CR: COVID-19 --Political Talk

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20462]

You can't fix stupid, part deux:

https://news.yahoo.com/nearly-covid-deaths-us-now-154100375.html

Nearly all COVID deaths in US are now among unvaccinated

CARLA K. JOHNSON and MIKE STOBBE

Thu, June 24, 2021, 10:41 AM·5 min read

 

 

Nearly all COVID-19 deaths in the U.S. now are in people who weren’t vaccinated, a staggering demonstration of how effective the shots have been and an indication that deaths per day — now down to under 300 — could be practically zero if everyone eligible got the vaccine.

An Associated Press analysis of available government data from May shows that “breakthrough” infections in fully vaccinated people accounted for fewer than 1,200 of more than 853,000 COVID-19 hospitalizations. That’s about 0.1%.

And only about 150 of the more than 18,000 COVID-19 deaths in May were in fully vaccinated people. That translates to about 0.8%, or five deaths per day on average.

[Captainant 27690]

20 minutes ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

You can't fix stupid: 


"The daughter of an unvaccinated county employee in Florida who died after COVID-19 swept through the government office building where she worked says she and her family are steadfast in refusing their shots, even though their mother’s inoculated coworkers did not get sick at all.

“No one in my family will be getting the vaccine,” Molly Hart told The Daily Beast.

Hart’s mom, 58-year-old Mary Knight, passed away last week from complications related to COVID-19, Manatee County authorities announced. An IT customer service supervisor, Knight had worked for the county on and off for 15 years. A second unvaccinated member of the IT department, 53-year-old systems analyst Alphonso Cox, also died last week after coming down with COVID-19. Three others in the office who were unvaccinated and contracted the virus were ill enough to be hospitalized, but survived.

 

None of their vaccinated coworkers were affected at all, County Administrator Dr. Scott Hopes said in a statement.

 

16 minutes ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

You can't fix stupid, part deux:

https://news.yahoo.com/nearly-covid-deaths-us-now-154100375.html

Nearly all COVID deaths in US are now among unvaccinated

CARLA K. JOHNSON and MIKE STOBBE

Thu, June 24, 2021, 10:41 AM·5 min read

 

 

Nearly all COVID-19 deaths in the U.S. now are in people who weren’t vaccinated, a staggering demonstration of how effective the shots have been and an indication that deaths per day — now down to under 300 — could be practically zero if everyone eligible got the vaccine.

An Associated Press analysis of available government data from May shows that “breakthrough” infections in fully vaccinated people accounted for fewer than 1,200 of more than 853,000 COVID-19 hospitalizations. That’s about 0.1%.

And only about 150 of the more than 18,000 COVID-19 deaths in May were in fully vaccinated people. That translates to about 0.8%, or five deaths per day on average.

[jimmyjazz 46000]

Well, that's just manipulated data.  A lot of deaths being attributed to cancer, heart disease, etc. were actually due to covid infections in fully vaccinated people, they just don't want to acknowledge the truth.

#newangle

[JimmyJames 12271]

At this point it’s basically impossible to feel sorry for these people. Even white Jesus up in heaven is saying, hey, you fuck around you find out.

[ChuckNorrisActionJeans 2680]

Just wish my 11 yr old could get vaccinated so I could laugh at all these dumbasses and get back to fully normal

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19128]

45 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

At this point it’s basically impossible to feel sorry for these people. Even white Jesus up in heaven is saying, hey, you fuck around you find out.

This is where I am at.  You can get vaccinated and you choose not to, go fuck yourself.  And I have a brother that has not been vaccinated.  He says he is nervous about the side affects.  I say he is Trumpy.

 

15 minutes ago, ChuckNorrisActionJeans said:

Just wish my 11 yr old could get vaccinated so I could laugh at all these dumbasses and get back to fully normal

Agreed.  Ready for younger children to be able to be vaccinated.

