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Company deducting stimulus money from pay

Pokoloco

By Pokoloco
in Can You Help Me With This?

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Rougarou

Rougarou 594

Posted
Posted

I’m definitely saving money not eating out and instead having to reacquaint myself with how to cook and then clean the kitchen (what a pain). I ate out 7 days a week, for dinner at least.

And I haven’t filled my truck up since I got back from skiing a month ago.

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SHOOTER12

SHOOTER12 8819

Posted
Posted
22 hours ago, Pokoloco said:

Then they'll just fire more people I guess.  They've already cut 120.

It sounds like a fucked up round about way to have the remaining employees help subsidize the damned company.

Nothing personal, but you work for a bunch of cheap ass butt nuggets.

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StruggleBus

StruggleBus 3922

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I can see how this occurs.  The owner’s family and other top execs are pissed that they are getting nothing from the govt personally because of their salary levels. Then they realize that every employee, that they’re underpaying, is getting $1200+ from the govt. time to turn over all of the govt benefits so we can make payroll, especially upper mgmt.

I suppose a company can legally decide to lower your salary whenever they want but this is screwed up given the circumstances.

i would inform HR that because of income unrelated to your job, you’re not receiving any stimulus benefits from the govt. if they ask to see past tax returns to prove it, i would create a fake 2018 tax return because screw them. 

You recommend committing fraud to help secure $1200? Solid 

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SHOOTER12

SHOOTER12 8819

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

At the end of the day, intent doesn’t matter if you’re taking money away from people that need it. Why not deduct $1200 from everyone including people making over 100k? 

 

You first ........I admire your courage, and self sacrifice.

An humble brag at it's very best.

Edited by SHOOTER12
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SHOOTER12

SHOOTER12 8819

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, immamac said:

if you won't name the company I'm locking this thread. 

Please don't.  Believe me though, I would love to know myself so we could all blast their ass.

Naming the company could put him in harms way.  We have NO idea how much employers know about our social media/message board activities.

Edited by SHOOTER12
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Iceman

Iceman 2724

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, StruggleBus said:

You recommend committing fraud to help secure $1200? Solid 

Fraud( debatable) to stop theft by an employer?

Justified as fuck.  What I get from the Treasury department is none of their business, unless they are paying my tax bills.

If Timmy 2 cubicles over doesn't get a reduction in pay because he's got zero kids, but I have two, WTF has that condition have to do with the other?

Ze-fucking-ro.

Edited by Iceman
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Pokoloco

Pokoloco 1281

Posted
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Posted
34 minutes ago, SHOOTER12 said:

Please don't.  Believe me though, I would love to know myself so we could all blast their ass.

Naming the company could put him in harms way.  We have NO idea how much employers know about our social media/message board activities.

Thank you.

   Here's the latest:

As a result of a few inquiries that we have this week, I wanted to make the following points of clarification with regard to the Employee Emergency Compensation Program that was announced and specifically for those employees who have not already sacrificed with immediate pay reductions.  

First, the plan will not go into effect until the earliest of April 6th and, there will be no pay reduction for the paycheck received on that date. 

Second, it appears that Congress is very close to passing sweeping legislation to provide relief to both companies like ours and to individuals.  It is a very complex bill with a lot of moving parts but our executive team is working around the clock to understand all of the implications related to our company and our employees.  If we can determine ways to minimize the amount of sacrifice that we have asked everyone to make, we will do so and amend the plan accordingly. 

As soon as we know more and once the final legislation has passed, we will provide any updates on changes to our plan.

 

 

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9083

Posted
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Just now, Pokoloco said:

Thank you.

   Here's the latest:

As a result of a few inquiries that we have this week, I wanted to make the following points of clarification with regard to the Employee Emergency Compensation Program that was announced and specifically for those employees who have not already sacrificed with immediate pay reductions.  

First, the plan will not go into effect until the earliest of April 6th and, there will be no pay reduction for the paycheck received on that date. 

