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Formula One 2020

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Francisco 2.0

Francisco 2.0 32290

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This is incredible.

https://jalopnik.com/what-it-takes-to-build-a-tyrrell-p34-from-scratch-1844809516

 

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What happens to old race cars after their on-track tenure is up? If you think they all end up in museums or the hands of collectors, you wouldn’t technically be wrong, but you’d be making the same mistake Jonathan Holtzman made when he went out looking to get his hands on a Tyrrell Project 34—better known as the unique six-wheeled Formula One car. Most of those P34s have gone to museums or former drivers, but two were also destroyed after their successful season. And if you’ve got some money and really want to drive one, why not initiate the process to get some new ones built?

 

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“[This project] is cool on so many levels,” Holtzman said in a recent interview with Jalopnik. “The idea that somebody would put four wheels on the front of the car, then have it be incredibly successful... it’s innovation.”

Formula One regulations in the mid-1970s dictated that the front wing could only be 1.5 meters, or about 4.9 feet. While it sounds like a lot, it meant that the tires would stick out from above and beside the wing—not ideal for aerodynamics. Keeping the wheel tucked behind the wing raised its own problems: those wheels would have to be tiny.

 

Spoiler

So, Tyrrell’s longtime chief designer Derek Gardner asked what would happen if, instead of just two small wheels up front, they added an extra set for increased contact and more total brake area? In September 1975, the Project 34 was revealed.

The P34 was only used for two seasons in 1976 and 1977, during which time it entered 30 races, won once at the Swedish Grand Prix, secured 14 podiums, and also had its fair share of retirements. Its innovative design was eventually regulated out of the rule books, leaving Tyrrell with a more conventional car going forward. After the 1977 season was over, two P34s were destroyed. The rest ended up in museums and private collections, tucked away from any interested eyes.

Holtzman, a former racer who left the sport to take up the mantle of the family business and now races in the FIA Masters Historic series in his free time, desperately wanted a P34 to add to his collection. When he couldn’t buy one outright, he started looking for other options. 

“There are 75 million baby boomers in American,” Holtzman said, identifying himself with the group. “These people aren’t retiring to old folks homes. They’re doing things, whether they’re charitable, or second careers, or education. They’re doing things they couldn’t do when they were younger because they either didn’t have the money or didn’t have the time.

“Who would buy a historic racing car? The baby boomers. I wanted to be a professional race car driver. I started reading about this historic racing, and it was amazing. All these famous drivers that you grew up with—you can buy the car they won races with and race that car on historic tracks they raced on.”

Holtzman is clear couldn’t have done it by himself. He likens himself to the “ideas man,” the one who planted the thought into the heads of others more qualified to start making connections and sourcing parts. He commissioned a British company called CGA Engineering to license the designs from the Tyrrell family, who agreed to allow the group to create two “continuations.” Continuations are notrestorations but are instead entirely new machines built using original designs. This isn’t the P34 that raced in Anderstorp, but CGA Engineering has made damn sure the it would be indistinguishable from the real one.

It takes a lot more than just a look over the designs. CGA sourced old magazine articles and photographs to compare the designs to in order to ensure nothing major had changed during the fabrication process. It also gained permission to take apart a P34 in a private collection in order to yet again check that all parts matched the designs. 

Then, in order to take advantage of modern machining, hundreds of the original hand-drawn designs had to be digitally converted. The team went out and bought every possible part it could need and even had to source a massive sheet of aluminum from Boeing because it was the only company that created sheets big enough to create the monocoque chassis. Add in some consultation with the car’s original designers, and you have a recipe for what is almost a perfect recreation.

“I think everything was a challenge,” Holtzman says about the entire continuation process. But he’s also honest about his role: “I wasn’t the one who asked, ‘can we do this?’ I wanted to buy [a P34]. I wanted to drive one. We tried to buy one for a lot of money, but the owner said no. Alistair [Bennett, director of CGA Engineering] was the one who said that we could make two. Alistair, James, everybody that made the parts—they’re so talented. I didn’t bring that talent. I brought the American ‘we can do this’ attitude.”

