Minneapolis Cop Murders A Black Man

[Message Board User 12,389]

 

[dcar00 14,028]

10 minutes ago, GotThatFire said:

That you, Shaun?

 

 

Well he's gonna be voted out of the club. Nice knowing you shaun.

[Message Board User 12,389]

 

[mdmost 42,825]

No, people haven't been voting at the city, county, and municipal levels where they can influence who polices the police. Those races typically have the worst turnout. Just in my city, Dallas, in 2018 the turnout for local races was 6%. 

Edited June 5, 2020 by mdmost

[BabaYaga 15,205]

1 minute ago, Brisketexan said:

That's a whole lot of words for you to just say "I think that your statement of problem 2 type cops is false."  Say it.  Own it. 

The fuck is wrong with you - you are doing the same thing that virtually ALL police are bad.  Hundreds of thousands.  Tens of millions over the years.  Billions of interactions this decade.  But yeah.  hey're all bad.  Jesus, what is this simplistic nonsense.  

 

9 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

I mean, unless you have a basic grasp of math and realize that the odds of finding the 48 worst cops in America,

You are really trying to make generalizations with a sample size of 48 over a period spanning 29 years and probably encompassing twenty+ million officers.  

6 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

) 4 cops being present at George Floyd's murder, and none of them stopping it?

And they are going to jail, except the guy that told the office to get off him, more than likely.  

7 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

well over 30 cops (my count from the video, and I'm being conservative) being present in Buffalo when a cop shoved an old man to the ground, cracking his skull....and none of them helping him or confronting the cop who shoved him?  In fact, one of them STOPPED the ONE cop who was about to try to do the right thing.

This was in the middle of a riot.  You are seriously not conflating nationwide policing to actions taken during on the worst riots in modern history?

3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

14 cops being present at the Rodney King beating, and none of them stopping it?

That was almost 30 years ago.  At 300+million interactions/year.....you really want to do the math?  

[John Lawrence 244]

1 minute ago, mdmost said:

No, people haven't been voting at the city, county, and municipal levels. Those races typically have the worst turnout. Just in my city, Dallas, in 2018 the turnout for local races was 6%. 

And the primaries are what matter in most urban areas.

[dcar00 14,028]

19 minutes ago, Lobo said:

A tacit rationale for the Posse Comitatus policy was that it was bad for morale and community standards to have U.S. Armed Forces deployed on domestic soil for anything other than humanitarian relief (and obviously foreign invaders).  There are no positive outcome examples in recorded human history where sovereign armies beat down their own civilians.  Communities are never the same after that.  It's awkward to go back to living among the people you beat and killed.  It's bad for all involved, that's a big part of the reason we keep the military off Main Street.  

So you'd think that rationale would have spread to the police.  That it's a bad look for all involved for them to beat and kill people in their own cities.  There was a time, particularly where I grew up in Chicago, where the various ethnic neighborhoods were largely patrolled by people of that ethnicity.  Hispanic cops patrolled the Hispanic parts of town, Irish in theirs, Polish in theirs, Italians in theirs, Blacks in theirs, Asians, and so on with the CBD being kind of a mixed bag as you'd expect downtown.  This was eventually, through societal pressure and some government policy, to be deemed regressive and now patrols are largely assigned on seniority, tactical experience, and systematic rotations.  I dunno anymore, maybe it was a good idea.  Take the sociological analysis away, I think people are just less likely to unnecessarily beat people that they live amongst.  

I guess large protests are different though because you have so many people from so many parts of town convening in one area.  But I'd still like to think a Buffalo police officer or any other officer would see a peaceful civilian and think, "Yeah, better not fuck him up...he could by my postman for all I know."  When I stay at a friend's house, I am clean, polite, and quiet.  When I stay in a hotel in another city, and I don't know anybody in the entire building ---yeah I'm defiling that room twelve ways from Tuesday.  Oh, it's a scene i

The move from Irish policing Irish, black policing black, etc was done because it was deemed racist but also because it would limit the corruption/back scratching, etc. Kind of like when companies rotate procurement people.

[BabaYaga 15,205]

9 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

But that doesn't fucking absolve the broken fucking culture that sees 48 cops have the chance to do the right thing,

Over twenty nine years and tens of millions of people later for your sample size, you can insert accountants (or lawyers....) that finger-fuck Teddy Ruxspin dolls and get more than 48 incidents.  

[Guest Lobo]

^dcar

I get it.  I'm just a little more willing to allow for a modicum more of financial corruption if it would mean a few less white cops killing black people for no reason.  I can count the news stories of police corruption in the last year on one hand, but the murder of innocent black men is in 3-figures year in and year out.  

The amount of financial corruption in police departments has never really gone down anyway, it's just a lot quieter and more discreet.  We're 90 pages into this thread and we haven't even scratched the surface on financial crimes committed by police.  The amount of officers involved in the drug trade would surprise a lot of Americans.  

