Dallas Cowboys 2020 Offseason Thread -- 25th Anniversary of Mediocrity

[Hiphopopotamos 20889]

10 hours ago, Irish Wrist Watch said:

Just watch. The Jones Boys are going to try and keep Kellen Moore. McCarthy is probably interviewing him right now, tonight. This has all the earmarks of a magnificent clusterfuck courtesy of those tightwad, gun jumping hillbillies.

 

[Fozzz 152]

Why shouldn't they keep Moore given what he accomplished with Dak and the offense this season?

[Vic Mackey 47161]

I'm hearing Matt Rhule is going to take the job with the Panthers. And that Jason Garrett could be next in line for the Giants job. Please make this happen lmao.

[Gene Parmesan 4016]

6 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

I'm hearing Matt Rhule is going to take the job with the Panthers. And that Jason Garrett could be next in line for the Giants job. Please make this happen lmao.

That would be strange unless the Giants just aren't interested in Rhule as much as early reports indicated.  I would say Giants > Panthers , but it is the NFL with a salary cap so there aren't any advantages for a large market team so who knows.  

[Big Frog II 511]

Well get ready for another 25 years of mediocrity.

[Vic Mackey 47161]

11 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

That would be strange unless the Giants just aren't interested in Rhule as much as early reports indicated.  I would say Giants > Panthers , but it is the NFL with a salary cap so there aren't any advantages for a large market team so who knows.  

Panthers did not let Rhule get on the plane to go to NY to even interview with the Giants. They spent time with him in Waco and liked him so much they got the deal done asap. It wasn't that the Giants were not interested. Him and McCarthy were their top targets but Dallas and Carolina never gave them a chance to interview those guys.

And I don't think NY is any better than Carolina. They are 31st in wins over the last 5 years. Only Cleveland is worse. Plus, you don't have to deal with the NY media. Carolina is much more laid back from that perspective.

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

Rhule to the panthers is official. Please Gettleman, hire Jason Garrett. It is a match made in heaven.

Also, I wouldn’t blame Kellen Moore if he wanted to bounce, but I don’t know why anyone would have an issue keeping him or Kitna. He showed a ton of promise as a first year OC and he seems like a smart enough dude to make the necessary adjustments over the offseason.

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

 

it’s happening, boys. Get it done Gettleman.

[utxmike05 1828]

Nsiap




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dr Fear 1268]

That Jason Garrett interview request didn't stay open for long.

['stache 21887]

The Garrett reports were probably just to fuck with Jerry. Why the fuck would anyone hire that ginger clown?

[Dr Fear 1268]

I believe this leaves the Browns as the only open HC left.

['stache 21887]

Just now, Dr Fear said:

I believe this leaves the Browns as the only open HC left.

Ginger may be an upgrade from Kitchens, lol. Maybe all Baker needs is some good old fashioned clapping.

[Gene Parmesan 4016]

I don't think Garrett is a good NFL coach but I do think he's good enough to get another NFL job though.  There aren't enough good HCs to fill up the spots.  That being said I wonder if a lot in the league lost respect with the reports of how he was clinging on the past week when pretty much any other coach with dignity would have just walked away after the first meeting.  

[Vic Mackey 47161]

4 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

I don't think Garrett is a good NFL coach but I do think he's good enough to get another NFL job though.  There aren't enough good HCs to fill up the spots.  That being said I wonder if a lot in the league lost respect with the reports of how he was clinging on the past week when pretty much any other coach with dignity would have just walked away after the first meeting.  

He was a HC for almost 10 years with zero success. Teams would rather go the route of unknown assistants and coordinators than a guy like him. Just as the Giants just did. Or an unproven college coach like the Panthers did.

At least the guy we hired dwarfs Garrett in terms of the resume.

I think Garrett is an upgrade over Kitchens but that is not saying anything at all. At least get a guy who you can have some hope in. Garrett gives no teams any hope.

