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College Football in 2020 in danger?

The_Great_Hornsby

By The_Great_Hornsby
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Fozzz

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I think MLB is illustrating how difficult it's going to be for college football to complete even a shortened season this fall unless there is a magical, substantial decline in community spread of the virus in the next month or two, or unless we magically get accurate instant tests.  Given community spread and a several day delay in receiving results from an accurate test, once a few players get it on a team the virus is going to spread like wildfire throughout the team and it's going to spread to players/staff of other teams during games.  

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SimkinsMan

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GG, college football.

 

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#WeAreUnited in our commitment to secure fair treatment for college athletes. Due to COVID-19 and other serious concerns, we will opt-out of Pac-12 fall camp and game participation unless the following demands are guaranteed in writing by our conference to protect and benefit both scholarship athletes and walk-ons.

 

 

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TexArcher

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36 minutes ago, Fozzz said:

I think MLB is illustrating how difficult it's going to be for college football to complete even a shortened season this fall unless there is a magical, substantial decline in community spread of the virus in the next month or two, or unless we magically get accurate instant tests.  Given community spread and a several day delay in receiving results from an accurate test, once a few players get it on a team the virus is going to spread like wildfire throughout the team and it's going to spread to players/staff of other teams during games.  

Yep.  I told a friend that baseball wouldn't last a month and its demise would be the end of college football, too.  Hope I was wrong on both, but that's how it's looking.

If the NBA bubble tactic works, then we might get the NFL this fall in the same manner.  But they won't even attempt that with college kids, nor should they.

 

Edited by TexArcher
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Bartles

Bartles 769

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If those players hold firm, that pretty much means no Pac-12 football. The NIL and 50% revenue distribution would be tough to legally pull off on short notice even if the league agreed, which of course they won't. Those are NCAA things, so we all know how that will be received.

Best the league can do is agree to negotiate, say yes to the easy ones like black players committee, and "hold discussions" on all the others.

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gmr548

gmr548 16580

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18 minutes ago, TexArcher said:

Yep.  I told a friend that baseball wouldn't last a month and its demise would be the end of college football, too.  Hope I was wrong on both, but that's how it's looking.

If the NBA bubble tactic works, then we might get the NFL this fall in the same manner.  But they won't even attempt that with college kids, nor should they.

 

Thhe NFL is by far the worst run of the major sports leagues. They will use their good fortune when it comes to timing to observe what's worked, what hasn't, and they'll go with the latter.

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ChiTownDoc

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I love people laughing.  I guess nobody has ever negotiated here.  They asked for a shitload and you can bet your ass they’ll land in the middle.  That’s a huge landing zone but the point stands, they’ll get a hell of a lot more than they have now.  And you better believe the PAC commish will make less 5 yrs from now than he makes today.  

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Neonmoon

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34 minutes ago, ChiTownDoc said:

I love people laughing.  I guess nobody has ever negotiated here.  They asked for a shitload and you can bet your ass they’ll land in the middle.  That’s a huge landing zone but the point stands, they’ll get a hell of a lot more than they have now.  And you better believe the PAC commish will make less 5 yrs from now than he makes now.  

Yep. They’re being smart

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Bartles

Bartles 769

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The revenue and NIL aren't really negotiable unless the NCAA, and maybe local legislators, acknowledge that those are even in play. That's a huge ask in itself, even before they talk about specific numbers. That's not happening in the next couple weeks.

Six year medical benefits probably doesn't even get on the docket for state of California governing bodies (state govt, UC and CSU systems).

The fact the season is hanging by such a thin thread anyway makes it even less likely the conference would make any major changes based on these demands.

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Ignatius

Ignatius 4017

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3 hours ago, gmr548 said:

Thhe NFL is by far the worst run of the major sports leagues. They will use their good fortune when it comes to timing to observe what's worked, what hasn't, and they'll go with the latter.