Edited June 25, 2021 by PenelopeWitherspoon

[TwiceHorn 31512]

On 6/23/2021 at 8:41 AM, Anastasis said:

I don't think that this is an accurate representation of the events on the time line.  If anything Trump's bumbling reflexively suppressed broad and careful consideration of the evidence.  and Fauci was part of that reflexive response at the time, yes. But the re-emergence of the discussion in broader circles at this time is the result of actions by a number of different scientists that have stepped forward, and either modified their prior hastily taken positions or newly piped in to tell people to slow their roll with the blanket dismissiveness.  Then the major media outlets started to ramp it up, and here we are.  I don't think that any of those individuals are driven by a desire to prove Trump right and Fauci wrong.  

The scientists perhaps.  But google Fauci and GOF and you will get an overwhelming amount of returns from absolute dogshit sites that have no interest in anything but proving Fauci to be wrong.

[JimmyJames 12271]

17 minutes ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

This is where I am at.  You can get vaccinated and you choose not to, go fuck yourself.  And I have a brother that has not been vaccinated.  He says he is nervous about the side affects.  I say he is Trumpy.

 

Agreed.  Ready for younger children to be able to be vaccinated.

What these dipshits fail to understand is once the virus figures out it can’t infect olds anymore because they are either vaccinated or dead, it mutates to infect even the young so that it can continue to survive. The goal of the virus is to never completely die and it will succeed. That is what is happening now. 

[elfenix 34331]

Which of you is this?

[WhatTheBuck 28794]

12 hours ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

You can't fix stupid: 


"The daughter of an unvaccinated county employee in Florida who died after COVID-19 swept through the government office building where she worked says she and her family are steadfast in refusing their shots, even though their mother’s inoculated coworkers did not get sick at all.

“No one in my family will be getting the vaccine,” Molly Hart told The Daily Beast.

Hart’s mom, 58-year-old Mary Knight, passed away last week from complications related to COVID-19, Manatee County authorities announced. An IT customer service supervisor, Knight had worked for the county on and off for 15 years. A second unvaccinated member of the IT department, 53-year-old systems analyst Alphonso Cox, also died last week after coming down with COVID-19. Three others in the office who were unvaccinated and contracted the virus were ill enough to be hospitalized, but survived.

 

None of their vaccinated coworkers were affected at all, County Administrator Dr. Scott Hopes said in a statement.

See? Stupid parents raise stupid kids. They’ll become the next generation of Fox News viewers and that’s why it’s a mistake to think that the olds dying off is going to change anything. The weapons of ignorance will simply reload. 

[Mrs Whiggins 13050]

You can't fix ...part three:

In the article, two people were quoted as reluctant due to the 'speed' of the vaccine development (I know the background of the tech, but that argument does not appear to resonate with citizens who are dug in on this.) It's sad because that was one thing the Trump administration touted--WARP and all that. So, Trump's double talk--'look at what we did' combined with his own vaccine reluctance/having the virus has really done a number on people, regardless of their political affiliations. I related on here before that 'new' science was something a community member related to us as the reason for her reluctance. I don't know if she ever got the vaccine but I doubt it. Pretty sad, but I'm going to harden my heart seeing that the physicians were willing to drive so far (in article) to make sure residents had access. If there is ready access to all, even the poorest and most shut in, then I have to figure that combating the misinfo is going to be next to impossible.

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19128]

You can't fix ...part three:
In the article, two people were quoted as reluctant due to the 'speed' of the vaccine development (I know the background of the tech, but that argument does not appear to resonate with citizens who are dug in on this.) It's sad because that was one thing the Trump administration touted--WARP and all that. So, Trump's double talk--'look at what we did' combined with his own vaccine reluctance/having the virus has really done a number on people, regardless of their political affiliations. I related on here before that 'new' science was something a community member related to us as the reason for her reluctance. I don't know if she ever got the vaccine but I doubt it. Pretty sad, but I'm going to harden my heart seeing that the physicians were willing to drive so far (in article) to make sure residents had access. If there is ready access to all, even the poorest and most shut in, then I have to figure that combating the misinfo is going to be next to impossible.

