Texas basketball 2020-21: Not even Shaka can fuck this up...right?

[Machinator 32103]

Well, we are sliding seed lines, considering we were in 1/2 seed contention a couple weeks ago. Most bubble watch articles track all teams, not just the ones on the cutline.

[Js1 87183]

1 minute ago, Machinator said:

Well, we are sliding seed lines, considering we were in 1/2 seed contention a couple weeks ago. Most bubble watch articles track all teams, not just the ones on the cutline.

Even at our highest ranking, I don't think we were ever a 1-seed contention (personally).  The big reason was the NET wasn't as in love with us as the media and coaches.  We were/are consistently ranked 5-10 spots higher than our NET ranking (still are - we are 9 spots lower in the NET than our polling ranking). 

The NET has had a long love affair with Gonzaga/Baylor/Michigan and then Illinois for that fourth spot.  Even when Iowa/Alabama/Houston/Texas/Ohio State were occupying the 4, 5 and 6 spots in the rankings. 

But it's also the same formula that currently has Loyola Chicago #11 and Colgate #13 so fuck if I know how the NCAA is going to seed anyone. 

[CurlyDumps 4659]

Keep stacking those good losses baby!

A first round loss is all but guaranteed at this point, no matter what seed we stumblefuck into. At least it will be a free space on my bracket.

[Machinator 32103]

4 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Even at our highest ranking, I don't think we were ever a 1-seed contention (personally).  The big reason was the NET wasn't as in love with us as the media and coaches.  We were/are consistently ranked 5-10 spots higher than our NET ranking (still are - we are 9 spots lower in the NET than our polling ranking). 

The NET has had a long love affair with Gonzaga/Baylor/Michigan and then Illinois for that fourth spot.  Even when Iowa/Alabama/Houston/Texas/Ohio State were occupying the 4, 5 and 6 spots in the rankings. 

But it's also the same formula that currently has Loyola Chicago #11 and Colgate #13 so fuck if I know how the NCAA is going to seed anyone. 

I think there was certainly perception among media types (the people who write the articles speculating about bubble teams, locks, and such things) that Texas was a 1-seed contender after they won at KU and WVU on successive Saturdays. You may be right that they were overestimating our chances based on the fundamentals.

None of that matters now, at any rate.

[ztejas 44227]

46 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

thats pretty interesting since Ramey's play has been pretty shitty for the most part down stretches of games and AJ has been clearly our best player.  Ramey being the "sargent at arms" in the locker room is hilarious.  the guy is a known choker.

that said, neither of these guys should be getting in someone's face on the court.  neither of them is good enough. but to your point Shaka should have grabbed both of them as soon as it started and sat them down in the huddle.  the issue is not Ramey or AJ.

I just don't like scapegoating the guy that has shown me the most heart of anyone this season, and who was by far our best player in the game in question. I agree that no one on this team should behave that way but I understand where he is coming from and to me stuff like that is just basketball. Get it out of your system and move on and go close the fucking game out. Letting it "hang over the team" or whatever and take you out of the moment is some pussy, loser shit that I guess Shaka condones or doesn't know how to coach out of. Not that I really beleive that Ramey's outburst was actually material in Texas losing the game, or anything more than a convenient excuse for Texas predictably doing what it has done for 6 years now under Shaka. 

[dcar00 14971]

1 minute ago, ztejas said:

I just don't like scapegoating the guy that has shown me the most heart of anyone this season, and who was by far our best player in the game in question. I agree that no one on this team should behave that way but I understand where he is coming from and to me stuff like that is just basketball. Get it out of your system and move on and go close the fucking game out. Letting it "hang over the team" or whatever and take you out of the moment is some pussy, loser shit that I guess Shaka condones or doesn't know how to coach out of. Not that I really beleive that Ramey's outburst was actually material in Texas losing the game, or anything more than a convenient excuse for Texas predictably doing what it has done for 6 years now under Shaka. 

so everyone should just start yelling at each other on the court?  and its OK to scapegoat AJ?  shown the most heart is subjective BS, but you are certainly welcome to your perspective. its like when everyone gets all excited when LeBron shows his "i'm serious/mean face".  LeBron is so "into it".   you know who was into it? guys like Jim Brown and Earl Campbell, because they didn't need to show their mean face they just ran over people.  Larry Bird and Magic Johnson didn't need to show their mean face.

