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NFL 2020 Season Catch All Thread

LTtxfan

By LTtxfan
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Brothahorn

Brothahorn 10100

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10 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

Well fuck me. All you “Stafford is a scrub” folks are about to find out what he looks like with an organization and offensive mind that actually knows wtf they’re doing. Wow

giphy.gif

So what's the benchmark? Goff got 3 playoff appearances and a shitty SuperBowl performance. Stafford is going to have to do a lot better before I believe he is anything more than JAG.

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youdunnf'dup

youdunnf'dup 2147

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5 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

giphy.gif

So what's the benchmark? Goff got 3 playoff appearances and a shitty SuperBowl performance. Stafford is going to have to do a lot better before I believe he is anything more than JAG.

If you don’t see how Stafford is a MASSIVE upgrade over Goff, I don’t know what to tell you. We aren’t watching the same sport. This is assuming health, of course. That is Stafford’s one Achilles heel. 

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Brothahorn

Brothahorn 10100

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6 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

If you don’t see how Stafford is a MASSIVE upgrade over Goff, I don’t know what to tell you. We aren’t watching the same sport. This is assuming health, of course. That is Stafford’s one Achilles heel. 

Oh, we're watching the same game. We just have different standards. Stafford's best season was 10 years ago. Goff is JAG like Stafford, so not much of an upgrade. 

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Brothahorn

Brothahorn 10100

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3 minutes ago, Burt Macklin said:

Lol what a horrible take. Stafford is way better than Goff. Not even close. 

You guys keep saying this, but after 11-12 years in the league, what exactly has he done? Nothing that any other JAG hasn't done.

 

I guess we'll find out now one way or the other.

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Burt Macklin

Burt Macklin 19230

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1 minute ago, Brothahorn said:

You guys keep saying this, but after 11-12 years in the league, what exactly has he done? Nothing that any other JAG hasn't done.

 

I guess we'll find out now one way or the other.

Of course he hasn’t won anything.  He plays for the fucking Lions. They’re one of the worst franchises in the NFL. HOFers who play for them retire early because it’s such a terrible team. 
 

He’s been an above average QB or better almost every year he’s played by just about any metric. Jared Goff might not even be one of the 32 best QBs in the NFL. 

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Murfdogg21

Murfdogg21 4578

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5 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

You guys keep saying this, but after 11-12 years in the league, what exactly has he done? Nothing that any other JAG hasn't done.

 

I guess we'll find out now one way or the other.

He was pretty badass when he had Calvin Johnson to throw to. Maybe the Rams can get him to unretire to put the band back together. 

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youdunnf'dup

youdunnf'dup 2147

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6 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

You guys keep saying this, but after 11-12 years in the league, what exactly has he done? Nothing that any other JAG hasn't done.

 

I guess we'll find out now one way or the other.

One of us is going to be loud wrong, but it’s just a bad take, brotha. Just a terrible, terrible take.

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naija

naija 3066

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did they even call Houston? I like Stafford, and think he is a QB that could have been on the list of top QBs with the right team, but he hasn't been healthy and I don't think you can describe him as young anymore. deal makes sense 3-4 years ago. It has a very short window to pay off for the Rams.

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3987

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3 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

 

Rams dumping the Goff contract is a helluva deal when you get Stafford in return with a reasonable contract...

 

In the end, Detroit will end up paying about 5 million in the next 2 years, whereby there's an out for Detroit to dump Goff without much on the books.  So Rams gave up 2 first rounders and a 3rd for Stafford and 5 million dollars.

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Captain Obvious

Captain Obvious 531

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1 hour ago, naija said:

did they even call Houston? I like Stafford, and think he is a QB that could have been on the list of top QBs with the right team, but he hasn't been healthy and I don't think you can describe him as young anymore. deal makes sense 3-4 years ago. It has a very short window to pay off for the Rams.

Aaron Donald, Robert Woods, and Jalen Ramsey are the only Rams players left on the books by the time Stafford's current contract is up.  No problem with this trade given those circumstances.

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Brew

Brew 3051

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6 hours ago, Captain Obvious said:

Aaron Donald, Robert Woods, and Jalen Ramsey are the only Rams players left on the books by the time Stafford's current contract is up.  No problem with this trade given those circumstances.

Good thing they have picks to reload. Oh wait.

