CR: COVID-19 --Political Talk

[TornACL 7,698]

When places reopen but the economy continues to stagger, guarantee that the Rs will make going out to dinner at Olive Garden a flag clutching call to arms to show your patriotism.

Eat at Applebee's, for the good of the country. Those people who wear masks and stay at home are bad Americans. 

 

[Mrs Whiggins 13,050]

I have never eaten at Applebee's once much less three times @TornACL. Am I missing something?

[UpperWestside 6,163]

42 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

He has become an empty husk of a man, devoid of any spine, principles, or anything of that sort.  He is just an empty vessel, waiting to be filled with Trumpism to spew it later at his master's behest.  

If it wasn't so evil, it would be sad to watch.  He's a non-entity, a true nothing.  He's just whatever a vile creature wants him to be in a given moment.  How humiliating.  What a pathetic legacy.  He was on track for a legacy of, at worst, "former US Senator."  Now, he's just going to go down in the books as "another Trump lackey."  The level of debasement that GOP officials have CHOSEN for themselves is one of the things that still amazes me.

Perhaps this is just who he always was and Dotard gave him the free reign to show just exactly how terrible of a human being he is. I honestly do not understand these people and do not wish to. Whatever happened in that man's life that made him into such an evil person is sad because his words have an effect on people in Texas and it is not a good one. How people can so readily choose to be evil will forever confound me. 

[Guest Lobo]

Didn't Italian places like Olive Garden suffer from Covid-19 worse than American restaurants?  Same reason I'm not going to Panda King or Taco Cabana, because China and Spain had such bad outbreaks of CoronaVirus.  

[Brisketexan 105,113]

Just now, Lobo said:

Didn't Italian places like Olive Garden suffer from Covid-19 worse than American restaurants?  Same reason I'm not going to Panda King or Taco Cabana, because China and Spain had such bad outbreaks of CoronaVirus.  

By those metrics, you should be eating a shitload of kimchee and kiwi fruit.

[Wanker Bob 379]

7 minutes ago, TornACL said:

When places reopen but the economy continues to stagger, guarantee that the Rs will make going out to dinner at Olive Garden a flag clutching call to arms to show your patriotism.

Eat at Applebee's, for the good of the country. Those people who wear masks and stay at home are bad Americans. 

 

This is what I see when I look ahead. Sure right now mostly people are staying out of shit but we're still in restrictions and people are still mostly in wait and see mode. Once another 2-3 or so weeks of going stir crazy is met with full on opening happening I just don't see how any sizable percentage of the population has the discipline to not rush right back into the old habits and routines they yearn for right now. The data right now is reflecting the last few weeks of cautious partial opening. Once trump political pressure forces the doors open fully in the coming weeks that data is surely to change dramatically. 

[Brisketexan 105,113]

1 minute ago, Wanker Bob said:

This is what I see when I look ahead. Sure right now mostly people are staying out of shit but we're still in restrictions and people are still mostly in wait and see mode. Once another 2-3 or so weeks of going stir crazy is met with full on opening happening I just don't see how any sizable percentage of the population has the discipline to not rush right back into the old habits and routines they yearn for right now. The data right now is reflecting the last few weeks of cautious partial opening. Once trump political pressure forces the doors open fully in the coming weeks that data is surely to change dramatically. 

That pressure will work on Trumpkins.  It will.  And that's bad.  But over 50% of us aren't Trumpkins.  My family has no intention to go out to eat 5 meals a week.  Even once we do start to go out, we'll pick lightly traveled restaurants on lightly visited nights, and even then, maybe once every couple of weeks.

[Wanker Bob 379]

2 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

That pressure will work on Trumpkins.  It will.  And that's bad.  But over 50% of us aren't Trumpkins.  My family has no intention to go out to eat 5 meals a week.  Even once we do start to go out, we'll pick lightly traveled restaurants on lightly visited nights, and even then, maybe once every couple of weeks.

I agree that pressure will work on trumpkins. But then the trumpkins pressure on their non trumpkins friends/relatives/co-workers will work on almost everyone. Once non trumpkins start seeing all those social media posts and Instagram pics of happy hour and brunch mimosas it won't be long before it all falls back into old habits for the vast majority of the US. 

