CR: COVID-19 --Political Talk

[kevwun 15777]

I mean just because no reputable study has found it to help, why have you got to lose?

Edited May 14, 2020 by kevwun

[triplehorn 2664]

5 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Unfortunately that benefit has not been established.  It exists at the current only at the intersection of wishful thinking and quackery. 

I'm just looking at what the national consensus is for multiple countries that happen to be kicking our butts in managing the pandemic.

Ditch the AZ if that makes anyone feel better.

[Hookah Horns 3083]

18 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Wait . . . are you saying that the negative cardiac issues reported with HCQ use in Covid patients didn't actually exist?  I'm not making a call either way, but it sure seemed like there was significant evidence floated up that there were heart issues in some patients.  Never mind the additional studies which seem to indicate it doesn't actually do any good in fighting Covid.

They do, and a lack of cardiac events in patients before covid existed doesn't prove it's safe when they've seen covid patients having cardiac events on it. 

[Anastasis 23469]

1 minute ago, triplehorn said:

I'm just looking at what the national consensus is for multiple countries that happen to be kicking our butts in managing the pandemic.

Ditch the AZ if that makes anyone feel better.

Which countries are those?

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13584]

1 hour ago, henrygandorf said:

and here it is.  this is his one move.

if someone says something bad about him, or something contradictory to anything he says or believes, then that person is disgruntled, angry, and is likely a never-trumper.  anyone like that has an axe to grind, and they're acting out of emotion and fueled by revenge, therefore they cannot be trusted, and are definitely not telling the truth.  also he never met them.

I don't know Rick Bright. Let me tell you about Rick Bright.

[FondrenRoad 4378]

2 hours ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

Pardon me while I turn the thread into my facebook post, since I don't have facebook.

TLDR (you'll need it): Not anti-science, but turning into what I describe as a fatalist.

I moved my family to a place where they knew nobody back in December.  For a few weeks, the kids only had each other to play with, and there was lots of grieving for their missed friends and locales.  The townhome we rented is in a great location, but no immediate families with kids their ages in the area.  School finally starts up (the schools in the area were one of many reasons I wanted to move here), and they were accepted by peers immediately and started making friends quickly.  Daughter got invited to birthday parties, and they were even getting playdates set up when boom, no more school/pandemic closure time.  So back to only having each other.  We put in an offer on a house at roughly the same time, not knowing how bad things were about to get.  Ignorance, desperation, I don't know.

Fast forward to this week and we're finally starting the move in process.  One day I was there with my son and we thought we'd skateboard the street and I see sooooo many kids playing together. I think, hmm, they can't all be from the same family.  This area is a pretty small subdivision and there would be no reason for through traffic.  You go into the neighborhood only if you live there, really. Next thing you know a giant gaggle of kids run up to me and start introducing themselves, asking questions, e.t.c.  Eventually their parents start walking over and doing the same.  If there was no pandemic going on, you'd think I moved into a Norman Rockwell scene with a forest background. Most of the kids were girls, and younger, but then there is a boy my son's age and I just couldn't help it, I let them visit, play.  For my son, after all this time cooped up, well, I imagine it was like water to a thirsty man.

As I talked to the parents, I realized I myself have been lonely too, and I was so happy to get all these friendly welcomes and just talk to some friendly adults in person.  Adults who know the area, who have kids, e.t.c.  I didn't want to offend in any way, so I tried to crack a joke about "so, not quarantining the kids, eh?"  The answer was essentially "we don't go anywhere, and they all know each other." 

Now, I KNOW that's not a great answer.  I KNOW the safest thing I could do is keep my kids cooped up.  But having them in their new place watching all the neighborhood kids play in the yards from the windows, well I'm not enough of  a Kurtz I guess.  I'm a fucking softie.  So I confess, I let the son walk off and talk to his new friend (kids make friends so fast).  The next day I let the daughter run with the other girls.  

I KNOW that's not smart. But I want you all to know that its not political, at least on my part.  Its tiredness, its loneliness, its wanting my kids to have some joy in these dark times.  And its a fatalism thing.  The area I'm in has had 0 deaths so far, that we know.  The testing is of course, minimal.  But if this thing is so hyper contagious that we're all about to get it anyway (or maybe had it and don't know), at some point I find myself finally giving up, a bit.  I don't plan on going to mass gatherings.  I don't plan on eating in a restaurant in person.  I shaved my head a few weeks back, so I don't care about haircuts.  I wear my mask when I shop for groceries or go to Target.  But not only do I not want my kids to be lonely, I'm tired of not knowing anyone myself in this place I've been in for six months.

If letting my kids play with the neighborhood kids is going to give it to me, then I'm getting it.  If talking outside to my neighbors is going to give it to me, then I am getting it.  I'm not anywhere close to ever voting for a Republican, much less a Trump (although as a lefty a lot of Dems don't please me either).  But I feel like some here would group me with science deniers/ak-47 protesters.

Confession over.

I have a 6 year old in outright revolt against online school and zoom friend meetups, so I get it. We have expanded our circle to include another couple of families so that the kids can play together and so can the adults.  And that mostly consists of picnics and things like that, and not going to each others houses.  But we have known them for years, and we all first did the month in isolation and continue to isolate from others. 

But I also know others who get panicky at the thought of it.  You can't throw a football back and forth!  It could get on your hands!  But that comes from people who have been in near total isolation since mid March which can drive up the anxiety.

Its different from your situation since you're new there. I would have some concerns about the whole neighborhood being in the "circle", and also about not knowing them well enough to know whether they have otherwise been maintaining social distance. 

I'm also in the biggest hot zone, fwiw.  I know a lot of people that have had it, and have a lot of friends with family members that have died from it.

Edited May 14, 2020 by FondrenRoad

[Dnaguy 11948]

1 hour ago, burntorangebongos said:

I think those were just binders filled with empty papers....there is no plan.

 

1 hour ago, Irwin F Fletcher said:

1 hour ago, burntorangebongos said:

I think those were just binders filled with empty papers....there is no plan.

In all honesty, blank pieces of paper with no actual plan, would be better than what Trump has already offered up.

 

NYTimes just released the leaked contents of Trump White House Pandemic Plan:

 

[Bateshorn 9927]

19 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

I have a 6 year old in outright revolt against online school and zoom friend meetups, so I get it. We have expanded our circle to include another couple of families so that the kids can play together and so can the adults.  And that mostly consists of picnics and things like that, and not going to each others houses.  But we have known them for years, and we all first did the month in isolation and continue to isolate from others. 

But I also know others who get panicky at the thought of it.  You can't throw a football back and forth!  It could get on your hands!  But that comes from people who have been in near total isolation since mid March which can drive up the anxiety.

Its different from your situation since you're new there. I would have some concerns about the whole neighborhood being in the "circle", and also about not knowing them well enough to know whether they have otherwise been maintaining social distance. 

I'm also in the biggest hot zone, fwiw.  I know a lot of people that have had it, and have a lot of friends with family members that have died from it.

There's two families up the street, on opposite sides. They both have kids aged 5 ish and 8ish. There might be another that's 10. One family white, one black.  Now, I live in Prince George's County, and that's not unusual, but the white family is relatively new to the neighborhood, and I don't believe the kids had much of a friendship prior to this absurdity. They obviously go to different schools from their uniforms in the AM.

I've watched the two sets of kids be drawn to each other like moths to flame over that last 2 months.  First independent play, then parallel, then coordinating their play across the street, then slowly inching out into the street (and being called back by parents to maintain social distancing).  The parents both threw in the towel last week and they basically ride up and down the street together and block of the street with forts and play all day.  Humans are going to human. It's actually one of the most uplifting signs that our historical racial and social barriers are completely artificial I've ever seen.

But they are kids. We are grown ass adults and going to an enclosed space and sharing air is the best way to catch this disease.

Edited May 14, 2020 by Bateshorn

[Chooky 13307]

Obama's low energy pandemic plan:

Trump's badass pandemic plan:

 

 

[MC Fresh Breath 4074]

2 hours ago, burntorangebongos said:

Good luck to you and your family.  I sincerely mean it.

I got around my extended family when I traveled to another city to visit my mother before her death. I knew that they were all using best practices to avoid contracting Covid due to my mother's health and nephew with medical issues. But I risked travel and exposure to get to them and eventually grieve for the loss of my mother with them. All this to say that it may come back to bite me and I will still deem it worth it.  I hope you are truly okay with the risk that you are taking and view it as worth it as well.

What I see as very troublesome is that these folks practiced no precautions before getting close to you, a stranger. Whereas my family made me spray alcohol all over myself and wear a mask and gloves before allowing me into the house where my mother was and washing my hands first thing after removing the gloves and mask. Just saying...maybe have your kids run around with hand sanitizer and at least a bandana when playing with the others. When they come home, off with the shoes and mist some alcohol in their hair and feet and run to wash hands first thing. Concerned female advice completed. Sorry if it seems naggy.

Not nagging at all, and I appreciate what you have to say.  Excellent points about no precautions with a stranger. 

[triplehorn 2664]

37 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Which countries are those?

Countries I'm aware of that are doing better than us, and are employing/employed early treatment with HCQ/CQ (and notably not AZ), are South Korea, Iceland, Malaysia, Costa Rica, UAE, Bahrain, and Italy.  Add Saudi and Qatar as well.  And as far as I can tell, the CFR for the Gulf nations employing early/proph HCQ is way below world average:

 

Spoiler

 

 

[MC Fresh Breath 4074]

1 hour ago, Snake Diggity said:

This mirrors my experience in a big way.  I am mostly liberal, I intend to vote for Biden, and I ABHOR Trump.  But I have 2 kids under 5 at home and both my wife and I work from home full time.  They haven’t been to daycare or around any other children since early March.  It’s driven all of us insane (not joking).  So last week I relented and let my wife go over to my SIL’s so the girls could play with their cousins, knowing my in-laws are Trumper “this is a hoax/flu” people who haven’t been social distancing at all.  I felt ashamed at allowing something that seemed so selfish, stupid, and careless.  But I was just too tired of fighting it.  Too tired of being the only person willing to listen to reason and continue to self-sacrifice for the greater good.  At this point even if the number of cases/deaths doesn’t keep going down, I will let my kids go back to daycare when they’re allowed.  It might be the biggest mistake I ever make, but I feel the needs they have that are currently being unmet outweigh the risks.

 

Yeah, I mean in some ways I immediately felt like I failed and I fell to peer pressure. I want to fit in w/the neighborhood as best I can, and felt like I had a split second choice--run away into the house dragging my son with me and (in my mind) risk alienation on the first impression.  But then I also feel like I lost the ability to make fun of the protesting folks, at least a little bit.  And as pointed out, these folks let their kids run up to people they didn't know right away. 

 But in terms of mood--everyone's mood improved so damn much that the house just filled with peace.  I'm not exaggerating, it felt like in some ways a giant weight left our family nearly instantly.  It felt like psychologically I was helping, even knowing I may be being ultimately foolish.  And that help felt, like you said, worth the risk.

Edited May 14, 2020 by MC Fresh Breath

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20396]

Republicans: those five cells clustered together are human life and human life is sacred!

Also Republicans: Grandpa has had a good run.
 

[MC Fresh Breath 4074]

38 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

 

Its different from your situation since you're new there. I would have some concerns about the whole neighborhood being in the "circle", and also about not knowing them well enough to know whether they have otherwise been maintaining social distance. 

 

You're right, and I know the "we don't go anywhere else" bit is bullshit, but maybe the kind of bs that people tell themselves to feel better.  I know it b/c driving back and forth in this town due to moving, I see lots of traffic and folks going somewhere.  I honestly think that there is a level of "If we're going to get it, we are going to get it" that goes beyond the ballot box leanings.  

And sorry for the losses, so far all I know have been spared.  My most vulnerable relatives are thousands of miles away from me, so I don't have much influence there.

[Bama Chick 28596]

"See! We have a plan! It's even in a binder! And so much better than that stupid Obama plan from three and a half years ago that they didn't give us."

BUT IS IT LAMINATED???

LAMINATION MAKES EVERYTHING OFFICIAL!

[Anastasis 23469]

23 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

Countries I'm aware of that are doing better than us, and are employing/employed early treatment with HCQ/CQ (and notably not AZ), are South Korea, Iceland, Malaysia, Costa Rica, UAE, Bahrain, and Italy.  Add Saudi and Qatar as well.  And as far as I can tell, the CFR for the Gulf nations employing early/proph HCQ is way below world average:

 

If HCQ is driving the results in those countries, and not other unrelated factors, it should be very easy for you to find some well designed and carried out controlled studies from those countries supporting HCQ as the factor driving those results.  Barring the existence of those data, it's baseless speculation to assign their CFR to HCQ without consideration of other factors known to impact CFR such as testing strategy, ICU capacity, population demographic and clinical characteristics, etc. 

[Bama Chick 28596]

Well, no shit????

[triplehorn 2664]

15 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

If HCQ is driving the results in those countries, and not other unrelated factors, it should be very easy for you to find some well designed and carried out controlled studies from those countries supporting HCQ as the factor driving those results.  Barring the existence of those data, it's baseless speculation to assign their CFR to HCQ without consideration of other factors known to impact CFR such as testing strategy, ICU capacity, population demographic and clinical characteristics, etc. 

I can't satisfy your standard.  That's not stopping the consensus medical decision making for incorporation of HCQ into national pandemic crisis response in a lot of countries faring better than us.  The absence of a peer reviewed journal publication does not suggest to me they are operating on a coin toss.

 

hey ho.  and enrolling mild cases

 

important for the long term.  but for now, we've bungled way into being earth's self-appointed national control group.

[Anastasis 23469]

12 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

I can't satisfy your standard. 

It's not my standard.  I didn't invent it.  It's the standard of the scientific medical community.

The NIH study is great.  I would argue that they should also include an HCQ only arm, but it is what it is.

 

If we can agree on some chalk I would love to get some action going.  I'd love to be wrong and write the check. 

HCQ/Azith fails to separate in a favorable direction from placebo on mortality endpoint - I'll give you even money

Safety signals detected in HCQ/Azith arm - give me +200 (revised from +150 after reviewing the exclusion criteria)

Study terminated early for any reason - give me +300

Edited May 14, 2020 by Anastasis

[elfenix 34237]

14th court rules in favor of allowing mail in ballots for those in fear of coronavirus. 

 

 

https://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2020/05/14/us/politics/14reuters-health-coronavirus-usa-texaselection.html?searchResultPosition=6

Edited May 14, 2020 by elfenix

[triplehorn 2664]

7 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

It's not my standard.  I didn't invent it.  It's the standard of the scientific medical community.

The NIH study is great.  I would argue that they should also include an HCQ only arm, but it is what it is.

 

If we can agree on some chalk I would love to get some action going.  I'd love to be wrong and write the check. 

HCQ/Azith fails to separate in a favorable direction from placebo on mortality endpoint - I'll give you even money

Safety signals detected in HCQ/Azith arm - give me +200 (revised from +150 after reviewing the exclusion criteria)

Study terminated early for any reason - give me +300

thanks, not interested. lol.  I agree there should be an HCQ only treatment group.  My main interest lies in answering questions about early HCQ reducing severity and duration of illness (and total infectivity). A reduction in incidence of virus transmission to others is harder to measure directly but could be inferred from any shortening of severity and duration of illness with HCQ.  I would also make the primary endpoint assess a reduction in need for higher level of care (hospitalization) as opposed to mortality.  With the key being early intervention, you could measure both, but conceivably early HCQ might significantly reduce the number cases requiring hospitalization without changing final mortality outcomes across groups.  Reducing severity/duration of illness, and infectivity, while reducing the need for hospitalizations, obviously would directly serve the interests of individuals, those of an overburdened health care system, and potentially allow greater confidence in opening back up.  Reducing and preventing infections is what saves us in many ways even if the CFR is unchanged.  Use in this manner is consistent with other vital measures we're using related to distancing, masks, hygiene, good ventilation etc.

[WhatTheBuck 28778]

1 hour ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

Republicans: those five cells clustered together are human life and human life is sacred!

Also Republicans: Grandpa has had a good run.

You can freeze an embryo and it will remain viable. Maybe try doing that with grandpa. 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

 

[Anastasis 23469]

9 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

thanks, not interested. lol.  I agree there should be an HCQ only treatment group.  My main interest lies in answering questions about early HCQ reducing severity and duration of illness (and total infectivity). A reduction in incidence of virus transmission to others is harder to measure directly but could be inferred from any shortening of severity and duration of illness with HCQ.  I would also make the primary endpoint assess a reduction in need for higher level of care (hospitalization) as opposed to mortality.  With the key being early intervention, you could measure both, but conceivably early HCQ might significantly reduce the number cases requiring hospitalization without changing final mortality outcomes across groups.  Reducing severity/duration of illness, and infectivity, while reducing the need for hospitalizations, obviously would directly serve the interests of individuals, those of an overburdened health care system, and potentially allow greater confidence in opening back up.  Reducing and preventing infections is what saves us in many ways even if the CFR is unchanged.  Use in this manner is consistent with other vital measures we're using related to distancing, masks, hygiene, good ventilation etc.

Duration of illness and recovery are secondary endpoints. So the data will be there. 

[Biff Tannen 45678]

45 minutes ago, elfenix said:

14th court rules in favor of allowing mail in ballots for those in fear of coronavirus. 

 

 

https://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2020/05/14/us/politics/14reuters-health-coronavirus-usa-texaselection.html?searchResultPosition=6

Hey Paxton. 
 

[Queen Bitch 1692]

America’s done. We’re fucked. It’s over.

[PsychMike 1552]

3 hours ago, triplehorn said:

 I am not aware of any study showing that HCQ/AZ becomes less safe as a result of active Covid infection.  That's an important distinction.  

From early on in this pandemic, when people started to discuss HCQ with or without AZ, they would cite the known safety data. But what they failed to acknowledge or understand, is that that safety data was not reported from Covid-19 patients. Yes, there can be real differences in toxicity. It's what we in the clinical pharmacy world refer to as drug-disease interactions. I didn't predict problems, I was concerned that people were overlooking potential problems that had not been studied under controlled conditions. The more safe people are convinced it is, the higher the potential risk for therapeutic misadventures.

Fast forward to 

"The QT interval in patients with COVID-19 treated with hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin" by Chorin et al. April 24, 2020 in Nature Medicine (I accessed it at nature.com)

The following excerpt provides preliminary evidence that yes, active Covid infection (at least higher severity cases) put patients at higher risk of toxicity. Thankfully, there were no incidents of Torsade de Pointes. Deaths in the HCQ/AZ patients were not related to arrhythmias and their ECGs were normal. But let me tell you: a mean prolongation of 24 msec and 11% incidence of QTc over 500 msec will make the cardiologists and intensivists pucker up. The patients were living in powder kegs and giving off sparks.

"The effectiveness of HZ/AZ in treating SARS-CoV-2 infection has been demonstrated in one small human study so far2. Previously, the combination of HY/AZ resulted in mild QTc prolongation when given to young healthy volunteers8. In our work, we found that in patients with COVID-19 who were treated with HY/AZ, the QTc was significantly prolonged. This discrepancy suggests that QT prolongation may be influenced by patient attributes such as the presence of co-morbidities and the severity of the disease9. Of note, recent guidance suggested ECG screening with QTc assessment for patients with COVID-19 who are candidates for novel therapies, including HY/AZ10. In our cohort, five of nine patients with severe QTc prolongation had a normal QTc at baseline. We therefore suggest that the QTc should be followed repeatedly in patients with COVID-19 who are treated with HY/AZ, particularly in those with co-morbidities and in those who are treated with other QT-prolonging medications."

 

I hope for the best for patients on these drugs. But don't let anyone try to convince you of their safety for Covid-19 based on old safety data in other populations.

[Chad Fuck 17673]

47 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

Hey Paxton. 
 

Countdown to Tx S.Ct. overturning in 3..2....

[RPM 26319]

16 minutes ago, Queen Bitch said:

America’s done. We’re fucked. It’s over.

Stupid attracts more stupid. They bask in the warm embrace of ignorance.

[Bama Chick 28596]

Y’all watch out for flying pigs.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

 

[Upgrayedd 5810]

I love her.

[cactusflinthead 27598]

3 hours ago, triplehorn said:

I can't satisfy your standard.  That's not stopping the consensus medical decision making for incorporation of HCQ into national pandemic crisis response in a lot of countries faring better than us.  The absence of a peer reviewed journal publication does not suggest to me they are operating on a coin toss.

 

hey ho.  and enrolling mild cases

 

important for the long term.  but for now, we've bungled way into being earth's self-appointed national control group.

Get some evidence. You've gotten two responses and I'll make three. What's the difference between those nations and ours? I'll posit that it ain't HCQ. Testing is the key and I'm going to guess that all of them have done a better job of it than we have. 

I'm all for some kind of remedy, but I am highly dubious of HCQ/AZ. At the outset I was all in favor of it, but new shit has come to light and ain't none of it been good.

[jimmyjazz 45910]

I love the "my constitutional rights are essential" crowd dismissing the press.  Hey, here's an idea.  Read the Constitution.  You can stop after 1A.

[Bama Chick 28596]

So, I’m done giving Governor MeeMaw praise for not being a moron.

Alabama was supposed to be doing the slow, phased in reopening but once it started, every place just started reopening and the state didn’t do jackshit.

And if you read the follow up tweets, our testing numbers are flat. So, the increase in cases is not a reflection of increased testing.

And highest numbers of hospitalizations doesn’t lie.

And I found out today that the hospital where I work has (as of today) our first confirmed cases of community spread in employees. Five so far - 2 nurses, 2 nursing assistants, and 1 housekeeper. The nurses and nursing assistants work in the same unit but the housekeeper works in multiple locations - including the unit where the nurses work.

I feel certain that number is about to go up.

[henrygandorf 29190]

4 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I love the "my constitutional rights are essential" crowd dismissing the press.  Hey, here's an idea.  Read the Constitution.  You can stop after 1A.

lulz their version definitely starts on page 2.

[Post Oak 20213]

33 minutes ago, Bama Chick said:

So, I’m done giving Governor MeeMaw praise for not being a moron.

Alabama was supposed to be doing the slow, phased in reopening but once it started, every place just started reopening and the state didn’t do jackshit.

 

 

And if you read the follow up tweets, our testing numbers are flat. So, the increase in cases is not a reflection of increased testing.

And highest numbers of hospitalizations doesn’t lie.

And I found out today that the hospital where I work has (as of today) our first confirmed cases of community spread in employees. Five so far - 2 nurses, 2 nursing assistants, and 1 housekeeper. The nurses and nursing assistants work in the same unit but the housekeeper works in multiple locations - including the unit where the nurses work.

I feel certain that number is about to go up.

 

 

[Message Board User 12395]

 

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13584]

This bwoke my widdle head.

 

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/without-a-vaccine-herd-immunity-wont-save-us/

[Message Board User 12395]

 

[Grade of D as in David 13253]

6 hours ago, FondrenRoad said:

I have a 6 year old in outright revolt against online school and zoom friend meetups, so I get it. We have expanded our circle to include another couple of families so that the kids can play together and so can the adults.  And that mostly consists of picnics and things like that, and not going to each others houses.  But we have known them for years, and we all first did the month in isolation and continue to isolate from others. 

But I also know others who get panicky at the thought of it.  You can't throw a football back and forth!  It could get on your hands!  But that comes from people who have been in near total isolation since mid March which can drive up the anxiety.

Its different from your situation since you're new there. I would have some concerns about the whole neighborhood being in the "circle", and also about not knowing them well enough to know whether they have otherwise been maintaining social distance. 

I'm also in the biggest hot zone, fwiw.  I know a lot of people that have had it, and have a lot of friends with family members that have died from it.

I'm not going to judge your decisions, but how the hell do you have a key party at a park?

[Grade of D as in David 13253]

3 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

You can freeze an embryo and it will remain viable. Maybe try doing that with grandpa. 

[MC Fresh Breath 4074]

County I live in has been approved by Kate Brown for "Phase 1" re-opening starting tomorrow.  

Quote

 

Phase 1, which allows businesses such as restaurants and bars (dining in), barbers and salons, massage business, gyms and fitness centers to reopen under physical distancing and other guidelines, such as workers required to wear masks and customers encouraged as well. In-person gatherings, previously under a 10-person limit, is raised to 25, but travel is still discouraged.

Phase 1 will last at least three weeks, while COVID-19 cases are closely monitored for any surge before a broader Phase 2 reopening can be considering.

 

 

https://ktvz.com/news/coronavirus/2020/05/13/gov-brown-set-to-announce-which-counties-enter-phase-1-reopening/

[Bama Chick 28596]

 

She went to Auburn.

[F250 28770]

5 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

Well, no shit????

 

One of the oddest things about the Trump era is that the President of the United States frequently talks on camera with massive amounts of orange shit on his face with contrasting white circles around his eyes and his scalp, and no one says anything.

 

[Bozo_Casanova 26450]

5 hours ago, Anastasis said:

It's not my standard.  I didn't invent it.  It's the standard of the scientific medical community.

The NIH study is great.  I would argue that they should also include an HCQ only arm, but it is what it is.

 

If we can agree on some chalk I would love to get some action going.  I'd love to be wrong and write the check. 

HCQ/Azith fails to separate in a favorable direction from placebo on mortality endpoint - I'll give you even money

Safety signals detected in HCQ/Azith arm - give me +200 (revised from +150 after reviewing the exclusion criteria)

Study terminated early for any reason - give me +300

FWIW, as a software salesman with YouTube and google I think it’s the HCQ+zinc that matters. The Z pack just interdicts secondary bacterial infection.

[Anastasis 23469]

Just now, Bozo_Casanova said:

FWIW, as a software salesman with YouTube and google I think it’s the HCQ+zinc that matters. The Z pack just interdicts secondary bacterial infection.

No clear to me which line you want to entertain some action on?

[Degenerate Gardner 4085]

3 hours ago, Queen Bitch said:

 

That's tremendously awful. Really well staged or just lucky: the kids afoot, the people ranting behind your back as you walk away, the Fake News buzzwords hanging in the air. I'm not convinced it wasn't some dystopian fiction. Or maybe we're living in one and I can't tell the difference anymore.

Edited May 15, 2020 by Degenerate Gardner

[Bullneck 19084]

2 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

Y’all watch out for flying pigs.

 

"I don't know enough."  Ladies and gentlemen, the leader of the US Senate.

 

Jon Wetheimer is a tennis writer for SI (or was).  He made the comment about how many Argentine tennis players were busted for using steroids in the 2000s.  To paraphrase, "my kid has a friend with a peanut allergy.  They make sure they know everything about everything he eats.  He's a kid and he checks as well.  The Argentines will get busted and say, "Oh, someone gave me a drink and I drank it. I guess it had steroids in it."  

Seems odd to be so ignorant of something so important.  

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13584]

"In March, when the severity of the coronavirus pandemic was becoming clear but many of the world’s leading nations had yet to formulate a response to it, one country was springing into action. Within 10 days of identifying its first case, it went into lockdown: Its borders were sealed, schools and restaurants were closed, and face masks were made mandatory in public places, with some of the country’s most visible public figures, including its president and prime minister, sporting them to set an example.

 

Today, life there is slowly returning to its usual rhythm. Small shops are reopening and hotels, restaurant terraces, and hairdressers have been invited to join them. Should its infection rate continue to slow, schools and sporting events won’t be far behind. The remarkable thing is, this isn’t an especially rich country with a strong national health system, nor was it regarded as particularly well equipped to handle a pandemic in the first place.

The country in question? Slovakia, the nation with the lowest per-capita death rate in all of Europe, and the one that on Friday recorded its first day of no new cases since March.

When this pandemic ends, and when the reckoning over how the world responded invariably begins, Slovakia will likely be among those highlighted as a success story, whereas the United States—which was supposed to be the country best prepared for such a crisis—will be remembered as among those that suffered the worst. How Slovakia was able to flatten its curve comes down to more than just quick decision making and the widespread adoption of face masks. Perhaps the greatest lesson to be learned from Slovakia is of the value of leading from the front."

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2020/05/slovakia-mask-coronavirus-pandemic-success/611545/