Not when it comes to monetizing their product; in that regard the NFL crushes the other three. The biggest issue they’re going to have is that there’s almost no way to pull off an Orlando-style bubble with 120-yard playing surfaces and 55-man rosters vs 30-yard courts and 12-man rosters....

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satyanash

satyanash 14486

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Great breakdown of what is and isn't feasible from Andy Staples.

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A group of Pac-12 players has threatened to sit out the season unless conference leaders consider a list of demands. Some of these demands are immediately practical (COVID-19 protections). Some are linked to issues schools and the NCAA have been discussing frequently in recent years (name, image and likeness rights and transfers). Some are requests for a bigger share of the money (health insurance, a larger revenue slice).

The players are making these demands now for a few reasons. First, Power 5 college football is the only major American sport trying to get back to playing that has no real mechanism for negotiating with players. Major League Baseball, the NBA and the NFL couldn’t create plans to restart during the pandemic without each respective players union’s approval. The college players understandably would like a say in how their sport comes back. Second, the pandemic has laid bare exactly how much money rides on a football season in the Power 5 conferences. The players aren’t stupid. They know their schools need them more than they need their schools at the moment.

What’s interesting is that now isn’t the ideal time to make these demands. This time last year was. College administrators understand there may be no way to safely play a season this year — even if the players completely agreed on everything — so they’re already making contingency plans for the possibility of a year without football. Those plans are unpleasant and involve a lot of furloughs and layoffs, so the administrators are still motivated to play this season. So they should be willing to listen to the players. But they probably aren’t as willing as they would be if this came out of the blue during a year when the money train was otherwise rolling merrily along.

But players and administrators do need to have these conversations. This group of players has put together a thorough list. Some of the demands will be met easily because players and administrators are on the same page. A few will get laughed at. It’s the stuff in the middle where the players could make significant progress if they’re willing to prioritize the feasible over the the unlikely. Today, we’ll break down the entire list of demands …

I. Health & Safety Protections

COVID-19 Protections

1. Allow option not to play in the pandemic without losing our athletics eligibility or spot on our team roster.

This makes perfect sense, and it’s a guarantee the Pac-12 (and the Big Ten and SEC) already have made for their players for at least the fall. Presumably, the players would like their scholarships honored for the amount of time they have remaining. A fair compromise would be that the scholarships are honored no questions asked until things return to normal, at which point a player would have the choice to play or relinquish the scholarship. The schools would probably agree to this one pretty easily. They’ve spent years arguing in federal court that athletes are just regular students who happen to play sports — even though everyone knows they’re not — so a very public instance of treating them differently than regular students (for money, during a pandemic) could be devastating in a future case.

2. Prohibit/void COVID-19 agreements that waive liability.

This is another easy one. No player ever should sign one of these, and every player who has signed one should claim it was done under duress. If the schools want to play and don’t want to provide extra money for those who play, then schools shouldn’t expect any player to waive anything. Plus, the schools need the players to actually play. If an entire team will play but refuses to sign, guess what recourse the school has? Zilch. School officials would let the players play and pretend they never asked because they want the players to play.

Plus, these won’t hold up in court anyway. They’re a waste of paper. That’s why SEC commissioner Greg Sankey told his schools to knock it off with these. Looking like ghouls in exchange for something that doesn’t actually provide any legal protection is the acme of stupidity.

3. Mandatory Safety Standards, Including COVID-19 Measures

Player-approved health and safety standards enforced by a 3rd party selected by players to address COVID-19 and serious injury, abuse and death. This shouldn’t be a problem, either. Of course the players should get input into the standards. Most of the players want to play, so they aren’t going to make requests so unreasonable that it becomes impossible to play.

