Formerly DT: COVID-19 - Featuring Lots of Politics, now CR because political talk not going away

[heso 2863]

20 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

And some of them....will have been a complete clusterfuck, allowing their jurisdiction to become a hub for the disease spreading (I mean, we're all expecting Florida will meet this description, right?)

 

Text exchange with a friend of mine in Florida:

Heso: Are hospitals testing people in Florida yet?

friend: Maybe. Seems very unclear. The one I’m at in ft Meyers is. And obviously the one in Sarasota did. But there’s been no statewide mandate on anything yet. 

[conVINCEd 21477]

Why do we need a test kit?  Can’t we just send blood samples to any lab with a functioning microscope?

[Goredho 17663]

We need to police ourselves against political opinion better or else the mods will have to.  The President's comments should be discussed here, but civilly and without invective.

[Brisketexan 107050]

Just now, Goredho said:

We need to police ourselves against political opinion better or else the mods will have to.  The President's comments should be discussed here, but civilly and without invective.

Yeah, sorry -- my bad, was bouncing back and forth between threads, forgot which one it was in.  I'll take my lumps.

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19353]

20 minutes ago, Parliament said:

So is most TP made in China? Why is everyone worried about THAT staple?

 

Also:

 

 

 

Cause Australia.

[Goredho 17663]

1 minute ago, Brisketexan said:

Yeah, sorry -- my bad, was bouncing back and forth between threads, forgot which one it was in.  I'll take my lumps.

All good, imo.  It is a shame we can't just speak freely about this issue and our government's response to it, but alas.

[Hate 20276]

If they never get tested, are experiencing very mild symptoms, and are indeed feeling better what makes you think that they aren’t going back to work?? That is most likely already occurring. Are we to mandate that everyone that feels cold like symptoms that they should stay home for at least 2 weeks? I don’t really think that is going to happen here. People will just never report feeling any level of “sickness”.

 

[InkaUtexas 26997]

Just now, Goredho said:

All good, imo.  It is a shame we can't just speak freely about this issue and our government's response to it, but alas.

we can and should, just in the proper place. 

[michaelpshayes 417]

Just now, Goredho said:

All good, imo.  It is a shame we can't just speak freely about this issue and our government's response to it, but alas.

you can spew your political horse shit in that fucking retard zoo all you want ....freely

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13440]

4 minutes ago, Goredho said:

The President's comments should be discussed here, but civilly and without invective.

Is such a thing even possible?

[Brisketexan 107050]

1 minute ago, Casual Encounter said:

Is such a thing even possible?

Not really.  Seriously, it's just not.  

[Bevo 13936]

Some notes from today:

8 new cases in Iceland. Now it is going after the blondes.

First 4 cases in West Bank, Palestine. They are fucked.

2 new cases in Portugal. I thought I would be safe in the Azores.

China’s National Health Commission reports 5 new cases across the mainland, excluding Hubei province. Yeah, fuck China.

[Captainant 28612]

1 minute ago, Goredho said:

All good, imo.  It is a shame we can't just speak freely about this issue and our government's response to it, but alas.

I just don't understand how you can discuss the issue as a current event without at least considering why the feds have been responding in the way they have. It shouldn't be political to point out that the president either is LYING TO OUR FACES about the impact and threat of the disease, or he doesn't understand it at a basic level - either of which is pretty fucking concerning for how all that shit could impede an effective response to an atleast outbreak-level disease that's already killed more people than SARS or ebola.

[TXSG8R 3362]

10 minutes ago, conVINCEd said:

Why do we need a test kit?  Can’t we just send blood samples to any lab with a functioning microscope?

You dont just look at a sample under a microscope.  The testing looks for the specific virus DNA to confirm you have SARS-CoV-2 and not some other coronavirus like the common cold.  

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/02/united-states-badly-bungled-coronavirus-testing-things-may-soon-improve

 

[akhornfan 4]

5 minutes ago, Bevo said:

Some notes from today:

8 new cases in Iceland. Now it is going after the blondes.

First 4 cases in West Bank, Palestine. They are fucked.

2 new cases in Portugal. I thought I would be safe in the Azores.

China’s National Health Commission reports 5 new cases across the mainland, excluding Hubei province. Yeah, fuck China.

China is just going to close the book on this thing, claim victory and stop testing. I doubt we’d ever know if it flared up again there unless it became catastrophic. 

[Parliament 14630]

If they never get tested, are experiencing very mild symptoms, and are indeed feeling better what makes you think that they aren’t going back to work?? That is most likely already occurring. Are we to mandate that everyone that feels cold like symptoms that they should stay home for at least 2 weeks? I don’t really think that is going to happen here. People will just never report feeling any level of “sickness”.
 

