Malik Jefferson

[Zavala 1384]

On 12/23/2018 at 9:53 AM, kevwun said:

I think Connor Williams wins pretty easily.  He was absolutely terrible and may be a bust.  He couldn't block anyone.

How many rookie O linemen are serviceable? I think it takes a while to understand how to play O line in the league. You got 350 lb linemen that can move really quick.

[Gene Parmesan 3992]

5 minutes ago, Zavala said:

How many rookie O linemen are serviceable? I think it takes a while to understand how to play O line in the league. You got 350 lb linemen that can move really quick.

I would think most of the ones that are going to end up being good are serviceable as rookies, and I would go out on the limb and say the ones that are just going to end up being serviceable for their ceiling aren't serviceable as rookies.

[Viper 12011]

38 minutes ago, Tex Pete said:

Wheeler looked pretty good to me last night. 

true, I guess the thought is that Orlando played into his strengths with blitzes and such, along with Georgia not putting him in many tough spots assignment-wise.

[Tex Pete 20136]

1 hour ago, Viper said:

true, I guess the thought is that Orlando played into his strengths with blitzes and such, along with Georgia not putting him in many tough spots assignment-wise.

Wheeler is a much better fit as an SEC LB than a Big 12 LB, but he contributed a lot over the course of his career.

[kingkoopa6 8305]

6 hours ago, Tex Pete said:

Wheeler looked pretty good to me last night. 

 

5 hours ago, Viper said:

true, I guess the thought is that Orlando played into his strengths with blitzes and such, along with Georgia not putting him in many tough spots assignment-wise.

 

4 hours ago, Tex Pete said:

Wheeler is a much better fit as an SEC LB than a Big 12 LB, but he contributed a lot over the course of his career.

[thepop 4409]

Geez imagine seeing Wheeler running straight towards you.

[Horn80 6074]

10 minutes ago, kingkoopa6 said:

 

 

Fromm gonna need PTSD therapy from this game.

Edited January 2, 2019 by Horn80

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

7 hours ago, Gene Parmesan said:

I would think most of the ones that are going to end up being good are serviceable as rookies, and I would go out on the limb and say the ones that are just going to end up being serviceable for their ceiling aren't serviceable as rookies.

Connor is serviceable. He needs to get stronger, especially playing inside, but he’s definitely serviceable. First year in a new position at the highest level of football. I’ll give him more than one year before I make any judgment. He was also starting when Paul Alexander was the oline coach. The line as a whole has looked a lot better since columbo stepped in. You don’t have to look any further than Byron Jones to say that the right position coach can make or break a players career in that first contract. 

[Machinator 32097]

 

[Neonmoon 38127]

Did he have turf toe his entire career?

[Gene Parmesan 3992]

Turf toe didn't cause him to drop from 1st round to 3rd that's for sure.

[Eskimohorn 5610]

Malik’s turf toe prevented him from taking on blockers

[DreadHead 110]

16 hours ago, Machinator said:

 

Anyone know what he may have paid out of pocket for that coverage? I wonder if schools ever pay the premium to cover athletes in this situation?

[South Austin 52037]

Charles Omenihu is Exhibit A for why Malik should have stayed at Texas for his senior year.

[Zavala 1384]

17 hours ago, Machinator said:

 

Quote

Jefferson went through pre-game warmups at the Texas Bowl and tried to play. 

[Machinator 32097]

2 minutes ago, Zavala said:

Some fans have questioned the sincerity of his efforts, but on the surface of it, that's exactly what happened.

[Zavala 1384]

1 minute ago, Machinator said:

Some fans have questioned the sincerity of his efforts, but on the surface of it, that's exactly what happened.

So he's kinda been scheming and planning this scam out for a while. Nice.

[realgreggym 832]

1 hour ago, DreadHead said:

Anyone know what he may have paid out of pocket for that coverage? I wonder if schools ever pay the premium to cover athletes in this situation?

Unless things have changed, the premiums are the responsibility of the family and not the .school.c

[TwiceHorn 31184]

I would think that a school paying on such a policy would be an illegal benefit just like a gold Trans Am.

[Gene Parmesan 3992]

I wonder how the policy reads?  If the injury has to be the sole cause for the drop, it seems like only Jaylon Smith like situations would get a payout, and how do they establish a baseline for a guy like Malik who wasn't a sure fire first rounder if healthy kind of player?

[someguy 1472]

1 hour ago, DreadHead said:

Anyone know what he may have paid out of pocket for that coverage? I wonder if schools ever pay the premium to cover athletes in this situation?

Per NCAA regulations, schools can pay for loss of value insurance out of the Student Assistance Fund.  I have no idea if Texas did this for Jefferson, or if he secured the insurance on his own.

How can coverage be paid for?

