CR: COVID-19 --Political Talk

[4th&Five 41558]

I wonder what the acceptable number would be for president Hillary. 

[Neonmoon 38129]

5 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

What's not shown in that graphic is the % of Republicans who believe the true number of coronavirus deaths is something like 1K Americans.

I have coworkers who keep telling me doctors are inflating the numbers because it gives the more funding. They have this belief that people who were going to die soon anyways in a month or two that die with a positive Covid test are marked as Covid deaths. Same with a guy That died in a motorcycle accident with a positive Covid test. They think the death numbers are inflated and if they weren’t, it would be like the flu numbers. 
 

[Francisco 2.0 32395]

9 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

What's not shown in that graphic is the % of Republicans who believe the true number of coronavirus deaths is something like 1K Americans.

 

My MIL.  Still clinging to the "fact" that hospitals and doctors are lying, because Covid deaths make more money for hospitals and doctors.

[Francisco 2.0 32395]

 

 

[HenryJames 66121]

 

[Anastasis 23475]

1 minute ago, HenryJames said:

 

Better than hcq. 

[kevwun 15798]

That's been a treatment for months.

[TexArcher 37978]

2 hours ago, Beau Vine said:

I can't even...

This is fucking rage-inducing.

 

 

[Brisketexan 105155]

This is fucking rage-inducing.
 
 

Death.
Cult.

[Skyline 325]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

What's not shown in that graphic is the % of Republicans who believe the true number of coronavirus deaths is something like 1K Americans.

I didn't realize this was a thing, but I heard it from my friend's mouth yesterday and my jaw dropped. I couldn't believe it. This guy is a serious hand washing, extreme germaphobe, and yet he doesn't believe the numbers of people dead from Covid. I asked him why? What makes you think it's lower? In his mind hospitals are inflating numbers for money. He voted Trump in 2016 but plans on staying home for 2020. 

[4th&Five 41558]

Our fb board is full of folks that don’t believe the numbers are real. 

[mdmost 43004]

No, they believe that they're real. They just don't care because it's mostly old people and people who "were going to die anyway before Covid". And they just want their football, consequences be damned. 

[GRHorn 105]

39 minutes ago, mdmost said:

No, they believe that they're real. They just don't care because it's mostly old people and people who "were going to die anyway before Covid". And they just want their football, consequences be damned. 

No. You’re misrepresenting what most think there. They believe that unless you have no students on campus at all, the relative increased risk of a small group of heavily tested, precaution taking students practicing and playing football is very small. 

[washparkhorn 9939]

1 hour ago, Skyline said:

I didn't realize this was a thing, but I heard it from my friend's mouth yesterday and my jaw dropped. I couldn't believe it. This guy is a serious hand washing, extreme germaphobe, and yet he doesn't believe the numbers of people dead from Covid. I asked him why? What makes you think it's lower? In his mind hospitals are inflating numbers for money. He voted Trump in 2016 but plans on staying home for 2020. 

Heard the same thing - can't determine the source for propaganda. My guess it is coming from Laura, Hannity, or Tucker. 

Edited August 23, 2020 by washparkhorn

[Grade of D as in David 13253]

3 hours ago, Neonmoon said:

I have coworkers who keep telling me doctors are inflating the numbers because it gives the more funding. They have this belief that people who were going to die soon anyways in a month or two that die with a positive Covid test are marked as Covid deaths. Same with a guy That died in a motorcycle accident with a positive Covid test. They think the death numbers are inflated and if they weren’t, it would be like the flu numbers. 
 

Very progressive of your employer to hire so many of your special needs co-workers.

[Mrs Whiggins 13050]

22 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

Heard the same thing - can't determine the source for propaganda. My guess it is coming from Laura, Hannity, or Tucker. 

