Formerly DT: COVID-19 - Featuring Lots of Politics, now CR because political talk not going away

[Degenerate Gardner 4085]

 

 

[Beau Vine 54471]

19 minutes ago, Caver60 said:

We closed down Natural Bridge Caverns yesterday. Laid off 20 seasonal employees we just hired to help out with the spring school group season, too. We are going to pay full-timers as long as we can, and we plan on getting some projects around the park done over the next couple of weeks. We are set up pretty well financially but nothing will last forever.

My daughter is a high school senior who is starting to realize that her senior year might be over. I don't have the heart to confirm that. With everything going on and the benefit of some age under my belt, I know that not having prom is not really a big deal. But for her, no prom, no graduation ceremony or party, no more soccer, no soccer playoffs, no chance to say goodbye to teachers and friends... it's gonna be a lot. Time for her and my son to gain some perspective on things, I suppose.

When Wimberley flooded a few years back right near the end of school,  they basically cancelled the rest of the year, but had one "official school day," just to let the kids come back and see each other and the teachers.  It was reportedly the best day of school ever.

Edited March 17, 2020 by Beau Vine
,/.

[C-Man 27286]

5 minutes ago, Degenerate Gardner said:

 

 

[Dbeasy 15135]

We can't shut everything down forever. Deaths and overcrowded hospitals or not, at some point we have to ensure the economy doesn't go past a point of no return. 

Correct. What’s happening right now is a best attempt to minimize the impact of the disease but there will be a point in the future, in the next 8-12 weeks, when everyone will possibly give up on containment and just roll with the deaths and swamping of hospitals.

[Surly Bevo 25226]

I think that what we will see is that certain areas get hit really hard fast and deep and others not so much. Where you are in this country from latitude to temperature to pop density to age demos etc etc etc all might end up playing a big part in how long you experience this. The US is unlikely to have a monolithic start and stop to all this. Just too big and too many people.

 

Hell even things like ski season for Colorado and Mardi Gras season in Louisiana at the time this was all taking hold may have impact as to why those two places are getting hit a little harder relative to some of those immediately around them.

[C-Man 27286]

My cousin just posted on FB that they're now to shelter-in-place. They're outside NYC in Darien (CT).

[triplehorn 2664]

4 minutes ago, NoName said:

It is all but impossible to have any evidence-based best practices, no matter how many hospitalizations, in 6 weeks. 

Results sharing is extremely difficult across even county borders, much less state and international. 

I don't think we have a good chance of having any kind of solid protocols set up almost entirely in part due to the fact that the healthcare system is likely to be very close to capacity or over capacity in the next 6 weeks. Makes it very difficult to focus on tracking things and documenting results instead of focusing on keeping patients alive or focusing on keeping your PPE in place and not catching the virus. 

 

I’m not talking evidence based, ie controlled studies.  It will involve recording data and searching for correlations and using week to week shared observations of treatments and outcomes as a guide.
 

A number of clinical papers are now emerging from China that we should be looking at closely.  After their coronavirus blizzard in Jan/Feb they now have some valuable information coming out.  Realize also that even though their rate of new cases dropped in early Feb, they have still been stuck managing 10’s thousands of unrecovered patients over the last month.  So the learning curve is still steep right now even for China.

[Message Board User 12396]

 

[Modessit 5607]

Am I behind or are you guys

2 of the new cases in Dallas are critical care, a 20 and 30 something with no previous underlying issues.

I wish people would quit using that reasoning. Just because the younger folks didn't have asthma or lung cancer or whatever previously doesn't mean that they weren't vaping illegal THC pods or licking toilet seats for likes. There are other factors besides health history that can cause susceptibility.

[Skipper 6210]

10 minutes ago, NoName said:

It is all but impossible to have any evidence-based best practices, no matter how many hospitalizations, in 6 weeks. 

Results sharing is extremely difficult across even county borders, much less state and international. 

I don't think we have a good chance of having any kind of solid protocols set up almost entirely in part due to the fact that the healthcare system is likely to be very close to capacity or over capacity in the next 6 weeks. Makes it very difficult to focus on tracking things and documenting results instead of focusing on keeping patients alive or focusing on keeping your PPE in place and not catching the virus. 

 

There are already several existing drugs that appear to have potential.  I think you underestimate the power of the smartest people in the world working on this and sharing data (which is evident if you go down a rabbit hole on twitter and see all the discussions among various specialists in the weeds on this).   I don't think anyone anticipates a cure in the short term but driving CFR down over time, if we can keep infrastructure from collapsing, seems like a realistic goal.