James Hanson of Speedmaster, a company that specializes in buying and selling historic cars, was tasked with tracking down the original parts that had been sold around the world. Bits and pieces of old F1 cars are often sold as novelty items (who wouldn’t want to own a piece of a P34?). While those original pieces weren’t used on the continuations, it was crucial to have a reference point when designing the new parts.

There was only a single change in the continuation process, one thing that makes these two newly built cars differ from their older siblings: the roll hoop, once made out of titanium, is now made out of steel.

The chassis alone took over 800 hours to build, with the full project coming in at around 7,000 hours of work. To put that into perspective, that’s almost 292 24-hour shifts, or 875 days of traditional nine-to-five work. The project took around two years to complete.

When both Holtzman and Hanson speak about testing the P34 for the first time, a wide smile is audible in their voices. 

A skilled driver and engineer, Hanson was the one who performed the initial two-day test with the recently completed P34. When asked about getting behind the wheel, he seemed at a loss for words for a moment. 

“It was very cool.” he said. “I’ve driven a few different cars, but it was a surprising sensation. You don’t really notice the six wheels until the car is at quite a slow speed. The amazing thing was how well the car had been built. From the moment it rolled out of the pits, the car just worked. Everything worked. I have to say, this was pretty much perfect.”

“It was remarkable,” Holtzman said about having gotten behind the wheel for the first time earlier this week. He’s equally enthusiastic about competing in the FIA Masters Historic series generally, which is completely understandable. Having the opportunity to compete against legendary equipment in a car you’ve spent years building has to be one hell of a satisfying feeling.

“You could close your eyes and open them again and wonder, what year is this?”

One of the two cars built will be Holtzman’s own to race in the FIA Masters Historic F1 series for the next few years. The other will be put up for sale—with a catch. Whoever buys that P34 will be contracted to race it for three year, after which point the owner can do whatever they choose. The whole purpose of building these cars, Holtzman maintains, 

Holtzman’s first race of the 2020 season is taking place this weekend, August 22-23, at Brands Hatch. It will be the first time in decades that the P34 will actually hit the track with the intent to compete.

 

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52-80
52-80

It's already happened multiple times in the season when either of the Mercs has some sort of issue, ends up at the back, and bulldogs its way all the way to the front.  Same for the FauxMerx of Perez.

texas08
texas08

ToroRosso...now AlphaTauri. DROOL.

wood
wood

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52-80

52-80 19066

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On 8/23/2020 at 4:16 AM, Francisco 2.0 said:
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So, Tyrrell’s longtime chief designer Derek Gardner asked what would happen if, instead of just two small wheels up front, they added an extra set for increased contact and more total brake area? In September 1975, the Project 34 was revealed.

The P34 was only used for two seasons in 1976 and 1977, during which time it entered 30 races, won once at the Swedish Grand Prix, secured 14 podiums, and also had its fair share of retirements. Its innovative design was eventually regulated out of the rule books, leaving Tyrrell with a more conventional car going forward. After the 1977 season was over, two P34s were destroyed. The rest ended up in museums and private collections, tucked away from any interested eyes.

Holtzman, a former racer who left the sport to take up the mantle of the family business and now races in the FIA Masters Historic series in his free time, desperately wanted a P34 to add to his collection. When he couldn’t buy one outright, he started looking for other options. 

“There are 75 million baby boomers in American,” Holtzman said, identifying himself with the group. “These people aren’t retiring to old folks homes. They’re doing things, whether they’re charitable, or second careers, or education. They’re doing things they couldn’t do when they were younger because they either didn’t have the money or didn’t have the time.

“Who would buy a historic racing car? The baby boomers. I wanted to be a professional race car driver. I started reading about this historic racing, and it was amazing. All these famous drivers that you grew up with—you can buy the car they won races with and race that car on historic tracks they raced on.”

