Formerly DT: COVID-19 - Featuring Lots of Politics, now CR because political talk not going away

[bullzak 428]

15 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Lol. There is not going to be football.

I am talking about 2021. 

2020 is the fucking "Year of Nobody Getting What they Want."

[Js1 87,189]

10 hours ago, Burt Macklin said:

Actually, Slorch’s raider rash is in the back. 

You mean brain. 

[Armybrat 41,415]

Gottdam

y’all are acting like you hit your heads on the dashboard.... so to speak.

[XYZ 2,154]

It’s pathetic how some western European countries have crushed the rate of infection and death from covid, meanwhile in America we are like muh freedoms! I used to think that Americans were not actually stupider than anyone else, maybe fatter and more entitled, but this shit is proving me wrong.

[bolverk 30,344]

47 minutes ago, Armybrat said:

Gottdam

y’all are acting like you hit your heads on the dashboard.... so to speak.

I actually did, twice, really hard.

Once when I was about five when my family was driving to my grandparents' place at night on a dark caliche road and a deer lept in front of the car and my dad stomped on the brakes back in the 70s. The other was when a friend and I were taking a back road through Sinton to get to Rockport for Spring Break in 1986 and some drunk farmer pulled out in front of us causing our car to t-bone his truck.

In both cases, I was not wearing a seat belt which, like masks, can save a fucking life.

Edited June 13, 2020 by bolverk
Spell check correction

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12,301]

Slorch’d.

Slorch when dozens of people from all angles tell you that you are as dumb as a box of rocks, is there ever a moment of introspection where you wonder if you are that dumb?

Do dumb people know they are dumb?

[mdmost 44,065]

Oh contraire. That's when he digs in even deeper! It's not him that's wrong. It's the rest of you!

Edited June 13, 2020 by mdmost

[MNLonghornFUKM 8,984]

One of the most serious issues with this virus is its killing of the younger and healthy. This fear is keeping the economy from recovering faster and causing significant numbers of people to not venture out.

Why isn’t the federal government setting up a process to contact the families of every person killed who was young and healthy to try and understand what piece of information is missing on this virus? If they could understand why it’s killing some younger healthy people but not others it could lead to a lot of potential improvements and processes that would make this whole situation less shitty.

What’s the numbers of the young and healthy dying to this virus?

[Armybrat 41,415]

If any of you insist on getting too close to me without a mask to converse and refuse to respect my space, then you can just talk to the muzzle end of what ever iron I’m packin’. 😝

 

j/k (sorta)

[babysdaddy 2,731]

What’s the numbers of the young and healthy dying to this virus?

According to cdc numbers, 777 out of 95,608 deaths in the US are under the age of 34. .8% of total deaths.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8,984]

According to cdc numbers, 777 out of 95,608 deaths in the US are under the age of 34. .8% of total deaths.

Any idea what their conditions were?

[Johnny Sack 8,397]

1 hour ago, XYZ said:

It’s pathetic how some western European countries have crushed the rate of infection and death from covid, meanwhile in America we are like muh freedoms! I used to think that Americans were not actually stupider than anyone else, maybe fatter and more entitled, but this shit is proving me wrong.

And our death rate is a fraction of many Western European countries.  

[Anastasis 23,723]

24 minutes ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

Any idea what their conditions were?

Fat AF would be my guess. 

[Newdoc 3,511]

2 hours ago, Dbeasy said:

One of the most serious issues with this virus is its killing of the younger and healthy

But not really.
 

“CONCLUSIONS: People <65 years old have very small risks of COVID-19 death even in pandemic epicenters and deaths for people <65 years without underlying predisposing conditions are remarkably uncommon. “

This is a little bit where you can start comparing Covid to other viral illness. Young healthy people die with one offs on illnesses all the time. It’s just not publicized. These type Covid deaths are click bait and you’ll hear about every one of them. It doesn’t mean we should be cavalier about the contagion but if you are healthy and under 30 and worried about Covid vs anything else then IMO you have bought into the hype machine. Over 65 and with heart disease, diabetes, etc.,  then you could have a big problem.

[GRHorn 105]

2 hours ago, Dbeasy said:

One of the most serious issues with this virus is its killing of the younger and healthy. This fear is keeping the economy from recovering faster and causing significant numbers of people to not venture out.

