Band of Brothers

[MagicSoccerSpray 1725]

14 hours ago, BearSchlong said:

In 2020 the idea of defoliating an entire country seems preposterous.

 

The "entire country"? AO was for clearing overgrowth and cover from roads to make ambushes harder.

[BearSchlong 8076]

Hyperbole. I use it periodically.

AO was not used sparingly.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

1 minute ago, BearSchlong said:

Hyperbole. I use it periodically.

Hyperbole ? Is that like Tylenol ?

[Guest Lobo]

Yeah but only for kids with ADD 

[Biff Tannen 45477]

On 11/12/2020 at 4:57 PM, RPM said:

Rumor has it Hanks/Spielberg are working on an 8th Air Force series.

Not just a rumor.

https://www.militarytimes.com/off-duty/military-culture/2020/10/12/upcoming-wwii-series-from-steven-spielberg-tom-hanks-inks-star-director/

[C-Man 26991]

For me, Pacific was like True Detective 2. It was not going to be good no matter which came first. It just wasn't good.

Agreed. I didn’t like it very much at all.

[RPM 26185]

Just now, C-Man said:

 

Agreed. I didn’t like it very much at all.

 

The Pacific was great. It just should have been released before BoB. Comparing them is apples to oranges.

[TwiceHorn 31184]

Just now, RPM said:

The Pacific was great. It just should have been released before BoB. Comparing them is apples to oranges.

Yeah, it doesn't compare very well, but evaluated on its own, it is a very solid "war story" or war movie/series,

[RPM 26185]

Just now, TwiceHorn said:

Yeah, it doesn't compare very well, but evaluated on its own, it is a very solid "war story" or war movie/series,

The Pacific took 3 different stories and combined them to tell the overall story. BoB followed one group of soldiers. Very different stories to tell.

[DougO 5239]

Watched the first two episodes again last night, still greatness.

Schwimmer was so good in this thing as the ultimate asshole it really should have transformed his career and gotten him out of the Friends type casting. Sometimes odd casting decisions work out perfectly.

[BearSchlong 8076]

Just bought Buck Compton's autobiography.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, DougO said:

Watched the first two episodes again last night, still greatness.

Schwimmer was so good in this thing as the ultimate asshole it really should have transformed his career and gotten him out of the Friends type casting. Sometimes odd casting decisions work out perfectly.

Seemingly every account from the men of Easy Company is that they hated the motherfucker.  Then they also are quick to qualify that sentiment with Sobel's bullshit and tomfuckery giving them a better mental toughness and esprit de corps than they might have had otherwise.

[BearSchlong 8076]

Seemingly every account from the men of Easy Company is that they hated the motherfucker.  Then they also are quick to qualify that sentiment with Sobel's bullshit and tomfuckery giving them a better mental toughness and esprit de corps than they might have had otherwise.

Very true.

Shot himself in 1970, died in a VA home in 1987. No funeral.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

4 hours ago, DougO said:

Watched the first two episodes again last night, still greatness.

Schwimmer was so good in this thing as the ultimate asshole it really should have transformed his career and gotten him out of the Friends type casting. Sometimes odd casting decisions work out perfectly.

People don't like assholes or Frank Burns would have won an oscar at some point .

[C-Man 26991]

8 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yeah, it doesn't compare very well, but evaluated on its own, it is a very solid "war story" or war movie/series,

Maybe one of these days I'll go back and try again but I just didn't find it very engaging after the first episode or two. Perhaps it was because it didn't follow the same "characters" all the way through the series.

[Hate 20102]

The Pacific was outstanding on its own. Nothing will ever compare to BoB and that’s ok. I liked the episode on leave in Australia. It gave you a completely different look into what was going on in the lives of the soldiers. I enjoyed the episode where Lueche (sp?) goes to the “mental health island”. All of it was fantastic if you just watch the series and don’t compare it to BoB.

[PRONG HORN 3108]

2 hours ago, C-Man said:

Maybe one of these days I'll go back and try again but I just didn't find it very engaging after the first episode or two. Perhaps it was because it didn't follow the same "characters" all the way through the series.

 It does follow the same characters for the whole series.  

