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Donald Trump 2020

Francisco 2.0

By Francisco 2.0
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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89465

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, Wanker Bob said:

Because he gives them false hope that he can change things back to the way they were in the past. When gays were never seen in public or on television, the entire neighborhood was only white people, and companies actually gave a shit about you. 

I'm not sure if that last one ever existed 

There were companies that gave a shit about retaining long-time employees (recognizing the value of institutional knowledge and Getting Shit Done), but those companies were all run with a longer-term view of things, versus too many company executives focused on some quarterly goal to score their bonus or whatever.

As for the other stuff, recently had an acquaintance from high school, MAGA type (hey this was Fort Bend County), who bought into the "there weren't any gays around publicly" bleh bleh bleh nonsense, and several of us corrected her - things like somebody noticed that she liked Hollywood Squares, and one of the UHF stations in Houston used to run a shit-ton of Hollywood Squares re-runs with Paul Lind, and those things were already 10-15 years old at least, and everybody knew he was gay.

And then the kicker - she didn't think we had any gay students in school back in the 80s/early 90s, even though multiple friends in our extended group were gay (really don't know how the fuck she missed at least one of them - he was all but flaming).  She didn't buy that at all, until one of them chimed in with a photo of he and his boyfriend.   My guess is that our gay friends never felt comfortable coming out to her and a couple of others, but did to the rest of us, but regardless, it wasn't hard to spot.

People living in a bubble.

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Thatguy
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Let me be candid and honest here my man. I cannot be sympathetic to your comments because this is how adult life has always been. From the moment I stepped out of my home and headed off to college I h

Francisco 2.0
Francisco 2.0
henrygandorf
henrygandorf

it won't matter if his taxes ever come out.  it won't matter if his taxes don't ever come out.  you wanna know why?  because we already know what's in them. since early 2017 when people starting

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

i bet he names hamilton or ben franklin before he gets to 10.

Good point.  Judges would have also accepted  John Hancock, Joseph Wharton, and “White” Frederick Douglas.

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89465

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3 hours ago, 4th&Five said:

Somewhere out there, a bunch of Americans just got off the fence and cast a vote for Biden, because this means they can skip all of those holidays around relatives and go vacation somewhere awesome, rather than spending Thanksgiving in East Possum Fuck, Texas downing PBR.

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Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand

Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13554

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1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

Somewhere out there, a bunch of Americans just got off the fence and cast a vote for Biden, because this means they can skip all of those holidays around relatives and go vacation somewhere awesome, rather than spending Thanksgiving in East Possum Fuck, Texas downing PBR.

Yeah, this is the "aaannddd.....???? moment.

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Chooky

Chooky 13302

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"If you vote for Biden there won't be good stuff.  Only bad stuff.  Bad stuff is bad.  You like good stuff?"  That's a talking point in 2020.  Seriously, how the fuck did we get here?  What are we doing?  I still struggle to comprehend this simple bullshit.

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Mdhorn

Mdhorn 5912

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5 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Don't believe them when they call themselves "conservative." A true conservative wouldn't risk long term stability for short term gain. 

By definition--conservative.  

Have a friend that was a corporate attorney, oftentimes defending these types of corporations.  If the fine was less less than the gain, that was the cost of doing business.  If I do something bad and make 12 million dollars but only have to pay a 3 million dollar fine, then it was worth the fine and is worth repeating.  That is pure capitalism. Now imagine that this involves your water, air, and food and 12 million is pocket change.  But hey, their investors made a lot of money so it justifies the damage, right?      

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Degenerate Gardner

Degenerate Gardner 4081

Posted
Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, Chooky said:

"If you vote for Biden there won't be good stuff.  Only bad stuff.  Bad stuff is bad.  You like good stuff?"  That's a talking point in 2020.  Seriously, how the fuck did we get here?  What are we doing?  I still struggle to comprehend this simple bullshit.

We used to collectively agree, for the most part in most places, that sort of behavior from leaders was intolerable. Boors were looked down upon. Archie Bunker was a punchline. Those were the days.

Then one side tolerated it. Embraced it. Celebrated it.

