Formerly DT: COVID-19 - Featuring Lots of Politics, now CR because political talk not going away

[XYZ 2154]

It’s going to be printed by the central bank, duh.

[Royalfan5 2384]

1 hour ago, JimmyJames said:

Where is the money for extending unemployment benefits going to come from? 

Pre-allocated disaster relief funds, so if it a Hurricane squares up on someone, the money’s already spent

[JimmyJames 12271]

3 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

I would have to specifically deep dive into South Korea's policies to answer with any level of clarity or certainty. I think I provided a wide swath above, but it doesn't address SK directly. I'm not inclined to deep dive at this time, so in admitting ignorance specific to SK I will simply state: I don't know. 

Deep dive into this.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/05/whats-south-koreas-secret/611215/

[JimmyJames 12271]

3 hours ago, GRHorn said:

This is semantics and just a cold numbers assessment, but 50-60,000 Americans die every week. So you’re looking at 3 weeks worth and I don’t believe those all count as excess deaths above the norm. It is a sad situation and I think we could’ve done better, but fortunately I think few would call those relative numbers apocalyptic. 
 

I’m sensing your emotional response is due to a personal experience with it. I’m sorry, if that’s the case. Just looking at it from a big picture view. 

So people die every day so who cares about the covid dead? Nice logical perspective there. Geezus. Go out and eat another crappy burnt steak and greasy hot dog.

[atomheartbevo 90642]

1 hour ago, JimmyJames said:

Where is the money for extending unemployment benefits going to come from? 

That's why I don't think he can do it, but like I said this could spur Congress into getting something done, because in theory he's now put the ball in their court, and they will be the ones taking away the extended unemployment benefits. 

[Hefeweizen 5444]

3 hours ago, GRHorn said:

This is semantics and just a cold numbers assessment, but 50-60,000 Americans die every week. So you’re looking at 3 weeks worth and I don’t believe those all count as excess deaths above the norm. It is a sad situation and I think we could’ve done better, but fortunately I think few would call those relative numbers apocalyptic. 
 

I’m sensing your emotional response is due to a personal experience with it. I’m sorry, if that’s the case. Just looking at it from a big picture view. 

I've now got two people I know who died from it and one in ICU - none of them in the expected category.  The excess deaths right now according to what I've read is over 200k.  So your take is not only callous, it's objectively wrong on the 3 weeks worth not being excess.  But you don't care about the numbers, as you've said.  You are not looking at anything from a big picture, just wishful thinking that this inconvenient flu would stop interfering with your life.

[Planet Houston 4950]

3 hours ago, GRHorn said:

This is semantics and just a cold numbers assessment, but 50-60,000 Americans die every week. So you’re looking at 3 weeks worth and I don’t believe those all count as excess deaths above the norm. It is a sad situation and I think we could’ve done better, but fortunately I think few would call those relative numbers apocalyptic. 
 

I’m sensing your emotional response is due to a personal experience with it. I’m sorry, if that’s the case. Just looking at it from a big picture view. 

Nope, nobody close to me has died. I’ve had some friends get very sick, and who knows if they’ll have long-term issues - but this response is not because of personal experience.

This might shock you, but a lot of people have empathy for people they’ve never met. Even people who [GASP] look different than them!!!

So, again - 🖕

[Message Board User 12405]

13 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

That's why I don't think he can do it, but like I said this could spur Congress into getting something done, because in theory he's now put the ball in their court, and they will be the ones taking away the extended unemployment benefits. 

 

[GRHorn 105]

1 hour ago, BurntEyes said:

See, I attempt to have discussion and admit ignorance with openness to being educated. You had the option to post this, present some thoughts on what the US could learn from it in the future and further discussion.

But instead you put a snippy comment, and post a link in a "ha suck it" facebook/twittee way that doesn't further mutual engagement, discussion or meaningful dialog. 

