CR: COVID-19 --Political Talk

[Mrs Whiggins 13050]

Remember when Trump said it would all go away? The invisible enemy? He's like Fat Bastard. We're still dealing with his smelly farts long after he's left the room.

He's managed to normalize a death toll so large only about 55 American cities are larger. Pretty sad, pretty horrific.

[4th&Five 41557]

 

Edited January 8, 2021 by 4th&Five

[4th&Five 41557]

More of this, please. 

 

[Goredho 17406]

My mom just got her first shot of the Pfizer vaccine.  Second shot in 1 month's time.  Hallelujah.

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19101]

 
Cuomo is really knocking this shit out of the park.  He might somehow be doing a worse job than Abbott.

He is.

[Longhorn_Fan68 33871]

Y'all joked about this, but heb about to fuck covid up:

https://communityimpact.com/austin/central-austin/coronavirus/2021/01/11/h-e-b-launches-covid-19-vaccine-registration-portal-but-awaits-additional-doses/

[honolulu horn 6158]

COVID has now killed as many people as live in Honolulu, Anaheim, or Aurora CO (Aurora is about 1/3 of the entire Denver metro area). By the end of January we will have eradicated New Orleans. 

Fuck Donald Trump. 

[Jive Turkey 12600]

 

[lemonlime 5503]

They also gave Covid to Rep. Bonnie Coleman Watson, who is black, 75-years-old, and a cancer survivor.  https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/mob-attack-capitol-coronavirus-congresswoman/2021/01/11/edae7c5e-5438-11eb-a08b-f1381ef3d207_story.html

[4th&Five 41557]

 

[Don Johnson 4753]

On 1/5/2021 at 1:15 PM, wildcat09 said:

 

Cuomo is really knocking this shit out of the park.  He might somehow be doing a worse job than Abbott.

 

[horn4life 3760]

Been Busy but here is a long update of possible interest Since I have some insights into the administration of the vaccine with my wife and daughter being pharmacists with a Nurse in training---

As any of you know trying to find the vaccine for an elderly parent is difficult.  The doses are limited and knowing when, where and how to get in line via registration or otherwise is difficult to say the least.  My wife is a pharmacist and while she is on the nursing home side of the business, she knows a lot of folks that know other pharmacists.  So she has been trying every day to make calls to find some doses for her elderly parents we assist nearly daily (they are the one's I cook the hot pockets for in the food thread).  So last week she got them on a list at a smaller pharmacy, but the pharmacy had no idea of when or amount of doses they would receive.  Which is par for the course as they flow is inconsistent and sporadic at most any pharmacy.  When it comes in, they try to get it out ASAP.  But the management of getting people in line for every dose incredibly is how I managed to get a dose yesterday with 5 minutes left on the clock. 

So yesterday evening, my wife got a call from a friend whose husband is a pharmacist about an hour out of Austin.  She said that he still had several doses that were assigned to people on the wait list, but that they had not shown up.  I sort of gathered that this must have not been their first clinic, because they had this same situation once before with a dose or two left from no shows?  It is a use it or lose it thing with these doses. My wife went and grabbed her folks and headed out on the hope of a first dose.  I sat down and contemplated what meal I was going to make and made myself a beverage thinking of football.  Roughly an hour later the wife calls and asks "Do I want a dose?" I'm about to turn 60 and have my own elderly parents, and want old folks to get a dose, but if it's gonna go to waste? I was told if one of the no shows appeared, or an older person walked in I wouldn't get a dose. If that doesn't happen and I don't show the dose is gonna get tossed. I then overhead the Pharmacist say he would wait for me. I then I hopped in the truck and hauled ass. 

I hauled ass, and got there in like 40 minutes about 15 minutes before closing time.  I asked even how this was available and he said it was technically that little remaining dose you end up with from using multiple 10 dose vials with a hair extra.  I also asked if there wasn't an older person they knew to take the dose and he explained that the other employees has already done that on a couple other no show doses.  WHO are these folks reserving doses and then NOT showing up???? Is it a transportation thing because they are elderly? Children registering and not cancelling for older parents or what? 

Anyhow I got a does of the Moderna yesterday, but have no idea how I will get the second follow up dose. But when I got it, they were gonna toss it in 10 minutes.  I still feel an underlying guilt for some reason.  Wasn't there some older person who should have gotten it? There obviously was somewhere, and likely near by, but that is the problem with the nature of organizing this roll out.  