The conservatives presided over the greatest decay of decency I've witnessed. 

Edited by Degenerate Gardner
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Irwin F Fletcher

Irwin F Fletcher 3550

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31 minutes ago, Bookman said:

Looks like Trump finally accomplished dishwasher reform:

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/comes-out-beautiful-trump-administration-rolls-back-dishwasher-water-conservation-n1245208

"Fuck! I knew this would happen if I cast my vote early. I thought he was all talk, but that son of a bitch did it! I'm rushing out to by a new dish washer today" - said no one ever.

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Bojack

Bojack 2073

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8 hours ago, Underdog said:

Pffft, I've voted in NY, Mass, NH, ME, VT, CT, RI and NJ. 

Classic Democratic cheating.  Don't vote in any battleground states.  Just run up the score in safe blue states like we did in 2016 with the 3 million extra votes in California.  

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Underdog

Underdog 28458

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27 minutes ago, Bojack said:

Classic Democratic cheating.  Don't vote in any battleground states.  Just run up the score in safe blue states like we did in 2016 with the 3 million extra votes in California.  

Well, I did end up in Philly but got sidetracked with a sandwich from DiNic's and forgot why I was there in the first place...  please forgive me. 

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Mrs Whiggins

Mrs Whiggins 13049

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3 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

I cannae see the article due to my limit, but I would add Pompeo to that list. He's been shuttling to and fro a lot lately. He was there in September and has been going since his first trip in 2017. He's been "deeply concerned" over the tensions, the money laundering (Cyprus he said, but conveniently ignores Trump's ties to Turkey), and so on. Some high level self-pardoning going on here.

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Bookman

Bookman 4611

Posted
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4 minutes ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

I cannae see the article due to my limit, but I would add Pompeo to that list. He's been shuttling to and fro a lot lately. He was there in September and has been going since his first trip in 2017. He's been "deeply concerned" over the tensions, the money laundering (Cyprus he said, but conveniently ignores Trump's ties to Turkey), and so on. Some high level self-pardoning going on here.

Get a subscription! It’s worth it.

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Mrs Whiggins

Mrs Whiggins 13049

Posted
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10 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

was waiting for this.  fool me once...

 

ElfqUlAXYAIejQe?format=jpg&name=small


 

Well, Nebraska is just having themselves a week now aren't they? Trump campaign shows up late, freezes their supporters, and strands a bunch of old folks in the cold. The big game that UNL pitched such a fit about several months ago is now cancelled due to positive cases on the Wisconsin team since Wisconsin is a hotspot and Douglas county is already experiencing a rise in their COVID cases before all the Trump people showed up to sing. There is no place like Nebraska.

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Bozo_Casanova

Bozo_Casanova 26309

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8 hours ago, Mdhorn said:

By definition--conservative.  

Have a friend that was a corporate attorney, oftentimes defending these types of corporations.  If the fine was less less than the gain, that was the cost of doing business.  If I do something bad and make 12 million dollars but only have to pay a 3 million dollar fine, then it was worth the fine and is worth repeating.  That is pure capitalism. Now imagine that this involves your water, air, and food and 12 million is pocket change.  But hey, their investors made a lot of money so it justifies the damage, right?      

No. And this is a tangent but it’s important.

 

That 9 million dollars is called an externality. It’s the cost of a private transaction borne by those who aren’t a party to the exchange of value. Socialized, in other words. 
The reason why the greatest environmental disasters in history have occurred under either socialist regimes is that if the everyone has equity in everything there’s no such thing as externalities cost. but I digress. 
The point here is that owning the means of production includes incurring the full cost. If the legal regime permits large scale externalized cost or artificial price caps are imposed (as in med mal caps) that’s not capitalism, period. It’s either socialism or kleptocracy. 
 

 

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Hiphopopotamos

Hiphopopotamos 20865

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3 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

The amount of corruption is staggering. How the fuck does Barr not get charges after this election?

There are going to be way too many people who are going to call for 'unity' and 'healing' and who will want to put this dark chapter behind us and 'help move the country forward'.

Fuck that.