This is the exact fucking reason I have avoided this thread, don't normally want to discuss it and regret having tried to engage you. This is the problem in general in the US of our new Facebook/Twitter told you so, look at me engagement.

It won't happen again, but congrats on fostering such great discussion. I have a lot of thoughts and even noted some items mentioned in the article earlier in my posts. But you know, fuck all that trying to discuss things like adults.

I'm going to let this thread sink right back to the bullshit thread it was, thanks for clearing my head.

 

Jimmy might be the dumbest motherfucker on this board so that’s no surprise. Put him on ignore and try not to let posters like him sour you on actual discourse. 

[workswithseed 2204]

18 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Step ahead of you, but thanks. For the record, BT wins that prize over Jimmy, hands down.

I always figured  the dumbest, or at least educated, just self aware.

[Pato del Muerto 53481]

On 8/4/2020 at 11:15 AM, crash_davis said:

hoooboy. things can't get worse, right?

 

Hmmm

https://www.ktvq.com/news/coronavirus/over-250-students-and-teachers-quarantined-in-georgia-district-after-first-week-of-school

[MNLonghornFUKM 8983]

[Pato del Muerto 53481]

So one thing vs “all other things” is a fair comparison?

[Brisketexan 106890]

Now do “Americans murdered by MS-13 this year,” since we also build a significant chunk of our national policy based on THAT risk.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

11 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

Step ahead of you, but thanks. For the record, BT wins that prize over Jimmy, hands down.

BT will actually debate,  even if his ideas are beyond bizarre about his panacea of utopian communism.  Jimmy James (if that's who you're referring to) can't do anything other than throw lame one liners at you.

[gmr548 16697]

Now do “Americans murdered by MS-13 this year,” since we also build a significant chunk of our national policy based on THAT risk.

Well yeah but COVID isn't brown.

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301]

10 hours ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

 

What on earth are we doing?

Does that tweet resonate with you @MNLonghornFUKM?

Edited August 9, 2020 by DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt

[bad_teammate 13519]

lol @ Communism ranting in the COVID thread

Seek professional help, guys.

[Foosters 18279]

Alex Berenson lol

 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8983]

What on earth are we doing?
Does that tweet resonate with you [mention=37]MNLonghornFUKM[/mention]?

Nope.

Can’t I post Death stats or just Hugo?

[MNLonghornFUKM 8983]

Alex Berenson lol
 

He’s a nut. Entertaining but a nut.

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301]

22 minutes ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

Nope.

Can’t I post Death stats or just Hugo?

Why did you post it?

[MNLonghornFUKM 8983]

Why did you post it?

I guess people aren’t allowed to read that covid has caused 5% of deaths for those under 55 because Hollywood said so. Im sorry for not running it by you first.

[JimmyJames 12271]

17 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

See, I attempt to have discussion and admit ignorance with openness to being educated. You had the option to post this, present some thoughts on what the US could learn from it in the future and further discussion.

But instead you put a snippy comment, and post a link in a "ha suck it" facebook/twittee way that doesn't further mutual engagement, discussion or meaningful dialog. 

This is the exact fucking reason I have avoided this thread, don't normally want to discuss it and regret having tried to engage you. This is the problem in general in the US of our new Facebook/Twitter told you so, look at me engagement.

It won't happen again, but congrats on fostering such great discussion. I have a lot of thoughts and even noted some items mentioned in the article earlier in my posts. But you know, fuck all that trying to discuss things like adults.

I'm going to let this thread sink right back to the bullshit thread it was, thanks for clearing my head.

 

So I post an article you don’t like, so you run away. 
 

You obviously didn’t want to discuss South Korea. And still don’t. Why is that? 

[AngryDragon 273]

22 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

I would suggest starting at the beginning and looking at Chinese immigrant, and tourist activity I SK. I suspect, purely on suppositions of China/SK relations, that SK has a much lower number of visitors and business visas from Chinese citizens. Additionally, I would guess they shut their doors to China a LOT faster than other western countries. Same for Japan. 

