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2020 Presidential Election -- Biden v Trump: Sleepy Joe vs Dopey Don [Results begin on page 409]

Patrick Bateman

By Patrick Bateman
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Bama Chick
Bama Chick

I am so thrilled tonight! I spoke with my mom and asked her how my dad was taking the election. She said after every network declared Biden the winner, he turned off Fox News and said “Well, glad t

HenryJames
HenryJames
Thatguy
Thatguy

This was my experience in Galveston County, except for one thing. I came in and presented my ID to the geriatric at the front who printed out my pin number. I took my pin number to a table where two B

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 104557

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Voldemort86 said:

Independents who vote for a right wing racist like Trump should permanently lose independent status.

"Independent" is the most worthless political label in history.  If you largely vote for one party over the other, you aren't an "independent."  Maybe you're a Republican who occasionally crosses over, or vice-versa.  But you're not independent.  An actual independent is going to have a more mixed voting history -- like 60-40.  They may be left-leaning or right-leaning, but the point is that they aren't a reliable vote for either party.  Someone who votes 80% of the time for one party or the other is a reliable vote, they ain't an "independent."

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mchookem

mchookem 16194

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Posted
2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

"Independent" is the most worthless political label in history.  If you largely vote for one party over the other, you aren't an "independent."  Maybe you're a Republican who occasionally crosses over, or vice-versa.  But you're not independent.  An actual independent is going to have a more mixed voting history -- like 60-40.  They may be left-leaning or right-leaning, but the point is that they aren't a reliable vote for either party.  Someone who votes 80% of the time for one party or the other is a reliable vote, they ain't an "independent."

*raises hand* i'm sure i'm considered part off the librul cabal on surly...but prior to 2016 i had in fact voted for the same number of Rs and Ds for president...and had actually voted 3rd party more than either (i am a rare Ross Perot Twice voter lol). 

i have primarily voted for the individual over party platform. in 2016, i might have voted for Kasich.

i still consider myself independent...but there's a malignant, rotting tumor that has taken over the republican party, i don't see myself swinging back any time soon. 

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BehoId, The Underminer!

BehoId, The Underminer! 11668

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, mchookem said:

*raises hand* i'm sure i'm considered part off the librul cabal on surly...but prior to 2016 i had in fact voted for the same number of Rs and Ds for president...and had actually voted 3rd party more than either (i am a rare Ross Perot Twice voter lol). 

i have primarily voted for the individual over party platform. in 2016, i might have voted for Kasich.

i still consider myself independent...but there's a malignant, rotting tumor that has taken over the republican party, i don't see myself swinging back any time soon. 

my votes were GWB1, GWB2, Obama, Romney, Clinton.  I am now in the "there's a malignant, rotting tumor that has taken over the republican party, i don't see myself swinging back any time soon" camp.

 

1. not actually.  disenfranchised student turned away at the polls for being at the wrong location, but woulda voted for him.

2. not actually. was overseas at the time and didn't mail in a ballot, but woulda voted for him.

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gmr548

gmr548 16491

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

"Independent" is the most worthless political label in history.  If you largely vote for one party over the other, you aren't an "independent."  Maybe you're a Republican who occasionally crosses over, or vice-versa.  But you're not independent.  An actual independent is going to have a more mixed voting history -- like 60-40.  They may be left-leaning or right-leaning, but the point is that they aren't a reliable vote for either party.  Someone who votes 80% of the time for one party or the other is a reliable vote, they ain't an "independent."

This is true. The vast majority of self-identified independents in this country fall into this basket. Independent in name only - in reality, Republican or Democratic voter with an iffy turnout track record. When I was younger I went with the whole "I'm a liberal independent, not a Democrat" bit. But there only ever was and continues to be one real option for me. So fuck it, I am a Democrat even if I have mixed feelings on that. Might as well vote in primaries and participate in shaping the party.

Actual independents are a very small portion of the electorate. Like five, maybe ten percent tops. We are a really partisan country at this point. And that five or ten percent aren't some little club of philosopher kings. They basically pay attention at Labor Day, vote based on personality as if it's high school or reality TV, and don't vote in midterms. Their POTUS ballots probably go Reagan x2, Bush, Clinton x2, Bush x2, Obama x2, Trump. Because each of those, for better or worse, had more captivating personalities than their opponents. Biden isn't really at a personality deficit vs Trump and even this crowd likely sees that Trump is a fucking moron of unprecedented proportions. So hopefully a good chunk of them do the right thing.

Make no mistake though, when your coalition is a clear majority, focusing on turning out the voters you know align with you is the way to go. Don't fight over the five percent.

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bolverk

bolverk 29397

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, mchookem said:

*raises hand* i'm sure i'm considered part off the librul cabal on surly...but prior to 2016 i had in fact voted for the same number of Rs and Ds for president...and had actually voted 3rd party more than either (i am a rare Ross Perot Twice voter lol). 

i have primarily voted for the individual over party platform. in 2016, i might have voted for Kasich.

i still consider myself independent...but there's a malignant, rotting tumor that has taken over the republican party, i don't see myself swinging back any time soon. 