[C-Man 26991]

2 minutes ago, PRONG HORN said:

 It does follow the same characters for the whole series.  

It's been awhile since I saw it but I thought it kind of changed who it was following through the series as it went through.

[PRONG HORN 3108]

1 minute ago, C-Man said:

It's been awhile since I saw it but I thought it kind of changed who it was following through the series as it went through.

 

It follows guys in the First Marine Division.  The guy who won the Medal of Honor on Guadalcanal was on Iwo when he died because he transfered to the 5th Marines.  

 

Quote

The series is a companion piece to the 2001 miniseries Band of Brothers and focuses on the United States Marine Corps's actions in the Pacific Theater of Operations within the wider Pacific War. Whereas Band of Brothers followed the men of Easy Company of the 506th Parachute Infantry Regiment through the European Theater, The Pacific centers on the experiences of three Marines (Robert Leckie, Eugene Sledge, and John Basilone) who were in different regiments (1st, 5th, and 7th, respectively) of the 1st Marine Division.

 

[Trey3216 15325]

On 11/13/2020 at 11:01 AM, BearSchlong said:

When wars shifted from real estate/territory held to attrition/kill ratios. . .Robert McNamara et al. Fascinating stuff.  Halberstam's The Best and the Brightest was a good read.

Hits close to home - my family has zero history of diabeetus. Then in his 60s my dad got it, inexplicably.  A long-time member of his 5:30 am Whataburger breakfast club is a VA doctor and he was SHOCKED to find out dad had never applied for VA benefits, nor ANY KIND of veteran's status, not even an ID card - even though he served a tour with the Americal Division ~ Chu Lai ~ 1968-69 as E5.  Dad was of the belief that benefits were for vets that needed them and didn't have alternate means/resources.  Literally got his discharge papers and had zero involvement with the VA/Army from 1969-2010.

VA doc says that 100% the diabetes was a result of Agent Orange.  Full benefits/100% disabled vet status.  Says this happened to thousands, decades after they were in-country.

In 2020 the idea of defoliating an entire country seems preposterous.

 

Pretty much exactly what happened with my dad.  

[TwiceHorn 31184]

17 hours ago, C-Man said:

It's been awhile since I saw it but I thought it kind of changed who it was following through the series as it went through.

It does rotate around a bit among the characters.  But those are the three main ones.

[MagicSoccerSpray 1725]

21 hours ago, Hate said:

The Pacific was outstanding on its own. Nothing will ever compare to BoB and that’s ok. I liked the episode on leave in Australia. It gave you a completely different look into what was going on in the lives of the soldiers. I enjoyed the episode where Lueche (sp?) goes to the “mental health island”. All of it was fantastic if you just watch the series and don’t compare it to BoB.

 

Leckie was the worst character imo. Totally whiny college boy, at least Sledge was tolerable.

[PRONG HORN 3108]

11 minutes ago, MagicSoccerSpray said:

 

Leckie was the worst character imo. Totally whiny college boy, at least Sledge was tolerable.

 

He probably had a few things to whine about.  On Guadalcanal they didn't have insect repellent among other things.  It took four months to secure Guadalcanal.   The battle of the Bulge (Bastogne) was about a month long for the 101st. 

Edited November 16, 2020 by PRONG HORN

[Macanudo 12922]

On 11/14/2020 at 6:10 PM, BearSchlong said:

Just bought Buck Compton's autobiography.

I met him at a book signing at Ft. Lewis years ago.  It pissed me off something serious that a couple of days before Stone Cold Steve Austin was on post and the line at the PX almost wrapped around the building but Buck had a very, very, very small crowd for his book tour.  

On the plus side, he was able to talk to 10-12 of us who were there on a personal level and tell some great stories.  I did finally muster up the courage to ask of the scene where Dick Winters tells him, after seeing Buck win at cards, "Never take anything from these men".  

Buck said that Dick did tell him that, it stuck with him and after that he tried his best to make sure his guys were always the best supplied in the company.  He didn't come right out and say it but he definitely let it be known that he was a big proponent of "appropriating" rations and ammo for his soldiers.  