 

[conVINCEd 21,469]

Trumpkins pressuring non-Trumpkins into doing anything is one of the funniest things I’ve read today.  Thanks for that.

[jimmyjazz 45,910]

1 hour ago, Wanker Bob said:

I can't believe I have even less faith in Americans than you do but somehow I think opening up America and saying fuck caution will actually be a national rallying cry. It just seems to be headed that way. Hopefully your level of cynicism is more accurate than mine. 

Well, at least Trump will lose.  #brightside

[Wanker Bob 379]

15 minutes ago, conVINCEd said:

Trumpkins pressuring non-Trumpkins into doing anything is one of the funniest things I’ve read today.  Thanks for that.

It won't be direct verbal pressure, it'll be peer pressure on social media and through social relationships. All it takes is having zero restrictions and seeing social media posts, pics, and vids of their friends and co-workers out before it starts to snowball. It won't be anything political at all. Will just be an insatiable thirst for socialization plus social media pressure combined with open opportunity to do so. 

It's inevitable

[triplehorn 2,664]

6 minutes ago, Wanker Bob said:

I agree that pressure will work on trumpkins. But then the trumpkins pressure on their non trumpkins friends/relatives/co-workers will work on almost everyone. Once non trumpkins start seeing all those social media posts and Instagram pics of happy hour and brunch mimosas it won't be long before it all falls back into old habits for the vast majority of the US. 

 

If that's the case, the response will be one to behold after infections spike with that 2 week delay.  Abbott announced Phase 1 re-opening beginning May1st.  Now look 2 weeks later -  May 13th and 15th had 1,636 and 2,012 new cases, the first days of over 1500 new cases ever for TX, with the 3rd highest day being back on May 1st at 1,438.  Given that the prevalence of the virus increased by over 50% in TX  compared to two weeks ago (16k new on top of 29k then), if it reverts back to exponential growth now or soon, the numbers could get jaw dropping pretty damn fast.  Opinions and behavior for those resistant to accepting what is needed will be painfully tested.

[TornACL 7,698]

3 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

If that's the case, the response will be one to behold after infections spike with that 2 week delay.  Abbott announced Phase 1 re-opening beginning May1st.  Now look 2 weeks later -  May 13th and 15th had 1,636 and 2,012 new cases, the first days of over 1500 new cases ever for TX, with the 3rd highest day being back on May 1st at 1,438.  Given that the prevalence of the virus increased by over 50% in TX  compared to two weeks ago (16k new on top of 29k then), if it reverts back to exponential growth now or soon, the numbers could get jaw dropping pretty damn fast.  Opinions and behavior for those resistant to accepting what is needed will be painfully tested.

I thought we were testing more now than two weeks ago, and that likely explains much of the jump. No? 

[Player 4,575]

https://abc13.com/community-events/jeep-weekend-rolls-on-despite-covid-19-pandemic-rain/6188199/

[Mrs Whiggins 13,050]

Seems to me the positive cases are the lesser part of the equation since looking at the dashboard for Texas, it does appear that the positivity rate is going down? The concern to me is that the hospitalization number has started to creep back up. On a high of 1,888 on May 5 ( 3 weeks and two days after Easter), and a downward slope to 1,525 on May 11, the numbers are going up and are now at 1,791. There appears to be beds etc available, but will be something to watch if it doesn't stabilize.

[triplehorn 2,664]

16 minutes ago, TornACL said:

I thought we were testing more now than two weeks ago, and that likely explains much of the jump. No? 

Unless the volume of testing had an abrupt lurch upward in the last 3 days, I wouldn't expect 2 of the last 3 days to spike upward, but in this case there appears to be a reason for it.  It so happens that two weeks ago almost to the day Abbott signaled the start of initial steps at re-opening.  The time to double TX from 10k to 20k was 12 days.  20k to 40k was about 20 days.  Re-opening started at about 30k known cases.  With a reference number of about 47k known today, continued doubling even every 3 weeks will necessitate re-imposition of shut down measures to avoid crashing the health care system.  

