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What's going on with this DNI Whistleblower ?

triplehorn

By triplehorn
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Js1
Js1

I'm sure you took both sides of that debate. 

Crusher
Crusher

First off there was no extortion. That was not in the transcript. No quid pro quo. Why do you make up shit? Who do you think you are, Adam Schiff?  

Post Oak
Post Oak

I spent a lot of time thinking about this, unfortunately. You have to have so little self-respect that you are ok being lied to over and over.  You have to be ok with being told what to do.  You

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Judge Roybeanbag

Judge Roybeanbag 11,821

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53 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

Goddamnit.

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His former Homeland Security adviser Thomas Bossert confessed over the weekend to being “deeply disturbed” that Trump couldn’t distinguish truth from fiction, choosing to believe a debunked conspiracy theory that Ukraine, not Russia, interfered in the 2016 election.

 

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Mrs Whiggins

Mrs Whiggins 13,050

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I know other folks follow this Walter Shaub fellow and I like his account so I try and check it every week. This is only tangentially related to the Whistleblower, but it does have some implications for the future and future administrations if it goes this way:

 

Further down in his own reply he says this:

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Why does this matter? Public servants, like the whistleblower, uphold the rule of law against the flood of Trump corruption. Guarding them are civil service protections administered by OPM. Water's sloshing over the levee. Trump wants the levee to break. (Cue the Led Zeppelin)

It isn't just Trump's corruption I am worried about. Any administration must be held accountable, for all time. There will always be those who seek to rule by fiat and we need government with strong checks and safeguards. Country over Party.

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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 45,742

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28 minutes ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

I know other folks follow this Walter Shaub fellow and I like his account so I try and check it every week. This is only tangentially related to the Whistleblower, but it does have some implications for the future and future administrations if it goes this way:

 

Further down in his own reply he says this:

It isn't just Trump's corruption I am worried about. Any administration must be held accountable, for all time. There will always be those who seek to rule by fiat and we need government with strong checks and safeguards. Country over Party.

That's a lot of acronyms flip flop.

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Irwin F Fletcher

Irwin F Fletcher 3,550

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Not that it's needed but if the journalist could next get the President to say something along the lines of "we are holding off all aide/tariff negotiations with China/Ukranine until the investigation of former VP Joe Biden has begun"

 

If they tried, they could have him walking into that trap by this afternoon.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 46,153

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8 minutes ago, Irwin F Fletcher said:

Not that it's needed but if the journalist could next get the President to say something along the lines of "we are holding off all aide/tariff negotiations with China/Ukranine until the investigation of former VP Joe Biden has begun"

 

If they tried, they could have him walking into that trap by this afternoon.

True.  It's not really a journalist's role to bait the President into making statements that are impeachable offenses, but I sure wouldn't complain.

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horn4life

horn4life 3,783

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First off for me the only actual point of inflection yesterday was at some point in Trump's rambling disjointed defense was that her (paraphrased) "I released the call and I couldn't have even released it without their permission."  A pre-emptive move to shield Moscow especially and Saudi Arabia from having his unsavory treasonous conversation also made public. 

It's an interesting situation for the surrounding characters.  Pompeo is all in now.  As is justice obstructing Barr. Mike Pence is his usual slimy self, and is the most likely to turn on the President IMHO.  I could easily see Pence shape all his actions as "Now looking back at it, I was an unknowing dupe in very troubling actions of President Trump." In fact I almost view this now as the most likely scenario.  Guliani and his Russian mob linked assistants might make for very interesting testimony, but all will simply take the 5th in all liklihood. Then Congress has an immunity decision to make.  

My dream would be to have Pence horrifically damaged as well as the GOP Senate with a very narrow conviction on what is very clearly a misuse of the office of the Presidency.  The bad news for Trump is that even after Mike Pence pardons him, for this particular crime (mike has a sense of humor by not wording the pardon broadly) Trump really starts worrying about jail as a more likely possibility than the promised Trump Tower Moscow.

 

 

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wildcat09

wildcat09 29,402

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3 minutes ago, Irwin F Fletcher said:

I'd like to see proof that the White House actually got permission from Ukraine. I recall a remark from their President that he was surprised by the fact that his conversations had been released. 

