CR: COVID-19 --Political Talk

[Sawbonz 27600]

7 hours ago, Foosters said:

I also have a problem with them denying service mainly because I don't want to wait extra time to find out Candace Owens has Covid

Well there’s that too. Schadenfreude delayed, etc

 

7 hours ago, lemonlime said:

I'm not in this profession.  And while I may agree with you in some hypothetical level, I am completely out of fucks to give right now about poor, poor Candace Owens, who might have to, gasp, wait a few days for test results with the rest of the hoi polloi who she's spent years arguing that access to basic healthcare should be removed from.  Fuck her.  If she wanted a reasoned discussion on access to healthcare maybe she and the rest of the right wing shouldn't have spent the past decade taking a sledge hammer to the social contract.

None of you have to give any fucks. If you are a healthcare professional you do. Or you need to GTFO of healthcare. You do not deny your services based on the beliefs or behaviors of those you care for. 

[OneOfTheOutOfFocusGuys 2098]

27 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

You do not deny your services based on the beliefs or behaviors of those you care for. 

Don’t have to base your services on the beliefs of those you care for of you don’t  care for her in the first place. 
 

[sidis 9832]

35 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

Well there’s that too. Schadenfreude delayed, etc

 

None of you have to give any fucks. If you are a healthcare professional you do. Or you need to GTFO of healthcare. You do not deny your services based on the beliefs or behaviors of those you care for. 

I get what you are saying and don’t disagree with you regarding the providing of medical care. 

I suspect the needle she’s threading mentally for herself is distinguishing between providing true medical services  to someone who needs them versus someone getting a test that is commercially ubiquitous, available virtually anywhere, and doesn’t have to be administered by a doctor. She’s clearly trying to make a point (a valid one) with her statement to Owens in denying the test that would not really be a big deal but it’s not like Owens is standing at the door hemorrhaging internally from a trauma or something  

either way, Candace Owens can get fucked. 

[Sawbonz 27600]

1 minute ago, sidis said:

She’s clearly trying to make a point (a valid one) with her statement to Owens in denying the test that would not really be a big deal but it’s not like Owens is standing at the door hemorrhaging internally from a trauma

So a lab should be able to refuse to draw a homosexual HIV patient’s CD4 titers because they’re not actively sick and there are several other labs in the vicinity as options for this patient?

[Captainant 27828]

6 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

So a lab should be able to refuse to draw a homosexual HIV patient’s CD4 titers because they’re not actively sick and there are several other labs in the vicinity as options for this patient?

Given the current composition of the supreme court, and our national policy of healthcare being an employer-granted privilege... I'd bet you could get away with that, yeah. 

[bad_teammate 13225]

13 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

So a lab should be able to refuse to draw a homosexual HIV patient’s CD4 titers because they’re not actively sick and there are several other labs in the vicinity as options for this patient?

Protected class

[washparkhorn 9939]

This is a publicity stunt by Owens.

I understand the principled argument that all deserve testing and treatment (and it would great if Owens believed all deserve testing and treatment for medical issues), but she doesn't.  

I have no tolerance for media stunts that make testing and treatment more difficult during a pandemic (all sides).

And - 

Spoiler

No platforms for fascist enablers.

 

Edited September 2, 2021 by washparkhorn

[Sawbonz 27600]

12 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Given the current composition of the supreme court, and our national policy of healthcare being an employer-granted privilege... I'd bet you could get away with that, yeah. 

Should not could

[Sawbonz 27600]

5 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Protected class

Should not could 

[lemonlime 5503]

12 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Given the current composition of the supreme court, and our national policy of healthcare being an employer-granted privilege... I'd bet you could get away with that, yeah. 

Didn't Ohio just pass a law saying providers could deny services based on patients' sexual orientation.  Yup.  They did.  https://fortune.com/2021/07/09/ohio-law-allows-doctors-to-deny-health-care-and-birth-control-to-lgbtq-patients/. And I'm sure with the support, or at best crickets, from Owens and her ilk.  Fuck them.

[bad_teammate 13225]

2 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

Should not could 

A private clinic refusing a non-vital service a non-protected class is far more defensible ethically than doing the same to a protected class.

There's a reason you had to change the nature of the argument by switching to a protected class.

[sidis 9832]

20 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

So a lab should be able to refuse to draw a homosexual HIV patient’s CD4 titers because they’re not actively sick and there are several other labs in the vicinity as options for this patient?

No, and as I said, I don’t disagree with you.

just contemplating the perspective of the doctor vis-a-vis this ethical threshold. 

