Dr. Anthony Fauci Appreciation Thread

[MC Fresh Breath 4074]

Dr. Fauci is at the beach when he discovers a bottle, he opens it and a Genie appears. 

The Genie says, "I have been trapped for 1000 years. As a reward you can make a wish." 

Dr. Fauci thinks about it and says - “Get me a time machine so that I can go to 2019 and stop the Chinese spread of COVID-19.”

The Genie replies, "I don't know.  I can do a lot, but this? Don't you have another wish?" 

Dr. Fauci thinks and finally says, OK. Can you get Floridians to wear a face mask? 

The Genie replies "Which year did you say?"

[TwiceHorn 31451]

35 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

It would have been nice if we could have aimed all our fire squarely on the Chinese, WHO, and WIV and never started the "The OMG TRUMP is DOING EVERYTHING WRONG and FAUCI is the GREATEST MAN on the PLANET" but here we are. Some of the Fauci emails are suspicious in their timing and substance IMO.

 

Um.  What good would it have done to "aim our fire at the Chinese"?  We lobbed plenty of bombs their way.

Trump did pretty much everything wrong.

No one said Fauci is the greatest man on the planet.

I would fucking love to see six months of Trump's emails.

This is such a fucking sideshow.

[aggie08 21497]

1 minute ago, TwiceHorn said:

I would fucking love to see six months of Trump's emails.

Mouse. Keyboard. Monitor. Man. Desk.

[Hagbard Celine 10853]

6 hours ago, Chuckie Finster said:

I hate to break it to you, but nobody outside the Breitbart news ecosystem has any idea what is going on with Fauci right now.  This is a story on par with migrant caravans and bamboo election ballots.

Dude, the chickens ate the ballots.  Blasphemer.

[Hagbard Celine 10853]

has anyone upthread pointed out the fallacy of fauci being "guilty" of anything when orange man opposed *everything* fauci recommended be done?

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

Public health officials lie all the time based on calculations of doing the greatest good or the least harm.

Houston / Harris County officials lied their asses off about how much rain Harvey was bringing because they did not want legions of idiots fleeing in their cars and drowning in underpasses; doing so probably saved the lives of hundreds, maybe even thousands (of idiots).

The mask thing was similar: we didn't have enough, and medical professionals needed them the most by a factor of 10000, so it was best to downplay them until there were enough for the hospitals. If Fauci had wholeheartedly endorsed masks from the get-go, you would have had hoarders / pandemic profiteers galore, just like those assholes in Tennessee who bought up half the hand sanitizer in a tri-state area and tried to sell it at grotesque mark-ups. I mean, people wigged out on toilet paper and that has no bearing whatsoever on pandemic safety, other than a vague association with protection from germs....

These officials accurately judge that the vast majority of people can't handle the truth or won't respond properly, and so they lie to us. The wise can detect these lies and accept them for sincere efforts at the greater good / least harm. Idiots get hung up trying to score political points in retrospect about these benevolent lies in isolation from the reality of the moments they were told.

[dcar00 14181]

16 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Um.  What good would it have done to "aim our fire at the Chinese"?  We lobbed plenty of bombs their way.

Trump did pretty much everything wrong.

No one said Fauci is the greatest man on the planet.

I would fucking love to see six months of Trump's emails.

This is such a fucking sideshow.

your TDS is showing.   the fawning over Fauci was epic.  He was a god among men.

we didn't do anything because WHO was covering for them and Trump was a xenophobe and the virus was wet market, just unlucky.  Fauci doesn't know why wet markets are open still.

shut down travel from China, xenophobe.  need ventilators, got them.  need hospital ships, got them.  start the vaccine and clear the regulatory decks done.  need a country wide lockdown, OK we'll do a lockdown.

[956 Worldwide 34705]

2 hours ago, Dahobbs said:

Lol, coming from the group he has to have their talking points spoon fed for them. Seriously, the manufactured outrage of a bunch of benign emails is hilarious. 

*Look Fauci got an email from someone who said the virus may or may not be altered. That some person later published an article saying it wasn't altered. Fauci knew China created the virus this whole time!*

* Look, Fauci has an email that says masks may provide margin benefits. See, he was lying when he said they don't provide great protection for the wearer earlier on!*

Seriously, y'all's shit is moronic. 

It’s been my understanding that masks’ primary benefit are to prevent the wearer from spreading the germs…not to keep the wearer from getting sick…since oh, about the first time I put one on.  That’s why surgeons wear masks, to keep from spreading diseases to a vulnerable patient.

If you are not a drooling moron you can see instantly why this is important and why people should wear one and how it helps you.  Unfortunately, health authorities have to dumb that message down to “masks keep you safe” because so many people are actually got damn toddlers who are not cognitively capable of grasping anything beyond “immediate consequences to me.” 
 

 

 

[Hmbre97 6306]

5 hours ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

 I can see why FDS is real. But that’s after the devastating impacts his words and recommendations, as the leading infectious disease expert of the country, left on businesses.
 

Won't someone please think of the 600k dead americans businesses? Like human life, they are gone forever and nothing will never ever take their place. All of those mourning families business owners, greiving the loss of their loved ones artisan candle shops/tattoo shops/salons. If only we could have had someone like Dan Patrick in charge to keep those businesses humming along, keeping us from being temporarily inconvenienced at the minor expense of dead people who will be dead forever, never to return. Like my dear grandpa always said "I'd sooner die than not be able to get my hair cut at the local Cost Cutters and eat my Chili's baby back ribs IN the restaurant rather than taking them home. Give me dine-in or give me death". That was his creed.  

Edited June 3, 2021 by Hmbre97

[Hornius Emeritus 12457]

38 minutes ago, Hmbre97 said:

Give me dine-in or give me death". That was his creed.  

My great uncle said he had similar thoughts while fighting the Japanese on Iwo Jima. 

