Bad boat fire off of LA

[Beau Vine 54,429]

47 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Why are people onboard, but motors are inboard?  What is the deal with that?  Motors can be outboard, but people are only offboard?  

What's the deal with Ovaltine?

[Deej 76,919]

49 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Why are people onboard, but motors are inboard?  What is the deal with that?  Motors can be outboard, but people are only offboard?  

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

38 minutes ago, crash_davis said:

are you offering?

My philosophy has always been to spread the wealth when it comes to good weed, and good liquor.

[crash_davis 23,115]

1 minute ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

My philosophy has always been to spread the wealth when it comes to good weed, and good liquor.

sounds like south austin, but with his mom.

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

16 minutes ago, crash_davis said:

sounds like south austin, but with his mom.

owwwwch......

[clapclapclap 9,000]

A 3-hour Viking funeral, a 3-hour Viking funeral

[clapclapclap 9,000]

Looks like that room was designed for up to 45 persons sleeping.

 

I'm surprised CA allowed such a deathtrap layout, at least for overnight accommodations.  Narrow aisles and up to 3 levels of bunks, it would probably take several minutes to fully evacuate 45 even if the stairs weren't blocked, much longer through only the escape hatch.  Would this design be legal for a land building?

Not a single person made it out of there.

[High Plains Drifter 11,052]

Looks pretty death trappy. Or DIAFy.

 

[smuggs 9,353]

6 minutes ago, clapclapclap said:

Looks like that room was designed for up to 45 persons sleeping.

 

Would this design be legal for a land building?

 

Maybe in Hong Kong.

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13,119]

14 minutes ago, clapclapclap said:

I'm surprised CA allowed such a deathtrap layout, at least for overnight accommodations.  Narrow aisles and up to 3 levels of bunks, it would probably take several minutes to fully evacuate 45 even if the stairs weren't blocked, much longer through only the escape hatch.  Would this design be legal for a land building?

These boats aren’t subject to CA codes regarding construction. They are built to federal regulations. These regulations are are not as strict for smaller passenger vessels as they would be for larger cruise ships/ferries. Small business owner protection and all that... Also, many older vessels are grandfathered in and don’t even have to meet modern small passenger vessel standards.

[MissingInAction 25,183]

I put my outboard in your moms inboard 

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13,119]

Just now, MissingInAction said:

I put my outboard in your moms inboard 

That’s a bit overboard.

[El Diablo 4,232]

6 hours ago, Casual Encounter said:

That’s a bit overboard.

2.0

[RPM 26,354]

6 hours ago, MissingInAction said:

I put my outboard in your moms inboard 

She likes my hardwood deck.

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

29 minutes ago, RPM said:

She likes my hardwood deck.

But she prefers my tiller

[immortal13 4,059]

What a fucking horrible way to die

[Anastasis 23,485]

49 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

But she prefers my tiller

Get a few drinks in her and she’ll swab the galley like a champ.  

[Trey3216 15,356]

12 hours ago, Casual Encounter said:

Ahh, because he would have been on a boat, with the fire and smoke, clearly in the fire.

Username definitely checks out

[TwiceHorn 31,536]

9 hours ago, MissingInAction said:

I put my outboard in your moms inboard 

I stuffed my prop shaft right up her stern drive.

[Trey3216 15,356]

3 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

I stuffed my prop shaft right up her stern drive.

Well yours seemed to prefer aft to mouth last night 

[ConferenceRoom 6,147]

Propellers. 

[wood 11,265]

I had a feeling ... seems to be a lot of chatter about lithium batteries. The boat's designer thinks the fire started in the bunk room. He thinks it was probably batteries charging, too, but there are conflicting reports about whether there were chargers in the bunk room. We'll see...

 https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2019-09-05/what-caused-fire-aboard-the-conception

Quote

SEP. 5, 2019 3 AM
One of the crew members aboard the dive boat Conception hadn’t been asleep long when a noise jolted him awake.

He swung open the door of the wheelhouse — the top level of the 75-foot boat, located just above the galley — and was greeted by flames.

As the fire raged in the predawn hours of Labor Day, the vessel’s captain made a frantic mayday call to the Coast Guard. Then he and four crew members jumped from the wheelhouse and climbed into a dinghy to get help from the Grape Escape, a fishing boat anchored nearby off Santa Cruz Island.