Why isn’t the federal government setting up a process to contact the families of every person killed who was young and healthy to try and understand what piece of information is missing on this virus? If they could understand why it’s killing some younger healthy people but not others it could lead to a lot of potential improvements and processes that would make this whole situation less shitty.

I don’t get the point here. It disproportionately kills Armybrats.

[GRHorn 105]

13 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Fat AF would be my guess. 

Yep and throw in the resultant diabeetus. Probably a few renal failure patients sprinkled in there too. 

[Telegraph_it 3,379]

I have worn a mask once and that was to get a haircut. But I also haven’t gone out to any restaurants, grocery store, retail store, or any other type of inside public place since March. 
 

I don’t like wearing one so I’ll just keep to myself.  Not too difficult. 
 

Next time I wear a mask will be on a plane. 

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

3 hours ago, UTPhil2006 said:

Several people in our social sphere had something that would likely be considered as COVID as early as November

I know somebody who had all/many of the symptoms associated with Covid. His doc was stumped by what he had, and said, he'd never seen anything presenting like what he had before. T hat was in October.

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

You can have my mask when our local ABC stores stop requiring you wear one to come in and buy hootch.

[Homercles 10,206]

51 minutes ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

Any idea what their conditions were?

Since they were dead my guess would their condition was quite poor.  

[utee94 16,090]

27 minutes ago, Newdoc said:

But not really.
 

“CONCLUSIONS: People <65 years old have very small risks of COVID-19 death even in pandemic epicenters and deaths for people <65 years without underlying predisposing conditions are remarkably uncommon. “

This is a little bit where you can start comparing Covid to other viral illness. Young healthy people die with one offs on illnesses all the time. It’s just not publicized. These type Covid deaths are click bait and you’ll hear about every one of them. It doesn’t mean we should be cavalier about the contagion but if you are healthy and under 30 and worried about Covid vs anything else then IMO you have bought into the hype machine. Over 65 and with heart disease, diabetes, etc.,  then you could have a big problem.

As always, thanks for bringing reasonable views and data to the this thread.  You and @ChiTownDoc have really made this thread worthwhile and bearable, even when sifting through all of the other shit.  Thank you.

 

[harpercollins 394]

These standalone ERs are so shady.

 

I took my 15 year old daughter for a COVID rapid antigen nasal swab yesterday after a possible exposure last weekend. She had thrown up once the night before and reported feeling lightheaded after vomiting, and since she had been babysitting for my sister who is currently in a high-risk pregnancy, I wanted to look into getting her tested.

 

I called signature ER who had been bombarding me with google ads. They got my insurance information over the phone, and told me the ER copay was $250, so I said no thanks (as I could get her a PCR test for free from her PCP). The receptionist quickly said, “oh okay we’ll only collect $100 of the copay.” Me: “I think that’s insurance fraud?” She says, “I don’t think so.” Ok, whatever—worth $100 for me to have a test result in “fifteen minutes” rather than 5 business days.

 

I drive to Killeen and check in. Intake person has zero PPE. No gloves, no mask, nothing. I pay my $100, sign a bunch of documents and then park in the designated spot.

 

We wait for an hour, and a second intake person (LVN I think) comes to interview my daughter through the car window. Again—no mask. Just going car to car interviewing people there for COVID testing.

 

Wait for another hour and a nurse comes (finally someone with a paper mask) and does the vital signs and nasal swab.

 

Wait for a third hour and the ER physician comes out and tells us test is negative. He listens to her chest, and asks her about being lightheaded after vomiting. He then tells me she needs further testing to figure out why she was lightheaded and vomited.

 

“What kind of testing?”

 

“CBC and lipid panel, EKG and chest x-ray.”

 

“Wow! For vomiting? Did you hear something in her chest that makes you think we need an x-ray?”

 

“No I couldn’t really hear anything because of the noise with the car running. My recommendation is to get admitted for further testing.”

 

“Ok I’ll make her an appointment with her primary care physician.”

 

“That’s fine, but since you’re leaving against my recommendation you’ll have to sign this affidavit saying that you understand you’re leaving against medical advice, and you won’t hold me responsible if she dies or has some adverse effects from forgoing testing.”

 

“For real, dude? You go to 11 years of school to come out here and shill EKGs in the parking lot?”

 

I’m sure they’re not all like that, but dayum. How do you sleep at night?

[Beau Vine 55,867]

15 hours ago, Iceman said:

yadah, yadah, yadah...