That's me. I had the flu/chest cold/Coronavirus/AIDS, pretty bad, earlier this week. Back to 90% now with no sneezing or coughing. Can I go back to work? I hope so, because I am.

[HenryJames 67477]

20 minutes ago, Casual Encounter said:

See what happens when you fuckers open the door? Rats come pouring in.

That's how the Black Death started.

[Newdoc 3511]

4 minutes ago, Captainant said:

I just don't understand how you can discuss the issue as a current event without at least considering why the feds have been responding in the way they have. It shouldn't be political to point out that the president either is LYING TO OUR FACES about the impact and threat of the disease, or he doesn't understand it at a basic level - either of which is pretty fucking concerning for how all that shit could impede an effective response to an atleast outbreak-level disease that's already killed more people than SARS or ebola.

There's a thread in the CR for it. Go there. That type of political discussion does nothing helpful here (or there) but at least it can be contained. Yes, pun intended.

[akhornfan 4]

6 minutes ago, Captainant said:

I just don't understand how you can discuss the issue as a current event without at least considering why the feds have been responding in the way they have. It shouldn't be political to point out that the president either is LYING TO OUR FACES about the impact and threat of the disease, or he doesn't understand it at a basic level - either of which is pretty fucking concerning for how all that shit could impede an effective response to an atleast outbreak-level disease that's already killed more people than SARS or ebola.

Or possibly, the threat is really, really low. I think it’s foolish to not at least consider that possibility. 

[TXSG8R 3362]

10 minutes ago, Hate said:

If they never get tested, are experiencing very mild symptoms, and are indeed feeling better what makes you think that they aren’t going back to work?? That is most likely already occurring. Are we to mandate that everyone that feels cold like symptoms that they should stay home for at least 2 weeks? I don’t really think that is going to happen here. People will just never report feeling any level of “sickness”.

 

Yea, thats the problem with containment in the US.  We dont have the discipline or means collectively to put the greater good in front of our needs.  Its easy to say "youre sick, stay home" but when you're the breadwinner working shit wages and dont have the ability to stay home for 2-4 weeks, I get why some people will say "fuck you, Im working."  The bigger problem is, people are contagious before they are symptomatic, so our lack of testing makes it a moot point anyway.  We should be identifying the sick prior to symptoms and keeping those people isolated.  

The real oh shit moment thats coming is when school districts start closing their doors for 2+ weeks and forcing parents to make hard choices.  Thats when this really gets people attention. 

[Goredho 17663]

This is just all my opinion, I'm no mod or anything:

I am limiting myself to surfacing facts and data and comparing that to direct quotes from government officials.  Others can form their own opinions of any impedance mismatch that may exist between them.

There are places where people get their information where they will be limited to hearing just the messaging from government officials without any data that bolsters or weakens that message.  I have found these people to be open to reviewing their positions when presented with facts and data that is not laced with invective.

I save for the cloak room my own interpretations as to why a mismatch exists between the facts/data and the messaging.

[Newdoc 3511]

I am concerned:

1) That our seemingly poor response is partly based on the fact our health system is set up to treat chronic disease. The profit is now mostly in chronic disease because it kills a lot of people and that the carrot for profit and mandate from Medicare is that we focus and treat chronic disease.  We still do extremely poor in prevention. As well, there has been very little motivation in our country to treat infectious disease. We have become complacent.  This has been a trend no matter who is in office.

2) Our population rivals third world countries in burden of obesity, lack of fitness, poor diet and general malaise about health education in general. This virus could wreck a good chunk of our population because they have self induced diabetes, heart disease and general lack of fitness needed to survive a serious case of Covid.

Edited March 5, 2020 by Newdoc

[Nice Guy Eddie 13745]

Personally I believe that testing for coronavirus is futile and perhaps even unnecessary. Most likely this is going to spread to a large percent of the globe and we're unable to stop it. Anyone that has flu-like symptoms should self-quarantine themselves as if they have the coronavirus. Schools and employers should also send people home.  And there should be clear understanding when you should head to a hospital.

Basically we should be educated by the health community and govt to understand how we should take care of ourselves until we can't.

 

 

Edited March 5, 2020 by Nice Guy Eddie

[Goredho 17663]

18 minutes ago, michaelpshayes said:

you can spew your political horse shit in that fucking retard zoo all you want ....freely

 

 

[JesusSweatDuck 18172]

1 hour ago, Grade of D as in David said:

They feel great and are headed to the mall.

[Pato del Muerto 53607]

37 minutes ago, CooterBrown said:

President Donald Trump suggested during an interview on Fox News Wednesday that many people with mild coronavirus symptoms could still go to work and get better. This goes against advice from medical professionals around the world who say that infected individuals should remain in isolation.