I understand the hesitation, having voted for Nader twice and never voting for a Republican at any level of government.

D > R, G > R, L > R

There's just something about self-identifying a party affiliation that puts a bad taste in my mouth.

Edit: OG Clinton was my first presidential vote.

Edited by bolverk
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fellside

fellside 1076

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Posted

A Biden ad just came up on YouTube and I spent about 45 seconds trying to figure out what person his diminishing speech reminded me of.  Then I realized it was Lee Corso.  I'm voting for the guy, but this is going to be painful to watch. 

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BehoId, The Underminer!

BehoId, The Underminer! 11668

Posted
Posted
Just now, fellside said:

A Biden ad just came up on YouTube and I spent about 45 seconds trying to figure out what person his diminishing speech reminded me of.  Then I realized it was Lee Corso.  I'm voting for the guy, but this is going to be painful to watch. 

I think I just saw the same ad.  Slight slur. 

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thepop

thepop 4409

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Posted

He’s way past his prime for sure. I’m hopeful he will serve 1 term and step down leading to Harris or Warren or whoever. He can take solace in getting rid of trump and helping elect the first female VP in 2020 and President in 2024. 

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G650

G650 14086

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, gmr548 said:

Actual independents are a very small portion of the electorate. Like five, maybe ten percent tops. We are a really partisan country at this point. And that five or ten percent aren't some little club of philosopher kings. They basically pay attention at Labor Day, vote based on personality as if it's high school or reality TV, and don't vote in midterms. Their POTUS ballots probably go Reagan x2, Bush, Clinton x2, Bush x2, Obama x2, Trump. Because each of those, for better or worse, had more captivating personalities than their opponents.

 

I think your percentage number is probably pretty close, unfortunately, but everything else you wrote here is utter bullshit and you should feel bad for writing it. I consume more politics than most anyone else I know, and minored in PoliSci, and I'm a committed Independent, and basically feel anyone that isn't is a mouth breathing ignorant moron. I've never filled out a party line ballot in my entire life (though this go round it is seriously likely to happen).

 

 

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gmr548

gmr548 16491

Posted
Posted



 
I think your percentage number is probably pretty close, unfortunately, but everything else you wrote here is utter bullshit and you should feel bad for writing it. I consume more politics than most anyone else I know, and minored in PoliSci, and I'm a committed Independent, and basically feel anyone that isn't is a mouth breathing ignorant moron. I've never filled out a party line ballot in my entire life (though this go round it is seriously likely to happen).
 
 


I'm sorry. You are very special and smart, and likely could form a little club of philosopher kings.

Anecdote with a sample of one aside, it's well documented that independents have much lower turnout rates, and most Americans, partisan, independent, or whatever, aren't high info voters so that's nor a ground breaking statement. Independents aren't some bloc of thoughtful centrists. They're ideologically diverse and just as dumb as the rest of us.
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G650

G650 14086

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, gmr548 said:

Anecdote with a sample of one aside, it's well documented that independents have much lower turnout rates, and most Americans, partisan, independent, or whatever, aren't high info voters so that's nor a ground breaking statement. Independents aren't some bloc of thoughtful centrists. They're ideologically diverse and just as dumb as the rest of us.

Well that is a completely different bloc than the 5% you are referencing, it's the group that was mentioned previously as not actually independent.

 

13 minutes ago, gmr548 said:

I'm sorry. You are very special and smart, and likely could form a little club of philosopher kings.

Good, I'm glad we see eye to eye on this.

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UpperWestside

UpperWestside 6134

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Posted

I have thought of myself as an independent when it comes to voting, but I align with Democrats and I’m good calling myself a Democrat and will continue voting for every Democratic candidate I can. A Republican will never receive a vote from me for the rest of my life for what they have willingly done to harm minorities. They make their lives a living hell just because they can. It’s time they pay for all the bullshit they have inflicted upon this country while continuing to support Dotard to the bitter end.

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The Dog

The Dog 43792

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Posted

I think some of you are confusing "swing voters" with those who identify as independents. They aren't the same. 

Swing voters are those whose vote is truly "up for grabs" every election. Those are the 5-10% y'all are talking about. 

Independents are simply those who refuse to identify with either political party, even though they may lean one way or another. They can be swing voters and therefore increase the population of "swing votes" for a single election, but that doesn't mean they don't consistently vote for the party with which they mostly agree. The big difference is that independents are far more likely to split their tickets than party loyalists. It's why many pollsters break down the independent vote with "Independent - Lean Democrat/Republican" designations to get a better idea of who is responding. 

 

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G650

G650 14086

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, The Dog said:

They aren't the same. 

Exactly right. But the nomenclature is used very loosely, and there is not one "correct" label. They are essentially interchangeable, which just further muddies the water and causes people to speak at cross purposes.

Edited by G650
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The Dog

The Dog 43792

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Posted

Yeah so Biden +5/7 as opposed to Biden +12/15

 

But I’ve seen some polls showing Biden with a bigger lead in LV models. So who knows?

 

(But I think considering their readership that it will be close otherwise why even do this?)