Subject to conference policies and procedures, schools may permit student-athletes to use the NCAA Student Assistance Fund to purchase either PTD or LoV policies.  Student-athletes may also take out loans against their future earnings to pay these premiums.  Please note, premiums paid using Student Assistance funds may be considered a taxable benefit to student-athletes and may affect their eligibility for financial aid.

http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/insurance/loss-value-faqs

Division I Student Assistance Fund

A combination of the Student-Athlete Opportunity and Special Assistance Funds. The purpose is to assist student-athletes with special financial needs. Most of this money is used for educational purposes, with some also going for needs such as clothing.

http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/finances/student-athlete-benefits

[C-Man 26992]

Quote

A linebacker who once played for the Texas Longhorns is suing two insurers for their refusal to pay off a “loss of value” policy.

Malik Jefferson recently filed a suit in the US District Court in Austin, naming Novae Corporate Underwriting Limited and Neon Underwriting Limited as the defendants, American-Statesman reported. He claimed that he paid the two London-based companies all the required premiums. According to the complaint, the two insurers had agreed to insure Jefferson for a loss of value up to $1.5 million and a maximum amount of $2.25 million in the event he was injured during the 2017 season at the University of Texas.

Jefferson sustained a turf toe injury in a game against Kansas on November 11, 2017. Team doctors advised him to rest for 4-6 weeks.

Despite his injury, Jefferson participated in pre-game warmups at the Texas Bowl and even tried to play, it is outlined. During UT’s game with Missouri, Jefferson was initially set to play wearing jersey no. 60 in honor of the late Tommy Nobis. However, his injuries benched him once more, and Breckyn Hager wore the jersey as UT won the game.

In the time leading up to the 2018 NFL scouting combine, Jefferson reportedly returned to training, but he only went through certain drills in Indianapolis. His filing also indicated that he did not run the 40-yard dash at Texas’s pro timing day due to “continuing pain of his injury.”

“As a result of his injury, Jefferson was not a first-round selection chosen for the 2018 NFL Draft,” the lawsuit stated. The Cincinnati Bengals selected Jefferson as a third-round pick.

On April 31, 2018, Jefferson filed a loss of value claim to the two insurance companies; he also filed other documentation to support the claim. However, the insurance companies “engaged in considerable delay” and requested redundant performance history and medical records, the lawsuit argued.

It was on October 19, 2018 that Jefferson finally heard back from his insurers. A letter from the companies said his claim was being denied “on the basis that Jefferson’s toe injury was not the sole cause of his declining draft status.”

Jefferson’s request for a formal review of the case was essentially turned down this month, his lawsuit stated. Hence, he is now seeking damages only to the maximum benefit amount of $2.25 million.
 

Not sure how much of this carries over to Brian Davis's story.

https://www.insurancebusinessmag.com/us/news/breaking-news/injured-linebacker-sues-two-british-insurers-for-denying-claim-163502.aspx?utm_source=Pinpointe&utm_medium=20190329&utm_campaign=WIBA-MorningBriefing&utm_content=55D7E01A-A2EE-4DD3-8B33-867AD97B08C1&tu=55D7E01A-A2EE-4DD3-8B33-867AD97B08C1

[victory88 5654]

lmao... turf toe did not prevent Malik from going in the 3rd round.  He needed to get stronger and get off blocks better.  He made a bad decision.  So did Deshon Elliot, so did LJH.  Those guys put 1 season of good film out with glaring weaknesses and assumed they would go early in the draft.  They listened to stupid fucking advice.  Not sure how these policies are written but I would imagine he would need to prove that he would have been taken in the first round if it wasn't for turf toe?  Where is he on the Bengals depth chart?  I don't remember hearing/reading about him whatsoever last season.  Guys that are 1st round talents get taken regardless of a turf toe injury.  If Dexter Lawrence, Ed Oliver, Josh Allen, Nick Bosa, Devin White etc had turf toe... none would make it to the 2nd round let alone the 3rd.

Edited March 29, 2019 by victory88

[texifornia 56434]

3 minutes ago, victory88 said:

lmao... turf toe did not prevent Malik from going in the 3rd round.  He needed to get stronger and get off blocks better.  He made a bad decision.  So did Deshon Elliot, so did LJH.  Those guys put 1 season of good film out with glaring weaknesses and assumed they would go early in the draft.  They listened to stupid fucking advice.  Not sure how these policies are written but I would imagine he would need to prove that he would have been taken in the first round if it wasn't for turf toe?  Where is he on the Bengals depth chart?  I don't remember hearing/reading about him whatsoever last season.  Guys that are 1st round talents get taken regardless of a turf toe injury.  If Dexter Lawrence, Ed Oliver, Josh Allen, Nick Bosa, Devin White etc had turf toe... none would make it to the 2nd round let alone the 3rd.

He had another injury that knocked him out for the season pretty early, so that was a problem.

