Dallas Cowboys 2018 offseason thread

[Amobie 58]

10 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

So more injured players we want on this team?

Injuries are part of the game. 

Oakland reached on a pick and he didn't live up to expectation.  Maybe he is a better fit here. 

Since we are revamping the passing game and special teams, Switzer wasn't going to make the team.  It's a good thing we got something for him.

[DougO 5,243]

I don't have a problem with moving Switzer. I don't have a problem with moving a 6th round pick. I have a problem of getting virtually zero in return for assets that could have been used to move up slightly to take need players at various points in the draft. The Cowboys continue to get the least value out of their draft currency. They talk about how all of these compensatory picks give them so much flexibility to move around, but instead they just waste them.

Twice in this draft they gave away assets in order to dispose of some other teams garbage, and pay extra salary for them in the process.

Edited April 30, 2018 by DougO

[JimmyHoffa 1,188]

12 hours ago, DeweyCox said:

Glad to see Joel Lanning on the UDFA list for us. I’d bet on this underdog.

He's a great story but I think he will be in the weeds. Plus he is slow. Hope he proves me wrong but I just don't see it.

[In10se 175]

36 minutes ago, DougO said:

I don't have a problem with moving Switzer. I don't have a problem with moving a 6th round pick. I have a problem of getting virtually zero in return for assets that could have been used to move up slightly to take need players at various points in the draft. The Cowboys continue to get the least value out of their draft currency. They talk about how all of these compensatory picks give them so much flexibility to move around, but instead they just waste them.

Twice in this draft they gave away assets in order to dispose of some other teams garbage, and pay extra salary for them in the process.

Exactly. It's not the trade itself that looks bad. It's the fact you gave up a 2017 4th rounder and a 2018 6th rounder for one year of a guy you nailed to the bench, a bust ass tiny receiver who fumbles a lot you say you actually want to use as a RB (lulz), and a bust ass DT who you're hoping a change of scenery causes to not be practically worthless. 

Bad use of assets. 

[Patrick Bateman 3,911]

30 minutes ago, JimmyHoffa said:

He's a great story but I think he will be in the weeds. Plus he is slow. Hope he proves me wrong but I just don't see it.

He'll have to make the team wit his ST play and a 4.75 is on the poorer end of the LB scale, but his 3 cone was pretty decent.  He also worked out at FB on his pro-day so there could be some hidden versatility.  Maybe like an up back on punt teams?  If he sticks at LB, at least he went to a team with terrible LB depth.  He may have to beat out Covington, who probably shouldn't have been drafted and signed as a UDFA if they wanted him and is considered a "Special Teams pick".  Ugh.

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

11 minutes ago, In10se said:

Exactly. It's not the trade itself that looks bad. It's the fact you gave up a 2017 4th rounder and a 2018 6th rounder for one year of a guy you nailed to the bench, a bust ass tiny receiver who fumbles a lot you say you actually want to use as a RB (lulz), and a bust ass DT who you're hoping a change of scenery causes to not be practically worthless. 

Bad use of assets. 

They've been looking for a Lance Dunbar replacement (for whatever reason) ever since we lost Lance.  Tavon ran the ball 59 times last year for 270yrds (no fumbles) and he's immediately better than Switzer in the return game.  

I'm not confident we could've grabbed more value in the 6th than what we got in return for Jihad.  We drafted 2 DTs in the 7th last year and neither are still with the team.   I'll take a chance on a guy who's at least part of the rotation. 

[Amobie 58]

9 minutes ago, In10se said:

Exactly. It's not the trade itself that looks bad. It's the fact you gave up a 2017 4th rounder and a 2018 6th rounder for one year of a guy you nailed to the bench, a bust ass tiny receiver who fumbles a lot you say you actually want to use as a RB (lulz), and a bust ass DT who you're hoping a change of scenery causes to not be practically worthless. 

Bad use of assets. 

So the new definition of fumble prone is 4 fumbles out of 184 runs, 158 returns and 194 catches..  So less than 1 fumble per 100 touches.

Zeke fumbled 6 times out of 564 runs and 58 receptions..   Is he fumble prone?

I seriously doubt you've followed much of Tavon's career if you don't think he's worth a 6th. 

[Amobie 58]

2 minutes ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

They've been looking for a Lance Dunbar replacement (for whatever reason) ever since we lost Lance.  Tavon ran the ball 59 times last year for 270yrds (no fumbles) and he's immediately better than Switzer in the return game.  