On the argument of it was developed too quickly, wasn’t a coronavirus vaccine in the works for years, and they piggy backed off that? Seems like some education needs to happen.

[Brisketexan 105180]

On the argument of it was developed too quickly, wasn’t a coronavirus vaccine in the works for years, and they piggy backed off that? Seems like some education needs to happen.

Correct, in part. It can also accurately be said that the vehicle had been in development for years - the customization to make an MRNA vax to fit this particular virus took literally days, because that’s how they work. But the overall vehicle of mRNA vax had been in development for a long time.

But….the trials etc did not take years, that’s true. But that’s also the case with the flu vax - a new one every year, no lengthy trials. And from now on, there probably won’t be lengthy trials with mRNA vaccines.

[The Dog 44073]

3 hours ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

It's sad because that was one thing the Trump administration touted--WARP and all that. So, Trump's double talk--'look at what we did' combined with his own vaccine reluctance/having the virus has really done a number on people, regardless of their political affiliations.

Yup - and the irony is that the fact that a set of vaccines that are this effective and safe was developed so quickly should be an incredible accomplishment. Trump supporters should be at the front of the line to get the shot. 

That said, they aren't the only issue. cross posting from the DT:

We have a LOT of work to do in getting shots in arms to the Hispanic and Black communities. These are the groups more likely to not be able to miss work if they are knocked on their ass for a couple of days due to any side effects. 

 

[Mrs Whiggins 13050]

14 minutes ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

On the argument of it was developed too quickly, wasn’t a coronavirus vaccine in the works for years, and they piggy backed off that? Seems like some education needs to happen.

Yes, but it's one of those tricky dissonance effects where that does not resonate with people who have absorbed the misinfo. I'm dead serious on that one as I've watched family members who have a very thorough virology background discuss it in a very plain non threatening relatable way and get no traction with people we've known who have expressed those concerns. It's just disheartening, because I suspect that the social media algos have spread some of the reluctance to the most vulnerable that otherwise would not be against it.

 

[Brisketexan 105180]

24 minutes ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

Yes, but it's one of those tricky dissonance effects where that does not resonate with people who have absorbed the misinfo. I'm dead serious on that one as I've watched family members who have a very thorough virology background discuss it in a very plain non threatening relatable way and get no traction with people we've known who have expressed those concerns. It's just disheartening, because I suspect that the social media algos have spread some of the reluctance to the most vulnerable that otherwise would not be against it.

 

I've seen it first hand, in depositions where the other side's case is built on a conspiracy theory.  When subjected to detailed questioning asking for FACTS to support their claims, they just recite their claims.  When pushed to give the facts and evidence supporting those claims, they just try to repeat the conclusion.  Finally, when confronted with the fact that they have zero evidence to support their nutbar claims, the answer is "that's what I believe."

And their belief is, literally, irrefutable.  That's what we're dealing with in this country, writ large.  There is no fixing this.

[Mrs Whiggins 13050]

7 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

I've seen it first hand, in depositions where the other side's case is built on a conspiracy theory.  When subjected to detailed questioning asking for FACTS to support their claims, they just recite their claims.  When pushed to give the facts and evidence supporting those claims, they just try to repeat the conclusion.  Finally, when confronted with the fact that they have zero evidence to support their nutbar claims, the answer is "that's what I believe."

And their belief is, literally, irrefutable.  That's what we're dealing with in this country, writ large.  There is no fixing this.

I wholly support the efforts of the mobile units that are being put to work in harder to reach communities. Combined with trusted locals, that may help with some of the target demographics. But after that, not sure how to rebuild trust.

[Willfully Horn 8040]

A threat was within our borders, killing citizens on a scale equivalent to a war. When on a wartime footing, some citizens rise and put themselves on the line to counter that threat. Some don’t. America first has always meant: ME first.

[Biff Tannen 45695]

So it appears NC State baseball fucked around and found out.  