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13121]

No need to worry guys, just like the flu.

[Message Board User 12396]

 

[Penelope 416]

15 minutes ago, Bevo said:

For good?

No but I don’t know when I will reopen

[Modessit 5607]

Btw - I know STAAR has been canceled and schools are closed for the next 3 weeks, but assuming they don't go back before summer break will they waive the requirement of 180 days of school (or whatever the minute requirement is with the latest rules) and just end the school year and start again in August? And how will that affect the federal funding based on attendance?

[Beau Vine 54471]

5 minutes ago, Casual Encounter said:

No need to worry guys, just like the flu.

I literally saw someone on Facebook just now who said it's like the flu, except it has caused fewer deaths.

[clapclapclap 9000]

7 minutes ago, C-Man said:

My cousin just posted on FB that they're now to shelter-in-place. They're outside NYC in Darien (CT).

I'm guessing that shelter in place orders are going too far, and will quickly backfire.  If you can't go out even for food and meds, those who didn't stockpile will quickly get restless/panic.  If we get violence, S-I-P zones will probably be the first areas.

[Pancho 45118]

2 minutes ago, Modessit said:

Btw - I know STAAR has been canceled and schools are closed for the next 3 weeks, but assuming they don't go back before summer break will they waive the requirement of 180 days of school (or whatever the minute requirement is with the latest rules) and just end the school year and start again in August? And how will that affect the federal funding based on attendance?

To your first question--probably yes. 

To the funding issue?  DeVos is in charge so ain't no telling. 

[Captainant 27862]

Just now, clapclapclap said:

I'm guessing that shelter in place orders are going too far, and will quickly backfire.  If you can't go out even for food and meds, those who didn't stockpile will quickly get restless/panic.  If we get violence, S-I-P zones will probably be the first areas.

Shelter in place doesn't mean don't ever leave your home. It means don't go outside for non-essential activities. Hell, gov Cuomo specifically made that distinction this morning during his presser.

The idea isn't to completely remove social interaction, it's to drastically reduce it wherever possible to help slow the spread and flatten the curve.

[NoName 16416]

13 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

I’m not talking evidence based, ie controlled studies.  It will involve recording data and searching for correlations and using week to week shared observations of treatments and outcomes as a guide.
 

A number of clinical papers are now emerging from China that we should be looking at closely.  After their coronavirus blizzard in Jan/Feb they now have some valuable information coming out.  Realize also that even though their rate of new cases dropped in early Feb, they have still been stuck managing 10’s thousands of unrecovered patients over the last month.  So the learning curve is still steep right now even for China.

I think you are drastically underrating how overwhelmed clinicians and facilities are going to be over the next 6 weeks (and longer)

I agree re: looking at clinical papers for a data but even then that isn't anywhere close to a protocol or best practice.

[Surly Bevo 25226]

I wish people would quit using that reasoning. Just because the younger folks didn't have asthma or lung cancer or whatever previously doesn't mean that they weren't vaping illegal THC pods or licking toilet seats for likes. There are other factors besides health history that can cause susceptibility.

Factors like young people die from a lot of things. Like the 3K 18-49 year olds last year that died from the flu (note I am not comparing the two just pointing out that even something like that will fuck up some young folks)

[SHOOTER12 8836]

57 minutes ago, Penelope said:

I closed my bar yesterday. Moved my inventory today, and boarded up my windows. Now I’m fighting with my ex because he believes we should stay open as long as possible. And that I’m overreacting and jumping the gun. He’s an Aggie so… 

 

56 minutes ago, tx 3 putt said:

Damn, best of luck through all that 

Open a bar they said... It'll be fun they said....

Aren't friends just freaking great?

[triplehorn 2664]

Spain 100 ---> 10,000 in 2 weeks.  If we were at about 4000-5000 over last 48 hours when we started piecemeal shutdowns, ----> likely minimum 500,000  2 weeks from now, ~50k hospitalized. US has 46k ICU beds total.

[Zepol87 9198]

8 minutes ago, Beau Vine said:

I literally saw someone on Facebook just now who said it's like the flu, except it has caused fewer deaths.

You're friends with Vic Mackey also?

[Penelope 416]

Just got off the phone with my ex. Complete 180 from this morning. I guess he finally understands the seriousness of the situation. 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8823]

Spain 100 ---> 10,000 in 2 weeks.  If we were at about 4000-5000 over last 48 hours when we started piecemeal shutdowns, ----> likely minimum 500,000  2 weeks from now, ~50k hospitalized. US has 46k ICU beds total.