[4th&Five 41,526]

Cool, cool

 

[babysdaddy 2,721]

Unless the volume of testing had an abrupt lurch upward in the last 3 days, I wouldn't expect 2 of the last 3 days to spike upward, but in this case there appears to be a reason for it.  It so happens that two weeks ago almost to the day Abbott signaled the start of initial steps at re-opening.  The time to double TX from 10k to 20k was 12 days.  20k to 40k was about 20 days.  Re-opening started at about 30k known cases.  With a reference number of about 47k known today, continued doubling even every 3 weeks will necessitate re-imposition of shut down measures to avoid crashing the health care system.  

Today is going to be our highest case day but lowest positive rate. What do you think that means?

[Anastasis 23,469]

5 minutes ago, babysdaddy said:

Today is going to be our highest case day but lowest positive rate. What do you think that means?

Hydroxychloroquine?

Edited May 16, 2020 by Anastasis

[Serak The Preparer 3,431]

3 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

You may have heard it.  But the actual data -- the economic activity happening -- says that people aren't running out to be in crowds and risk their health.  I mean, I know we think everyone is stupid (I sure do), and we hear idiots at loud volume....but the ACTUAL PERFORMANCE, what is ACTUALLY HAPPENING, doesn't bear that out.  Most restaurants that are open are NOT being filled even to their reduced capacity.  The nail salon doesn't have 'em lined up.  They just don't.  People remain cautious -- and that data bears out everywhere this is happening - Texas, Georgia, wherever.

What economic data are talking about? Is there anything published at state or city level that includes revenue by industry in last couple of weeks? I agree with you that we should use data when we have it but also shouldn't make up data.

[Message Board User 12,395]

Would be nice if some of our governors and our POTUS would copy the governor of Idaho.

 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,396]

[triplehorn 2,664]

1 hour ago, babysdaddy said:

Today is going to be our highest case day but lowest positive rate. What do you think that means?

Just need to demonstrate a sustained inversion of the slope of the growth curve for daily new cases.  

 

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

Hydroxychloroquine?

Maybe ?  NIH is now asking better questions. With the start of its just announced study that includes mild (early-ish?) cases, the picture might shift.  

It's obvious that communication is lacking around important considerations including differences in timing of use and in risk alone or use in combination with other meds. And that the incidence of adverse effects like G6PD associated hemolytic anemia and toxic retinopathy really only become measurable once people have been on HCQ for thousands of doses spanning years, not over 5 days for covid.

Check out this WaPo article today:

Drug promoted by Trump as coronavirus ‘game changer’ increasingly linked to deaths

Quote

May 15, 2020 at 3:41 p.m. PDT

For two months, President Trump repeatedly pitched hydroxychloroquine as a safe and effective treatment for coronavirus, asking would-be patients “What the hell do you have to lose?”

Growing evidence shows that, for many, the answer is their lives.

Clinical trials, academic research and scientific analysis indicate that the danger of the Trump-backed drug is a significantly increased risk of death for certain patients. Evidence showing the effectiveness of hydroxychloroquine in treating covid-19 has been scant. Those two developments pushed the Food and Drug Administration to warn against the use of hydroxychloroquine outside of a hospital setting last month, just weeks after it approved an emergency use authorization for the drug.

Alarmed by a growing cache of data linking the anti-malaria drug to serious cardiac problems, some drug safety experts are now calling for even more forceful action by the government to discourage its use. Several have called for the FDA to revoke its emergency use authorization, given hydroxychloroquine’s documented risks.

Claims about hydroxychloroquine to treat covid-19 have gained traction despite a lack of scientific evidence. How did this happen?

“They should say, ‘We know there are harms, and until we know the benefits, let’s hold off,’ ” said Joseph Ross, a professor of medicine and public health at Yale University, who added that the original authorization may have been warranted but new evidence has emerged about the drug’s risks.

“I’m surprised it hasn’t been revoked yet,” said Luciana Borio, who served as director for medical and biodefense preparedness of the National Security Council and was acting chief scientist at the FDA.