So why I am posting this?  To let others know that right now it's going to be try to get your elderly parents on a list for a vaccination, somewhere/anywhere you can.  Which as hard to do even if you know everywhere to try. But there is apparently some opportunity to get access to the last doses if people who the doses were reserved for do not show up.  For the most part I DO NOT believe no shows are frequent, but I also know that private businesses do NOT want to overpromise and underdeliver.  They are not going to promise more doses than they have been allocated.  So there MAY be some sort of last minute availability at the end of the day at vaccine clinics that are based on reserving doses. Pharmacist said to try and get another dose on Feb 8th, or as close to that date as possible. I think by then the second tier access will be available which is a category I do belong to, so hopefully the second dose will be easier to come by.  Or I am gonna spend a lot of cold nights in February hoping for rural no shows for my second dose, or that last dose they hope to squeeze out from the overages.  Our worry has always been accidentally killing my wife's folks trying to help take care of them accidentally.  IF I can get a second dose, a February I think I am going to try and find a way to help out and volunteer to guide traffic or something when we start having larger clinics in Austin.  I thought I might be able to get licensed to give injections, but I do not think that's possible, unless it's botox? Any other thoughts on how to "pay it forward" once I am fully vaccinated (hopefully.) I thought about food bank too.  I can do a lot more if I am less afraid of accidentally killing people via accidental transmission.  

Here is the flip side of the coin Nursing homes- My wife had been trying like hell to coordinate with Nursing homes in California to schedule and CONFIRM their covid vaccine clinics.  Her homes are in Texas, but she was assigned 60 homes in California to try to coordinate scheduling with.  She is great at her job and honestly cares about getting doses into residents. So she religiously checks the "scheduled" and "confirmed" lists making sure that the facilities actually follow up and get the clinics scheduled! About 20 percent simply do not call in and confirm the testing.  Thank God she watches closely and prevented several clinics from being cancelled this week because of lack of confirmation.  Technically this is not her job, she gets them the right info and they are supposed to take care of their end.  But even when the clinic is scheduled for the Nursing home her company does not always have the doses they were supposed to be allocated.  So in one instance here in town they only had 150 of the 240 doses they thought they would have.  So they vaccinated who they could, and rescheduled the rest.  Well you guessed it somebody was mad that their parent did not get vaccinated, and went to the news.  Well here is the news, this is not a smooth process.  IF the allocations promised were in the place they were supposed to be when they were supposed to be the private contractors could manage the flow better.  This is NOT to say the private contractors do not screw up, but with supply chains screwed up that's an inevitability with so many moving parts.  The good news is that slowly but surely they are digging though and getting the homes scheduled and old folks vaccinated.  Thee hiccups from the first week are fewer in the second, and will likely be even better by the end of next week.  With 40% of the deaths coming from nursing home residents this is a huge priority in trying to reduce the death count.  

My daughter works as a pharmacist in New Orleans for the biggest hospital network there and they have similar issues from the supply side.  Now it's more like, we are shipping X quantity out today.  So there is not a lot of lead time in planning. It's here...then it's gone. When are they getting more? Soon... hopefully. Then a call... We are shipping you Y quantity. For them it's a bit easier to try and get a greater percentage of the shot in the arms of the right people, since they are the dominant provider in the area and apparently have decent communication with their target groups.  Seems like that is where the biggest issue is, managing the sign ups properly to match up with the priority groups, to match with the supply delivered. The addition of not knowing how much or when you are getting the next vaccine shipment adds another layer of challenge to an already difficult task.

So things are getting better.  I wish like hell we would have had real planning on the roll out back in November but with the Trump Administration failing to even determine who should get the vaccine first and formulating rules until the middle of December that was an impossibility. As if the demographics of who should be vaccinated first were not known clearly back in the Summer.  But things are slowly but surely breaking the right way.  Let's all PRAY that the Biden administration's wanting to take vaccinating more seriously and LEADING helps get the vaccines into arms.  It's going to take a little time for the new Administration to get up to speed, but I expect we will be able to see real progress by the first or second week of February.  

MY OPINION - IMHO -

1) I think we should release as much as 50% or more of the reserved doses.  I do NOT like taking the risk on the supply chain catching up, but wise use of the military production act should help us here, especially with the Moderna vaccine with the longer lead time between doses. We need to study right now the efficacy of the vaccines if the second doses are delayed what is the effect of efficacy? Get some volunteers into some studies here today.