It is getting harder and harder to tolerate people that are actively working against you…doing it with utter contempt for the health care advice they are receiving and the health care professionals giving it to them, and then showing up with the expectation that those same people will do then sacrifice everything else to save their dumbasses. 

[DDD Dad 14352]

Something something HIPPA (intentionally misspelled) violation infringing on my first amendment rights! /candace

[Bookman 4642]

10 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Protected class

What is the protected class?

[TXSG8R 3362]

32 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

So a lab should be able to refuse to draw a homosexual HIV patient’s CD4 titers because they’re not actively sick and there are several other labs in the vicinity as options for this patient?

I don’t agree with denying care or testing, but triaging care and testing based on vaccination status (outside of medical reasons) or outright denial of covid also makes sense to me. If you’re an idiot that has refused to take the free, most effective preventatives like masking and vaccines, you go to the back of the line for testing and care. That’s not political, it’s a more effective use of limited resources. 
 

To extend that to your HIV example. Being gay doesn’t cause HIV infection. Unprotected sex does. If you have an idiot that advocates for refusing to wear condoms during an HIV pandemic, gay or not, and want to triage care based on that (assuming some equivalent strain on resources), I think that also makes sense. 

Edited September 2, 2021 by TXSG8R

[bad_teammate 13225]

2 minutes ago, Bookman said:

What is the protected class?

LGBTQ is a protected class (as it should be). Political affiliation is not (as it should not be).

Edited September 2, 2021 by bad_teammate

[sidis 9832]

2 minutes ago, Bookman said:

What is the protected class?

Homosexuals. 

[Captainant 27828]

6 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

LGBTQ is a protected class (as it should be). Political affiliation is not (as it should not be).

Oh oh we're working on changing that in Texas too!

https://www.theverge.com/2021/9/1/22652764/facebook-twitter-censor-ban-texas-republicans-abbott

The bill would make it unlawful for social media companies with more than 50 million users, like Facebook and Twitter, to censor users and content based on political views or geographic location. This includes moderation actions like banning, deplatforming, or demonetizing users and removing posts.

[Bookman 4642]

7 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

LGBTQ is a protected class (as it should be). Political affiliation is not (as it should not be).

But having AIDS is not a protected class, right?

And I've never fully read the opinion, but is Bostock being read broadly enough to say that LGBTQ is a protected class for all purposes?

[bad_teammate 13225]

is the "geographic location" thing because the right-wingers want Russian botnets protected? lol

[Sawbonz 27600]

18 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

A private clinic refusing a non-vital service a non-protected class is far more defensible ethically than doing the same to a protected class.

There's a reason you had to change the nature of the argument by switching to a protected class.

I’m making a moral as well as ethical argument. And in either case it is a logical equivalent, being people who a given provider may find morally objectionable, though many or most may not, and regardless of any legal protection they might have. Protected class is a legal construct. A healthcare professional should not deny care based on beliefs or behaviors. 

Same goes for murderers and child rapists. I have provided care over the years to some of the most vile people imaginable. It's a calling not just a job

[DDD Dad 14352]

I’m making a moral as well as ethical argument. And in either case it is a logical equivalent, being people who a given provider may find morally objectionable, though many or most may not, and regardless of any legal protection they might have. Protected class is a legal construct. A healthcare professional should not deny care based on beliefs or behaviors. 

Same goes for murderers and child rapists. I have provided care over the years to some of the most vile people imaginable. It's a calling not just a job

Reminds me of the time my dad told me about operating on a “bullet catcher” who rolled up to the ER after a drug deal gone bad. (He was also a carpenter)

[Sawbonz 27600]

31 minutes ago, sidis said:

It is getting harder and harder to tolerate people that are actively working against you…doing it with utter contempt for the health care advice they are receiving and the health care professionals giving it to them, and then showing up with the expectation that those same people will do then sacrifice everything else to save their dumbasses

This has been the case since Hippocrates was in a short Toga

 

30 minutes ago, TXSG8R said:

don’t agree with denying care or testing, but triaging care and testing based on vaccination status (outside of medical reasons) or outright denial of covid also makes sense to me

Scarcity and rationing is a legitimate issue. To my knowledge this person did not claim that they refused to give her a Covid test because there weren’t enough to go around

[NAVY 6747]

Team horse paste about to start fucking around with snek. Load up the FAFO cannon… nevermind. Snek got this 

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/brazilian-viper-venom-may-become-tool-fight-against-coronavirus-study-shows-2021-08-31/

 

[Brisketexan 105445]

5 minutes ago, NAVY said:

Team horse paste about to start fucking around with snek. Load up the FAFO cannon… nevermind. Snek got this 

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/brazilian-viper-venom-may-become-tool-fight-against-coronavirus-study-shows-2021-08-31/

 

....which means we're just weeks away from our ERs being overwhelmed with idiots with copperheads latched onto their dicks or some shit like that.