As the coronavirus has spread, the Trump administration has delivered mixed messages about whether a drug used to treat malaria should be used for the virus. 

Testimony this week from a former top vaccine official removed from his post last month further highlighted allegations that Trump’s White House pressured government scientists to quickly sign off on the untested drug in March, at the same time the president was pitching it as a “game changer.”

Rick Bright, former director of the Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, told Congress on Thursday that political pressure forced “dozens of federal scientists” to spend a harried 48-hour stretch rushing to put together a protocol for approving hydroxychloroquine for widespread use in covid-19 patients. Ultimately, that approach wasn’t taken. The FDA issued an emergency authorization for hospitalized covid-19 patients who cannot participate in a clinical trial.

In his whistleblower complaint, Bright said he was removed from his position in part because of his reluctance to promote the use of chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine, because they had not been tested and deemed safe for treating covid-19.

“It’s important to use available clinical data,” Bright told lawmakers. “And if we know there are potential risks, we need to make sure that we are cognizant of those risks and make sure those drugs are used in a very safe and controlled manner.”

Ousted vaccine official testifies country still lacks master plan amid pandemic

The White House did not respond to requests for comment. Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar attacked Bright on Thursday, saying “his allegations do not hold water.”

In a recent interview, FDA Commissioner Stephen Hahn denied that he was pressured to authorize hydroxychloroquine: “I can assure you 100 percent that the president has never pressured me to make a decision regarding any regulatory aspect of the FDA’s work.”

The FDA said in a statement Friday that it is continuing to evaluate its emergency use authorization for chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine, as it does with all such authorizations for drugs to ensure their continued safety.

“In general, the FDA may revise or revoke an EUA under certain circumstances, including information related to linked or suspected adverse events, newly emerging data that may contribute to revision of the FDA’s initial conclusion that a product may be effective against the particular threat or a material change in the risk/benefit assessment based on evolving understanding of the disease or condition,” the statement said.

Trump has continued to promote hydroxychloroquine without reservation while attacking those who question its effectiveness. He has described Bright as a “disgruntled employee” who is resisting the proposed treatment without cause.

“So we have had some great response, in terms of doctors writing letters and people calling on the hydroxychloroquine,” Trump told reporters Thursday. “And this guy is fighting it. There’s no reason to fight it. There’s no reason. But more importantly than that, we’ve had tremendous response to the hydroxy.”

But doctors, health experts and officials from Trump’s own administration say the evidence does not back up the president’s positive assertions. Those assertions, which Trump has claimed are partly based on “a feeling,” could be costing lives, they said.

Yogen Kanthi, assistant professor in the division of cardiovascular medicine at the University of Michigan, said that it has been clear that the combination of hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin — used to treat bacterial infections — could lead to cardiac arrhythmias, which cause the heart to beat irregularly or too fast or slow. Many patients hospitalized for covid-19 had underlying cardiovascular disease that put them at higher risk for arrhythmias, “so it shouldn’t be surprising we saw an increase in death,” he said.

“The question has been answered that if you have the infection and it’s significant enough to be in the hospital, the drug doesn’t seem to do anything for you,” he said. “It may be the horse is out of the barn.”

Many hospitals have stopped using the drug outside of clinical trials.

“We no longer are keeping large quantities and have returned most of it,” said Nishaminy Kasbekar, director of pharmacy for the Penn Presbyterian Medical Center in Philadelphia. “I think they should revoke the EUA because clearly based on the data it is no longer considered a treatment for covid.”

Some doctors, including one in Texas who is also a Republican committeeman, have continued to give the drug to coronavirus patients — with mixed results.

A study of Veterans Affairs patients hospitalized with the coronavirus found no benefit and higher death rates among those taking hydroxychloroquine, researchers said last month.

More than 27 percent of patients treated with hydroxychloroquine died, and 22 percent of those treated with the combination therapy died, compared with an 11.4 percent death rate in those not treated with the drugs, the study said.

Growing friction between White House, CDC hobbles pandemic response

The National Institutes of Health announced Thursday that it had begun a clinical trial of 2,000 adults to determine if the combination of hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin — the cocktail touted by Trump — works as a therapeutic for those with coronavirus.