Hopefully having almost 2 weeks of living like hermits with little social life can help with that

[MAUFRAIS 6657]

Remember that espn reporter who died?

I wonder if he had this?

[MAUFRAIS 6657]

Remember that espn reporter who died?

I wonder if he had this?

[achooloco 1086]

8 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Shelter in place doesn't mean don't ever leave your home. It means don't go outside for non-essential activities. Hell, gov Cuomo specifically made that distinction this morning during his presser.

The idea isn't to completely remove social interaction, it's to drastically reduce it wherever possible to help slow the spread and flatten the curve.

Serious question, so i'm good if i walk the dog for an hour twice a day but remain away from folk and just mind my own business? Go on a run alone on less populated side streets? Outside of those two things and grocery store runs, i've been S-I-P since thursday. Since gyms and bars are closed but liquor stores are open, i'm a little confused on what the guidelines are/is allowed.

[ChiTownDoc 21175]

2 minutes ago, MAUFRAIS said:

Remember that espn reporter who died?

I wonder if he had this?

No, they found he had non Hodgkin's lymphoma on autopsy. 

Edited March 17, 2020 by ChiTownDoc

[achooloco 1086]

2 minutes ago, MAUFRAIS said:

Remember that espn reporter who died?

I wonder if he had this?

nevermind, already answered

Edited March 17, 2020 by achooloco

[Foosters 17889]

20 minutes ago, Modessit said:

41 minutes ago, bluto said:

Am I behind or are you guys

2 of the new cases in Dallas are critical care, a 20 and 30 something with no previous underlying issues.

 Just because the younger folks didn't have asthma or lung cancer or whatever previously doesn't mean that they weren't vaping illegal THC pods or licking toilet seats for likes.

[triplehorn 2664]

19 minutes ago, NoName said:

I think you are drastically underrating how overwhelmed clinicians and facilities are going to be over the next 6 weeks (and longer)

I agree re: looking at clinical papers for a data but even then that isn't anywhere close to a protocol or best practice.

I'm an optimist even when it's beyond shitty.  You push hard and find the best solutions even when you know there are limits to what you can do.  You can't necessarily anticipate when you do strike a surprise breakthrough.

For example, right now re chloroquine phosphate and hydroxychloroquine, I think a regimen of prophylactic use or immediate use upon a positive test before severe complications arise could be a major boost to mitigation hiding in plain sight.  Most of the Chinese, SoKo, and Italian reports related to initiating it after people have complicated pneumonia.

And if by chance we find there's an application in that context, we direct available supplies first to our health care providers on the front line for them to take.

 

Edited March 17, 2020 by triplehorn

[NoName 16416]

23 minutes ago, Skipper said:

There are already several existing drugs that appear to have potential.  I think you underestimate the power of the smartest people in the world working on this and sharing data (which is evident if you go down a rabbit hole on twitter and see all the discussions among various specialists in the weeds on this).   I don't think anyone anticipates a cure in the short term but driving CFR down over time, if we can keep infrastructure from collapsing, seems like a realistic goal.

Over time? sure - I agree 100% on this. 

Over the next 6 weeks? highly doubtful in my opinion.

I think that longer term this happens, but in the next 6-8 weeks I really don't think it does.

I would love to be wrong here...

Edited March 17, 2020 by NoName

[clapclapclap 9000]

1 minute ago, MAUFRAIS said:

Remember that espn reporter who died?

I wonder if he had this?

Naw, he went to the emergency room Dec. 1st.  Turns out he had undiagnosed cancer, too.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2020/01/16/espns-edward-aschoff-had-an-aggressive-cancer-when-he-died-his-fiancee-reveals/

Jan. 16, 2020 at 7:59 a.m. CST

An aggressive form of cancer was discovered shortly after ESPN reporter Edward Aschoff died on Christmas Eve, his fiancee revealed Wednesday, clearing up part of the mystery of why a seemingly healthy young man died on his 34th birthday.

Aschoff’s death initially was attributed to hemophagocytic lymphohistiocytosis (HLH) and multifocal pneumonia, but Katy Berteau tweeted Wednesday that the results of a lung biopsy, delivered after his death, showed that he was terminally ill.

“Unbeknownst to us, Edward had stage 4, non-Hodgkin’s lymphoma in his lungs,” she wrote in what she said would be the last message from Aschoff’s Twitter account. “This is an aggressive type of cancer that is usually undetectable until it is very advanced.”...