This is a team of slightly above average college players.  not one of them is an alpha.

Yes, we agree on the overall point that the problem is Shaka.

 

[MotownHorn 1904]

39 minutes ago, CurlyDumps said:

Keep stacking those good losses baby!

A first round loss is all but guaranteed at this point, no matter what seed we stumblefuck into. At least it will be a free space on my bracket.

I'm more than happy to put $50 on us to win our first round game if you'd like to do more than yap.

[Catdaddyhorn 3467]

18 minutes ago, ztejas said:

I just don't like scapegoating the guy that has shown me the most heart of anyone this season, and who was by far our best player in the game in question. I agree that no one on this team should behave that way but I understand where he is coming from and to me stuff like that is just basketball. Get it out of your system and move on and go close the fucking game out. Letting it "hang over the team" or whatever and take you out of the moment is some pussy, loser shit that I guess Shaka condones or doesn't know how to coach out of. Not that I really beleive that Ramey's outburst was actually material in Texas losing the game, or anything more than a convenient excuse for Texas predictably doing what it has done for 6 years now under Shaka. 

Ramey makes too many mistakes himself to display such vitriol towards a teammate for a mistake. His shitty ass pass was in part the cause of one of Kai’s late game drops. And Ramey immediately started faulting Kai for not catching it cleanly and leading to TO.  In fact on the play in question with AJ it was partly Sims fault for not communicating the switch in time. AJ had his back to the defender and then Sims touches him to alert him of the switch, but he does it pretty late in the process.

[MotownHorn 1904]

Ramey's not my favorite. I didn't get to watch the game because I was out hiking, but I was telling the friend I was with that "they have 3 pretty good guards but I'm not really a fan of one of them." I wasn't surprised to hear later that he pulled this shit.

Ramey puts in a whole lot of 3 for 14, 5 turnover type performances to be talking shit to Jones about one bad play on D.

[CurlyDumps 4659]

20 minutes ago, MotownHorn said:

I'm more than happy to put $50 on us to win our first round game if you'd like to do more than yap.

I’m just here to yap. Thanks for the offer though.

[shadow_operative 15932]

1 hour ago, MotownHorn said:

Man if I didn’t know better I’d think Derka has some sort of agenda 😁

huh?

[ztejas 44227]

52 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

so everyone should just start yelling at each other on the court? 

 

1 hour ago, ztejas said:

I agree that no one on this team should behave that way but I understand where he is coming from

 

52 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

and its OK to scapegoat AJ? 

Is it scapegoating him when he shot 4/16 with 6 turnovers in a 2 point game? 

52 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

its like when everyone gets all excited when LeBron shows his "i'm serious/mean face".  LeBron is so "into it".   you know who was into it? guys like Jim Brown and Earl Campbell, because they didn't need to show their mean face they just ran over people.  Larry Bird and Magic Johnson didn't need to show their mean face.

What a strange example. Magic was an extremely demonstrative player. Bird was a legendary trash talker. LeBron is basically at worst a top 5 player ever and most have him higher than that (for example I'd have him above both Magic and Bird)

38 minutes ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

His shitty ass pass was in part the cause of one of Kai’s late game drops.

Kai shouldn't have dropped either of those balls. Please.

34 minutes ago, MotownHorn said:

Ramey puts in a whole lot of 3 for 14, 5 turnover type performances to be talking shit to Jones about one bad play on D.

No he doesn't. He's shot (around) that poorly 6 times this season. In none of those games did he have more than 2 turnovers. In fact, he hasn't had 5 turnovers all season. You could spend 30 seconds looking that up instead of talking out of your ass.