They have been blowing first round picks like they are afraid of them. Most everyone they have used them on are no longer with the team at this point. They have stayed right on the cusp though, so this upgrade may be the piece that gets them over the hump. One SB then crashing and burning is still worth one SB. They have to hope that with Mahomes contract kicking in, they will have a shot. They should be able to get through the NFC as it sits right now.

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Brew

Brew 3051

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12 minutes ago, SimkinsMan said:

Is it possible that Detroit is loading up on picks to make a run at Watson?

No way Watson takes that trade. He’s not that stupid. They could be loading up to try and move up, but none of the teams above them are taking Goff as their future QB. They have seen how that story plays out. The Rams picks also don’t carry a high value.

It has to be a terrible day to wake up as Jared Goff. Go from a SB contender in LA to f-ing Detroit. Not sure it gets much worse.

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TexArcher

TexArcher 39078

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27 minutes ago, SimkinsMan said:

Is it possible that Detroit is loading up on picks to make a run at Watson?

Watson has a no-trade clause.  Him moving to Detroit is about as likely as me moving to College Station.

I hate that the Texans are gonna trade Watson, but I like the bar that this trade sets for that one.  If Miami wants him, they'll have to start with Tua, both of their first round picks, and then a bunch more.

Edited by TexArcher
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boilerhorn

boilerhorn 1638

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The Rams' strategy here is interesting.  They've had no first round pick since 2017 and will not have another until 2024.

Here's a timeline of relevant Rams activity.
2014 - Starter Sam Bradford out for the year.
2015 - Bradford traded to Philly for Nick Foles.  7th round pick to Texans for Case Keenum.
2016 - Trade up from 15 to 1 to get Goff.  Same class as Wentz and Prescott.
2016 - Jeff Fisher fired mid-season.
2017 - Sean McVay hired.
2017.5 - Pick traded as part of Goff trade.  Could have had: Mahomes or Watson with that pick.
2018.23 - Traded for Brandin Cooks.  Reasonable trade, late #1 for known quantity.  Overpaid him.  Traded with a 4th to Houston for a 2nd.
2019.31 - Traded to 31 and 206 to Atlanta for 45 and 79.
2020.20 - Traded for Jalen Ramsey
2021.25 - Traded for Jalen Ramsey
2022 - Traded for Matt Stafford
2023 - Traded for Matt Stafford

They've had the same GM since 2012: Les Snead.  I understand the recent philosophy - trade high draft picks (valuable, yet unproven) for established and proven players.

With what we know now, they should have played all of 2016 with Keenum and drafted either Mahomes or Watson in 2017.  That said, their coach/front-office composition in 2016 would not have seen the value of either of Watson or Mahomes for 2017; I'm sure that Fisher and Snead discussed the 2017 draft class before pulling the trigger.   Hiring McVay allowed them to salvage the Goff pick.  #21 and #25 for Ramsey seems like a good football value, contract notwithstanding.  

I do not see the Rams having top-10 picks in 2022 or 2023.  Their roster and coaching staff is too good.  So trading for Stafford makes sense.  They've seen Goff's ceiling and clearly think Stafford's is higher.  

Sending Goff, 2022.15, 2023.15 and a 3rd seems like a king's ransom.  Consider

  • Goff's crappy contract
  • Stafford's relatively decent contract
  • The demand for capable, established QBs is high

Did they overpay?  Perhaps, but they were competing with Colts, NE, Denver, SF, Carolina, and others.

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Beantown Express 2.0

Beantown Express 2.0 6598

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1 hour ago, TexArcher said:

Watson has a no-trade clause.  Him moving to Detroit is about as likely as me moving to College Station.

I hate that the Texans are gonna trade Watson, but I like the bar that this trade sets for that one.  If Miami wants him, they'll have to start with Tua, both of their first round picks, and then a bunch more.

I am not sure the bar is as high as you think.  They basically traded a late 1st and a 3rd for Stafford.  The other first was thrown in to take Goff’s contract off their hands.  Not sure Houston wants to take a contract like Goff’s on so the return for Watson may be similar to this since Watson is way better than Stafford.  I would guess a few #1s and maybe some 3rd or 4th rounders.  Then again there are always idiot GM’s in the NFL so you could get 10 #1 picks from a team and it wouldn’t surprise me.