[Born to Run 6569]

So it appears NC State baseball fucked around and found out.  

Nah, they chose to do thier own research and make deeply personal choices based on values. Lucky for them fellas, thier coach only focused on ball and not general life skills or critical thinking or really even management of the program.
I mean they all knew the rules and made informed choices. I'm just glad they are living free. Good for them.

(Sucks for the non idiots on the team and thier fans and whomever faces Vandy plus 4 days rest)

[UDontKnow 10447]

1 hour ago, Biff Tannen said:

So it appears NC State baseball fucked around and found out.  

 

4 minutes ago, Born to Run said:

Nah, they chose to do thier own research and make deeply personal choices based on values. Lucky for them fellas, thier coach only focused on ball and not general life skills or critical thinking or really even management of the program.
I mean they all knew the rules and made informed choices. I'm just glad they are living free. Good for them.

(Sucks for the non idiots on the team and thier fans and whomever faces Vandy plus 4 days rest)

 

 

Oh you know Elliott Avent just didn't want to indoctrinate his players.....that's all.....nothing else to see here, move along.

 

Apparently only those players that were not vaccinated (maybe fully vaccinated) were subject to COVID testing and you know what the results were. I'm sure the other three major NC universities (Duke, UNC-Chapel Hill, and Wake Forest) are pointing and laughing at NC State. Research Triangle will never become Research Quad(rilateral).

 

[Anastasis 23480]

Testing asymptomatic vaccinated people is stupid. 

[tchookem 3905]

Testing asymptomatic vaccinated people is stupid. 

I thought they only tested the unvaccinated players... and some players/coaches were symptomatic.

(If you're referring to NCState baseball)

[Neonmoon 38130]

3 hours ago, Anastasis said:

Testing asymptomatic vaccinated people is stupid. 

Agree. But that team knew the rules and the risks associated with not getting vaccinated. If everyone was vaccinated, there was zero risk of being eliminated for COVID protocols. Their path has greater than zero risk. They made a choice. They have to live with it. 

[Anastasis 23480]

1 hour ago, tchookem said:

I thought they only tested the unvaccinated players... and some players/coaches were symptomatic.

(If you're referring to NCState baseball)

One one person tested positive, the entire roster was tested. Two unvaxxed positive cases, 4 positive cases from vaccinated. 

[Anastasis 23480]

1 minute ago, Neonmoon said:

Agree. But that team knew the rules and the risks associated with not getting vaccinated. If everyone was vaccinated, there was zero risk of being eliminated for COVID protocols. Their path has greater than zero risk. They made a choice. They have to live with it. 

Yeah. Everyone plays by the same rules. Some rules just don’t make sense. Like a pitch clock or assigning a strike to a batter for delay without a warning. 

[Js1 85449]

Carrot/stick by the NCAA.  Get the vaccine for everyone, skip testing. Nice competitive advantage to avoid getting popped. 

[MissingInAction 25131]

Just found out an old high school buddy died from it. I had defriended him on fb a awhile back due to his trumpkiness, and rabid covid is a hoax bullshit.

The fucked up thing is his family is in complete denial about the cause of death.

 

[Neonmoon 38130]

29 minutes ago, MissingInAction said:

Just found out an old high school buddy died from it. I had defriended him on fb a awhile back due to his trumpkiness, and rabid covid is a hoax bullshit.

The fucked up thing is his family is in complete denial about the cause of death.

 

That sucks man, I'm sorry. 

[Biff Tannen 45695]

2 hours ago, Anastasis said:

Yeah. Everyone plays by the same rules. Some rules just don’t make sense. Like a pitch clock or assigning a strike to a batter for delay without a warning. 

Agree.  I accept the pitch clock rules for now.  I sure as shit hope they get changed, but if they don't, I would hope that Texas is more careful about letting the clock run out.

[JimmyJames 12271]

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

Yeah. Everyone plays by the same rules. Some rules just don’t make sense. Like a pitch clock or assigning a strike to a batter for delay without a warning. 