It's mostly Fox, but other news aggregates picked it up and ran with it. The problem is that the talking point first debuted in April (as numbers skyrocketed) and gained too much traction. If anyone googles it now: "Do hospitals receive more money for COVID deaths?" there are loads of links and fact checks debunking the falsehood or explaining what is actually happening with respect to how a death is classified. People are intellectually lazy and they want to be spoon fed soundbites so they can appear up to date and currant. Thus, the doubling down when questioned because admitting you don't really know is what losers do (in their mind), but actually admitting you were too lazy to learn is the bigger mistake in my view.

https://orthospinenews.com/2020/04/27/us-hospitals-getting-paid-more-to-label-cause-of-death-as-coronavirus/

https://fee.org/articles/physicians-say-hospitals-are-pressuring-er-docs-to-list-covid-19-on-death-certificates-here-s-why/https://tenthfloorliving.com/hospitals-receive-more-money-if-deaths-are-listed-as-covid-19/

https://gellerreport.com/2020/04/covid-death-numbers-inflated.html/

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2020/05/29/us_covid-19_death_toll_is_inflated.html

[washparkhorn 9939]

7 minutes ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

It's mostly Fox, but other news aggregates picked it up and ran with it. The problem is that the talking point first debuted in April (as numbers skyrocketed) and gained too much traction. If anyone googles it now: "Do hospitals receive more money for COVID deaths?" there are loads of links and fact checks debunking the falsehood or explaining what is actually happening with respect to how a death is classified. People are intellectually lazy and they want to be spoon fed soundbites so they can appear up to date and currant. Thus, the doubling down when questioned because admitting you don't really know is what losers do (in their mind), but actually admitting you were too lazy to learn is the bigger mistake in my view.

https://orthospinenews.com/2020/04/27/us-hospitals-getting-paid-more-to-label-cause-of-death-as-coronavirus/

https://fee.org/articles/physicians-say-hospitals-are-pressuring-er-docs-to-list-covid-19-on-death-certificates-here-s-why/https://tenthfloorliving.com/hospitals-receive-more-money-if-deaths-are-listed-as-covid-19/

https://gellerreport.com/2020/04/covid-death-numbers-inflated.html/

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2020/05/29/us_covid-19_death_toll_is_inflated.html

Thank you. Excellent analysis of the propaganda problem.  Hook 'em. 

[Homercles 10206]

 

[4th&Five 41558]

 

[NameAlreadyInUse 5114]

5 hours ago, 4th&Five said:

I wonder what the acceptable number would be for president Hillary. 

2. 

[Sawbonz 27578]

6 hours ago, Neonmoon said:

I have coworkers who keep telling me doctors are inflating the numbers because it gives the more funding. They have this belief that people who were going to die soon anyways in a month or two that die with a positive Covid test are marked as Covid deaths. Same with a guy That died in a motorcycle accident with a positive Covid test. They think the death numbers are inflated and if they weren’t, it would be like the flu numbers. 
 

The amount of money hospitals lost by not being able to perform elective surgeries and procedures for 6-8 weeks is easily 10 times the amount they received for covid vent patients, even if the amt is truly 39k, and I have not found a credible source for that number anywhere 

[4th&Five 41558]

18 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

2. 

I’ll take the under. 

[washparkhorn 9939]

22 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

The amount of money hospitals lost by not being able to perform elective surgeries and procedures for 6-8 weeks is easily 10 times the amount they received for covid vent patients, even if the amt is truly 39k, and I have not found a credible source for that number anywhere 

Facts.

[Anastasis 23475]

So what was the therapeutic breakthrough announcement?

[hookemATL 11759]

3 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

So what was the therapeutic breakthrough announcement?

Pop rocks and soda. 

[StassneyHorn 6614]

On 8/22/2020 at 12:50 PM, Lobo said:

You guys serious? The most geographically beautiful state without ocean coasts is hands down---Utah.  And it's deep, deep red.  And I love visiting there.  As do millions of tourists.  Same could be said for Wyoming, Idaho, and Montana.  The Ozarks are deep red and gorgeous, as are parts of the Smoky Mountains in Red Tennessee and Purple North Carolina (stretch from Asheville to Chattanooga in particular).  And the coastal area from Charleston to Savannah.    Lots of great places to drink and camp and hike in Kentucky, same for South Dakota.  The northwoods of Wisconsin/Michigan are my favorite places to fish and canoe in the whole continent.    
Now you can definitely keep on the shitlist places like Nebraska, Oklahoma, Kansas, Louisiana, Alabama, Mississippi, Ohio, Indiana, et. al. Problem is Trump voters look at places like Orlando or Biloxi and think, 'ROAD TRIP!'  