[gecko 1104]

Double post

[Updawg 2286]

Serious question, so i'm good if i walk the dog for an hour twice a day but remain away from folk and just mind my own business? Go on a run alone on less populated side streets? Outside of those two things and grocery store runs, i've been S-I-P since thursday. Since gyms and bars are closed but liquor stores are open, i'm a little confused on what the guidelines are/is allowed.

Yep. I've noticed a lot more families getting out in the evening s in my hood lately. A lot more dog walks are happening. Dogs might end up living this

[Beau Vine 54471]

9 minutes ago, MAUFRAIS said:

Remember that espn reporter who died?

I wonder if he had this?

I think the cancer was probably plenty: https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2020/01/16/espns-edward-aschoff-had-an-aggressive-cancer-when-he-died-his-fiancee-reveals/

[BradInATX 9208]

There are at least ten presumed cases in a hospital in Austin. I'm not going to say much more than that. But it's about to hit the fan here. 

Edited March 17, 2020 by BradInATX

[closetojumping 62898]

 

 

 

1 hour ago, clapclapclap said:

A bit about me: I’m a generally healthy, 44-year-old male, 153 lbs. (surely less now), 5’7”, no drugs , rarely drink, no health conditions other than exercise-induced asthma, which I manage with an inhaler. #COVID19 #coronavirus #LatsCovid19Journal

 

I completed the NYC Marathon twice - not the greatest times, but I did - and even now that I can’t run much (knees post-40), each week I still walk 25 miles and go to at least 3 high-intensity interval training classes at the gym. #LatsCovid19Journal #COVID19

 

In my current state, #LivingWithCovid, I am constantly weak and winded. I’m hooked up to oxygen 24/7. Even with oxygen, the simplest tasks are extremely difficult. #LatsCovid19Journal

 

This morning, this ex-marathoner could barely walk the five feet from the bed to the toilet - and I had to pee as quickly as possible, chest heaving with the labor of breathing, because I was going to collapse if I stood too long. #LatsCovid19Journal #covid19

 

I’m usually a fast eater (bad habit, I know). Today it took my 90 minutes to eat my lunch - because I kept getting winded. Who DOES that? I’m so weak, the fork wobbled each time I lifted it to my mouth. #LatsCovid19Journal #COVID19 #CoronavirusOutbreak

 

To be sure, #COVID19 hits different people differently #ymmv. I gave it to my husband, and for him it was a low-level flu that seems to have almost run its course after about a week. #coronavirus #CoronavirusOutbreak #LatsCovid19Journal

 

But for those who get severe cases, like me, it’s been hell. I’ve had 10 days & counting, with no real improvement, of fever, fatigue, joint aches, chills, cough, respiratory difficulty. I have never been this sick in my entire life. #LatsCovid19Journal

 

To paraphrase

@Beyonce

, #COVID19 did not come to play with us hoes; it came to slay. Please keep me - and my very anxious family - in your thoughts and prayers. Thank you. #LatsCovid19Journal #CoronaVirusUpdates #Coronavirusnyc

 

No underlying conditiojns, except fucking asthma. I'm sorry, but that's not an "oh by the way" issue as it pertains to this.

 

47 minutes ago, Jiggy-Z said:

no health conditions other than exercise-induced asthma, which I manage with an inhaler.

 

But then again:

 

NEW: Three of Dallas County’s new confirmed #Covid19 cases are currently hospitalized in critical condition. And two of those are young: one in their 20’s, another in their 30’s. The third critical patient is in their 60’s. No underlying health conditions. #WFAA #Coronavirus

 

411

2:43 PM - Mar 17, 2020

 

28 minutes ago, Modessit said:

49 minutes ago, bluto said:

Am I behind or are you guys

2 of the new cases in Dallas are critical care, a 20 and 30 something with no previous underlying issues.

I wish people would quit using that reasoning. Just because the younger folks didn't have asthma or lung cancer or whatever previously doesn't mean that they weren't vaping illegal THC pods or licking toilet seats for likes. There are other factors besides health history that can cause susceptibility.

No shit. There have been startlingly few deaths around the globe for people below 50, and most of them have had some sort of underlying issue. But hey, maybe fucking Dallas is going to roll out the first outliers to blow the numbers up. I'm also sure that forgetting to discuss their scorching meth habit or coke problem, or just a little jogging asthma didn't matter at all. 

 

[Loco 3754]

Well this is cool... Florida school year do overs.   I have no idea how this will work.  uncharted waters

 

[berlinerbaer 678]

11 minutes ago, achooloco said:

Serious question, so i'm good if i walk the dog for an hour twice a day but remain away from folk and just mind my own business? Go on a run alone on less populated side streets? Outside of those two things and grocery store runs, i've been S-I-P since thursday. Since gyms and bars are closed but liquor stores are open, i'm a little confused on what the guidelines are/is allowed.