“Although there is anecdotal evidence that hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin may benefit people with COVID-19, we need solid data from a large randomized, controlled clinical trial to determine whether this experimental treatment is safe and can improve clinical outcomes,” Anthony S. Fauci, the nation’s top infectious disease expert, said in a statement.

While Fauci has cautioned against drawing broad conclusions from anecdotal evidence, Trump’s promotion of the drug has been almost exclusively based on personal stories he has heard — often on cable news. He has largely ignored scientific studies to pitch the drug without caveat.

In a tweet shared 102,800 times and liked 384,800 times on March 21 Trump claimed that “HYDROXYCHLOROQUINE AZITHROMYCIN, taken together, have a real chance to be one of the biggest game changers in the history of medicine.”

He invited several recovered coronavirus patients to the White House last month, including some who said hydroxychloroquine saved their lives.

From mid-March through early April, Trump touted the drug as a potential panacea while downplaying any potential risks.

“The nice part is it’s been around for a long time, so we know that if things don’t go as planned, it’s not going to kill anybody,” he told reporters on March 19.

The president’s associates, including Fox host Laura Ingraham and his personal attorney, Rudolph W. Giuliani, have also pushed the drug as a treatment for covid-19 in private Oval Office meetings and phone calls.

Some Republican lawmakers have continued to promote hydroxychloroquine while attempting to defend Trump’s handling of the coronavirus pandemic, which has killed more than 86,000 Americans.

“When you’re the physician at the bedside, and there is a medication that has promise, and that has a safety profile that we understand — doctors will use this medication offline,” Rep. Larry Bucshon (R-Ind.) told Bright during Thursday’s hearing. “That’s what’s happening. Whether that’s right or wrong, it might take us years to prove, but in the meantime, people can die.”

The Trump administration deployed tens of millions of doses of the drug from the Strategic National Stockpile as the president promoted the FDA’s emergency use authorization. His repeated statements that the drug had been fully “approved” by the FDA in record time added to the false sense that hydroxychloroquine had been vetted and declared safe for use, experts said.

While the FDA didn’t intend for the authorization to signal an endorsement, many physicians and patients interpreted it that way, especially with “political figures saying the FDA had approved the drug,” said Jesse Goodman, former chief scientist at the FDA and now a Georgetown University professor.

“There’s a misperception out there that the EUA means that the FDA has approved the drug,” said Aaron S. Kesselheim, a professor of medicine at Harvard Medical School. “That’s wrong, of course, but it’s a widespread misconception driven by irresponsible statements from certain politicians and members of the media.”

Goodman and Kesselheim are among a growing number of medical experts calling for the FDA to revoke its emergency use authorization for hydroxychloroquine in light of new evidence about its risks.

While an emergency use authorization is not a full-fledged approval by the FDA, it allows unapproved drugs and devices to be used during a public health emergency. The standard for an emergency authorization is that the agency “determines that the known and potential benefits of the medical products for their intended uses outweigh their known and potential risks,” according to the agency.

Mark McClellan, who was FDA commissioner during President George W. Bush’s administration, said he disagreed with calls to revoke the authorization. He called for it to be strengthened with additional warnings about side effects for those with heart disease, adding that removing the emergency authorization could create access issues for people who need the drug for ailments other than covid-19. In weeks before the Veteran’s Administration study was released in late April, there was a steady stream of warnings from different physician groups about the potentially deadly side effects of hydroxychloroquine. On Apr. 8, the United States’ three cardiology medical groups urged “caution” in using the combination. On Apr. 21, a National Institutes of Health panel recommended against using hydroxychloroquine with azithromycin due to potential toxic effects.

While hydroxychloroquine is approved by the FDA to treat malaria, rheumatoid arthritis and lupus, some medical groups have long voiced concern that using it for coronavirus patients was particularly risky.

Several studies have been published since then that support those initial findings. Doctors in Brazil stopped a trial of chloroquine, closely related to hydroxychloroquine, after 11 patients died. They reported in JAMA Open Network on April 24 that in 81 patients, those who took high doses of the drug had a 3.6-fold higher death rate as compared to a lower dose group.

