Formerly DT: COVID-19 - Featuring Lots of Politics, now CR because political talk not going away

[Dahobbs 18194]

1 hour ago, Wulaw Horn said:

I’m vaxed. I don’t care. If it’s really that much of a worry then let’s just not let anyone come in from overseas. Hell- let’s just not run airplanes at all anymore. Because that dude that just got off the plane from Bangladesh is going to an Uber, and then a hotel, then out to dinner and a movie and a rub and tug and he’s not wearing a mask to any of those places nor is anyone else. There’s nothing magical about an airplane that makes it worse than any restaurant or bar or theater out there and I don’t see anyone arguing wear masks there forever. 

For fucks sake- it’s stupid at some point in time very close to now. As stupid as taking my shoes and belt and whatever else passes for post 9/11 safety theater at the airport.  
 

Or, and hear me out here, maybe just have people wear masks. Seriously, what is the big deal? Do you fart in them before putting them on?

[Message Board User 12405]

 

[Cheeseweasel 26439]

Kabuki Theater

[Wulaw Horn 19561]

1 hour ago, Dahobbs said:

Or, and hear me out here, maybe just have people wear masks. Seriously, what is the big deal? Do you fart in them before putting them on?

It’s not good to force people to do pointless things. Whatever justification you have for masking on an airplane could apply everywhere in life. That’s not how this thing should work. 

[Captainant 28412]

Say, weren't yall super interested in how California is going a couple weeks ago? It looks like their masking and shutdown policies worked

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-04-26/california-lowest-coronavirus-case-rate-nation

California’s latest seven-day rate of new cases was 32.5 per 100,000 people, according to data from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

Over that same period, Hawaii had the second-lowest rate, at 36.8, and the nationwide rate was 114.7. California has for weeks reported one of the lowest case rates in the nation — though the top spot had remained largely out of reach.

[Anastasis 23703]

15 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Say, weren't yall super interested in how California is going a couple weeks ago? It looks like their masking and shutdown policies worked

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-04-26/california-lowest-coronavirus-case-rate-nation

California’s latest seven-day rate of new cases was 32.5 per 100,000 people, according to data from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

Over that same period, Hawaii had the second-lowest rate, at 36.8, and the nationwide rate was 114.7. California has for weeks reported one of the lowest case rates in the nation — though the top spot had remained largely out of reach.

How do you assess the impact of vaccine uptake on these outcomes vs. other measures?

[jimmyjazz 46985]

Any walk-up sites in the Austin area for Moderna #2?  My wife's appointment for yesterday at Dell Diamond got cancelled because of a drop of rain.

[GRHorn 105]

51 minutes ago, Message Board User said:

 

What a dipshit. 
 

So for the foreseeable future he’s going to wear masks around vaccinated people if they come within 6 feet?

#Science 

He knows you don’t need to do that, but he’s signaling to his followers to do it. Subtly making sure people stay in compliance. You can’t tell me it’s not about maintaining control. Normalizing it. So weird. 

Edited April 30, 2021 by GRHorn

[Captainant 28412]

2 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

How do you assess the impact of vaccine uptake on these outcomes vs. other measures?

I'm not sure the best way to control for vaccination rates but just doing a naive comparison against population % of fully vaccinated, CA is pretty much the middle of the pack at 29.9% (per the google dashboard's data). It's not a stretch to infer that they've got something else that's working for them besides just vaccines, especially once you compare against other states with a higher vaccination rate (31.7%) AND high case rate (206.4 per 100k) like Colorado .

[Cheeseweasel 26439]

12 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

How do you assess the impact of vaccine uptake on these outcomes vs. other measures?

[Newdoc 3508]

2 minutes ago, Captainant said:

I'm not sure the best way to control for vaccination rates but just doing a naive comparison against population % of fully vaccinated, CA is pretty much the middle of the pack at 29.9% (per the google dashboard's data). It's not a stretch to infer that they've got something else that's working for them besides just vaccines, especially once you compare against other states with a higher vaccination rate (31.7%) AND high case rate (206.4 per 100k) like Colorado .

Tons of variables but natural herd immunity due to early give no f&$@s likely plays a big role. We’re still not seeing significant reinefections from those who were positive in the first couple of waves last year. 