I'm not confident we could've grabbed more value in the 6th than what we got in return for Jihad.  We drafted 2 DTs in the 7th last year and neither are still with the team.   I'll take a chance on a guy who's at least part of the rotation. 

Clearly it was a wasted pick because we didn't get Adrian Peterson in his prime for a 6th rounder. 

[Patrick Bateman 3,911]

4 minutes ago, Amobie said:

So the new definition of fumble prone is 4 fumbles out of 184 runs, 158 returns and 194 catches..  So less than 1 fumble per 100 touches.

Zeke fumbled 6 times out of 564 runs and 58 receptions..   Is he fumble prone?

I seriously doubt you've followed much of Tavon's career if you don't think he's worth a 6th. 

I don't think those stats would be the definition of fumble prone...... Of course, they're not Tavon Austin's so who the fuck knows what you're looking at, but if you simply were asking a hypothetical, there you are.

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

9 minutes ago, Amobie said:

So the new definition of fumble prone is 4 fumbles out of 184 runs, 158 returns and 194 catches..  So less than 1 fumble per 100 touches.

Zeke fumbled 6 times out of 564 runs and 58 receptions..   Is he fumble prone?

I seriously doubt you've followed much of Tavon's career if you don't think he's worth a 6th. 

Hold the phone.  He had a rushing fumble too. So add that bad boy in there. 

[Amobie 58]

1 minute ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

Hold the phone.  He had a rushing fumble too. So add that bad boy in there. 

Missed that one.  My bad.  Still don't view him as a turnover machine.

8 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

I don't think those stats would be the definition of fumble prone...... Of course, they're not Tavon Austin's so who the fuck knows what you're looking at, but if you simply were asking a hypothetical, there you are.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/15786/tavon-austin

 

[futureman 22,445]

2 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

The Switzer trade is pretty easy to understand.  His selection was heavily influenced by Rich Bisaccia, our ex Special Teams coach, who we allowed to go to the Raiders in the offseason.  After this, Switzer lost his biggest advocate in the facility and therefore we drafted over him.  I'll say after doing some research on Ward, Raiders fans are ecstatic to dump him.  They feel like they fleeced us, for taking on his contract alone (although I believe most of his guaranteed portion has already been paid).  I'm assuming Lett or the Old man think there's still potential there, but Ward has been a huge bust and the Raiders were happy to dump him and acquire a punt returner and WR5.

 

not really.  played ok as a rookie then had the hurt foot last year.  he’s a big athletic monster and I think he’ll do very well here.  

[futureman 22,445]

1 hour ago, DougO said:

I don't have a problem with moving Switzer. I don't have a problem with moving a 6th round pick. I have a problem of getting virtually zero in return for assets that could have been used to move up slightly to take need players at various points in the draft. The Cowboys continue to get the least value out of their draft currency. They talk about how all of these compensatory picks give them so much flexibility to move around, but instead they just waste them.

Twice in this draft they gave away assets in order to dispose of some other teams garbage, and pay extra salary for them in the process.

you can’t make any of those conclusions for at least another year or two. 

[Patrick Bateman 3,911]

1 minute ago, Amobie said:

Missed that one.  My bad.  Still don't view him as a turnover machine.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/15786/tavon-austin

 

Uhm no.... To get an accurate assessment of Austin's ball security issues, you need to incorporate his ST's gaffes.  He's fumbled or muffed punts an unbelievable 16/17 times in those 158 punt returns.  That's unbelievably terrible and why the Rams benched him in the return game.  ESPN is very poor for individual stats, I would recommend you don't use them....

PFR has 21-10

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/A/AustTa00.htm

NFL.com and CBS have 22-8.  Rams.com the same as they use nfl data.

http://www.nfl.com/player/tavonaustin/2539336/careerstats

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/1700338/tavon-austin

http://www.therams.com/team/roster/Tavon-Austin/87702b37-f274-4cbf-9100-bb91cde795dc

Quote

In his career, Austin has returned three punts for touchdowns, all coming in his first three seasons in the NFL. He averaged a very respectable 8.3 yards per return last season despite not housing one, which should give McVay confidence in him.

However, he’s always had trouble fielding them cleanly. In five seasons, Austin has fumbled 15 punts, which is obviously a huge number. 

https://theramswire.usatoday.com/2017/09/28/nfl-los-angeles-rams-tavon-austin-punt-return-fumbles-sean-mcvay/

He would have 2 more which would eventually get him benched last season after this article came out, which led to this....

https://theramswire.usatoday.com/2017/10/10/nfl-los-angeles-rams-tavon-austin-sean-mcvay-punt-return-fumbles/

Quote

Austin has already fumbled it four times in five games on punt returns, just one shy of his career high. Giving the ball away on special teams is one of the worst things a player can do, especially when returning punts is essentially your primary role.