Those are all dumb rules but if you know the rules you can’t bitch about them you just adjust. NC state players didn’t and now they’re on the way home instead of on the way to the championship series. Hope their stance was worth it to them so much and so principled that they fucked over their own team and cost them a chance at a first ever national title. Frankly I blame the coach. 

[Sawbonz 27580]

Read the replies. Man I could have my own island in the Caribbean if only I had no scruples. 

[UDontKnow 10447]

1 hour ago, Sawbonz said:

Read the replies. Man I could have my own island in the Caribbean if only I had no scruples. 

Allegedly a PhD in Psychology.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/jun/17/facebook-posts/no-sign-spike-proteins-covid-19-vaccines-including/

[horn4life 3775]

I wish that some Trump supporter would actually document their hospital experience from life to death from Covid.  Then do a Yule Brenner type of mea culpa.  It's not a nice way to die, drowning until your heart gives out.  But instead you have folks that have so fully invested their lives into an alternative set of "facts" that they cannot admit even as they die, what they are dying from much less that their choices are the only reason they are dying...

The really bad thing?  Is that because the new strain is so virulent, you protection from only the first shot is only about 33%.  So when the anti-vax folks do start to realize their folly, the lead time to protection will be weeks away.  What a waste.

 

[horn4life 3775]

DP...                                                  not that kind!

 

Edited June 26, 2021 by horn4life

[Sawbonz 27580]

I have stopped wearing my mask at the office. I stop at the exam room door and let my patient know I’ve been vaccinated and tell them I’m happy to put a mask on if they would like me to. Almost all are ok with it either because they are vaccinated (most), or they aren’t worried about the virus. There is a small group though who are genuinely worried about the virus but genuinely scared of the vaccine. Invariably these are older high risk folks. I spend a good deal of time with them explaining how the vaccine works, how it can’t alter their DNA, and let them know I got the vaccine literally the first day it was offered, and my wife as well as our kids did the same. All have thanked me for taking the time and several told me they were now going to get the vaccine. 
 

But maybe they just want me to shut up so they can talk about their bone or joint problems 

[Mrs Whiggins 13050]

2 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

several told me they were now going to get the vaccine.

I hope they do, that would be a good thing!

[Neonmoon 38130]

2 hours ago, Sawbonz said:

I have stopped wearing my mask at the office. I stop at the exam room door and let my patient know I’ve been vaccinated and tell them I’m happy to put a mask on if they would like me to. Almost all are ok with it either because they are vaccinated (most), or they aren’t worried about the virus. There is a small group though who are genuinely worried about the virus but genuinely scared of the vaccine. Invariably these are older high risk folks. I spend a good deal of time with them explaining how the vaccine works, how it can’t alter their DNA, and let them know I got the vaccine literally the first day it was offered, and my wife as well as our kids did the same. All have thanked me for taking the time and several told me they were now going to get the vaccine. 
 

But maybe they just want me to shut up so they can talk about their bone or joint problems 

Yeah but you’re a medical doctor. I’m going to listen to Jane Ruby, the licensed nurse practitioner who said it was a bio weapon 

[Mrs Whiggins 13050]

I am so disappointed that she does not yet have an entry in RationalWiki's Encyclopedia of American Loons. Really a tragic oversight.

[Bevo in VA 342]

University of Rochester just lost a lot of that prestige.

[WhatTheBuck 28794]

I’ve met students who were attending the University of Rochester. I wasn’t impressed. 

[Newdoc 3448]

6 hours ago, Sawbonz said:

I have stopped wearing my mask at the office.

I wish. But we were Outpatient Covid central during the peak of the pandemic and we will be the last clinic to ditch the masks despite most of us being vaccinated. Still seeing a couple of cases a day and seat of the pants observation tells me it’s the Delta variant. Almost no one is coming in symptomatic positive post vaccine or post previous infection.