Brazil’s top health official resigned Friday following reported disagreements with President Jair Bolsonaro over the efficacy of the anti-malarial drug in curbing the rapid rise of coronavirus in Latin America’s largest country.

The departure of the oncologist Nelson Teich, who resigned less than one month after becoming health minister, came as Bolsonaro has followed Trump’s lead in wagering heavily on the drug. He has ordered its mass production despite serious questions over its side effects and its effectiveness in a country that now has the worst outbreak in the Southern Hemisphere.

Many public health officials have called for Trump to defer to his medical experts, a push that intensified last month after the president pondered aloud whether light or disinfectant could be used internally to kill the coronavirus.

“Data-free advocacy for projects rarely turns out well,” said Peter Lurie, a former top FDA official and president of Center for Science in the Public Interest who has criticized the promotion of hydroxychloroquine by politicians. “This was a product that never had a solid basis for believing it worked, and the data that has since emerged are not encouraging. The best thing to do is to leave drug review to the experts. That goes for hydroxychloroquine, it goes for bleach and it goes for ultraviolet light as well.”

the takeaway: “The question has been answered that if you have the infection and it’s significant enough to be in the hospital, the drug doesn’t seem to do anything for you,”

The article fails to make any distinction between early treatment vs initiation once requiring hospitalization, the latter of which is what US studies to date have involved.  The article also fails to make the distinction that combining AZ with HCQ appears to increase cardiovascular risk over HCQ alone, and HCQ given early may do just as well (if not better and more safely) as combining with zithro.  And finally, no mention whatsoever of the potential critical role of co-administering HCQ with 100-150mg/d Zinc for ~5 days for clinical benefit.  

Dr. David Ho, who spearheaded successful treatments for HIV, explained "you have to hit the virus early and hard" - before it takes hold.  Even the soon to be launched NIH study may not start subjects on HCQ until they've been positive or symptomatic for 7 days or more, mild or not, when it very well could be that starting within 72 hours makes all the difference.  

To date, I think we've been digging in the wrong place.

Edited May 16, 2020 by triplehorn

[Anastasis 23,469]

6 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

 

Check out this WaPo article today:

Drug promoted by Trump as coronavirus ‘game changer’ increasingly linked to deaths

  The article also fails to make the distinction that combining AZ with HCQ appears to increase cardiovascular risk over HCQ alone...

Wapo fails to make a crucially relevant point that posters on this site have been making since the jump. No fucking shit?

[TwiceHorn 31,457]

6 hours ago, pantone159 said:

This actually happened during WWII. Soon after the USA entered the war, the Germans sent some submarines to attack shipping on the east coast of the USA. They were devastating at first, partially because the merchants refused to turn off the lights, it was bad for business, and then the silhouettes of ships were easy to find and easy pickings.

 

It took quite a while for America to become what it became by the end of the war.

I heard a podcast about the political climate surrounding the 1918 pandemic and the Wilson administration.  Some fucked up shit went on then, too.

[TornACL 7,698]

2 hours ago, triplehorn said:

 

 

2 hours ago, triplehorn said:

Unless the volume of testing had an abrupt lurch upward in the last 3 days, I wouldn't expect 2 of the last 3 days to spike upward, but in this case there appears to be a reason for it.  It so happens that two weeks ago almost to the day Abbott signaled the start of initial steps at re-opening.  The time to double TX from 10k to 20k was 12 days.  20k to 40k was about 20 days.  Re-opening started at about 30k known cases.  With a reference number of about 47k known today, continued doubling even every 3 weeks will necessitate re-imposition of shut down measures to avoid crashing the health care system.  

If the state is accurate in their reporting, we've tested as many people in Texas thru May as we did in March and April combined. 

Edited May 16, 2020 by TornACL

[Bama Chick 28,596]

Tim Ryan has had it.

(Me too, Tim.)

“WHERE DO YOU LIVE????”

[honolulu horn 6,158]

8 minutes ago, Bama Chick said:

Tim Ryan has had it.