“A lot of people will have this and it’s very mild. They’ll get better very rapidly. They don’t even see a doctor, they don’t even call a doctor. You never hear about those people,” Trump told Fox News host Sean Hannity. “So you can’t put them down in the category of the overall population in terms of this corona flu and or virus. So you just can’t do that. So, if you know, we have thousands or hundreds of thousands of people that get better just by, you know, sitting around and even going to work. Some of them go to work, but they get better.”

https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/trump-work-coronavirus-074817221.html

He’s right. Thousands will get a mild case and continue their daily lives because people are selfish. He’s framing it to downplay the overall severity of the problem, but he happens to be right.  I’ve been at work with people could barely stand and certainly couldn’t focus on a task, that had to be ordered home by a supervisor.  Why would this virus be any different?  
 

that’s a big reason this virus won’t be contained. People think of their paycheck or their deadline and ignore their symptoms. Until we start welding people in, we are a giant incubator. Recommendations for self quarantine will not be followed. 

[InkaUtexas 26997]

2 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Recommendations for self quarantine will not be followed. 

Was talking to a group of college students last night. A lot work in at cafes, etc. They all said they could not force to quarantine. They do not have the resources on hand to withstand 2 weeks of no work or to purchase 2 weeks worth of supplies. You are correct, a large segment will not follow the rules. But I think in part is because they cannot, not that they do not want to. 

[Loco 3754]

welp the olds are going to pay a heavy price...  not just soon, but if this shitty management allows the virus to become seasonal like the flu

[TXSG8R 3362]

Just now, InkaUtexas said:

Was talking to a group of college students last night. A lot work in at cafes, etc. They all said they could not force to quarantine. They do not have the resources on hand to withstand 2 weeks of no work or to purchase 2 weeks worth of supplies. You are correct, a large segment will not follow the rules. But I think in part is because they cannot, not that they do not want to. 

Agreed.  People working at/near minimum wage, usually dont get paid time off, or have any signficant savings built up.  We have a very delicate house of cards that may come tumbling down if we get widespread quarantines, because the country is just not prepared to sit at home for 2-4 weeks without pay.  

[Goredho 17663]

 

2 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Recommendations for self quarantine will not be followed. 

I don't disagree with you that many won't.  But many will.  The throttling of cases against our healthcare system has been discussed a lot here in this thread.  I'm of the opinion that if a measure prevents no infections but throttles their rate, its a good thing.  Arbitrary number, lets say 100,000 would eventually become infected and need serious treatment.  If that 100,000 are spread over 6 months, we are better prepared to handle it than if they all hit the system over 2 months.

[JesusSweatDuck 18172]

18 minutes ago, TXSG8R said:

Yea, thats the problem with containment in the US.  We dont have the discipline or means collectively to put the greater good in front of our needs.  Its easy to say "youre sick, stay home" but when you're the breadwinner working shit wages and dont have the ability to stay home for 2-4 weeks, I get why some people will say "fuck you, Im working."  The bigger problem is, people are contagious before they are symptomatic, so our lack of testing makes it a moot point anyway.  We should be identifying the sick prior to symptoms and keeping those people isolated.  

The real oh shit moment thats coming is when school districts start closing their doors for 2+ weeks and forcing parents to make hard choices.  Thats when this really gets people attention. 

I'm sure it's already there especially in Kirkland/Seattle.  The fortunate part is that it doesn't seem to be impacting kids nearly has hard as adults for whatever reason

[Hate 20276]

welp the olds are going to pay a heavy price...  not just soon, but if this shitty management allows the virus to become seasonal like the flu

Doesn’t most of Surly already hate old people?

[Skipper 6412]

5 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

 

that’s a big reason this virus won’t be contained. People think of their paycheck or their deadline and ignore their symptoms. Until we start welding people in, we are a giant incubator. Recommendations for self quarantine will not be followed. 

That's actually why I think testing is important.  Not only do we need it right now to identify hot spots and help local officials make decisions regarding cancelling schools/events, etc. (particularly if we're hoping to get to summer hoping that will delay the spread), but we also need it widely (cheaply) available once it has spread everywhere because hopefully if people know they have Covid rather than just a cold, they may actually be more likely to stay home.  And employers will put in policies mandating that they stay home.  Sure, not everyone will follow, we are a nation of fat, stupid, morons, but every bit helps.

[Goredho 17663]

Just now, Hate said:

 

Doesn’t most of Surly already hate old people?

 

Except for the token Armybrat.

[TXSG8R 3362]

2 minutes ago, JesusSweatDuck said:

I'm sure it's already there especially in Kirkland/Seattle.  The fortunate part is that it doesn't seem to be impacting kids nearly has hard as adults for whatever reason

I dont think they are closing schools because of any increased risk to the kids.  They are closing schools because its a prime place to spread the virus.  Its a hub for a lot of spokes.  Lots of kids that dont wash their hands touching a lot of commons surfaces, and then going home to thousands of houses and spreading it further. 