Holtzman is clear couldn’t have done it by himself. He likens himself to the “ideas man,” the one who planted the thought into the heads of others more qualified to start making connections and sourcing parts. He commissioned a British company called CGA Engineering to license the designs from the Tyrrell family, who agreed to allow the group to create two “continuations.” Continuations are notrestorations but are instead entirely new machines built using original designs. This isn’t the P34 that raced in Anderstorp, but CGA Engineering has made damn sure the it would be indistinguishable from the real one.

It takes a lot more than just a look over the designs. CGA sourced old magazine articles and photographs to compare the designs to in order to ensure nothing major had changed during the fabrication process. It also gained permission to take apart a P34 in a private collection in order to yet again check that all parts matched the designs. 

Then, in order to take advantage of modern machining, hundreds of the original hand-drawn designs had to be digitally converted. The team went out and bought every possible part it could need and even had to source a massive sheet of aluminum from Boeing because it was the only company that created sheets big enough to create the monocoque chassis. Add in some consultation with the car’s original designers, and you have a recipe for what is almost a perfect recreation.

“I think everything was a challenge,” Holtzman says about the entire continuation process. But he’s also honest about his role: “I wasn’t the one who asked, ‘can we do this?’ I wanted to buy [a P34]. I wanted to drive one. We tried to buy one for a lot of money, but the owner said no. Alistair [Bennett, director of CGA Engineering] was the one who said that we could make two. Alistair, James, everybody that made the parts—they’re so talented. I didn’t bring that talent. I brought the American ‘we can do this’ attitude.”

James Hanson of Speedmaster, a company that specializes in buying and selling historic cars, was tasked with tracking down the original parts that had been sold around the world. Bits and pieces of old F1 cars are often sold as novelty items (who wouldn’t want to own a piece of a P34?). While those original pieces weren’t used on the continuations, it was crucial to have a reference point when designing the new parts.

There was only a single change in the continuation process, one thing that makes these two newly built cars differ from their older siblings: the roll hoop, once made out of titanium, is now made out of steel.

The chassis alone took over 800 hours to build, with the full project coming in at around 7,000 hours of work. To put that into perspective, that’s almost 292 24-hour shifts, or 875 days of traditional nine-to-five work. The project took around two years to complete.

When both Holtzman and Hanson speak about testing the P34 for the first time, a wide smile is audible in their voices. 

A skilled driver and engineer, Hanson was the one who performed the initial two-day test with the recently completed P34. When asked about getting behind the wheel, he seemed at a loss for words for a moment. 

“It was very cool.” he said. “I’ve driven a few different cars, but it was a surprising sensation. You don’t really notice the six wheels until the car is at quite a slow speed. The amazing thing was how well the car had been built. From the moment it rolled out of the pits, the car just worked. Everything worked. I have to say, this was pretty much perfect.”

“It was remarkable,” Holtzman said about having gotten behind the wheel for the first time earlier this week. He’s equally enthusiastic about competing in the FIA Masters Historic series generally, which is completely understandable. Having the opportunity to compete against legendary equipment in a car you’ve spent years building has to be one hell of a satisfying feeling.

“You could close your eyes and open them again and wonder, what year is this?”

One of the two cars built will be Holtzman’s own to race in the FIA Masters Historic F1 series for the next few years. The other will be put up for sale—with a catch. Whoever buys that P34 will be contracted to race it for three year, after which point the owner can do whatever they choose. The whole purpose of building these cars, Holtzman maintains, 

Holtzman’s first race of the 2020 season is taking place this weekend, August 22-23, at Brands Hatch. It will be the first time in decades that the P34 will actually hit the track with the intent to compete.

 

gejn7ex0ykzz55x4zonp.jpg

so whatssss the deal with men named jody, really?

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52-80

52-80 19066

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7 hours ago, PRONG HORN said:

 

 

 

 

 

even if in jest, hes got a really good point.

