CR: COVID-19 --Political Talk

[Biff Tannen 45692]

1 hour ago, workswithseed said:

Vpn?

[Royalfan5 2354]

My Aunt who teaches in Giddings mentioned to me on the phone that she is last person wearing a mask in her school(she is vaxxed as is my uncle) and that administration seemed confused why they keep having more and more kids turn up sick

[Anastasis 23479]

Good click through.  Feels like some of the stuff @trauma babe was posting here a while back...

 

 

[Deej 76842]

8 minutes ago, Royalfan5 said:

My Aunt who teaches in Giddings mentioned to me on the phone that she is last person wearing a mask in her school(she is vaxxed as is my uncle) and that administration seemed confused why they keep having more and more kids turn up sick

Because their god thinks they are idiots.

[Sawbonz 27580]

On 9/29/2021 at 2:51 PM, cactusflinthead said:

It's settled that vaccinated individuals have a higher count and a wider variety of antibodies

Do you have a link to support this? People who have recovered from the virus should have antibodies to a number of viral antigens in addition to antibodies to the spike protein, which is what the 3 approved vaccines induce. Also recovered patients should have t-cell immunity. 

[DigglerontheHoof 21204]

10 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Good click through.  Feels like some of the stuff @trauma babe was posting here a while back...

 

 

Really sobering read.  What a horrible way to die. 

[BearSchlong 8099]

Really sobering read.  What a horrible way to die. 

I've got a very good friend that is 2 months into exactly what is described in that string of tweets.

Was sedated/vented for about a month, but slowly getting better.

I cant imagine he will have a normal quality of life, long term.

He still has a trach tube with oxygen but is off the vent. Just texted him and he went on the vent on August 13, per my last text to him. Had covid, which in turned caused a heart attack and a stroke. So he is partially paralyzed as well.

[cactusflinthead 27601]

18 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

Do you have a link to support this? People who have recovered from the virus should have antibodies to a number of viral antigens in addition to antibodies to the spike protein, which is what the 3 approved vaccines induce. Also recovered patients should have t-cell immunity. 

You're gonna have better access to the studies than I do. 

"Some studies have found that the vaccine may lead to higher antibody levels than a natural COVID-19 infection — although Graham stressed that it’s hard to make apples-to-apples comparisons with antibody levels, since the immune response is so complex.

There is some evidence that the immune response after the vaccine is better equipped to deal with different variants of the coronavirus, Graham said.

An NIH-supported study this summer found that post-vaccine antibodies could target a wider range of mutations on the virus’s spike compared to post-infection antibodies."

https://spectrumnews1.com/wi/milwaukee/news/2021/08/23/covid-19-questions--should-i-get-a-vaccine-even-if-i-ve-been-infected-

2021.04.15.440089v2.full.pdf

Edit: from NIH link

"Now, a new NIH-supported study shows that the answer to this question will vary based on how an individual’s antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 were generated: over the course of a naturally acquired infection or from a COVID-19 vaccine. The new evidence shows that protective antibodies generated in response to an mRNA vaccine will target a broader range of SARS-CoV-2 variants carrying “single letter” changes in a key portion of their spike protein compared to antibodies acquired from an infection.

These results add to evidence that people with acquired immunity may have differing levels of protection to emerging SARS-CoV-2 variants. More importantly, the data provide further documentation that those who’ve had and recovered from a COVID-19 infection still stand to benefit from getting vaccinated."

Edited October 1, 2021 by cactusflinthead

[Sawbonz 27580]

48 minutes ago, cactusflinthead said:

You're gonna have better access to the studies than I do. 

My issue was with the wider variety of antibodies statement. It is unlikely that a vaccine that only presents the spike protein to the immune system could generate a more varied response in terms of antibodies produced than would an infection. While it is possible that there is a wider variety of antibodies to the spike protein, I’m not sure how you can measure clinically if that is better than antibodies to a wider variety of viral antigens plus t-cell mediated immunity. There was one clinical study from the US (that left out total numbers of infections in each cohort) that showed more recurrent infections than breakthrough infections, but it was done before delta became the dominant variant IIRC. The newer studies in Israel lean toward recovered patients doing slightly better than vaxed but I don’t think boosters were being done then.

 

Bottom line is we are still learning. Ideally you are vaxed plus booster at proper interval. If you’ve had covid you ought to still get vaxed. If you’re vaxed and have a breakthrough you’re probably golden for a long time. 

Edited October 1, 2021 by Sawbonz
Are not aren’t

[cactusflinthead 27601]

@Sawbonz

Wider variety was probably a poor choice of words. I wish I could remember the exact numbers(and the goddamn source) but it was on the order of 4x difference between vaxed and recovered. And yeah we're feeling our way in the dark at times.

[4th&Five 41565]

[Sawbonz 27580]

5 minutes ago, cactusflinthead said:

@Sawbonz

Wider variety was probably a poor choice of words. I wish I could remember the exact numbers(and the goddamn source) but it was on the order of 4x difference between vaxed and recovered. And yeah we're feeling our way in the dark at times.

It stands to reason that giving you a shitload of spike proteins (or causing your body to manufacture them) will induce a robust antibody response to various parts of that protein. From what we know about the other coronaviruses that infect humans, the mechanism of long term immunity is T cell mediated, which is probably why you don’t see a more vigorous antibody response in recovered patients. 

[Sawbonz 27580]

1 hour ago, BearSchlong said:

I've got a very good friend that is 2 months into exactly what is described in that string of tweets.

Was sedated/vented for about a month, but slowly getting better.

I cant imagine he will have a normal quality of life, long term.

He still has a trach tube with oxygen but is off the vent. Just texted him and he went on the vent on August 13, per my last text to him. Had covid, which in turned caused a heart attack and a stroke. So he is partially paralyzed as well.

Golden triangle?

[cactusflinthead 27601]

8 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

It stands to reason that giving you a shitload of spike proteins (or causing your body to manufacture them) will induce a robust antibody response to various parts of that protein. From what we know about the other coronaviruses that infect humans, the mechanism of long term immunity is T cell mediated, which is probably why you don’t see a more vigorous antibody response in recovered patients. 

Then why the need for yearly flu shots? Do T cells forget? New variants require new programming from mRNA to fight them off?

Edit: mo questions

Have we found the genetics that determine resistance? It's gotta be way too early to know for sure.

Edited October 1, 2021 by cactusflinthead

[Sawbonz 27580]

1 hour ago, BearSchlong said:

I've got a very good friend that is 2 months into exactly what is described in that string of tweets.

Was sedated/vented for about a month, but slowly getting better.

I cant imagine he will have a normal quality of life, long term.

He still has a trach tube with oxygen but is off the vent. Just texted him and he went on the vent on August 13, per my last text to him. Had covid, which in turned caused a heart attack and a stroke. So he is partially paralyzed as well.

Golden triangle?

[Sawbonz 27580]

2 minutes ago, cactusflinthead said:

Then why the need for yearly flu shots? Do T cells forget? New variants require new programming from mRNA to fight them off?

 

There are several strains of the flu and it mutates fairly frequently. It’s not a matter of your immune system forgetting, it’s being presented new antigens

[Anastasis 23479]

4 minutes ago, cactusflinthead said:

Then why the need for yearly flu shots?

Flu is a very different virus that mutates differently.  Antigenic drift (accumulated small mutations) and shift (rapid but rare large mutation events) are continually introducing substantive changes to the way the immune system perceives it. See: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/viruses/change.htm

Coronaviruses do not undertake the same sorts of changes as the flu virus.  

[BearSchlong 8099]

Golden triangle?

Yes. Patient J.O. but it looks like he is at Kindred hospital in Houston.

[jimmyjazz 45989]

2 hours ago, Anastasis said:

Good click through.  

This is remarkable.  Seriously.  Everybody should try this exercise just to get a hint of what it feels like to not be able to breathe in enough air.  As a (formerly) acute asthmatic, I'm keenly aware, but it's been a couple of decades and I really didn't enjoy the flashback.

[brakeman 28380]

This could be a game changer around the globe. But here in the US but the red hats / anti-vax would rather have ivermectin.

[Goredho 17412]

Interesting thing about that study for molnupiravir.  It started with roughly 700 “at risk, non-hospitalized adult patients with mild-to-moderate COVID-19.”  14.1% of the placebo group were dead or hospitalized after 29 days compared to 7.3% for those receiving the medication.  8 died from the placebo group and none from the group taking molnupiravir.

https://www.merck.com/news/merck-and-ridgebacks-investigational-oral-antiviral-molnupiravir-reduced-the-risk-of-hospitalization-or-death-by-approximately-50-percent-compared-to-placebo-for-patients-with-mild-or-moderat/

This isn’t an antiviral to treat the effects of covid.  It’s a vaccine against FAAFO.

[formermav43 4606]

2 hours ago, brakeman said:

This could be a game changer around the globe. But here in the US but the red hats / anti-vax would rather have ivermectin.

Well you can’t trust Big Pharma! Merck just wants to make a profit. But you can trust ivermectin, since it’s made by…wait, Merck????

[aggie08 21505]

1 minute ago, formermav43 said:

Well you can’t trust Big Pharma! Merck just wants to make a profit. But you can trust ivermectin, since it’s made by…wait, Merck????

Why do you think Merck is telling people not to use ivermectin? To make way for their more expensive--but less effective--options. It's like you don't even understand capitalist communism, bruh.

[4th&Five 41565]

[Guest Lobo]

Wait, you can get Covid from beer?  

[brakeman 28380]

Can America make to a million deaths? That is about 300,000 less red hat wearing anti-vaxxers.

 

[sidis 9832]

1 hour ago, formermav43 said:

Well you can’t trust Big Pharma! Merck just wants to make a profit. But you can trust ivermectin, since it’s made by…wait, Merck????

i guarantee you that the next argument that will be propagated throughout that crowd will be...

well, ivermectin is an older drug in which merck has lost patent protection...thus, there are lots of generics out there so merck can't make any money off of it.  that's why they are contributing to the anti-ivermectin media onslaught calling it horse paste.  it's also why they conjured up molnupiravir brand new...so they can charge non-generic, retail prices for it.  don't trust molnupiravir, just take stromectol (ivermectin).

[sidis 9832]

12 minutes ago, brakeman said:

Can America make to a million deaths? That is about 300,000 less red hat wearing anti-vaxxers.

 

beau vine's jibe is my fewer.

[aggie08 21505]

20 minutes ago, sidis said:

i guarantee you that the next argument that will be propagated throughout that crowd will be...

well, ivermectin is an older drug in which merck has lost patent protection...thus, there are lots of generics out there so merck can't make any money off of it.  that's why they are contributing to the anti-ivermectin media onslaught calling it horse paste.  it's also why they conjured up molnupiravir brand new...so they can charge non-generic, retail prices for it.  don't trust molnupiravir, just take stromectol (ivermectin).

I mean...yeah. Like...verbatim. 

This guy owns a red hat, get him!

[Newy25 7698]

1 hour ago, 4th&Five said:

Even adjusted for the low expectations of human depravity that is this board, this is a pretty disgusting display. You have to wonder how truly corrupt you have become to have thoughts like this. 

[Gap03 3308]

3 minutes ago, Newy25 said:

Even adjusted for the low expectations of human depravity that is this board, this is a pretty disgusting display. 

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19120]

1 hour ago, 4th&Five said:

 

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19120]

9 minutes ago, Newy25 said:

Even adjusted for the low expectations of human depravity that is this board, this is a pretty disgusting display. You have to wonder how truly corrupt you have become to have thoughts like this. 

Well, you really won't like my response then.  

Oh, and fuck Brett Kavanaugh.

[RDCanecutter 26454]

21 hours ago, ROFL BOX said:

Where in Florida?

I too am interested in details of livings in the Florida province of USA's.

[bolverk 29694]

Read earlier this morning that Kavanaugh has been fully vaccinated since January. The odds are overwhelmingly in his favor which brings me to this graphic from today's NYTimes showing the Covid death rate since the middle of June. 100,000 Americans have died in that time.

Quote

The United States government has not closely tracked the vaccination status of everyone who has been infected with the virus, but the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has so far identified 2,900 people who were vaccinated among the 100,000 who died of Covid since mid-June.

Vaccines have been proven highly effective in preventing severe illness and death, and a study from the C.D.C. that was published in September found that after Delta became the dominant variant, unvaccinated people were more than 10 times as likely to die of the virus as the vaccinated were. The study, which spanned from April to mid-July, used data from 10 states, New York City, Los Angeles County and King County, Wash., which includes Seattle.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/01/us/us-covid-deaths-700k.html

 

[Celery Man 20973]

On 9/29/2021 at 4:18 PM, kevwun said:

Amazon has cloud stuff that runs through the UK and Microsoft has the same thing with the Netherlands.  We have a geo-ip filter on our firewall at work and I had to open up both countries because any website that used AWS or Azure wouldn't work with them blocked.

we had geographical IP filtering in a firewall that corporate IT slapped in front of our analytics platform that collected data from our global customers. the data came off of airplanes (off the airplane to hanger computers to our datacenter). i wanted to shoot myself in the fucking head trying to get that removed.

[cactusflinthead 27601]

1 hour ago, Newy25 said:

Even adjusted for the low expectations of human depravity that is this board, this is a pretty disgusting display. You have to wonder how truly corrupt you have become to have thoughts like this. 

Fuck off.

I'd rather have John Prine, Jerry Jeff, or a host of other people we have lost than to keep that lying sack of shit alive.