(Me too, Tim.)

“WHERE DO YOU LIVE????”

 

damn right

[staboner 4,969]

58 minutes ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

ah yes. reminds of when the US bombed the milk factory in iraq in '91.

milk. baby's milk, Mandrake

[pyrohornIII 4,814]

On 5/15/2020 at 3:41 PM, Bama Chick said:

We will never ever have that kind of cooperation and national spirit and pride ever again.

And there’s one reason - dumb people with attitudes.

Back then, dumb people weren’t personally aggrieved because smart people existed. Dumb people used to be able to get lifelong jobs that let them have a nice enough life and they were okay with letting the smart people run things.

Now, dumb people work in dumb jobs and spend 18 hours a day in front of any various type of screen; a screen with self curated news or entertainment or other like minded dumb people.

Their jobs suck. Their kids suck. Their housing sucks. Everything sucks.

And they KNOW it. But they’re too proud to admit it. And heaven help any know it all, busy body, smart person who points out their sucky lives.

So, anything backed by smart people and leaders is reflexively met with resistance and usually outright hostility and violence.

There is no more “Everyman” who will fall in line with a plan laid out by smart people and pull together for the national or global good.

There’s just “Joe Sixpack” and he ain’t got time for your bleeding heart, high falutin’ plan. His motto is “Fuck you, pay ME! And if I ain’t getting mine, no one is getting anything!”

America isn’t part of The Allies any more.

We’re The Axis.

Yes, this is exactly what Hitler played on to build his party.  It's been a while since I read the Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, but it seems there were a lot more political parties in Germany after WWI and it was easier for him to divide and conquer them.   With basically just two parties here, what are the odds of National Socialism actually taking hold?  They went from being a joke in the Blues Brothers to a real player in just those few decades.  Still, it is less than half the country being all out Trumpkins, and I just can't see their strength growing enough to be dominant in politics.   The biggest threat are those who are already in the judiciary, both state and federal.   

4 hours ago, Wanker Bob said:

It won't be direct verbal pressure, it'll be peer pressure on social media and through social relationships. All it takes is having zero restrictions and seeing social media posts, pics, and vids of their friends and co-workers out before it starts to snowball. It won't be anything political at all. Will just be an insatiable thirst for socialization plus social media pressure combined with open opportunity to do so. 

It's inevitable

It's also the pressure to go back to work and serve these inconsiderate asses.   That's where I fear more spread than peer pressure.  Only if we had some sort of system to protect the workers....

2 hours ago, babysdaddy said:

Today is going to be our highest case day but lowest positive rate. What do you think that means?

Up until this month, the state (and feds) were limiting tests to those most possible to be positive, via symptoms or contact.   They are beginning to loosen the restrictions.  More people getting tested without such potential to return positive results will actually help the percentages of cases vs tested.  The positive cases are offset by more negative cases, since the restrictions were lifted and more general population are being tested?  

[Wanker Bob 379]

2 hours ago, babysdaddy said:

Today is going to be our highest case day but lowest positive rate. What do you think that means?

That testing restrictions decreased but the virus has infected a lower percentage of the population than we hoped. 

So it's now infecting more people with loosened social restrictions but those borderline cases are coming back negative. Probably means a larger pool of non-immune hosts on which to feast.

[Pancho 44,767]

 

[GW Hayduke 1,953]

[Bama Chick 28,596]

This fucking idiot.

[Gengs1 2,583]

5 hours ago, Player said:

https://abc13.com/community-events/jeep-weekend-rolls-on-despite-covid-19-pandemic-rain/6188199/

Is it bad to be rooting for the virus?

[Bama Chick 28,596]

lol

[triplehorn 2,664]

bored punks

 

Spoiler

 

 

[Bama Chick 28,596]

All the “OPEN UP AMERICA!” yahoos want to know why a lot of us think you’re stupid and this shit is only going to get worse?

This administration has had THREE MONTHS of lockdown. The primary reason was to slow down the spread of this virus thus saving lives and preventing our health care system from being overwhelmed.

