Ronald Reagan... My God

[vin2basketball 10]

Newly released tape from the Nixon Presidential Library shows Ronald Reagan making racist or at least racially tinged comments to Richard Nixon about African delegates to the UN in 1971.

Quote

The day after the United Nations voted to recognize the People’s Republic of China, then–California Governor Ronald Reagan phoned President Richard Nixon at the White House and vented his frustration at the delegates who had sided against the United States. “Last night, I tell you, to watch that thing on television as I did,” Reagan said. “Yeah,” Nixon interjected. Reagan forged ahead with his complaint: “To see those, those monkeys from those African countries—damn them, they’re still uncomfortable wearing shoes!” Nixon gave a huge laugh.

So that's pretty bad. The other part of the story that I found interesting is:

Quote

The exchange was taped by Nixon, and then later became the responsibility of the Nixon Presidential Library, which I directed from 2007 to 2011. When the National Archives originally released the tape of this conversation, in 2000, the racist portion was apparently withheld to protect Reagan’s privacy. A court order stipulated that the tapes be reviewed chronologically; the chronological review was completed in 2013. Not until 2017 or 2018 did the National Archives begin a general rereview of the earliest Nixon tapes. Reagan’s death, in 2004, eliminated the privacy concerns. Last year, as a researcher, I requested that the conversations involving Ronald Reagan be rereviewed, and two weeks ago, the National Archives released complete versions of the October 1971 conversations involving Reagan online.

The thing that I don't understand is why there was a differential application of privacy just to this portion of the tape. Like I understand the argument that this is private communication, so you can't release all of the tapes. But why would you only apply that privacy standard to a small portion of the tape?

[Js1 85104]

No wonder Republicans still talk about Ronnie like he was the second coming.

[David Dennison 18655]

Ronald Reagan's legacy is only going to diminish with time. He was a terrible president and not a very good person, it seems.

[F250 28682]

A 60 year old white guy making racist comments in 1971 doesn't seem very surprising. Shit, it was probably more uncommon for whites to be offended by that kind of language in '71.

[David Dennison 18655]

1 minute ago, F250 said:

A 60 year old white guy making racist comments in 1971 doesn't seem very surprising. Shit, it was probably more uncommon for whites to be offended by that kind of language in '71.

And that's just one of many reasons why the notion American exceptionalism is a load of horse shit.

[Mojo Hand 4580]

26 minutes ago, vin2basketball said:

Newly released tape from the Nixon Presidential Library shows Ronald Reagan making racist or at least racially tinged comments to Richard Nixon about African delegates to the UN in 1971.

So that's pretty bad. The other part of the story that I found interesting is:

The thing that I don't understand is why there was a differential application of privacy just to this portion of the tape. Like I understand the argument that this is private communication, so you can't release all of the tapes. But why would you only apply that privacy standard to a small portion of the tape?

Not to nitpick, but calling black UN delegates "monkeys" is unquestionably racist, not just racially tinged.   It's as racist a comment as it gets. 

[Asithappens 974]

7 minutes ago, F250 said:

A 60 year old white guy making racist comments in 1971 doesn't seem very surprising. Shit, it was probably more uncommon for whites to be offended by that kind of language in '71.

No shit.

Look at LBJ.

Stop applying current day codes of morality to the past. We get it. It's wrong. 

[David Dennison 18655]

Just now, Asithappens said:

No shit.

Look at LBJ.

Stop applying current day codes of morality to the past. We get it. It's wrong. 

And it needs to be pointed out for posterity so we know just how shitty these men were.

[Tuco 5076]

Have you heard his press secretary joking about AIDS as the epidemic was ramping up, killing Americans. Not a private conversation; it was in multiple press conferences, teasing reporters on why they would be concerned about a disease predominantly killing gay men.

As bad as Trump is and as bad as Trumpkins are, we do need to step back, review recent history, and acknowledge progress.

[Asithappens 974]

8 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

And it needs to be pointed out for posterity so we know just how shitty these men were.

This kind of sums up my point quite well.

LBJ, who had his faults, but who also ushered in civil/voting rights the likes of which had never been seen before, is labeled "shitty" because he held un-enlightened views as defined by our time. His racist views trump everything else, to some.

Imo, this mentality is a problem. It's corrosive. 

[David Dennison 18655]

1 minute ago, Asithappens said:

This kind of sums up my point quite well.

LBJ, who had his faults, but who also ushered in civil/voting rights the likes of which had never been seen before, is labeled "shitty" because he held un-enlightened views as defined by our time. His racist views trump everything else, to some.

Imo, this mentality is a problem. It's corrosive. 

The opposite is apologia.

[Incredulity 11564]

7 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

And it needs to be pointed out for posterity so we know just how shitty these men were.

Shut the fuck up, you dainty petulant cunt.

[David Dennison 18655]

Just now, Incredulity said:

Shut the fuck up, you dainty petulant cunt.

Settle down, snowflake.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13411]

35 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Ronald Reagan's legacy is only going to diminish with time. He was a terrible president and not a very good person, it seems.