Edited February 22, 2021 by ztejas

[Catdaddyhorn 3467]

5 minutes ago, ztejas said:

 

 

Is it scapegoating him when he shot 4/16 with 6 turnovers in a 2 point game? 

What a strange example. Magic was an extremely demonstrative player. Bird was a legendary trash talker. LeBron is basically at worst a top 5 player ever and most have him higher than that (for example I'd have him above both Magic and Bird)

Kai shouldn't have dropped either of those balls. Please.

No he doesn't. He's shot (around) that poorly 6 times this season. In none of those games did he have more than 2 turnovers. In fact, he hasn't had 5 turnovers all season. You could spend 30 seconds looking that up instead of talking out of your ass.

Hence the words "in part".

[ztejas 44227]

Just now, Catdaddyhorn said:

Hence the words "in part".

I'm just going off of memory but I don't remember either of his flubs as half of a turnover. They were both bad drops.

I'm not sure how much more I'm interested in defending Ramey - he has driven me nuts plenty this season - but I do think he tends to get a bad rap and the timing here seems strange to me. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

On 2/14/2021 at 3:35 AM, shadow_operative said:

yeah for sure.

 

Texas Kenpom rankings since January:

 

1/6- #5

1/12- #6

1/15- #7

2/5- #12

2/7- #16

2/9 #17

2/14- #19

 

all aboard the Optimism Train! CHOO CHOO! conducted by Shaka Smart, this train definitely won't derail in painstaking fashion. no way!

2/21- #21

we've steadily been dropping in the kenpom rankings since January 6th. not a week has gone by where we didn't drop from the previous week. are we allowed to be upset yet?

[Catdaddyhorn 3467]

13 minutes ago, ztejas said:

I'm just going off of memory but I don't remember either of his flubs as half of a turnover. They were both bad drops.

I'm not sure how much more I'm interested in defending Ramey - he has driven me nuts plenty this season - but I do think he tends to get a bad rap and the timing here seems strange to me. 

The pass from Sims to Kai was a complete flub by Kai. However Ramey's pass to Kai was bad.  Kai was setting up for a baseline 3 as the ball rotated over to Ramey.  Ramey was probably trying  to lead Kai towards the basket but Kai was set at the 3 point line and thus had to unexpectedly reach for a pass off target which he eventually mishandled.  A better pass prevents it from being a turnover.  Ramey was actually leading Kai towards his defender with his poor pass.  

Edited February 22, 2021 by Catdaddyhorn

[shadow_operative 15932]

Shaka's teams have never known how to properly set up their teammates with good passes. It's another one of his hallmarks as a coach, and just another example of his teams not valuing the ball.

with our penchant for losing close games it's amazing how many small things, if corrected, could be the difference in winning or losing at least half a dozen games every year. better passing, better shot selection, better off-ball movement, fewer one-shot possessions where we take a 23 foot shot with 25 seconds left on the shot clock, etc. just fix even one of these things (all on the offensive end) and we probably win 3-5 more games each season. but nope. it's death by a thousand cuts watching this team on offense. one little fixable mistake after another. 

Edited February 22, 2021 by shadow_operative

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

who is the best college coach who ever had to separate two of his players during a game? I bet there are some good ones, I just can't think of fucking any

[Herpa Derpa 6343]

38 minutes ago, SwanderedTalent said:

who is the best college coach who ever had to separate two of his players during a game? I bet there are some good ones, I just can't think of fucking any

It happens in all programs.  The great coaches either take immediate control of the moment and/or don't let the subsequent fallout destroy the game.  Shaka did neither.

[dogbreath 440]

For all of Shaka's faults, his team had good opportunities at the end. 

Coleman misses a one and one with 8 seconds left.  Senior captain shooting 83% misses.  I remember when he was a freshman and missed those fts against Tech.  He went and worked on fts at 3 am after landing from Lubbock.  Saturday had to hurt.

Good out of bounds play to get A. Jones a good look and he misses 3 pointer with 3 seconds left.  0.4 seconds left and Sims misses tap in.  The shot by Jones and Sims were good plays drawn up by coaching staff.  

How much of this disappointment carries over to tomorrow night?