But I could be completely wrong.

You're completely wrong. 

[JimmyJames 12271]

3 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

BT will actually debate,  even if his ideas are beyond bizarre about his panacea of utopian communism.  Jimmy James (if that's who you're referring to) can't do anything other than throw lame one liners at you.

It’s interesting to me that I’m so prominent in your head. 

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301]

16 minutes ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

I guess people aren’t allowed to read that covid has caused 5% of deaths for those under 55 because Hollywood said so. Im sorry for not running it by you first.

Ok so you did think that tweet had merit. That’s scary. 

[clapclapclap 9000]

Poll:  Americans as a whole vastly overestimate WuFlu deaths.

https://www.kekstcnc.com/media/2793/kekstcnc_research_covid-19_opinion_tracker_wave-4.pdf?fbclid=IwAR3HgPih2KPCdE8RUWogxBrn_yEMrNqDXdG16GYQPTj73Vkh23Jtb-tLH8U

p.24

Perception vs reality – the impact of Covid-19

Respondents across all countries were asked to enter a % for each category. The mean percentage is shown for each. Comparisons are shown on confirmed cases/deaths or, in the case of the UK, best modelled estimates of total COVID cases.

How many people in your country have died from coronavirus?

US - 9% - 225x confirmed deaths (CDC)

 

Every country surveyed overestimated by at least 100x actual, Germany 300x actual.  Of course there is a lot more in the report than just that question.

 

Edited August 9, 2020 by clapclapclap

[Captainant 28536]

2 minutes ago, clapclapclap said:

Poll:  Americans as a whole vastly overestimate WuFlu deaths.

https://www.kekstcnc.com/media/2793/kekstcnc_research_covid-19_opinion_tracker_wave-4.pdf?fbclid=IwAR3HgPih2KPCdE8RUWogxBrn_yEMrNqDXdG16GYQPTj73Vkh23Jtb-tLH8U

p.24

Perception vs reality – the impact of Covid-19

Respondents across all countries were asked to enter a % for each category. The mean percentage is shown for each. Comparisons are shown on confirmed cases/deaths or, in the case of the UK, best modelled estimates of total COVID cases.

How many people in your country have died from coronavirus?

US - 9% - 225x confirmed deaths (CDC)

 

Every country surveyed overestimated by at least 100x actual, Germany 300x actual.

 

That's a poll of regular people's perception of the pandemic. Not of the actual data. 

Are you posting this as support for the argument that covid is overblown? Not sure what this shows besides the regular population is freaked out about covid

[Lurch 5949]

He’s just asking questions

[workswithseed 2204]

4 minutes ago, Lurch said:

He’s just asking questions

Yes, Captainant is asking questions. Weird to bring that up.

[bad_teammate 13519]

I think it's very important to constantly gauge and critique perception and reality. It's not good that we think 100x more people are dying of this than are actually dying of it. That's not good. And those of us who believe this thing is real and believe we should be over-cautious in our approach, if we ignore things like this we just look stupid and naive.

Intake the information and think about why it's useful. If a troll is presenting it, then sure, say "fuck you" to the troll, but don't hide from the data.

-------------------------------------
Closely connected to growing public health concerns is how rife people think the virus is. Despite relatively low incidence rates compared to earlier in the pandemic in most countries (with the exception of the U.S.), people significantly over-estimate the spread and fatality rate of the disease. In Sweden and the UK for example, the public think 6-7% of people have died from coronavirus – around one hundred times the actual death rate based on official figures. And across countries, people think 5-12% of people currently have coronavirus. Perception is reality when it comes to coronavirus, and such views will be impacting consumer behaviour and wider attitudes – business leaders and governments will need to be conscious of this as they move to restart economies and transition into living with coronavirus for the medium to longer term.
-------------------------------------

We are being led poorly. I don't mean that in an exclusively political sense, but basically every institution with a voice is leading to this pathetic result among the people. We cannot make good decisions if our overall outlook is either "EVERYONE IS DYING!" or "THIS IS ALL FAKE!"

