Dallas Cowboys 2020 Offseason Thread -- 25th Anniversary of Mediocrity

[Apex73 313]

5 hours ago, Vic Mackey said:

And yet some people still buy into this myth that we do well in the draft. 

I disagree.  They hit on Dak, Zeke, Gallup, Martin, Frederick, Jones, Awuzie, LV, Jaylon, etc...  The drafting and acquiring of talent had not been the problem.

[futureman 22444]

awuzie?

[markstanco 12573]

I disagree.  They hit on Dak, Zeke, Gallup, Martin, Frederick, Jones, Awuzie, LV, Jaylon, etc...  The drafting and acquiring of talent had not been the problem.

Some of those guys are gone. Also, good point made by radio talking heads last week concerning running backs. Are they that important in current offenses? Jerry thinks so like its 2005.

UDFA RBs started in the superbowl. Maybe a coincidence, but probably not.

Todd Gurley wrecked RBs with that dumb contract from the rams. Pretty sure after him and Zeke that's going the other way.

[michaelpshayes 417]

42 minutes ago, markstanco said:

Some of those guys are gone. Also, good point made by radio talking heads last week concerning running backs. Are they that important in current offenses? Jerry thinks so like its 2005.    1992.

UDFA RBs started in the superbowl. Maybe a coincidence, but probably not.

Todd Gurley wrecked RBs with that dumb contract from the rams. Pretty sure after him and Zeke that's going the other way.

 

[Hate 20107]

Actually, it was 93 when Emmitt held out ans we started 0-2 including a home loss to Buffalo. 

[Pato del Muerto 52487]

58 minutes ago, Hate said:

Actually, it was 93 when Emmitt held out ans we started 0-2 including a home loss to Buffalo. 

Pretty sure buffalo made the Super Bowl that season, so a home loss to them early wasn’t necessarily a harbinger of shitty play going forward without emmitt. Jerry reacted like it was, though. 

[Iceman 2695]

4 hours ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Pretty sure buffalo made the Super Bowl that season, so a home loss to them early wasn’t necessarily a harbinger of shitty play going forward without emmitt. Jerry reacted like it was, though. 

signing Emmitt is about  #146278822277262552 on Jerry's list of personnel mistakes. They won 2 more SBs and the dude is the all time leading rusher in NFL history.  It doesn't take much imagination to see Jimmy raising hell and telling Jerry to get his f'ing RB into the fold so they could win games.

Edited March 24, 2020 by Iceman

[EastTexan 662]

1 hour ago, Iceman said:

signing Emmitt is about  #146278822277262552 on Jerry's list of personnel mistakes. They won 2 more SBs and the dude is the all time leading rusher in NFL history.  It doesn't take much imagination to see Jimmy raising hell and telling Jerry to get his f'ing RB into the fold so they could win games.

Yea. Emmitt was pretty instrumental.

[TornACL 7698]

[csb] Teenage TornACL ran into Emmitt at the airport during the summer before that season. I told him he's got to re-sign. He laughed and said "we'll see" and then brushed me off because two smoking hot chicks walked up to him to talk. [/csb] 

Sorry I wasn't more persuasive, guys. Those first two losses were on me. 

Edited March 24, 2020 by TornACL

[Vic Mackey 47012]

 

[Rougarou 594]

Just seemed to me from the eyeball test that Frederick wasn't who he was prior to the diagnosis. He just looked smaller. No surprise he wasn't as effective as his All-Pro, younger years,-- indeed the surprise was he was as good as he was last year. I didn't expect him to be as effective as he was, at least.

Travis Frederick always seemed like a guy who would try to do more than football, whether it be as an analyst like Mike Golic (he was always radio-friendly with the Cowboys/Ben&Skin) or if it was in business. 

The one thing that was obnoxious was the narrative that was packaged and sold to Cowboy fans when they drafted him, that he was some technology wizard as a CS major who built an app for his capstone project at UW (when I think he admitted he built out a story board or technical design document). The narrative being he's Tech Bro genius who just so happens to play good football. But hey, we all have a pitch, I guess.