[Willfully Horn 8008]

Sometime in 2017: The Trump Administration is briefed on an Obama-era National Security Council Pandemic “playbook.” The brief is reportedly not adopted as an official Trump administration strategy. 
 

March-May 2017: President Trump proposes cutting over $277 millionin pandemic-preparedness funding. Congress, in bipartisan action, rejects the funding cuts. 
 

Spring 2017: The Trump Administration stops working on an Obama-era OSHA regulation designed to prepare health care centers to combat airborne infectious diseases. 

May 11, 2017: The Intelligence Community’s Worldwide Threat Assessment warns of major pandemic risks.

December 2017: The Trump administration reportedly bans the CDC from using the terms “evidence-based” and “science-based.”

February 9, 2018: President Trump signs bill that cuts $1.35 billion in funding for Prevention and Public Health Fund at the CDC.

February 13, 2018: The Intelligence Community’s Worldwide Threat Assessment warns of major pandemic risks.

May 7, 2018: The National Security Council’s director of medical and biodefense preparedness warns that pandemic flu is the top health security concern and that the country is not prepared for it.

May 8, 2018: The National Security Council removes the top official responsible for pandemic response and disbands the global health security team. 
 

May 18, 2018: Senator Sherrod Brown of Ohio sends the president a letter saying the decision to cut funding for global health programs and disband the global health team at the National Security Council could cost American lives. 
 

September 2018: The Department of Health and Human Services diverts funding from the CDC to pay for housing detained immigrant children.

The same month: The Trump administration fails to follow through with an Obama-era project designed to protect against medical supply shortages during pandemics.

More shite decisions over the next 15 months. A bit of context.

2 hours ago, dcar00 said:

shut down travel from China, xenophobe.  need ventilators, got them.  need hospital ships, got them.  start the vaccine and clear the regulatory decks done.  need a country wide lockdown, OK we'll do a lockdown.

 

 

[washparkhorn 9939]

We went rogue as a nation. That's why the dollar is in trouble. International capital looks at us and thinks - what the fuck. 

We adopted an unstructured "let's have Covid parties" model, and it killed 611,000 in the United States - and counting. 

We failed miserably as a nation on Covid. No victory laps on this one - especially until it is done. 

Edited June 3, 2021 by washparkhorn

[Incredulity 11665]

2 hours ago, washparkhorn said:

We went rogue as a nation. That's why the dollar is in trouble. International capital looks at us and thinks - what the fuck. 

We adopted an unstructured "let's have Covid parties" model, and it killed 611,000 in the United States - and counting. 

We failed miserably as a nation on Covid. No victory laps on this one - especially until it is done. 

 

Warp Speed was an amazing success, we are one of the leading nations in percentage of population vaccinated.

[Cheeseweasel 26438]

[TwiceHorn 31451]

7 hours ago, dcar00 said:

your TDS is showing.   the fawning over Fauci was epic.  He was a god among men.

we didn't do anything because WHO was covering for them and Trump was a xenophobe and the virus was wet market, just unlucky.  Fauci doesn't know why wet markets are open still.

shut down travel from China, xenophobe.  need ventilators, got them.  need hospital ships, got them.  start the vaccine and clear the regulatory decks done.  need a country wide lockdown, OK we'll do a lockdown.

Look.  A pandemic is beyond most Presidents.  It was certainly beyond Trump.

The major things, like vaccine funding and expedited approval, would have happened under any president.  The supply chain meddling and playing open favorites with governors. probably not so much.

What a President can do is provide unifying leadership and comfort.

On that, Trump gets an F.  Or in the words of Dr. Kolschmieder, meteorology prof, a G.  For Gross.

[Anastasis 23469]

 

Timely:

 

An excerpt.  There is extremely high likelihood that this cave in Yunnan is the site where SARS-CoV2 (or a very closely related progenitor) originated. Shi has obfuscated activities related to the mine and the collection and sequencing of specimens in numerous ways. 

 

VII. The Mojiang Miners

In 2012, six miners in the lush mountains of Mojiang county in southern Yunnan province were assigned an unenviable task: to shovel out a thick carpet of bat feces from the floor of a mine shaft. After weeks of dredging up bat guano, the miners became gravely ill and were sent to the First Affiliated Hospital at the Kunming Medical University in Yunnan’s capital. Their symptoms of cough, fever, and labored breathing rang alarm bells in a country that had suffered through a viral SARS outbreak a decade earlier.

The hospital called in a pulmonologist, Zhong Nanshan, who had played a prominent role in treating SARS patients and would go on to lead an expert panel for China’s National Health Commission on COVID-19. Zhong, according to the 2013 master’s thesis, immediately suspected a viral infection. He recommended a throat culture and an antibody test, but he also asked what kind of bat had produced the guano. The answer: the rufous horseshoe bat, the same species implicated in the first SARS outbreak.

Within months, three of the six miners were dead. The eldest, who was 63, died first. “The disease was acute and fierce,” the thesis noted. It concluded: “the bat that caused the six patients to fall ill was the Chinese rufous horseshoe bat.” Blood samples were sent to the Wuhan Institute of Virology, which found that they were positive for SARS antibodies, a later Chinese dissertation documented.

But there was a mystery at the heart of the diagnosis. Bat coronaviruses were not known to harm humans. What was so different about the strains from inside the cave? To find out, teams of researchers from across China and beyond traveled to the abandoned mine shaft to collect viral samples from bats, musk shrews, and rats.

In an October 2013 Nature study, Shi Zhengli reported a key discovery: that certain bat viruses could potentially infect humans without first jumping to an intermediate animal. By isolating a live SARS-like bat coronavirus for the first time, her team had found that it could enter human cells through a protein called the ACE2 receptor.