Edited March 5, 2020 by TXSG8R

[Loco 3754]

1 minute ago, Hate said:

 

Doesn’t most of Surly already hate old people?

 

not moms

[Bevo 13936]

Just now, InkaUtexas said:

Was talking to a group of college students last night. A lot work in at cafes, etc. They all said they could not force to quarantine. They do not have the resources on hand to withstand 2 weeks of no work or to purchase 2 weeks worth of supplies. You are correct, a large segment will not follow the rules. But I think in part is because they cannot, not that they do not want to. 

I agree with most of this but only partially agree with the last sentence. People choose to have debt, to buy iPhones, to buy Jordans, and to have expensive car payments. And partially because of those choices, they need to work when they are sick. And this causes a problem for employers. One of my assistants asked me what would happen if I got the virus and missed 3 weeks worth of work or died. And I answered, "Sucks for you". The truth of the matter is, that if I shut down for three weeks, I could handle it but she couldn't. I do need to get out the magnifying glass and check the exclusions on my business interruption insurance, though.

[Trey3216 15454]

3 minutes ago, Hate said:

 

Doesn’t most of Surly already hate old people?

 

I mean, I guess this is a way to keep Social Security solvent  

[Your Mom 4985]

3 minutes ago, Loco said:

not moms

Pos rep

[HenryJames 67477]

5 minutes ago, Hate said:

 

Doesn’t most of Surly already hate old people?

 

Most of Surly hates everyone.

[Bevo 13936]

3 minutes ago, Hate said:

 

Doesn’t most of Surly already hate old people?

except when it is one of its own, like ab.

[TXSG8R 3362]

Just now, Bevo said:

I agree with most of this but only partially agree with the last sentence. People choose to have debt, to buy iPhones, to buy Jordans, and to have expensive car payments. And partially because of those choices, they need to work when they are sick. And this causes a problem for employers. One of my assistants asked me what would happen if I got the virus and missed 3 weeks worth of work or died. And I answered, "Sucks for you". The truth of the matter is, that if I shut down for three weeks, I could handle it but she couldn't. I do need to get out the magnifying glass and check the exclusions on my business interruption insurance, though.

Our economic system is largely based on easy credit and long debt.  Your assistant is the norm, youre the exception.  

[Liquor and Poker 3659]

12 minutes ago, Hate said:

 

Isn’t most of Surly already self-hating old people?

 

fify.

[Loco 3754]

1 minute ago, MoJames said:

Teehee if you think anyone had the ability to keep this from becoming what it has become. And fuck Trump /noCR.

I believe the science that if you can slow the spread you can have the infection burn out.  Seems to me the Alfred E Neuman approach is risky and stupid.

[crimsonlonghorn 2313]

24 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

He’s right. Thousands will get a mild case and continue their daily lives because people are selfish. He’s framing it to downplay the overall severity of the problem, but he happens to be right.  I’ve been at work with people could barely stand and certainly couldn’t focus on a task, that had to be ordered home by a supervisor.  Why would this virus be any different?  
 

that’s a big reason this virus won’t be contained. People think of their paycheck or their deadline and ignore their symptoms. Until we start welding people in, we are a giant incubator. Recommendations for self quarantine will not be followed. 

I agree with this and I think it’s already way more widespread than people think and lots of people have already had it and gotten over it, which is actually good news in the overall picture. 
 

 

[MoJames 8258]

7 minutes ago, Loco said:

I believe the science that if you can slow the spread you can have the infection burn out.  Seems to me the Alfred E Neuman approach is risky and stupid.

Well when there is a multitude of asymptomatic people wandering around, it makes that infinitely difficult. But what do I know I'm no Alfred E Neuman.

Edited March 5, 2020 by MoJames

[HenryJames 67477]

 

[GreenspointTexas 9993]

Cats already outta the bag. Cant put the toothpaste back in the tube

 

we had a chance to nip this in the bud 6-7 weeks ago and DID NOTHING. its too late to contain or minimize this thing.

 

if youre over 60... good luck

[atomheartbevo 90692]

1 hour ago, Loco said:

Ever wipe your ass with a newspaper ipad?

Why would I want to catch Wuhan Flu?

[Skipper 6412]

2 minutes ago, GreenspointTexas said:

 

 

if youre over 60... good luck

According to Deblasio tweets this AM there is a 40 year old in NYC in ICU.  And of course, he's pleading with the govt to get them more test kits.   I've always assumed our federal govt was incompetent but this fiasco has taken that to a different level.