Maybe.  Most on the Right already put ideals on him that he didn't even believe in.  It's the speakers ideal but they want to use Ronnie to validate it.  "Ronald Reagan was 100% behind supporting Crown Prince MBS and his war in Yemen."

[atomheartbevo 89416]

I’ll catch some shit for this, but as despicable as he was, he was perfect for that brief period where the Cold War ramps up and then wound down and the Soviet Union fell soon after.    Doesn’t excuse his personal views, but how do things play out if Carter wins a second term, and say George H. W.or Bob Dole win in ‘84?

[Asithappens 974]

To add something, look at Coke Stevenson. An honorable man, no doubt, who held (at the time widely accepted) very racist views.

Are his views justified/condoned simply b/c they were accepted more then than now? Of course not. But it sure as hell doesn't make him a shitty person.

 

[David Dennison 18655]

Just now, Asithappens said:

To add something, look at Coke Stevenson. An honorable man, no doubt, who held (at the time widely accepted) very racist views.

Are his views justified/condoned simply b/c they were accepted more then than now? Of course not. But it sure as hell doesn't make him a shitty person.

Yes, it does. 

[Js1 85104]

4 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Maybe.  Most on the Right already put ideals on him that he didn't even believe in.  It's the speakers ideal but they want to use Ronnie to validate it.  "Ronald Reagan was 100% behind supporting Crown Prince MBS and his war in Yemen."

Ronald Reagan in 2019 would be a Mexican-loving libtard RINO. 

[Judge Roybeanbag 11810]

Curious to find out who released this and what the motivation was.  To further drive in a racial wedge?   To normalize Trump's shittiness?  To point out the GOP has always been racist? 

Whatever the reason it doesn't surprise me.  Reagan was a shitty person, from all I know.

[kevwun 15643]

The Nixon Library people ran across it when they were going through all of his tapes I believe.  I think the former director was involved in making it public.

[formermav43 4599]

33 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

And that's just one of many reasons why the notion American exceptionalism is a load of horse shit.

I don’t disagree about American exceptionalism. But this isn’t an American problem - it’s common to all humanity.

[Mojo Hand 4580]

Why is it that Republicans decry moral relativism applied to the present, but consistently use it to excuse abhorrent behavior in the past?   

[NowThis 931]

is Reagan still the God of the Right or Trump taken that role?

[Junior Miller 1502]

So a shitty actor/pop culture celebrity who tries to differentiate themselves in politics by pandering to the uneducated/naive republican base is actually a shitty person and terrible president? No, this could never happen today. 

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

a dude one time said something racist half a century ago in the middle of the civil rights era.  it ended up on tape.  on things i evaluate reagan's role in our country, i'd place something he said to one person 9 years before he was president pretty far behind probably everything else that appears on his wikipedia page right now.

[RomaVicta 29783]

Calling people from Africa monkeys unaccustomed to wearing shoes is not marginal.

There were other stories when Reagan was in office. Specifically related to his staff when he was considering what to do about the MLK holiday bill. Martin Lucifer Coon is a real knee-slapper. 

Also recall the image Reagan liked to draw of people on welfare.

He was the smiling, avuncular face stretched across the front of the hate engine. 

And he didn't win the goddamn Cold War. That effort had been bi-partisan for decades. The Soviets were going to go broke faster than we would no matter who was in office. We didn't exactly win it considering the money we poured into so much useless military spending.

Reagan himself was not a bad man like Trump, but his presidency enabled bad men. Very bad men.

Edited July 31, 2019 by RomaVicta

[Tuco 5076]

It’s also worth noting that he supported South African apartheid much longer than the rest of the country. His veto of sanctions was overridden by Congress. His reasoning was that they were our ally against Communism. But, when looking at balancing different concerns, this quote does provide context to how much apartheid concerned him.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

And it needs to be pointed out for posterity so we know just how shitty these men were.

Yes we know, everyone is shitty, everyone has always been shitty. I'd say it's probably time for you to set sail for Utopia island where no one has ever been racist.  

PRO TIP:  Yer gonna need a ship as powerful as a Saturn 5 to get the journey started.

[RDCanecutter 26255]

I think I got my ass spanked in the circle dance in 1971 for dropping the N-bomb. I was wrong, so was Ron.

[Brian Fantana 6667]

He's dead who cares

[Hornius Emeritus 12419]

52 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Yes, it does. 

 

No, it doesn't, any more than the racist things uttered by Abraham Lincoln made him a shitty person.

[tx 3 putt 76354]

1 hour ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

To further drive in a racial wedge ?

This tactic is straight out of the kgb / Putin playbook 

[FondrenRoad 4378]

2 hours ago, vin2basketball said:

Newly released tape from the Nixon Presidential Library shows Ronald Reagan making racist or at least racially tinged comments to Richard Nixon about African delegates to the UN in 1971.

So that's pretty bad. The other part of the story that I found interesting is:

The thing that I don't understand is why there was a differential application of privacy just to this portion of the tape. Like I understand the argument that this is private communication, so you can't release all of the tapes. But why would you only apply that privacy standard to a small portion of the tape?

Fuck privacy for Presidents.  If you want to be President, you should have to waive your right to privacy.