II. Protect All Sports

Preserve All Existing Sports by Eliminating Excessive Expenditures

1. Larry Scott, administrators, and coaches to voluntarily and drastically reduce excessive pay.

2. End performance/academic bonuses.

3. End lavish facility expenditures and use some endowment funds to preserve all sports.*

* As an example, Stanford University should reinstate all sports discontinued by tapping into their 27.7 Billion dollar endowment

While there are a few Pac-12 athletic directors who will gladly get behind reducing Larry Scott’s pay, this is a non-starter. Drop it. Create ways for money to flow to the players and let the market adjust salaries on its own. The same goes for facility expenditures. If the money is flowing to the players, it can’t flow into a third training room waterfall. As for the endowment funds, that’s not exactly how endowments work. Much of the money in university endowments is already earmarked for a specific purpose by the person or organization giving the money. If you want to save other sports, then you’ll need to raise the money to endow them. If you make Larry Scott pay to endow them, then maybe you kill two birds with one stone.

III. End Racial Injustice in College Sports and Society

1. Form a permanent civic engagement joint task force of our leaders and experts of our choice and university and conference administrators to address outstanding issues such as racial injustice in college sports and in society.

2. Two percent of conference revenue directed by players in partnership with conference to support financial aid for low-income Black students, community initiatives, and development programs for college athletes on each campus.

3. Form annual Pac-12 Black College Athlete Summit with guaranteed representation of at least 3 athletes of our choice from every school.

The first one is a no-brainer. People who work on college campuses love forming task forces and working groups. Ask for one of these and you may get 10. The second also is something most leagues would get behind. (Though some might argue that they’re helping pay for development programs for college athletes on campus.)  The third demand seems like something they’d do even without a proposed work stoppage. College administrators love summits as much as they love task forces.

IV. Economic Freedom and Equity

Guaranteed Medical Expense Coverage

1. Medical insurance selected by players and [covering] sports-related medical conditions, including COVID-19 illness, for six years after college athletics eligibility ends.

This is the second-best demand on the list. It’s a tangible item that has tremendous real-world value. I’d argue that this demand doesn’t go far enough. Forget sports-related medical conditions. A lot of Power 5 schools already cover those once players leave. Ask for health insurance — the good, PPO stuff — for six years following the end of eligibility. An individual buying this insurance on the open market can expect to pay up to $10,000 a year. The schools would get better deals because of their large group rates, but this could still be expensive. If every former athlete took advantage for all six years, the cost could get near eight figures. But the fact is not every former athlete would take advantage. Some would opt out to use their employer’s insurance plan. Some would rather purchase a family policy if they already have children.

But having the insurance option available would be a tremendous perk. It would allow former athletes more flexibility as they chose their post-college jobs because they wouldn’t have to focus exclusively on jobs that provided health insurance. It would keep some former athletes from accruing large medical debts that would take years to pay. This is the type of demand that provides real benefits, and it is an example of a way the players can change the flow of the money toward them. It’s also something that college administrators would be wise to agree to lest they look greedy.

V. Name, Image, and Likeness Rights & Representation

1. The freedom to secure representation, receive basic necessities from any 3rd party, and earn money for use of our name, image, and likeness rights.

This is the best demand on the list, because this is the one that opens the most doors. This is the NIL discussion boiled down into its simplest form: If someone wants to give a college athlete money, they can. We know the schools already are going to concede some of this. They’ve said as much over the past few months. The trick here is to make the new rules as permissive as possible.

As a condition of playing, make schools drop their campaign for a federal NIL law, because they want a more restrictive law — which means less money for players because they don’t want recruits to be able to take advantage of these basic economic rights that every other American enjoys. Essentially, the schools are afraid people will pay 17-year-olds to pick a certain school. If that hadn’t already been going on for 120 years, it might be of more actual concern. Perhaps the schools would just like to keep those payments under the table, but we’re all about sunshine here.

