Formerly DT: COVID-19 - Featuring Lots of Politics, now CR because political talk not going away

[triplehorn 2664]

Keeping liquor stores open keeps a fair number of people out of the ERs due to acute withdrawal.  It's a thing ERs do not need right now. 

 

 

[stork642 4511]

9 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

 

You guys are arguing with a cloak room troll. They seem to all be of some sort of pathology where they think that we’re all in danger based on whatever the president says, and when someone dies of their own stupidity, he must be held accountable and personally put on trial for murder.

That’s the best I can tell. I’ve never seen this phenomenon in real life where people hang on every word someone they despise says, and then spend all day talking about it. I get the vibe that that is pretty much what happens in the cloak room all day. Just wait to see what is said next, then rotate between fuming and sobbing. Watching paint dry sounds more fun, but I’m not a fucking lemming, so who knows. 

Anywho, feel free to join me in just negging these fucktards on site. I’ve actually stopped waiting to finish reading their posts. 

You are correct.  Once the corona is all under control these trolls will have no choice but to slither back to CR and yell to each other in their echo chamber.   

Edited March 24, 2020 by stork642

[SydneyCarton 49329]

3 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

Yeah, it’s all trending towards the fantasy some have articulated here in which we put the cops fully in power, and then let them decide what we all should and shouldn’t be doing at any given point in time. I didn’t even realize that that was a thing in America, but it’s revealed itself loudly and proudly on this thread. 

It’s a weird combination, considering many of these people are Bernie Bro’s who think cops are all basically gangsters and should all be arrested. But yes give them more power right now. How the fuck does that cognitive dissonance work?

[Beau Vine 55826]

29 minutes ago, GreenspointTexas said:

How in the fuck are liquor stores essential?

You're not married?

[Hpara759 1788]

2 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

Keeping liquor stores open keeps a fair number of people out of the ERs due to acute withdrawal.  It's a thing ERs do not need right now. 

 

 

And out of ICU beds.....because acute alcohol W/D will take up ICU beds

[GreenspointTexas 9933]

7 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

Keeping liquor stores open keeps a fair number of people out of the ERs due to acute withdrawal.  It's a thing ERs do not need right now. 

 

 

They cant get their fix at the grocery store or pharmacy?

[Hmbre97 6337]

4 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Just curious, when did you self quarantine ?

I know you're being facetious and don't really give a fuck but I'll indulge.

Since the beginning of March, I've been to 2 stores and to my barber. We also sent most of our admin staff to work from home 2 weeks ago but I work for a health care org that serves central Texas so we've been on top of this shit since January. The people like yourself and CTJ who don't really care about the impact outside of yourself is why this shit is blowing up now. 

But who am I to try and talk sense to someone that was still wanting to go on a ski vacation 10 days ago even when people were telling you this shit was spreading through the ski resorts. 

[SydneyCarton 49329]

3 minutes ago, GreenspointTexas said:

They cant get their fix at the grocery store or pharmacy?

You live in Texas and youre asking if grocery stores or pharmacies sell LIQUOR?

also, great idea, let’s push more people to go to grocery stores so they can try to chug 8 bottles of wine a day and then go back the next day, again and again. 

Edited March 24, 2020 by SydneyCarton

[Neonmoon 38130]

NOLA might see a spike soon

https://nypost.com/2020/03/22/39-year-old-woman-dies-waiting-for-coronavirus-test-results/

Quote

A healthy 39-year-old social worker died days after initially turning down a coronavirus test because she was told she was “low-risk,” her boyfriend said in a heartbreaking Facebook post.

“They sent her home, but didn’t test her — she was told she was low-risk,” he wrote, calling his partner “a profoundly kind, passionate, funny and loving 39-year-old woman in good health.”

Sorry if already posted

[JesusSweatDuck 18045]

37 minutes ago, GreenspointTexas said:

How in the fuck are liquor stores essential?

Have you ever watched an alcoholic go cold turkey?  This is not the time to do that.

[GreenspointTexas 9933]

Just now, SydneyCarton said:

You live in Texas and youre asking if grocery stores or pharmacies sell LIQUOR?

Grocery stores and pharmacies dont sell alcohol!??  

[JBJ 3780]

14 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

I literally said “not the healthiest outlet” in my post, so you can fuck right off with that and shove it up your ass. So by all means, please, stay on your high horse. 
 

in France cigarette shops are considered essential. Now feel free to shit all over every aspect of their society. I’m sorry free society doesn’t mean much to you, and you don’t have any sympathy for those who are really struggling with the newfound restrictions on said personal freedoms. 

Wasn't directed at you.  Just quoted the latest post on the topic since there are 1-3 convos going on at once on this thread.

I have been thinking about it since Adam Silver said something along the lines of basketball games on TV being essential to the American psyche.  Struck me as odd, but you have since heard the same sort of statement made by several entertainment companies and other vices.

Edited March 24, 2020 by JBJ

[G650 14422]

2 hours ago, ChickenSandwich said:

Hopefully we take note and follow NY as what not to do with overpopulation and density. 