Edited March 24, 2020 by Rougarou

[DougO 5243]

On 3/23/2020 at 11:07 AM, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

Gregory back?

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/28940406/source-cowboys-de-randy-gregory-files-reinstatement

"Nope, suspended indefinitely again kid, I don't like the cut of your gap toothed jib"  - Goodell probably

Doesn't like the color and design of his uniform, most likely.

[Hate 20107]

10 hours ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Pretty sure buffalo made the Super Bowl that season, so a home loss to them early wasn’t necessarily a harbinger of shitty play going forward without emmitt. Jerry reacted like it was, though. 

They were 0-2 in what was a good division that year and also had SF and Green Bay to worry about for playoff seeding.  They only scored 26 points in those 2 games. They went 12-2 the rest of the way and got the #1 seed for the NFC that year.  Signing Emmitt was absolutely crucial.

[DougO 5243]

Yes, such a tragic misstep paying the eventual NFL all time leading rusher what he was worth.

[Horny Bull 2759]

 

[DougO 5243]

 

[Viper 12104]

On 3/23/2020 at 5:32 PM, Patrick Bateman said:

First round picks ain't looking so good for McClay and group.... especially if LVE can't get his career back on track.

 

I'm not sure how you can blame McClay and the drafting department for Jones, Vander Esch, and Frederick. They were great draft picks. 

[Catdaddyhorn 3444]

 

['stache 21800]

Fuck blake bell. But I guess if he's a better blocker, fine. Jarwin should get more passing situations next year.

['stache 21800]

14 hours ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

 

Just get it done already. $35 per is what Russell Wilson got last year. The next man up will get more, and Mahomes will reset the market when his monster deal comes through. That's how it goes. If he regresses, you can dump him after 2 or 3 years having paid most of his guarateed money. Just get it done before Mahomes gets paid, and before some no-name chump resets the market.

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/contract-negotiations-between-dak-prescott-cowboys-heating-up-044224321.html

Edited March 26, 2020 by 'stache

[futureman 22444]

36 minutes ago, 'stache said:

and before some no-name chump resets the market.

are you referring to dak?

[jeevsie 3733]

Beat me to it, future.

[C-Man 27196]

23 hours ago, Viper said:

I'm not sure how you can blame McClay and the drafting department for Jones, Vander Esch, and Frederick. They were great draft picks. 

Meh. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/dal/draft.htm

[Drew 2404]

Cowboys are winning double digit games next year.  It's what they do after a so-so year.  Dak has only shown he won't lose that many games, especially back to back.  The Offense might be even better(even without Fredrick) and I don't think the defense will be any worse, even with the losses...let's see how they finish filling it out with the draft and bargains in FA.  

Special Teams was a disaster last year...maybe we'll see improvement there too.

 

They're winning 10-11 games at least.  And wouldn't surprise me if they had a big year with the new coaches.

['stache 21800]

6 minutes ago, Drew said:

Cowboys are winning double digit games next year.  It's what they do after a so-so year.  Dak has only shown he won't lose that many games, especially back to back.  The Offense might be even better(even without Fredrick) and I don't think the defense will be any worse, even with the losses...let's see how they finish filling it out with the draft and bargains in FA.  

Special Teams was a disaster last year...maybe we'll see improvement there too.

 

They're winning 10-11 games at least.  And wouldn't surprise me if they had a big year with the new coaches.

Also a new coaching staff, so the tape from last year won't help opposing teams as much, and won't be as predictable as ginger. It'll be enough for probably a few extra wins. I'm still hoping the new coaching can get us over the hump to some real playoff success, but we'll just have to wait and see (assuming there is an NFL season at all). 

[Pato del Muerto 52487]

32-34-36-38 take it. I think the only way dak would agree to a 5th year at say 40 would be if 120 or more was guaranteed. 