Knoxville and Chattanooga been on my mind for a bit. Memphis if I want to be a slumlord.

[Guest Lobo]

You do you, Mr. Landlord       .  But a good chunk of SouthEastern Tennessee is all that.  Only one fishing trip back that way, but a half dozen hiking/camping trips and it was all phenomenal and gorgeous. 

[HornPhD 1368]

On 8/19/2020 at 10:24 AM, kevwun said:

Call her up and tell her you're not accepting the covid excuse because it's a liberal hoax.  No written records so you can deny it later.

I have two pages before I catch up. I’m hoping you called her. 

[WhatTheBuck 28788]

1 hour ago, hookemATL said:

Pop rocks and soda. 

That's what killed Mikey!

[wildcat09 29355]

21 hours ago, Beau Vine said:

I can't even...

So who the hell are the 10% of Dems who think it's been acceptable?

[Brisketexan 105155]

13 hours ago, hookemATL said:

Pop rocks and soda. 

Motherfucker...

[4th&Five 41558]

 

[Dark Horse 2284]

The third tweet in the chain is interesting

 

3) Since reinfection can occur, herd immunity by natural infection is unlikely to eliminate #SARSCoV2. The only safe and effective way to achieve herd immunity is through vaccination. (4/n)

[jimmyjazz 45976]

1 hour ago, wildcat09 said:

So who the hell are the 10% of Dems who think it's been acceptable?

Those would be Republicans.

[Brisketexan 105155]

16 minutes ago, Dark Horse said:

The third tweet in the chain is interesting

 

3) Since reinfection can occur, herd immunity by natural infection is unlikely to eliminate #SARSCoV2. The only safe and effective way to achieve herd immunity is through vaccination. (4/n)

Yeah.....that's a big extrapolation from literally a single case.  Just because reinfection due to strain difference is technically possible, albeit statistically super-rare, doesn't mean that repeated vaccinations etc. are the only way to control the disease.

It is most likely that a sustained vaccination program will knock the disease down significantly.  When it does flare up again (and it will, from time to time), it will be localized, won't spread as easily, and should be easier to contain.  And, for that matter, as we are already aware of genetic variations, we can start to develop alternate vaccines for those variations that can be 1) kept on standby for small outbreaks and 2) ramped up into production to contain an outbreak that starts to spread.

We will have to live with COVID forever, but we don't have to live with it as a pandemic forever.

[GRHorn 105]

1 hour ago, Dark Horse said:

The third tweet in the chain is interesting

 

3) Since reinfection can occur, herd immunity by natural infection is unlikely to eliminate #SARSCoV2. The only safe and effective way to achieve herd immunity is through vaccination. (4/n)

Or looking at it another way, it’s provides more evidence supporting the theory that other coronaviruses are providing some immunity. The patient was asymptomatic the second time. 

[relapse98 634]

On 8/22/2020 at 10:41 PM, Degenerate Gardner said:

Dropped my daughter off today to start nursing school. 

No pics.

Which club she stripping at?

[GRHorn 105]

Some more info on these findings 

https://twitter.com/avik/status/1297860934829047808?s=21
 

 

 

 

[GRHorn 105]

 

[Guest Lobo]

Happy to listen to Hong Kong's ideas about this.  They lost 77 people out of 7.7mm people.  We've lost 180,000 out of 330mm people.  

But think about 0.00001 versus 0.0005 

We were once in a position to go about a solution like Hong Kong, Sweden, et. al.  But that ship sailed for us in February and the only way we can get back on is to die.  

[jimmyjazz 45976]

43 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

Or looking at it another way, it’s provides more evidence supporting the theory that other coronaviruses are providing some immunity. The patient was asymptomatic the second time. 

Uhhh . . . I don't think there's anything particularly true about that statement, at all.

[GRHorn 105]

40 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Uhhh . . . I don't think there's anything particularly true about that statement, at all.

Let me help. 

Pt gets Covid 1st time. Hospitalized for 2 weeks. 

Pt gets different strain Covid 2nd time. Asymptomatic. 