[MirrOlure 14607]

Well, all I can say is, (a) he bought and paid for an insurance policy, (b) he had an actual injury, and (c) he was drafted in the 3rd round.  So....what the heck, why not try and make it stick?

But yeah...reality is that choosing to enter the draft a year early is what cost him any shot at the 1st Round.

[gmr548 16463]

I would assume the legal language in the contract is iron clad in requiring that injury be the sole cause of loss of value. It's obvious it wasn't. This seems like a huge waste of time/ money on his part.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

[Lerka Lerka 1084]

Iron clad? Do you even lawyer, bro?

Insurance Company:  We received your claim Mr. Jefferson.  We think it is total bullshit and you probably do as well.  However, we'd be willing to settle for X amount if you sign this release and settlement agreement.

Malik: Where do I sign? Profit.

[TwiceHorn 31184]

To an extent, publicity related to this may actually cause people to enter the draft earlier.  An insurance policy like this is one of the things considered when an athlete sticks around an extra year.

If it becomes known that claims are difficult, then that's out the window and more leave.  However, I'm not sure how common these policies actually are.

[Gene Parmesan 3992]

Seems like for such a policy to actually work they would need to establish a agreed injury free draft value, otherwise how do you distinguish between him sucking or an injury causing the slip?  Malik was never going to be a first rounder without a huge step forward from sophomore to junior.  That didn't happen and he was injured.

[C-Man 26992]

2 hours ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Seems like for such a policy to actually work they would need to establish a agreed injury free draft value, otherwise how do you distinguish between him sucking or an injury causing the slip?  Malik was never going to be a first rounder without a huge step forward from sophomore to junior.  That didn't happen and he was injured.

I've never seen one of these policies before but I don't see how they can be written on any basis other than if an injury is serious enough to be career-ending or keep you from being drafted at all.

[Pig Bellmont 8679]

2 hours ago, Lerka Lerka said:

Iron clad? Do you even lawyer, bro?

Insurance Company:  We received your claim Mr. Jefferson.  We think it is total bullshit and you probably do as well.  However, we'd be willing to settle for X amount if you sign this release and settlement agreement.

Malik: Where do I sign? Profit.

No insurance company operates this way

[Nope 3111]

15 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

No insurance company operates this way

Look up nuisance settlements (and yes, I work in the industry)

[TwiceHorn 31184]

2 minutes ago, Nope said:

Look up nuisance settlements (and yes, I work in the industry)

Well an indemnity insurance policy, with cost-of-defense, as well as damage coverage is more likely to work that way than a discrete event policy like Malik's.  His is more like health insurance:  it's covered or it isn't and it behooves the insurer to stick to its guns and the insured to stick to his or hers.

[Nope 3111]

3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well an indemnity insurance policy, with cost-of-defense, as well as damage coverage is more likely to work that way than a discrete event policy like Malik's.  His is more like health insurance:  it's covered or it isn't and it behooves the insurer to stick to its guns and the insured to stick to his or hers.

Gotcha. I was more responding to his broad “no insurance company” statement, but I’m less familiar with this highly specialized type of policy.

[TwiceHorn 31184]

1 minute ago, Nope said:

Gotcha. I was more responding to his broad “no insurance company” statement, but I’m less familiar with this highly specialized type of policy.

It's certainly not out of the realm of possibility that it settles, but if the insurer is interested in this type of business, it behooves them to establish some claims precedent.  Moreso than your average indemnity insurer.  I don't think it will settle as a matter of routine course the way a lot of claims disputes do.

[Pig Bellmont 8679]

11 minutes ago, Nope said:

Look up nuisance settlements (and yes, I work in the industry)

I mean not to get into a dick measuring contest but I too have industry experience. Just bucking the idea that companies routinely give money away when liability analysis = 0. Yes, you are more accurate than my blanket statement in bringing up nuisance payments. More often I find insurance companies to be quite aggressive. 

[Cairn Horn88 8148]

I think this is just a "use it or lose it" policy.  Malik paid for this....and he's determined to use it....what does he have to lose?

[Foosters 17691]

4 hours ago, victory88 said:

lmao... turf toe did not prevent Malik from going in the 3rd round.  He needed to get stronger and get off blocks better.  He made a bad decision.  So did Deshon Elliot, so did LJH.  Those guys put 1 season of good film out with glaring weaknesses and assumed they would go early in the draft.  They listened to stupid fucking advice.  Not sure how these policies are written but I would imagine he would need to prove that he would have been taken in the first round if it wasn't for turf toe?  Where is he on the Bengals depth chart?  I don't remember hearing/reading about him whatsoever last season.  Guys that are 1st round talents get taken regardless of a turf toe injury.  If Dexter Lawrence, Ed Oliver, Josh Allen, Nick Bosa, Devin White etc had turf toe... none would make it to the 2nd round let alone the 3rd.