Edited March 26, 2020 by Pato del Muerto

[futureman 22444]

53 minutes ago, Drew said:

Cowboys are winning double digit games next year.  It's what they do after a so-so year.  Dak has only shown he won't lose that many games, especially back to back.  The Offense might be even better(even without Fredrick) and I don't think the defense will be any worse, even with the losses...let's see how they finish filling it out with the draft and bargains in FA.  

Special Teams was a disaster last year...maybe we'll see improvement there too.

 

They're winning 10-11 games at least.  And wouldn't surprise me if they had a big year with the new coaches.

dumb.

[Vic Mackey 47012]

 

[futureman 22444]

highest paid nfl player.  good stuff, jerry. 

[futureman 22444]

what a fucking clown show. 

[Iceman 2695]

It's all OK because Russell Wilson and Patrick Mahomes... 2 absolute game changers and...um...Super Bowl champions.

That conversation is about an MVP winner, a contender, and a pretender.

It ain't personal...the numbers being thrown around for that contract are just stupid, however.  You be you, jerrah...

Edited March 27, 2020 by Iceman

[Burt Macklin 19020]

16 hours ago, Vic Mackey said:

 

10 hours ago, futureman said:

highest paid nfl player.  good stuff, jerry. 

 

10 hours ago, futureman said:

what a fucking clown show. 

Look man, you spend all your time trolling Surly. Jerry spends all his time trolling you. It’s a beautiful karmic circle. 

[Drew 2404]

He was always going to get Wilson money or higher as "next man up".  The fact that some of you act like that's some huge issue or some massive overpay is a joke.  In 2 years average NFL QB's will be getting 33-35 mil a year and Dak will be underpaid, again.

[Pato del Muerto 52487]

16 minutes ago, Drew said:

He was always going to get Wilson money or higher as "next man up".  The fact that some of you act like that's some huge issue or some massive overpay is a joke.  In 2 years average NFL QB's will be getting 33-35 mil a year and Dak will be underpaid, again.

In 2 years average qbs will be getting 35 a year because average qbs like Goff and Prescott (I’m back and forth on him but I’ll use him here for this point) will be getting 35. It’s a self fulfilling prophecy. 

[Radical Larry 28566]

 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

Let’s fucking go! 

[C-Man 27196]

23 hours ago, Drew said:

Cowboys are winning double digit games next year.  It's what they do after a so-so year.  Dak has only shown he won't lose that many games, especially back to back.  The Offense might be even better(even without Fredrick) and I don't think the defense will be any worse, even with the losses...let's see how they finish filling it out with the draft and bargains in FA.  

Special Teams was a disaster last year...maybe we'll see improvement there too.

 

They're winning 10-11 games at least.  And wouldn't surprise me if they had a big year with the new coaches.

[futureman 22444]

35 minutes ago, Radical Larry said:

 

show me a loss. 

[Hate 20107]

23 hours ago, Drew said:

Cowboys are winning double digit games next year.  It's what they do after a so-so year.  Dak has only shown he won't lose that many games, especially back to back.  The Offense might be even better(even without Fredrick) and I don't think the defense will be any worse, even with the losses...let's see how they finish filling it out with the draft and bargains in FA.  

Special Teams was a disaster last year...maybe we'll see improvement there too.

 

They're winning 10-11 games at least.  And wouldn't surprise me if they had a big year with the new coaches.

There is no way they are winning 11 games next year.  Have you seen their schedule??  The division should be better outside of maybe Washington (although an argument could be made that they will) and the play the Ravens, 49ers, Vikings and Seattle (playoff teams out of division).  They play the Rams (who could be better) as well as the Falcons (who knows), Steelers (barely missed the playoffs with scrub QB's all year) ,and finally the Cardinals, Bengals, Browns (two of which should be better).  Find 11 wins on that schedule based on what we know about each team right now.  You can maybe get to 8 (Redskins twice, split with NY and Philly, Cardinals, Browns, Bengals, and Falcons).  And as we saw plenty of times last year, the Cowboys have the ability to lay a turd on any given Sunday.  Your banking on the drafting perfectly and that McCarty will make them better.  I have no doubt they will be better coached, but there is still no way they are getting to 11 wins.