Try again Sparky.

 

[BurntOrange&White 41656]

There's several reasons actually. First and foremost, when your road caves in or watermain breaks, we are the ones that have to fix it, and we aren't like Roto rooter just hanging out waiting for a call. We can't just idle and then go, it's a lot of moving parts.

 

Secondly, we can keep generating economic activity fairly safely because we are all spread out in the open air working, and we are self contained, ie. not customer facing. We don't mix with the public so there's no wider transmission risk.

 

ETA: Even in Italy the road contractors are still working.

I get reactive and emergency maintenance/construction needs for infrastructure and so on as essential.

 

But what does the apartment high rise being built downtown with hundreds of workers everyday do to deter the spread? What about the construction on 35 between Waco and Dallas that’s been going on for 10+ years? How is that essential for 2 weeks? That shit isn’t going to miraculously finish in 2 weeks?

 

Are these workers checked everyday and can you say they are all following the strict social distancing policy? I can tell you for certain at my job I’ve seen people huddled up in groups of 2-6 all day already, working alongside each other to move parts, and etc

 

Can you assure me the contractors coming to pick up their material haven’t been in contact with infected? Can you assure to me fellow employees are following the shelter in place guidelines? Can you ensure me that they also haven’t been in contact?

[SydneyCarton 49329]

Just now, GreenspointTexas said:

Grocery stores and pharmacies dont sell alcohol!??  

Are you illiterate? Or do you think it’s an accident I wrote LIQUOR in all caps? For the hardcore drunks, wine ain’t going to cut it. And it’s going to be way more expensive than cheap liquor to keep hands steady. 
 

and yes, perhaps dispersing more traffic from grocery stores in any way is probably a positive thing. 

[JesusSweatDuck 18045]

1 minute ago, GreenspointTexas said:

Grocery stores and pharmacies dont sell alcohol!??  

They sell beer and wine.  There are a bunch of alcoholics that could not consume enough alcohol that way and would start experiencing withdrawals.  It's a sad statement, but true.  Alcohol withdrawal is a serious medical issue and needs to be done under medical supervision or can result in death.

[Cheeseweasel 26439]

10 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

Keeping liquor stores open keeps a fair number of people out of the ERs due to acute withdrawal.  It's a thing ERs do not need right now. 

And keep husbands from murdering their wives. 

 

This is a paid advertisement for the Wives and the Stupid Shit They Say/Do thread. 

Come for the @Angry Gorilla drinking binge, stay for the @Mitch Cumsteen crazy.

[Neonmoon 38130]

2 minutes ago, GreenspointTexas said:

Grocery stores and pharmacies dont sell alcohol!??  

Why are debating the differences between wine/beer and liquor?

[The Dog 44773]

1 minute ago, Neonmoon said:

Why are debating the differences between wine/beer and liquor?

Do you even Greenspoint bro?

[Eastwood 4394]

We're a week into social distancing and this thread is starting to tear itself apart. Seems about right.

[Limp Brisket 549]

16 minutes ago, Don Johnson said:

 

Like, ohhhh I don’t know, a bat?

 

[Texas_Rocks 347]

Picked up a case of beer and a handle of Jack a couple of days ago. I rarely drink alcohol these days, but this seems like a good time to get back in shape.

[Hefeweizen 5416]

Is it too soon to tell people to drink chloroquine phosphate?

[Murfdogg21 4550]

2 minutes ago, Eastwood said:

We're a week into social distancing and this thread is starting to tear itself apart. Seems about right.

I guess that’s better than them tearing into their wife and children. 

[G650 14422]

1 minute ago, Bevo VIII said:

I get reactive and emergency maintenance/construction needs for infrastructure and so on as essential.

But what does the apartment high rise being built downtown with hundreds of workers everyday do to deter the spread? Are these workers checked everyday and can you say they are all following the strict social distancing policy? I can tell you for certain at my job I’ve seen people huddled up in groups of 2-6 all day already, working alongside each other to move parts, and etc

Can you assure me the contractors coming to pick up their material haven’t been in contact with infected? Can you assure to me fellow employees are following the shelter in place guidelines? Can you ensure me that they also haven’t been in contact?

Well I'm not speaking for the builders first and foremost. I am a utility and grading contractor. But as I said, we can't just sit around waiting for a call to fix something. We have to be working the whole time to be able to respond. And in our field, there's not much huddling up. Operators live all day in their machines, laborers are spread out doing what they do.

As far as assuring no one has been in contact, no, nobody can. But you have to weigh the risk with the loss. Without coming in contact with the public whatsoever there is exponentially less chance of spread, and it does the job of slowing down transmission which is what the big picture is now anyway.

[Lobwedgephil 1146]

Here is the exempt list, it is very long. 