2) Lists versus Lines?  Lists would have been the best way, but right now lines are the ONLY way to speed out the vaccinations.  The time for lists and planning was months ago, everything now is just an adaptation.  Lists are much better for old people, but online lists are hard for them...  So I think we have to switch to lines.  I would have the lines be prioritized by age, with gradual staged openings for the younger groups as each day went on.  Limit the number of cars that EXPECT to get vaccinations, but secure a group of folks who KNOW they may not get the vaccine, but might from the additional doses.  We give these folks some sort of card for priority access the next Vaccine Clinic.  They are going to wait and some may get that extra squeezed dose. Most will not. But we need to be damn sure we do not waste any doses, thus these folks.

3) Can we really get the military production act working properly?  Can we find a way to squeeze more production of vaccine out with the help of the ACT?  I honestly do not know, but my #1 assertion of letting more vaccine flow to even out the supply hiccups is largely depending on some increased levels of efficiency here.

Well Fuck that was Long!  You should get the Presidential Medal of Freedom if you read this diatribe.  But I know a lot more about what is actually happening on the ground now than I did last week, and providing a plethora of often useless information is a specialty of mine.  It's more fun from a bar stool trust me!

 

Edited January 12, 2021 by horn4life

[Anastasis 23472]

30 minutes ago, horn4life said:

1) I think we should release as much as 50% or more of the reserved doses. 

All of this. 

[Anastasis 23472]

BTW, both my parents and in laws are scheduled for this week. Took a little doing, and some back channels to accomplish, but they are in.  

[Captainant 27677]

32 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

BTW, both my parents and in laws are scheduled for this week. Took a little doing, and some back channels to accomplish, but they are in.  

Must be nice to have the hookups. My 65yo dad in a nursing home is still waiting on his first dose.

[Anastasis 23472]

8 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Must be nice to have the hookups. My 65yo dad in a nursing home is still waiting on his first dose.

Not necessarily any special hookup, just a lot of leg work and persistence.  My parents were established patients with Austin ENT and able to get on their list; my in laws got a number from a friend of a friend and were able to get an appt at a local clinic. 

Have you talked with his nursing home to determine what their vaccine protocols and timing are?  As I understand it after next week Texas is going to stop reserving substantial doses for care facilities, so they better have a plan in place at this point or the doses might start getting pushed out to 1B more aggressively. 

 

From DSHS:

In addition to the vaccine outlined above, Texas will reserve 121,875 doses for the federal Pharmacy Partnership for Long-Term Care program. [b]This completes the first doses the state has been required to set aside, freeing up that much more vaccine to be shipped to providers each week in the future.[/b] Texas providers will also receive about 500,000 doses intended as the second dose for people first vaccinated a few weeks ago.

Edited January 12, 2021 by Anastasis

[Captainant 27677]

Just now, Anastasis said:

Have you talked with his nursing home to determine what their vaccine protocols and timing are?  As I understand it after next week Texas is going to stop reserving substantial doses for care facilities, so they better have a plan in place at this point or the doses might start getting pushed out to 1B more aggressively. 

We have, he's in an unfortunate limbo getting moved between rehabilitation hospitals to more adequately care for a bedsore that developed into a wound at a nursing home we just moved him out of. We have been calling and asking but haven't gotten much more than "we'll let you know" 

[Anastasis 23472]

Just now, Captainant said:

We have, he's in an unfortunate limbo getting moved between rehabilitation hospitals to more adequately care for a bedsore that developed into a wound at a nursing home we just moved him out of. We have been calling and asking but haven't gotten much more than "we'll let you know" 

That's terrible.  Might get more difficult after they stop reserving doses for the LTC program. If you post his locale I am sure some posters here would try to help locate a dose for him or provide some advice. There is a lot of chatter on the DT vaccine thread about availability.  Obviously more complex if he is institutionalized.  

[jimmyjazz 45960]

Any recs on drive-thru rapid testing in the Austin area?  My wife found out she had a short exposure to someone last Wednesday who came down with symptoms on Saturday.  Both were masked, in a decent sized room with good ventilation, so all in all, I don't suppose her risk is super high, but it's not exactly comforting.  She has a telemed appointment at 6 PM with ADC but that would just screen for the test that doesn't return results any sooner than 24 hours, and as of now it's not even clear if she could get that test tonight.  Would there be a substantial difference in accuracy for the two different types of tests?  Obviously we're not looking for evidence of prior infection.

I don't know anything about the various community clinics.  Tarrytown Pharmacy has some time slots, although I'd have to handle the insurance filing myself, but that's fine.