[CooterBrown 18288]

https://www.npr.org/2020/08/08/900494834/children-can-get-severe-covid-19-cdc-says-especially-black-and-hispanic-children


Despite persistent rumors that children are "almost immune" from the virus, the analysis of 576 children hospitalized for the virus across 14 states found that one out of three was admitted to the ICU — similar to the rate among adults. Almost 1 in 5 of those were infants younger than 3 months. The most common symptoms included fever and chills, inability to eat, nausea and vomiting.

[Pato del Muerto 53481]

2 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

I think it's very important to constantly gauge and critique perception and reality. It's not good that we think 100x more people are dying of this than are actually dying of it. That's not good. And those of us who believe this thing is real and believe we should be over-cautious in our approach, if we ignore things like this we just look stupid and naive.

Intake the information and think about why it's useful. If a troll is presenting it, then sure, say "fuck you" to the troll, but don't hide from the data.

-------------------------------------
Closely connected to growing public health concerns is how rife people think the virus is. Despite relatively low incidence rates compared to earlier in the pandemic in most countries (with the exception of the U.S.), people significantly over-estimate the spread and fatality rate of the disease. In Sweden and the UK for example, the public think 6-7% of people have died from coronavirus – around one hundred times the actual death rate based on official figures. And across countries, people think 5-12% of people currently have coronavirus. Perception is reality when it comes to coronavirus, and such views will be impacting consumer behaviour and wider attitudes – business leaders and governments will need to be conscious of this as they move to restart economies and transition into living with coronavirus for the medium to longer term.
-------------------------------------

We are being led poorly. I don't mean that in an exclusively political sense, but basically every institution with a voice is leading to this pathetic result among the people. We cannot make good decisions if our overall outlook is either "EVERYONE IS DYING!" or "THIS IS ALL FAKE!"

If the population in general doesn’t have an accurate idea of what is going on, who is to blame?  You can’t control how or where Americans consume their information, but that far off for that many people means the information out there by and large isn’t being delivered well. 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8983]

If the population in general doesn’t have an accurate idea of what is going on, who is to blame?  You can’t control how or where Americans consume their information, but that far off for that many people means the information out there by and large isn’t being delivered well. 

Agreed

[Mole 4339]

Humans aren’t very good at intuitively understanding numbers once they reach a certain size (both the humans and the numbers). It shouldn’t be a surprise that we aren’t accurately estimating how bad it is because that’s something we’re bad at.

Even smart, mathematically literate people are bad at this. I’m not sure we should read into these kinds of surveys beyond this.

[JimmyJames 12271]

2 hours ago, Pato del Muerto said:

If the population in general doesn’t have an accurate idea of what is going on, who is to blame?  You can’t control how or where Americans consume their information, but that far off for that many people means the information out there by and large isn’t being delivered well. 

Unfortunately the correct answer to your question can’t be answered on this thread since no politics are allowed. 

[JimmyJames 12271]

4 hours ago, clapclapclap said:

Poll:  Americans as a whole vastly overestimate WuFlu deaths.

https://www.kekstcnc.com/media/2793/kekstcnc_research_covid-19_opinion_tracker_wave-4.pdf?fbclid=IwAR3HgPih2KPCdE8RUWogxBrn_yEMrNqDXdG16GYQPTj73Vkh23Jtb-tLH8U

p.24

Perception vs reality – the impact of Covid-19

Respondents across all countries were asked to enter a % for each category. The mean percentage is shown for each. Comparisons are shown on confirmed cases/deaths or, in the case of the UK, best modelled estimates of total COVID cases.

How many people in your country have died from coronavirus?

US - 9% - 225x confirmed deaths (CDC)

 

Every country surveyed overestimated by at least 100x actual, Germany 300x actual.  Of course there is a lot more in the report than just that question.