Second, it appears that Congress is very close to passing sweeping legislation to provide relief to both companies like ours and to individuals.  It is a very complex bill with a lot of moving parts but our executive team is working around the clock to understand all of the implications related to our company and our employees.  If we can determine ways to minimize the amount of sacrifice that we have asked everyone to make, we will do so and amend the plan accordingly. 

As soon as we know more and once the final legislation has passed, we will provide any updates on changes to our plan.

 

 

"We" ?  So it's your company !!!  j'accuse !!!

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StruggleBus

StruggleBus 3922

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Posted
47 minutes ago, Iceman said:

Fraud( debatable) to stop theft by an employer?

Justified as fuck.  What I get from the Treasury department is none of their business, unless they are paying my tax bills.

If Timmy 2 cubicles over doesn't get a reduction in pay because he's got zero kids, but I have two, WTF has that condition have to do with the other?

Ze-fucking-ro.

Yeah I’m not disagreeing with any of that. The employer is shitty. But I also wouldn’t falsify tax returns for monetary gain.

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Brew

Brew 3049

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, fattyflattie said:

Negative.  Takeout has gone thru the roof due to very limited groceries (thanks hoarders) and not working.  Many of us can go months not paying for a lunch with all the vendors hunting work.  Now I'm buying my own and trying to keep proper rations at the house.  It's not going to be a huge amount of money lost, but I'm definitely not home just stacking cash by not burning diesel, which  my company pays for anyhow.  Daycare doesn't stop, or you lose your spots (3) when it's time to go back.  Wife no longer gets mileage so while it's a gas "savings", we were way ahead as long as she was over 6 mpg.  Lot's of "little" changes, but I'm not confident at all that we will come out ahead on the deal.

It’s not 100% by any stretch, but the vast majority of people have lowered their general spending and eating out cost. Restaraunts may be busy on take out, but they aren’t running full seating loads plus normal take out loads right now which means money coming in is down significantly. Look at all the closed stores right now, that level of walk in business hasn’t been replaced by online shopping. There are certain areas that costs have increased, but overall spending is down. As far as the daycare example, our school daycare has refunded tuition and all spots are held until they can reopen so it depends on the daycare.

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13517

Posted
Posted
9 hours ago, StruggleBus said:

You recommend committing fraud to help secure $1200? Solid 

I don’t see how giving someone a fake 1040 is fraud.  Handing a copy of it to your boss is not the same as filing it. It’s legal to write down whatever I want on a 1040 and paper my walls with it. 

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gmr548

gmr548 16591

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Posted

While I think it's shitty, the deduction for the individual stimulus check could at least be explained as a way to trim payroll costs at a time of extreme strain on company finances in an effort to stay afloat, keep people employed, etc. No idea if that's the case.

The dependent thing tells you it's a pure moneygrab though. That's some Grade A bullshit. Scum.

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hornbri

hornbri 1401

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Posted
20 hours ago, Brew said:

 As far as the daycare example, our school daycare has refunded tuition and all spots are held until they can reopen so it depends on the daycare.

Ours did not do that and we are paying full tuition. On top of that (and this is the part that bothers me) the teachers working are getting paid, but those that are not due to low attendance or because they are self isolating are NOT getting paid. In my mind if I am paying full tuition all the teachers should be getting paid. 

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Brew

Brew 3049

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, StassneyHorn said:

I know this is an oversimplification, but the amount of times I’ve been told to have an emergency fund for at least 6 months of living expenses has to be in the hundreds. So many large, National companies resorting to shit like this after 2 weeks is insane.

Really, if everyone had an emergency fund of 6 months we wouldn’t be moving heaven and earth to get $1200/$2400+ checks out to everyone under $170k and an additional $600 a week in unemployment benefits. We would be propping up those at the lowest end of the spectrum only. Let’s not pretend that this is just a corporate problem.