Edited January 12, 2021 by jimmyjazz

[Anastasis 23472]

47 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Any recs on drive-thru rapid testing in the Austin area?  My wife found out she had a short exposure to someone last Wednesday who came down with symptoms on Saturday.  Both were masked, in a decent sized room with good ventilation, so all in all, I don't suppose her risk is super high, but it's not exactly comforting.  She has a telemed appointment at 6 PM with ADC but that would just screen for the test that doesn't return results any sooner than 24 hours, and as of now it's not even clear if she could get that test tonight.  Would there be a substantial difference in accuracy for the two different types of tests?  Obviously we're not looking for evidence of prior infection.

I don't know anything about the various community clinics.  Tarrytown Pharmacy has some time slots, although I'd have to handle the insurance filing myself, but that's fine.

I'd do Tarrytown myself, but be aware that they do not do PCR tests, only rapid antigen tests. 

[jimmyjazz 45960]

What's the risk with the rapid antigen test?  Is 6 days after potential exposure too soon?

I've been trying to study up but there is a lot of murky info out there.

[immamac 42852]

3 hours ago, horn4life said:

Been Busy but here is a long update of possible interest Since I have some insights into the administration of the vaccine with my wife and daughter being pharmacists with a Nurse in training---

As any of you know trying to find the vaccine for an elderly parent is difficult.  The doses are limited and knowing when, where and how to get in line via registration or otherwise is difficult to say the least.  My wife is a pharmacist and while she is on the nursing home side of the business, she knows a lot of folks that know other pharmacists.  So she has been trying every day to make calls to find some doses for her elderly parents we assist nearly daily (they are the one's I cook the hot pockets for in the food thread).  So last week she got them on a list at a smaller pharmacy, but the pharmacy had no idea of when or amount of doses they would receive.  Which is par for the course as they flow is inconsistent and sporadic at most any pharmacy.  When it comes in, they try to get it out ASAP.  But the management of getting people in line for every dose incredibly is how I managed to get a dose yesterday with 5 minutes left on the clock. 

So yesterday evening, my wife got a call from a friend whose husband is a pharmacist about an hour out of Austin.  She said that he still had several doses that were assigned to people on the wait list, but that they had not shown up.  I sort of gathered that this must have not been their first clinic, because they had this same situation once before with a dose or two left from no shows?  It is a use it or lose it thing with these doses. My wife went and grabbed her folks and headed out on the hope of a first dose.  I sat down and contemplated what meal I was going to make and made myself a beverage thinking of football.  Roughly an hour later the wife calls and asks "Do I want a dose?" I'm about to turn 60 and have my own elderly parents, and want old folks to get a dose, but if it's gonna go to waste? I was told if one of the no shows appeared, or an older person walked in I wouldn't get a dose. If that doesn't happen and I don't show the dose is gonna get tossed. I then overhead the Pharmacist say he would wait for me. I then I hopped in the truck and hauled ass. 

I hauled ass, and got there in like 40 minutes about 15 minutes before closing time.  I asked even how this was available and he said it was technically that little remaining dose you end up with from using multiple 10 dose vials with a hair extra.  I also asked if there wasn't an older person they knew to take the dose and he explained that the other employees has already done that on a couple other no show doses.  WHO are these folks reserving doses and then NOT showing up???? Is it a transportation thing because they are elderly? Children registering and not cancelling for older parents or what? 

Anyhow I got a does of the Moderna yesterday, but have no idea how I will get the second follow up dose. But when I got it, they were gonna toss it in 10 minutes.  I still feel an underlying guilt for some reason.  Wasn't there some older person who should have gotten it? There obviously was somewhere, and likely near by, but that is the problem with the nature of organizing this roll out.  

So why I am posting this?  To let others know that right now it's going to be try to get your elderly parents on a list for a vaccination, somewhere/anywhere you can.  Which as hard to do even if you know everywhere to try. But there is apparently some opportunity to get access to the last doses if people who the doses were reserved for do not show up.  For the most part I DO NOT believe no shows are frequent, but I also know that private businesses do NOT want to overpromise and underdeliver.  They are not going to promise more doses than they have been allocated.  So there MAY be some sort of last minute availability at the end of the day at vaccine clinics that are based on reserving doses. Pharmacist said to try and get another dose on Feb 8th, or as close to that date as possible. I think by then the second tier access will be available which is a category I do belong to, so hopefully the second dose will be easier to come by.  Or I am gonna spend a lot of cold nights in February hoping for rural no shows for my second dose, or that last dose they hope to squeeze out from the overages.  Our worry has always been accidentally killing my wife's folks trying to help take care of them accidentally.  IF I can get a second dose, a February I think I am going to try and find a way to help out and volunteer to guide traffic or something when we start having larger clinics in Austin.  I thought I might be able to get licensed to give injections, but I do not think that's possible, unless it's botox? Any other thoughts on how to "pay it forward" once I am fully vaccinated (hopefully.) I thought about food bank too.  I can do a lot more if I am less afraid of accidentally killing people via accidental transmission.  