In subsequent studies in 2014 and 2016, Shi and her colleagues continued studying samples of bat viruses collected from the mine shaft, hoping to figure out which one had infected the miners. The bats were bristling with multiple coronaviruses. But there was only one whose genome closely resembled SARS. The researchers named it RaBtCoV/4991.

On February 3, 2020, with the COVID-19 outbreak already spreading beyond China, Shi Zhengli and several colleagues published a paper noting that the SARS-CoV-2 virus’s genetic code was almost 80% identical to that of SARS-CoV, which caused the 2002 outbreak. But they also reported that it was 96.2% identical to a coronavirus sequence in their possession called RaTG13, which was previously detected in “Yunnan province.” They concluded that RaTG13 was the closest known relative to SARS-CoV-2.

In the following months, as researchers around the world hunted for any known bat virus that might be a progenitor of SARS-CoV-2, Shi Zhengli offered shifting and sometimes contradictory accounts of where RaTG13 had come from and when it was fully sequenced. Searching a publicly available library of genetic sequences, several teams, including a group of DRASTIC researchers, soon realized that RaTG13 appeared identical to RaBtCoV/4991—the virus that had sickened the miners in 2012 with what looked like COVID-19.

In July, as questions mounted, Shi Zhengli told Science magazine that her lab had renamed the sample for clarity. But to skeptics, the renaming exercise looked like an effort to hide the sample’s connection to the Mojiang mine.

Their questions multiplied the following month when Shi, Daszak, and their colleagues published an account of 630 novel coronaviruses they had sampled between 2010 and 2015. Combing through the supplementary data, DRASTIC researchers were stunned to find eight more viruses from the Mojiang mine that were closely related to RaTG13 but had not been flagged in the account. Alina Chan of the Broad Institute said it was “mind-boggling” that these crucial puzzle pieces had been buried without comment.

In October 2020, as questions about the Mojiang mine shaft intensified, a team of journalists from the BBC tried to access the mine itself. They were tailed by plainclothes police officers and found the road conveniently blocked by a broken-down truck.

Shi, by now facing growing scrutiny from the international press corps, told the BBC: “I’ve just downloaded the Kunming Hospital University’s student’s master’s thesis and read it…. The conclusion is neither based on evidence nor logic. But it’s used by conspiracy theorists to doubt me. If you were me, what would you do?”

Edited June 3, 2021 by Anastasis

[BabaYaga 15290]

10 hours ago, Willfully Horn said:

Huh. You obviously google better than I.  This is the first response I found when searching “Fauci gof”
 

In COVID Origins Storm, Fauci Denies US Funded Controversial Study in Wuhan

https://science.thewire.in/the-sciences/in-covid-origins-storm-fauci-denies-us-funded-controversial-study-in-wuhan/

Some excerpts:

“Wade’s article was seized upon by both political commentators and conspiracy theorists; it also drew comments from some scientists that the virus’s origins warrant further investigation. At the same time, the people whose research Wade criticised in the article, including Anthony Fauci, have hit back at the article and said Wade has got many of his facts wrong.”

”According to The Hill, Fauci retorted: “Sen. Paul, with all due respect, you are entirely, entirely and completely incorrect. The NIH has not ever, and does not now, fund ‘gain of function research’ in the Wuhan Institute.””

”The Hill reported, “Fauci noted that although the NIH did fund a project at the Wuhan lab, it was not meant for ‘gain of function’ research into human-made superviruses” but to investigate bat viruses that could infect humans in future.”

”Wade also criticised Peter Daszak, president of EcoHealth Alliance, on two fronts. First, for failing to disclose a conflict of interest after he put together a group of experts in the pandemic’s early days to claim the virus couldn’t have come from any lab. The conflict was that Daszak had funded work at the Wuhan Institute. Second, Wade alleged that neither Daszak nor anyone else could have known the virus’s origins so early into the pandemic – February 2020 – so claiming it couldn’t have come from a lab at that time was disingenuous and “unscientific”.”

 

As this stuff is not my jam, maybe you can lead me to something that explains your perspective.

Faucci is the godfather of GOF research.  He controls all the grant money.  As stated, he was quoted in 2012 

Quote

GOF benefits outweigh the risks

Quote

The Weekend Australian report adds that Fauci, the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, did not alert senior White House officials before lifting a ban on gain-of-function research in 2017.

As stated earlier - he went on record in 2012 that the benefits of GOF research outweigh the potential pandemic risks.  His words.  Problem is, leaks happen ALL THE TIME.  In fact, there was a leak in the US two months before the Wuhan leak.....a leak that China tried to use as a possible origin story, but doesn't hold water as the outbreak started in Wuhan, not the US.

And the moratorium - that was Obama in 2014 telling him to shut this shit down for these very reasons.  It's dangerous.  Again, the Wuhan lab was cited in 2018 as being dangerously lax on it's safety precautions.  

Quote

In 2014, the Obama administration paused funding for gain-of-function experiments in 22 fields, including those involving SARS, influenza and MERS because of the increased risk such experimentation carries of causing a pandemic. In 2012, when Fauci authored the paper supporting gain-of-function research, there was a voluntary ban on such experiments related to highly infectious influenza viruses.

Yet the EcoHealth Alliance diverted $600,000 in grants from the NIH to the WIV in the form of sub-grants from 2014 through 2019, for the purpose of studying bat coronaviruses.

Again, he runs all the grant money for the NIH.  Why do you think they had to move the particular research to Wuhan on the first place?  This is just one publication saying the same thing as many others.  There is ZERO chance with his depth of GOF knowledge and monies granted that he was unaware of the ACE2 receptor research at the Wuhan lab that just happened to be adjacent to a pandemic with a virus that attaches to the ACE2 receptors in the lungs.  