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

1 hour ago, Herpa Derpa said:

It happens in all programs. 

Really? During a game? Can you name an instance of it? My question was, who's the best coach you ever saw it happen to? I'm honestly curious. 

I get that players come to blows in practice, but on the court seems like a "your program is completely fucking broken" moment that never happens to the kind of coaches that Shaka defenders like to point to and say "they almost ran HIM out of town after four years and now he's in the Hall of Fame!"

[jimmyjazz 47203]

2 hours ago, dogbreath said:

For all of Shaka's faults, his team had good opportunities at the end. 

His team had a fantastic opportunity when it was up 19 in the 2nd half.  I'm not suggesting Shaka go all Guy V. Lewis, but for pity's sake, it's entirely possible for a good coach to make it virtually impossible for the other team to win at that point.  Unfortunately, we don't have that coach.  I guarantee Huggins was thinking exactly that as the clock expired.

[Herpa Derpa 6343]

25 minutes ago, SwanderedTalent said:

Really? During a game? Can you name an instance of it? My question was, who's the best coach you ever saw it happen to? I'm honestly curious. 

I get that players come to blows in practice, but on the court seems like a "your program is completely fucking broken" moment that never happens to the kind of coaches that Shaka defenders like to point to and say "they almost ran HIM out of town after four years and now he's in the Hall of Fame!"

No, I can't name a specific instance off the top of my head.  Jordan was notorious for ripping teammates during a game (no, not comparing the two players, so stahp). Teammates yell at each other constantly, and get in each other's faces.  Ramey was screaming fire. The coaches should have shut that down. They should have taken both players and spent a half second getting it cleared up. When it appears that there's a lingering problem that has altered the game, the coach takes back control of the team.

It's not about Ramey blowing up and creating the type of energy that kills a team/game. It's about the hapless Coach standing idly by and watching it play out without taking one step toward leadership and command. Shit went sideways and the guy in charge simply adjusted his seat.

[shadow_operative 15932]

1 hour ago, SwanderedTalent said:

Really? During a game? Can you name an instance of it? My question was, who's the best coach you ever saw it happen to? I'm honestly curious. 

I get that players come to blows in practice, but on the court seems like a "your program is completely fucking broken" moment that never happens to the kind of coaches that Shaka defenders like to point to and say "they almost ran HIM out of town after four years and now he's in the Hall of Fame!"

it's also not any two random players, it's two guys who are supposed to be the heart and soul of the team, and two guys who've been in the program for years together, and at this point are more young men than they are kids. there's no way you can separate Shaka's culture of no accountability and what happened between Jones and Ramey on the court. teams often take on the personality of their coach, and this team is clearly lacking for leadership, which should not be the case considering the experience of our back court. sadly, this team is "led" by a kiddie coach with no skins on the wall who is in over his head, has no spine, and no idea what he's doing. it's not surprising that his players don't ever seem to mature. 

Edited February 22, 2021 by shadow_operative

[Wulaw Horn 19595]

5 hours ago, ztejas said:

No. Texas could lose out and would still make the tourney.

Fuck around and find out...

I mean, that’s probably true, but I don’t think they are a complete and total lock as of this minute. Depends upon how ugly the losses all were and what happens around the rest of the country with the bubble. 

[HookEm 2509]

Maybe my optimism was misplaced...

[dcar00 14971]

4 hours ago, Herpa Derpa said:

No, I can't name a specific instance off the top of my head.  Jordan was notorious for ripping teammates during a game (no, not comparing the two players, so stahp). Teammates yell at each other constantly, and get in each other's faces.  Ramey was screaming fire. The coaches should have shut that down. They should have taken both players and spent a half second getting it cleared up. When it appears that there's a lingering problem that has altered the game, the coach takes back control of the team.

It's not about Ramey blowing up and creating the type of energy that kills a team/game. It's about the hapless Coach standing idly by and watching it play out without taking one step toward leadership and command. Shit went sideways and the guy in charge simply adjusted his seat.