For those that dont know...  Buck was the lead prosecutor in the Sirhan Sirhan case.  Sirhan shot RFK in 1968.  

Buck had a very interesting life.

 

[jimmyjazz 45512]

I think The Pacific falls mighty short of Band of Brothers, and it has nothing to do with which came first.  The BoB storyline was just far more compelling.  The characters were better developed and they weren't one-dimensional.  I can watch BoB front to back multiple times per year.  The Pacific?  I'll drag through it every few years just to convince myself I didn't miss something.

[TwiceHorn 31184]

1 hour ago, MagicSoccerSpray said:

 

Leckie was the worst character imo. Totally whiny college boy, at least Sledge was tolerable.

Well, except Leckie never attended college, and Sledge had only done a year at a juco military academy.  Sledge wound up with a PhD.  Leckie never received a degree, which is kind of interesting because he spent his life as a journalist and writer.  But that's the way it was back then.

[MagicSoccerSpray 1725]

4 hours ago, PRONG HORN said:

 

He probably had a few things to whine about.  On Guadalcanal they didn't have insect repellent among other things.  It took four months to secure Guadalcanal.   The battle of the Bulge (Bastogne) was about a month long for the 101st. 

 

I know, I watched the show and have read plenty about Guadalcanal. The way he was written in the show came off poorly imo, though I'll assume he was not that way in rl.

 

3 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well, except Leckie never attended college, and Sledge had only done a year at a juco military academy.  Sledge wound up with a PhD.  Leckie never received a degree, which is kind of interesting because he spent his life as a journalist and writer.  But that's the way it was back then.

 

College or not, his character was the least compelling and interesting to me compared to Sledge or Basilone. Maybe it was James Badge Dale as I wasn't a big fan in Rubicon either.

Edited November 16, 2020 by MagicSoccerSpray

[Biff Tannen 45477]

On 11/14/2020 at 6:10 PM, BearSchlong said:

Just bought Buck Compton's autobiography.

I read Don Malarkey's and David Kenyon Webster's.  Very different accounts of somewhat similar experiences.  I recommend Malarkey's.

[BearSchlong 8076]

As I recall Webster's was published posthumously, after he was lost at sea on a shark fishing trip.

I really loved how Ambrose emphasized Webster's sense of honor at being someone of privilege willing to die for his country.

When his mom commented that she hoped he would make it home safe and sound, he chastised her for being selfish, why should a different American mother suffer grief and not her.

[Trey3216 15325]

42 minutes ago, BearSchlong said:

As I recall Webster's was published posthumously, after he was lost at sea on a shark fishing trip.

I really loved how Ambrose emphasized Webster's sense of honor at being someone of privilege willing to die for his country.

When his mom commented that she hoped he would make it home safe and sound, he chastised her for being selfish, why should a different American mother suffer grief and not her.

Damn 

[AUS-97HORN 11654]

History Channel did the entire series today.   caught the last few episodes.

 

its been only 19 years since the series was released..... yet as I watched the final episode and they showed the interviews with the actual members of Easy, as I was watching I got virtually  slapped in the face...  because we've lost them all.  ALL of them.   There are 2 veterans who served some time in Easy left, but none of the characters portrayed in the series are still around. 

 

more than likely in the next 20 years, the last WW2 veteran will pass away.  thats a gut punch feeling for a guy in his mid 40s whose entire life has had WW2 veterans either in his life or around. 

time is a cruel mistress. 

 

[Homercles 10205]

Few odds and ends:

1) I watch the series every year leading up to Christmas, and if I can’t catch the whole series I will at least watch Bastogne to see Sink read General Taylor’s ‘what’s so merry about this’ letter to the troops.  
 

2) When I was younger I often skipped the Currahee episode as it was ‘boring’ yet now at 40, I cherish it as a way to see how those men were forged.  Schwimmer did an outstanding job as Sobel.  Always wondered what those guys were thinking watching him on screen jog about in his USAAF bomber jacket yelling hi ho silver.  
 

3) Winters apparently hated the scene in his leave in Paris...saying something like his actor ‘looked like a faggot’.  I actually tend to agree as the flashbacks made sense but the awkward smiles at the French boy seemed out of place.  In the book it notes how he did ride the train to the end of the line and had to walk back for his big night in Paris.  Also always cringe at Fallons presence feeling forced when he resupplies E...oh well.  
 