But it was also supposed to give the federal government some time to make plans and come up with solutions to allow the country to “open back up” safely and in accordance with living with this virus in the framework of normal life.

Yet - we have this.

NOTHING has been done with the time they have been given. America is going to have the worst of both scenarios - hundreds of thousands dead AND a completely fucked economy.

This entire lockdown will have been for nothing. Trump is crossing his fat sausage fingers and waiting for some magical solution - a pill, a vaccine, letting it burn out, hot weather, bleach IVs, a flashlight up the ass.

You can’t declare bankruptcy and quit when dealing with a virus. When the going gets tough, that’s the Trump way.

[4th&Five 41,526]

Sending his followers out to die to make a point. Also, they’re protesting his fucking guidelines. It’s just so stupid. 

 

[4th&Five 41,526]

(Plague!)

 

[Message Board User 12,395]

 

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13,584]

Why doesn't Texas report hospitalizations?

[HenryJames 66,048]

 

[burntorangebongos 10,710]

What a fucking liar. There were no lost weeks my ass. DIAF, dickhead.

[Wanker Bob 379]

On the other hand Spain just randomly antibody tested 70,000 people and found that as bad as their pandemic has been only roughly 5 % of the total population (10-14 percent of Madrid, 7% of Barcelon and lower elsewhere) has antibodies to the virus. Means lifting their very strict restrictions could mean another bad spike in cases. Also showing an infection fatality rate of 1.15 which is higher than thought. 

If the test is accurate and holds true for America as well we could be right at the beginning of a massive spike here in Texas. The numbers are trending down right now but that's 2-3 weeks at least behind. Since Texas doesn't report hospitalization numbers this could be difficult to track until it's too late to do much of anything. 

Quote

Things could get much worse

That is the fundamentally sobering lesson for America.

The US’s case volumes and daily death tolls have fallen over the course of May, which has generated lots of talk of bent curves and peaks. But there’s no mechanical reason that caseloads can’t rise as people start to travel again, as businesses reopen, and as even basic precautions like wearing a mask become fodder for culture wars.

Spain has suffered more than double America’s per-capita death toll, but that’s based on just 5 percent of the population becoming infected. If the US reaches infection rates of 10-20 percent — to say nothing of the 60 percent threshold some scientists think is necessary for herd immunity to kick in — there will likely be many more deaths.

The Spanish data suggests about 1.15 percent of those who got infected in Spain ended up dying. Spain has a significantly older age profile than the US, so Americans might be better off. But the fact remains that if the virus fully blows through our population, the US could end up with millions of deaths — there’s no secret pool of hidden infections to indicate the virus is much less deadly than assumed.

https://www.vox.com/2020/5/16/21259492/covid-antibodies-spain-serology-study-coronavirus-immunity

[Message Board User 12,395]

 

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13,584]

21 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

Look alive, North Korea! Comin' atchya!

[BrickHorn 18,224]

13 minutes ago, Wanker Bob said:

On the other hand Spain just randomly antibody tested 70,000 people and found that as bad as their pandemic has been only roughly 5 % of the total population (10-14 percent of Madrid, 7% of Barcelon and lower elsewhere) has antibodies to the virus. Means lifting their very strict restrictions could mean another bad spike in cases. Also showing an infection fatality rate of 1.15 which is higher than thought. 

If the test is accurate and holds true for America as well we could be right at the beginning of a massive spike here in Texas. The numbers are trending down right now but that's 2-3 weeks at least behind. Since Texas doesn't report hospitalization numbers this could be difficult to track until it's too late to do much of anything. 

https://www.vox.com/2020/5/16/21259492/covid-antibodies-spain-serology-study-coronavirus-immunity

If those numbers are accurate, then Spain’s stats point to a 1.2% CFR. That’s based on officially counted COVID deaths, which is likely low.  

[SameSame 1,704]

37 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

Every single state with Republican leadership, and especially Georgia & Florida, will be trying to manipulate the numbers in every way they can to support Trump.  In other words, it’s lie your ass off time for Dear Leader.

 The orders have been given. 

[tchookem 3,900]

Why doesn't Texas report hospitalizations?

That's not how we roll.