 

That survey is worthless. Might as well ask 1000 people how far away in miles the moon is from the earth. 

[bad_teammate 13519]

23 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

That survey is worthless. Might as well ask 1000 people how far away in miles the moon is from the earth. 

just up yonder a ways

[Pato del Muerto 53481]

33 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

That survey is worthless. Might as well ask 1000 people how far away in miles the moon is from the earth. 

Depends on what time of year it is. Duh. 

[Neonmoon 38130]

56 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

That survey is worthless. Might as well ask 1000 people how far away in miles the moon is from the earth. 

Trick question, the answer is in kilometers 

[B00M 6734]

3 hours ago, Pato del Muerto said:

If the population in general doesn’t have an accurate idea of what is going on, who is to blame?  You can’t control how or where Americans consume their information, but that far off for that many people means the information out there by and large isn’t being delivered well. 

With one side under selling it, calling it a hoax for so long (still?), it seems reasonable for the other side to over sell it trying to compensate for the short comings of half the country... 

Edited August 9, 2020 by B00M
They're all after clicks. It sorta works out.

[scottsins 2047]

So are we just ignoring the “excess deaths indicate underreported Covid-caused fatalities?

It seems like it because there are several assertions debated in the last 50ish posts that are dependent on assuming that the “Covid-related deaths” number is gospel, and comparing it to other causes, etc. what’s the caparison to a similar timeframe last year, controlled for populations?

Do the numbers just line right up?

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

22 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

Trick question, the answer is in kilometers 

Only for the countries who haven't put men on the moon.

[BradInATX 9208]

4 hours ago, bad_teammate said:

I think it's very important to constantly gauge and critique perception and reality. It's not good that we think 100x more people are dying of this than are actually dying of it. That's not good. And those of us who believe this thing is real and believe we should be over-cautious in our approach, if we ignore things like this we just look stupid and naive.

Intake the information and think about why it's useful. If a troll is presenting it, then sure, say "fuck you" to the troll, but don't hide from the data.

-------------------------------------
Closely connected to growing public health concerns is how rife people think the virus is. Despite relatively low incidence rates compared to earlier in the pandemic in most countries (with the exception of the U.S.), people significantly over-estimate the spread and fatality rate of the disease. In Sweden and the UK for example, the public think 6-7% of people have died from coronavirus – around one hundred times the actual death rate based on official figures. And across countries, people think 5-12% of people currently have coronavirus. Perception is reality when it comes to coronavirus, and such views will be impacting consumer behaviour and wider attitudes – business leaders and governments will need to be conscious of this as they move to restart economies and transition into living with coronavirus for the medium to longer term.
-------------------------------------

We are being led poorly. I don't mean that in an exclusively political sense, but basically every institution with a voice is leading to this pathetic result among the people. We cannot make good decisions if our overall outlook is either "EVERYONE IS DYING!" or "THIS IS ALL FAKE!"

bad_teammate, 

 

voice of reason and moderation.

[atomheartbevo 90642]

1 hour ago, JimmyJames said:

That survey is worthless. Might as well ask 1000 people how far away in miles the moon is from the earth. 

'bout 72 hours.

[El Diablo 4232]

2 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

'bout 72 hours.

That's like 2, maybe 3 cases of beer. 

[atomheartbevo 90642]

2 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

That's like 2, maybe 3 cases of beer. 

They didn't nickname him 'Buzz' for nothing.

[Hefeweizen 5444]

So now that this "flu" is causing college football to be canceled, I wonder why?  I mean, those 18-22 year old football  players have nothing to fear from this virus, or so our experts in virology have assured us.  So why in the world would it be necessary to stop football games?  Color me further confused about this pandemic.

[atomheartbevo 90642]

Americans still going to Mexico for sex, so we got that going for us?

https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/09/americas/mexico-tijuana-prostitution-coronavirus-intl/index.html