Donald Trump 2018

[jimmyjazz 46351]

3 hours ago, scottsins said:

Isn’t the 2% requirement already agreed to, and only effective by 2024?

Yes.  I read an article on NPR that says 9 of 24 nations will be compliant this year, and several don't plan to gain compliance by 2024.

In an ironic twist (not), Trump has been overstating our spending at 4.2% of GDP.  The Pentagon says it's 3.3%.

[Anastasis 23471]

 

4 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Yes.  I read an article on NPR that says 9 of 24 nations will be compliant this year, and several don't plan to gain compliance by 2024.

In an ironic twist (not), Trump has been overstating our spending at 4.2% of GDP.  The Pentagon says it's 3.3%.

 

I've never seen any stat that puts it at 4%. I have seen anywhere from 3.1 to 3.6%.

As far as breakdown by country, here's 2017:

 

[Biff Tannen 45751]

Damn you Luxembourg!  Pull your weight!

[Anastasis 23471]

Here's another chart from WSJ, with data apparently sourced from NATO, that puts US @ 4.4%:

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

2 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Here's another chart from WSJ, with data apparently sourced from NATO, that puts US @ 4.4%:

In 2013

[Anastasis 23471]

2 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

In 2013

Good eye. Same data plotted over time:

[jimmyjazz 46351]

14 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

 

 I've never seen any stat that puts it at 4%. I have seen anywhere from 3.1 to 3.6%.

Like I said, it's just POTUS lying moving his lips.

[Huckleberry 33159]

It's fairly ridiculous that so many "conservatives" think the response to that graphic should be the other countries coming up to meet our line instead of us moving down to meet theirs.

[Clackles 276]

48 minutes ago, retread said:

 

Where’s the data on those that just scribbled in “WITCH HUNT!!!”.

[Fozzz 152]

35 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Here's another chart from WSJ, with data apparently sourced from NATO, that puts US @ 4.4%:

I wonder how much we could save if we only spent 2% GDP, several hundred billion a year?  Imperialism sure is expensive.  

[jimmyjazz 46351]

11 minutes ago, Fozzz said:

I wonder how much we could save if we only spent 2% GDP, several hundred billion a year?  Imperialism sure is expensive.  

If we assume a 1.3% reduction in defense spending, then based on a current GDP of $19.4T, that would save $252B.

[Js1 85648]

2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

If we assume a 1.3% reduction in defense spending, then based on a current GDP of $19.4T, that would save $252B.

Yeah, OR, and hear me out, Paul Ryan says we can just cut Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, CHIP and SNAP for poor, lazy, freeloading minorities - err, I mean, impoverished, non-working, non-white takers -  instead! With all those savings, we can actually INCREASE defense spending. Then we'll really be MAGA-ing so much you'll be tired of MAGA-ing.

Edited July 12, 2018 by Js1

[jimmyjazz 46351]

 

4 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

If we assume a 1.3% reduction in defense spending, then based on a current GDP of $19.4T, that would save $252B.

I didn't word that well -- the assumption is that we would drop defense spending from 3.3% of GDP to 2% of GDP.

[Anastasis 23471]

Just now, jimmyjazz said:

If we assume a 1.3% reduction in defense spending, then based on a current GDP of $19.4T, that would save $252B.

And we would still have a multiple on spending dollar for dollar relative to China at #2. Wonder if there is anything cool we could do with an extra quarter trillion annually. 

[Fozzz 152]

4 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

If we assume a 1.3% reduction in defense spending, then based on a current GDP of $19.4T, that would save $252B.

lol but shit like Sanders' free college plan, which would cost far less than that, is a pipe dream.  This country is so impossibly fucked up.

 

 

[Chad Fuck 17827]

1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

And we would still have a multiple on spending dollar for dollar relative to China at #2. Wonder if there is anything cool we could do with an extra quarter trillion annually. 

Feed the hungry, heal the sick, house the homeless.

Aw fuck it.  More missiles!

[Huckleberry 33159]

1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

And we would still have a multiple on spending dollar for dollar relative to China at #2. Wonder if there is anything cool we could do with an extra quarter trillion annually. 

According to Kevin Morgan's lawyer we could be 720,000 shaggytexas websites.

[ChiTownDoc 21181]

12 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

And we would still have a multiple on spending dollar for dollar relative to China at #2. Wonder if there is anything cool we could do with an extra quarter trillion annually. 

Dotard could light up his political enemies RocketMan style.  

[Anastasis 23471]

I'm thinking that we could make a legit run at largest tamale in Guinness Book of World Records. http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/world-records/436743-largest-tamale

[tchookem 3919]

Feed the hungry, heal the sick, house the homeless.
Aw fuck it.  More missiles!

This is actually an important point, the increased spending isn't going to the soldiers' pockets or being used to care for veterans, it's making defense contractors very rich. Most Americans think defense cuts hurt the soldiers.

[softlynow 1842]

14 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

And we would still have a multiple on spending dollar for dollar relative to China at #2. Wonder if there is anything cool we could do with an extra quarter trillion annually. 

52 actual infrastructure weeks a year, please.

[GreenspointTexas 9708]

1 minute ago, tchookem said:

14 minutes ago, Chad Fuck said:

Feed the hungry, heal the sick, house the homeless.
Aw fuck it.  More missiles!

This is actually an important point, the increased spending isn't going to the soldiers' pockets or being used to care for veterans, it's making defense contractors very rich. Most Americans think defense cuts hurt the soldiers.

This is correct.

 

 

also

 

 

 

 

Brexit

[staboner 4988]

17 minutes ago, Chad Fuck said:

Feed the hungry, heal the sick, house the homeless.

Aw fuck it.  More missiles!

hello from overseas friends. its been interesting. hope you fools are ok. lets hear from Bill on this concept a bit

 

[Chad Fuck 17827]

Just now, tchookem said:

13 minutes ago, Chad Fuck said:

Feed the hungry, heal the sick, house the homeless.
Aw fuck it.  More missiles!

This is actually an important point, the increased spending isn't going to the soldiers' pockets or being used to care for veterans, it's making defense contractors very rich. Most Americans think defense cuts hurt the soldiers.

That's exactly it.  

[FondrenRoad 4378]

8 minutes ago, tchookem said:

21 minutes ago, Chad Fuck said:

Feed the hungry, heal the sick, house the homeless.
Aw fuck it.  More missiles!

This is actually an important point, the increased spending isn't going to the soldiers' pockets or being used to care for veterans, it's making defense contractors very rich. Most Americans think defense cuts hurt the soldiers.

Yep.  315 billion dollars worth of F35s.  And that's just the purchase price.  That doesn't include maintenance/etc.  We have 1.2 million troops.  We could have forgone the F35 program entirely and cut every service member a 265,000 dollar check.  Or we could have updated older planes (which we are updating anyway) at a fraction of the cost and cut the service members 150k checks instead.

And that's just one boondoggle program. The DoD has loads of wasteful spending.  None of these budget increases go to the troops.  Hell, we bitch about the VA and act like we can barely fund it.

Edited July 12, 2018 by FondrenRoad

[GSU&UT 1798]

 

[jimmyjazz 46351]

I could probably google this, but I'm overcome with laziness:  anybody know what our $ commitment is to salaries and benefits for all military personnel?  I'm gonna guess $50B but that assumes an average of $40K per year and I haven't the foggiest notion of whether that's reasonable.

[WhatTheBuck 28821]

45 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

And we would still have a multiple on spending dollar for dollar relative to China at #2. Wonder if there is anything cool we could do with an extra quarter trillion annually. 

We could use it to improve public education. But then, an educated electorate is bad for the GOP so they would never adopt that plan. They'd just use the surplus as an excuse to cut more taxes for the rich. 

[SimonBolivar 10961]

29 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I could probably google this, but I'm overcome with laziness:  anybody know what our $ commitment is to salaries and benefits for all military personnel?  I'm gonna guess $50B but that assumes an average of $40K per year and I haven't the foggiest notion of whether that's reasonable.

I would assume with the bulk of the military being enlisted that that salary figure is high.

[GSU&UT 1798]

7 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

We could use it to improve public education. But then, an educated electorate is bad for the GOP so they would never adopt that plan. They'd just use the surplus as an excuse to cut more taxes for the rich. 

Didn't you get the memo? Charter schools that aren't regulated are what we need more of!

[Red Five 41007]

It seems like this would be a pretty good platform for a candidate. “Hey I’m going to drop our defense budget by like 1% and pay for infrastructure, education, healthcare, and pay off our debt.”

[woohorn 1131]

That person would be primary-ed in all 4 parties.

[GSU&UT 1798]

2 minutes ago, Red Five said:

It seems like this would be a pretty good platform for a candidate. “Hey I’m going to drop our defense budget by like 1% and pay for infrastructure, education, healthcare, and pay off our debt.”

I agree, but I think people are so scared of that being used against them in states that are more red or swing districts. "THEY WANT THE BROWN TERRORISTS TO WIN!" is stupidly effective even in suburban areas.

[sidis 9832]

53 minutes ago, tchookem said:

1 hour ago, Chad Fuck said:

Feed the hungry, heal the sick, house the homeless.
Aw fuck it.  More missiles!

This is actually an important point, the increased spending isn't going to the soldiers' pockets or being used to care for veterans, it's making defense contractors very rich. Most Americans think defense cuts hurt the soldiers.

[jimmyjazz 46351]

10 minutes ago, Red Five said:

It seems like this would be a pretty good platform for a candidate. “Hey I’m going to drop our defense budget by like 1% and pay for infrastructure, education, healthcare, and pay off our debt.”

Just to clarify, it wouldn't be cutting the defense budget by 1%, it would be cutting it by 39%.  The math I showed assumed we cut defense spending from 3.3% of GDP to 2% of GDP.

I should just delete that post.

[Anastasis 23471]

12 minutes ago, Red Five said:

It seems like this would be a pretty good platform for a candidate. “Hey I’m going to drop our defense budget by like 1% and pay for infrastructure, education, healthcare, and pay off our debt.”

Do you even MIC bro?

[Sgt Hulk 13928]

Mmmmm I love me some defense spending. I love even more reading people hate on my salary bennies.  Yummy and saucy. 

 

For FY 18  personnel costs are about 141B for that question asked and another 10B or so for family support.  I’m not sure if that includes pension payments or not but luckily for you guys the military did away with those pensions for new troops so they have to fend for themselves.  Although if they stick it out for 20 which many very rarely do they will get a little something

[Mapache 1117]

Ex-ambassador says US voters' ignorance is Trump's biggest asset

 

 

[WhatTheBuck 28821]

42 minutes ago, GSU&UT said:

Didn't you get the memo? Charter schools that aren't regulated are what we need more of!

Not to mention paying our tax money to church-run schools (aka madrassas) so we can keep our children ignorant of science, literature, uncomfortable historical facts, etc. 

[GSU&UT 1798]

1 minute ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Not to mention paying our tax money to church-run schools (aka madrassas) so we can keep our children ignorant of science, literature, uncomfortable historical facts, etc. 

Sounds like Sharia law or something. 🤔

[WhatTheBuck 28821]

36 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I should just delete that post.

If only the forum software afforded us that luxury. 

[Mdhorn 5992]

1 hour ago, tchookem said:

1 hour ago, Chad Fuck said:

Feed the hungry, heal the sick, house the homeless.
Aw fuck it.  More missiles!

This is actually an important point, the increased spending isn't going to the soldiers' pockets or being used to care for veterans, it's making defense contractors very rich. Most Americans think defense cuts hurt the soldiers.

Have friends that do contracts for various middlemen.  If you're not making 6 figures,  you're not doing it right.  But yeah, 'Merica and the soldiers.  

[Longhorn_Fan68 33901]

man, this image gives me anxiety for some reason.

 

[Sgt Hulk 13928]

2 hours ago, tchookem said:

2 hours ago, Chad Fuck said:

Feed the hungry, heal the sick, house the homeless.
Aw fuck it.  More missiles!

This is actually an important point, the increased spending isn't going to the soldiers' pockets or being used to care for veterans, it's making defense contractors very rich. Most Americans think defense cuts hurt the soldiers.