The crew that used to bitch about "bow and apologize" must be apoplectic now. Hey, @MixtyMotions, you're just furious about this, right?  

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Goredho

Goredho 17,421

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13 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

These aren't Trump going loco quotes.  This is a planned strategy of discussing the stuff in the open to make us question if his originally doing it is improper at all.

Absolutely.  Normalization after the fact.  This is why its crucial the dems act quickly and decisively, before the public gets weary and numb.


Edit: Traditional logic might be to react by letting him take more rope to hang himself with, but Trump is a very shrewd provocateur.  Traditional logic does not apply.

Edited by Goredho
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wildcat09

wildcat09 29,402

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5 minutes ago, Goredho said:

Absolutely.  Normalization after the fact.  This is why its crucial the dems act quickly and decisively, before the public gets weary and numb.


Edit: Traditional logic might be to react by letting him take more rope to hang himself with, but Trump is a very shrewd provocateur.  Traditional logic does not apply.

Yeah, Pelosi and Schiff need to be holding daily press conferences explaining why Trump's conduct is so awful, otherwise swing voters won't even get it. A lot of people really need the full picture explained to them, over and over and over and over again, before they begin to see it. You're not going to convince his base, but the goal is to convince enough to support impeachment that the Republicans have only their base left supporting them and everyone else strongly opposed.

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Eastwood

Eastwood 4,394

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One thing I just can't wrap my brain around is how people who claim to be America first are okay with Trump inviting other nations to investigate American citizens, much less political rivals. I thought the attitude was that we keep that stuff "in the family" and investigate our own. We send the FBI into countries to investigate American citizens, not have the countries investigate on their own. But cool, subject American citizens to the foreign justice of possibly corrupt nations. Very America first of you.

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Goredho

Goredho 17,421

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11 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Yeah, Pelosi and Schiff need to be holding daily press conferences explaining why Trump's conduct is so awful, otherwise swing voters won't even get it. A lot of people really need the full picture explained to them, over and over and over and over again, before they begin to see it. You're not going to convince his base, but the goal is to convince enough to support impeachment that the Republicans have only their base left supporting them and everyone else strongly opposed.

Yep.  Everyone is going to be fed Trump's alternative narrative non-stop, 1000 times a day via his twitter feed until their brain's are saturated with "Trump defends himself from persecution".  Imagine WITCH HUNT sung to the tune of "Boomer Sooner" every minute of every day.  In 30 days, you're brain will be congealed and you'll be a full blown Trumpublican.

The Dem's have to act before that takes effect, or they need to counter that disinformation with a greater amount of legit information.

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Longhorn94

Longhorn94 2,458

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7 minutes ago, Eastwood said:

One thing I just can't wrap my brain around is how people who claim to be America first are okay with Trump inviting other nations to investigate American citizens, much less political rivals. I thought the attitude was that we keep that stuff "in the family" and investigate our own. We send the FBI into countries to investigate American citizens, not have the countries investigate on their own. But cool, subject American citizens to the foreign justice of possibly corrupt nations. Very America first of you.

but its not just that. because that would suggest a legitimate end to justify the means. no, this is about corruption. this is about asking foreign nations that want or need military aid from us or foreign nations that are locked into a trade war with us to create dirt on his opponent so he can win reelection. its all about his interests first. its about subjugating our foreign policy, our economy, our democracy to his personal interest. its illegal and he should be impeached and removed for it.

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Eastwood

Eastwood 4,394

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1 minute ago, Longhorn94 said:

but its not just that. because that would suggest a legitimate end to justify the means. no, this is about corruption. this is about asking foreign nations that want or need military aid from us or foreign nations that are locked into a trade war with us to create dirt on his opponent so he can win reelection. its all about his interests first. its about subjugating our foreign policy, our economy, our democracy to his personal interest. its illegal and he should be impeached and removed for it.