[We’reTexas 1477]

9 minutes ago, Captainant said:

I'm not sure the best way to control for vaccination rates but just doing a naive comparison against population % of fully vaccinated, CA is pretty much the middle of the pack at 29.9% (per the google dashboard's data). It's not a stretch to infer that they've got something else that's working for them besides just vaccines, especially once you compare against other states with a higher vaccination rate (31.7%) AND high case rate (206.4 per 100k) like Colorado .

The vaccine rollout here was a total disaster, though we have made huge strides since then. Note that the winter surge was in Southern California. In Northern California (ie, the Bay Area), rates have always been among the lowest in the nation, and I think it’s fair to attribute that to strict masking/social distancing protocols and universal compliance. 

[Baconboy 143]

41 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Say, weren't yall super interested in how California is going a couple weeks ago? It looks like their masking and shutdown policies worked

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-04-26/california-lowest-coronavirus-case-rate-nation

California’s latest seven-day rate of new cases was 32.5 per 100,000 people, according to data from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

Over that same period, Hawaii had the second-lowest rate, at 36.8, and the nationwide rate was 114.7. California has for weeks reported one of the lowest case rates in the nation — though the top spot had remained largely out of reach.

Per your own link to the CDC, it looks like Alabama is actually the lowest at 26.5 per 100,000. Let's all do what they're doing! I kid, I kid. Just pointing out there are a lot of variables in play. 

Edited April 30, 2021 by Baconboy

[Cheeseweasel 26439]

3 minutes ago, Baconboy said:

Alabama is actually the lowest

99 times out of 100, regardless of the metric.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8964]

Say, weren't yall super interested in how California is going a couple weeks ago? It looks like their masking and shutdown policies worked
https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-04-26/california-lowest-coronavirus-case-rate-nation

California’s latest seven-day rate of new cases was 32.5 per 100,000 people, according to data from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

Over that same period, Hawaii had the second-lowest rate, at 36.8, and the nationwide rate was 114.7. California has for weeks reported one of the lowest case rates in the nation — though the top spot had remained largely out of reach.

Doesn’t come without cost for Hawaii and California

https://www.bls.gov/web/laus/laumstrk.htm


Also the majority of their kids haven’t been in school at all

https://cai.burbio.com/school-opening-tracker/

[Cheeseweasel 26439]

BUT IT'S WORKED!

[Samson's Wig 3222]

23 minutes ago, Baconboy said:

Alabama is actually the lowest  

 

20 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

99 times out of 100, regardless of the metric.

 

Don't sleep on New Mexico.

[Cheeseweasel 26439]

13 minutes ago, Samson's Wig said:

Don't sleep on New Mexico.

Laughs in Mississippi

[gmr548 16681]

taking my shoes and belt and whatever else passes for post 9/11 safety theater at the airport.  
 

We’ve beaten and will continue to beat the dead horse of masks so I don’t have anything to say there, but do want to say 100 percent agree with fuck all this.

[workswithseed 2201]

3 hours ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Sorry for partying man. 

Out of the the tent straight to work 

[Johnny Sack 8397]

1 hour ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

Doesn’t come without cost for Hawaii and California

https://www.bls.gov/web/laus/laumstrk.htm


Also the majority of their kids haven’t been in school at all

https://cai.burbio.com/school-opening-tracker/

And they have the 5th worst unemployment rate in the country.

[babysdaddy 2731]

confirmation bias is a hell of a drug.  disregard every other example showing the logic behind my reasoning is a bag of shit.

Edited April 30, 2021 by babysdaddy
derp

[YChang 3533]

So... basically highlights and lowlights for Ca. Who woulda figured?

[Telegraph_it 3376]

 

[Cheeseweasel 26439]

Follow (some of) the science!

[phdhorn 6224]

7 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

Follow (some of) the science!

There needs to be a science of how to debunk the science.

[Cheeseweasel 26439]

2 minutes ago, phdhorn said:

There needs to be a science of how to debunk the science.

Sorry, man. All science is settled.

[dcar00 14907]

somebody is a xenophobe...

[Okie State 3888]

Just think how few cases we'd have if nobody ever left their home again. Could be a game changer.

[Guest Lobo]

I know a disaster scientist.  Is that anything?  

[Enchubben 5598]

1 hour ago, Cheeseweasel said:

Follow (some of) the science!

[Serak The Preparer 3482]

8 hours ago, Wulaw Horn said:

I think his point is “everyone that wants to be is” not everyone is. 
IOW fuck anyone who isn’t in about a month or two. 