The NBA is a different animal.  the star players run the show.  In college the coach should be running the show.   maybe you get a guy like Laettner or Cleaves who, as a Jr/Sr, is lighting people up for lack of effort or missing assignments.  it is rare that a college player gets to that point anymore because they are leaving early.

neither Ramey or AJ should have done what they did but as we all agree, its on the coach.

 

[orangecat92 306]

8 hours ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Fuck around and find out...

I mean, that’s probably true, but I don’t think they are a complete and total lock as of this minute. Depends upon how ugly the losses all were and what happens around the rest of the country with the bubble. 

lose last two in a row, and then lose by double digits to a TCU quality team in conference tourney and we may find out. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

nah, we're in. not enough games left for us to plummet all the way out of the field of 68. but we've gone from a 2 seed to a 5 seed in the last six weeks, and the way things are going it would not be shocking to see us as a 6 or even a 7 seed. still, i think we end up as a favored seed, and comfortably in the field. 

[Horn80 6360]

Texas blew out Kansas at home in the first game but Kansas improved their play over the season while Texas predictably gotten worse.  Does anyone really think Texas will win tonight?   I think not.

[Machinator 32103]

Vegas has us as 3-point favorites.

Edited February 23, 2021 by Machinator

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

7 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

nah, we're in. not enough games left for us to plummet all the way out of the field of 68. but we've gone from a 2 seed to a 5 seed in the last six weeks, and the way things are going it would not be shocking to see us as a 6 or even a 7 seed. still, i think we end up as a favored seed, and comfortably in the field. 

if we lose out, badly, maybe we could end up in the Shaka Smart Invitational, aka the First Four!

Edited February 23, 2021 by SwanderedTalent

[jimmyjazz 47203]

2 hours ago, Machinator said:

Vegas has us as 3-point favorites.

Give me Kansas and the points any day.  I would so love to be wrong.

[ztejas 44227]

There's a good chance Kansas smacks this team tonight. I don't like doubting Vegas but... I'm not sure about that one. 

Edited February 23, 2021 by ztejas

[VinyVango 708]

I'm an old school X-O's guy, but do appreciate the psychology element required to manage a roster of college kids, especially those who believe they are just killing time before their childhood NBA dreams are fulfilled.  

That said, it bothers the hell out of me that all of Shaka's answers to press conference questions about what needs to change, what went wrong, what went right, etc... are answers like "we need to play for each other"... or "stay in the moment", rather than things like "our movement on offense stopped ... we quit driving the paint... we started jacking up ill-advised, quick three pointers as soon as we got a lead"...  He could be just trolling, but it reeks of a guy who needs to read a few John Wooden books with pictures.

[MotownHorn 1904]

22 hours ago, ztejas said:

 

No he doesn't. He's shot (around) that poorly 6 times this season. In none of those games did he have more than 2 turnovers. In fact, he hasn't had 5 turnovers all season. You could spend 30 seconds looking that up instead of talking out of your ass.

We've played 18 games this season. He's got a 3-11, 4-11, 5-17, 0-6, 2-10, 5-14, 2-15, and 2-8.

That's almost half our games where he played like dogshit. And I'm including the easy games at the start of the season. I'm not talking out of my ass.

[shadow_operative 15932]

3 hours ago, VinyVango said:

I'm an old school X-O's guy, but do appreciate the psychology element required to manage a roster of college kids, especially those who believe they are just killing time before their childhood NBA dreams are fulfilled.  

That said, it bothers the hell out of me that all of Shaka's answers to press conference questions about what needs to change, what went wrong, what went right, etc... are answers like "we need to play for each other"... or "stay in the moment", rather than things like "our movement on offense stopped ... we quit driving the paint... we started jacking up ill-advised, quick three pointers as soon as we got a lead"...  He could be just trolling, but it reeks of a guy who needs to read a few John Wooden books with pictures.

i remember that our problem last year, according to Shaka, is that we weren't "having enough better tomorrows". it's goddamn infuriating listening to this clown speak. 