Here is the flip side of the coin Nursing homes- My wife had been trying like hell to coordinate with Nursing homes in California to schedule and CONFIRM their covid vaccine clinics.  Her homes are in Texas, but she was assigned 60 homes in California to try to coordinate scheduling with.  She is great at her job and honestly cares about getting doses into residents. So she religiously checks the "scheduled" and "confirmed" lists making sure that the facilities actually follow up and get the clinics scheduled! About 20 percent simply do not call in and confirm the testing.  Thank God she watches closely and prevented several clinics from being cancelled this week because of lack of confirmation.  Technically this is not her job, she gets them the right info and they are supposed to take care of their end.  But even when the clinic is scheduled for the Nursing home her company does not always have the doses they were supposed to be allocated.  So in one instance here in town they only had 150 of the 240 doses they thought they would have.  So they vaccinated who they could, and rescheduled the rest.  Well you guessed it somebody was mad that their parent did not get vaccinated, and went to the news.  Well here is the news, this is not a smooth process.  IF the allocations promised were in the place they were supposed to be when they were supposed to be the private contractors could manage the flow better.  This is NOT to say the private contractors do not screw up, but with supply chains screwed up that's an inevitability with so many moving parts.  The good news is that slowly but surely they are digging though and getting the homes scheduled and old folks vaccinated.  Thee hiccups from the first week are fewer in the second, and will likely be even better by the end of next week.  With 40% of the deaths coming from nursing home residents this is a huge priority in trying to reduce the death count.  

My daughter works as a pharmacist in New Orleans for the biggest hospital network there and they have similar issues from the supply side.  Now it's more like, we are shipping X quantity out today.  So there is not a lot of lead time in planning. It's here...then it's gone. When are they getting more? Soon... hopefully. Then a call... We are shipping you Y quantity. For them it's a bit easier to try and get a greater percentage of the shot in the arms of the right people, since they are the dominant provider in the area and apparently have decent communication with their target groups.  Seems like that is where the biggest issue is, managing the sign ups properly to match up with the priority groups, to match with the supply delivered. The addition of not knowing how much or when you are getting the next vaccine shipment adds another layer of challenge to an already difficult task.

So things are getting better.  I wish like hell we would have had real planning on the roll out back in November but with the Trump Administration failing to even determine who should get the vaccine first and formulating rules until the middle of December that was an impossibility. As if the demographics of who should be vaccinated first were not known clearly back in the Summer.  But things are slowly but surely breaking the right way.  Let's all PRAY that the Biden administration's wanting to take vaccinating more seriously and LEADING helps get the vaccines into arms.  It's going to take a little time for the new Administration to get up to speed, but I expect we will be able to see real progress by the first or second week of February.  

MY OPINION - IMHO -

1) I think we should release as much as 50% or more of the reserved doses.  I do NOT like taking the risk on the supply chain catching up, but wise use of the military production act should help us here, especially with the Moderna vaccine with the longer lead time between doses. We need to study right now the efficacy of the vaccines if the second doses are delayed what is the effect of efficacy? Get some volunteers into some studies here today.

2) Lists versus Lines?  Lists would have been the best way, but right now lines are the ONLY way to speed out the vaccinations.  The time for lists and planning was months ago, everything now is just an adaptation.  Lists are much better for old people, but online lists are hard for them...  So I think we have to switch to lines.  I would have the lines be prioritized by age, with gradual staged openings for the younger groups as each day went on.  Limit the number of cars that EXPECT to get vaccinations, but secure a group of folks who KNOW they may not get the vaccine, but might from the additional doses.  We give these folks some sort of card for priority access the next Vaccine Clinic.  They are going to wait and some may get that extra squeezed dose. Most will not. But we need to be damn sure we do not waste any doses, thus these folks.