They need to start hauling these assholes up in front of the Senate - and then they need to start bringing charges.  They need to make the Benghazi hearing look tame by comparison.  Every single one of these assholes need to be held accountable for the corruption and the human rights abuses.

They need to make an example of Barr so that no future AG gets the idea that he can act as the president's personal attorney.

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Your Mom

Your Mom 4797

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41 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

was waiting for this.  fool me once...

 

ElfqUlAXYAIejQe?format=jpg&name=small


 

“and they kept singing YMCA.”

Of course they did. This right here validates my vote. Any group of people that sings YMCA public gatherings is not a group of people I need to be aligned with.

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Mdhorn

Mdhorn 5912

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7 minutes ago, Hiphopopotamos said:

There are going to be way too many people who are going to call for 'unity' and 'healing' and who will want to put this dark chapter behind us and 'help move the country forward'.

Fuck that.

They need to start hauling these assholes up in front of the Senate - and then they need to start bringing charges.  They need to make the Benghazi hearing look tame by comparison.  Every single one of these assholes need to be held accountable for the corruption and the human rights abuses.

They need to make an example of Barr so that no future AG gets the idea that he can act as the president's personal attorney.

Well, like many others, Benghazi was a Trumped up claim whereas these are real crimes.  

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Francisco 2.0

Francisco 2.0 32347

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https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/10/28/is-president-donald-trump-a-flight-risk-433313?cid=apn

 

Quote

He said it.

Earlier this month, at a campaign rally in Macon, Georgia, President Donald Trump mused aloud to the crowd about what he might do if he loses the election on November 3. “Maybe I'll have to leave the country, I don’t know,” Trump said.

Was the statement merely a sour-grapes throwaway line by a cantankerous candidate facing potential defeat? Or was it a signal that Trump might actually abandon—some would say flee—our shores and seek refuge elsewhere if he is routed by a Joe Biden victory?

 

Quote

During my long military intelligence career I spent countless hours with my peers working on diverse “What if … ?” contingency scenarios in complex locales such as the Balkans and Afghanistan. In these intensely personal environments, where clan or tribal loyalty is paramount, local and regional leaders, often with links to organized criminal activities and enabling transnational networks, could be dangerously unpredictable. Judging from the array of personality traits gleaned from these and numerous other experiences, and correlating them to his current circumstances, to me Trump appears to be a classic flight risk.

 

Quote

Setting aside for the moment his conduct as president, Trump faces a financial and legal reckoning of immense proportions as soon as he leaves office. If he loses, he will no longer have protection from an avalanche of charges and lawsuits against him, his family and the Trump Organization. His years of alleged tax evasion will be officially scrutinized—and far more publicly than before he held office. He will no longer be able to claim (falsely) that his taxes are still “under audit” and unavailable. Trump properties and investments could be frozen, seized or plummet in value. The true nature of his extraordinary personal financial debt—recently reported as $421 million—will be exposed, and his likely foreign creditors revealed. Surely adding to his worries was the announcement on October 15 by the Internal Revenue Service that it is indicting Robert Brockman, a wealthy Houston software magnate, in its largest tax-fraud case ever. The action against Brockman shows that the IRS is not afraid to go after big fish who attempt to circumvent their tax obligations.

 

Spoiler

Personality and longstanding habits are key factors in assessing a subject’s likely future behavior and choices. Even the most casual observer knows that Donald Trump is heavily invested in his self-image as a successful businessman and wheeler-dealer. He takes pride in flouting norms, finding loopholes and playing fast and loose with laws and the truth. If his private financial house of cards is put on harsh public display in high-stakes government and state-level litigation, the aura of celebrity and success that Trump has cultivated for decades is not likely to survive intact. There is nothing in this president’s demeanor, past or present, to suggest that he has the fortitude or integrity to face auditors, prosecutors, or anyone else who challenges him, particularly if the outcome is likely to involve public humiliation and loss of assets, prestige and power. The option of salvaging what he can by relocating to a jurisdiction beyond the reach of U.S. laws would not be a stretch for someone who has long been openly disdainful of our tax and legal systems.

