Dayum

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Al_4_ISU

Al_4_ISU 12485

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4 hours ago, Celery Man said:

Really it is the sequence of emotions - fuck this guy for being a racist piece of shit, fuck this guy for loving hate more than he loves love, for turning away from his daughter out of ignorance and hate, and fuck this guy for having the gall to go on living and laughing after having done so. And then the lyrics of "seems like just a week ago she was sitting on your shoulders watching fireworks in the sky" god damn. Still fuck that guy, still utter sadness for the daughter, but the connection with that moment and the fear that something could ever happen that could turn me into any version of that guy, that could ever harm the love between the little girl on my shoulders and I. You can hear her laughing and screaming.

I guess the first verse is also about something sweet and innocent that turned into hate and evil. And the chorus, little aphorisms that we all heard growing up (specifically in the south). And the thing about not washing the cast iron skillet is actually bullshit, and I think he said as much in an interview. Still stitching the meaning together but that father-daughter verse kills me.

I kinda get the impression that the dad in Cast Iron Skillet literally murders the boyfriend 

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4th&Five

4th&Five 41590

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He’s said they’re two different stories about people he knew/knows. The murderer was a friend he grew up with that fell in with the wrong crowd. The girl is someone in his extended family whose immediate family disowned her for dating a black man. 

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4th&Five

4th&Five 41590

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Found it:

Q: I wanted to talk to you about “Cast Iron Skillet” because that seems like a really important song on this record. And tying it back to Drive-By Truckers, a thought I had is that it is sort of like the dark underbelly of “Outfit.” In both songs, there’s a dad giving advice, and in “Outfit” it’s this warm and inviting song. But in “Cast Iron Skillet, the dad is a monster. And he is dispensing similar little bits of witty lines, but there’s a terrible undercurrent to it.

JI: The verses were based on real things that happened when I was a kid. Those were real people. I had some friends when I was little that, as we got older, we sort of drifted apart and they fell in with a bad crowd and they wound up murdering somebody. And that was a huge deal in a small town. And then the second half of that story was about a member of my extended family who had a boyfriend who was black and her dad disowned her for that. Those things stuck with me. And they’re both topics that I tried to address in songs for a long time, but it took this particular project for me to really wrap my mind around it.

It felt right to set that against advice that’s various levels of trustworthy. You can tell a lot about somebody from the South by what sort of adages they tend to throw at you. Some of those are more violent than others. The one about the dog [“That dog bites my kid, I’ll kill it”] there’s an undercurrent of violence in there that I feel like really helped develop the character.

It’s not necessarily advice you’re supposed to follow. I mean, you can wash a cast iron skillet. It doesn’t hurt it. That’s a myth. And a lot of these things are myths. Violent, violent myths.

Q: I actually think that “There’s a hole inside of you, fill it” is pretty good advice in terms of just telling someone they need to take control of their own happiness.

JI: Yeah. It could also be bad advice. That one serves multiple purposes. It’s like, “Take care of yourself, clean up your own yard,” or “Put something inside you that allows you to forget about the thing that you really need.”

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Seasick Sailor

Seasick Sailor 3747

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9 minutes ago, 4th&Five said:

Found it:

Q: I wanted to talk to you about “Cast Iron Skillet” because that seems like a really important song on this record. And tying it back to Drive-By Truckers, a thought I had is that it is sort of like the dark underbelly of “Outfit.” In both songs, there’s a dad giving advice, and in “Outfit” it’s this warm and inviting song. But in “Cast Iron Skillet, the dad is a monster. And he is dispensing similar little bits of witty lines, but there’s a terrible undercurrent to it.

JI: The verses were based on real things that happened when I was a kid. Those were real people. I had some friends when I was little that, as we got older, we sort of drifted apart and they fell in with a bad crowd and they wound up murdering somebody. And that was a huge deal in a small town. And then the second half of that story was about a member of my extended family who had a boyfriend who was black and her dad disowned her for that. Those things stuck with me. And they’re both topics that I tried to address in songs for a long time, but it took this particular project for me to really wrap my mind around it.

It felt right to set that against advice that’s various levels of trustworthy. You can tell a lot about somebody from the South by what sort of adages they tend to throw at you. Some of those are more violent than others. The one about the dog [“That dog bites my kid, I’ll kill it”] there’s an undercurrent of violence in there that I feel like really helped develop the character.

It’s not necessarily advice you’re supposed to follow. I mean, you can wash a cast iron skillet. It doesn’t hurt it. That’s a myth. And a lot of these things are myths. Violent, violent myths.

Q: I actually think that “There’s a hole inside of you, fill it” is pretty good advice in terms of just telling someone they need to take control of their own happiness.

JI: Yeah. It could also be bad advice. That one serves multiple purposes. It’s like, “Take care of yourself, clean up your own yard,” or “Put something inside you that allows you to forget about the thing that you really need.”

Do you have a link to this interview?

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 46130

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I find his approach to lyrics fascinating.  He has a very clear understanding of when he needs to be literal, when he can be vague, what's OK to leave up to the listener.

I'm not 1/10 the writer he is and it's in part because I'm determined to be crystal clear, all the time.  He just operates on a higher plane, using the language at times like a surgeon, at times like Jackson Pollack, at times halfway in between.  Dude is a monster writer.

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AbeFroman

AbeFroman 2204

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18 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

I kinda get the impression that the dad in Cast Iron Skillet literally murders the boyfriend 

That’s the impression I got as well.  And makes the last verse more poetic knowing they ‘tried’ to kill her love, but they never changed her mind.

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Al_4_ISU

Al_4_ISU 12485

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9 minutes ago, AbeFroman said:

That’s the impression I got as well.  And makes the last verse more poetic knowing they ‘tried’ to kill her love, but they never changed her mind.

The bit about lying to the county cops steered me that way.  I imagined this old racist monster killing the boyfriend and just good-ol’-boying the cops at the gas station lying through his teeth.

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Celery Man

Celery Man 20996

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I've probably talked about it as well but that album must've come out in the summer of 2004, because the very short window in which I had a show on KVRX (UT Radio station) I found it bouncing around in the new releases bin and played it a few times. I wound up buying it and it was in the 6 disc CD changer in the trunk of my '96 Saab, so did it get some spins?

i-think-you-should-leave-tim-robinson.gi

honestly had no idea who Isbell was and it wasn't until I was reintroduced to him through Southeastern and did some reading that I knew he had anything to do with that album. But it's a great fucking album... lots of great songs top to bottom but also every Isbell song on there is great to among his best (Goddamn Lonely Love, Danko/Manuel, Never Gonna Change, John Henry) and I am in complete agreement that John Henry is way overlooked. Say your prayers John Henry Ford cause we don't you work no more.

 

Also this song such a vibe. I wish some mainstream country artists had the balls to write shit like this

oh shit and is that the remix? I guess I gotta go listen to that whole album now

Edited by Celery Man
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