Oh, I agree. But peel all that down to the basic concept of "he's asking a foreign nation to conduct their own investigation of an American citizen." So, what happens if this nation renders a guilty verdict? Is Trump then going to extradite an American citizen? Are Trumpers cool with serving up American citizens to foreign countries now? Even if you strip away all of the implications and quid pro quo of the current situation, you still have the fact that Trump is willing to expose American citizens to foreign justice. I'm just highlighting one more hypocrisy that I really haven't seen discussed, yet.

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triplehorn

triplehorn 2,664

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10 minutes ago, Goredho said:

Yep.  Everyone is going to be fed Trump's alternative narrative non-stop, 1000 times a day via his twitter feed until their brain's are saturated with "Trump defends himself from persecution".  Imagine WITCH HUNT sung to the tune of "Boomer Sooner" every minute of every day.  In 30 days, you're brain will be congealed and you'll be a full blown Trumpublican.

The Dem's have to act before that takes effect, or they need to counter that disinformation with a greater amount of legit information.

This is why there's a risk of dropping articles of impeachment too soon.  I've maintained it all along - so much hinges on getting his DB financials and tax returns.  When Trump goes to far greater lengths to continue to hide his taxes and financials than releasing the damning transcript of his extortion convo with Zelensky, it should signal something.  And yes, if its a direct hit, it will thoroughly involve Russia.

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Celery Man

Celery Man 21,001

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One thing I just can't wrap my brain around is how people who claim to be America first are okay with Trump inviting other nations to investigate American citizens, much less political rivals. I thought the attitude was that we keep that stuff "in the family" and investigate our own. We send the FBI into countries to investigate American citizens, not have the countries investigate on their own. But cool, subject American citizens to the foreign justice of possibly corrupt nations. Very America first of you.


1) America comes first and shall be made great
2) people I don’t like are not real Americans and can get fucked
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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 46,153

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Eastwood said:

Oh, I agree. But peel all that down to the basic concept of "he's asking a foreign nation to conduct their own investigation of an American citizen." So, what happens if this nation renders a guilty verdict? Is Trump then going to extradite an American citizen? 

I highlighted the question that occurred to me when he started down this path.  Under normal circumstances, the natural reaction would be "OK, great, he's pushing to have other countries investigate a US citizen, nothing would ever happen with a guilty plea, even if we had an extradition treaty."  But with Trump, that's not true.  He would absolutely extradite anyone he felt he had good reason to.

We are hanging the fortunes of people like Hunter Biden on the good will of other countries.  It's fucking maddening.

Edited by jimmyjazz
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Goredho

Goredho 17,421

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Posted

 

1 minute ago, Celery Man said:

 


1) America comes first and shall be made great
2) people I don’t like are not real Americans and can get fucked

 

I am the beneficiary of the traditional American order.  Minorities, women, gays, non-Christians and other undesirables pulling a seat up to the table of power means I or someone like me leaves.  What's that?  My class that has traditionally held power will be a voting minority in less than 15 years?  Fuck that.  Bar the fucking door and get the shotgun from the mantle.

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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 45,742

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Eastwood said:

One thing I just can't wrap my brain around is how people who claim to be America first are okay with Trump inviting other nations to investigate American citizens, much less political rivals. I thought the attitude was that we keep that stuff "in the family" and investigate our own. We send the FBI into countries to investigate American citizens, not have the countries investigate on their own. But cool, subject American citizens to the foreign justice of possibly corrupt nations. Very America first of you.

It's easy if you realize that anyone who isn't in their cult is also not American.

Edited by Biff Tannen
clunky sentence. still clunky. but the point is made. also what Celery said
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deech

deech 2,293

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2 hours ago, Irwin F Fletcher said:

Not that it's needed but if the journalist could next get the President to say something along the lines of "we are holding off all aide/tariff negotiations with China/Ukranine until the investigation of former VP Joe Biden has begun"

 

If they tried, they could have him walking into that trap by this afternoon.

Like going on NBC with Lester Holt and admitting obstruction with Russia investigation?

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Js1

Js1 85,583

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1 minute ago, Pig Bellmont said:

So let me get this straight. Trump wants China to open an investigation into the Biden’s related to inappropriate influence by top office holders with foreign governments for the benefit of their children? When does the investigation into Ivanka begin and will she resign?

Image result for ivanka un

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