Once aboard, the crew member who had been jolted awake shook as he recounted the horrific story to Grape Escape owner Shirley Hansen. His theory, Hansen said, was that the fire started in the galley, where cellphones and cameras had been plugged in to charge overnight.

“The impression I got was that the fire was already too big to do anything,” Hansen said in an interview Wednesday.

The cause of the fire, which killed 34 people, is now the subject of an intensive investigation by the National Transportation Safety Board, the U.S. Coast Guard and other federal and county agencies. Investigators are trying to determine where and how it started.

The concern about the charging station in the galley is one possibility.

Roy Hauser, who designed the Conception and commissioned its construction in 1981, suggested another. He said he thinks, based in part on footage he viewed of the wood-hulled boat being ravaged by fire, that the blaze started in the bunk area and spread so rapidly that the 34 people there could not get out.

Lack of escape routes in boat fire becomes focus as investigation intensifies
“This had to have been, in my estimation, one of those lithium battery chargers,” Hauser told The Times. “This happened in the belly of the boat. Those people did not have a chance to get out: From stem to stern, that boat was burning.”

The Conception was one of three dive boats operated out of Santa Barbara Harbor by Truth Aquatics Inc., a long-established operation founded by Hauser in 1974 and now owned by Glen Fritzler.

The diesel-powered boat had three decks: the wheelhouse on top, the main dive deck in the middle and the bunk room on the bottom.

The sleeping area had 20 single bunks and 13 doubles, some stacked three high, records show. When fire consumed the boat, the bunks were occupied by 33 passengers and one crew member.

For those in the bunk room, there were two exits. At the bow end of the room was a staircase that led up to the galley area. Toward the stern, an escape hatch located above one of the bunks led to a mess area next to the galley — and just a few feet from the large, open main deck.

Officials said Tuesday that both exits from the bunk area were blocked by fire. Hauser said passengers should not have been impeded by flames — if they had been able to get to the escape hatch from the bunk room.

“When you come out of the escape hatch you look straight out to the main deck — you’re within 3 or 4 feet of the main deck. All you have to do is lurch forward,” Hauser said. “I don’t think those people ever had a chance to get out of their bunks.”

Boat fires often start in engine compartments, where fuel ignition sources can combine. Other such fires have been traced to electrical sources, such as wiring harnesses or batteries, or to external causes such as fires in marinas or storage facilities.

Hauser said the rapid spread of fire caused by a lithium battery could explain why no one got out.

The Federal Aviation Administration prohibits airline passengers from stowing devices containing lithium batteries — such as those in cellphones, laptops and cameras — in checked luggage unless they are turned off and protected from damage. As of Aug. 1, the FAA had recorded 265 air or airport incidents involving lithium batteries in cargo or baggage.

The U.S. Navy and others in the dive industry also have expressed concerns about lithium batteries, which in various sizes are used to power everything from automobiles to hoverboards. They also power smaller devices, such as cellphones and camera equipment, that can be carried aboard boats.

“Lithium cells and batteries offer many advantages compared to other power sources,” U.S. Navy guidelines state. “However, they are high-energy devices and shall be considered hazardous at all times. “

Mike Strong, a Phoenix-area PADI master dive instructor, said, “We’ve all seen these batteries go,” alluding to reports of cellphones, e-cigarettes and lithium car batteries catching fire.

“They’re a major safety issue,” he said, noting that he charges his batteries in a fireproof container.

And yet, on some boats, people have their camera and dive equipment charging at outlets in bunk rooms, in the galley or in the salon, he said.
“Most dive boats now require you to charge them externally on the deck,” Strong said. “There are fewer combustibles out there and more firefighting equipment.”

Dale Sheckler, a longtime diver who’s been on the Conception roughly 100 times, said there was a main charging station in the galley. A number of AC power outlets — the power strips one might have at home — are available for charging cellphones, batteries for strobes, underwater lighting and laptops.

The main charging station would be “directly above the bunk bed areas,” he said.

There are conflicting account about whether power outlets were available in the sleeping quarters. Sheckler said he thought there were some there and in the restroom area. But he recalls the galley area as the main charging station.

“You can plug in overnight,” he said. “Sometimes with a lot of people on board, there’d be competition for space.”

Gerry Lazzareschi, a physician who’s led seven trips on the Conception over the past 20 years, said power outlets were located every few feet along a ledge that lined the galley. He did not recall outlets in the sleeping quarters.

“There were never any wires haphazardly hanging out,” Lazzareschi said of the outlets. “It was all very well appointed.”