 

"we think this might happen"

 

there's no proof, but we'd like to set policy from our parameters.

 

/Go fuck yourselves and your high horses.

[Newdoc 3,511]

2 hours ago, harpercollins said:

I’m sure they’re not all like that, but dayum. How do you sleep at night?

Wait till you get the ED bill.  ED docs are the ready, fire, aim types when it comes to testing in my experience. Sometimes that’s the result of getting sued, training or being a part owner of a stand alone ED (which you may have had).
 

Next time look for an urgent care. There are some that even charge only the primary care copay. The testing won’t be 15 minute results but for example, we have about a 24 hour turnaround with a reasonably reliable test (Baylor Scott and White).

[B00M 6,734]

7 hours ago, Iceman said:

I'm trolling the thread.

 

Oh! It was all a joke. Sorry for the neg reps.

[Bozo_Casanova 26,859]

3 hours ago, harpercollins said:

These standalone ERs are so shady.

 

I took my 15 year old daughter for a COVID rapid antigen nasal swab yesterday after a possible exposure last weekend. She had thrown up once the night before and reported feeling lightheaded after vomiting, and since she had been babysitting for my sister who is currently in a high-risk pregnancy, I wanted to look into getting her tested.

 

I called signature ER who had been bombarding me with google ads. They got my insurance information over the phone, and told me the ER copay was $250, so I said no thanks (as I could get her a PCR test for free from her PCP). The receptionist quickly said, “oh okay we’ll only collect $100 of the copay.” Me: “I think that’s insurance fraud?” She says, “I don’t think so.” Ok, whatever—worth $100 for me to have a test result in “fifteen minutes” rather than 5 business days.

 

I drive to Killeen and check in. Intake person has zero PPE. No gloves, no mask, nothing. I pay my $100, sign a bunch of documents and then park in the designated spot.

 

We wait for an hour, and a second intake person (LVN I think) comes to interview my daughter through the car window. Again—no mask. Just going car to car interviewing people there for COVID testing.

 

Wait for another hour and a nurse comes (finally someone with a paper mask) and does the vital signs and nasal swab.

 

Wait for a third hour and the ER physician comes out and tells us test is negative. He listens to her chest, and asks her about being lightheaded after vomiting. He then tells me she needs further testing to figure out why she was lightheaded and vomited.

 

“What kind of testing?”

 

“CBC and lipid panel, EKG and chest x-ray.”

 

“Wow! For vomiting? Did you hear something in her chest that makes you think we need an x-ray?”

 

“No I couldn’t really hear anything because of the noise with the car running. My recommendation is to get admitted for further testing.”

 

“Ok I’ll make her an appointment with her primary care physician.”

 

“That’s fine, but since you’re leaving against my recommendation you’ll have to sign this affidavit saying that you understand you’re leaving against medical advice, and you won’t hold me responsible if she dies or has some adverse effects from forgoing testing.”

 

“For real, dude? You go to 11 years of school to come out here and shill EKGs in the parking lot?”

 

I’m sure they’re not all like that, but dayum. How do you sleep at night?

They are often shady as shit and take advantage of people who don’t understand the financial difference between a free standing emergency room and urgent care. They (along with the trade secrecy of the hospital charge master in most states) are my go-to example why there’s a need for benign regulation in healthcare.

[Armybrat 41,415]

Am a bit confused.

When I had my heart attacks I went to the hospital ER.

Free standing? Urgent Care? Which is which?

[Bozo_Casanova 26,859]

51 minutes ago, Armybrat said:

Am a bit confused.

When I had my heart attacks I went to the hospital ER.

Free standing? Urgent Care? Which is which?

you can google ER vs urgent care for more, but Short answer- if it says “Emergency Room” it bills at ER rates regardless of the problem, and if the problem isn’t a bona-fide emergency insurance companies can and will deny the claim. So you could wind up paying $3k for 5 stitches on the top of your thumb on a Sunday afternoon, like my neighbor. By contrast I went to UR when I cut the tip off my thumb with a mandolin because I was slicing drunk and wound up paying about $200, all of which applied to my deductible. 
“Urgent care” has far lower rates for everything and is always covered, typically with a slightly higher co-pay than a regular visit for those in a PPO.

relevant to you- freestanding ERs usually can’t take medicare because they aren’t connected to hospitals. HOWEVER right now they can in some cases as a result of very high effective lobbying of the Trump Admin by the freestanding ER industry, taking advantage of the COVID-19 crisis. But guessing when is a financial crapshoot. 
 