[Pods 7586]

1 hour ago, Newdoc said:

I wish. But we were Outpatient Covid central during the peak of the pandemic and we will be the last clinic to ditch the masks despite most of us being vaccinated. Still seeing a couple of cases a day and seat of the pants observation tells me it’s the Delta variant. Almost no one is coming in symptomatic positive post vaccine or post previous infection.

Ugh, probably smart to keep the masks on if you're getting exposed multiple times a day. 

https://www.businessinsider.com/israel-50-of-delta-variant-cases-vaccinated-severe-2021-6

Israel says the Delta variant is infecting vaccinated people, representing as many as 50% of new cases. But they're less severe.

 

 

[FORTY NINE TO ZERO 2652]

Had our family reunion today. One of the cousins proudly said she wasnt vaccinated due to the fact she wants to have kids some day.   Funny enough, she showed up with a new 400 pound boyfriend (also unvaccinated) who preceded to  jump in the kids pinata line and hit the paper mache animal with all his fat strength destroying the poor thing on impact.   Kids were a crying.   
 

people who never leave east texas are strange.   

 

 

 

[UDontKnow 10447]

1 hour ago, Pods said:

Ugh, probably smart to keep the masks on if you're getting exposed multiple times a day. 

https://www.businessinsider.com/israel-50-of-delta-variant-cases-vaccinated-severe-2021-6

Israel says the Delta variant is infecting vaccinated people, representing as many as 50% of new cases. But they're less severe.

 

 

Thanks for posting that. It was always gonna be too soon to toss the masks away given that we're connected with the rest of the world which is trying to get caught up with vaccinations. For that matter, we still have (and always will have) diehards that refuse to get vaccinated not only endangering themselves, but their fellow Americans too. 

I still wear my mask when I am stepping out of the home and I know I'll be coming in contact with people. I also haven't stopped trying to social distance although admittedly that has become much more difficult.  

Also from that article:

Quote

An analysis by UK health officials found that two doses of Pfizer's vaccine were 88% effective against Delta while a single shot was 33% effective. That's compared with 95% efficacy against the original strain, or 52% after one shot.

This is the other reason why all those previous suggestions of spacing apart doses were absolutely ridiculous because it failed to take into account the unknown that future variants bring. The viruses that are capable of causing pandemics do not evolve for human benefit, they evolve to mankind's detriment. It still is and has been a better idea to get people fully vaccinated as soon as possible. 

Edited June 27, 2021 by UDontKnow

[Pods 7586]

The vaccinations make the symptoms less severe, but fully vaccinated people are still getting it. In rare cases, they are still dying. Looks like it's also possible to get Long Covid even if fully vaccinated.

https://www.businessinsider.com/nurse-coronavirus-long-hauler-fully-vaccinated-breakthrough-infection-2021-6

A 33-year-old nurse got long COVID despite being fully vaccinated. Doctors think we may see more of these rare cases.

 

If you do get exposed, keep your viral loads low. Delta is some nasty shit and outcompeting the wild type and variants quickly. 

[Anastasis 23480]

Delta is going to be a real problem for the unvaccinated. The good news is that protection against severe disease does not appear to be diminished. 
 

Edited June 27, 2021 by Anastasis

[Bozo_Casanova 26510]

Just popping in to say that if we had

2 hours ago, Anastasis said:

Delta is going to be a real problem for the unvaccinated. The good news is that protection against severe disease does not appear to be diminished. 
 

Just popping in to point out that if we had seen those kinds of numbers from the vaccine on the initial strains, we would have been dancing on the ceilings. The Covid vaccines are a triumph and being alive to witness this moment has given me all kinds of hope about the future. 

[Anastasis 23480]

100%

 

[jimmyjazz 46000]

4 hours ago, Anastasis said:

Delta is going to be a real problem for the unvaccinated. The good news is that protection against severe disease does not appear to be diminished. 
 

Are those results specific to a particular 2-dose vaccine; i.e., Pfizer or Moderna?  Do they hold for both?