 

Spoiler

HEALTHCARE / PUBLIC HEALTH

• Workers providing COVID-19 testing; Workers that perform critical clinical research needed for COVID-19 response
• Caregivers (e.g., physicians, dentists, psychologists, mid-level practitioners, nurses and assistants, infection control and quality assurance personnel, pharmacists, physical and occupational therapists and assistants, social workers, speech pathologists and diagnostic and therapeutic technicians and technologists)
• Hospital and laboratory personnel (including accounting, administrative, admitting and discharge, engineering, epidemiological, source plasma and blood donation, food service, housekeeping, medical records, information technology and operational technology, nutritionists, sanitarians, respiratory therapists, etc.)
• Workers in other medical facilities (including Ambulatory Health and Surgical, Blood Banks, Clinics, Community Mental Health, Comprehensive Outpatient rehabilitation, End Stage Renal Disease, Health Departments, Home Health care, Hospices, Hospitals, Long Term Care, Organ Pharmacies, Procurement Organizations, Psychiatric Residential, Rural Health Clinics and Federally Qualified Health Centers)
• Manufacturers, technicians, logistics and warehouse operators, and distributors of medical equipment, personal protective equipment (PPE), medical gases, pharmaceuticals, blood and blood products, vaccines, testing materials, laboratory supplies, cleaning, sanitizing, disinfecting or sterilization supplies, and tissue and paper towel products
• Public health / community health workers, including those who compile, model, analyze and communicate public health information
• Blood and plasma donors and the employees of the organizations that operate and manage related activities
• Workers that manage health plans, billing, and health information, who cannot practically work remotely
• Workers who conduct community-based public health functions, conducting epidemiologic surveillance, compiling, analyzing and communicating public health information, who cannot practically work remotely
• Workers performing cybersecurity functions at healthcare and public health facilities, who cannot practically work remotely
• Workers conducting research critical to COVID-19 response
• Workers performing security, incident management, and emergency operations functions at or on behalf of healthcare entities including healthcare coalitions, who cannot practically work remotely
• Workers who support food, shelter, and social services, and other necessities of life for economically disadvantaged or otherwise needy individuals, such as those residing in shelters
• Pharmacy employees necessary for filling prescriptions
• Workers performing mortuary services, including funeral homes, crematoriums, and cemetery workers
• Workers who coordinate with other organizations to ensure the proper recovery, handling, identification, transportation, tracking, storage, and disposal of human remains and personal effects; certify cause of death; and facilitate access to mental/behavioral health services to the family members, responders, and survivors of an incident

LAW ENFORCEMENT, PUBLIC SAFETY, FIRST RESPONDERS

• Personnel in emergency management, law enforcement, Emergency Management Systems, fire, and corrections, including front line and management
• Emergency Medical Technicians
• 911 call center employees
• Fusion Center employees
• Hazardous material responders from government and the private sector.
• Workers – including contracted vendors -- who maintain, manufacture, or supply digital systems infrastructure supporting law enforcement emergency service, and response operations.

FOOD AND AGRICULTURE

• Workers supporting groceries, pharmacies, convenience stores  and other retail that sells human food, animal/pet food,  and beverage products
• Restaurant carry-out and quick serve food operations - Carry-out and delivery food employees
• Food manufacturer employees and their supplier employees—to include those employed in food processing (packers, meat processing, cheese plants, milk plants, produce, etc.) facilities; livestock, poultry, seafood slaughter facilities; pet and animal feed processing facilities; human food facilities producing by-products for animal food; beverage production facilities; and the production of food packaging
• Farm workers to include those employed in animal food, feed, and ingredient production, packaging, and distribution; manufacturing, packaging, and distribution of veterinary drugs; truck delivery and transport; farm and fishery labor needed to produce our food supply domestically
• Farm workers and support service workers to include those who field crops; commodity inspection; fuel ethanol facilities; storage facilities; and other agricultural inputs
• Employees and firms supporting food, feed, and beverage distribution, including warehouse workers, vendor-managed inventory controllers and blockchain managers
• Workers supporting the sanitation of all food manufacturing processes and operations from wholesale to retail
• Company cafeterias - in-plant cafeterias used to feed employees
• Workers in food testing labs in private industries and in institutions of higher education
• Workers essential for assistance programs and government payments
• Employees of companies engaged in the production, storage, transport, and distribution of chemicals, medicines, vaccines, and other substances used by the food and agriculture industry, including pesticides, herbicides, fertilizers, minerals, enrichments, and other agricultural production aids
• Animal agriculture workers to include those employed in veterinary health; manufacturing and distribution of animal medical materials, animal vaccines, animal drugs, feed ingredients, feed, and bedding, etc.; transportation of live animals, animal medical materials; transportation of deceased animals for disposal; raising of animals for food; animal production operations; slaughter and packing plants, renderers, and associated regulatory and government workforce
• Workers who support the manufacture and distribution of forest products, including, but not limited to timber, paper, and other wood products
• Employees engaged in the manufacture and maintenance of equipment and other infrastructure necessary to agricultural production and distribution

ENERGY

Electricity industry:

• Workers who maintain, ensure, or restore, or are involved in the development, transportation, fuel procurement, expansion, or operation of the generation, transmission, and distribution of electric power, including call centers, utility workers, reliability engineers and fleet maintenance technicians
• Workers needed for safe and secure operations at nuclear generation
• Workers at generation, transmission and electric blackstart facilities
• Workers at Reliability Coordinator (RC), Balancing Authorities (BA), and primary and backup Control Centers (CC), including but not limited to independent system operators, regional transmission organizations, and balancing authorities
• Mutual assistance personnel
• IT and OT technology staff – for EMS (Energy Management Systems) and Supervisory Control and Data Acquisition (SCADA) systems, and utility data centers; Cybersecurity engineers; cybersecurity risk management
• Vegetation management crews and traffic workers who support
• Environmental remediation/monitoring technicians
• Instrumentation, protection, and control technicians

Petroleum workers:

• Petroleum product storage, pipeline, marine transport, terminals, rail transport, road transport
• Crude oil storage facilities, pipeline, and marine transport
• Petroleum refinery facilities
• Petroleum security operations center employees and workers who support emergency response services
• Petroleum operations control rooms/centers
• Petroleum drilling, extraction, production, processing, refining, terminal operations, transporting, and retail for use as end-use fuels or feedstocks for chemical manufacturing
• Onshore and offshore operations for maintenance and emergency response
• Retail fuel centers such as gas stations and truck stops, and the distribution systems that support them

Natural and propane gas workers:

• Natural gas transmission and distribution pipelines, including compressor stations
• Underground storage of natural gas
• Natural gas processing plants, and those that deal with natural gas liquids
• Liquefied Natural Gas (LNG) facilities
• Natural gas security operations center, natural gas operations dispatch and control rooms/centers natural gas emergency response and customer emergencies, including natural gas leak calls
• Drilling, production, processing, refining, and transporting natural gas for use as end-use fuels, feedstocks for chemical manufacturing, or use in electricity generation
• Propane gas dispatch and control rooms and emergency response and customer emergencies, including propane leak calls
• Propane gas service maintenance and restoration, including call centers
• Processing, refining, and transporting natural liquids, including propane gas, for use as end-use fuels or feedstocks for chemical manufacturing
• Propane gas storage, transmission, and distribution centers

WATER AND WASTEWATER

Employees needed to operate and maintain drinking water and wastewater/drainage infrastructure, including:

• Operational staff at water authorities
• Operational staff at community water systems
• Operational staff at wastewater treatment facilities
• Workers repairing water and wastewater conveyances and performing required sampling or monitoring
• Operational staff for water distribution and testing
• Operational staff at wastewater collection facilities
• Operational staff and technical support for SCADA Control systems
• Chemical suppliers for wastewater and personnel protection
• Workers that maintain digital systems infrastructure supporting water and wastewater operations

TRANSPORTATION AND LOGISTICS

• Employees supporting or enabling transportation functions, including truck drivers, bus drivers, dispatchers, maintenance and repair technicians, warehouse workers, truck stop and rest area workers, and workers that maintain and inspect infrastructure (including those that require cross-jurisdiction travel)
• Employees of firms providing services that enable logistics operations, including cooling, storing, packaging, and distributing products for wholesale or retail sale or use.
• Mass transit workers
• Workers responsible for operating dispatching passenger, commuter and freight trains and maintaining rail infrastructure and equipment
• Maritime transportation workers - port workers, mariners, equipment operators
• Truck drivers who haul hazardous and waste materials to support critical infrastructure, capabilities, functions, and services
• Automotive repair and maintenance facilities
• Manufacturers and distributors (to include service centers and related operations) of packaging materials, pallets, crates, containers, and other supplies needed to support manufacturing, packaging staging and distribution operations
• Postal and shipping workers, to include private companies
• Employees who repair and maintain vehicles, aircraft, rail equipment, marine vessels, and the equipment and infrastructure that enables operations that encompass movement of cargo and passengers
• Air transportation employees, including air traffic controllers and maintenance personnel, ramp workers, aviation and aerospace safety, security, and operations personnel and accident investigations
• Workers who support the maintenance and operation of cargo by air transportation, including flight crews, maintenance, airport operations, and other on- and off- airport facilities workers

PUBLIC WORKS

• Workers who support the operation, inspection, and maintenance of essential dams, locks and levees
• Workers who support the operation, inspection, and maintenance of essential public works facilities and operations, including bridges, water and sewer main breaks, fleet maintenance personnel, construction of critical or strategic infrastructure, traffic signal maintenance, emergency location services for buried utilities, maintenance of digital systems infrastructure supporting public works operations, and other emergent issues
• Workers such as plumbers, electricians, exterminators, and other service providers who provide services that are necessary to maintaining the safety, sanitation, and essential operation of residences
• Support, such as road and line clearing, to ensure the availability of needed facilities, transportation, energy and communications
• Support to ensure the effective removal, storage, and disposal of residential and commercial solid waste and hazardous waste

COMMUNICATIONS AND INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY

Communications:

• Maintenance of communications infrastructure- including privately owned and maintained communication systems- supported by technicians, operators, call-centers, wireline and wireless providers, cable service providers, satellite operations, undersea cable landing stations (including cable marine depots and submarine cable ship operators), Internet Exchange Points, and manufacturers and distributors of communications equipment
• Workers who support radio, television, and media service, including, but not limited to front line news reporters, studio, and technicians for newsgathering and reporting
• Workers at Independent System Operators and Regional Transmission Organizations, and Network Operations staff, engineers and/or technicians to manage the network or operate facilities
• Engineers, technicians and associated personnel responsible for infrastructure construction and restoration, including contractors for construction and engineering of fiber optic cables
• Installation, maintenance and repair technicians that establish, support or repair service as needed
• Central office personnel to maintain and operate central office, data centers, and other network office facilities
• Customer service and support staff, including managed and professional services as well as remote providers of support to transitioning employees to set up and maintain home offices, who interface with customers to manage or support service environments and security issues, including payroll, billing, fraud, and troubleshooting
• Dispatchers involved with service repair and restoration

Information Technology:

• Workers who support command centers, including, but not limited to Network Operations Command Center, Broadcast Operations Control Center and Security Operations Command Center
• Data center operators, including system administrators, HVAC & electrical engineers, security personnel, IT managers, data transfer solutions engineers, software and hardware engineers, and database administrators
• Client service centers, field engineers, and other technicians supporting critical infrastructure, as well as manufacturers and supply chain vendors that provide hardware and software, and information technology equipment (to include microelectronics and semiconductors) for critical infrastructure
• Workers responding to cyber incidents involving critical infrastructure, including medical facilities, SLTT governments and federal facilities, energy and utilities, and banks and financial institutions, and other critical infrastructure categories and personnel
• Workers supporting the provision of essential global, national and local infrastructure for computing services (incl. cloud computing services), business infrastructure, web-based services, and critical manufacturing
• Workers supporting communications systems and information technology used by law enforcement, public safety, medical, energy and other critical industries
• Support required for continuity of services, including janitorial/cleaning personnel

OTHER COMMUNITY-BASED GOVERNMENT OPERATIONS AND ESSENTIAL FUNCTIONS

• Workers to ensure continuity of building functions
• Security staff to maintain building access control and physical security measures
• Elections personnel
• Federal, State, and Local, Tribal, and Territorial employees who support Mission Essential Functions and communications networks
• Trade Officials (FTA negotiators; international data flow administrators)
• Weather forecasters
• Workers that maintain digital systems infrastructure supporting other critical government operations
• Workers at operations centers necessary to maintain other essential functions
• Workers who support necessary credentialing, vetting and licensing operations for transportation workers
• Customs workers who are critical to facilitating trade in support of the national emergency response supply chain
• Educators supporting public and private K-12 schools, colleges, and universities for purposes of facilitating distance learning or performing other essential functions, if operating under rules for social distancing
• Hotel Workers where hotels are used for COVID-19 mitigation and containment measures

CRITICAL MANUFACTURING

• Workers necessary for the manufacturing of materials and products needed for medical supply chains, and for supply chains associated with transportation, energy, communications, food and agriculture, chemical manufacturing, nuclear facilities, the operation of dams, water and wastewater treatment, emergency services, and the defense industrial base. Additionally, workers needed to maintain the continuity of these manufacturing functions and associated supply chains.

HAZARDOUS MATERIALS

• Workers at nuclear facilities, workers managing medical waste, workers managing waste from pharmaceuticals and medical material production, and workers at laboratories processing test kits
• Workers who support hazardous materials response and cleanup
• Workers who maintain digital systems infrastructure supporting hazardous materials management operations

FINANCIAL SERVICES

•  Workers who are needed to process and maintain systems for processing financial transactions and services (e.g., payment, clearing, and settlement; wholesale funding; insurance services; and capital markets activities)
• Workers who are needed to provide consumer access to banking and lending services, including ATMs, and to move currency and payments (e.g., armored cash carriers)
• Workers who support financial operations, such as those staffing data and security operations centers

CHEMICAL

• Workers supporting the chemical and industrial gas supply chains, including workers at chemical manufacturing plants, workers in laboratories, workers at distribution facilities, workers who transport basic raw chemical materials to the producers of industrial and consumer goods, including hand sanitizers, food and food additives, pharmaceuticals, textiles, and paper products.
• Workers supporting the safe transportation of chemicals, including those supporting tank truck cleaning facilities and workers who manufacture packaging items
• Workers supporting the production of protective cleaning and medical solutions, personal protective equipment, and packaging that prevents the contamination of food, water, medicine, among others essential products
• Workers supporting the operation and maintenance of facilities (particularly those with high risk chemicals and/or sites that cannot be shut down) whose work cannot be done remotely and requires the presence of highly trained personnel to ensure safe operations, including plant contract workers who provide inspections
• Workers who support the production and transportation of chlorine and alkali manufacturing, single-use plastics, and packaging that prevents the contamination or supports the continued manufacture of food, water, medicine, and other essential products, including glass container manufacturing

DEFENSE INDUSTRIAL BASE

• Workers who support the essential services required to meet national security commitments to the federal government and U.S. Military. These individuals, include but are not limited to, aerospace; mechanical and software engineers, manufacturing/production workers; IT support; security staff; security personnel; intelligence support, aircraft and weapon system mechanics and maintainers
• Personnel working for companies, and their subcontractors, who perform under contract to the Department of Defense providing materials and services to the Department of Defense, and government-owned/contractor-operated and government-owned/government-operated facilities

 

Edited March 24, 2020 by Lobwedgephil

[Cheeseweasel 26439]

3 minutes ago, Hefeweizen said:

Is it too soon to tell people to drink chloroquine phosphate?