[ztejas 44227]

2 hours ago, MotownHorn said:

We've played 18 games this season. He's got a 3-11, 4-11, 5-17, 0-6, 2-10, 5-14, 2-15, and 2-8.

That's almost half our games where he played like dogshit. And I'm including the easy games at the start of the season. I'm not talking out of my ass.

You claimed that he's had a "whole lot of" sub 25% FG and 5 turnover "type" games when he hasn't had one game even somewhat resembling that this season. Yes, he has had poor shooting outings. No one is debating that. In the 8 games you are now listing (and I wouldn't consider 4/11 from the field and 4/4 from the line with 0 turns "dogshit") he averaged just under 1.4 turnovers a game. So no, your assessment wasn't really accurate at all. You're just throwing out stupid, easily fact-checked misinformation. 

[Machinator 32103]

 

[Js1 87183]

Guessing the Baylor game is cancelled. 

Also we finish KU, @ Tech, @ ISU, @ OU, @ TCU

We really need a 3-2 record in there, but a 4-1 would be a lot better. 

Edited February 23, 2021 by Js1

[Machinator 32103]

 

[Js1 87183]

TV for the rescheduled games:

@ ISU  - ESPN+

@ OU - ESPN or ESPN2

@ TCU - ESPN+

[LTtxfan 50005]

4 hours ago, ztejas said:

There's a good chance Kansas smacks this team tonight. I don't like doubting Vegas but... I'm not sure about that one. 

Yeah, this smells like a jayhawk revenge win against a group of individuals wearing TEXAS jerseys...

Heard on the radio that this is the last TEXAS home game this season -- DAMN !!!

[dcar00 14971]

4 hours ago, VinyVango said:

I'm an old school X-O's guy, but do appreciate the psychology element required to manage a roster of college kids, especially those who believe they are just killing time before their childhood NBA dreams are fulfilled.  

That said, it bothers the hell out of me that all of Shaka's answers to press conference questions about what needs to change, what went wrong, what went right, etc... are answers like "we need to play for each other"... or "stay in the moment", rather than things like "our movement on offense stopped ... we quit driving the paint... we started jacking up ill-advised, quick three pointers as soon as we got a lead"...  He could be just trolling, but it reeks of a guy who needs to read a few John Wooden books with pictures.

you forgot "we need to stay connected".

[CurlyDumps 4659]

Shaka is a guidance counselor/life coach/motivational speaker masquerading as a basketball coach. 

I look forward to us stackin’ another good loss tonight.

[MotownHorn 1904]

2 hours ago, ztejas said:

You claimed that he's had a "whole lot of" sub 25% FG and 5 turnover "type" games when he hasn't had one game even somewhat resembling that this season. Yes, he has had poor shooting outings. No one is debating that. In the 8 games you are now listing (and I wouldn't consider 4/11 from the field and 4/4 from the line with 0 turns "dogshit") he averaged just under 1.4 turnovers a game. So no, your assessment wasn't really accurate at all. You're just throwing out stupid, easily fact-checked misinformation. 

My bad dude. I should have been more specific and said "he turns in a lot of 2-15 with 2 turnovers in double OT loss type outings"

You totally got me!

[Blotto 24021]

On one hand we need a win, on the other hand KU no doubt would like to pay us back for that ass beating we doled out in Lawrence earlier. 

Looking at the past 5 games, I'm tempted  to take the KU moneyline at +135. If we win, I'm happy and if we lose I'm not as pissed off. Just seems like KU is playing better ball lately and our team can't figure out a way to get the shaka stank off of 'em. If we run out to a 10 point lead, I'll be taking the in-game KU ML for sure, just not sure if I'll bet it before the game starts. 

[Js1 87183]

We’ve had the harder schedule. Wish we couldn’t played ISU twice and then KSU to run off some wins in a row. 

[Machinator 32103]

First ever regular season sweep of Kansas.

[Wulaw Horn 19595]

14 hours ago, Machinator said:

 

See, with those makeup games if we lost out all of those and lost the first game in the tournament I could see us missing the tourney. Don’t think we will lose all those games but it’s possible.