Hauser, the boat’s designer, said there were electrical outlets in the bunk room, where he fears the blaze started and spread rapidly.

Long since retired, Hauser, 75, said he has not yet spoken with Fritzler, his former partner and Truth Aquatics’ current owner, and has no inside information on the fire. But even though he has been out of the business for years, Hauser said, he is distraught by the Labor Day catastrophe on the Conception.

“I’m devastated,” Hauser said. “My God, we did this so people could go out and have fun and dive — not die. Especially in that magnitude. It’s unbelievable.”

Times staff writer Laura Newberry contributed to this report.

 

Edited September 5, 2019 by wood

[crash_davis 23,115]

I'm going to invent a fireproof box for charging electronic devices and make millions.  Crazy to think a lithium battery killed 30+ people.

edit: actually there are already a few in amazon.  

Edited September 5, 2019 by crash_davis

[clapclapclap 9,000]

The Great Grape Ape Escape is pretty good boat name.

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13,119]

11 hours ago, crash_davis said:

I'm going to invent a fireproof box for charging electronic devices and make millions.

[Beau Vine 54,429]

12 hours ago, crash_davis said:

I'm going to invent a fireproof box for charging electronic devices and make millions.  Crazy to think a lithium battery killed 30+ people.

edit: actually there are already a few in amazon.  

maybe move on to a tamper-proof festival cup lid?

[wood 11,265]

NTSB seems to think the crew did what they could do ...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/05/us/california-boat-fire-thursday/index.html

Quote

"What's emerging from the interviews, and these are individual interviews with NTSB investigators, is a harrowing story of the moments before the fire erupted on the vessel," NTSB board member Jennifer Homendy said.
One crew member said he awoke to a noise and left his bunk to see flames erupting from the galley area below, Homendy said. The galley was above the sleeping quarters of the guests
The crew members tried to get down the ladder from the galley to the sleeping area but it was engulfed in flames. They were forced to go down to the main deck from the bridge, and one of them broke their leg getting down, according to Homendy.
'The crew had to jump from the boat'
A chart showing the layout of the bunk room on the website of the company that owns the Conception, Truth Aquatics, appears to show the main way in and out of the bunk room is through the galley.
After reaching the main deck, the crew members went to the double doors of the galley to try to get to the passengers, but it too was engulfed in flames, NTSB investigators were told.
They then tried and failed to get in through a window in the front of the vessel, Homendy said at the press conference.
"At that point, due to heat, flames and smoke, the crew had to jump from the boat," Homendy said.

...

After investigating a similar boat owned by the same company, Homendy told CNN she has several safety concerns, including whether there is proper equipment for detecting and suppressing fire.
On the similar boat, the Vision, smoke alarms were not connected throughout the boat.
"We're looking into the adequacy of smoke detectors and were there enough fire extinguishers," Homendy said.
The escape hatch in the lower bunk level on the Vision was small, difficult to see, access and maneuver, she said.
In trying to pinpoint where the fire started, investigators are looking at the main deck and galley now, Homendy said.
"But we are not closing out any possibilities, from the engine room to the passenger compartment," she said.
"We are looking at the engineering, the wiring," Homendy said. "We are aware that there was a lot of gear on board with the cameras and the crew, cameras, phones, extra batteries. And chargers."
'Regulations are written in blood'
Diver Dale Sheckler said he has taken well over 100 trips on the Conception since 1985 and reported seeing several stations with power strips charging phones, laptops, cameras, underwater lights and more.
"The main charging station would be above the bunk beds in the galley," Sheckler said. "It was a little tight to find space to charge."
Still, any theory that the fire started at a charging station is "conjecture," he said.
"The Conception always has been a top notch, well-run operation," Sheckler said.
The Labor Day disaster may well spark changes in regulations of commercial dive boats and related vessels, said retired US Coast Guard Capt. Kyle McAvoy, an expert with Robson Forensic, who specializes in watercraft safety and accidents.
"A lot of regulatory and policy and safety initiatives are driven by tragic events such as this," McAvoy told CNN. "The expression is that a lot of regulations are written in blood."

 

Edited September 6, 2019 by wood

[wood 11,265]

Re: the escape ladder/hatch ...

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2019-09-05/california-boat-fire-victims-crew-members-passengers

Quote

Homendy said she was “taken aback” by the size of the emergency hatch when she toured the Vision on Wednesday with a team of investigators.