[Lerka Lerka 1094]

Never even heard of Joe Judge.  Patriots wr's were below average as well this year. Guess some teams just want a branch from the Belichick coaching tree... 

[Gene Parmesan 4016]

Just now, Vic Mackey said:

He was a HC for almost 10 years with zero success. Teams would rather go the route of unknown assistants and coordinators than a guy like him. Just as the Giants just did. Or an unproven college coach like the Panthers did.

At least the guy we hired dwarfs Garrett in terms of the resume.

I think Garrett is an upgrade over Kitchens but that is not saying anything at all. At least get a guy who you can have some hope in. Garrett gives no teams any hope.

I'm not arguing to defend Garrett, but if you define success as Super Bowls, and most fans do then yeah he has zero success just like everyone else who doesn't have a Super Bowl which is the entire league outside of a handful.  There are 32 spots to fill though.

[Dr Fear 1268]

 

['stache 21887]

6 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

I'm not arguing to defend Garrett, but if you define success as Super Bowls, and most fans do then yeah he has zero success just like everyone else who doesn't have a Super Bowl which is the entire league outside of a handful.  There are 32 spots to fill though.

There are a lot of teams for which 8-8 average with a few playoff wins would be an improvement. Also not meant to defend Garrett, but to point out how bad some franchises have it.

[Burt Macklin 19053]

6 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

I'm not arguing to defend Garrett, but if you define success as Super Bowls, and most fans do then yeah he has zero success just like everyone else who doesn't have a Super Bowl which is the entire league outside of a handful.  There are 32 spots to fill though.

How about 2 playoff wins in 10 years? Do you count that as success?

[Huckleberry 33109]

Makes sense that the contact was to gauge Garrett's interest in the OC position. He absolutely does not deserve a HC position right now. Far better to hire a guy who hasn't proven anything than to hire a guy who has proven he can't get it done. I didn't think Garrett was horrible, just average, until this season. The 2019 NFC East was served to Dallas on a platter and he blew it.

[Gene Parmesan 4016]

1 minute ago, Burt Macklin said:

How about 2 playoff wins in 10 years? Do you count that as success?

No.  There are NFL teams that aren't Super Bowl or bust though.

 

[Nicole44 22078]

But according to JJ, Garrett is in “high” demand as a HC. 
I can’t see how he’d work as an OC. He’d have to call plays. 

[Vic Mackey 47161]

16 minutes ago, 'stache said:

There are a lot of teams for which 8-8 average with a few playoff wins would be an improvement. Also not meant to defend Garrett, but to point out how bad some franchises have it.

And those teams are going to be very bad teams with not a great roster. Garrett did that with a pretty damn good roster. If he could only muster that in a pretty decent situation, how do you think he will fare with a far lesser team? Not good. Garrett brings the talent down. He doesn't elevate it.

[Drew 2537]

11 hours ago, Vic Mackey said:

Oh it's going to happen. Kellen and Kitna are still under contract. They aren't going anywhere. I heard today that McCarthy already was a fan of Kellen.

I don't mind Kellen staying. I am more worried about our DC and ST coaches.

Exactly. I'm not sure why anyone would have any problem if McCarthy kept the two guys that had the most impact on Dak's best season to date.  It's defense and ST that will make or break next season.  Not the offense.

Besides, everyone knows the Cowboys bounce back next year no matter who's coaching.  They do this. Great year followed by bad year.  It's their turn again next year. Eagles aren't going to be that much better if at all and the division is still trash otherwise.

32 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

I don't think Garrett is a good NFL coach but I do think he's good enough to get another NFL job though.  There aren't enough good HCs to fill up the spots.  That being said I wonder if a lot in the league lost respect with the reports of how he was clinging on the past week when pretty much any other coach with dignity would have just walked away after the first meeting.  

 

15 minutes ago, 'stache said:

There are a lot of teams for which 8-8 average with a few playoff wins would be an improvement. Also not meant to defend Garrett, but to point out how bad some franchises have it.