The best light you can make for Austin on ball security is to take away his punt returns and simply look at rushing and receiving but then again, if he can't help in the return game, then his value has eroded....

[DougO 5,243]

32 minutes ago, futureman said:

you can’t make any of those conclusions for at least another year or two. 

The Rams and Raiders made those conclusions already.

[DougO 5,243]

Redskins released Terrell McClain, who was a dumb signing for them last year because he doesn't fit there. Dallas could use the help at 1-tech, at least as an injury option through preseason.

[Vic Mackey 47,012]

 

[In10se 175]

Did anyone hear Stephen Jones calling Austin a "webback"? Yeah, not much thought given before using that one. 

[Viper 12,105]

17 minutes ago, DougO said:

Redskins released Terrell McClain, who was a dumb signing for them last year because he doesn't fit there. Dallas could use the help at 1-tech, at least as an injury option through preseason.

Only reason I might not (assuming he signs at pretty close to the vet min) is the question of how this would affect our compensatory pick for losing Hitchens. It won't matter if we can wait till after May 8th I think, but before that I think it would cancel it out.

Edited April 30, 2018 by Viper

[futureman 22,445]

23 minutes ago, DougO said:

The Rams and Raiders made those conclusions already.

the rams, raiders, and cowboys can’t make any of those conclusions for at least another year or two.  

[Ricky Butler 2,683]

11 minutes ago, futureman said:

the rams, raiders, and cowboys can’t make any of those conclusions for at least another year or two.  

Just let him go. He's got it all figured out.

[futureman 22,445]

3 minutes ago, Ricky Butler said:

Just let him go. He's got it all figured out.

doug is my nemesis.  I can’t quit him. 

[Patrick Bateman 3,911]

 

[Patrick Bateman 3,911]

 

[EastTexan 662]

6 hours ago, In10se said:

This isnt 1989 anymore. They have severe limitations on practice duration and intensity under the CBA and this is especially true during the season when you have basically nothing but glorified walkthroughs and 7 on 7 in shells and helmets. In this new era you have to see what a guy can do on the field in games before you give up on him. 

I think it's probably true Garrett and Linehan never wanted him and didn't like the pick on draft day and were set on it from the start. 

 

I don't have much faith in Garret or Linehan.

[Lat22 4,010]

I just finished All or Nothing. I cannot stand the Jones clan. Except maybe for Charlotte......

[DougO 5,243]

5 hours ago, Viper said:

Only reason I might not (assuming he signs at pretty close to the vet min) is the question of how this would affect our compensatory pick for losing Hitchens. It won't matter if we can wait till after May 8th I think, but before that I think it would cancel it out.

I don't believe that process includes acquisitions of players who have been released, only players who have played out their contracts.

[DougO 5,243]

Nothing but a gut feeling, but I kinda think Witten will take a one-season victory lap before moving into the booth. He's got multiple offers, so there will be opportunities when he's good and ready.

[cactusflinthead 27,598]

2 hours ago, DougO said:

Nothing but a gut feeling, but I kinda think Witten will take a one-season victory lap before moving into the booth. He's got multiple offers, so there will be opportunities when he's good and ready.

Just saw on twitterville that an unnamed source said his vehicle was not in its regular spot when they got there for offseason workouts. Witten is not missing day one of voluntary offseason workouts. he gone

[In10se 175]

5 hours ago, Lat22 said:

I just finished All or Nothing. I cannot stand the Jones clan. Except maybe for Charlotte......

Watched episode 1, some things stood out:

1) Dez going to Jerry's Hof party dressed like Shaft while everyone else wears suits was hilarious. 

2) every team meeting with Garrett addressing the team had at least half if not 3/4 of the team sitting in the back 4 rows while the front half of seating was mostly empty. How Garrett puts up with that shit is infuriating. 

3) Why the fuck is Charlotte addressing the team?

4) bigger why the fuck is Jerry addressing the team after the Denver loss? Completely undercutting the coach's authority. 

5) Garrett is one goofy fuck but I feel bad for him. That organization is completely dysfunctional. 