The lobbyists for the NCAA and the schools appear to have convinced some in the U.S. Senate to get behind a law that provides the “guardrails” school, conference and NCAA officials want. Make them drop it. That bill might not pass the House of Representatives — where it will meet with bipartisan resistance as currently constructed — but don’t take the chance. (And especially don’t take the chance that the schools manage to fool Congress into giving them an antitrust exemption they don’t deserve.) Tell the schools that you’ll play if they pass an NIL rule that mimics the most permissive of the state laws already passed by California, Colorado and Florida. This won’t cost them an extra penny now, so it might be one of the first things they’re willing to agree upon. Also, you’ll have the backing of an on-the-books state law in case they try to change their minds and change the rules. Though it doesn’t so it directly, this should eventually help adjust the overall flow of the money to the players. And once the rule takes effect, the most marketable players could begin cashing in immediately without fear of jeopardizing their eligibility.

VI. Fair Market Pay, Rights, & Freedoms

1. 50 percent of each sport’s total conference revenue distributed evenly among athletes in their respective sport.

2. 6-year athletic scholarships to foster undergraduate & graduate degree completion.

3. Elimination of all policies and practices restricting or deterring our freedom of speech, our ability to fully participate in charitable work, and our freedom to participate in campus activities outside of mandatory athletics participation.

4. Ability of players of all sports to transfer one time without punishment and additionally in cases of abuse or serious negligence.

5. Ability to complete eligibility after participating in a pro draft if player goes undrafted and foregoes professional participation within 7 days of draft

6. Due process rights

No. 1 shows either a complete lack of understanding or a willful ignorance of how different college sports are funded. It’s perfectly understandable that football players would want half the revenue their sport generates. They did the work that made the money, after all. But all sports? Are they asking for the league to send all the soccer teams a bill? You can’t split revenue that doesn’t exist, and most of the sports don’t make money.

The football players need to decide how they want to approach this. If they’re interested in getting a larger share of the money produced by their work, then they will have to tell the athletes in the other sports that they’re on their own. At the Power 5 level, football and men’s basketball (but mostly football) pay for everything else. Without football, men’s basketball is the only sport that could sustain itself across most of the Power 5. There might be some pockets where baseball, softball and women’s basketball could survive, but none of those sports would thrive nationally.

So the football players have to choose whether they want a bigger share or whether they want to continue subsidizing the other sports. If they want to keep paying for the other sports as they do now, then they aren’t going to get anywhere near 50 percent of their sport’s revenue. The NFLPA can ask for this because the NFL isn’t trying to sponsor 22 other sports. If they’d like to demand what they believe is theirs and let the other sports figure out ways to pay for themselves, they should say so. But they have to choose one tack or the other. Until the players can decide how to proceed, they should table this demand.

For No. 2, the players need to confer with their coaches. Football coaches have been asking for five-years-to-play-five for at least 20 years. Perhaps the groups can team up and get something passed.

No. 3 is a no-brainer, and my guess is that some of the issues surrounding this demand would get resolved with a satisfactory resolution on the NIL issue. One of the dumber byproducts of the NCAA rules against players making money is the chilling effect those rules have had on players trying to raise money for worthy causes. We saw a loosening of this when the pandemic hit, and some good things happened. Texas quarterback Sam Ehlinger, for example, used his platform to raise about $200,000 for charity.

As for the other piece of No. 3, it seems as if the dam has broken on limiting what players can say. The coach who tries to limit players’ freedom of expression at this point is asking for a mutiny, a firing or both.

The players are going to get No. 4. It’s happening in the next year or two. The Big Ten and ACC already have offered their support, and it isn’t going to be worth it for the other leagues to fight. Players aren’t the only ones fed up with the current transfer rules. Plenty of school administrators hate that getting a waiver to play immediately after a transfer seems to depend solely on the player’s ability to hire a high-priced attorney. The rules need an overhaul, and there really are two options.

• Make all undergrads sit a year after transferring.

• Let everyone transfer once without penalty.

Because they’ve handled this issue so poorly for years, the schools lost the benefit of the doubt on this issue. Lots of athletic directors and conference administrators know this, and that’s why you won’t see many fighting for option to make them all sit.

As for No. 5, if those players can stay academically eligible while prepping for the draft, they should have that option. I wrote a much longer piece on this particular issue when Michigan coach Jim Harbaugh suggested something similar, and it tackles a lot more of the minutiae than we have space for here.

No. 6 is a lot more complicated than its three words imply. We should presume this is about athletes accused of wrongdoing on campus as well as athletes who find themselves enmeshed in the NCAA enforcement process. In both cases, giving the accused rights more similar to those given the accused in our criminal justice system would seem more fair. As far as the NCAA side of it goes, that’s something the players could discuss with their athletic directors and conference leaders. The campus side would require an entirely different conversation with the provosts and presidents.

That last one probably can’t be solved before training camp. But at least one of these (the NIL demand) probably could be. The players would be shocked at how much changes for them after that. So if they want to use their leverage, that’s the demand they should use that leverage to push through. It’s real. It’s doable. It’s free on the front end for the desperate schools, and players current and future can reap all the benefits on the back end.

 

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Sgt Hulk

Sgt Hulk 13716

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33 minutes ago, Reese Bennett said:

Some of those are a little whack, but the extended (it should be more than 6 years) health insurance should be an obvious one that everyone agrees to considering we don't have a decent grasp of long-term health issues from COVID.

I guess an honest question I have is this. Let’s say the ncaa offers you health insurance because covid.  Does the university then get to dictate that players life?  Aka no high risk activities such as life. Going to store. Seeing other humans etc. do they get that power to bubble them up or if these kids decide to go party go to Cancun or you know be 19 year old kids and catch the Rona doing something they shouldn’t have been doing is that a denial of benefits? 

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atomheartbevo

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5 hours ago, Bartles said:

If those players hold firm, that pretty much means no Pac-12 football. The NIL and 50% revenue distribution would be tough to legally pull off on short notice even if the league agreed, which of course they won't. Those are NCAA things, so we all know how that will be received.

Best the league can do is agree to negotiate, say yes to the easy ones like black players committee, and "hold discussions" on all the others.

Take their full tuition and all associated costs with training them individually out of that 50%.  You could whittle that number down really quick.  Point out that if they don't play, they aren't out on a stage that promotes them to pro sports, which means they can go simmer in some shitty minor league/development league/whatever.

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GHOSTUSER

GHOSTUSER 361

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5 hours ago, Bartles said:

If those players hold firm, that pretty much means no Pac-12 football. The NIL and 50% revenue distribution would be tough to legally pull off on short notice even if the league agreed, which of course they won't. Those are NCAA things, so we all know how that will be received.

Best the league can do is agree to negotiate, say yes to the easy ones like black players committee, and "hold discussions" on all the others.

These over pampered college athletes are killing the golden goose that has given them everything. The vast majority of college sports fans do not give a shit about their social justice bullshit posturing nor do we want our enjoyment of said sports to be interrupted by BLM this or that. Sports is supposed to be an escape. What they’re reaping is the end of college sports as we know it. I’m glad that there will be less opportunities now and that these players can be blamed for it. Don’t fuck with your fan base.

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Pancho

Pancho 44804

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3 minutes ago, Iconoclast Texan said:

Sure, there’s a tremendous pent up demand to hear 18-22 year old athletes thoughts on life. Please go ahead and monetize that. Would make you filthy rich.

So you have no evidence for you claim. 

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MirrOlure

MirrOlure 14779

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These over pampered college athletes are killing the golden goose that has given them everything. The vast majority of college sports fans do not give a shit about their social justice bullshit posturing nor do we want our enjoyment of said sports to be interrupted by BLM this or that. Sports is supposed to be an escape. What they’re reaping is the end of college sports as we know it. I’m glad that there will be less opportunities now and that these players can be blamed for it. Don’t fuck with your fan base.

They’re likely to find out how expendable they are. There are at least ten willing football players to fill

Every one spot that becomes available.

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