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Larry T. Spider

Larry T. Spider 1740

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Posted
1 hour ago, cactusflinthead said:

This tells me everything I need to know about Biden

Read all 12. 

That story has happened 1,000 times in Joe’s life. He has his issues but he’s a good and decent man. How many people can say dotard has gone out of his way to help somebody on a personal level with no cameras or fanfare? No expectation of repayment? 

Voters will connect with Joe on this level. We are a broken country in many ways and the Republican Party has been masterful at tapping into that hate. Voters didn’t see HRC as a good person so there was no difference to choose from. I still think decency will win out in the end this time. If not, flush this country down the toilet.

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cactusflinthead

cactusflinthead 27594

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Larry T. Spider said:

That story has happened 1,000 times in Joe’s life. He has his issues but he’s a good and decent man. How many people can say dotard has gone out of his way to help somebody on a personal level with no cameras or fanfare? No expectation of repayment? 

Voters will connect with Joe on this level. We are a broken country in many ways and the Republican Party has been masterful at tapping into that hate. Voters didn’t see HRC as a good person so there was no difference to choose from. I still think decency will win out in the end this time. If not, flush this country down the toilet.

I've heard some of them too. Maybe I have been so starved for a President with a teaspoon of empathy that even a little anecdote of honoring a donor is enough to move me.

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Larry T. Spider

Larry T. Spider 1740

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Posted

I will also say that saying wildly mean things about HRC worked because people saw her as corrupt and untrustworthy. When trump tries it with biden it will backfire, other than with his worthless base. 

Biden is going to pick Kamala and set her loose on Trump. Then joe can be positive and optimistic with feel good stories.

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BehoId, The Underminer!

BehoId, The Underminer! 11668

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Posted
1 hour ago, The Dog said:

PPP just did another Texas poll (voters only - not RV or LV). 

Trump +2

 https://progresstexas.org/sites/default/files/June 2020 Progress Texas-PPP Poll.pdf

Very interesting in there:

Q8 If you are 18-34 years old, press 1. If 35-49, press 2. If 50-64, press 3. If 65 or older, press 4.

18 to 34 . . . 13%

35 to 49 . . . 23%

50 to 64 . . . 38%

65 or older . . . 27%

Actual voting breakdown from 2016 (nationwide, but whatever)

2-12.png

 

Whereas 56% of the electorate were olds in 2016, that poll had 65% olds.  So the poll definitely skewed old, and old definitely means Trump in Texas.  That's one data point that seems like the poll may be too Trump friendly.

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Gil Bang

Gil Bang 25897

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Posted
22 hours ago, thepop said:

He’s way past his prime for sure. I’m hopeful he will serve 1 term and step down leading to Harris or Warren or whoever. He can take solace in getting rid of trump and helping elect the first female VP in 2020 and President in 2024. 

I don't think he's as sharp as he was 10 years ago, but neither am I.  I also don't believe that he's senile.

IDGAF if he resigns 3 months into his term.   Whatever it takes to get rid of Trump is good with me. 

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Gil Bang

Gil Bang 25897

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Posted
On 6/19/2020 at 1:39 PM, Voldemort86 said:

Trump asking for more debates is a sign of desperation. 

he’s trying to change the campaign format which has been in place for years. We always have 3 debates and the first one is at the end of September.

the more desperate candidate is almost always the one who wants more debates.

I hope they don’t change anything to placate his sorry ass.

my dad used to say about poker: the winner's telling jokes, the loser is screaming "deal!:

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Gil Bang

Gil Bang 25897

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Posted
On 6/19/2020 at 4:39 PM, Bozo_Casanova said:

But Biden is legit great at not doing that, as he showed against Palin. He just smiles and kind of softly chuckles and moves on. Hillary made the mistake of chasing them down because she’s a great litigator who is really bad at getting people to like her.

Biden needs to have the absolute best social media team that money can buy.  Every fucking Trump lie, Biden needs to chuckle and say "folks, that's a lie and my social media team will prove it in the next few minutes.  It needs to be an all-platform fact check.  Twitter, facebook, press releases to all media complete with video, footnoted quotes, etc.  

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Larry T. Spider

Larry T. Spider 1740

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

Biden needs to have the absolute best social media team that money can buy.  Every fucking Trump lie, Biden needs to chuckle and say "folks, that's a lie and my social media team will prove it in the next few minutes.  It needs to be an all-platform fact check.  Twitter, facebook, press releases to all media complete with video, footnoted quotes, etc.  

They tried that once and he told people to go to joe 30330.com

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MaybeACoordinator

MaybeACoordinator 8349

Posted
Posted

 

On 6/22/2020 at 10:39 PM, longhornmatt said:

I want to know what makes a person identify as independent but still be an enthusiastic Trump supporter.  Too cool for school both siderism?   Or a real crazy that’s like, “I support Trump, but I won’t register for the Republican Party until those RINO cucks stop pussyfooting around and execute everyone in Antifa!”

A cousin of mine in Red River County (godforsaken county east of Paris) went on FB and praised Mitt for voting his conscience during the impeachment. The whole county lit into her except for the local Philosopher King who hates Trump because he thinks he's just another Soros stooge. 

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