The 2020 version of DIAF? Nice.

[akhornfan 4]

27 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

Yeah, it’s all trending towards the fantasy some have articulated here in which we put the cops fully in power, and then let them decide what we all should and shouldn’t be doing at any given point in time. I didn’t even realize that that was a thing in America, but it’s revealed itself loudly and proudly on this thread. 

In California the Governor specifically came out and said that the SIP order wasn’t going to be enforced by the police. 

[Brisketexan 106629]

For some discussion, a conversation among legal colleagues about the reach and enforceability of various restrictive orders issued by county, state, etc. authorities that exercise what is called "police power" and temporarily restrain liberty (posting a good piece below).  The TLDR version: in the interest of public health, restrictions on liberty are allowed, and have been for a long time, per SCOTUS.  Each rule/reg will be different, and of course can be challenged as an impermissibly broad exercise of that power, but the law is pretty clear that the authorities CAN take significant action to restrict liberty in the interest of public health.

Quote

"It is, then, liberty regulated by law."

This Constitutional law piece is from my Texas Lawyer colleague:

Here is the Supreme Court’s ruling on the government’s exercise of police power in the face of an epidemic:

In Jacobson v. Massachusetts, 197 U.S. 11, 25 S.Ct. 358, 49 L.Ed. 643 (1905), the United States Supreme Court considered a challenge to a state law requiring everyone to be vaccinated against smallpox. Henning Jacobson refused vaccination and was convicted. The court upheld the law and Jacobson’s conviction.

Mr. Justice Harlan wrote for a 7-2 majority:
“The Constitution does not import an absolute right in each person to be, at all times and in all circumstances, wholly freed from restraint.” Instead, “a community has the right to protect itself against an epidemic.” Its members “may at times, under the pressure of great dangers, be subjected to such restraint, to be enforced by reasonable regulations, as the safety of the general public may demand.”

“The authority of the state to enact this statute is to be referred to what is commonly called the police power,—a power which the state did not surrender when becoming a member of the Union under the Constitution.”

“According to settled principles, the police power of a state must be held to embrace, at least, such reasonable regulations established directly by legislative enactment as will protect the public health and the public safety.”

“Even liberty itself, the greatest of all rights, is not unrestricted license to act according to one’s own will. It is only freedom from restraint under conditions essential to the equal enjoyment of the same right by others. It is, then, liberty regulated by law.”

“In every well-ordered society charged with the duty of conserving the safety of its members the rights of the individual in respect of his liberty may at times, under the pressure of great dangers, be subjected to such restraint, to be enforced by reasonable regulations, as the safety of the general public may demand.”

“We hold that the statute in question is a health law, enacted in a reasonable and proper exercise of the police power.”

“We do not perceive that this legislation has invaded any right secured by the Federal Constitution.”

“Nothing clearly appears that would justify this court in holding the statute to be unconstitutional.”

The judgment of conviction must be affirmed.
It is so ordered.

 

[Beau Vine 55826]

Lulz.

[C-Man 27686]

1 hour ago, Wally Fairway said:

I'm sure I'm late on this - but is Dan Patrick really advocating what is effectively death squads for the olds? 
What a dumb fuck, let's just kill several million when the hospital get overrun; this seems very immature, like a toddler who can't understand how time works or that we've talked about how this was going to work.
I feel sorry for Texas and for Texans having someone like this in a leadership position (sorry to CR the thread - but that is how Trump is treating this as well)

Dan Patrick is an embarrassment.

[closetojumping 65257]

35 minutes ago, Captainant said:

What in the fuck are you talking about? Nobody in this thread wants or has said they want cops to come and lock the country down. 

That’s actually not true. When people are ardently pushing for “lock it down”, they’re asking for formal intervention so people can be saved from themselves. If you live in a fantasyland where they’re not referring to a military or paramilitary intervention, congrats on your profound naïveté, bro. 

Edited March 24, 2020 by closetojumping

[C-Man 27686]

15 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

Are you illiterate? Or do you think it’s an accident I wrote LIQUOR in all caps? For the hardcore drunks, wine ain’t going to cut it. And it’s going to be way more expensive than cheap liquor to keep hands steady. 
 

and yes, perhaps dispersing more traffic from grocery stores in any way is probably a positive thing. 

Isn't Greenspoint a nurse or something? Am I remembering that right? Is he retired or something? Otherwise, I can't imagine why he's not working instead of posting worst-case, jerk-off fantasies on this thread.