All of this.  We're too close to it.  WE all know he sucks on game day and game planning, but he has something that has his players playing for him most of the time.  A team like Cleveland would upgrade automatically by hiring him, even if they were just going to have to fire him in 3 years to get a better coach.  Giants too honestly(I know he's being considered for the OC...now that's a bit laughable IMO)

[Vic Mackey 47161]

Poor Giants fan. Actually thinking this would be a good hire and that he was a solid OC. Lmao.

 

Edited January 7, 2020 by Vic Mackey

['stache 21887]

I never know what to think when the story is the HC "interferred" with the OC playcalling. If Garrett really did that, then he sucks. I somehow doubt that Garrett is up to speed with current trends in dynamic offenses, and Daniel Jones is overrated. 

[Vic Mackey 47161]

39 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Makes sense that the contact was to gauge Garrett's interest in the OC position. He absolutely does not deserve a HC position right now. Far better to hire a guy who hasn't proven anything than to hire a guy who has proven he can't get it done. I didn't think Garrett was horrible, just average, until this season. The 2019 NFC East was served to Dallas on a platter and he blew it.

Not to mention he wasted so many careers here. Dak/Zeke on rookie deals and didn't do jack shit. Front office also needs to take heat but still, he sucks. 

[Vic Mackey 47161]

50 minutes ago, Lerka Lerka said:

Never even heard of Joe Judge.  Patriots wr's were below average as well this year. Guess some teams just want a branch from the Belichick coaching tree... 

Has any coach from his tree had a successful head coach career? I can't think of any. They all seem to wilt when their Daddy is not around to hold their hands.

[conVINCEd 21469]

4 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Has any coach from his tree had a successful head coach career? I can't think of any. They all seem to wilt when their Daddy is not around to hold their hands.

Saban?

[Iceman 2726]

Vrabel is a work in progress

[dcar00 14378]

the time to run from Garrett was when he won exactly zero games without Romo the season he got hurt.  A real exec would say "hmm, he can't get over the hump when all the cards are in his hand and when the ace is pulled he craters." tells me he isn't the guy.  but Jerry was so invested in him getting the credit for Garrett that he road it into the ditch.

the great coaches know how to win(maybe not Super Bowl but win) when the shit hits the fan.  there is a foundation in the team, not hero ball.

[Jim Tressell’s Vest 10]

57 minutes ago, Lerka Lerka said:

Never even heard of Joe Judge.  Patriots wr's were below average as well this year. Guess some teams just want a branch from the Belichick coaching tree... 

Anyone from the Patriots' system gets an exponential value boost solely because they are from the Pats i.e., O'Brien, McDaniels, Jimmy G, etc.

[Vic Mackey 47161]

1 minute ago, dcar00 said:

the time to run from Garrett was when he won exactly zero games without Romo the season he got hurt.  A real exec would say "hmm, he can't get over the hump when all the cards are in his hand and when the ace is pulled he craters." tells me he isn't the guy.  but Jerry was so invested in him getting the credit for Garrett that he road it into the ditch.

the great coaches know how to win(maybe not Super Bowl but win) when the shit hits the fan.  there is a foundation in the team, not hero ball.

Wade was fired for this exact thing. Midseason of 2010. Romo went down and the team fell apart. Although we sucked even with Romo that year. Garrett did one game that year without Romo. In Washington on MNF, which was a terrible football game.

I wanted Garrett gone after he went 0-3 in his first 3 years in end of year win or go home games to win the East. Watching him coach, you could easily tell he was in over his head with how poorly he called a game and all his in game blunders. A real coach with the 2014 and 2016 teams could have actually won something for us. At the least, gotten us to the NFC title game both years. We were better than GB both years and lost. Especially 2016. That GB team overachieved and were ripe for us to kick their ass at home. But in true Garrett form, we are not prepared and go down 21-3. And Rodgers was on one leg the other time. Those were SB caliber teams we had and Garrett shitted on them.