[Junior Miller 1502]

On 3/25/2020 at 2:26 PM, Viper said:

I'm not sure how you can blame McClay and the drafting department for Jones, Vander Esch, and Frederick. They were great draft picks. 

True outside of Vander Esch who had very questionable medical on the neck and dropped in the draft because of it. Outside of the 2016 draft they're getting nothing from the 2nd round on and throwing in 1st round busts. 

2017 Taco - Bust, Chidobe -Benched last season, Switzer and Marquez White gave nothing, Xavier Woods is a less than average safety, and Jourdan Lewis is a decent slot corner.

2018 - Vander Esch injury prone, Connor looks bad playing out of position, Gallup looks good, Chris Covington was replacement level, but then Dorance Armstrong, Mike White, Cedric Wilson, Bo Scarborough, Dalton Schultz gave nothing. 

2019 - Hill looks super busty, McGovern hasn't taken a snap, Pollard is good but blocked by an overpaid Zeke, and Joe Jackson, Mike Jackson, Donovan Wilsonz Mike Weber, and Jalen Jelks all have nothing. 

McClay/Stephen/drafting department have turned in 3 straight shit drafts after hitting big on the 2016 draft. They should definitely be blamed for not finding more than 1 good player per draft. 

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

1 hour ago, Radical Larry said:

 

Makes sense.... Maher missed the most FGs in the NFL last year.  Greg the Leg missed the 2nd most.

[Junior Miller 1502]

1 hour ago, Hate said:

There is no way they are winning 11 games next year.  Have you seen their schedule??  The division should be better outside of maybe Washington (although an argument could be made that they will) and the play the Ravens, 49ers, Vikings and Seattle (playoff teams out of division).  They play the Rams (who could be better) as well as the Falcons (who knows), Steelers (barely missed the playoffs with scrub QB's all year) ,and finally the Cardinals, Bengals, Browns (two of which should be better).  Find 11 wins on that schedule based on what we know about each team right now.  You can maybe get to 8 (Redskins twice, split with NY and Philly, Cardinals, Browns, Bengals, and Falcons).  And as we saw plenty of times last year, the Cowboys have the ability to lay a turd on any given Sunday.  Your banking on the drafting perfectly and that McCarty will make them better.  I have no doubt they will be better coached, but there is still no way they are getting to 11 wins.

Damn, would be the absolute perfect year to franchise and trade Dak then IR whoever worth a shit gets a paper cut while starting the absolute worst quarterback they can find to chase 0-16. Give Trevor Lawrence to McCarthy who has shown he can develop the hell out of quarterbacks? Nah, makes way too much sense for these idiots. 

[Vic Mackey 47012]

6 hours ago, Drew said:

He was always going to get Wilson money or higher as "next man up".  The fact that some of you act like that's some huge issue or some massive overpay is a joke.  In 2 years average NFL QB's will be getting 33-35 mil a year and Dak will be underpaid, again.

Please don't bring logic into this! Not allowed for many. Russell Wilson right now in per year salary, is the highest paid QB at $35million. But Matt Ryan has the most guaranteed money of any player. Wentz is at $32. Dak was going to get more than him and deservedly so. He's put in way more work than Wentz. People get way too caught up in these labels of "highest paid player!!!!: That shit lasts a year. Stafford and Derek Carr were once the highest paid players. And now look. Who fucking cares. The QB market is skyrocketing. The salary cap will keep rising. People have no concept of this at all. 

Dak could get paid a couple hundred grand more than  Wilson and be the highest paid player in the league. Until Mahomes signs and dwarfs anyone out there. So who gives a shit. 

[Vic Mackey 47012]

5 hours ago, Radical Larry said:

 

Isn't he a Mahrer clone? He will make the long exciting kicks but miss the chip shots. At least they are actually bringing in competition, though. Something they should have did before last season. Mahrer was a huge reason of  a good chunk of those losses in many aspects.