And this shouldn't even be a private communication in the first place.  It is a sitting President speaking with a state governor about state affairs.  If you want to have a private conversation, don't record it.

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

2 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

If you want to have a private conversation, don't record it.

 

laughs nixonionly.

[F250 28682]

Just now, FondrenRoad said:

  If you want to have a private conversation, don't record it.

I don't think the people talking to Nixon were aware of the fact they were being recorded. The Nixon Tapes are the gift that keeps on giving.

 

[wildcat09 29237]

The guy kicked off his presidential campaign shouting about state's rights down the street from where civil rights workers were murdered in Mississippi.  It's not like he was exactly subtle about his racism.

[Asithappens 974]

10 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Fuck privacy for Presidents.  If you want to be President, you should have to waive your right to privacy.

Everybody, even Presidents, have a right to privacy.

 

[Horn Dog 9671]

1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

And it needs to be pointed out for posterity so we know just how shitty these men were.

But I’m told that the viewpoints and motivations  of a bunch of slave owners in the 1780’s is the only thing that should matter when deciding government policy in 2019.

[FondrenRoad 4378]

1 minute ago, Asithappens said:

Everybody, even Presidents, have a right to privacy.

 

But they shouldn't.  We all have a choice to run for President or not.  If you want to be President, it should be required that you be an open book.  The people should get to know every thing about you.  If you have something to hide, you shouldn't get to hide it and be President.

[GHOSTUSER 361]

1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

I’ll catch some shit for this, but as despicable as he was, he was perfect for that brief period where the Cold War ramps up and then wound down and the Soviet Union fell soon after.    Doesn’t excuse his personal views, but how do things play out if Carter wins a second term, and say George H. W.or Bob Dole win in ‘84?

Carter lost Iran to the mullahs and humiliated us by allowing them to keep our embassy personnel hostage for over 444 days instead of invading Iran like any other President would have. Another term and he would have allowed another calamity to happen, most likely Soviet Union aggression or leaving Israel out to dry.

[retread 2951]

1 hour ago, Mojo Hand said:

Why is it that Republicans decry moral relativism applied to the present, but consistently use it to excuse abhorrent behavior in the past?   

If the R party embraced minorities and immigrants in 2019, then their apologists might be able to say that the Rs have at least evolved in a good way. They can't say that.

Shitholes countries, infested cities, concentration camps, go back where you came from, etc.

[GHOSTUSER 361]

1 minute ago, retread said:

If the R party embraced minorities and immigrants in 2019, then their apologists might be able to say that the Rs have at least evolved in a good way. They can't say that.

Shitholes countries, infested cities, concentration camps, go back where you came from, etc.

The most successful immigrant communities in this country - Cuban and Iranian Americans, have been solidly GOP for years. Our interests are aligned with the wealthy

[David Dennison 18655]

2 minutes ago, Iconoclast Texan said:

The most successful immigrant communities in this country - Cuban and Iranian Americans, have been solidly GOP for years. Our interests are aligned with the wealthy

Those aren't the most successful immigrant communities in this country

 

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

Also, lulz at whatever you're implying about the Cubans being aligned with Rs.  I think we all know why they are, and it's not particularly relevant to any other group.

[wildcat09 29237]

4 minutes ago, Iconoclast Texan said:

The most successful immigrant communities in this country - Cuban and Iranian Americans, have been solidly GOP for years. Our interests are aligned with the wealthy

It's hilarious how proud you are of being a racist political party's pet.

[Js1 85104]

4 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Those aren't the most successful immigrant communities in this country

 

Jeez, those poor Asian immigrants. And the Jews. I hear they run everything. 

[GHOSTUSER 361]

16 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Those aren't the most successful immigrant communities in this country

 

Wrong as usual. From a source you’d trust. HuffPost 

A report by the Iranian Studies Group at MIT reveals that per capita average income for Iranian-Americans is 50% higher than that of the rest of the nation. Iranian-Americans living in homes valued at over $1 Million exceeds the national average by ten times

Edited July 31, 2019 by Iconoclast Texan

[GHOSTUSER 361]

6 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

It's hilarious how proud you are of being a racist political party's pet.

I support a party that allows me to keep as much of my wealth as possible and whose policies have allowed my commercial real estate investments to do exceptionally well. My interests don’t lie with a party that panders to the needs of poor minorities. 

Edited July 31, 2019 by Iconoclast Texan

[tantric superman 4667]

1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

I’ll catch some shit for this, but as despicable as he was, he was perfect for that brief period where the Cold War ramps up and then wound down and the Soviet Union fell soon after.    Doesn’t excuse his personal views, but how do things play out if Carter wins a second term, and say George H. W.or Bob Dole win in ‘84?

Stanford wins the 1982 Big Game, and then goes on to win the Peach Bowl?

[wildcat09 29237]

Just now, Iconoclast Texan said:

I support a party that allows me to keep as much as my wealth as possible and have seen my commercial real estate investments do exceptionally well. My interests don’t lie with the needs of poor minorities 

If your party isn't defeated they will seize your property and throw you in a camp as a suspected Muslim.  You will never be white to them.