[BabaYaga 15290]

13 hours ago, Trey3216 said:

There are emails showing that this research started in ‘15, meaning he went under Obama and Trump’s noses on it.    Dude is fucked

Again, his words from 2012:  "Doing gain-of-function research was worth the risk of a pandemic"

[TwiceHorn 31451]

7 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Faucci is the godfather of GOF research.  He controls all the grant money.  As stated, he was quoted in 2012 

As stated earlier - he went on record in 2012 that the benefits of GOF research outweigh the potential pandemic risks.  His words.  Problem is, leaks happen ALL THE TIME.  In fact, there was a leak in the US two months before the Wuhan leak.....a leak that China tried to use as a possible origin story, but doesn't hold water as the outbreak started in Wuhan, not the US.

And the moratorium - that was Obama in 2014 telling him to shut this shit down for these very reasons.  It's dangerous.  Again, the Wuhan lab was cited in 2018 as being dangerously lax on it's safety precautions.  

Again, he runs all the grant money for the NIH.  Why do you think they had to move the particular research to Wuhan on the first place?  This is just one publication saying the same thing as many others.  There is ZERO chance with his depth of GOF knowledge and monies granted that he was unaware of the ACE2 receptor research at the Wuhan lab that just happened to be adjacent to a pandemic with a virus that attaches to the ACE2 receptors in the lungs.  

Goddamn dude.  Dailycaller?  Really?

No wonder you're so willing to connect the dots in the way you do.

That article doesn't mention Fauci at all, and demonstrates that if anything wrongful occurred, it was at least one layer removed from Fauci.

[wildcat09 29349]

I was wrong, Babayaga might be about a month away from full TTom.

[Incredulity 11665]

3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

it was at least one layer removed from Fauci.

[Da Fino 2780]

10 hours ago, Dahobbs said:

Lol, coming from the group he has to have their talking points spoon fed for them. Seriously, the manufactured outrage of a bunch of benign emails is hilarious. 

 

Seriously, y'all's shit is moronic. 

 

It's always fucking projection. 

[TwiceHorn 31451]

Here's a quote from Rand Paul, filtered through dogshit NY Post, through the dogshit Ingraham angle

“The emails paint a disturbing picture, a disturbing picture of Dr. Fauci, from the very beginning, worrying that he had been funding gain-of-function research,” Paul (R-Ky.) told Fox News’ “The Ingraham Angle,” “and he knows it to this day, but hasn’t admitted it.”

Even Paul acknowledges that Fauci, if anything, was "worried" that NIH had funded such research.  After the fact.  Meaning, he didn't know it was happening as it happened.

https://nypost.com/2021/06/03/fauci-emails-prove-he-knew-of-wuhan-research-sen-paul/

The email chain is most inconclusive and certainly does not prove that Fauci knowingly funded unlawful research.

The facts seem to be that NIH gave money to EHA, which, in turn, gave $600k to Wuhan over a period of time.  A not very significant sum in the realm of bio research.  It's not at all clear whether the funds were used for unlawful research, or when, or whether anyone other than Wuhan intended to use it for unlawful research.

Edited June 3, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[gmr548 16576]

lol y’all responding to babayaga

[gmr548 16576]

Look.  A pandemic is beyond most Presidents.  It was certainly beyond Trump.
The major things, like vaccine funding and expedited approval, would have happened under any president.  The supply chain meddling and playing open favorites with governors. probably not so much.
What a President can do is provide unifying leadership and comfort.
On that, Trump gets an F.  Or in the words of Dr. Kolschmieder, meteorology prof, a G.  For Gross.

Trump gets credit for the easy parts just like they love to praise corch jumbo for beating the MS schools, South Carolina, Lamar, etc.

[BabaYaga 15290]

Just now, TwiceHorn said:

Goddamn dude.  Dailycaller?  Really?

No wonder you're so willing to connect the dots in the way you do.

That article doesn't mention Fauci at all, and demonstrates that if anything wrongful occurred, it was at least one layer removed from Fauci.

Oh for fucks sake.  It was just at the top of the page.  Do you really now know Faucci history with GOF research?  He controls almost ALL the grant money for the field for the NIH.  He IS the premier player in the field.  One layer of removal was Peter Daszak, longtime associate and colleague of Faucci.  

He was one of the players from the WHO that travelled to Wuhan, to "investigate" the lab leak theory early on.  Problem is, he had a conflict of interest as he was best friends with most of the scientists there and spent a whole three hours talking to them.  He also later thanked Faucci for publicly stated early on (back to the emails as he know this was probably BS) that the lab leak theory was hogwash.

Quote

“I just wanted to say a personal thank you on behalf of our staff and collaborators, for publicly standing up and stating that the scientific evidence supports a natural origin for COVID-19 from a bat-to-human spillover, not a lab release from the Wuhan Institute of Virology,” Daszak wrote. He added that Fauci’s “brave” comments were coming from a “trusted voice” and would help “dispel the myths being spun around the virus’s origins.”

Daszak heads an organization, EcoHealth Alliance, which provided $3.4 million in grants from the National Institutes of Health to the Wuhan institute to study bat coronaviruses between 2014 and 2019. He was also a member of the WHO team that traveled to Wuhan to probe the origins of Covid-19. 

Daszak and Faucci

Daszak was also one of the prime sources (along with others) that all the media used as their scientific sources on the origin story for the virus.  The story we are starting to see unravel.

Nobody is saying this was an intentional leak, but we are seeing mountains of new material coming out indicating that the lab was the origin, and that many key players in the US and other governing bodies knew what research was being done.

[Dahobbs 17534]

21 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

I was wrong, Babayaga might be about a month away from full TTom.

The best thing for him would be if someone could unplug his internet for a year or two. 

[Dahobbs 17534]

16 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Never said a damn thing about any conspiracy, but hey you make up little lies all you like. Said the guy knew more about how it came about than we were told.

What is it that you think he knew? That someone speculated that it may have been engineered and then changed their mind AND published an article on why it didn't appear to be engineered? 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

1 hour ago, Dahobbs said:

What is it that you think he knew? That someone speculated that it may have been engineered and then changed their mind AND published an article on why it didn't appear to be engineered? 