Yeah, that senior season would've really helped LJH bring down that 4.8 40

[someguy 1472]

2 hours ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Seems like for such a policy to actually work they would need to establish a agreed injury free draft value, otherwise how do you distinguish between him sucking or an injury causing the slip?  Malik was never going to be a first rounder without a huge step forward from sophomore to junior.  That didn't happen and he was injured.

Not to keep going to the same well, but that NCAA FAQ link I posted upthread sheds a little bit of light on the question.

How does loss-of-value coverage work?

Insurance underwriters will first determine an athlete’s eligibility based on their draft position. If they are projected to be selected early in the draft, underwriters could offer coverage limit that typically falls between $1 million and $10 million, based on the projected draft position. The underwriters will then set a loss-of-value threshold that is typically 50 to 60 percent of the athlete’s projected rookie contract. If the contract an athlete signs falls below that threshold as a direct result of an injury or illness suffered during the coverage period, the insurance would pay them the difference between the actual contract’s value and the policy’s predetermined value.

It also recommends that only athletes projected to go in the top 10 of the draft get loss of value insurance.

Who should purchase loss-of-value coverage?

If an athlete chooses to purchase LoV coverage, the NCAA recommends they only do so if they are projected to be selected among the top 10 picks in their respective draft. Athletes projected to be selected outside of that range may have challenges proving their projected value when they file a claim.

What factors can affect a payout?

It’s important to understand that simply suffering an injury or illness and then being selected with a later draft pick than anticipated does not guarantee a claim will be paid. Proving an injury or illness was the sole and direct reason for the decrease in value can be difficult, and many factors can be used to void a claim. In fact, policies include standard exclusions for pre-existing injuries or illnesses, osteoarthritis or degenerative conditions, drug and alcohol use, criminal acts and mental, nervous or psychological disorders. But other factors that can adversely affect a claim include: off-field issues; poor performance during the season; poor performance at pre-draft events; a rise in the draft value of other athletes due to superior performances; changes in professional teams’ needs. 

http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/insurance/loss-value-faqs

[Gene Parmesan 3992]

Doesn't appear like he has much of a chance provided the info above. 

[Sock Drawer 214]

2 hours ago, Pig Bellmont said:

I mean not to get into a dick measuring contest but I too have industry experience. Just bucking the idea that companies routinely give money away when liability analysis = 0. Yes, you are more accurate than my blanket statement in bringing up nuisance payments. More often I find insurance companies to be quite aggressive. 

Those big-ass 'Vegas casinos didn't get built by letting suckers win. Those big-ass insurance companies didn't get to be big-ass insurance companies by paying claims they didn't absolutely have to pay.

[ImissWallyPryor 9045]

3 hours ago, Nope said:

Look up nuisance settlements (and yes, I work in the industry)

Malik isn't going to jump at $1,000 or $10,000, and $500,000 isn't nuisance money.  Any yes, I worked in the industry, (including doing business with Lloyd's of London...I've got a story or three, but that's for another day).

[Nope 3111]

5 minutes ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

Malik isn't going to jump at $1,000 or $10,000, and $500,000 isn't nuisance money.  Any yes, I worked in the industry, (including doing business with Lloyd's of London...I've got a story or three, but that's for another day).

Yeah, I clarified more of what I was getting at in the next post

[Bevo 13493]

48 minutes ago, Sock Drawer said:

Those big-ass 'Vegas casinos didn't get built by letting suckers win. Those big-ass insurance companies didn't get to be big-ass insurance companies by paying claims they didn't absolutely have to pay.

Wrong. Consider medical malpractice. It will cost upwards of $50,000 to prove a case in court when representing a doctor. And rulings are based more on the likeability of the physician and the disfigurement of the patient than guilt or innocence of the physician. So most of the time the insurance company will settle for some amount less than $50,000 unless it chooses to pursue a case to make a point to ambulance chasers.

[texifornia 56434]

With OU commit Seth McGowan, who goes to Poteet

 

[Machinator 32097]

 

[Bruh Man 3160]

 

[Native Horn 3484]

Whoa!  Surely he will get picked up.  

[Stampeder 92]

7 minutes ago, Bruh Man said:

 

He really should've come back for his senior season to refine his game.  Pretty clear at this point the coaching his first two years under the Strong regime was subpar.  Another year under TO might've helped him go higher in the draft and stick longer in the league.  Pulling for him to get picked up elsewhere.

[Texas007 195]

Wow!

https://www.cincyjungle.com/2018/7/12/17560426/malik-jefferson-contract-breakdown-bengals

This article from July highlighted how his contract would hit the cap and explained why he wouldn't be cut....guess they were wrong.

NOTE: not as big a cap issue but still suprising

Edited August 31, 2019 by Texas007
woops, article is from 2018