[Vic Mackey 47161]

7 minutes ago, conVINCEd said:

Saban?

True. Guess I forgot about him since he had all his success in college.

[Jim Tressell’s Vest 10]

Garrett, O'Brien and Kitchens are all about the same level of terrible in my eyes. To have teams with as much talent as the Browns, Texans and Cowboys, yet still underperform year in and year out should say something about their coaching ability (or lack there of). The Texans are only in the playoffs because they have a Top 5-8 team talent wise, but they never seem like a true contender because BOB is just such an awful playcaller. he gets carried by Deshaun, something that Garrett and Kitchens don't benefit from

[Vic Mackey 47161]

7 minutes ago, Iceman said:

Vrabel is a work in progress

I have to applaud any coach who can win a road playoff game with Tannehill. Hell, just getting to the playoffs with Tannehill in general. 

[Vic Mackey 47161]

1 minute ago, Jim Tressell’s Vest said:

Garrett, O'Brien and Kitchens are all about the same level of terrible in my eyes. To have teams with as much talent as the Browns, Texans and Cowboys, yet still underperform year in and year out should say something about their coaching ability (or lack there of). The Texans are only in the playoffs because they have a Top 5-8 team talent wise, but they never seem like a true contender because BOB is just such an awful playcaller. he gets carried by Deshaun, something that Garrett and Kitchens don't benefit from

To be fair, Baker is not a good QB. And OBJ is a fucking cancer and has been since NYG.  OBrien and Garrett have much better QBs in Watson and Dak. Cleveland was put together like a kid playing Madden. Flashy names and what not but no real substance.

Although if you switched Garrett and Kitchens, the results would probably be similar for Cle and Dallas.

[Jim Tressell’s Vest 10]

1 minute ago, Vic Mackey said:

To be fair, Baker is not a good QB. And OBJ is a fucking cancer and has been since NYG.  OBrien and Garrett have much better QBs in Watson and Dak. Cleveland was put together like a kid playing Madden. Flashy names and what not but no real substance.

Although if you switched Garrett and Kitchens, the results would probably be similar for Cle and Dallas.

Baker doesn't get enough credit. He may not be an elite QB, but he is certainly better than a lot of guys out there. I would like to see and top-tier QB try and throw the ball effectively with an O-Line made of paper like the Browns'. Though, DW4 does it year after year. Plus, with Hunt and Chubb, paired with OBJ (no matter how much of a cancer he may be) and Jarvis, there's no way the offense should have been as bad as it was. I put the blame primarily on the O-line, then Dorsey, then Kitchens. Maybe switch Dorsey and the O-Line. Also, Dak is so incredibly overrated

[Nicole44 22078]

Garrett was always out coached by better coaches. Bellichick, SP, etc

[Huckleberry 33109]

1 minute ago, Jim Tressell’s Vest said:

Baker doesn't get enough credit. He may not be an elite QB, but he is certainly better than a lot of guys out there. I would like to see and top-tier QB try and throw the ball effectively with an O-Line made of paper like the Browns'. Though, DW4 does it year after year. Plus, with Hunt and Chubb, paired with OBJ (no matter how much of a cancer he may be) and Jarvis, there's no way the offense should have been as bad as it was. I put the blame primarily on the O-line, then Dorsey, then Kitchens. Maybe switch Dorsey and the O-Line. Also, Dak is so incredibly overrated

lulz

Mayfield was fucking awful this year. 

Only one of these was not a bad throw or play by Mayfield, the 4th and goal play against the Rams. You can call a few of them unlucky bounces, but those unlucky bounces happened because the ball was low or behind the receiver.

