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Michael Cohen Investigation

DanTheHorn

By DanTheHorn
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Mojo Hand

Mojo Hand 4580

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

I'm sure Mueller will ask for copies of Cohen's consulting reports,  notes of his consulting advice, and records of meetings or phone calls to listen to advice.  A showing of $200K worth of advice would go a long way to arguing that the payment was for advice.  I don't expect we'll see that though.

 

The real question is whether Trump received money or benefits (e.g. payment to women) from Cohen.  Was Cohen (1) providing real benefit, (2) running a scam or (3) serving as Trump's bagman?  The documents will say.

We already know the same company that ATT paid was the one that cut the check to Stormy, don't we?   That means it wasn't just Cohen scamming off Trump's name. 

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TahoeHorn

TahoeHorn 107

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

As an American public company, won't AT&T pretty much has to explain why they are using funds to pay Cohen?  It would seem that if you owned 1 share of AT&T stock, you could ask for an explanation, and most likely file a suit to get more info.  not to mention that some state's AG may be interested to hear more about this as well.   They may want to see if this fits the category of a bribe or not.  

Yes.  There are people who will want to see what AT&T received for $200K.  If Mueller had acted more ineptly Cohen would be secretly writing a consulting report (however lame) right now for AT&T.

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TahoeHorn

TahoeHorn 107

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Cohen will hide behind the cloak of lobbying.  

 

 

I don't think so.  That has to be registered and AT&T has been clear that it wasn't for lobbying.  They're arguing "consulting". 

But Cohen is cooked.  Forget Cohen.  The question is whether Trump received some of that money.  That's the part which will need serious explaining.

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TahoeHorn

TahoeHorn 107

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

We already know the same company that ATT paid was the one that cut the check to Stormy, don't we?   That means it wasn't just Cohen scamming off Trump's name. 

There may be other funds flows between Trump and Cohen.  And money is fungible.  "Proof" gets messy.  

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Mojo Hand

Mojo Hand 4580

Posted
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9 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

false. 

How about saving everyone some time and just letting us know your argument for why the "cloak of lobbying" will hide Cohen from this, even though ATT says he was not doing any lobbying work for this?  

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triplehorn

triplehorn 2664

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

There may be other funds flows between Trump and Cohen.  And money is fungible.  "Proof" gets messy.  

"Proof" gets mets messy, and "warrants" get downright rude.  

 

fwiw, I went to school for 6 years with the top legal counsel for ATT, David McAtee, and last visited with him last Spring at an alumni event.  I sincerely hope he navigates this well.

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23191

Posted
Posted (edited)
Just now, Mojo Hand said:

How about saving everyone some time and just letting us know your argument for why the "cloak of lobbying" will hide Cohen from this, even though ATT says he was not doing any lobbying work for this?  

Cause he will claim that the payment was for consulting/lobbying and that he did not spend more than 20% of his time on the combined accounts, thereby not having to register as a lobbyist. I hope that saves you the time necessary to put 1 and 1 together.

Edited by Anastasis
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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 103148

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, triplehorn said:

"Proof" gets mets messy, and "warrants" get downright rude.  

 

fwiw, I went to school for 6 years with the top legal counsel for ATT, David McAtee, and last visited with him last Spring at an alumni event.  I sincerely hope he navigates this well.

David is damned sharp, and good people.

This is going to be an interesting process for him....

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Mojo Hand

Mojo Hand 4580

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Cause he will claim that the payment was for consulting/lobbying and that he did not spend more than 20% of his time on the combined accounts, thereby not having to register as a lobbyist. I hope that saves you the time necessary to put 1 and 1 together.

I don't follow.  Whether or not he had to register, how does a "cloak of lobbying" hide his activities, particularly when ATT has already confirmed that he was not doing lobbying work for them?   Either he was doing legit work for ATT, and if so there will be documents showing $200K worth of "insight," or the slush fund gets completely exposed. 

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TahoeHorn

TahoeHorn 107

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Cause he will claim that the payment was for consulting/lobbying and that he did not spend more than 20% of his time on the combined accounts, thereby not having to register as a lobbyist. I hope that saves you the time necessary to put 1 and 1 together.

I think if you're going to lie or spin you damn well better not lie to yourself or you'll get caught for sure.  (The reason Trump gets caught lying so much is that he lies to himself.)

So, before we decide how Cohen will spin this let's decide what truth is, and how he'll explain away problems. 

I think it's fairly clear that he was not providing a legitimate service.  He was either functioning as a bagman for Trump (my guess) or acting like he was, and keeping the money for himself.  If he was not a bagman then there can't be money (or benefits of the money) going to Trump.  And he has to fool very smart people into thinking he's a bagman when he isn't.  I just can't see him doing that.  Maybe you scam AT&T, but you don't scam $4.4 MM including the Prez and $500K from a Russian mobster and live a healthy life.  I have to believe the Prez was in on it.  But I'll let you assume whatever you think the real facts are.

Now, tell me what documents exist, what phone taps exist and what AT&T et al will say.  I don't think "lobbyist" is the bets spin, and it's not the one they are using.

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Sawbonz

Sawbonz 26736

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

Nothing wrong, or nothing illegal?

Ah yes the old cloakroom standby — when the other side does something shady but legal focus on morals; when your side does it focus on the legality

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Tuco

Tuco 5003

Posted
Posted
49 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

I don't think so.  That has to be registered and AT&T has been clear that it wasn't for lobbying.  They're arguing "consulting". 

But Cohen is cooked.  Forget Cohen.  The question is whether Trump received some of that money.  That's the part which will need serious explaining.

The other companies have also avoided the term.  Korea Aerospace is claiming for it's for consulting on accounting.  Novartis just said it was "focused on health care matters" but refused to elaborate. 

I think ATT's version may be the most defensible. Barring any additional evidence, I could see building plausible deniability off of it. But they have to be shitting themselves about what Cohen may have recorded or took notes on. 

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Tuco

Tuco 5003

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

I need some accounting insight.  I need some health care advice.  I need some insight into the new administration.  

Who should we call?

I like that guy from literally the worst school in America.  Me too!  Same here!

...and let's funnel it through that shell company he created to pay off pornstars. 

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sheeeit

sheeeit 129

Posted
Posted

Look I think Cohen is shady as fuck.  I hope he gets nailed if he actually committed a crime.  From what has been reported, I have not seen a crime yet.  Shady dealings for sure.

But if Cohen pimped himself as a consultant with insights into Trump and people paid him for it, then I do not think he did anything illegal.

It is pretty hilarious that people think ATT could "buy" net neutrality for a few hundred grand.  Trump was vocally against it from the campaign trail.  

Also, this is a great site https://www.publicintegrity.org/.   Go there and search for Obama, Bush, Clinton, Trump etc.  You will find reams of stories about bundlers and corps and friends of every one of them that got plum govt jobs, multi million dollar contracts, loans etc.  This is nothing new.  It is shady and bad, but not new.

I have stated many, many times that it is impossible to get money out of politics.  Impossible.  The way to fix the problem is having strictly termed people that never run for reelection.

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TahoeHorn

TahoeHorn 107

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, sheeeit said:

...

But if Cohen pimped himself as a consultant with insights into Trump and people paid him for it, then I do not think he did anything illegal.

...

Sure.  Do you think anybody believes that people were buying his insights into Trump?  Do you think he will be able to show that he provided any insights into Trump?  Do you think he prepared a 58 page report on his insights?

BUT ...

I'm not sure it will matter.  I suspect that the documents will tell a story.  I suspect that $4.4 MM wasn't for Cohen, and I suspect there are phone taps and documents which talk about what the money was for.  And I suspect that entities like AT&T will ultimately decide to come clean.

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Tuco

Tuco 5003

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7 minutes ago, sheeeit said:

It is pretty hilarious that people think ATT could "buy" net neutrality for a few hundred grand.  Trump was vocally against it from the campaign trail.  

 

Nobody is saying that.  But he sure as shit could buy Cohen's assistance on Net Neutrality for 200k.  Call it a commission.  Cohen was in the lead on RNC fundraising.  That gave him some ability to work as middleman with Congressmen on the issue.  He doesn't need all the Congressmen, just the leaders, like Paul Ryan.  Cohen had his office raided on April 9th.  Ryan announced his retirement on April 11. 

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Bat Guano

Bat Guano 359

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Tuco said:

Nobody is saying that.  But he sure as shit could buy Cohen's assistance on Net Neutrality for 200k.  Call it a commission.  Cohen was in the lead on RNC fundraising.  That gave him some ability to work as middleman with Congressmen on the issue.  He doesn't need all the Congressmen, just the leaders, like Paul Ryan.  Cohen had his office raided on April 9th.  Ryan announced his retirement on April 11. 

Yup. And ATT sure as shit didn't expect those payments to ever see the light of day. Cohen undoubtedly told them they were secure and untraceable. Because, you know, he's a really smart guy who's got all this stuff figured out.

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sheeeit

sheeeit 129

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

Sure.  Do you think anybody believes that people were buying his insights into Trump?  Do you think he will be able to show that he provided any insights into Trump?  Do you think he prepared a 58 page report on his insights?

BUT ...

I'm not sure it will matter.  I suspect that the documents will tell a story.  I suspect that $4.4 MM wasn't for Cohen, and I suspect there are phone taps and documents which talk about what the money was for.  And I suspect that entities like AT&T will ultimately decide to come clean.

I am not sure he has to legally.  If he met with them, had calls with them, set up meetings for them then he can claim he did his job.  Or, ATT can sue him and ask for their money back.

Of course it could be something else.  I have a hard time believing that ATT willingly gave money to Cohen to set up a slush fund to fix things for Trump.  I have already said I think Cohen is shady and there very well may be some incriminating stuff in his files.  We shall see.

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Dertyberd

Dertyberd 394

Posted
Posted

The thing about these investigations is that when one of these shady LLC's gets cracked open, it leads to more shady LLC's, "Non profits", and other ways around campaign finance laws.  You get to see the money trail now.  What is different about this particular case is dirty ass Russian cash mixed with legit businesses here in the US.  You would think any normal fucker would have an LLC for the dirty foreign money separate from the legit stuff, but no, this fixer can't even manage that.  I don't know what's in there, but one dumbass can take down a hell of a lot more than they thought.  It will be more complicated than the average American's attention span can handle, but it is the first time we will see the scale of this shit directly involving a President.  This story does have the potential to bring much needed attention to campaign reform. 

 

No matter how bad your day is today, nothing is worse than Michael Cohen's next several years.  I can only imagine his wife is begging him to stay loyal to the Donald and get that pardon he'll need.  Haha! These pathetic fucks.   

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sheeeit

sheeeit 129

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Tuco said:

Nobody is saying that.  But he sure as shit could buy Cohen's assistance on Net Neutrality for 200k.  Call it a commission.  Cohen was in the lead on RNC fundraising.  That gave him some ability to work as middleman with Congressmen on the issue.  He doesn't need all the Congressmen, just the leaders, like Paul Ryan.  Cohen had his office raided on April 9th.  Ryan announced his retirement on April 11. 

So what is illegal?  Are you claiming that ATT buying Cohen's assistance is illegal?  Is working as a middleman illegal?  

You seem to be implying that Cohen was illegally getting foreign money or dirty money into the RNC.  Super.  I hope they catch him on that and put him in jail.

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23245

Posted
Posted

March 20, 2018

Michael Cohen, a longtime attorney and confidant of President Donald Trump, joked about the ongoing litigation he and the President have with Stormy Daniels, suggesting he might use winnings from the case to take a long trip.

"The more I'm thinking about it, I might even take an extended vacation on her dime," he said in a profile that Vanity Fair published Monday.

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triplehorn

triplehorn 2664

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Pig Bellmont said:

RNC disclosures of Andrew Intrater giving $29,600 in a single contribution 

After donating not more than a few hundred dollars here or there in previous years, Intrater gave 250K to Trump's Inauguration fund.  You know, that Inauguration that blew the lid off all previous inaugurations in terms of cash contributions exceeding 100M, but were only partially used to pay that polka band that arrived by bus ?  Whatever happened to the rest of that 100M.  It got donated like they said they would, right?

 

Also, Novartis paid Cohen $1 million for literally...nothing ?

 

DcxbU7nXcAENRAB.jpg:small

  1 hour ago, Mojo Hand said:

 

 

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Francisco 2.0

Francisco 2.0 31568

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

After donating not more than a few hundred dollars here or there in previous years, Intrater gave 250K to Trump's Inauguration fund.  You know, that Inauguration that blew the lid off all previous inaugurations in terms of cash contributions exceeding 100M, but were only partially used to pay that polka band that arrived by bus ?  Whatever happened to the rest of that 100M.  It got donated like they said they would, right?

 

Also, Novartis paid Cohen $1 million for literally...nothing ?

 

DcxbU7nXcAENRAB.jpg:small

  1 hour ago, Mojo Hand said:

 

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/09/novartis-paid-trumps-lawyer-michael-cohen-more-than-1-million-for-work-he-was-unable-to-do-company-says.html

 

Quote

Novartis paid Trump lawyer Michael Cohen $1.2 million for advice on Obamacare – work he was unable to do

Drug giant Novartis reveals it paid Trump lawyer Michael Cohen $1.2 million for health-care policy consulting work that he proved "unable" to do.

Cohen was originally contracted to consult Novartis on health-care policy issues, including ones related to Obamacare.

Novartis also says it has talked to investigators from special counsel Robert Mueller's team about the payments.

 

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 103148

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, High Plains Drifter said:

Sorry, you don't get to be top legal counsel for a bribing, cheating company like ATT and also be "good people". Its more like an either/or type of deal.

I disagree.  Every client gets legal counsel.  Even Trump, for example.

ATT surely does some unsavory stuff....as do many other enterprises.  As for the ethics of the legal counsel, then it's a question of whether he knowingly advised the client to do something illegal or unethical.  I've known David for a long time.  Ethics is not something he takes lightly.

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triplehorn

triplehorn 2664

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, High Plains Drifter said:

Sorry, you don't get to be top legal counsel for a bribing, cheating company like ATT and also be "good people". Its more like an either/or type of deal.

Don't leave out spying !  

I heard David give an impressive response to questions posited to him by some sharp teenage up n comers about ATT work with the US govt re privacy.  I don't believe (certainly don't want to believe) that McAtee would knowingly engage in illegal behavior.  His work and reputation is what led to him being offered the position in the first place.

 

 

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Judge Roybeanbag

Judge Roybeanbag 11728

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

Lulz at the Novartis statement.  We met with him one time.  Found out he couldn’t do anything we thought we were contracting for.  Paid him $1.2MM over 12 equal installments.  

 

Thats some crack due diligence team team you’ve got there.  

Crack contracts legal team too, entering into agreements that cant' be terminated for convenience.  Yeah right, ya did that on purpose.

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