TL;DR. If you can, go to urgent care. If you can’t, go to a hospital ER. If you literally have no other options And it really can’t wait, go to  freestanding ER. 

Edited June 13, 2020 by Bozo_Casanova

[Anastasis 23,723]

And don't use a mandolin after moderate to heavy drinking. Real talk. 

[InkaUtexas 26,905]

8 hours ago, XYZ said:

It’s pathetic how some western European countries have crushed the rate of infection and death from covid, meanwhile in America we are like muh freedoms! I used to think that Americans were not actually stupider than anyone else, maybe fatter and more entitled, but this shit is proving me wrong.

New York... 

 

[Bozo_Casanova 26,859]

3 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

And don't use a mandolin after moderate to heavy drinking. Real talk. 

Never again! I came home and threw that motherfucker away. 

[Brisketexan 106,921]

And don't use a mandolin after moderate to heavy drinking. Real talk. 

...unless you’re Bruce Hornsby.

[washparkhorn 9,973]

A mandolin a one hell of a kitchen tool. But always have gauze and superglue on the counter when using - slap the skin flap back on the finger, cover with a layer of gauze and generously apply the superglue. Good as new. Cost - less than $5.00.

As for billing practices, we need to transition to price transparency for medical care. I wonder how many died of Covid without going to a doctor because the medical billing system is so damn complicated. 

[Armybrat 41,415]

41 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

you can google ER vs urgent care for more, but Short answer- if it says “Emergency Room” it bills at ER rates regardless of the problem, and if the problem isn’t a bona-fide emergency insurance companies can and will deny the claim. So you could wind up paying $3k for 5 stitches on the top of your thumb on a Sunday afternoon, like my neighbor. By contrast I went to UR when I cut the tip off my thumb with a mandolin because I was slicing drunk and wound up paying about $200, all of which applied to my deductible. 
“Urgent care” has far lower rates for everything and is always covered, typically with a slightly higher co-pay than a regular visit for those in a PPO.

relevant to you- freestanding ERs usually can’t take medicare because they aren’t connected to hospitals. HOWEVER right now they can in some cases as a result of very high effective lobbying of the Trump Admin by the freestanding ER industry, taking advantage of the COVID-19 crisis. But guessing when is a financial crapshoot. 
 

TL;DR. If you can, go to urgent care. If you can’t, go to a hospital ER. If you literally have no other options And it really can’t wait, go to  freestanding ER. 

Thanks, that is excellent information.

If I ever take up playing the accordion again that may come in handy.... what with the moobs I’ve developed in my pyrite years.

[scottsins 2,047]

 

I drive to Killeen and check in.

 

 

 

This is really all you needed to say.

[Scheiss Meister 8,472]

37 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

A mandolin a one hell of a kitchen tool. But always have gauze and superglue on the counter when using - slap the skin flap back on the finger, cover with a layer of gauze and generously apply the superglue. Good as new. Cost - less than $5.00.

Dude.  Kevlar glove.  Don't get cut in the first place.

[Somnio 751]

A mandolin as a kitchen tool?!?

 

[Iceman 2,978]

50 minutes ago, Somnio said:

A mandolin as a kitchen tool?!?

 

or a dildo...if you're brave enough.

[mchookem 16,771]

11 hours ago, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

Slorch’d.

Slorch when dozens of people from all angles tell you that you are as dumb as a box of rocks, is there ever a moment of introspection where you wonder if you are that dumb?

Do dumb people know they are dumb?

exact opposite

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect

[Iceman 2,978]

3 minutes ago, mchookem said:

exact opposite

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect

That is the Cloak room sir, and its ilk.   Smartest motherfuckers ever invented.   Just ask em...  

 

Oh wait.  No need for that.  they'll insist upon themselves.

[Dbeasy 15,599]

20 hours ago, Newdoc said:

But not really.
 