I didn't say it's been engineered, I've maintained it was being studied, and poor protcol allowed it to escape. These are highly infectious diseases apparently.  I would not be surprised to find out he knew it was going on.

 I do think Dr. Fauci was put on a pedestal, and that was wrong. He was saying into March that masks maybe weren't really needed. The email trail he's part of is troubling.  

I don't have a dog in the fight about him taking the fall for anything.  There is a smoking gun, and it's typical that people fall on a side that completely believes or doesn't believe someone, and it's often based on politics.  The facts are in the middle a bit more on this situation IMO.

Edited June 3, 2021 by Onboard 2.0

[sheeeit 129]

10 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well, really, the whole criticism of Fauci is a gigantic straw man.  It's not really relevant to anything.

You used to care about truth and accountability.

I am not suggesting that Fauci did anything intentionally wrong.  I am sure he was overwhelmed.  And i do not really care about the NIH funding and other issues surrounding Fauci.  

What I am very specifically saying is that in mid march Fauci "should" have been acutely aware that elderly people were the most vulnerable to the virus and, as a result, should be given the highest priority in terms of prevention and treatment.  One of the emails clearly stated this to Fauci, and as the other poster linked, there were lots of statements from the CDC and other medical institutions regarding the very high risk to seniors.  

Fauci was the face person and point of contact for the govt on the pandemic.  He advised the governors who then advised the mayors and so forth.  According to most, everyone in the medical community, certainly including fauci, should have known in mid march that seniors needed extra protection.

Yet, in late March/early April, several states (not just Cuomo and some R and some D) implemented directives to send infected people to nursing homes.  This is not just a matter of hindsight or second guessing and there was certainly panic and chaos.  Everyone makes mistakes and makes bad decisions but some are certainly worse than others.  

In this case there really are only 2 plausible scenarios.  Either Fauci was derelict for not telling the various governors that sending infected people to nursing homes was the absolute worst thing they could do or the the worst plan of the limited options they had at the time or the governors completely disregarded the advice of the medical community and sent infected people to nursing homes anyway and ended up massively increasing the death toll.

That is why it is important to know what happened.  In a vacuum the decision to send people to nursing homes made sense.  They had beds and quasi medical people already on staff etc.  But the medical world already knew that the elderly were the most vulnerable so, with that knowledge, the decision to send infected people to nursing homes was likely criminal.  It is not hindsight or a case of they did not know.  It was known in early march that elderly people were in deep shit.  We know fauci was advising the governors in february and that in the specific case of Cuomo was personally consulting with him daily.  

Again, either Fauci didnt tell the governors that the elderly were the most vulnerable and that sending infected people to elderly centers was the stupidest idea he had ever heard, or, Fauci did tell them that and the governors did it anyway.  

 

[Dahobbs 17534]

2 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

I didn't say it's been engineered, I've maintained it was being studied, and poor protcol allowed it to escape. These are highly infectious diseases apparently.  I would not be surprised to find out he knew it was going on.

 I do think Dr. Fauci was put on a pedestal, and that was wrong. He was saying into March that masks maybe weren't really needed. The email trail he's part of is troubling.  I don't have a dog in the fight about him taking the fall for anything.  There is a smoking gun, and it's typical that people fall on a side that completely believes or doesn't believe someone, and it's often based on politics.  The facts are in the middle a bit more on this situation IMO.

Again, what is it that you think these emails prove he knew? 

The emails show that he thoughts masks wouldn't protect the wearer. That is what he said in public too. They also show that he thought masks could protect others from the wearer, but I don't think that was in the context of the preventing spread during the pandemic. Rather, what he is referring to is the doctor wearing a mask to avoid infecting a patient with direct droplet contact. The science on masks helping during a pandemic was less certain and studies were being conducted. At any rate, we didn't have enough masks for our medical professionals, much less the general population, so it wouldn't have made any sense to tell everybody to wear them. 

[Dahobbs 17534]

14 minutes ago, sheeeit said:

You used to care about truth and accountability.

I am not suggesting that Fauci did anything intentionally wrong.  I am sure he was overwhelmed.  And i do not really care about the NIH funding and other issues surrounding Fauci.  

What I am very specifically saying is that in mid march Fauci "should" have been acutely aware that elderly people were the most vulnerable to the virus and, as a result, should be given the highest priority in terms of prevention and treatment.  One of the emails clearly stated this to Fauci, and as the other poster linked, there were lots of statements from the CDC and other medical institutions regarding the very high risk to seniors.  

Fauci was the face person and point of contact for the govt on the pandemic.  He advised the governors who then advised the mayors and so forth.  According to most, everyone in the medical community, certainly including fauci, should have known in mid march that seniors needed extra protection.

Yet, in late March/early April, several states (not just Cuomo and some R and some D) implemented directives to send infected people to nursing homes.  This is not just a matter of hindsight or second guessing and there was certainly panic and chaos.  Everyone makes mistakes and makes bad decisions but some are certainly worse than others.  

In this case there really are only 2 plausible scenarios.  Either Fauci was derelict for not telling the various governors that sending infected people to nursing homes was the absolute worst thing they could do or the the worst plan of the limited options they had at the time or the governors completely disregarded the advice of the medical community and sent infected people to nursing homes anyway and ended up massively increasing the death toll.

That is why it is important to know what happened.  In a vacuum the decision to send people to nursing homes made sense.  They had beds and quasi medical people already on staff etc.  But the medical world already knew that the elderly were the most vulnerable so, with that knowledge, the decision to send infected people to nursing homes was likely criminal.  It is not hindsight or a case of they did not know.  It was known in early march that elderly people were in deep shit.  We know fauci was advising the governors in february and that in the specific case of Cuomo was personally consulting with him daily.  