I disagree with the month, but not the two. I just got my first shot last week, so I am five weeks out from the 2nd shot + 2 week "safety" period. Given that there are still people just now able to get their first shot, I think it is unfair to assume that anybody who wants to be vaccinated will be vaccinated for another 7-8 weeks. Nice thing is that ramps perfectly to July 4th. I think that becomes, at least unofficially, return to normal day for a lot of people.

[DDD Dad 14572]

4 hours ago, GRHorn said:

What a dipshit. 
 

So for the foreseeable future he’s going to wear masks around vaccinated people if they come within 6 feet?

#Science 

He knows you don’t need to do that, but he’s signaling to his followers to do it. Subtly making sure people stay in compliance. You can’t tell me it’s not about maintaining control. Normalizing it. So weird. 

We can't tell you it's not about maintaining control because you'll never allow yourself to accept it, QRHorn.  It's not about compliance,  It's about consideration of others. 

Edited April 30, 2021 by DDD Dad

[dcar00 14907]

3 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

We can't tell you it's not about maintaining control because you'll never allow yourself to accept it, QRHorn.  It's not about compliance,  It's about consideration of others. 

Good we can agree that it certainly isn't about science.

[DDD Dad 14572]

5 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

Good we can agree that it certainly isn't about science.

Wut?

The science is that masks do help prevent spread of airborne communicable diseases.  The science also is that we are not at herd immunity.  The science also is that until we reach herd immunity there is an ongoing risk that variants could develop that would be resistant to vaccines and antibodies.  But irrespective of the science, if you don't know whether those around you have  been vaccinated wear a fucking mask, because to do otherwise is inconsiderate at the least.

[Anastasis 23703]

17 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

Wut?

The science is that masks do help prevent spread of airborne communicable diseases.  The science also is that we are not at herd immunity.  The science also is that until we reach herd immunity there is an ongoing risk that variants could develop that would be resistant to vaccines and antibodies.  But irrespective of the science, if you don't know whether those around you have  been vaccinated wear a fucking mask, because to do otherwise is inconsiderate at the least.

Has anyone actually quantified the incremental effect of mask wearing for fully vaccinated people?  The science would suggest to me that the incremental effect is likely to be extremely small.  There just isn't much additional space for a substantial effect size. 

The variant thing is a drum that people keep beating and can keep beating, but the reality is that the vaccines are quite effective against all the variants to date.  Maybe something changes in the future, but the variants do not appear to be something to cower about.  We should be promoting the good news re: the effectiveness of the vaccines against the variants. Achieving greater immunization rates is absolutely crucial. We should be spreading the gospel of the good news. Mask wearing by vaccinated individuals is mostly public health theater at this point. Which I can understand.  Too many monkey see monkey do brains out there. 

Edited April 30, 2021 by Anastasis

[Neonmoon 38130]

Yeah I can’t believe a leader would try and set an example. What a pussy. Anyone who wears a mask after being vaccinated is a pussy. 

[Wulaw Horn 19561]

1 hour ago, Serak The Preparer said:

I disagree with the month, but not the two. I just got my first shot last week, so I am five weeks out from the 2nd shot + 2 week "safety" period. Given that there are still people just now able to get their first shot, I think it is unfair to assume that anybody who wants to be vaccinated will be vaccinated for another 7-8 weeks. Nice thing is that ramps perfectly to July 4th. I think that becomes, at least unofficially, return to normal day for a lot of people.

You are in California right?  We got vaccine out better than y’all anecdotally. So, maybe that’s fair in your area. July 4 is longer than I like but not unreasonable. Anytime in the fall is absurd. 

[Wulaw Horn 19561]

4 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

Yeah I can’t believe a leader would try and set an example. What a pussy. Anyone who wears a mask after being vaccinated is a pussy. 

It’s certainly not about “the science” or any semblance of even rudimentary risk management. 
the messaging is doing more harm than good. 

[DDD Dad 14572]

Has anyone actually quantified the incremental effect of mask wearing for fully vaccinated people?  The science would suggest to me that the incremental effect is likely to be extremely small.  There just isn't much additional space for a substantial effect size. 
The variant thing is a drum that people keep beating and can keep beating, but the reality is that the vaccines are quite effective against all the variants to date.  Maybe something changes in the future, but the variants do not appear to be something to cower about.  We should be promoting the good news re: the effectiveness of the vaccines against the variants. Achieving greater immunization rates is absolutely crucial. We should be spreading the gospel of the good news. Mask wearing by vaccinated individuals is mostly public health theater at this point. Which I can understand.  Too many monkey see monkey do brains out there. 