So either the patient was asymptomatic the second time because the mutation made the virus that weak, or there’s still some residual immunity (likely T cell mediated) from the original Covid infection that helped him fight it off easily. 

If you buy theory there’s residual immunity from initial Covid infection, then it’s not a big leap to believe there’s signifiant portion of population walking around with some degree of immunity due to garden variety coronaviruses we see all the time. 

[jimmyjazz 45976]

3 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

Let me help. 

Pt gets Covid 1st time. Hospitalized for 2 weeks. 

Pt gets different strain Covid 2nd time. Asymptomatic. 

So either the patient was asymptomatic the second time because the mutation made the virus that weak, or there’s still some residual immunity (likely T cell mediated) from the original Covid infection that helped him fight it off easily.

Or the viral load on round 2 was mild and so no significant infection occurred. 

[GRHorn 105]

10 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Or the viral load on round 2 was mild and so no significant infection occurred. 

That is a possibility. 
 

Another thought, I’m not a virologist but the utility of a vaccine for a bug that mutates sufficiently to reinfect people inside of 5 months has to be lowered. 

[Anastasis 23475]

5 hours ago, wildcat09 said:

So who the hell are the 10% of Dems who think it's been acceptable?

Not nearly as surprising to me as the independents. 

[MonkeyDoughnut 10301]

19 hours ago, Sawbonz said:

The amount of money hospitals lost by not being able to perform elective surgeries and procedures for 6-8 weeks is easily 10 times the amount they received for covid vent patients, even if the amt is truly 39k, and I have not found a credible source for that number anywhere 

Part of the HHS CARES ACT?? more than 39k...

https://www.hhs.gov/about/news/2020/07/17/hhs-begin-distributing-10-billion-additional-funding-hospitals-high-impact-covid-19-areas.html#:~:text=As COVID-19 continues to,and other healthcare providers%2C including

Government distributing $175B+ in funds to hospitals dealing with COVID

"On June 8, 2020, HHS sent communications to all hospitals about plans to distribute a second round of funding to high impact COVID-19 areas and asked them to submit data on their COVID-19 positive-inpatient admissions for the period January 1, 2020, through June 10, 2020. Their submissions were used to determine their eligibility and share of the second round of the funding being announced today to ensure hospitals are equitably supported in the battle against this pandemic."

"The first round of funding was based on a formula that distributed funds to hospitals with 100 or more COVID-19 admissions between January 1 and April 10, 2020 and paid $76,975 per eligible admission."

Second round "...Hospitals will be paid $50,000 per eligible admission."

 

[lemonlime 5503]

10 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Not nearly as surprising to me as the independents. 

It's because no one is truly independent now.  The "independents" are about 40% death cult members, consistent with those numbers.

[MonkeyDoughnut 10301]

As a followup on HHS CARES COVID payments, found this interesting "methodology" matrix with these items:

https://www.aha.org/system/files/media/file/2020/05/details-on-hhs-distribution-of-emergency-funds-bulletin-5-8-2020.pdf

HHS noted that this payment is not intended to reimburse the
specific cost of these admissions. Rather, the number of COVID-19 admissions was
being used as a proxy for the extent to which each facility experienced lost revenue and
increased expenses associated with directly treating a substantial number of COVID-19
inpatient admissions.

Recipient certifies that it:
 provides or provided after January 21, 2020 diagnoses, testing, or care for individuals with possible*3 or
actual cases of COVID-19;

Footnote:

3 The Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) “broadly views every patient as a possible case of COVID-19.” Id.

[ChiTownDoc 21154]

4 hours ago, Dark Horse said:

The third tweet in the chain is interesting

 

3) Since reinfection can occur, herd immunity by natural infection is unlikely to eliminate #SARSCoV2. The only safe and effective way to achieve herd immunity is through vaccination. (4/n)

This is bizarre.  With such a tiny percent being re-infected how's that make any sense?  Unless they're saying all of our immunity or a significant percentage will soon be wearing off? 

[GRHorn 105]

37 minutes ago, ChiTownDoc said:

This is bizarre.  With such a tiny percent being re-infected how's that make any sense?  Unless they're saying all of our immunity or a significant percentage will soon be wearing off? 

That was my concern, dude. I’m not a virologist but I immediately thought the opposite of her