Again, either Fauci didnt tell the governors that the elderly were the most vulnerable and that sending infected people to elderly centers was the stupidest idea he had ever heard, or, Fauci did tell them that and the governors did it anyway.  

 

Or jeez, maybe the President was telling everyone it was no big deal. And maybe those governors just fucked up on their own, in part because we had no fucking leadership from the head of the federal government. Where are you on that accountability? Or do you prefer to just scape goat the employee that was publicly neutered by his boss and who had to deal with a boss who wanted to ignore the whole fucking thing?

Edited June 3, 2021 by Dahobbs

[Genco 3040]

7 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Again, what is it that you think these emails prove he knew? 

[TwiceHorn 31451]

9 minutes ago, sheeeit said:

You used to care about truth and accountability.

I am not suggesting that Fauci did anything intentionally wrong.  I am sure he was overwhelmed.  And i do not really care about the NIH funding and other issues surrounding Fauci.  

What I am very specifically saying is that in mid march Fauci "should" have been acutely aware that elderly people were the most vulnerable to the virus and, as a result, should be given the highest priority in terms of prevention and treatment.  One of the emails clearly stated this to Fauci, and as the other poster linked, there were lots of statements from the CDC and other medical institutions regarding the very high risk to seniors.  

Fauci was the face person and point of contact for the govt on the pandemic.  He advised the governors who then advised the mayors and so forth.  According to most, everyone in the medical community, certainly including fauci, should have known in mid march that seniors needed extra protection.

Yet, in late March/early April, several states (not just Cuomo and some R and some D) implemented directives to send infected people to nursing homes.  This is not just a matter of hindsight or second guessing and there was certainly panic and chaos.  Everyone makes mistakes and makes bad decisions but some are certainly worse than others.  

In this case there really are only 2 plausible scenarios.  Either Fauci was derelict for not telling the various governors that sending infected people to nursing homes was the absolute worst thing they could do or the the worst plan of the limited options they had at the time or the governors completely disregarded the advice of the medical community and sent infected people to nursing homes anyway and ended up massively increasing the death toll.

That is why it is important to know what happened.  In a vacuum the decision to send people to nursing homes made sense.  They had beds and quasi medical people already on staff etc.  But the medical world already knew that the elderly were the most vulnerable so, with that knowledge, the decision to send infected people to nursing homes was likely criminal.  It is not hindsight or a case of they did not know.  It was known in early march that elderly people were in deep shit.  We know fauci was advising the governors in february and that in the specific case of Cuomo was personally consulting with him daily.  

Again, either Fauci didnt tell the governors that the elderly were the most vulnerable and that sending infected people to elderly centers was the stupidest idea he had ever heard, or, Fauci did tell them that and the governors did it anyway.  

 

Yeah I do like truth.  I'm not seeing lots of truth here. I'm seeing a lot of innuendo and jumping to conclusions. 

And those pumping this "conspiracy" haven't been overly concerned with truth for quite some time. 

I personally have not idolized Fauci.  I'm sure he's made gobs of mistakes. 

But as between him amd Trump, he's been a beacon of truth and trust. It's like being the tallest midget in the room. 

[elguapo 4586]

This is just the new right wing moron playbook, it's happening at all levels of government right now.

• Comb through statements/emails trying to find something that looks bad out of context
• When they find said item, hysterically repeat and spread that this is wrong/illegal/evil
• Repeat ad infinitum

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

I used to have a beef with Fauci for not breaking the glass early on to save more lives but then I concluded breaking the glass wouldn’t have been worth the cost of him being replaced with Scott Atlas at NIH. 

[sheeeit 129]

1 minute ago, Dahobbs said:

Or jeez, maybe the President was telling everyone it was no big deal. And maybe those governor's just fucked up on their own, in part because we had no fucking leadership from the head of the federal government. Where are you on that accountability? Or do you prefer to just scape goat the employee that was publicaly neutered by his boss and who had to deal with a boss who wanted to ignore the whole fucking thing?

I started to call you a non truthful poster again but it is possible you just have selective memory or something similar.

We are discussing a very specific timeline in early March 2020.  At that point, Trump was still lauding Fauci.  Fauci and Trump were doing their daily press conferences.  fauci is on record before the senate committee where he said that trump implemented every recommendation that fauci gave him.  It was much later that Fauci fell out of favor with trump.  Fauci was not "neutered" in the slightest in march of 2020.  Not one single bit.

I think trump was a horrible communicator and i am glad he is not the potus and hope he never runs again.  But in march of 2020, everyone in the govt, past or present- Obama, Biden, Bush, Trump, Clinton etc) said we have to trust the science and the doctors.  Everyone.  

Fauci has said publicly and under oath that Trump never asked him or insinuated to him that he should modify his public comments.  And fauci was indignant that he would never follow such orders if they were ever given.  So your but trump because somehow Fauci was "nuetered" in march of 202 is just complete bullshit.

[Brisketexan 105095]

17 minutes ago, sheeeit said:

You used to care about truth and accountability.

I am not suggesting that Fauci did anything intentionally wrong.  I am sure he was overwhelmed.  And i do not really care about the NIH funding and other issues surrounding Fauci.  

What I am very specifically saying is that in mid march Fauci "should" have been acutely aware that elderly people were the most vulnerable to the virus and, as a result, should be given the highest priority in terms of prevention and treatment.  One of the emails clearly stated this to Fauci, and as the other poster linked, there were lots of statements from the CDC and other medical institutions regarding the very high risk to seniors.  

Fauci was the face person and point of contact for the govt on the pandemic.  He advised the governors who then advised the mayors and so forth.  According to most, everyone in the medical community, certainly including fauci, should have known in mid march that seniors needed extra protection.

