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Donald Trump 2020

Francisco 2.0

By Francisco 2.0
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8 hours ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

It's hard, I mean really hard. I miss my parents, and my in-laws too. All of them, save my mother, passed away prior to the 2016 election so I can't say for sure how it would have gone but I can see how the elderly can get 'fear' radicalized via television and the internet. Seems that it is a little less likely with print media--but a lot of the older folks have gotten, not what I would call savvy, but at least able to use electronic media enough to abandon the print. --which is a shame, I love reading a paper in the morning. Especially since our local paper has an op-ed by that hack Marc Thiessen every week. So satisfying to dump coffee grounds on his face.

The obstacle for me (and my spouse) was distance. That social media/tv is there all the time, a constant companion whispering in their ear, sending them alerts on their phone, tweeting them or targeting them on Facebook. You could see that with my in laws back when the email chains would come and come and come. You all know the FW:FW jokes. And for adult children living where the closest relative is over 8 hours away it's a challenge to combat the isolation bubble and loneliness that older parents live in. After my dad passed and my mom was staying for a visit, her phone kept going off with alerts from her local tv station. Almost every one was crime-related and I started noticing how she would fret. So, we talked about changing the habit/phone so that instead of her receiving a notification, she would just check her phone in the morning like you would read the newspaper at breakfast. And then I began covert operations. Sounds sneaky, but I hated the thought of her feeling so afraid and isolated and vulnerable even though the chances of her being a crime victim were low. An elder scam, maybe, but a gas station robbery twenty miles away from her neighborhood less so.

We were already texting/talking almost daily anyway, we had for years; but I began 'happy distractions'-- finding twitter accounts with videos of positive things that were in her interests. She loved the animal cams that the National Zoo has, the videos that "Tasty' has, the Great British Bake-Off, things like that. And my mom liked a good challenge, thus I began to notice she was spending more and more time searching for things to send in return or actually trying some of the recipes. This was especially fortunate as her health began to keep her inside more. It kept the conversation going and her spirit a little lighter. The kids helped too--they could find the most hilarious stuff. I imagine we were fortunate. Not every family is going to mend the scars, but I have hope that families can find some kind of workable peace or create relationships outside of family to get them through this.

that's serious dedication.  very admirable.  I don't think my relationship is strong enough with my mom to interfere (in a good way) like that.  yes I totally see FB as the evolution of chain email.  we just need our parents to post funny memes and like if you agree posts that aren't dark, sinsister, politically irresponsible and fake again.  I promise I won't ever complain again.  I'll like every single silly and annoying one of them.

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Thatguy
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Let me be candid and honest here my man. I cannot be sympathetic to your comments because this is how adult life has always been. From the moment I stepped out of my home and headed off to college I h

Francisco 2.0
Francisco 2.0
henrygandorf
henrygandorf

it won't matter if his taxes ever come out.  it won't matter if his taxes don't ever come out.  you wanna know why?  because we already know what's in them. since early 2017 when people starting

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Goredho

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7 hours ago, Snake Diggity said:

Most encouraging thing over the last 72 hours is Trumps more frequent acknowledgement of the possibility that he might lose.  The “y’all are gonna miss me” tweet, the “if we lose I won’t call you great” rally cry.  Great sign.  IF (big IF) he plans to allow the election to be fair and is willing to leave without finishing destroying the country on his way out, I think we will see more and more of this rhetoric.  He may even pivot to hyping his post president plans (news network, etc) while he still has the limelight.

So I now have two family members that voted for Trump in 2016 and were prepared to do it again that now say they are not voting for him.  They aren't rabid Trumpkins -- just conservative, busy and they get their view of the world outside of their fishbowl from Fox.  I am working on them to vote for Biden, but they probably just won't vote.

The debate seemed to be a seeing-Oz-behind-the-curtain moment for them.  They feel personally affronted by Trump telling white supremacists to stand by and then his camp's "you didn't see or hear what you saw and heard" gaslighting after the fact.  They didn't use the term gaslighting, probably aren't even aware of it, but they now say they feel Trump is full of shit and not the right man to be President.