She and the investigators turned the lights off to see what it would have been like for the passengers trapped on the Conception. Getting to the emergency hatch was difficult , she said, adding that they couldn’t find the light switches in the dark.

“You have to climb up a ladder and across the top bunk and then push a wooden door up,” she said. “It was a tight space. We couldn’t turn the light on.

“It surprised me how small it was and how difficult it was to access,” she said about the escape hatch. “I couldn’t see the people in front of me.”

...and leading up to the fire...

Quote

A source familiar with the crew’s actions said that hours before the fire broke out, the passengers had performed a night dive. A crew member was awake on the boat and straightening up items in the galley and mess area but went upstairs to the wheelhouse about 2:35 a.m.

Before the crew member went upstairs, he checked that the stove was cold and nothing flammable was out, said the source, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to comment publicly. Sometime between 2:35 a.m. and 3:15 a.m., the crew member heard a noise and thought somebody had tripped. The crew member went down to the middle level and saw the fire. The flames prevented him from getting down into the galley, the source said.

In the aftermath, the crew has speculated that the fire began in the seating area in the galley area, the source said.

No crew members have reported hearing an alarm sound, the source said.

 

[woohorn 1,131]

Early on, commentators were saying there was supposed to be someone on watch all night. Was that correct?

[wood 11,265]

8 minutes ago, woohorn said:

Early on, commentators were saying there was supposed to be someone on watch all night. Was that correct?

I think that's pretty much standard practice, and from what I've read, it seems like there was someone up & on watch in this case. However, there appears to be some concern over the lack of someone roaming around the boat watching for problems.

[Pato del Muerto 52,598]

Maybe it’s a space issue, but why aren't the crew racks way below under the kitchen and the passenger racks up at or above the water level?

[wood 11,265]

5 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Maybe it’s a space issue, but why aren't the crew racks way below under the kitchen and the passenger racks up at or above the water level?

Probably space like you mentioned, and I'm guessing it's a weight issue as well - keeping the center of gravity lower by keeping the passengers and their bunks lower. Maybe more practical as well, since the crew mostly works topside.

[justhookit 4,191]

3 hours ago, wood said:

I think that's pretty much standard practice, and from what I've read, it seems like there was someone up & on watch in this case. However, there appears to be some concern over the lack of someone roaming around the boat watching for problems.

I understand what you are saying, but “watch” at night on a vessel means there is someone in the wheelhouse watching (hopefully) the radar and other than that any other warning light that might go off. There just aren’t that many safety systems and VERY few, if any audio alarms. No crew is going to be wandering the boat unless it was for a piss and even if that was the case they are doing it upstairs or off the side of the deck.

edit- this boat was not underway. Even then, that doesn’t change much at all.

Edited September 6, 2019 by justhookit

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13,119]

The requirement is for a roving watch  when overnight passengers are on board to  prevent this exact scenario. We’ll probably hear shortly that this requirement was not being met and all crew members were asleep.

[Terry Silver 219]

Helen Seinfeld:
You're going underwater?

Jerry Seinfeld:
Yes. Generally that's where scuba diving is done.

Helen Seinfeld:
What do you have to go underwater for? What's down there that's so special?

Jerry Seinfeld:
What's so special up here?

[SquishMitten 10,435]

Shouldn’t boats have a water pump that would create a fire hose directly from the water they’re sitting in? Or would that be a bad idea as often as not? I would imagine a lot of fires would be caused by fuel leaks, so maybe spraying water on them would just make it worse. Maybe a steam issue if you started spraying into the cabin while people were in a confined space?

[El Diablo 4,232]

3 hours ago, Casual Encounter said:

The requirement is for a roving watch  when overnight passengers are on board to  prevent this exact scenario. We’ll probably hear shortly that this requirement was not being met and all crew members were asleep.

If that IS a requirement what exactly are the guidelines? Once an hour check all spaces on the boat? I stood plenty of roving watches on US Navy ships and I don't recall there being any specific guidelines on how that was to be accomplished. We'd wander around the boat for an hour and then report back to the bridge. An 80' boat wouldn't take long to make a round so then you've got another 50 minutes or so to sit on the bridge and shoot the shit with the guy on bridge watch. You can't reasonably expect a person to be making rounds every ten minutes/continuously because of the size of the boat. (I made up the once an hour and ten minute round just as an example).