I mean, we're getting closer and closer to 40% of our population LITERALLY opting for snake oil over actual medical measures.

[pyrohornIII 4823]

 

15 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

 

He has no reason to do this. He’s a hundred millionaire. 

I doubt he got the whole nut up front.  I would imagine there are stipulations in his contract to grow his base, or possibly bonuses for base growth?   Either way, he's grifting.  

3 hours ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

https://kfor.com/news/local/patients-overdosing-on-ivermectin-backing-up-rural-oklahoma-hospitals-ambulances/

Video at link, can't imbed here.

 

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

“Growing up in a small town, rural area, we’ve all accidentally been exposed to ivermectin at some time. So, it’s something people are familiar with. Because of those accidental sticks, when trying to inoculate cattle, they’re less afraid of it,” he said.

Now, the rural patients are going into their local agricultural or tractor supply store, ignoring the warning signs surrounding the products, and figuring out a dosage themselves.

“Some people taking inappropriate doses have actually put themselves in worse conditions than if they’d caught COVID,” said the doctor.

Dr. McElyea said the patients are suffering from nausea, vomiting, muscle aches and cramping, and that’s only in minor cases.

“The scariest one that I’ve heard of and seen is people coming in with vision loss,” he said.

Florida Poison Control sees spike in calls from people taking livestock deworming drug ivermectin 

Even the manufacturer states there is no scientific basis or meaningful evidence Ivermectin is effective against COVID. However, many of the tractor supply stores say their shelves are empty.

“You have to ask yourself, ‘If I take this medicine, what am I going to do if something bad happens?’ What’s your next step, what’s your backup plan?” the doctor said. “If you’re going to take a medicine that could affect your health, do it with a doctor on board. Make those decisions with a thoroughly vetted opinion. There’s a lot of schooling that goes into that. It’s not just something you look on the internet for and decide if it’s the right dose.”

 

This type of thing started happening in the rural area around San Antonio a few months back.  It's what finally got my brother's attention.  

[NAVY 6747]

8 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

....which means we're just weeks away from our ERs being overwhelmed with idiots with copperheads latched onto their dicks or some shit like that.

I mean, we're getting closer and closer to 40% of our population LITERALLY opting for snake oil over actual medical measures.

Maybe snake FILLED with horse paste is the trick. 

[Bozo_Casanova 26579]

 

20 hours ago, crash_davis said:

It's name is Covid. 

 

20 hours ago, babysdaddy said:

Republican's that have died 17,245

The apostrophe situation  is the real pandemic

3 hours ago, Bookman said:

Gunshot victims in rural Oklahoma are having a difficult time receiving medical care because of horse paste poisonings.

This is America.

Just wait until affluent people from DFW can't book 1st trimester abortions in Oklahoma for their high school kids because of COVID. 

Edited September 2, 2021 by Bozo_Casanova

[Js1 85603]

40 minutes ago, NAVY said:

Maybe snake FILLED with horse paste is the trick. 

Snek 

[Nivek 16992]

11 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

I would really like to hear someone who believes in this chip nonsense to explain to me, even if that technology existed, exactly how the chip is supposed to work.

Umm, it is apparent that they do not understand fundamental physics.  A chip in a dog is about 12mm, so if they are using something of the same size, they have a very limited antenne size, which in turn, has a limited power source, and can only use very high frequencies which will attenuate over small distances and has to pass through the body.   I guess they are under the idea that it is now sending secret signals through your phone which is designed to receive this information.   I must say, it is quite an impressive leap for a country that can barely contain the spread of a virus to organizing a global scale of information gathering and keeping it secret considering the number of people, agencies, and data analyzers involved.  

 

Furthermore, I welcome the NSA to spy on me.   Kid put your shoes on.   Kid put your shoes on.  Kid put your shoes on.  It is not minecraft talk time, put your shoes on.   Must really befuddle them.  Why does Nivek and Mrs. Nivek have semidiurnal repetition events. 

Edited September 2, 2021 by Nivek

[Js1 85603]

Plus I'm still paying AT&T for cell service and it's not like it's been any better since I got vaccinated.  Total bullshit! 