Sorta like the constant drum beating that masks don’t do anything and that it’s all about conformity and government control.

Both sides, amirite?

[Neonmoon 38130]

42 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

It’s certainly not about “the science” or any semblance of even rudimentary risk management. 
the messaging is doing more harm than good. 

[Anastasis 23703]

25 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

Sorta like the constant drum beating that masks don’t do anything and that it’s all about conformity and government control.

Both sides, amirite?

Don't whine DDD. The exchange I read was related to vaccinated people being around other vaccinated people wearing masks. You said the science supports that masks help prevent the spread of airborne communicable disease.  I agree with that point, but that is not relevant to the exchange. Does the science support that masks have a meaningful incremental impact among people that are fully vaccinated?  No data I am aware of; however, mounting data that supports that the effect size if any is quite constrained by the high efficacy of the vaccines. I understand that we are going to have these sorts of problems when the lawyers get outside their lane on issues related to science because they are butt hurt over the political arrows being slung, amirite?

[Sawbonz 28087]

Bucees  in temple packed and nowhere near 50% mask usage. If hospital numbers continue to drop we're ok. If not blame the sheep fucker variant for the coming apocalypse 

[smoky 842]

Look, the TSA has always been the top theatre troupe in the country. They're just solidifying their place for the next ten years.

We almost had them when we were able to bring gallon sized hand sanitizer on the planes, but they're not falling for that shit twice.

[DDD Dad 14572]

Don't whine DDD. The exchange I read was related to vaccinated people being around other vaccinated people wearing masks. You said the science supports that masks help prevent the spread of airborne communicable disease.  I agree with that point, but that is not relevant to the exchange. Does the science support that masks have a meaningful incremental impact among people that are fully vaccinated?  No data I am aware of; however, mounting data that supports that the effect size if any is quite constrained by the high efficacy of the vaccines. I understand that we are going to have these sorts of problems when the lawyers get outside their lane on issues related to science because they are butt hurt over the political arrows being slung, amirite?

Not whining and my post clearly was directed at mask wearing around those who are not vaccinated.

Don’t misrepresent me. That’s gaslighting or goalpost moving.

[GRHorn 105]

3 hours ago, DDD Dad said:

We can't tell you it's not about maintaining control because you'll never allow yourself to accept it, QRHorn.  It's not about compliance,  It's about consideration of others. 

So, it’s about feelings? At least you’re being honest. 
 

2 hours ago, Neonmoon said:

Yeah I can’t believe a leader would try and set an example. What a pussy. Anyone who wears a mask after being vaccinated is a pussy. 

I’d go more with overly cautious, but whatever. 

[Anastasis 23703]

1 minute ago, DDD Dad said:

Not whining and my post clearly was directed at mask wearing around those who are not vaccinated.

Don’t misrepresent me. That’s gaslighting or goalpost moving.

You’re the one gaslighting man. Try harder. 

[utee94 16070]

Just now, DDD Dad said:

Not whining and my post clearly was directed at mask wearing around those who are not vaccinated.

Don’t misrepresent me. That’s gaslighting or goalpost moving.

Oh I'm pretty sure it's Ipso Facto.

Or post hoc ergo proper hoc.

[dcar00 14907]

3 hours ago, DDD Dad said:

Wut?

The science is that masks do help prevent spread of airborne communicable diseases.  The science also is that we are not at herd immunity.  The science also is that until we reach herd immunity there is an ongoing risk that variants could develop that would be resistant to vaccines and antibodies.  But irrespective of the science, if you don't know whether those around you have  been vaccinated wear a fucking mask, because to do otherwise is inconsiderate at the least.

my post was about vaccinated people wearing masks.  if you are vaccinated you don't transmit the virus.

[Anastasis 23703]

8 minutes ago, utee94 said:

Oh I'm pretty sure it's Ipso Facto.

Or post hoc ergo proper hoc.

is that somewhat similar to being unable to decide whether the fallacy is gaslighting or goal posting moving?  Cause that pretty much looks to me like a monkey flinging poo against the wall. 

Edited May 1, 2021 by Anastasis