[Vic Mackey 47161]

2 minutes ago, Jim Tressell’s Vest said:

Baker doesn't get enough credit. He may not be an elite QB, but he is certainly better than a lot of guys out there. I would like to see and top-tier QB try and throw the ball effectively with an O-Line made of paper like the Browns'. Though, DW4 does it year after year. Plus, with Hunt and Chubb, paired with OBJ (no matter how much of a cancer he may be) and Jarvis, there's no way the offense should have been as bad as it was. I put the blame primarily on the O-line, then Dorsey, then Kitchens. Maybe switch Dorsey and the O-Line. Also, Dak is so incredibly overrated

I admit I did not watch a lot of Baker this year but I did watch about 4 games. Which were the primetime games they played in. I saw a guy who is not accurate. He has a weird throwing motion and I never had any confidence he would be able to get the ball to his guys when he dropped back. I do agree his OL sucked but even when given time, he just did not cut it. I didn't see much progression from his rookie year to this year. There's still time but as of now, I don't think he's that good. 

[C-Man 27281]

17 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Although if you switched Garrett and Kitchens, the results would probably be similar for Cle and Dallas.

Look, I know you hate Ginger, who wasn't very good. He was about as average as you can get. Kitchens is downright dreadful as a NFL coach at this point.

[DougO 5256]

3 hours ago, Vic Mackey said:

I'm hearing Matt Rhule is going to take the job with the Panthers. And that Jason Garrett could be next in line for the Giants job. Please make this happen lmao.

They took another bill coaching tree guy, so I'm Ok with the prospects there.

[DougO 5256]

Browns gonna Brown themselves. It's what they do. Latest buzz is they are interviewing fecals DC Schwartz for the head coaching job. Good DC, but he was one of the dumbest head coaches in history for the Lions. Terrible game-decision coach.

Edited January 7, 2020 by DougO

[Jim Tressell’s Vest 10]

13 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

lulz

Mayfield was fucking awful this year. 

Only one of these was not a bad throw or play by Mayfield, the 4th and goal play against the Rams. You can call a few of them unlucky bounces, but those unlucky bounces happened because the ball was low or behind the receiver.

I didn't say he was good this year, but he doesn't deserve all the blame. The play calls were atrocious, as was the offensive line. And "bad throw" or not, they are NFL WRs...they have to catch the ball if it hits them in the hands

[Vic Mackey 47161]

8 minutes ago, C-Man said:

Look, I know you hate Ginger, who wasn't very good. He was about as average as you can get. Kitchens is downright dreadful as a NFL coach at this point.

It's all relative. Garrett came into a pretty good situation. Not great but as good as you can ask for in regards to a team looking for a coach. He coached almost 10 years and never got better at all. He took SB caliber teams and made them underachieve big time.

Wasn't this Kichens first year as head coach? He had some ok stints as a coordinator and assistant. I think he coached Witten in 2006. He coached Carson Palmer in Arizona when they went to the NFC title game.

You think Garrett would have had more success in Cleveland this year than Kitchens? I'm not sure about that. Would Kitchens have did any worse than Garrett did with this team? We let an Eagles team who was playing their practice squad win the division. We had no real injuries this year. 

[Irish Wrist Watch 1398]

If I'm the Giants, knowing that McCarthy may keep Moore, I'm interviewing Ginger simply to find out what the strengths and weaknesses of that offense are/were - from the horse's mouth, so to speak. Then I'm telling him thanks but no thanks

[Gene Parmesan 4016]

4 minutes ago, Irish Wrist Watch said:

If I'm the Giants, knowing that McCarthy may keep Moore, I'm interviewing Ginger simply to find out what the strengths and weaknesses of that offense are/were - from the horse's mouth, so to speak. Then I'm telling him thanks but no thanks

They already hired their coach.  The cloak and dagger stuff is great fan fiction, but NFL teams don't have secret exhaust ports that only the coaches know about.  Besides the Giants don't have the roster to do anything about it anyways.

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

21 minutes ago, DougO said:

Browns gonna Brown themselves. It's what they do. Latest buzz is they are interviewing fecals DC Schwartz for the head coaching job. Good DC, but he was one of the dumbest head coaches in history for the Lions. Terrible game-decision coach.

I'm not convinced the browns goal is to win.  Their fans are pretty loyal regardless.