[Captainant 27828]

11 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

I would really like to hear someone who believes in this chip nonsense to explain to me, even if that technology existed, exactly how the chip is supposed to work.

IIRC, it all stems from a gates foundation effort to have markers in the vaccine itself so that it leaves a physical record of the vaccine in the patient

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/invisible-ink-could-reveal-whether-kids-have-been-vaccinated/

And so the right wing conspiracy disinformation machine took that and misrepresented it until we get to injected microchips. Same sort of absurdity after absurdity that leads to a guy popping off a couple rounds in a pizza parlor

[babysdaddy 2728]

1 hour ago, DDD Dad said:

Reminds me of the time my dad told me about operating on a “bullet catcher” who rolled up to the ER after a drug deal gone bad. (He was also a carpenter)

I knew a guy that was a neurosurgeon and he said they had a saying in the hospital that 'trash survives'.  Drug dealers etc. would come in with half their head blown off and they'd make it while some little kid that fell off a merry go round would die.

[DDD Dad 14352]

7 minutes ago, babysdaddy said:

I knew a guy that was a neurosurgeon and he said they had a saying in the hospital that 'trash survives'.  Drug dealers etc. would come in with half their head blown off and they'd make it while some little kid that fell off a merry go round would die.

If I recall correctly he got dumped at the ER by some guys who quickly drove off.  Had over 20 bullet wounds and survived.

[Pato del Muerto 52618]

1 hour ago, NAVY said:

Team horse paste about to start fucking around with snek. Load up the FAFO cannon… nevermind. Snek got this 

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/brazilian-viper-venom-may-become-tool-fight-against-coronavirus-study-shows-2021-08-31/

 

Hmm. So the pentacostals have been ahead of the game this whole time. 

[Goredho 17423]

If we're going to turn the ivermectin crowd onto snake venom, we need to think BIG.  It needs to be publicized as viper venom administered rectally.

I stand ready to deploy the memes.

[ConferenceRoom 6147]

Rectum? Damn near killed him. 

[kopp0e 1135]

Well..? If this stuff gets out, the political platform many now stand on, may be wrecked...

 

[Huckleberry 33115]

5 minutes ago, kopp0e said:

Well..? If this stuff gets out, the political platform many now stand on, may be wrecked...

 

Explain the logic behind your statement, please, if it exists.

[bad_teammate 13225]

vaccine doesn't protect against every single disease possibility?

CHECKMATE, STUPID LIBS

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

14 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Explain the logic behind your statement, please, if it exists.

All the antivax idiots will feel vindicated if the vaccine proves to be of little worth.  

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

3 hours ago, NAVY said:

Team horse paste about to start fucking around with snek. Load up the FAFO cannon… nevermind. Snek got this 

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/brazilian-viper-venom-may-become-tool-fight-against-coronavirus-study-shows-2021-08-31/

 

Can’t die of COVID if you die of a snake bite!!

[NAVY 6747]

8 minutes ago, dingleberryswitzer said:

Can’t die of COVID if you die of a snake bite!!

I kinda hope this method of owning the libs goes, well, viral. Ahhhhhh well. So tired of stupid people 

[Longhorn_Fan68 33900]

Man, this kinda hits it home. Pretty chaotic and even in the beginning, but the graph becomes pretty blood red as time goes on. Thought about putting this in the GQP death cult thread, but chose here. Still may. If anyone knows how to embed, lmk
http://dangoodspeed.com/covid/total-deaths-since-july

[ConferenceRoom 6147]

 

50 minutes ago, kopp0e said:

Well..? If this stuff gets out, the political platform many now stand on, may be wrecked...

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/01/who-monitoring-new-coronavirus-variant-named-mu

Spoiler

The World Health Organization has added another version of coronavirus to its list of “variants of interest” amid concerns that it may partially evade the immunity people have developed from past infection or vaccination.

The Mu variant, also known as B.1.621, was added to the WHO’s watchlist on 30 August after it was detected in 39 countries and found to possess a cluster of mutations that may make it less susceptible to the immune protection many have acquired.

According to the WHO’s weekly bulletin on the pandemic, the Mu variant “has a constellation of mutations that indicate potential properties of immune escape”. Preliminary data suggests it may evade immune defences in a similar way to the Beta variant first discovered in South Africa, the report adds, but this needs to be confirmed by further work.

The Mu variant was first identified in Colombia in January 2021. Since then, sporadic cases and some larger outbreaks have been recorded around the world. Beyond South America, cases have been reported in the UK, Europe, the US and Hong Kong. While the variant makes up less than 0.1% of Covid infections globally, it may be gaining ground in Colombia and Ecuador where it accounts for 39% and 13% of Covid cases respectively.