3) Can we really get the military production act working properly?  Can we find a way to squeeze more production of vaccine out with the help of the ACT?  I honestly do not know, but my #1 assertion of letting more vaccine flow to even out the supply hiccups is largely depending on some increased levels of efficiency here.

Well Fuck that was Long!  You should get the Presidential Medal of Freedom if you read this diatribe.  But I know a lot more about what is actually happening on the ground now than I did last week, and providing a plethora of often useless information is a specialty of mine.  It's more fun from a bar stool trust me!

 

Should we split this out into it's own Article/Thread? I think this is valuable information that goes beyond the scope of simply this thread and the viewership of Surly and it could get picked up by search and let people get educated

[Anastasis 23472]

1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

What's the risk with the rapid antigen test?  Is 6 days after potential exposure too soon?

I've been trying to study up but there is a lot of murky info out there.

Less sensitivity.  Agree that the info to guide is murky. Looks like they also do molecular NAAT tests....

I'd do the NAAT I think. 

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/lab/resources/antigen-tests-guidelines.html

 

Nucleic Acid Amplification Testing for SARS-CoV-2 Infection

Reverse transcriptase polymerase chain reaction (RT-PCR)-based diagnostic tests (which detect viral nucleic acids) are considered the gold standard for detecting current SARS-CoV-2 infection. More recently, NAATs have included a variety of additional platforms (e.g., real-time loop mediated isothermal amplification). Clinically, there may be a window period of up to 5 days after exposure before viral nucleic acids can be detected. However, false negative NAAT results can also occur outside of this 5-day window. Therefore, a single negative test result does not completely exclude SARS-CoV-2 infection in people with a high likelihood of infection based on their exposure history and/or their clinical presentation, and repeat testing using a NAAT should be considered.3

SARS-CoV-2 poses several diagnostic challenges, including potentially discordant shedding of virus from the upper versus the lower respiratory tract. Due to the high specificity of NAAT, there is no need to obtain a lower respiratory tract sample to diagnose COVID-19 when a patient with recent onset of COVID-19-compatible symptoms has a positive NAAT on an upper respiratory sample. Because the viral load is higher in the lower respiratory tract than in the upper respiratory tract of patients with COVID-19, severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS), and Middle East respiratory syndrome (MERS), more positive results are reported for lower respiratory tract specimens.4-10 In intubated or mechanically ventilated patients who have clinical signs and symptoms consistent with COVID-19 pneumonia and an initial negative result on an upper respiratory tract sample, a NAAT of a lower respiratory tract sample is recommended (BII). The COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines Panel (the Panel) recommends obtaining endotracheal aspirates rather than bronchial wash or bronchoalveolar lavage (BAL) samples when collecting lower respiratory samples to establish a diagnosis of COVID-19 (BII).

BAL and sputum induction are aerosol-generating procedures that should be performed only with careful consideration of the risk of aerosol generation to staff. Endotracheal aspiration appears to carry a lower risk of aerosolization than BAL, and in the view of some experts, the sensitivity and specificity of endotracheal aspirates and BAL specimens are comparable.

Antigen Testing for SARS-CoV-2 Infection

When compared with RT-PCR-based tests, antigen-based diagnostic tests (which detect viral antigens) are less sensitive but have a similarly high specificity. Antigen tests perform best early in the course of symptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection, when the viral load is thought to be highest. When a person who is strongly suspected of having SARS-CoV-2 infection receives a negative result on an initial antigen test, repeat testing using a NAAT should be considered. Advantages of antigen-based tests are their low cost and rapid turnaround. The availability of immediate results makes antigen-based tests an attractive option for point-of-care testing in high-risk congregate settings where preventing transmission is critical. Antigen-based tests also allow for repeat testing to quickly identify persons with SARS-CoV-2 infection. Currently, there are limited data to guide the use of rapid antigen tests to detect or exclude SARS-CoV-2 infection in asymptomatic persons or to determine whether a person who was previously confirmed to have SARS-CoV-2 infection is still infectious.11

[LurkingHorn 1066]

Posted in DT thread as well:

 

Johnson & Johnson Getting Close

  Quote

Speaking at an industry conference on Monday, Johnson & Johnson (ticker: JNJ) CEO Alex Gorsky said that the company is in the “final stages” of analyzing the data from its 45,000-patient Phase 3 trial of the single-dose version of its vaccine. Bloomberg also reported on Monday that the study would be ready to submit to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration for emergency authorization on Jan. 21, citing a report in a South African newspaper.