[Cheeseweasel 26439]

1 minute ago, C-Man said:

Otherwise, I can't imagine why he's not working instead of posting worst-case, jerk-off fantasies on this thread.

Everyone needs a hobby. 

[InkaUtexas 26803]

2 minutes ago, C-Man said:

Isn't Greenspoint a nurse or something? Am I remembering that right? Is he retired or something? Otherwise, I can't imagine why he's not working instead of posting worst-case, jerk-off fantasies on this thread.

If so maybe just waiting for that offer from NY for 10K a week. 

[triplehorn 2664]

Need to designate *plinkers* as essential workforce infrastructure. 

Spoiler

better than warring monkey hordes, I guess.

[Liquor and Poker 3659]

38 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

Yeah, it’s all trending towards the fantasy some have articulated here in which we put the cops fully in power, and then let them decide what we all should and shouldn’t be doing at any given point in time. I didn’t even realize that that was a thing in America, but it’s revealed itself loudly and proudly on this thread. 

This is getting political but I always thought that's what cops did in America.

[ChickenSandwich 9918]

1 hour ago, stork642 said:

They drank FISH TANK CLEANER.  You sound about as dumb as they are.  

 

59 minutes ago, Don Johnson said:

If someone tells me to get chemo if I have cancer, that doesn't mean they are encouraging me to go home and mix a few of the ingredients myself and inject it into my body.

12345

Edited March 24, 2020 by ChickenSandwich

[Liquor and Poker 3659]

36 minutes ago, Don Johnson said:

 

Have more than 10,000 Youtube videos on "DON'T DIE - how to refine aquarium cleaner into usable chloroquine" been posted yet?

[smuggs 9394]

2 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

Need to designate *plinkers* as essential workforce infrastructure. 

  Hide contents

better than warring monkey hordes, I guess.

There was a great episode of Insomniac where Dave Attell rode around with New Orleans PD and whacked nutria from the back of a truck with a .22.

[Auto Driller 2563]

2 minutes ago, smuggs said:

There was a great episode of Insomniac where Dave Attell rode around with New Orleans PD and whacked nutria from the back of a truck with a .22.

That was a great show. I miss the old Comedy Central.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

27 minutes ago, Hmbre97 said:

I know you're being facetious and don't really give a fuck but I'll indulge.

Since the beginning of March, I've been to 2 stores and to my barber. We also sent most of our admin staff to work from home 2 weeks ago but I work for a health care org that serves central Texas so we've been on top of this shit since January. The people like yourself and CTJ who don't really care about the impact outside of yourself is why this shit is blowing up now. 

But who am I to try and talk sense to someone that was still wanting to go on a ski vacation 10 days ago even when people were telling you this shit was spreading through the ski resorts. 

Facectious ? No not at all. January and February saw millions and  millions of people on airplanes around the county.  You tried to bash somebody who did just that.  Stop with you holier than thou BS. 

You're really a piece of work aren't you ?  I didn't go, and said I was watching and listening to the situation as it unfolded.  I wasn't going to panic and just cancel my life till I saw it was the right thing to do.  Again, in January and February people were traveling everywhere.   There were no quarantines, and no travel restrictions  Your post was BS much as your response above to me.

[Spaulding Smails 1610]

35 minutes ago, G650 said:

 

There's several reasons actually. First and foremost, when your road caves in or watermain breaks, we are the ones that have to fix it, and we aren't like Roto rooter just hanging out waiting for a call. We can't just idle and then go, it's a lot of moving parts.

 

Secondly, we can keep generating economic activity fairly safely because we are all spread out in the open air working, and we are self contained, ie. not customer facing. We don't mix with the public so there's no wider transmission risk.

 

ETA: Even in Italy the road contractors are still working.

100% this.  I think the decision to keep construction active by some states and municipalities is multi-faceted.  There's probably less risk of a four-man roofing crew being exposed while putting down a TPO roof at the strip center in Florence than when they go to HEB or Walgreens or the gas station on the way home.  I would hope that most politicians driving these orders understand that.

Second, it's extremely difficult to differentiate some businesses (mine included) that provide both essential and non-essential work.  We provide construction and facility maintenance services.  On the facility maintenance side, we service essential services like medical, restaurant, manufacturing and child care facilities.  While we're prepared to shut down 2/3 of our business, our attorneys have advised us to continue working until we receive specific directives that shut down our construction sites.  We're practicing social distancing on the job and have equipped all of our employees with additional PPE and sanitizers in accordance with CDC guidelines.  

Lastly, I think there would be tremendous financial and legal repercussions if construction did shut down.  We've had a number of preparatory calls with our legal team to discuss Force Majeure clauses in our contracts.  But, how do owners, lenders, tenants and all other parties react / respond when a location is set to open May 1 but gets delayed due to the impact of shelter in place orders?  Or, if you're a homeowner on a lease-back of a house you're selling while you wait for your new home to finish construction, and that gets delayed, are you out on the streets for a few months?  