Edited by Beantown Express 2.0
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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3987

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2 hours ago, SimkinsMan said:

Is it possible that Detroit is loading up on picks to make a run at Watson?

Doubtful Watson would approve going there.  However, it's 50-50 if Goff remains there.  Now that Goff's dead money is off the books to trade, Goff's contract isn't great especially the next 2 years, but it's easier to cut him after that and move on if he proves unproductive.  2 years isn't a huge commitment.  One of these teams playing QB musical chairs is going to have a huge opening once the music stops.  

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LTtxfan

LTtxfan 50038

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9 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

In the end, Detroit will end up paying about 5 million in the next 2 years, whereby there's an out for Detroit to dump Goff without much on the books.  So Rams gave up 2 first rounders and a 3rd for Stafford and 5 million dollars.

Also Rams aren't paying Goff anymore -- they must have really wanted that dude GONE !!!

Money saved on Goff, is being paid to Stafford...

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3987

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2 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

Also Rams aren't paying Goff anymore -- they must have really wanted that dude GONE !!!

Money saved on Goff, is being paid to Stafford...

They wanted the upgrade and want to go all in with Aaron Donald's prime (along with Ramsey's).  They keep kicking the can down the road, but eventually that's going to be a shitty squad with no draft capital.  Really hard to plug holes with cheap talented labor without top 100 picks.

Holy shit!!!  Talk about a haul.  Now, who has that type of capital?  

 

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Carl Spackler

Carl Spackler 3625

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3 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

Also Rams aren't paying Goff anymore -- they must have really wanted that dude GONE !!!

Money saved on Goff, is being paid to Stafford...

Goff's cap hit is huge in '21, but it gets a lot better after that -- Detroit could walk away from him after 2 seasons with zero cap hit according to a couple articles I read.  And Stafford's cap hit over the next two seasons is $43M -- not exactly chicken feed.  You add that to all the other large $ contracts the Rams are paying over the next couple seasons (Donald, Ramsey, etc.) and it's not as if the Rams have cleared their books.  Plus they're still paying $$ on Todd Gurley's contract for chrissake.

Les Snead & Co. are rolling the dice that Stafford can take them to the top in the next couple seasons.  While I think Stafford is a better QB than Goff and it wouldn't shock me to see Stafford blossom in a new setting after spending his career in shitty Detroit, that's still a tough hill to climb, esp. given that the NFC West is already very competitive.  And if Stafford doesn't take the Rams back to the top within the next couple seasons, their future will be pretty bleak given that they just gave up their first rounds picks in the next two seasons and will likely need to shed contracts of some valuable players.    

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Juicy

Juicy 730

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10 hours ago, SimkinsMan said:

Is it possible that Detroit is loading up on picks to make a run at Watson?

I would love that but I don't think Watson wants to go from the worst run NFL team to the second worst run NFL team. 

I loved Stafford here, the Lions have been terrible my whole life, but Stafford was one of the bright spots. Playing hurt in meaningless games probably shortened his career but endeared him to the fans here. If the lions would have had any sort of competence in the GM spot Stafford would have been a lot better. 

Sad to see him go, but pretty happy about the haul. Even without Goff, two first rounders and an 3rd is more than I expected them to get. 

I expect one of the 1st they got from the rams to be swapped with the Dolphins at 3 so the lions can take their QB of the future, let him sit behind Goff for this year, then Next season if he looks ready they can have Goff as a backup before they cut him after the 2022 season for basically nothing. 

It is shocking to me that the Lions seem to have actually made the right move, for once. 

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Murfdogg21

Murfdogg21 4578

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8 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

 

This disappoints me since it’s coming from Pancakes, the official press secretary of the Texans. They will end up with two borderline starters and two firsts (the 2022 one will be shitty because Deshaun’s new team will be in the playoffs), and the Texans will claim it was a Herschel Walker type haul. 

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youdunnf'dup

youdunnf'dup 2147

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54 minutes ago, Spider2YBanana said:

Stafford with his 1 pro bowl appearance in 12 seasons will really show them! Jesus Christ. The Rams might be dumber than the Texans. 

Injuries, and playing for historically the worst franchise in the sport will do that to you. We’re about to find out if mcvay is the offensive mind that we think he is, because Stafford is CLEARLY better than Goff. But what they gave up is just ridiculous 

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