 

[jimmyjazz 45960]

20 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Antigen Testing for SARS-CoV-2 Infection

When compared with RT-PCR-based tests, antigen-based diagnostic tests (which detect viral antigens) are less sensitive but have a similarly high specificity. 

Difference between sensitivity and specificity?  (I know, I'm googling it, but this group is smarter than google.)

[Anastasis 23472]

Just now, jimmyjazz said:

Difference between sensitivity and specificity?  (I know, I'm googling it, but this group is smarter than google.)

Sens: Percent with a positive result given a true positive case.

Spec: Percent with a negative result given a true negative case. 

[jimmyjazz 45960]

2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Difference between sensitivity and specificity?  (I know, I'm googling it, but this group is smarter than google.)

Looks like "true positive" and "true negative".

EDIT:  you beat me to it

Edited January 12, 2021 by jimmyjazz

[Anastasis 23472]

7 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Looks like "true positive" and "true negative".

EDIT:  you beat me to it

Right, so in practical terms, false negative is 1-sensitivity. Higher sensitivity, fewer false negatives. 

[jimmyjazz 45960]

Working this around my brain:  if sensitivity is 80%, then 20% of negative test results are wrong.

Would a pair of negative test results (i.e., get her retested tomorrow if today's results are negative) drop that to 4%?  (i.e., 0.2 x 0.2 = 0.04)  I guess that might not be true if the testing is done too early or late in the disease.

Oh, I got her a RAT appointment at Tarrytown Pharmacy for this afternoon.

 

[Anastasis 23472]

49 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Working this around my brain:  if sensitivity is 80%, then 20% of negative test results are wrong.

Would a pair of negative test results (i.e., get her retested tomorrow if today's results are negative) drop that to 4%?  (i.e., 0.2 x 0.2 = 0.04)  I guess that might not be true if the testing is done too early or late in the disease.

I think that you are going to need to find a Bayesian witch and estimate the pre-test probability of infection to do this math.  

[jimmyjazz 45960]

6 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I think that you are going to need to find a Bayesian witch and estimate the pre-test probability of infection to do this math.  

My starter wife was a Wiccan, maybe I'll call her.

[HenryJames 66067]

 

[Brisketexan 105147]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

Working this around my brain:  if sensitivity is 80%, then 20% of negative test results are wrong.

Would a pair of negative test results (i.e., get her retested tomorrow if today's results are negative) drop that to 4%?  (i.e., 0.2 x 0.2 = 0.04)  I guess that might not be true if the testing is done too early or late in the disease.

Oh, I got her a RAT appointment at Tarrytown Pharmacy for this afternoon.

 

Umm, I'm pretty sure that getting RATS takes longer than a single drive-thru appointment.

[jimmyjazz 45960]

16 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Umm, I'm pretty sure that getting RATS takes longer than a single drive-thru appointment.

Well, it's too late now.  No pics.

[4th&Five 41557]

 

[jimmyjazz 45960]

Update:  negative

Might do another test tomorrow.

[Dnaguy 11967]

2 hours ago, HenryJames said:

 

See just another flu.... every week

[Bigpoppapump 531]

16 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

Update:  negative

Might do another test tomorrow.

Just stay low unless you get symptoms.  If you had direct contact with anyone who was positive, you are "supposed" to self quarantine.  Also if you schedule with Austin Public Health, no insurance involved, totally free.  I know my wife had to use insurance at the emergency clinic, not sure about pharmacies.

[Anastasis 23472]

11 minutes ago, Bigpoppapump said:

Just stay low unless you get symptoms.  If you had direct contact with anyone who was positive, you are "supposed" to self quarantine.  Also if you schedule with Austin Public Health, no insurance involved, totally free.  I know my wife had to use insurance at the emergency clinic, not sure about pharmacies.

Tarrytown will not submit to insurance for reimbursement, so the individual has to pay out of pocket. They will provide the material necessary for the individual to submit the claim themselves. 

[Brisketexan 105147]

New record -- over 4,300 people died of COVID...IN ONE DAY.  

For all of the shittacularity of Trump and the MAGAs, let's never forget this one -- they CONTINUE to insist that it's a "hoax" and "no worse than the flu."  4300 people died....in a single day.  That's nearly one and a half 9/11s.  And we're now experiencing it EVERY day.

In terms of domestic body counts racked up by psychotic, evil belief systems, Trumpism is the leader since the Civil War, and there's not even a close second.