Yet, in late March/early April, several states (not just Cuomo and some R and some D) implemented directives to send infected people to nursing homes.  This is not just a matter of hindsight or second guessing and there was certainly panic and chaos.  Everyone makes mistakes and makes bad decisions but some are certainly worse than others.  

In this case there really are only 2 plausible scenarios.  Either Fauci was derelict for not telling the various governors that sending infected people to nursing homes was the absolute worst thing they could do or the the worst plan of the limited options they had at the time or the governors completely disregarded the advice of the medical community and sent infected people to nursing homes anyway and ended up massively increasing the death toll.

That is why it is important to know what happened.  In a vacuum the decision to send people to nursing homes made sense.  They had beds and quasi medical people already on staff etc.  But the medical world already knew that the elderly were the most vulnerable so, with that knowledge, the decision to send infected people to nursing homes was likely criminal.  It is not hindsight or a case of they did not know.  It was known in early march that elderly people were in deep shit.  We know fauci was advising the governors in february and that in the specific case of Cuomo was personally consulting with him daily.  

Again, either Fauci didnt tell the governors that the elderly were the most vulnerable and that sending infected people to elderly centers was the stupidest idea he had ever heard, or, Fauci did tell them that and the governors did it anyway.  

 

I usually think sheeeit is full of sheeeit, but on this broad point, this is EXACTLY the kind of post-mortem we should be doing.  Wherever the impetus came from -- or the course-correction FAILED to come from -- not taking drastic action to protect the elderly, as opposed to putting them in what amounted to be disease incubators, was a systemic failure.  We should learn how that happened, so we don't make a similar mistake next time.

Because there WILL be a next time.

I think much of the other discussion of the Fauci emails and whatnot is just more idiotic political bullshit, but looking at the actual public health decisions made is a relevant exercise.

1 minute ago, elguapo said:

This is just the new right wing moron playbook, it's happening at all levels of government right now.

• Comb through statements/emails trying to find something that looks bad out of context
• When they find said item, hysterically repeat and spread that this is wrong/illegal/evil
• Repeat ad infinitum

A whole lot of this.  Shit, it STARTS from some sort of premise that this is a "leak," of information that Fauci wouldn't have wanted to get out.  Ummm.....they were released, voluntarily, in response to a FOIA request.  You know, the way it's supposed to work.  

And as for the emails that are supposedly scandalous, the vast majority of them are FROM other people TO Fauci -- he has no control over what someone else says, nor do those statements contain his actions or opinions.  One of you can send me a DM that Immamac is a shape-shifting alien who is using his position of power to anally violate you, but the fact that such a DM is in my in-box does not reflect that I agree in any way with that ridiculous statement (I mean....I DO agree, but that's based on separate evidence not found in that particular DM).  As for the various emails reflecting that he's "worried" about X, or "wonders" about Y.....that's fucking exactly what I would expect from a public health expert in an unfolding pandemic of a novel disease.  Shit, I can find posts with the exact same language from the same timeframe on this board, wondering many of the same things.

From what I can tell, the "story" on Fauci's emails is a tale, told by idiots, full of sound and fury and signifying nothing.

If the story was what the emails ACTUALLY show -- what information we did and didn't know at various times, and what decisions we did and didn't make at various times, that would be both relevant and interesting to a good-faith post-mortem.  But nobody's interested in good-faith ANYTHING, so we just get idiotic soundbites and shit.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Is Amazon just piling on the Dr. Fauci is no bueno band wagon removing his book ?  Seems kind of quick.

Edited June 3, 2021 by Onboard 2.0

[BabaYaga 15290]

23 minutes ago, sheeeit said:

I started to call you a non truthful poster again but it is possible you just have selective memory or something similar.

We are discussing a very specific timeline in early March 2020.  At that point, Trump was still lauding Fauci.  Fauci and Trump were doing their daily press conferences.  fauci is on record before the senate committee where he said that trump implemented every recommendation that fauci gave him.  It was much later that Fauci fell out of favor with trump.  Fauci was not "neutered" in the slightest in march of 2020.  Not one single bit.

I think trump was a horrible communicator and i am glad he is not the potus and hope he never runs again.  But in march of 2020, everyone in the govt, past or present- Obama, Biden, Bush, Trump, Clinton etc) said we have to trust the science and the doctors.  Everyone.  

Fauci has said publicly and under oath that Trump never asked him or insinuated to him that he should modify his public comments.  And fauci was indignant that he would never follow such orders if they were ever given.  So your but trump because somehow Fauci was "nuetered" in march of 202 is just complete bullshit.

There needs to a 9/11 level investigation into this entire mess.  Nobody is saying the leaks were intentional.  Nobody is even saying the lab hypothesis is 100% accurate or that the natural spill over theory is out of bounds.  But we need to know.  Faucci and Daszak need to be a part of this as well.  

We do know lab leaks happen all the time.  There was a biolab leak in the US 2 months before the Wuhan outbreak (Ft Detrick).

The point of the Faucci 2012 quote about the risk of a pandemic being worth it is that he is so dedicated to trying to predict and prevent outbreaks, he sees the risks as being worth it.  Fine.  To an extent I agree with him.  But as more and more circumstantial evidence points that he was aware of the ACE2 receptor research being done, then we need to know that as well.  

We know Daszak and his team were best friends with the scientists in the lab and their "confirmation" that it was not a leak is a clear conflict of interest.  We also know Faucci and Daszak are close, close colleagues and that Faucci controls the majority of the NIH grant money.  This ties back to your point about sending in the most vulnerable back into nursing homes.  If it comes out that he knew the type of research being done and its potential infection characterizations, then we have a big problem.  

[BabaYaga 15290]

3 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Is Amazon just piling on the Dr. Fauci is no bueno band wagon removing his book ?  Seems kind of quick.

Speaking of piling on.  Here's a video of the dude that recently died that invented the PCR test.  Not a Faucci fan.  At all.