4) I can’t remember what trooper said this but he succinctly notes ‘it wasn’t like Korea or Vietnam, we was attacked’ which certainly underpins the difference in morale towards a clear objective as noted above.  
 

5) If you haven’t read how Dale Dye contributed to the series or Private Ryan, you need to watch the Ron Livingston video diaries on YouTube.  Their chemistry really comes across on scene due to their 10 rotten days in the field playing soldiers.  
 

Few quotes that always give me shivers:

”What are we gonna hit those things with, Lip?” -start of armored assault outside Foy

“They got ole Guarnere this time” -Bill losing a leg from artillery in the woods

”Lieutenant!” -Bull shouting at the officer with his binoculars out during market garden  just before he gets shot 

“Well you are officers, you’re grown ups you oughta know” -doc roe at welsh after they can’t recall how much morphine moose had after getting shot by his own sentry

 

Could go on...sorry for the novel, will always have time to talk about this story/book/show

Edited December 25, 2020 by Homercles

[Wade 463]

On 11/15/2020 at 8:24 PM, TwiceHorn said:

Well, except Leckie never attended college, and Sledge had only done a year at a juco military academy.  Sledge wound up with a PhD.  Leckie never received a degree, which is kind of interesting because he spent his life as a journalist and writer.  But that's the way it was back then.

It wasn't the character, it was the actor.  He's just a smarmy unlikeable guy, imo

[Carl Spackler 3461]

BoB was definitely better than The Pacific, IMO, but that doesn't mean The Pacific wasn't great.  It was.  

[Parliament 14112]

"We're paratroopers. We're supposed to be surrounded."

That whole scene, with the men solemnly walking in the cold, into a city on fire, is the best of the series. Even Jimmy Fallon can't ruin it.

[Macanudo 12922]

12 hours ago, AUS-97HORN said:

History Channel did the entire series today.   caught the last few episodes.

 

its been only 19 years since the series was released..... yet as I watched the final episode and they showed the interviews with the actual members of Easy, as I was watching I got virtually  slapped in the face...  because we've lost them all.  ALL of them.   There are 2 veterans who served some time in Easy left, but none of the characters portrayed in the series are still around. 

 

more than likely in the next 20 years, the last WW2 veteran will pass away.  thats a gut punch feeling for a guy in his mid 40s whose entire life has had WW2 veterans either in his life or around. 

time is a cruel mistress. 

 

20 years.   More than likely closer to 10.  An 18 year old private in 1945 is 93 now.  

Edited December 25, 2020 by Macanudo

[DougO 5239]

3 hours ago, Parliament said:

"We're paratroopers. We're supposed to be surrounded."

That whole scene, with the men solemnly walking in the cold, into a city on fire, is the best of the series. Even Jimmy Fallon can't ruin it.
 

That, and his role in Almost Famous are really his only reasons to exist in any audio/visual format.

[AUS-97HORN 11654]

1 hour ago, Macanudo said:

20 years.   More than likely closer to 10.  An 18 year old private in 1945 is 93 now.  

I hope its closer to 20 years.  hurts to think about a world without WW2 vets.

17 year olds were legally allowed to serve.  and there are a shitload of examples of 16 year olds who lied and enlisted. Last US WW1 vet lived to 110.   Last Brit vet lived to 113.

[The Ace of Aces 5106]

Since moving to Pennsylvania however many years ago, we started a tradition on Christmas Day if we are in town we drove over to Winters’ farm (15 or so miles away) and say a little prayer of thanks for the soldiers. This morning, with the snow falling, thousands of miles from family, was no exception and felt more real than ever. 

[RPM 26185]

3 hours ago, Macanudo said:

20 years.   More than likely closer to 10.  An 18 year old private in 1945 is 93 now.  

And smoked 2 packs of Lucky's a day for 60+ years.

[DougO 5239]

7 hours ago, RPM said:

And smoked 2 packs of Lucky's a day for 60+ years.

And caught covid and kicked its ass and is fine.