 

is there anything more frustratng than hearing a driver on the race radio begging for the engineers to remotely unlock more power to the car?  or drivers being instructed to switch to different 'programs', effectively racing their own race

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PittsburghTiger

PittsburghTiger 6136

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https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.formula-1-to-return-to-turkey-istanbul-park-as-four-more-races-added-to-F1-calendar.2cVIVl0QDr4OiZa7rPt7Zg.html?utm_keyword=BreakingNews&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Ogilvy&utm_campaign=20200825_Announcement_F1Calendar&utm_term=20200825_Announcement_F1Calendar

 

 

14 November 13-15 FORMULA 1 DHL TURKISH GRAND PRIX 2020
15 November 27-29 FORMULA 1 GULF AIR BAHRAIN GRAND PRIX 2020
16 December 4-6 FORMULA 1 ROLEX SAKHIR GRAND PRIX 2020 (Bahrain)
17 December 11 - 13 FORMULA 1 ETIHAD AIRWAYS ABU DHABI GRAND PRIX 2020
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wood

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Alonso fielded questions yesterday on Instagram...some interesting answers (translated):

https://www.marca.com/motor/formula1/2020/08/28/5f48abc746163f780d8b45c2.html


"I don't know exactly what I will do in the next few years, or how many I will race in F1 again. At least there will be two and I will still run one, two, three more or leave it after 2022. Then I will think about the next category", He says about a return to the Dakar or the Indy500 in the next few years, something that remains parked, as he confesses in a chat with his fans on Instagram.
...
"In 2021 cars will be an evolution of this year, so what we see every weekend we will see until 2022, unfortunately that is the sport. It is what happened when I left in 2018. But 2021 will be a good preparation for 2022 , that's the idea".
...
"Better than being three years away, I join the team and develop the car for 2022. 2021 will be a year of preparation, there are no goals as such. I am receiving a lot of support, I think people are looking forward to seeing me at Renault. another team might not be so keen. "
...
"It's something that has never happened to me since I was 13 years old, Being able to have six or seven months at home to walk, see a new mountain, go away for the weekend, quite basic things that I have never done. It has helped me to recharge the batteries. After recharging the batteries, I'm ready to go back. "
...
Vettel and his situation at Ferrari. "I am choosing the most difficult questions. It is a difficult situation for him, because this car is difficult. Other years they fought for the World Championship, and with a punctual error they could recover quickly in the following races, but this year they are struggling to enter Q3. They have had opportunities other years to fight for the World Cup, but few, you have to be honest and see the dominance of Mercedes. From my experience, racing for that team is unmatched and for life, regardless of the results, Being a Ferrari Driver is fantastic and Seb will have a positive experience. "

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Paper_jam

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On 8/22/2020 at 9:16 PM, Francisco 2.0 said:

This is incredible.

https://jalopnik.com/what-it-takes-to-build-a-tyrrell-p34-from-scratch-1844809516

It kind of kills me that the current regulations in F1 and Indycar mean we can never see cool, one-off designs like this. Part of me wishes the only design rules were: 1) Car must have at least 3 and no more than 8 wheels, unless car uses some type of levitation technology (which is allowed if you can invent it). 2) Car + driver race weight (at end of race) must be at least 1200 lbs and no more than 5000 lbs. 3) Car must be fully piloted by a human--no "autonomous driving" technology.

Use any fuel you want, any engine displacement or tech you want (gasoline, diesel, electric, turbine, nuclear, rocket boosters), any kind of tires you want, any aero tech you want (active or passive). Take as many or as few pitstops as you want.

I guess the concern is that this approach would kill the series by making the less-well-funded teams noncompetitive (and unwilling to participate). But at least we'd get to see what bleeding edge technology and design could really do. In terms of actual performance (speed) it seems race cars haven't made much progress in 20+ years. 