Take that anecdotal report for what it is worth.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105312

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Just now, Goredho said:

So I now have two family members that voted for Trump in 2016 and were prepared to do it again that now say they are not voting for him.  They aren't rabid Trumpkins -- just conservative, busy and they get their view of the world outside of their fishbowl from Fox.  I am working on them to vote for Biden, but they probably just won't vote.

The debate seemed to be a seeing-Oz-behind-the-curtain moment for them.  They feel personally affronted by Trump telling white supremacists to stand by and then his camp's "you didn't see or hear what you saw and heard" gaslighting after the fact.  They didn't use the term gaslighting, probably aren't even aware of it, but they now say they feel Trump is full of shit and not the right man to be President.

Take that anecdotal report for what it is worth.

I'm perfectly happy if we can convert Trump voters to a "you may have voted for Trump before, but now that you see how awful he is, I'm not saying you need to vote for Biden -- you just know you can't vote for that awful a person again."  And if they stay home altogether.....that's a win (hint: it's also a down-ballot win, as they won't be voting in the Senate or local races either).  IF they still show up, but write in Mickey Mouse for POTUS, that's still a win.

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5 hours ago, tokamak said:

My in-laws are lifelong Republicans, mainly because they're rich as fuck. They cannot stand the idea that one penny of their tax dollars might go toward helping someone else out. If you press them, they'll pretty much admit that they don't give a fuck about culture war issues. They're racists, but more in a "those kind of people tend to be lazy" type way than an overt "we must protect White heritage!!" way. They're what used to be called Country Club Republicans. For the life of me, I can't figure out what they stand to gain from a Donald Trump presidency.

Their only sources of information about the world are Fox News and stuff that they see in emails from their friends and on Facebook. Therefore, DT can do no wrong in their minds. Any mainstream information source like the NYT or network news is laughably biased and not worthy of the slightest attention.

It's sad to watch because my wife has trouble even talking with them right now. For example, last Sunday she was talking to them on the phone and they asked what we were up to. Oh, not much, just watching the Cowboys game. "WELL WE DON'T WATCH THE NFL ANYMORE!". Keep in mind that these are people that loved the Cowboys and had season tickets for years. You can't even have a simple, innocuous conversation with them without it turning into an airing of perceived grievances. It's incredibly tiresome.

I'm going to just get more radically liberal I think to combat that.  our country belongs to the kids now, by default agree with the liberal kids.  and when I'm old, I'm checking out.  all my hobbies will be fully enjoyed.  that's sad, I wish it was different for them. 

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Goredho

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2 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

I'm perfectly happy if we can convert Trump voters to a "you may have voted for Trump before, but now that you see how awful he is, I'm not saying you need to vote for Biden -- you just know you can't vote for that awful a person again."  And if they stay home altogether.....that's a win (hint: it's also a down-ballot win, as they won't be voting in the Senate or local races either).  IF they still show up, but write in Mickey Mouse for POTUS, that's still a win.

Yep, I'm being cautious with them.  I am very intentionally letting them lead the conversations and avoiding any sort of "I told you so" type of end zone dancing.  Main thing I'm trying to get across about Biden is that he's more of a centrist than far left liberal.

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C-Man

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48 minutes ago, yoladu said:

fucking moron.

the acorn doesn't fall far from the tree.

Junior just hit CTL-F, then typed "stand by" and picked the first one he could find uttered by a Democrat. I imagine he got a hard-on when he saw it was Obama who used it.

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WhatTheBuck

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6 hours ago, Lagunamadre said:

I find myself in this same situation with my parents, their friends and my in-laws. The best response to the NFL type of comment is just flippantly say "ohhh ya I think I heard about that, that Trump kneeling deal? I don't really follow that stuff and I'm not big into the "cancel culture" thing like y'all are". It works perfectly. Play dumb. Make them think the casual observer thinks they are the cancel culture people, it sends them scrambling. "No, no, no, no, we are not cancel culture, the liberals are the cancel culture, etc. etc." 

Theirs is a cancer culture. Call it that. 

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JimmyJames

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40 minutes ago, Goredho said:

So I now have two family members that voted for Trump in 2016 and were prepared to do it again that now say they are not voting for him.  They aren't rabid Trumpkins -- just conservative, busy and they get their view of the world outside of their fishbowl from Fox.  I am working on them to vote for Biden, but they probably just won't vote.

The debate seemed to be a seeing-Oz-behind-the-curtain moment for them.  They feel personally affronted by Trump telling white supremacists to stand by and then his camp's "you didn't see or hear what you saw and heard" gaslighting after the fact.  They didn't use the term gaslighting, probably aren't even aware of it, but they now say they feel Trump is full of shit and not the right man to be President.

Take that anecdotal report for what it is worth.

Trump made a fairly explicit call for white supremacist violence on national television during a presidential debate. He is now doubling down by refusing to back off of it. 

That’s gonna be a tough one for all but the most violent racists trumpkins to just explain away or ignore.

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lemonlime

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2 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Trump made a fairly explicit call for white supremacist violence on national television during a presidential debate. He is now doubling down by refusing to back off of it. 

That’s gonna be a tough one for all but the most violent racists trumpkins to just explain away or ignore.

Hell, my trumpiest aunt posted on facebook that "nobody one (sic) the debate."  And she's a full fledged member of the trump cult.  But, sadly, I'm sure she and the rest of them will all in line by the time they vote.

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staboner

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59 minutes ago, Hornius Emeritus said:


Isn't it amazing that every other President, even Obama whom he hates, has managed to have an election go off without a hitch, relatively speaking, and here we are five weeks out and his administration can't seem to do it?  In any case, it just feels like more and more people are tuning him out. 

thats the spirit

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29194

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2 hours ago, ChuckNorrisActionJeans said:

Is he setting the stage to refuse to do any more debates? That would be a fantastic outcome on a number of levels. 

since no one else seems to get it, no.  the answer is no.

trump and his people have been saying since before the debate that biden and his team have been "working the refs".  this means trump and his team are working the refs presently.  he was already bitching and moaning during the debate about how it was 2 on 1 and unfair and everything since then seems to be that biden is getting unfair advantages.  he will continue to bitch and moan like a 5 year old with a skinned fucking knee until the debate, probably threatening a few times to not show up (he thinks this sun tzu shit will psych biden out) then he will show up, and (spoiler alert) he will bitch some more.

he will spend valuable (~) minutes during the debate complaining that the commission and the media and everyone involved has been trying to give biden an advantage, but he's still there to show everyone how tough he is and how it doesn't bother him.  then he'll bitch some more.

he wears makeup and distracts and cries.  he is, in the seinfeld sense, pagliacci.  the sad and tragic clown.

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D_Goose

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Posted
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19 minutes ago, Hank Scorpio said:

I love you Dilbert guy 

 

Sums up a large fraction of supporters, really:

"I know he's a contemptible, awful human being, but a group of people I really don't like can't stand him, therefore I support him."

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WhatTheBuck

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54 minutes ago, Goredho said:

Yep, I'm being cautious with them.  I am very intentionally letting them lead the conversations and avoiding any sort of "I told you so" type of end zone dancing.  Main thing I'm trying to get across about Biden is that he's more of a centrist than far left liberal.

If you're over 20 and don't know exactly who Joe Biden is then you're a fucking moron. If you let Donald Trump define who Joe Biden is for you then you're too stupid to breed. Just say, "You know damn well who Joe Biden is."

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31534

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1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

I'm perfectly happy if we can convert Trump voters to a "you may have voted for Trump before, but now that you see how awful he is, I'm not saying you need to vote for Biden -- you just know you can't vote for that awful a person again."  And if they stay home altogether.....that's a win (hint: it's also a down-ballot win, as they won't be voting in the Senate or local races either).  IF they still show up, but write in Mickey Mouse for POTUS, that's still a win.

Unfortunately, you cannot write in candidates for President in Texas.

I was fully prepared to write in one of these guys.

IMG-20200622-163420767.jpg

But could not.  Had to settle for Gary Johnson, instead.

 

Edited by TwiceHorn
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Sawbonz

Sawbonz 27586

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34 minutes ago, D_Goose said:

Sums up a large fraction of supporters, really:

"I know he's a contemptible, awful human being, but a group of people I really don't like can't stand him, therefore I support him."

They used to call this cutting off your nose to spite your face

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

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59 minutes ago, lemonlime said:

Hell, my trumpiest aunt posted on facebook that "nobody one (sic) the debate."  And she's a full fledged member of the trump cult.  But, sadly, I'm sure she and the rest of them will all in line by the time they vote.

The Trumpists on Facebook I know are all saying nobody won. That means Trump lost, bigly.

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Francisco 2.0

Francisco 2.0 32426

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https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/01/us/politics/trump-polls-victim.html?referringSource=articleShare

 

Quote

On Thursday afternoon, President Trump claimed that he had won this week’s debate against former Vice President Joseph R. Biden Jr., then veered into complaining about how the Commission on Presidential Debates might change procedures for their next event to avoid him repeatedly talking over his opponent again.

“Why would I allow the debate commission to change the rules for the second and third debates when I easily won last time?” Mr. Trump tweeted, raising the prospect that he might not go ahead with their second scheduled debate.

 

Quote

A short time later, his political advisers devoted a 20-minute campaign call with reporters to denouncing commission members by name and accusing them of “bias.” The advisers insisted that Mr. Trump would take part in future debates, but the complaining hardly exuded confidence.

A day earlier, Mr. Trump was insisting, too, that he was being denied his due for his chaotic and widely panned debate performance. At a campaign rally that night in Duluth, Minn., he also complained that he had not received sufficient media coverage for nominations for the Nobel Peace Prize.

“We got nothing!” he told the crowd.

 

Quote

Over nearly four years in office, Mr. Trump has frequently changed his positions on issues, issued conflicting statements and shuffled through a revolving cast of staff.

The one constant has been the president portraying himself as a victim at every turn.

Be it congressional Democrats or Republican foes like the late Senator John McCain, the news media or the standards enforcers at Twitter, the impeachment inquiry or, now, the debate commission, Mr. Trump has repeatedly blamed others for problems and self-inflicted wounds, something he hopes will appeal to a shared sense of grievance among his supporters.

 

Spoiler

That instinct is now increasingly on display as he faces ominous polling showing him behind in his re-election campaign, a position that aides say is unfathomable for someone who has long staked his personal brand on “winning.” Mr. Trump, some advisers inside and outside the White House say, has telegraphed to them that he is scared of losing — and in particular, scared of losing to Mr. Biden, whom he does not respect.

Mr. Trump has taken to describing shadows on almost every wall: false claims that the election is “rigged” against him, complaints that the coronavirus pandemic was “unfair” to his record on the economy, insistence that people who disagree with him within his own government about policy matters are part of a concerted effort to undermine him.

He has lobbed accusations at Democrats who want more extensive public health measures, and who haven’t agreed to Republican terms on an aid package for people impacted by the coronavirus, usually saying they are trying to harm his re-election prospects.

Even the personal troubles of Mr. Trump’s former campaign manager, Brad Parscale, whom the president has attacked in private for months and whom Mr. Trump demoted over the summer, became a vehicle for assigning blame. When Mr. Trump was told a few days ago that Mr. Parscale had been detained by the police for allegedly threatening to harm himself, the president ordered aides to write a statement blaming “Democrats” and “Republicans in name only” who had been critical of Mr. Parscale, according to two people familiar with what took place.

Claiming to be the victim of the political establishment has been key to Mr. Trump’s political persona since he entered the 2016 presidential race. And if he loses this time, he has spent months laying the groundwork for large swaths of voters to be receptive to his claim that it was wrongly taken from him.

Representative Peter King, Republican from Long Island, called Mr. Trump’s play for self-pity “a two-edged sword.” It has been successful in harnessing his base of voters who see him as fighting for them, but not necessarily with others whom he still needs to convince.

“I think it is important for the president to keep his base mobilized and tell some independent voters that the media is unfair to him,” he said. “But he can overplay that hand, so he has to watch it.”

Avoiding responsibility has been a trademark of the Trump White House on matters big and small, from the response to the coronavirus pandemic to Mr. Trump’s false claims about specific incidents of voting problems. As a businessman, too, Mr. Trump’s modus operandi was to deflect blame for anything that went wrong. But in a pandemic, when more than 200,000 people have died and millions have lost their jobs, Mr. Trump’s complaints about the system being unfair to him are discordant at best. 

“The only way to convince people that you’re not a loser is to convince them that you’re a victim,” said Amanda Carpenter, a columnist for the Bulwark and a former communications director for Senator Ted Cruz. “Having something be rigged against him is the ultimate ego protector, because he never has to admit that he lost.”

But Mr. Trump’s habit of blaming others has done little to erase the forbidding polling reality he faces against Mr. Biden.

Both nationwide and in most crucial swing states, a slight majority of voters tend to disapprove of the job Mr. Trump is doing as president, as they have throughout most of his term in office. And it looks increasingly unlikely that voters will buy his argument that Mr. Biden presents a dangerous alternative.

Polls over the past week have shown Mr. Trump trailing Mr. Biden by anywhere from five to 10 points nationwide. And his fortunes are no better in many key swing states, including Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and Arizona: Recent polls from The New York Timesand Siena College showed Mr. Biden with an eight to 10 point lead among likely voters in each of those three states. With one small exception, no credible survey this month has shown Mr. Trump ahead in any of them.

The president finds himself playing defense in every one of the states that he flipped four years ago, including in Iowa, where a Times/Siena poll this month gave Mr. Biden a three-point edge. Even in southern states that were key to his win in 2016, such as North Carolina and Florida, polls show him in a dogfight with Mr. Biden, hobbled — as he is elsewhere — by his stark unpopularity among women and his inability to maintain the confidence of suburban voters who had narrowly swung in his favor four years ago.

His angry performance in the debate on Tuesday did little to quiet the concerns of such voters. A CNN snap poll conducted that night among registered voters found that by more than two-to-one, debate viewers thought Mr. Biden had been the winner.

And in a reminder of how unpopular his pugilistic, taunting style remains with most voters, respondents said by an equally wide margin — 67 to 32 percent — that the president’s attacks on Mr. Biden that night had been unfair.

The debate commission is expected to announce some changes soon to the format for the remaining two presidential debates. Whether Mr. Trump uses such changes as justification to skip his next debate, on Oct. 15, remains to be seen.

Scott Jennings, a Republican strategist, said that he is sympathetic to some of Mr. Trump’s complaints, particularly about his media coverage.

But he also described errors made by Mr. Trump that are followed by people rallying to his side, comforting him and then fighting for him — without the president ever acknowledging that he was the one who kicked off that kind of exhausting cycle.

“It’s statistically impossible for someone to be totally the victim 100 percent of the time,” Mr. Jennings said. “Sometimes you brought it on yourself.”

 

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Mole

Mole 4333

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4 hours ago, Red Five said:

No more debates would be ideal for Biden and terrible for Trump. No way they'd do that. 

This. If you’re down a few TDs late in the 4th quarter, you don’t kneel, burn clock, and punt; you open up the ten yard minimum offense.

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Francisco 2.0

Francisco 2.0 32426

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2 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Trump giving Biden covid at the debate would be peak 2020. 

Or, Trump getting Covid from an aide who left the White House over a year ago and brought back in by Trump because he needed her counsel  attention would be peak 2020.

 

Edited by Francisco 2.0
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