[Pig Bellmont 8719]

30,000 Texans are dead from Covid. Unbelievable there has been zero blowback on Abbott for fucking things this badly 

[JFKFC 4881]

 

[27-25 2047]

CDC says we lost about 34,000 people in 2018-2019 season due to the flu.  We're currently losing about 28,000 people to COVID per week.  And that's with some portion of the population at least trying to slow it down.  Yet, there remains a sizable portion of this God forsaken country that claim COVID is just like the flu.

[HenryJames 66067]

 

[horn4life 3760]

We have used Care Now Urgent Care on Burnet Road for a couple of rapid tests.  They took our insurance, and our SIL's insurance as well.

It's a rapid test, I think my buddy who is in the movie/advertising production business has gotten like 8 or 9 tests there before shoots.

[Biff Tannen 45690]

This vaccine rollout is an absolute disaster.  My wife is a "1a" status and hasn't been able to get one yet.  She's a healthcare worker, though not frontline.  Regardless, some places in Texas (ARC) are now getting 2nd round doses, but no more 1st round doses and they "don't expect to get more".  WTF.

[27-25 2047]

We all focus on deaths (well, except for complete morons or about 40% of the population), and rightfully so, but even those who recover face long term repercussions.  A Texas trauma surgeon says "Post-COVID lungs look worse than any type of terrible smoker's lung we've ever seen."

Even asymptomatic survivors show damage 70-80% of the time.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-lungs-scarring-smokers-lungs/

But it's fine.  Everything's fine.

[TXSG8R 3362]

For those frustrated with our vaccine rollout, I found out today that my 90 year old grandmother in Germany still hasn't been vaccinated.  She doesn't live in a nursing home, and actually lives in a tiny village (15-20 total houses), so maybe that is a factor.  Still surprising that someone at that age would still be waiting in a country that has taken things more seriously.  She has an appointment next week, and her 93 year old sister (similar living arrangement one village over) is still waiting for an appointment.  

There's also a fucky wrinkle with my aunt that lives with her as a caretaker.  She's a German citizen with a US green card.  Because of the green card, she isn't able to register a German address with the state (something about only having one primary address).  Without a registered German address, she cant get a vaccination through the German system.  She hasn't contacted the US embassy yet, but they generally shit on green card holders.  She's over 65, has comorbidities, and has to fly back to the US sometime soon to reset the clock on her green card.  Fun time for bureaucracy to rear its ugly head.  

[JFKFC 4881]

 

[Francisco 2.0 32395]

DeSantis can just get fucked.

Quote

A common trait of the counties that are part of Florida’s growing COVID-19 vaccination partnership with the Publix supermarket chain is that they are all safely Republican.

As of Thursday morning, 105 Publix stores were offering limited numbers of shots to people 65 and older in Bay, Citrus, Collier, Escambia, Flagler, Hernando, Marion, Okaloosa, Santa Rosa, St. Johns, Volusia and Walton counties.

 

Quote

All 12 counties were won comfortably by Republican President Donald Trump in November and by Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis in 2018.

Asked Wednesday while in St. Johns County about when the vaccination partnership could stretch into neighboring and more urban Duval County, DeSantis said the initial rollout has focused on areas where hospital systems might need assistance and where there are large senior populations.

 

Quote

“I think the thing that separates, like a Duval from a Flagler or Collier, is Duval has a really strong hospital system,” DeSantis said. “You’ve got many hospitals, a lot of them have gotten doses. I know people have gotten shots at a bunch of these different places.”

DeSantis included Miami-Dade and Orange counties as having big health-care infrastructures, which isn’t the same in places like Marion, Hernando and Citrus.

“We saw a gap there that we could really get the shots up right now,” DeSantis said, adding the goal would be to have vaccines available at all Publix locations in Florida.

 

Spoiler

But the Lakeland-based supermarket giant has 817 locations in the state, according to its website.

“If we did it everywhere, you can do the math, you’d need hundreds of thousands of doses just for Publix, and they'd run out in four or five days on that clip,” DeSantis said.

Stores offering vaccinations are getting about 100 to 125 doses a day.

And while the state can’t stop non-Floridians from skipping into lines, DeSantis said the Publix offerings are intended for Floridians.

“I know if you live in Mobile, Ala., maybe you want to come to Pensacola. Well, we're doing it for Floridians,” DeSantis said. “Now, obviously, we have some people that only live here half the year, that's fine. But if you're kind of a permanent resident in these neighboring states, we do want it for Floridians. I don't think you're going to police the different county stuff. But obviously it's easier for folks to get to Publix that are close to them.”