“CONCLUSIONS: People <65 years old have very small risks of COVID-19 death even in pandemic epicenters and deaths for people <65 years without underlying predisposing conditions are remarkably uncommon. “

This is a little bit where you can start comparing Covid to other viral illness. Young healthy people die with one offs on illnesses all the time. It’s just not publicized. These type Covid deaths are click bait and you’ll hear about every one of them. It doesn’t mean we should be cavalier about the contagion but if you are healthy and under 30 and worried about Covid vs anything else then IMO you have bought into the hype machine. Over 65 and with heart disease, diabetes, etc.,  then you could have a big problem.

Thanks for the info. When I said young, I should have clarified that I was referencing under the age of 50.  Also, hospitalization, not deaths, is what I’m concerned about because of the indications of long-term damage being reported as a result of hospitalization. So, I just took a quick look at the CDC website for hospitalization rates by age and by condition. No idea how accurate the data below is, but it's close enough for government work. This is through 6/13.

Hospitalizations By Age

0-4 YR 110       

5-17 YR  161         

18-49 YR   7538         

50-64 YR  8431     

65+ YR     12747

So, 27% of cases are under age 50.

 

Then, I looked at Hospitalizations By Condition

Asthma   849

Cardiovascular disease   2210

Chronic lung disease 1381

Immune suppression  656

Metabolic disease  2790

Neurologic disease  1577

Other disease   389

No known condition   627 (8.5%)

Autoimmune disease   199

Obesity  3068

Pregnancy N/A

Renal disease  1063

Gastrointestinal/liver disease  345

Hypertension  3752

 

8.5% have had no condition. Not sure how many are under 50 and have no condition, but probably a significant portion of that 8.5%.

So, probably about 5-8.5% are healthy under 50 which would be about 400-627 of the cases, pretty small part of the almost 30,000 hospitalizations. Not zero, but not large either.

Edit: Just noticed the total numbers between condition and age varied by 10k. Not sure why on CDC site. Assuming 8.5% of 30k hospitalizations would imply 2,550 people had no health issues and most were likely under 50.

Edited June 14, 2020 by Dbeasy

[Schulz2.0 29,280]

10 hours ago, mchookem said:

exact opposite

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect

Plenty of smart people fall victim to the Dunning-Kruger effect. Its much more of a "people with a little bit of knowledge on a subject grossly overestimate their competence in that subject" than a "dumb people overestimate their competence in a subject."

[Schulz2.0 29,280]

A cluster of cases found in Beijing.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucelee/2020/06/14/coronavirus-outbreak-fears-of-second-wave-lead-to-beijing-lockdown/#289f83aa7347

[Message Board User 12,406]

 

[ABSR 5,370]

23 hours ago, babysdaddy said:

According to cdc numbers, 777 out of 95,608 deaths in the US are under the age of 34. .8% of total deaths.

If the question is about young people I would use this data.  137 deaths are 24 and under, so .0014.   As a compare the best cdc shows for 2018-2019 flu deaths is 34,157 and (not sure why they use different age range for this than for COVID) for 17 and under deaths are 477.  So for that flu season the percent of deaths for a smaller age range was .013.   
 

COVID is overall much worse for the overall population, but as a parent the risk to a child or even young adult is greater for flu.  The real concern as a parent would be if the child gets it and infects someone (possibly the parents) who are at higher risk.

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

Yeah this is a opportunistic virus. It attacks people with compromised immune systems, and other underlying conditions for the most part.  Some idiot on FB posts a picture a of an 19 year old black kid who is obviously very obese, and the headline is "healthy 19 year old dies suddenly from Covid.  This was one of those, a picture is worth a 1,000 words moments.

[Newdoc 3,511]

11 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

obviously very obese, and the headline is "healthy 19 year old dies

There is likely a disconnect in what is “healthy.”

Just because you haven’t been formally diagnosed with some type of self induced metabolic disease doesn’t mean you’re healthy.

After watching a few videos of the crazy crowded conditions in tubing rivers of central Texas, I don’t know how we won’t skyrocket our R value in Texas. 
 

Plus, the body habitus of 3/4 of the patrons likely has Covid 19 -

[ChickenSandwich 9,960]

looks like Houston will lead the charge in regards to Covid numbers for the rest of the state. Well done. 

[Hate 20,250]

[Viper 12,221]

family friend and her boys got it from the ex who is a janitor at a hospital. she's about 40, does a lot of 10k and triathlon training, said she had a bad cough and it felt like a weight was on her chest. one boy just had a cough and fever and diarrhea, while the other boy tested negative. wouldn't be surprised if he already had it and recovered, or is about to get it soon.