6) what was Dez going on about with the receiver coach in film? He wants film to be all rah rah you guys are the best bullshit? Film is for analyzing and preparing, obviously things Dez never cared to do. And people wonder why he wore out his welcome when he stopped producing. 

Edited May 1, 2018 by In10se

[cactusflinthead 27,598]

Y'all are doing a piss poor job of selling me on watching that show. I already know that Jerry undercuts coaches. He has since he took the reins from Jimmy. The coaches know this and it is part of the deal. I don't need to look for reasons to be pissed off at Jerry

[Loch Ness Monster 3,533]

Garrett doesn't seem like a great football mind but that's mainly from seeing him address the team/coaches. Not from film study or anything. 

Stephen Jones also doesn't seem too brilliant. Think we're in for mostly the same after Jerry dies unless Stephen just gets out of the way but I doubt it. At least he doesn't give speeches to the team like Jerry. 

Edited May 1, 2018 by Loch Ness Monster

[Rabidhorn 121]

31 minutes ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

Garrett doesn't seem like a great football mind but that's mainly from seeing him address the team/coaches. Not from film study or anything. 

Stephen Jones also doesn't seem too brilliant. Think we're in for mostly the same after Jerry dies unless Stephen just gets out of the way but I doubt it. At least he doesn't give speeches to the team like Jerry. 

Who do you think has been running the draft for Dallas the last few years? Stephen would not let his dad draft Johnny Beerpong Football.

[Patrick Bateman 3,911]

10 minutes ago, Rabidhorn said:

Who do you think has been running the draft for Dallas the last few years? Stephen would not let his dad draft Johnny Beerpong Football.

Will McClay...... we've become a mediocre drafting team from maybe worst 2-3 in the league when Jerrah was running the show.  Yea???..... #silverandbluelinings

[Bone3421 716]

I wouldnt say mediocre....hit on quite a few recently with some misses

If they werent so risky with last few 2nd rd picks no one would have a bad word to say

[Catdaddyhorn 3,444]

the 2nd round takes like Gregory, Jaylon Smith, Escobar are obviously Jerry influenced. 

[Rabidhorn 121]

The drafts the last 4-5 years have been very good, I would like Stephen to lock Jerry out of the draft room when the second rounds starts.

[Napoleon 8,666]

26 minutes ago, Rabidhorn said:

The drafts the last 4-5 years have been very good, I would like Stephen to lock Jerry out of the draft room when the second rounds starts.

I have no issues with this year's 2nd round pick.

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

7 hours ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

the 2nd round takes like Gregory, Jaylon Smith, Escobar are obviously Jerry influenced. 

What about Chido?

[Amobie 58]

1 hour ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

What about Chido?

And Lawrence

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

This may be the year that all our second round picks actually get involved.  If Gregory can get reinstated and Jaylon can stay healthy.  

[futureman 22,445]

10 hours ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

the 2nd round takes like Gregory, Jaylon Smith, Escobar are obviously Jerry influenced. 

the jury’s not out on jaylon smith. 

[DougO 5,243]

11 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Will McClay...... we've become a mediocre drafting team from maybe worst 2-3 in the league when Jerrah was running the show.  Yea???..... #silverandbluelinings

Problem is they appear to have kept the same scouting staff from the terrible drafting days. They've been needing to clean house in that department for decades. Just keep the guy that's tied to Boise State, at least he's found a few decent guy.

[Vic Mackey 47,012]

13 hours ago, Rabidhorn said:

The drafts the last 4-5 years have been very good, I would like Stephen to lock Jerry out of the draft room when the second rounds starts.

Uhhh what? 2015 was fucking pathetic.

[Gene Parmesan 4,004]

33 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Uhhh what? 2015 was fucking pathetic.

Absolutely.  The idea that Dallas drafts have been very good is misguided.  If the last 4-5 years of drafts have been very good, why does this team have no depth? 

[Patrick Bateman 3,911]

 

[Ricky Butler 2,683]

12 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Absolutely.  The idea that Dallas drafts have been very good is misguided.  If the last 4-5 years of drafts have been very good, why does this team have no depth? 

They've been alright. '16 was great. '15 not so much. 

[futureman 22,445]

1 hour ago, Vic Mackey said:

Uhhh what? 2015 was fucking pathetic.

but swaim!!

[In10se 175]

6 hours ago, futureman said:

the jury’s not out on jaylon smith. 

Yep last season the jury rendered s verdict of "sucks"

[DougO 5,243]

Still holding out hope that Smith will regenerate a new foot and be able to cut better than me.