Scientists and public health officials are particularly eager to know whether the Mu variant is more transmissible, or causes more serious disease, than the Delta variant that is dominant in much of the world. “The epidemiology of the Mu variant in South America, particularly with the co-circulation of the Delta variant, will be monitored for changes,” the WHO bulletin states.

At least 32 cases of the Mu variant have been detected in the UK, where the pattern of infections suggests it was brought in by travellers on multiple occasions. A report by Public Health England (PHE) in July said most were found in London and in people in their 20s. Some of those testing positive for Mu had received one or two doses of Covid vaccine.

The Mu variant was added to PHE’s list of variants under investigation in July. The designation, which refers to Mu as VUI-21JUL-01, means the variant will be monitored to see how it behaves. So far it has not raised alarm as much as Alpha and Delta, which are classified as more serious variants of concern, largely because of their increased transmissibility but also concerns about evading immune defences.

A risk assessment of the Mu variant released by PHE in August highlighted laboratory work that suggests the variant is at least as resistant as the Beta variant to immunity arising from vaccination. But more evidence is needed from other laboratory studies and real-world cases of the variant. How much of a threat the variant poses is highly uncertain and depends on whether cases grow substantially in the weeks and months ahead, particularly in the presence of the fast-spreading Delta variant.

“At present, there is no evidence that VUI-21JUL-01 is outcompeting the Delta variant and it appears unlikely that it is more transmissible,” the report states, though it goes on to warn: “Immune escape may contribute to future changes in growth.”

Part of the concern about Mu comes from the particular mutations it carries. One genetic change, the P681H mutation, is found in the Alpha variant first detected in Kent and has been linked to faster transmission. Other mutations, including E484K and K417N, may help the virus evade immunity defences, which could give the variant an advantage over Delta as immunity rises into the autumn.

 

 

 

Quote

The World Health Organization has added another version of coronavirus to its list of “variants of interest” amid concerns that it may partially evade the immunity people have developed from past infection or vaccination.

The Mu variant, also known as B.1.621, was added to the WHO’s watchlist on 30 August after it was detected in 39 countries and found to possess a cluster of mutations that may make it less susceptible to the immune protection many have acquired.

According to the WHO’s weekly bulletin on the pandemic, the Mu variant “has a constellation of mutations that indicate potential properties of immune escape”. Preliminary data suggests it may evade immune defences in a similar way to the Beta variant first discovered in South Africa, the report adds, but this needs to be confirmed by further work.

The Mu variant was first identified in Colombia in January 2021. Since then, sporadic cases and some larger outbreaks have been recorded around the world. Beyond South America, cases have been reported in the UK, Europe, the US and Hong Kong. While the variant makes up less than 0.1% of Covid infections globally, it may be gaining ground in Colombia and Ecuador where it accounts for 39% and 13% of Covid cases respectively.

Scientists and public health officials are particularly eager to know whether the Mu variant is more transmissible, or causes more serious disease, than the Delta variant that is dominant in much of the world. “The epidemiology of the Mu variant in South America, particularly with the co-circulation of the Delta variant, will be monitored for changes,” the WHO bulletin states.

I like my headline posts to come with stories and not just screenshots. 

Sorry for the British spelling, @Huckleberry

Edited September 2, 2021 by ConferenceRoom

[wildcat09 29423]

49 minutes ago, kopp0e said:

Well..? If this stuff gets out, the political platform many now stand on, may be wrecked...

 

You should try the snake venom.

[Goredho 17423]

Just found out a third person I knew from high school between 1984 and 1988 has died from covid in the last 8 days. I was pretty close to this guy, we played football together.  All three were apparently unvaccinated conservative Hispanics.  Is anyone else seeing a big uptick in death in their circles?

[Huckleberry 33115]

Thanks y'all, that's what I figured. No actual logic behind the statement, and completely ignorant of the benefits that the vaccines have already provided.

[TheStoicPaisano 9939]

Re: snekbite

you can’t tourniquet the taint!

[Goredho 17423]

17 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

Man, this kinda hits it home. Pretty chaotic and even in the beginning, but the graph becomes pretty blood red as time goes on. Thought about putting this in the GQP death cult thread, but chose here. Still may. If anyone knows how to embed, lmk
http://dangoodspeed.com/covid/total-deaths-since-july

Elections have consequences.  Here's to the consequences swinging elections.

Most Deaths Total:


Least Deaths Total: