College Football in 2020 in danger?

[Hagbard Celine 10938]

6 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Of all the people in my life that I know and have spoken to about this (and I try to avoid these discussions as much as possible, but sometimes you can't), the ones that are most strident about shut it all down work for the government. Or tech, or something like that. It's really easy to say when your livelihood isn't in direct threat (though if it gets much worse the tax base will deteriorate to such a point that the government worker isn't safe either).  Those who are in the industries getting decimated are probably sick and fucking tired of hearing "out of an overabundance of caution we will..."

Just talked to my little brother. He was going to flow over to American probably spring of 21. Now they are telling him he's likely to be looking at 2025 based upon their best guess. He's stuck in a regional, with a reduced schedule, for 4 or 5 years. He went into this as a career change later in life (35 or so) with the idea that he'd have to put in X amount of years and then he'd be in the big time and life gets a lot better easier. Now- he's finding out it's X + 5.  That sucks. Big time. But at least he has a job. So many people are so much worse off.  

It will break your heart if you sit down and think about it too long.  I feel so bad for the class of 2020 that didn't have prom, graduation, sports etc.  That's time they will never get back. Same thing with college sports if they get cancelled (though I suppose at least most of those guys can take a victory lap if they want) but truly, if we don't play now there's no argument to ever play again without a vaccine or herd immunity. And maybe that's the play, to just shut down most of what people find enjoyable in life and live in sheltered little groups because any time we go out into the wide world it spikes back up and becomes inevitable.  I told my wife in February that this thing was going to be the end of the world as we know it. It looks like that right now. Praying for a vaccine. 

All of this was avoidable.   The cost to our country and our citizens is going to be 10x what it should have been, and that number could go much higher, we just don't know yet.

The mttr (main time to resolve) would have been 1/10th what it will end up being.

I can't go any further because doing so is an indictment that will result in soul-crushing myocardial-infarction-inducing cognitive dissonance for ~37% of US citizens.

[Newy25 7703]

3 minutes ago, Hurtlocker said:

Yeah kind of feels like the tossed it out to test the waters to see if they were alone.   Its one thing to lose $700m+ on your own, its another thing to lose it when no one else does.

And really if you cannot articulate why the spring will be better, many will fear this just means a lost season altogether. None of the reasons given will change with the passage of 3-4 months. And since that won’t change people just want to play. 

[markstanco 12631]

Oh. My understanding was that colleges were hurting because a much larger relative portion of their revenue comes from actual game tickets/concessions versus tv revenue. 

The nfl makes more money when you are at home vs at the games. I'm sure cfb is in a similar position for most teams if not all.

[WBT 20675]

24 minutes ago, ztejas said:

There's more money in college football than every professional sport in this country save the NFL (and maybe NASCAR?). This isn't about amateur vs professional, it's about $$$.

College football doesn't generate more revenue than MLB and the NBA

[Beau Vine 54471]

9 minutes ago, Hurtlocker said:

But I do believe you can sufficiently mitigate the risk of bringing COVID onto the football field or into the training room at a level that’s no different than living as a student on campus.”

Well, yeah, and many of these schools have already gone online only because they've decided that level of risk is not palatable.

[Hagbard Celine 10938]

4 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

26 posts, all either politically charged in this thread or other politically charged Daily Texan threads. Shoehorns "Wuhan Xi virus" into every post.

Definitely seems legit. 

yeah, i'm still trying to figure out who the "Wuhan Eleven" are.

[Wulaw Horn 19153]

14 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

NBA and golf through mid-December ending with the Presidents' Cup mid-December. Hopefully NFL through the Super Bowl.

From Super Bowl Sunday until March, you can either spend time with your family or get drunk in your garage and watch replays of the 2005 Rose Bowl. Your choice.

Pray for a vaccine and/or March Madness.

Profit.

NO presidents cup this year. This year was a ryder cup year and they postponed that. Otherwise this seems like a pretty solid take.

[Randolph Duke 4034]

5 minutes ago, ouflak said:

So no sovereign immunity there at all. Hard to see how they get protected from the Wuhan Xi virus lawsuits then.

Sovereign immunity limited the university's (state's) liability to $525k. The legislature was asked to waive sovereign immunity and passed on that opportunity. I happen to know the attorney who represented the state in the litigation. Also, because of my knowledge of the ongoing Bynam copyright case against A&M, I know a lot about A&M's history of invoking sovereign immunity.

 

[Newy25 7703]

1 minute ago, kopp0e said:

Also the optics of having schools play in other leagues, whilst not getting tv contracted money, looks bad...
 

 

I’m torn here. On one hand it would put pressure on conferences to try and play if they knew some of their higher profile schools would join another conference for a year. On the other hand, fuck those guys. They chose to go to the Big 10 so live with the consequences. 

['stache 21892]

2 minutes ago, ouflak said:

I'm just not willing to let China off the hook the way the media apparently is determined to. This thread is about a severe consequence of their actions that we, but especially the players and coaches, are having to deal with. And I don't think my post in the 'Almost died' thread was political.

What exactly are your favorite politicians doing to hold China accountable? All I've seen is repeated use of the words "Chinese virus" to deflect blame while continuing to subsidize walmart and its cheap goods 90% of which come from China. Nice deflection with blaming the media "msm ehermaherrd!"

[Hagbard Celine 10938]

3 minutes ago, ouflak said:

I'm just not willing to let China off the hook the way the media apparently is determined to. This thread is about a severe consequence of their actions that we, but especially the players and coaches, are having to deal with. And I don't think my post in the 'Almost died' thread was political.

"The gene-pool politics which monitor power struggles among terrestrial humanity are transcended in this info-world, i.e. seen as static, artificial charades. One is neither coercively manipulated into another's territorial reality nor forced to struggle against it with reciprocal game-playing (the usual soap opera dramatics). One simply elects, consciously, whether or not to share the other's reality tunnel."

- Leary & Wilson, 1988

[kopp0e 1135]

Just now, Newy25 said:

And really if you cannot articulate why the spring will be better, many will fear this just means a lost season altogether. None of the reasons given will change with the passage of 3-4 months. And since that won’t change people just want to play. 

At this point, (for 2021) I'd wager a better chance for the Texas -[XII]@ Arkansas -[SEC], game to happen than Nebraska -{B1G] @ Oklahoma -[XII]...

In a few years, maybe ESPN "allows" Notre Dame & +1 to ACC/ TCU & West Virginia to SEC/ XII gets Nebraska-Colorado-USC-Oregon-Washington..?

[Wulaw Horn 19153]

5 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

All of this was avoidable.   The cost to our country and our citizens is going to be 10x what it should have been, and that number could go much higher, we just don't know yet.

The mttr (main time to resolve) would have been 1/10th what it will end up being.

I can't go any further because doing so is an indictment that will result in soul-crushing myocardial-infarction-inducing cognitive dissonance for ~37% of US citizens.

Maybe. Maybe not.  But that's not the world we are living in right now and it doesn't change or diminish any of what I said, and it's all heartbreaking. 

[Steelers Roll Left 1186]

It feels to me like we're at a place in this country where you can find a professional to support whatever point of view you want to put forth publicy whether we're talking about conference-specific doctors currently in college football or choosing a court to challenge the Constitutionality of a politician's action.  Nothing you hear should be taken at face-value without at least questioning whether there is an agenda behind the opinion.    

[Veerbone 116]

1 hour ago, BevoBuck14 said:

We live in a world where all information is biased for political or ideological gain. A world where all viral myocarditis forms don't matter and only covid myocarditis matters.

Also, we live in a world where all forms of threat to players don't matter, only those that are socially, politically, or emotionally relevant due. A similar small percentage of players die from or get heat strokes, rhabdomyolosis, cardiomyopathies, other myocarditis, CTE, etc. Those issues aren't as politically or emotionally relevant right now.

[Newy25 7703]

8 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

All of this was avoidable.   The cost to our country and our citizens is going to be 10x what it should have been, and that number could go much higher, we just don't know yet.

The mttr (main time to resolve) would have been 1/10th what it will end up being.

I can't go any further because doing so is an indictment that will result in soul-crushing myocardial-infarction-inducing cognitive dissonance for ~37% of US citizens.

It’s possible you are right. I just do not know how you can speak with so much authority on something that has not happened in over 100 years. You certainly have no personal experience solving global pandemics. And now cases are on the decline and we did that while keeping those states open and their economies recovering from lockdown. So there is definitely some circumstantial evidence that says you are just flat wrong in your position. 

[Hagbard Celine 10938]

2 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Maybe. Maybe not.  But that's not the world we are living in right now and it doesn't change or diminish any of what I said, and it's all heartbreaking. 

i'm supporting your lamentation of the heartbreak by piling on with the reality that it didn't have to go down this way.

we could stop it in 3 weeks if we wanted to, and reopen the entire country 100% on September 15th.  and that includes college football kicking off a week or 2 later.

but we're not going to do it because we're too fucking stupid and captured from the top down.

[Pato del Muerto 52624]

47 minutes ago, ouflak said:

In their defense (barely), I just don't anyone think even remotely planned for something like the Wuhan Xi virus hitting us all like this. It's just contingency plan they never put together.

But apparently from the cancellation of spring sports and postponement of pro sports in March until mid August, they just assumed everything would be fine. Only now are they discussing what to do. 

[SHOOTER12 8836]

28 minutes ago, Randolph Duke said:

The aggy bonfire debacle absolutely was on state (school) property, and there absolutely was litigation involving TAMU. It went on for quite a few years.

The U.S. Supreme Court weighed in on the subject of state sovereign immunity just this last session.

The ability of public universities to escape liability through invoking sovereign immunity is rather well established. Private universities aren't as fortunate.

I was thinking it was, and didn't they move it off campus when they started doing it again?

[Hagbard Celine 10938]

1 minute ago, Newy25 said:

It’s possible you are right. I just do not know how you can speak with so much authority on something that has not happened in over 100 years. You certainly have no personal experience solving global pandemics. And now cases are on the decline and we did that while keeping those states open and their economies recovering from lockdown. So there is definitely some circumstantial evidence that says you are just flat wrong in your position. 

New Zealand.

Next.

[Wulaw Horn 19153]

7 minutes ago, Newy25 said:

And really if you cannot articulate why the spring will be better, many will fear this just means a lost season altogether. None of the reasons given will change with the passage of 3-4 months. And since that won’t change people just want to play. 

Yep. That's my take on school's postponing opening up face to face (or shutting down in March when they did), or the idea of bouncing CFB until spring or anything else we are talking about- articulate to me how things will be better or more workable in September, or November, or January or what have you that will enable it then when we can't do it now. If you can't do that then we just need to figure out if this is worth doing now, or if we just need to say- we are done with that until we have a vaccine.

Things it looks to me like we are done with until we have a vaccine:

Spectators at events (concerts, sports, political conventions etc)

Bars

eating in a crowded restaurant

Movie theaters

Face to face education (we haven't thrown in the towel on this but my guess is that we will)

 

I don't think college football has to be one of those things, as I fully expect the NFL to play and it looks like MLB is going to power through various flare ups not in a bubble.  The EPL is doing fine.  NBA is probably the model of player safety in this whole thing- but it's also clear that their logistics are by far the easiest.  Now, those guys are all getting paid so if you want to say that makes the difference sure- ok. I'd prefer people be allowed to decide to take the risk for themselves or receive a medical scholarship good forever at that school if they don't want to play as a compromise, but don't see how you can have the activities with fear of lawsuits and the like.  

[Newy25 7703]

4 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

New Zealand.

Next.

My fault for falling for the troll. I apologize for contributing for the detailing of the thread.  

Edited August 11, 2020 by Newy25

[kopp0e 1135]

In the midst of this, more sports layoffs, as recently Fox & NBC has done the same,COVID might put the smack down on big collegiate contracts...

 

['stache 21892]

8 minutes ago, ouflak said:

Agreed 1000%. I don't have any 'favorite' politicians. Never really have. I think the whole lot are fumbling around clumsily and am bitterly disappointed the lack of coherency. It has literally cost lives. What's bothering me about the media is that they are happy to let China's initial actions slide off into the past, and hop into the blame-you-favorite-even-politician. It doesn't seem to matter the politics of the politician, only the numbers from their respective country/region/state. Heck the < insert politician > may have once, and normally be, a media favorite. But when it comes to the Corona hysteria, they pile on. It's disingenuous, inaccurate, and sometimes astonishingly hypocritical.

Media outlets report when developments are learned about how China acted early in the pandemic. You just choose to ignore it to deflect blame from US politicians you like and cry about MSM. The bottom line is, China can bear responsibility, but it does not exonerate US politicians who failed to do what was needed in their states to contain the virus early on, and are still refusing to acknowledge the spread and continue to support anti-maskers and criticizing schools districts that see the numbers and seeing that having thousands of kids and teachers and staff in a building is not safe. All of those things needed to be addressed regardless of China's responsibility or lack thereof. And it's all relevant to why it looks more and more like we can't have college football, nearly 6 months after the pandemic was declared.

Edited August 11, 2020 by 'stache

[ouflak 60]

9 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

But apparently from the cancellation of spring sports and postponement of pro sports in March until mid August, they just assumed everything would be fine. Only now are they discussing what to do. 

I don't know. *shrug* Maybe they naively thought it would all just pass. Or maybe it's just a severe lack of leadership (with regards to planning ahead). We may never know. If we were to somehow get a tape of all of the conversations they've had on the subject, I think we'd notice two trends:

1. They would be reacting more than taking proactive steps.
2. They would all be, as a group, agreeing to a lot of wait-and-see.
3. And though I only said 'two', I think they'd each be separately praying that media just quitely drops the whole thing.

But that's pure conjecture. We only get to hear things from 'sources', and sometimes those blips even seem to contradict each other in extremely short periods of time.

Edited August 11, 2020 by ouflak

[Don Johnson 4757]

2 hours ago, DiceHands said:

I cant believe we are at the point in history where we ignore doctors in favor of people far less intelligent because... football.

I can't believe we live in a world where people want doctors making all the decisions in this country.

Its quite possible to take their medical insight very seriously yet decide to not follow their recommendations because its only one piece of the puzzle.

At some point "listen to science" became "do exactly as science says."  Strictly from a medical perspective of course playing football is more risky than not playing football.  But there are other factors that come into the decisions.  There's little doubt that- from a medical perspective -my family is more at risk if my kids play youth sports.  But we made the decision a few months that the rewards outweigh the risks.  Only time will tell if we were right or wrong, but it certainly wasn't because we didn't weigh all factors.

As Faucci told us back in May discussing the economy..."“I’m a scientist, a physician and a public health official. I give advice according to the best scientific evidence. ... I don’t give advice about economic things. I don’t give advice about anything other than public health.”

Edited August 11, 2020 by Don Johnson

[Wulaw Horn 19153]

5 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

New Zealand.

Next.

Dude. Maybe, just maybe, a homogonous island of very few citizens and zero population density, out in the middle of the ocean isn't the best comparison point.  Maybe.  Lets just say that's a pretty obvious candidate for the old sesame street "one of these things is not like the other" game.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

22 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

yeah, i'm still trying to figure out who the "Wuhan Eleven" are.

Sum Ting Wong, Ho Lee Fuk, We Tu Lo, you know those guys

[BurntOrange&White 40049]

I think this is my first neg on this site ever.  Fuck off dude- being a marine isn't worthy of scorn. And I'm pretty sure you and him are way more aligned than he and I. This is stupid bullshit and you should feel awful for it.

I, for one, back any negative vote toward Kevin.

[Hurtlocker 2213]

 

[UncleSonny 6573]

If the ACC and SEC go full steam ahead and force a season I have the think Texas is going to play too. With or without the Big12. 

[BurntOrange&White 40049]

 

I wouldn’t be surprised if they conference called to each other given their conferences strong ties to each other regarding post season.

[Hurtlocker 2213]

1 minute ago, UncleSonny said:

If the ACC and SEC go full steam ahead and force a season I have the think Texas is going to play too. With or without the Big12. 

Can't imagine that the rest wouldn't play if Texas plays.   Have any Big 12 schools hinted they'd sit out?

[Fletch 5800]

51 minutes ago, irishtexan said:

 

Any legitimate take you have gets "lost in the shuffle" of your political shit posting and personal slap fights with other posters about neg rep. Just shut the fuck up. And this comes from someone who generally agrees with your misplaced, unrequested political rage posts. 

Take. It. To. The. Cloakroom.

Yeah I’ve done my CR venting for the week. I’ll just stand by for updates and whatnot 

[Hagbard Celine 10938]

New Zealand 2019 GDP: $203 billion.

The US Military spend in 2019: $693 billion.

Total active personnel: 1347106

Total reserves: 807562

Before i even go in to any other US industry spend/personnel, the world's best command and control force projection, directed in to the funding country, i.e. the US, would have resulted in the best supply chain coordination, testing and tracing in the world, way beyond what New Zealand achieved.

We didn't take a war footing on anything other than shoring up the markets and to our credit a jatrilliondollar dole plan that's going to a long ass time to "pay back" because captured politics.

[Hurtlocker 2213]

 

[UncleSonny 6573]

5 minutes ago, Hurtlocker said:

Can't imagine that the rest wouldn't play if Texas plays.   Have any Big 12 schools hinted they'd sit out?

Reports yesterday that conference members were split and also that Texas decisions makers were united in wanting to play. Can’t remember the source. 

[AustinMT 952]

13 minutes ago, SwanderedTalent said:

Sum Ting Wong, Ho Lee Fuk, We Tu Lo, you know those guys

Don’t forget Dam Son and Da Phuc 

 

[Pato del Muerto 52624]

10 minutes ago, Hurtlocker said:

 

This is not a weird twist. 

[Js1 85614]

New Zealand and China talk not going away in 2020 college football season discussion.

Not a surprise - GRHorn comes to complain about David Dennison.  Wulaw drags this thread the other way with his pointless off topic ranting.  And some racist little baby can't stop showing his true colors with "Wuhan Xi" virus. 

All y'all should be in timeout. 

[VABuckeye 2472]

2 minutes ago, Js1 said:

New Zealand and China talk not going away in 2020 college football season discussion.

Not a surprise - GRHorn comes to complain about David Dennison.  Wulaw drags this thread the other way with his pointless off topic ranting.  And some racist little baby can't stop showing his true colors with "Wuhan Xi" virus. 

All y'all should be in timeout. 

You seem to be really good at pointing fingers at others.

[Hurtlocker 2213]

 

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

3 minutes ago, Js1 said:

All y'all should be in timeout. 

if you want to put Wulaw in timeout, this thread serves no purpose. 

[4th&Five 41603]

 

Edited August 11, 2020 by 4th&Five

[Js1 85614]

3 minutes ago, Hurtlocker said:

 

Pull out method doesn't always work. 

[Sejjr 3246]

24 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Dude. Maybe, just maybe, a homogonous island of very few citizens and zero population density, out in the middle of the ocean isn't the best comparison point.  Maybe.  Lets just say that's a pretty obvious candidate for the old sesame street "one of these things is not like the other" game.

Let's not start sucking New Zealand's dick just yet. They just reported their first 4 cases after 102 days in Auckland.  

[Hurtlocker 2213]

So it is just going to be the ACC/B12/SEC

[Hurtlocker 2213]

 

[Hurtlocker 2213]

 

[Valmy77 13275]

2 minutes ago, Hurtlocker said:

So it is just going to be the ACC/B12/SEC

I don't see why we all cannot just play in the Spring. Would it kill any of us to start the season in Decembe or January? Why risk a disaster with little obvious payoff? Plus we stand a better chance of getting to play a real season with the real schedules not this "college football lite" stuff being peddled by the SEC and others.