[kevwun 15806]

5 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

we had geographical IP filtering in a firewall that corporate IT slapped in front of our analytics platform that collected data from our global customers. the data came off of airplanes (off the airplane to hanger computers to our datacenter). i wanted to shoot myself in the fucking head trying to get that removed.

Ha, it works great for us, but that was a terrible idea for your situation.  It’s pointless for global networks.

Edited October 1, 2021 by kevwun

[Anastasis 23479]

1 hour ago, Newy25 said:

Even adjusted for the low expectations of human depravity that is this board, this is a pretty disgusting display. You have to wonder how truly corrupt you have become to have thoughts like this. 

Dismisses the notion that the posters here rooting for the death of others are limited to strictly FAFO people that skip the vax.  It is just politically motivated and as simple as that for some.

 

Edited October 1, 2021 by Anastasis

[Anastasis 23479]

Meanwhile, in the not rooting for death of people camp, as being discussed in the DT vax thread...

Oral antiviral has some compelling data as a therapeutic. 

 

https://www.merck.com/news/merck-and-ridgebacks-investigational-oral-antiviral-molnupiravir-reduced-the-risk-of-hospitalization-or-death-by-approximately-50-percent-compared-to-placebo-for-patients-with-mild-or-moderat/

Merck and Ridgeback’s Investigational Oral Antiviral Molnupiravir Reduced the Risk of Hospitalization or Death by Approximately 50 Percent Compared to Placebo for Patients with Mild or Moderate COVID-19 in Positive Interim Analysis of Phase 3 Study

 

[Neonmoon 38129]

That's awesome. Start mass producing that shit. 

[Anastasis 23479]

3 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

That's awesome. Start mass producing that shit. 

From the NYT write up:

The federal government has placed advance orders for 1.7 million courses of Merck’s drug, at a price of about $700 per patient. That is about one-third of the current cost of a monoclonal antibody treatment.

[wildcat09 29355]

It's pretty likely that thousands of people have died because of Kavanaugh's votes to overturn covid restrictions. 

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19120]

From the NYT write up:
The federal government has placed advance orders for 1.7 million courses of Merck’s drug, at a price of about $700 per patient. That is about one-third of the current cost of a monoclonal antibody treatment.

So it is 1/3 the cost of the antibody treatment but many times as expensive as the two dose vaccine.

[Anastasis 23479]

Just now, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

42 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

From the NYT write up:
The federal government has placed advance orders for 1.7 million courses of Merck’s drug, at a price of about $700 per patient. That is about one-third of the current cost of a monoclonal antibody treatment.

So it is 1/3 the cost of the antibody treatment but many times as expensive as the two dose vaccine.

Let's call it ~10x the cost, yep. 

[conVINCEd 21469]

12 minutes ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

54 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

From the NYT write up:
The federal government has placed advance orders for 1.7 million courses of Merck’s drug, at a price of about $700 per patient. That is about one-third of the current cost of a monoclonal antibody treatment.

So it is 1/3 the cost of the antibody treatment but many times as expensive as the two dose vaccine.

While I certainly agree with your point, this is like bitching about the play calling in the first quarter after a 40 point win.  Let’s have a few drinks and enjoy the victory, we can get back to bitching about GDGD in a few days.

[4th&Five 41565]

 

[Horn Dog 9875]

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

Dismisses the notion that the posters here rooting for the death of others are limited to strictly FAFO people that skip the vax.  It is just politically motivated and as simple as that for some.

 

How exactly do you get from a gif that simply states "That's a Shame"  that Kav has been diagnosed with COVID equals "posters rooting for others deaths"?  

The sentiment is political in the sense that an entire politician party has acted incredibly irresponsibly to prolong and worsen this pandemic by spreading misinformation and bogus conspiracy theories.  When the consequences of this disinformation campaign directly impact these politicians (and lets be clear that Kav is most definitely a GOP political operative as are several of the other supremes) then yea, the sentiment that "Its a shame" that he will be impacted in some way is absolutely appropriate . 

[Anastasis 23479]

7 minutes ago, conVINCEd said:

While I certainly agree with your point, this is like bitching about the play calling in the first quarter after a 40 point win.  Let’s have a few drinks and enjoy the victory, we can get back to bitching about GDGD in a few days.

Agree, this is a great development.  Vaccines + therapeutics are the way out. 

[4th&Five 41565]

3 hours ago, Newy25 said:

Even adjusted for the low expectations of human depravity that is this board, this is a pretty disgusting display. You have to wonder how truly corrupt you have become to have thoughts like this. 

Thoughts like what? He's vaccinated and will be fine.  Just like the rest of the GQP leaders that don't give a shit if their devoted cult skip the vax and die.