 

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13581]

54 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

And maybe those governor's just fucked up on their own, in part because we had no fucking leadership from the head of the federal government. 

This is way too charitable. It wasn't JUST that "God Emperor" publicly proclaimed he took "no responsibility at all", that individual states were the primary authorities for dealing with a global pandemic and that the federal government was just there as a "backup". It was that he actively sabotaged the very states he said were in charge with his "LIBERATE!" tweets. 

Step 1. Project and falsely claim Fauci was considered a god.

Step 2. Carpet-bomb with accusations indistinguishable from convictions to the base/find actual missteps and *ta da!* Fauci The Mere Mortal is an equivalent if the perpetual Fireworks Factory Fire that was and is "God Emperor".

Edited June 3, 2021 by Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand

[Fondren & Main 6710]

8 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Is Amazon just piling on the Dr. Fauci is no bueno band wagon removing his book ?  Seems kind of quick.

That son of a bitch Bezos is a full on right winger!

[Continental Op 3934]

8 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

There needs to a 9/11 level investigation into this entire mess. 

Now do the insurrection on 1/6!  

[Dahobbs 17534]

28 minutes ago, sheeeit said:

I started to call you a non truthful poster again but it is possible you just have selective memory or something similar.

I stated that medical professionals (and really the general public) knew about the risk to the elderly and those with pre-existing conditions by early March. Hell, we fucking discussed it on this board. You told me I was dishonest for stating an easily provable fact. Maybe you're the one with the selective or non-existent memory. 

Quote

We are discussing a very specific timeline in early March 2020.  At that point, Trump was still lauding Fauci.  Fauci and Trump were doing their daily press conferences.  fauci is on record before the senate committee where he said that trump implemented every recommendation that fauci gave him.  It was much later that Fauci fell out of favor with trump.  Fauci was not "neutered" in the slightest in march of 2020.  Not one single bit.

What exactly do you think Fauci should have done in March of 2020? Told the general public to hoard masks even though none were available? Why is this discussion only limited to that time and not April and May of 2020? Maybe because you're trying to concoct a very specific narrative that completely falls apart if any broader context is considered? 

Quote

I think trump was a horrible communicator and i am glad he is not the potus and hope he never runs again.  But in march of 2020, everyone in the govt, past or present- Obama, Biden, Bush, Trump, Clinton etc) said we have to trust the science and the doctors.  Everyone.  

Everyone huh? 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/28/technology/coronavirus-fauci-trump-conspiracy-target.html

Actually, go ahead and look at the original Daily Texan thread from that time frame. You'll see plenty of people saying it was all overblown and that the scientists and media were fear mongering. I'm pretty sure you were among them. 

Quote

Fauci has said publicly and under oath that Trump never asked him or insinuated to him that he should modify his public comments.  And fauci was indignant that he would never follow such orders if they were ever given.  So your but trump because somehow Fauci was "nuetered" in march of 202 is just complete bullshit.

His recommendations were ignored by Trump, who went so far as to publicly disagree with Fauci in proclaiming the end of the virus and advocating for treatments like hydroxychloroquine and bleach. 

[Dahobbs 17534]

15 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Is Amazon just piling on the Dr. Fauci is no bueno band wagon removing his book ?  Seems kind of quick.

According to the publisher, it wasn't supposed to be posted yet. Honestly though, they may have regretted the pricing. I'm pretty sure this publicity is going to increase demand for the book. Whatever the reason, it isn't because of y'alls strange campaign to cancel Fauci. 

https://deadline.com/2021/06/dr-anthony-fauci-book-scrubbed-amazon-barnes-noble-premature-post-1234768402/

Quote

 

Amazon and Barnes & Noble have apparently taken down a new book by Dr. Anthony Fauci, the director of the US National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases and the chief medical advisor to the president.

Fauci’s 80-page book, Expect the Unexpected: Ten Lessons on Truth, Service, and the Way Forward, is expected to be released by National Geographic Books on November 2.

On Tuesday, the book was posted for pre-sale online at $18 on both websites. The posts were then removed. National Geographic Books confirmed the removal to DailyMail.com, which reported that the book sale had been posted accidentally and prematurely.

 

 

[BabaYaga 15290]

8 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

What exactly do you think Fauci should have done in March of 2020? Told the general public to hoard masks even though none were available?

And tell us why there were no masks.....

[Judge Roybeanbag 11819]

If only we had had a leader, like an elected president who wasn’t a lying, incompetent narcissistic shitbag, we might not be having this conversation.  This is like watching children who shit their pants and smeared it on their faces complain about someone farting on the other side of the room.  For gods sake, have some dignity.  Or sanity, even!

[Dahobbs 17534]

5 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

And tell us why there were no masks.....

Because we had a sudden increase in demand and limited supply? We knew we needed more PPE, hell, we needed more PPE for just our doctors. It isn't Fauci's fault that the Federal Government helmed by Trump was completely incapable of the leadership necessary to organize the private sector and state governments for production of PPE, including masks. But, to be fair to Trump, I'm not sure there is a ton that could have been done that early on to increase our supply of masks as I'm pretty confident the stuff we normally got would have come from China. 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

26 minutes ago, Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand said:

This is way too charitable. It wasn't JUST that "God Emperor" publicly proclaimed he took "no responsibility at all", that individual states were the primary authorities for dealing with a global pandemic and that the federal government was just there as a "backup". It was that he actively sabotaged the very states he said were in charge with his "LIBERATE!" tweets. 

Step 1. Project and falsely claim Fauci was considered a god.

Step 2. Carpet-bomb with accusations indistinguishable from convictions to the base/find actual missteps and *ta da!* Fauci The Mere Mortal is an equivalent if the perpetual Fireworks Factory Fire that was and is "God Emperor".

The master or revisonism.. He was being fucking canonized for sainthood.  Not even gonna debate that with you.