[wood 11,265]

5 hours ago, justhookit said:

I understand what you are saying, but “watch” at night on a vessel means there is someone in the wheelhouse watching (hopefully) the radar and other than that any other warning light that might go off. There just aren’t that many safety systems and VERY few, if any audio alarms. No crew is going to be wandering the boat unless it was for a piss and even if that was the case they are doing it upstairs or off the side of the deck.

edit- this boat was not underway. Even then, that doesn’t change much at all.

Yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking. I only mentioned the roving crewmember because that's something that was mentioned in one of the articles.

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13,119]

6 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

If that IS a requirement what exactly are the guidelines? Once an hour check all spaces on the boat? I stood plenty of roving watches on US Navy ships and I don't recall there being any specific guidelines on how that was to be accomplished. We'd wander around the boat for an hour and then report back to the bridge. An 80' boat wouldn't take long to make a round so then you've got another 50 minutes or so to sit on the bridge and shoot the shit with the guy on bridge watch. You can't reasonably expect a person to be making rounds every ten minutes/continuously because of the size of the boat. (I made up the once an hour and ten minute round just as an example).

It is a requirement. 46 CFR 185.410:

The owner, charterer, master, or managing operator of a vessel carrying overnight passengers shall have a suitable number of watchmen patrol throughout the vessel during the nighttime, whether or not the vessel is underway, to guard against, and give alarm in case of, a fire, man overboard, or other dangerous situation.

 

 

Obviously, there are not many details in the regulations as to what constitutes a watch, but I can tell you only one person would have been required on this vessel.

I’ve heard from someone I trust that they were all asleep. The question then becomes, was it a company-wide complacency issue, not requiring the watch, or derelict of duty by someone who should have been on watch. I don’t believe there is a required navigation watch while at anchor for this class of vessel, only when underway.

Is reasonable to assume a company may have migrated away from having a designated person to hang out watching movies all night, while everyone sleeps. Then to have that person sleep all day, when they could use them during their daylight diving operations. Again, just speculation.

[El Diablo 4,232]

My experience has been that mariners in general and divers in particular are a meticulous lot. It was posted above that a crew member had been in the galley between 2:00 and 3:00 a.m. and specifically mentions them checking the stove. That sounds quite normal and I suspect that it's accurate, it's just the sort of thing that you do on a boat routinely.

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

6 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

My experience has been that mariners in general and divers in particular are a meticulous lot. It was posted above that a crew member had been in the galley between 2:00 and 3:00 a.m. and specifically mentions them checking the stove. That sounds quite normal and I suspect that it's accurate, it's just the sort of thing that you do on a boat routinely.

Unfortunately it can also be a crew member covering their ass. Not really sure how a Maritime investigation will clear up what anyone was doing when the fire broke out.  I'm sure the 5 escaping crewman had time alone to create a timeline.   And I'm in no way saying that happened, only that it could. 

But I agree with your comment, and hope it's accurate.  Seems like this could be a pretty significant design lesson for future boat designers.  Sequestered, fire shielded  sleeping berths, direct access to the deck above thru a well marked, and lit escape hatches. Marine design by its very nature is space intensive/sensitive, so a feature like that could be difficult to incorporate.

[Vito Andolini 9,132]

One account I read last night (I didn’t see it above, apologies if already quoted) confirmed there was a lot of camera equipment on board, and that may lend credence to the exploding battery scenario. 

And the photo of the bunk room above is the one used by the company to promote their fleet. It’s taken with a lens designed to make it look more expansive than it really was, with every available light turned on to brighten the space. Other shots I’ve seen from the ships indicate a much more cloistered environment.

33 disoriented people, crammed together in the dark, surrounded by flames and smoke, rushing for the same small staircase is a recipe for a heartbreaking disaster.

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13,119]

26 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

My experience has been that mariners in general and divers in particular are a meticulous lot. It was posted above that a crew member had been in the galley between 2:00 and 3:00 a.m. and specifically mentions them checking the stove. That sounds quite normal and I suspect that it's accurate, it's just the sort of thing that you do on a boat routinely.

Small passenger vessel operations are a mixed bag when it comes being meticulous. This sounds like it was one of the better companies based on testimony from the community. 

[wood 11,265]

2 hours ago, Vito Andolini said:

One account I read last night (I didn’t see it above, apologies if already quoted) confirmed there was a lot of camera equipment on board, and that may lend credence to the exploding battery scenario. 

And the photo of the bunk room above is the one used by the company to promote their fleet. It’s taken with a lens designed to make it look more expansive than it really was, with every available light turned on to brighten the space. Other shots I’ve seen from the ships indicate a much more cloistered environment.

33 disoriented people, crammed together in the dark, surrounded by flames and smoke, rushing for the same small staircase is a recipe for a heartbreaking disaster.

Yeah I posted this above, but I meant to emphasize this part below. The NTSB chick said the emergency hatch was very difficult to open. In a different article she said that even once you crawled across the bunk atop the ladder, you'd have twist your body into a position where you could push the hatch open. In the land-based Fire Prevention world, this wouldn't even qualify as anything even close to being an emergency exit, but space is at a premium in the maritime world, so that standard might be much more lenient there.

Quote

Homendy said she was “taken aback” by the size of the emergency hatch when she toured the Vision on Wednesday with a team of investigators.

She and the investigators turned the lights off to see what it would have been like for the passengers trapped on the Conception. Getting to the emergency hatch was difficult , she said, adding that they couldn’t find the light switches in the dark.

“You have to climb up a ladder and across the top bunk and then push a wooden door up,” she said. “It was a tight space. We couldn’t turn the light on.

“It surprised me how small it was and how difficult it was to access,” she said about the escape hatch. “I couldn’t see the people in front of me.”

 

[wood 11,265]

2 hours ago, Casual Encounter said:

Small passenger vessel operations are a mixed bag when it comes being meticulous. This sounds like it was one of the better companies based on testimony from the community. 

Yeah every single personal account from people I've seen posting online says that these guys were very safety conscious and just top-notch in general. Everyone can fuck up though.

[wood 11,265]

After reading about what the crew told the NTSB, the theory that the fire started in the bunk room makes more and more sense to me. It would be consistent with the crew not being aware of the fire when it started, and it could explain why both access points to the bunk room were already untenable as soon as they tried to make access. Those accessways would have acted like chimneys for the fire, heat, etc to escape, and the fire would have been very intense there even before the galley & mess became fully involved.

Edited September 6, 2019 by wood

[wood 11,265]

4 hours ago, SquishMitten said:

Shouldn’t boats have a water pump that would create a fire hose directly from the water they’re sitting in? Or would that be a bad idea as often as not? I would imagine a lot of fires would be caused by fuel leaks, so maybe spraying water on them would just make it worse. Maybe a steam issue if you started spraying into the cabin while people were in a confined space?

That would probably be a good thing for some fires, but I doubt a whole lot of boats have anything like that. Re: the steam, putting out the fire is the best thing you can do for the people involved, and esp for the boat in general. The steam can burn people, but if they're close enough to the fire to be burned by any steam that would be produced, they're already in much greater danger from the fire & smoke, and frankly are probably already injured at the very least.

Edited September 6, 2019 by wood

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13,119]

1 hour ago, wood said:

After reading about what the crew told the NTSB, the theory that the fire started in the bunk room makes more and more sense to me. It would be consistent with the crew not being aware of the fire when it started, and it could explain why both access points to the bunk room were already untenable as soon as they tried to make access. Those accessways would have acted like chimneys for the fire, heat, etc to escape, and the fire would have been very intense there even before the galley & mess became fully involved.

I have a difficult time understanding how nobody escapes from the bunk room if the fire started there. The combination of smoke detectors, 34 people able to detect, and two exits (not next to each other) leads me to believe someone would have escaped.

[wood 11,265]

19 minutes ago, Casual Encounter said:

I have a difficult time understanding how nobody escapes from the bunk room if the fire started there. The combination of smoke detectors, 34 people able to detect, and two exits (not next to each other) leads me to believe someone would have escaped.

It all depends on a variety of factors ... was anyone awake at 3am (probably not), did the smoke detectors work (none of the crew reported hearing them), did the fire start with a bang or smolder quietly before really getting going, did it start near the stairs, what actually caused the fire, and more...

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13,119]

From an AP article:

SANTA BARBARA, Calif. (AP) — Dozens of people trapped on a scuba diving boat that caught fire off the Southern California coast appear to have died from smoke inhalation, not burns, authorities said Friday.

"The indicators are from the preliminary examination of the bodies that the victims died prior to being burned," Santa Barbara County Sheriff Bill Brown said. "The burn damage to the victims was post-mortem."

https://www.yahoo.com/news/fatal-fire-foiled-rescue-attempts-053539918.html