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gmr548

gmr548 16591

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Posted
14 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I don’t see how giving someone a fake 1040 is fraud.  Handing a copy of it to your boss is not the same as filing it. It’s legal to write down whatever I want on a 1040 and paper my walls with it. 

Yeah, yu don't have a legal obligation to share your tax information beyond whatever limited info they need for proper payroll and withholding. They aren't the IRS. They aren't even entitled to your fake 1040, let alone a real one.

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13517

Posted
Posted

The leadership in this company is misguided at best, and unethical at worst. If I did business with a company that did this, I would cease activity with them when possible. I would wonder what other shady shit they're up if they are staying afloat by raiding their lower employee's govt benefits, which is none of their business. 

Are they next going to identify which employees might be receiving food stamps and drop wages accordingly.  "jane - we've assumed that you receive $300 in monthly in food stamps, so you will see that deduction out of your next paycheck. To be nice, we're only going back 6 months and spread that amount over the next year."

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13517

Posted
Posted (edited)

People on Reddit are saying they believe its Conduent.  No idea who that is, or whether it's true.  Instead I'm just passing on unsubstantiated rumors.

here's the video: https://www.kxan.com/news/austin-company-looking-to-dock-paychecks-for-those-receiving-stimulus-checks/

Edited by Nice Guy Eddie
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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31519

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Posted
On 3/26/2020 at 9:43 PM, Brew said:

This clearly isn’t the popular opinion here, but I can definitely see the companies thought process. As someone that is trying to keep 250 people on the payroll without layoffs, that $750k or so reduction in payroll would definitely help us out and essentially the employee is net neutral. I’m not going to do it, but I see the thought process.

You are going to end up with unemployment in the 10’s of millions, but people complain about a company trying to keep people employed but asking the employees to take some of the hit. It would be much simpler to just start processing layoffs.

For those that have mentioned SBA, there is no guarantee the business qualifies.

Yeah, it all depends on the business.  I don't think it's reasonable to demand that every small business go into debt, even favorable debt, to keep the doors open or the payroll flowing.

If this is a major corporation, well fuck them.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31519

Posted
Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I don’t see how giving someone a fake 1040 is fraud.  Handing a copy of it to your boss is not the same as filing it. It’s legal to write down whatever I want on a 1040 and paper my walls with it. 

Representing that your 1040 is what you paid in taxes, or your tax status, when it is not in order to obtain an advantage is fraud.  It's not tax fraud, but it is fraud.

It's no different from giving someone a false financial statement; you're just using a government form.

Edited by TwiceHorn
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Iceman

Iceman 2724

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Posted (edited)
30 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Representing that your 1040 is what you paid in taxes, or your tax status, when it is not in order to obtain an advantage is fraud.  It's not tax fraud, but it is fraud.

It's no different from giving someone a false financial statement; you're just using a government form.

My employer is not entitled to my financial statements, beyond what concerns them on my w-2.  Now, if my kid was applying for a corporate scholly or something, I'm game.  That is an extra benefit offered by the employer.

 

They wanna play fucked up games, we gonna play.  No fucks given, whatsoever.  It's completely different than submitting false info to the gov't( which would almost certainly be done to obtain benefits/ lower taxes.)

 

Thankfully, I've never worked for someone like that.  I'd be searching like a motherfucker, granted, the job climate ain't exactly robust, right now.

Edited by Iceman
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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31519

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Posted
5 hours ago, Iceman said:

My employer is not entitled to my financial statements, beyond what concerns them on my w-2.  Now, if my kid was applying for a corporate scholly or something, I'm game.  That is an extra benefit offered by the employer.

 

They wanna play fucked up games, we gonna play.  No fucks given, whatsoever.  It's completely different than submitting false info to the gov't( which would almost certainly be done to obtain benefits/ lower taxes.)

 

Thankfully, I've never worked for someone like that.  I'd be searching like a motherfucker, granted, the job climate ain't exactly robust, right now.

