CR: COVID-19 --Political Talk

[wildcat09 29187]

1 minute ago, 4th&Five said:

 

What I don’t get is how there wasn’t a shitload of science on this from past epidemics in Asia where mask wearing has become prevalent. 

[Anastasis 23375]

Masks absolutely are effective at blunting the spread of a respiratory virus. I can understand the initial messaging, trying to prevent a run on PPE, but I think it ended up being a horrible move. The messaging should have been more nuanced, although it probably would have fallen on deaf ears.  "We have to preserve the medical respirators for front line healthcare workers, but everybody should be wearing some form of face covering right now.  And when we get the supply chains up and running, people should start switching over to using respirators." 

[Anastasis 23375]

13 minutes ago, kevwun said:

I don't think it's nefarious in his case, he just wants an effective treatment that will make it go away and has settled on HCQ being the answer to all our prayers.

We all want that. Some are just more reality based than others. Unfortunately there does not appear to be a silver bullet here. We're riding this motherfucker out until a vax rolls out. 

[Red Five 40593]

I was thinking. Imagine if there was this massive terrorist organization, spread out all over the US. These terrorists are killing 1000 people a day, and they target old people, like your grandparents. And they kill them in awful, painful ways. Every day, 1000 painfully murdered. I'm thinking, after about a day of that we'd put 100% of our resources into eradicating them, immediately. But a virus? Where we can save the lives of thousands just by wearing a fucking mask? Eh, too much trouble. Later grandma. 

[burntorangebongos 10681]

Yeah, that is pretty much it. NPR did a story that  there was good evidence with an HIV drug that I can't spell or pronounce that seems to be promising but wasnt viewed as a game changer. It just might ease symptoms. In the same report, they mentioned a vaccine Merck got involved with. Merck was slow to get in the game but they pounced on some study about a vaccine that uses RNA and partnered with that company. I don't think there is anything that is really gonna help until we have a vaccine.

 

[Anastasis 23375]

1 minute ago, Red Five said:

I was thinking. Imagine if there was this massive terrorist organization, spread out all over the US. These terrorists are killing 1000 people a day, and they target old people, like your grandparents. And they kill them in awful, painful ways. Every day, 1000 painfully murdered. I'm thinking, after about a day of that we'd put 100% of our resources into eradicating them, immediately. But a virus? Where we can save the lives of thousands just by wearing a fucking mask? Eh, too much trouble. Later grandma. 

At it's core, the push back originates in pride. 

 

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

6 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

At it's core, the push back originates in pride. 

 

I gotta say, after 30+ years of marriage, words we both learned to say to each other early on were, "I made a mistake."

 

Edit--AAAAND after reading that and realizing how it could be misconstrued, I made another one. What I mean is admitting that one made a mistake and that the other answer/view was correct. Haha, senility is going to be my new answer for everything.

Edited June 12, 2020 by Mrs Whiggins
addition

[BrickHorn 18176]

21 minutes ago, 4th&Five said:

 

My recollection is that the message was not “Don’t wear masks.” The message was “Don’t hoard masks.” Experts early on were very clear that medical professionals needed the equipment more than the general public. And there was a huge PPE shortage early on because the public started bulk buying masks. They overshot by diminishing the benefit of masks, but that was done for justifiable reasons at the time.

[Guest Lobo]

Isn't the 30 year anniversary gift pearls or surgical grade masks?  One of the two.  I need to check my hard copy calendar.

 

[elfenix 34167]

3 minutes ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

I gotta say, after 30+ years of marriage, words we both learned to say to each other early on were, "I made a mistake."

[jimmyjazz 45512]

21 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Masks absolutely are effective at blunting the spread of a respiratory virus. I can understand the initial messaging, trying to prevent a run on PPE, but I think it ended up being a horrible move. The messaging should have been more nuanced, although it probably would have fallen on deaf ears.  "We have to preserve the medical respirators for front line healthcare workers, but everybody should be wearing some form of face covering right now.  And when we get the supply chains up and running, people should start switching over to using respirators." 

Not saying this to or at you, but perhaps if our fucking government had jumped on US manufacturers to go 3 shifts and even repurpose similar manufacturing equipment, we could have had enough masks for all.

[Texas Jeff 1932]

16 hours ago, 4th&Five said:

 

Ask the same folks if they are ok requiring pants to be worn in public.  Lots of people just don't want to wear pants .... too much communist government control ... it's too hot for pants ... what if I have to go and I've got these darn pants in the way.  Freedom man, feel the breeze....  I see my time has expired....

[NAVY 6738]

5 minutes ago, Texas Jeff said:

Ask the same folks if they are ok requiring pants to be worn in public.  Lots of people just don't want to wear pants .... too much communist government control ... it's too hot for pants ... what if I have to go and I've got these darn pants in the way.  Freedom man, feel the breeze....  I see my time has expired....

JFC these people are stupid 

[Anastasis 23375]

5 minutes ago, Texas Jeff said:

Ask the same folks if they are ok requiring pants to be worn in public.  Lots of people just don't want to wear pants .... too much communist government control ... it's too hot for pants ... what if I have to go and I've got these darn pants in the way.  Freedom man, feel the breeze....  I see my time has expired....

I did a google search for a freeballing parody of Tom Petty. Did not realize there was a whole genre out there. I opt to just post Tom.

 

[Irwin F Fletcher 3550]

My recollection is that the message was not “Don’t wear masks.” The message was “Don’t hoard masks.” Experts early on were very clear that medical professionals needed the equipment more than the general public. And there was a huge PPE shortage early on because the public started bulk buying masks. They overshot by diminishing the benefit of masks, but that was done for justifiable reasons at the time.

I think early on it was a bad message of don't hoard masks and masks aren't effective.

"U.S. Surgeon General Jerome Adams made comments in February and March 2020 recommending people not wear masks to help protect against the spread of the COVID-19 coronavirus disease, and those comments began to recirculate online in April and May. As of April, though, Adams had changed his views in accordance with evolving recommendations from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and, to a lesser extent, from the World Health Organization (WHO). "

[Pig Bellmont 8679]

9 minutes ago, Irwin F Fletcher said:

I think early on it was a bad message of don't hoard masks and masks aren't effective.

"U.S. Surgeon General Jerome Adams made comments in February and March 2020 recommending people not wear masks to help protect against the spread of the COVID-19 coronavirus disease, and those comments began to recirculate online in April and May. As of April, though, Adams had changed his views in accordance with evolving recommendations from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and, to a lesser extent, from the World Health Organization (WHO). "

Yes, this was a big fuck up

[BrickHorn 18176]

2 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

Yes, this was a big fuck up

I tend to agree. But think about the concern that motivated that message. The alternative was to say “masks are an important and effective way to prevent transmission of the disease, but please don’t buy any right now. Just stay home for a couple months instead.” How do you think our stupid, selfish, panicky populace would have responded to that message?

[NAVY 6738]

Any half way decent leadership would have just been honest about masks at the beginning of the outbreak.

"Hey everybody, this is your competent government with an important message. Pay attention! Masks are an important component in fights against any virus.  Unfortunately, there are not enough for everyone right now and our healthcare workers are the priority.  Here are some instructions for making home-made masks until we can ramp up production. Again, masks are important. Wear them! "

Instead we got smoke and mirror bullshit so as not to panic idiots. 

[kevwun 15595]

There still would have been a run on masks.  We ran out of toilet paper for a disease that doesn't even give most people the shits.

[NAVY 6738]

1 minute ago, kevwun said:

There still would have been a run on masks.  We ran out of toilet paper for a disease that doesn't even give most people the shits.

You're right and there was a run on masks. The point is messaging up front is important. Instead of having a strong point-of-view about the importance of masks .gov said fuck it and left guidelines ambiguous. 

[Brisketexan 104462]

Good sequence of posts above.  Yes, the mixed messaging on masks was and is maddening.  But, the explanations above also make sense -- we didn't want a run on masks when healthcare providers needed the few that were around.  And it was still a fuckup, because homemade masks were an option at all times.  Whatever the case, here we are -- everyone wearing a mask is absolutely the right thing to do.   But we have to overcome the leftover confusion that some "anti-mask" crowd is hanging their hats on.  Sigh.

[kevwun 15595]

I think the percentage of people who will refuse to wear masks until the end is about 40%.

Edited June 12, 2020 by kevwun

[elfenix 34167]

My recollection is that the message was not “Don’t wear masks.” The message was “Don’t hoard masks.” Experts early on were very clear that medical professionals needed the equipment more than the general public. And there was a huge PPE shortage early on because the public started bulk buying masks. They overshot by diminishing the benefit of masks, but that was done for justifiable reasons at the time.

A lot of the buying was from China, actually. had that discussion on another board back in Jan or early Feb.

[NAVY 6738]

Hummmm, where have I seen that 40% figure often? So fucking disappointed in so many people

[Foosters 17691]

I could have sworn I saw statements from experts indicating that wearing masks actually increased touching of the face and that was at least a partial explanation?

[NAVY 6738]

That's probably some policy wonk inventing a third bullet point to round out the communication template. 

[Serak The Preparer 3423]

3 hours ago, Dnaguy said:

 

I always love the completely random cameo by Loudon Wainwright III in that scene. He has some cool songs.

[Wanker Bob 379]

1 hour ago, Irwin F Fletcher said:

I think early on it was a bad message of don't hoard masks and masks aren't effective.

"U.S. Surgeon General Jerome Adams made comments in February and March 2020 recommending people not wear masks to help protect against the spread of the COVID-19 coronavirus disease, and those comments began to recirculate online in April and May. As of April, though, Adams had changed his views in accordance with evolving recommendations from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and, to a lesser extent, from the World Health Organization (WHO). "

Jerome Adams is nothing but a trump ass kisser. Of course he said stupid shit like that. He's a fucking tool

[Wanker Bob 379]

59 minutes ago, kevwun said:

I think the percentage of people who will refuse to wear masks until the end is about 40%.

Right in line with the positive approval rating for the worst president in history who has somehow managed to bungle America into the 1918 pandemic, great depression, and 1960's civil rights riots/street unrest all simultaneously. 

40 percent of Americans are too stupid to sustain a democracy 

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

SIAP and I have been avoiding the DT thread of late. It's a little testy sometimes.

 

[triplehorn 2664]

new study out: Pre exposure Hydroxychloroquine use is associated with reduced COVID19 risk in healthcare workers

n=106 in cohort study.  good discussion section in the full .pdf version at the link.

 

Quote

This is the second study out of India significant for PEP.  We have no pre-exposure prophylaxis studies out in the US.

This effect resembles what you see with the HIV PEP med Truvada.  If while having been taken daily exposure to the HIV virus happens, HIV infection is neutralized.  If it's not being taken and exposure to HIV happens but it's started 72 hrs later, good likelihood infection happens, which is exactly what has been found in two US post-exposure prophylaxis studies to date.  

Compared to Truvada which has to be taken once daily, HCQ is being taken once per week, and at the same dose and frequency used by millions of people for malaria prophylaxis over the last half century.  

 

Edited June 13, 2020 by triplehorn

[JBJ 3647]

14 hours ago, Sawbonz said:

Untreated plague has a mortality rate of 60 - 100%. Even treated w antibiotics and supportive care it’s up to 30%. 

60% of the time, it kills you every time.

[safe sex 11659]

10 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

Any hot tips where one can purchase legitimate N95 masks?  Rough approximations thereof that weren't made in converted slaughterhouses?  Slightly effective surgical masks?  Bandanas?
 

I get the feeling the N95 mask I've baked about 6 times is about as effective as a Kleenex at this point.  I almost never wear it because I never go anywhere that isn't curbside "put it in my trunk" (dear Lord) pickup.  But, it's obvious this thing is gonna hang around for a long time and I need to protect my family.  They are going stir crazy and it's driving me nuts trying to dampen the urge to meet a friend at the lake, etc.  (Honestly, that's probably fairly low risk, but still.)

envomask.com

Several weeks lead time, but our anesthesia teams are all wearing them. They're small, much more comfortable than a standard N95, and have replaceable/recyclable filters. I have a big bulky 3M respirator right now to use at work (and nail appointments), but I've got an envomask on order. The 3M was purchased by myself, and I'm not technically supposed to wear it at work, but fuck my bosses.

[safe sex 11659]

Wait, there isn't a supply chain problem with masks anymore? Because we still only get on N95 per shift unless visibly soiled. Very weird. We're told every day the administration is working hard to procure supplies for us but just can't get them lol

(which is why I bought my own respirator)

Edited June 13, 2020 by trauma babe

[VRHorn 718]

Did I miss a memo? Is there a reason this thread is an orgy of HCQ information when 99% of the planet doesn’t think it’s a panacea? Can @triplehorn and @Anastasis take that conversation elsewhere?

or maybe I’m the idiot and I should ignore this thread?

FTR, I am fine with being an idiot...

Edited June 13, 2020 by VRHorn

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20342]

Alabama covid-19 hospitalizations hit all-time high.  Timing related to memorial day.


https://wbhm.org/feature/2020/alabama-covid-19-hospitalizations-hit-record-high/



 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20342]

The woman who approaches this guy has been doxxed.  She owns a cosmetics company called LaFace skincare. I predict it probably won't go well for her over the next few days.
 

 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20342]

42 minutes ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

The woman who approaches this guy has been doxxed.  She owns a cosmetics company called LaFace skincare. I predict it probably won't go well for her over the next few days.
 

 

Sorry .. posted this on the wrong thread. Mea Culpa! Should be on the Minneapolis is burning thread. 

[HenryJames 65868]

6 hours ago, VRHorn said:

Did I miss a memo? Is there a reason this thread is an orgy of HCQ information when 99% of the planet doesn’t think it’s a panacea? Can @triplehorn and @Anastasis take that conversation elsewhere?

or maybe I’m the idiot and I should ignore this thread?

FTR, I am fine with being an idiot...

Only one of them is an HCQ truther.

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

She is using information that is public but takes more digging. Wonder how long the information will remain public now that the article explains how she is doing it....

 

[SizzleChest 8275]

8 hours ago, VRHorn said:

Did I miss a memo? Is there a reason this thread is an orgy of HCQ information when 99% of the planet doesn’t think it’s a panacea? Can @triplehorn and @Anastasis take that conversation elsewhere?

or maybe I’m the idiot and I should ignore this thread?

FTR, I am fine with being an idiot...

@triplehorn takes high dose HCQ suppositories before he logs in each day.  They're his Adderall.

[VRHorn 718]

2 hours ago, HenryJames said:

Only one of them is an HCQ truther.

Sure, but if both of them stopped posting about it...

[Anastasis 23375]

43 minutes ago, SizzleChest said:

@triplehorn takes high dose HCQ suppositories before he logs in each day.  They're his Adderall.

If his rectum is full of HCG where exactly is the zinc suppose to go? Answer me that unknowable granularity. 

[Judge Roybeanbag 11796]

2 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

If his rectum is full of HCG where exactly is the zinc suppose to go? Answer me that unknowable granularity. 

HCG in the stink, zinc in the pink.   

[SizzleChest 8275]

3 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

If his rectum is full of HCG where exactly is the zinc suppose to go? Answer me that unknowable granularity. 

Zinc goes in his uterus.

[triplehorn 2664]

47 minutes ago, VRHorn said:

Sure, but if both of them stopped posting about it...

I unplugged for over a month this spring.  I log in and my Notifications are a solid column of jimi hendrix faces.  It was a little weird.  I've seen a lot over the years, but this was new.  It doesn't take a randomized controlled trial to conclude he's obsessed with something.  like a heat seeking suppository.  I'll do the simple thing and put Anastasis on ignore.  Doesn't mean his mentions and call outs will end, but it'll help curb the back and forth shit pile for the rest of you.  

[Anastasis 23375]

42 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

 I'll do the simple thing and put Anastasis on ignore.  Doesn't mean his mentions and call outs will end, but it'll help curb the back and forth shit pile for the rest of you.  

You'd be better off putting your #HCQworks twitter feed on ignore.  Besides, if you put me on ignore you will miss when I post the link to the results of the HCQ early intervention trial that is currently under peer review.

[GRHorn 105]

21 hours ago, kevwun said:

I think the percentage of people who will refuse to wear masks until the end is about 40%.

 

21 hours ago, NAVY said:

Hummmm, where have I seen that 40% figure often? So fucking disappointed in so many people

Up until a couple weeks ago, mask use here in San Antonio was well over 60% so both these points appear off to me. 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20342]

Bar in Nashville last night.  Western civilization is fucked. 
 

 

[Judge Roybeanbag 11796]

I do not see one dude who has their hat on properly.  Actually I do now but it’s like Waldo.

Edited June 13, 2020 by Judge Roybeanbag