While it is rare among leaders of developed democracies, during the past 50 years we’ve seen a number of high-profile flights by national leaders facing major legal, political or societal problems at home, These include Bolivian president Evo Morales, who fled to Mexico just last year; Ukraine’s Viktor Yanukovych, who fled to Russia in 2014; and Ferdinand Marcos from the Philippines in 1986. All three fled in the wake of contentious elections, either after being ousted by voters or toppled by sustained protests. At the moment nothing suggests that Trump faces the unlikely prospect of being chased out of the country. But it’s no stretch to point out the parallel, either: They were all unorthodox strongman leaders who abused their offices, and simply didn’t see a way to stay comfortably in their countries once they’d lost power.

In the U.S., Trump might be familiar with some of the high-rolling financial fraudsters who decamped from the U.S. as the law was closing in. Among the most notorious was Robert Vesco, who successfully evaded justice by fleeing in a corporate jet in 1973 and remained out of reach until his death decades later. Less fortunate were Richard Allen Stanford, 2009, and Martin Frankel, 1999. Both tried to escape the U.S. by leasing private jets. Stanford was captured before he could finalize arrangements; Frankel made it as far as Germany but was later extradited to the U.S. for a long jail term.

If Trump were to lose the election and opt to slip away, where, when, and how might such a scenario play out? The “where” is straightforward: His most logical move would be to negotiate asylum somewhere from which extradition would be difficult. Doing so would allow him to temporarily escape U.S. jurisdiction and law, although he would also become in essence a hostage, a gilded trophy of sorts. After first fleeing to Costa Rica in 1973, Vesco made his home in Antigua, Nicaragua and Cuba, whose governments were not inclined to cooperate with U.S. authorities. And Edward Snowden, the disgruntled Booz Allen contractor turned whistleblower, has been living in Russia, under the protection (and eye) of the Putin regime, after fleeing the U.S. in 2013 with a treasure trove of classified information.

When and how Trump might exit the country are slightly more complex questions. If Trump is decisively trounced next week, one subset of possibilities emerges; if his defeat is a narrow one, another subset arises.

If Trump loses badly, it is conceivable he could plan a stealth departure sometime during the 11-week period before Inauguration Day, while he still has the protection of legal immunity as a sitting president. Leaving U.S. airspace before he resumes the status of private citizen at noon on January 20 would allow him to escape—or at least delay—dealing face-to-face with many creditors and lawsuits. Classic indicators of preparation for such a move would include fast sales of domestic properties and investments, and a quiet amassing of wealth offshore, out of reach of U.S. authorities. Trump’s family members and trusted corporate staff would likely be heavily involved in orchestrating the relocation.

A chilling alternative, however fanciful, could arise if Trump flees abroad after losing a close, viciously contested election. Hunkered down in a foreign country willing to provide sanctuary, he could conceivably style himself a “president in exile” and incite his die-hard American followers to resist the election results. A degree of domestic upheaval and dangerous division would linger for an extended period until the new administration is able to foster calm and unity.

How might this happen? What methods might a sitting U.S. president use to leave the country on a one-way journey? The choice could be as brazen as not reboarding Air Force One while out of the country at a conference or summit. Cases abound of athletes and artists escaping repressive regimes by refusing to reboard official aircraft and instead negotiating asylum. While on U.S. shores, Trump could find a creative way to slip his Secret Service detail and fly away in a friend’s private jet or foreign aircraft. Sailing away into international waters would also be a plausible option. In 2019, fugitive U.S. computer-security software magnate John McAfee used his yacht to elude the IRS and Securities and Exchange Commission for months until he was arrested in Spain on October 6, 2020. Steve Bannon made news last August when the Coast Guard arrested him while on a foreign yacht off Connecticut.

If all this sounds like a B-grade spy novel, it should. The flight of a U.S. president would be unprecedented, unsettling and profoundly disappointing. As a minimum, a presidential defection would temporarily absorb the resources and attention of a wide range of U.S. defense, intelligence and law enforcement agencies. In more than two centuries of peaceful transfers of presidential power, nothing remotely conceivable like it has ever happened.

I fervently hope we won’t face such a disturbing turn of events. But if there is anything to learn with this president, it is to expect the unexpected. As his unabashed admiration of authoritarian world leaders has shown us these past four chaotic years, Donald Trump values autocrats over democratic government, and places his self-interest well above the sacred trust he was elected to protect and uphold four years ago.

 

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Mrs Whiggins

Mrs Whiggins 13049

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4 minutes ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/10/28/is-president-donald-trump-a-flight-risk-433313?cid=apn

 

 

 

 

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Personality and longstanding habits are key factors in assessing a subject’s likely future behavior and choices. Even the most casual observer knows that Donald Trump is heavily invested in his self-image as a successful businessman and wheeler-dealer. He takes pride in flouting norms, finding loopholes and playing fast and loose with laws and the truth. If his private financial house of cards is put on harsh public display in high-stakes government and state-level litigation, the aura of celebrity and success that Trump has cultivated for decades is not likely to survive intact. There is nothing in this president’s demeanor, past or present, to suggest that he has the fortitude or integrity to face auditors, prosecutors, or anyone else who challenges him, particularly if the outcome is likely to involve public humiliation and loss of assets, prestige and power. The option of salvaging what he can by relocating to a jurisdiction beyond the reach of U.S. laws would not be a stretch for someone who has long been openly disdainful of our tax and legal systems.

While it is rare among leaders of developed democracies, during the past 50 years we’ve seen a number of high-profile flights by national leaders facing major legal, political or societal problems at home, These include Bolivian president Evo Morales, who fled to Mexico just last year; Ukraine’s Viktor Yanukovych, who fled to Russia in 2014; and Ferdinand Marcos from the Philippines in 1986. All three fled in the wake of contentious elections, either after being ousted by voters or toppled by sustained protests. At the moment nothing suggests that Trump faces the unlikely prospect of being chased out of the country. But it’s no stretch to point out the parallel, either: They were all unorthodox strongman leaders who abused their offices, and simply didn’t see a way to stay comfortably in their countries once they’d lost power.

In the U.S., Trump might be familiar with some of the high-rolling financial fraudsters who decamped from the U.S. as the law was closing in. Among the most notorious was Robert Vesco, who successfully evaded justice by fleeing in a corporate jet in 1973 and remained out of reach until his death decades later. Less fortunate were Richard Allen Stanford, 2009, and Martin Frankel, 1999. Both tried to escape the U.S. by leasing private jets. Stanford was captured before he could finalize arrangements; Frankel made it as far as Germany but was later extradited to the U.S. for a long jail term.

If Trump were to lose the election and opt to slip away, where, when, and how might such a scenario play out? The “where” is straightforward: His most logical move would be to negotiate asylum somewhere from which extradition would be difficult. Doing so would allow him to temporarily escape U.S. jurisdiction and law, although he would also become in essence a hostage, a gilded trophy of sorts. After first fleeing to Costa Rica in 1973, Vesco made his home in Antigua, Nicaragua and Cuba, whose governments were not inclined to cooperate with U.S. authorities. And Edward Snowden, the disgruntled Booz Allen contractor turned whistleblower, has been living in Russia, under the protection (and eye) of the Putin regime, after fleeing the U.S. in 2013 with a treasure trove of classified information.

When and how Trump might exit the country are slightly more complex questions. If Trump is decisively trounced next week, one subset of possibilities emerges; if his defeat is a narrow one, another subset arises.

If Trump loses badly, it is conceivable he could plan a stealth departure sometime during the 11-week period before Inauguration Day, while he still has the protection of legal immunity as a sitting president. Leaving U.S. airspace before he resumes the status of private citizen at noon on January 20 would allow him to escape—or at least delay—dealing face-to-face with many creditors and lawsuits. Classic indicators of preparation for such a move would include fast sales of domestic properties and investments, and a quiet amassing of wealth offshore, out of reach of U.S. authorities. Trump’s family members and trusted corporate staff would likely be heavily involved in orchestrating the relocation.

A chilling alternative, however fanciful, could arise if Trump flees abroad after losing a close, viciously contested election. Hunkered down in a foreign country willing to provide sanctuary, he could conceivably style himself a “president in exile” and incite his die-hard American followers to resist the election results. A degree of domestic upheaval and dangerous division would linger for an extended period until the new administration is able to foster calm and unity.

How might this happen? What methods might a sitting U.S. president use to leave the country on a one-way journey? The choice could be as brazen as not reboarding Air Force One while out of the country at a conference or summit. Cases abound of athletes and artists escaping repressive regimes by refusing to reboard official aircraft and instead negotiating asylum. While on U.S. shores, Trump could find a creative way to slip his Secret Service detail and fly away in a friend’s private jet or foreign aircraft. Sailing away into international waters would also be a plausible option. In 2019, fugitive U.S. computer-security software magnate John McAfee used his yacht to elude the IRS and Securities and Exchange Commission for months until he was arrested in Spain on October 6, 2020. Steve Bannon made news last August when the Coast Guard arrested him while on a foreign yacht off Connecticut.

If all this sounds like a B-grade spy novel, it should. The flight of a U.S. president would be unprecedented, unsettling and profoundly disappointing. As a minimum, a presidential defection would temporarily absorb the resources and attention of a wide range of U.S. defense, intelligence and law enforcement agencies. In more than two centuries of peaceful transfers of presidential power, nothing remotely conceivable like it has ever happened.

I fervently hope we won’t face such a disturbing turn of events. But if there is anything to learn with this president, it is to expect the unexpected. As his unabashed admiration of authoritarian world leaders has shown us these past four chaotic years, Donald Trump values autocrats over democratic government, and places his self-interest well above the sacred trust he was elected to protect and uphold four years ago.

 

While I thank you in providing this article, I am not happy that I just read it. Wow, that was, ugh. Plausible but sad to think about. Damn.

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Snake Diggity

Snake Diggity 4614

Posted
Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, tx 3 putt said:


im really don’t know how anyone with a half a brain support this idiot 

I know a lot of people with half a brain that support him.  But that’s all you can have.  Half.  You cannot be introspective and support Trump. You cannot have a broad worldview and support Trump.  You cannot be an empathetic person and support Trump.  


I know a lot of generally good-hearted, educated, capable people who voted for and even actively support Trump.  But it takes a pretty narrow combination of factors.  Working in oil and gas.  Being surrounded by uneducated rural whites.  Being raised with abortion as the overriding  issue that determines your vote.  Having inherited a lot of money.

If Trumpism isn’t defeated, we’re fucked. But if it is defeated, this country is going to need to be able to forgive, and forgiving people who aren’t contrite is really hard.  That will be easier with an overwhelming rebuke of Trumpism that convinces Trumpers that ideology truly is dead, but either way, we need to somehow manage constructive rehabilitation.

 

ETA: Im talking about his base, not the leaders.  Trump and his minions should be in a fucking gulag.  And I’m also not saying we should forget and not punish at all.  I just think the end goal should be unity.

Edited by Snake Diggity
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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 104688

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Posted
42 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

No. And this is a tangent but it’s important.

 

That 9 million dollars is called an externality. It’s the cost of a private transaction borne by those who aren’t a party to the exchange of value. Socialized, in other words. 
The reason why the greatest environmental disasters in history have occurred under either socialist regimes is that if the everyone has equity in everything there’s no such thing as externalities cost. but I digress. 
The point here is that owning the means of production includes incurring the full cost. If the legal regime permits large scale externalized cost or artificial price caps are imposed (as in med mal caps) that’s not capitalism, period. It’s either socialism or kleptocracy. 
 

 

tenor.gif

If you push the costs of an activity of a few onto the society of a whole.....that's squarely within the definition of socialism.  You are literally socializing costs.

If you let a private enterprise impose those costs on society, and keep the profits they made/money they saved by imposing those costs on the public, that's kleptocracy.

When you then apply it to the Trump GOP model, and you realize that they have managed to create a perfect toxic stew of socialized costs, kleptocratic gains, and fascist systems of order to keep that train going, well, you oughta puke.

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