[futureman 22444]

1 minute ago, Vic Mackey said:

Wentz is at $32. Dak was going to get more than him and deservedly so.

not sure you have a grasp of the term "deservedly."

[Drew 2404]

He grasps it just fine clown.  And he's right.

 

Also, this team is too good to tank a year. Even if Dak was nearly as bad as some of you idiots think, and they pulled to plug on him and started Cooper Fucking Rush, they'd still win 4-5 games(just like they did in 2015).

Also, I think it's not just feasible, but HIGHLY likely the Cowboys win double digit games. Don't give me this shit about "look at that schedule" because it doesn't make a shit what it looks like in March/April.  By the time they're midway through the schedule teams that were supposed to be good aren't, and other teams rise up.  I really don't think it's a stretch at all to see them winning 11 games with the new coaching staff, another year of a high octane offense, and at least some additions on Defense/ST's to help.

[futureman 22444]

shut the fuck up, drew.

[DougO 5243]

They may not even play double-digit games this season. You never know.

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

On 3/27/2020 at 2:47 PM, Patrick Bateman said:

Makes sense.... Maher missed the most FGs in the NFL last year.  Greg the Leg missed the 2nd most.

 

On 3/27/2020 at 6:32 PM, Vic Mackey said:

Isn't he a Mahrer clone? He will make the long exciting kicks but miss the chip shots. At least they are actually bringing in competition, though. Something they should have did before last season. Mahrer was a huge reason of  a good chunk of those losses in many aspects.

Greg the leg was hurt most of last year, so I’ll give him a pass. He has a pretty large sample size showing that he’s a good deal better than Maher, or Forbath, or even Dan Bailey later in his career. If he can gain his confidence back (big if, like it is for all kickers), then he’s a top 5 kicker. If not, him and forbath can battle it out. When we were screaming “bring in the best available kicker to have a competition with Maher” this is the best available guy. 
 

Plus, he just seems like Fassel’s guy, so I’ll trust his word until I’m given a reason not to. Hopefully we can somehow bring the Rams old punter with him too. 

Edited March 29, 2020 by youdunnf'dup

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

2 hours ago, youdunnf'dup said:

 

Greg the leg was hurt most of last year, so I’ll give him a pass. He has a pretty large sample size showing that he’s a good deal better than Maher, or Forbath, or even Dan Bailey later in his career. If he can gain his confidence back (big if, like it is for all kickers), then he’s a top 5 kicker. If not, him and forbath can battle it out. When we were screaming “bring in the best available kicker to have a competition with Maher” this is the best available guy. 
 

Plus, he just seems like Fassel’s guy, so I’ll trust his word until I’m given a reason not to. Hopefully we can somehow bring the Rams old punter with him too. 

I was sort of kidding when I posted that.  Greg Z has a big leg but I don't know if I would call him the best available kicker. And there is not much in his sample size which says he's better than Bailey.  Kickers are weird guys but ST coaches tend to fall in love with their guys and maybe he can get Greg back to his 18' season when he probably was the best kicker in the league (38-40 FGM with 6-7 over 50).  But aside from a couple of years, he's a big legged kicker who's accuracy is average at best.  82% FGM percentage with 4 seasons (out of 8.) at 80% or less.   To give you an idea 80% would have tied him as the 20th most accurate kicker.  His career average would have put him at 19th last year.  Even when Bailey got squirrely, his accuracy was 75%.  Greg Z has 2 seasons worse than that including last season.  He probably would have been cut except the Rams used some good draft capital on him initially so stuck with him and then in McVay's first year, Z had his career year.  What does all that mean?  Not a whole lot except he's a league average kicker who will definitely help us in touchbacks and field position so that's a big positive. Big leg, below average accuracy, but is liked by our ST coach.  Kickers are weird birds.... he could be great or we could cut him 5 games in. 2.5 million is a lot of the flip of a coin though but doubt a lot is guaranteed.