Except it does hurt. What most folks who aren’t involved think is that it lines defense contractors pockets.  But the largest expense for the military is personnel cost hence why so much is now contracted out today that never was. So when there’s a slash to budget. The first thing that goes is personnel and manning in the form of RIFs Voluntary outs early retirement mandatory retraining to undermanned career fields or get out. Closing of doors to various programs slashing TA funding and education. Cutting annual raises to 1.0% ( I know be happy with 1.0 or should have went to college and got a real job. Which is what I’ve been told).  Then you tell our maintainers to go to the nearest aviation museum and can parts off displays to keep our 40-50 year old aircraft flying that husband brothers sisters are flying on. So yeah defense cuts especially the ones we saw last admin hurt and cut us deep. Now we do more with less having leave cancelled because our 100 man shop is now 40 man shop still doing requirements of a 110 man shop.  But again I’m just a stupid military guy 

[Huckleberry 33159]

1 minute ago, Sgt Hulk said:

Now we do more with less having leave cancelled because our 100 man shop is now 40 man shop still doing requirements of a 110 man shop.  But again I’m just a stupid military guy 

In the private sector what this says is that you should have never had a 100 man shop if 40 men can do the job. But for some reason that "IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR" logic never gets applied by the right to the military, only to other government agencies like the EPA, Education, etc.

[Sgt Hulk 13928]

6 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

In the private sector what this says is that you should have never had a 100 man shop if 40 men can do the job. But for some reason that "IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR" logic never gets applied by the right to the military, only to other government agencies like the EPA, Education, etc.

6 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

In the private sector what this says is that you should have never had a 100 man shop if 40 men can do the job. But for some reason that "IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR" logic never gets applied by the right to the military, only to other government agencies like the EPA, Education, etc.

So out of all that what you deduced was that we had an overmanned shop ? Completely missing the point that we went from slightly undermanned to half our manning gone  I love when someone tries to compare military operations to the private sector.   Lol 

Edited July 12, 2018 by Sgt Hulk

[Huckleberry 33159]

Just now, Sgt Hulk said:

 

Yes. Your example says that you have 40 men who are now getting the job done but that you want 100 men to do the same job. What that means is that the 100 man level of staffing was government bloat and waste. You don't agree with that opinion because it's your ass on the line.

But if the EPA had a 100 person office with a workload that 40 people could get done then you would want to know why tax dollars are being wasted on 60 extra heads and wouldn't care one lick about the stress that the 40 EPA employees would be under. And you'd be right to question that.

[Sgt Hulk 13928]

5 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Yes. Your example says that you have 40 men who are now getting the job done but that you want 100 men to do the same job. What that means is that the 100 man level of staffing was government bloat and waste. You don't agree with that opinion because it's your ass on the line.

But if the EPA had a 100 person office with a workload that 40 people could get done then you would want to know why tax dollars are being wasted on 60 extra heads and wouldn't care one lick about the stress that the 40 EPA employees would be under. And you'd be right to question that.

Lol so again you deduced that we have a workload of a 40 man office even when i states we had a 110 man workload You’re wrong. But I wouldn’t expect you to understand.  When I saidnhaving leave cancelled because we now don’t have enough manning to do the mission someone you think that’s perfectly acceptable saying the job is still gettin accomplished.   You’re partly right because these guys make the mission happen regardless.  Now at 7 Day a week 12 hour day shifts with no leave or time off and no overtime til keep MC rates above 70% that were one time above the majcom standard of 90 mission capability.  But thought processes like yours are the reason why we got cut so deep because you think a 3 person job can be done by 1 person just tell him he can’t go home or have a day off until done 

Edited July 12, 2018 by Sgt Hulk

[Huckleberry 33159]

Oh, I completely understand. People are selfish creatures. You will whine about how tough your job is and how you need more resources but will then wonder why we're "wasting" so many resources elsewhere. It's human nature, everyone does it including me. The important thing to do is to admit it.

[Sgt Hulk 13928]

I’ll come back and admit it later. Heading to a bloated office bathing in your tax dollars thanks for the platinum toilet seat and your support bro