[Mileslong 4710]

That’s awesome, but you probably shouldn’t fly that on your garage.

Username doesn’t check out

[Biff Tannen 45477]

On 12/24/2020 at 11:33 PM, Homercles said:

Winters apparently hated the scene in his leave in Paris...saying something like his actor ‘looked like a faggot’.

[Balcones 430]

On 12/25/2020 at 1:12 PM, The Ace of Aces said:

Since moving to Pennsylvania however many years ago, we started a tradition on Christmas Day if we are in town we drove over to Winters’ farm (15 or so miles away) and say a little prayer of thanks for the soldiers. This morning, with the snow falling, thousands of miles from family, was no exception and felt more real than ever. 

God bless you

[Homercles 10205]

On 12/26/2020 at 4:48 PM, Biff Tannen said:

Cant remember where I read that, maybe Biggest Brother...but pretty sure that’s the term he used there when he’s smiling at the boy.  Winters never liked that part of it. 

[Wade 463]

1 hour ago, Homercles said:

Cant remember where I read that, maybe Biggest Brother...but pretty sure that’s the term he used there when he’s smiling at the boy.  Winters never liked that part of it. 

Just watched that episode today.  Seen that scene a few times before and I never drew any sexual connotations from it.  They even flashback to the young German he shot as he's looking at the boy, it's obvious he reminded him of that shooting.

[Wade 463]

On 12/24/2020 at 8:16 PM, AUS-97HORN said:

its been only 19 years since the series was released..... yet as I watched the final episode and they showed the interviews with the actual members of Easy, as I was watching I got virtually  slapped in the face...  because we've lost them all.  ALL of them.   There are 2 veterans who served some time in Easy left, but none of the characters portrayed in the series are still around. 

more than likely in the next 20 years, the last WW2 veteran will pass away.  thats a gut punch feeling for a guy in his mid 40s whose entire life has had WW2 veterans either in his life or around. 

time is a cruel mistress. 

 

My dad was in WWII, he died fairly young in 1989, before getting to enjoy retirement.  I never thought much about it as I was growing up, but as I see these interviews with men from various war documentaries, and they talk about their comrades. I realized that the relationship my dad had with his squadron mates was at a different level from any friendships he developed after, even though they only spent a few months together and later a few days a year at a pilot reunion.  There was a level of respect and endearment he had for this group that he didn't have for anyone else.

My dad was as tight with a buck as one can be, grew up poor in Great Depression (our stove for years had a screw hook to hold the oven door closed.)   But when that group was due to stay at our house for a few days because the annual reunion was close by that year, he spent thousands of dollars fixing up the house.  That's the level of respect he had for them.

[HouTex 1847]

My dad was in WWII, he died fairly young in 1989, before getting to enjoy retirement.  I never thought much about it as I was growing up, but as I see these interviews with men from various war documentaries, and they talk about their comrades. I realized that the relationship my dad had with his squadron mates was at a different level from any friendships he developed after, even though they only spent a few months together and later a few days a year at a pilot reunion.  There was a level of respect and endearment he had for this group that he didn't have for anyone else.
My dad was as tight with a buck as one can be, grew up poor in Great Depression (our stove for years had a screw hook to hold the oven door closed.)   But when that group was due to stay at our house for a few days because the annual reunion was close by that year, he spent thousands of dollars fixing up the house.  That's the level of respect he had for them.

God bless your father.

[The Ace of Aces 5106]

Seems appropriate to post - drive today to Arlington to out wreaths on the grandparents and great grandparents graves. The wife’s grandfather was a bigwig general during Korea and her great grandfather one during the period between WW1 and into WW2. It’s nice having a family pass so we can drive straight in and sit in quiet in one of the most amazing places in America. 

[AUS-97HORN 11654]

History nerd alert.    youtube recommmended this vid to me.

 

The part where hes showing the foxholes and then all you can see is tall straight tree after tree after tree all around you helps really put episodes 5 & 6 into perspective.  Especially the part in episode 5 where the German soldier managed to wander into their lines to take a shit...   everything covered in snow, you cant see more than 15 feet in any direction because the trees block your line of sight, yeah, I can see the lines being totally fluid.