Yes, you'll be fine. The virus is not truly airborne. As long as you stay 6 feet away from an infected person, your risk of contracting Covid is minimal.

Even day trips to places that don't involve being confined with other people are okay.

[F250 28830]

1 hour ago, bolverk said:

Anyone else wonder whether they should've delayed the demolition of Brackenridge in light of the need for hospital space or is it a totally unusable building right now?

https://www.kvue.com/article/news/local/umc-brackenridge-tower-demolition-begins-austin/269-19b5aa69-cc12-46b5-99ee-51272592758d

Last I saw, the place was overrun with Zombies in season four of FTWD.

 

 

[Pancho 45118]

damn, now KD!

 

[Brisketexan 105465]

Sigh.  Talked to the daughter again.  As her friends peel away and head home, she's really feeling the anxiety/uncertainty, and now loneliness in Montreal.  She wants to come home.  She has things to get done -- packing up her stuff and getting it to their apartment for storage, etc.  So she's thinking of departing on Monday.  On the plus side, flights are absurdly cheap, so, yeah.

Suspect we'll be picking up a sad kiddo from the airport Monday night.  Dammit.  I mean, I'll be glad to be able to be protective dad, and have her here, but we were really hoping that she could make it work to stay up there.  I get it, and I understand how she feels.  Morale is just so damned low.  There's only one person left on her floor.  It's shitty.

Also, have a colleague whose daughter is studying in New Zealand.  New Zealand said GTFO by March 30th -- go home.  So, she's gotta head home, too.  She was loving it over there.

[Bevo 13606]

37 minutes ago, Penelope said:

No but I don’t know when I will reopen

I guess that means that if you don't board up the windows and doors, people will break in and steal everything?

[FondrenRoad 4378]

19 minutes ago, achooloco said:

Serious question, so i'm good if i walk the dog for an hour twice a day but remain away from folk and just mind my own business? Go on a run alone on less populated side streets? Outside of those two things and grocery store runs, i've been S-I-P since thursday. Since gyms and bars are closed but liquor stores are open, i'm a little confused on what the guidelines are/is allowed.

Liquor store workers are like the 3rd or 4th most essential workers. They come in just below firefighters, but above police. 

[Eastwood 4394]

3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Sigh.  Talked to the daughter again.  As her friends peel away and head home, she's really feeling the anxiety/uncertainty, and now loneliness in Montreal.  She wants to come home.  She has things to get done -- packing up her stuff and getting it to their apartment for storage, etc.  So she's thinking of departing on Monday.  On the plus side, flights are absurdly cheap, so, yeah.

Suspect we'll be picking up a sad kiddo from the airport Monday night.  Dammit.  I mean, I'll be glad to be able to be protective dad, and have her here, but we were really hoping that she could make it work to stay up there.  I get it, and I understand how she feels.  Morale is just so damned low.  There's only one person left on her floor.  It's shitty.

Also, have a colleague whose daughter is studying in New Zealand.  New Zealand said GTFO by March 30th -- go home.  So, she's gotta head home, too.  She was loving it over there.

Every generation has their life-altering event. We had 9/11. Let's hope this is her one and only.

[Jiggy-Z 3437]

7 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

 

 

 

No underlying conditiojns, except fucking asthma. I'm sorry, but that's not an "oh by the way" issue as it pertains to this.

 

 

No shit. There have been startlingly few deaths around the globe for people below 50, and most of them have had some sort of underlying issue. But hey, maybe fucking Dallas is going to roll out the first outliers to blow the numbers up. I'm also sure that forgetting to discuss their scorching meth habit or coke problem, or just a little jogging asthma didn't matter at all. 

 

We did have the 45 year old guy in Louisiana, too.  Surly sleuths sussed it out that he is possibly struggling with a weight problem (from pics) and  was treated with copious amounts of Ibuprofen initially- a possible no no.

[ztejas 43556]

5 minutes ago, Pancho said:

damn, now KD!

 

Lord take me instead.

[Bevo 13606]

9 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

 

 

 

No underlying conditiojns, except fucking asthma. I'm sorry, but that's not an "oh by the way" issue as it pertains to this.

 

 

The guy runs marathons so I doubt his exercise induced asthma is severe. I will get asthma when running in the cold but I could still kick your ass in the 40 and 100. And I wouldn't consider myself high risk with regard to the virus.