I know these financial and legal issues pale in comparison to loss of life and the overall impact on the global economy, but at some point, they're going to have to be considered and discussed.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8964]

Lulz.

Wtf? Premature

[achooloco 1086]

Cuomo on, had a reply but got lost. Yeah he is longwinded and grim (agree with @PenelopeWitherspoon) but at least has facts and confronts the situation head on. Do people look to the TX, CA PCs as much as this one? Not trying to be CR just wondering if they are as informative. But damn, Cuomo is longwinded as shit. Stick to the facts! And agreed that they need to include info on recoveries and not just focus on the bad shit (although not sure if thats to keep dumbshits from wanting to break social distancing or if he just is not wanting to which is bad info). 

EDIT: todays talk mostly about ventilators and talking about putting them in the acute need areas and moving them "personally" to the next area that needs it.

Re: liquor stores, NY and TX don't sell liquor at grocery stores and it's dumb as shit. Yes, liquor stores need to be essential until that bullshit is fixed.

Edited March 24, 2020 by achooloco

[Captainant 28397]

1 minute ago, Liquor and Poker said:

Have more than 10,000 Youtube videos on "DON'T DIE - how to refine aquarium cleaner into usable chloroquine" been posted yet?

I mean, there's headlines out there if you want to find them lol

https://nypost.com/2020/03/19/sales-of-fish-tank-additive-skyrocket-after-studies-say-it-could-treat-coronavirus/

Or this interview with them is also illustrative of the point that we're trying to make that people aren't going to use much critical thought

Quote

The name "chloroquine" resonated with the man's wife, who asked that her name not be used to protect the family's privacy. She'd used it previously to treat her koi fish.

"I saw it sitting on the back shelf and thought, 'Hey, isn't that the stuff they're talking about on TV?'"

The couple — both in their 60s and potentially at higher risk for complications of the virus — decided to mix a small amount of the substance with a liquid and drink it as a way to prevent the coronavirus.

 Cloroquine Phosphate is indeed taken on its own to treat malaria. Now, nobody is saying that the president is personally liable for these people's terrible decision making. However, it's strong evidence of the danger that comes from a lack of consistent message from the white house, and the president overriding his medical experts advice and counsel on the topic. 

[XYZ 2154]

Y’all stop being so bitchass.

[Murfdogg21 4550]

Watching this Gov. Cuomo presser. I give him credit for trying to be a leader and look out for his constituents. Rambling on and on about things that were done wrong before today is not helping anyone though. And he’s a typical New Yorker by claiming that all 20,000 reserve federal ventilators should go to NY, “they don’t have to live here permanently, when we get past this they will be relocated to other parts of the country!” Have you seen northern Italy, sir? You won’t be done with 20,000 ventilators before the end of the year. But NY first above all! 
 

Every city in the country will be short on them very soon. 

[mchookem 16729]

1 hour ago, GabrielsHorn said:

Because if they get closed down, you’ll see a run on the liquor stores that will end up hurting your original directive. 
 

source: I experienced it yesterday and the lines were more dangerous than keeping them open with more strict guidelines. 

that's apparently what happened in Denver yesterday... they announced their order that only excepted medical use dispensaries...and people absolutely mobbed dispensaries and liquor stores. i think they changed the order within an hour lol

i mean... there's some mental health concerns to think of, in all seriousness. 

[Sbbruin 22082]

5 minutes ago, Spaulding Smails said:

100% this.  I think the decision to keep construction active by some states and municipalities is multi-faceted.  There's probably less risk of a four-man roofing crew being exposed while putting down a TPO roof at the strip center in Florence than when they go to HEB or Walgreens or the gas station on the way home.  I would hope that most politicians driving these orders understand that.

Second, it's extremely difficult to differentiate some businesses (mine included) that provide both essential and non-essential work.  We provide construction and facility maintenance services.  On the facility maintenance side, we service essential services like medical, restaurant, manufacturing and child care facilities.  While we're prepared to shut down 2/3 of our business, our attorneys have advised us to continue working until we receive specific directives that shut down our construction sites.  We're practicing social distancing on the job and have equipped all of our employees with additional PPE and sanitizers in accordance with CDC guidelines.  

Lastly, I think there would be tremendous financial and legal repercussions if construction did shut down.  We've had a number of preparatory calls with our legal team to discuss Force Majeure clauses in our contracts.  But, how do owners, lenders, tenants and all other parties react / respond when a location is set to open May 1 but gets delayed due to the impact of shelter in place orders?  Or, if you're a homeowner on a lease-back of a house you're selling while you wait for your new home to finish construction, and that gets delayed, are you out on the streets for a few months?  

I know these financial and legal issues pale in comparison to loss of life and the overall impact on the global economy, but at some point, they're going to have to be considered and discussed.

We have several tenant improvement projects currently underway.  Where we normally have subs from different trades working simultaneously in space, we are staggering and limiting the work to a single trade at a time.

We also have a MASSIVE ground up development that has basically stopped.  And it is going to be brutally expensive.