 

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Prepuce of Doom

Prepuce of Doom 20969

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1 hour ago, Paper_jam said:

It kind of kills me that the current regulations in F1 and Indycar mean we can never see cool, one-off designs like this. Part of me wishes the only design rules were: 1) Car must have at least 3 and no more than 8 wheels, unless car uses some type of levitation technology (which is allowed if you can invent it). 2) Car + driver race weight (at end of race) must be at least 1200 lbs and no more than 5000 lbs. 3) Car must be fully piloted by a human--no "autonomous driving" technology.

Use any fuel you want, any engine displacement or tech you want (gasoline, diesel, electric, turbine, nuclear, rocket boosters), any kind of tires you want, any aero tech you want (active or passive). Take as many or as few pitstops as you want.

I guess the concern is that this approach would kill the series by making the less-well-funded teams noncompetitive (and unwilling to participate). But at least we'd get to see what bleeding edge technology and design could really do. In terms of actual performance (speed) it seems race cars haven't made much progress in 20+ years. 

 

We just need to get Raytheon, Lockheed, etc. involved. 

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wood

wood 11103

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1 hour ago, Paper_jam said:

It kind of kills me that the current regulations in F1 and Indycar mean we can never see cool, one-off designs like this. Part of me wishes the only design rules were: 1) Car must have at least 3 and no more than 8 wheels, unless car uses some type of levitation technology (which is allowed if you can invent it). 2) Car + driver race weight (at end of race) must be at least 1200 lbs and no more than 5000 lbs. 3) Car must be fully piloted by a human--no "autonomous driving" technology.

Use any fuel you want, any engine displacement or tech you want (gasoline, diesel, electric, turbine, nuclear, rocket boosters), any kind of tires you want, any aero tech you want (active or passive). Take as many or as few pitstops as you want.

I guess the concern is that this approach would kill the series by making the less-well-funded teams noncompetitive (and unwilling to participate). But at least we'd get to see what bleeding edge technology and design could really do. In terms of actual performance (speed) it seems race cars haven't made much progress in 20+ years. 

 

Yep. It would be very cool, and too expensive. Re: the speeds, they could already go sooo much faster, but of course for many reasons I'm sure you're well aware of, they can't just keep going faster. So they keep slowing them down with new regs, which they eventually bust through, forcing a new set to be made...

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wood

wood 11103

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8 hours ago, Goofyboy said:


Good. Where did Renault find this speed?

Their car has been shit, but they made a good increase in power in the off-season. They haven't been bad on power tracks, which lends a little hope for the future. Of course Merc still has a power advantage, but I think their car is where a significant portion of their advantage comes from. That thing is just on rails and looks so easy to drive compared to the others. But who really knows ....

And damn, that Ferrari is not only gutless, but handles like complete dogshit as well. 

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It really would be cool if F1 started enforcing the actual track limit. WTF is this shit where they use the outside edge of the curbs as the limit? Masi is a fucking joke so far imho. 

Ant was complaining about it in FP2, so it's not just me/us. He can't understand why the white line is being ignored either. Karun agreed (in probably his most intelligent comments of the weekend, which isn't saying much. Ready for Ted to come back from vacation & reduce Karun's mic time).

Why ignore the line that's there specifically to designate the track limit and then arbitrarily select a different line to enforce as the track limit? It's at least consistent, which is an improvement of sorts, but it's still wrong.

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PittsburghTiger

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2 hours ago, wood said:

It really would be cool if F1 started enforcing the actual track limit. WTF is this shit where they use the outside edge of the curbs as the limit? Masi is a fucking joke so far imho. 

Ant was complaining about it in FP2, so it's not just me/us. He can't understand why the white line is being ignored either. Karun agreed (in probably his most intelligent comments of the weekend, which isn't saying much. Ready for Ted to come back from vacation & reduce Karun's mic time).

Why ignore the line that's there specifically to designate the track limit and then arbitrarily select a different line to enforce as the track limit? It's at least consistent, which is an improvement of sorts, but it's still wrong.

I concur

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