It's still fraud.  I didn't address any of that other shit.

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Iceman

Iceman 2724

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Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

It's still fraud.  I didn't address any of that other shit.

defrauding whom? The person attempting to steal from me?  It's not a condition of my employment, nor is it that of virtually anyone else.

Those days are long gone...at least we thought they were.

If I'm supposed to shoulder an ounce of guilt towards those motherfuckers...welp, DENIED, bro.  That ain't how it works.

Edited by Iceman
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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31519

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Iceman said:

defrauding whom? The person attempting to steal from me?  It's not a condition of my employment, nor is it that of virtually anyone else.

Those days are long gone...at least we thought they were.

If I'm supposed to shoulder an ounce of guilt towards those motherfuckers...welp, DENIED, bro.  That ain't how it works.

I'm not talking about guilt or overall fairness. It's fraud.

  • A  misrepresentation
  • Of a material fact
  • On which the recipient relies
  • To the recipient's detriment or damage.

In the scenario posed, the poster advocated dummying up a 1040 to prove something so he received more money.

All that other shit out the window, that is classic common law fraud.

That's all I said.

Your legal analysis ability sucks.

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Bevo in VA

Bevo in VA 342

Posted
Posted
I'm not talking about guilt or overall fairness. It's fraud.
  • A  misrepresentation
  • Of a material fact
  • On which the recipient relies
  • To the recipient's detriment or damage.
In the scenario posed, the poster advocated dummying up a 1040 to prove something so he received more money.
All that other shit out the window, that is classic common law fraud.
That's all I said.
Your legal analysis ability sucks.
So what's the penalty for "common law fraud" and who is going to prosecute that?
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Iceman

Iceman 2724

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, TwiceHorn said:

I'm not talking about guilt or overall fairness. It's fraud.

  • A  misrepresentation
  • Of a material fact
  • On which the recipient relies
  • To the recipient's detriment or damage.

In the scenario posed, the poster advocated dummying up a 1040 to prove something so he received more money.

All that other shit out the window, that is classic common law fraud.

That's all I said.

Your legal analysis ability sucks.

I'm not arguing in a  courtroom.  That's what too many of you fuckers forget.

The recipient isn't dependent upon my tax returns, either.  It is not damaging the recipient.  It is preserving my wages as well as my payment from the gov't intended for me, not my fucking employer.  They are attempting to misappropriate mu fucking money, but you go ahead and die on that hill that I am somehow defrauding them.

Go kick rocks, motherfucker...

 

Edited by Iceman
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Iceman

Iceman 2724

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Jack Straw said:

And where exactly do you think one ends up making and defending these arguments when an employee commits fraud against his employer? hmmmm

This would NEVER hit a courtroom and you fucking know it.

I defrauded the employer from paying me a fair wage, by depriving them of info related to a payment from an entity that does not concern them?  Nobody can explain why i should receive a lower wage than my coworker who has no kids, but I have 2, but yeah... I'm the one in the fucking wrong.

 

LOlz. The second my employment is jeopardized, we goin public, and my $1200 will be the least of their fucking worries.

Edited by Iceman
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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31519

Posted
Posted (edited)

Well, since you're simple, let's keep it simple:  you don't meet a wrong with a wrong.  

How bou da?

No one was talking about court or anything else.  A poster proposed a fraudulent course of action.  Another poster called it fraud.  The second poster was literally correct.  The first poster had tax fraud conflated with civil fraud.

You keep bringing extraneous shit into it.

Edited by TwiceHorn
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Iceman

Iceman 2724

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well, since you're simple, let's keep it simple:  you don't meet a wrong with a wrong.  

How bou da?

Don't fuck with me, and I won't fuck with you.  They started it...

I'm gonna defend my situation.  They can do what they fucking think they need to do.

And yes, it's absolutely a simple situation.  They shouldn't be fucking over their employees.

 

Edited by Iceman
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