Edited June 5, 2020 by Lobo

[Trey3216 15,325]

1 hour ago, MissingInAction said:

They just DGAF

 

 

If you can stand with em, you’re against em.    
 

jeez 

[BabaYaga 15,205]

 

[BabaYaga 15,205]

5 minutes ago, Lobo said:

The amount of financial corruption in police departments has never really gone down anyway, it's just a lot quieter and more discreet.  We're 90 pages into this thread and we haven't even scratched the surface on financial crimes committed by police.  The amount of officers involved in the drug trade would surprise a lot of Americans.  

Oh, I know.  It goes up and downstream as well.  Accountants.  Business Owners.  Elected officials.  Bureaucratic fraud and systemic oversight is needed in the worst way.  Problem is, I think layers of more bureaucrats is often the "solution".  Few more pockets get lined.....viola, the train keeps rolling.  

[bolverk 29,392]

8 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

The fuck is wrong with you - you are doing the same thing that virtually ALL police are bad.  Hundreds of thousands.  Tens of millions over the years.  Billions of interactions this decade.  But yeah.  hey're all bad.  Jesus, what is this simplistic nonsense.  

 

You are really trying to make generalizations with a sample size of 48 over a period spanning 29 years and probably encompassing twenty+ million officers.  

And they are going to jail, except the guy that told the office to get off him, more than likely.  

This was in the middle of a riot.  You are seriously not conflating nationwide policing to actions taken during on the worst riots in modern history?

That was almost 30 years ago.  At 300+million interactions/year.....you really want to do the math?  

These cops marched down a quiet residential street (i.e. not a riot), unlawfully barking orders at residents to get inside their homes. When they didn't, one cop orders the others to "light 'em up."

Help me identify one good cop in this video.

 

[BabaYaga 15,205]

1 minute ago, bolverk said:

These cops marched down a quiet residential street (i.e. not a riot), unlawfully barking orders at residents to get inside their homes. When they didn't, one cop orders the others to "light 'em up."

Help me identify one good cop in this video.

 

I'm not defending behavior in a riot.  Nor am I using it as evidence that the MAJORITY of cops are bad.  

[Brisketexan 104,534]

13 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

The fuck is wrong with you - you are doing the same thing that virtually ALL police are bad.  Hundreds of thousands.  Tens of millions over the years.  Billions of interactions this decade.  But yeah.  hey're all bad.  Jesus, what is this simplistic nonsense.  

 

You are really trying to make generalizations with a sample size of 48 over a period spanning 29 years and probably encompassing twenty+ million officers.  

And they are going to jail, except the guy that told the office to get off him, more than likely.  

This was in the middle of a riot.  You are seriously not conflating nationwide policing to actions taken during on the worst riots in modern history?

That was almost 30 years ago.  At 300+million interactions/year.....you really want to do the math?  

Okay.  So, you really want us to pull up all of the recorded instances of cops abusing citizens, and no cop stopping them?  I mean, give me a few hours tonight, and you know I'm going to longcat the FUCK out of this post.  Come on.  I can do it.  You really, really don't want me to.

I started with Rodney King to show that this is a CONTINUING problem.  

Seriously, what are the odds that out of those 48 cops, not ONE was good?  And as for "in the middle of a riot," watch the goddamned video.  There was no riot there.  There were no bottles flying or any of that shit.  The area they were in was peaceful.

And please DO raise the fact that all four of George Floyd's murderers are going to jail.  That's the point.  They are going to jail NOT because a cop reported the murder, but because members of the public saw it happening and recording it.  THAT MAKES THE POINT.  If the public hadn't recorded that, do you think the rest of the world would have even known it happened?  Or would those cops all have filed CYA reports lying about what happened.

What I love most is that you won't let go of the logical fallacy of "there's lots of times they DON'T break the law."  That's fucking amazing.  I'm serious.  Every single criminal in the world can use that defense equally well.  "I've shopped thousands of times without stealing anything -- why are you freaking out because I lifted that necklace?"  It's that stupid, and the fact that you continue to hang onto it just makes you look absurd.

48 cops.  48.  Not one good one in the bunch.  Think about what the odds must be for that to happen WITHOUT the vast majority of cops being type 2 bad cops?

[drt 637]

Correct me if I'm wrong Lou, but you can't riot from your own front porch.

[bolverk 29,392]

1 minute ago, BabaYaga said:

I'm not defending behavior in a riot.  Nor am I using it as evidence that the MAJORITY of cops are bad.  

That wasn't a riot situation, and I know you're not. But how is possible for a good cop to shoot peaceful chicks standing on their own front porch? It's kind of dark video, but it did look like the MAJORITY stopped, aimed, and fired.

[Guest Lobo]

Just now, drt said:

Correct me if I'm wrong Lou, but you can't riot from your own front porch.

I shoot at 'em in their own house, they're gonna lock me up and throw away the key.  

Yeah, let's do the same thing but with Gophers.  It is Minnesota after all .

[Brisketexan 104,534]

Just now, drt said:

Correct me if I'm wrong Lou, but you can't riot from your own front porch.

Yep.  I can post that one.  The curfew order expressly allowed people to be on their porches.  The cop shot those people, after one yelled "light em up!".....and dozens of cops saw it and....did nothing.

So, let's say that only 12 cops saw it.  We're up to 60 cops who saw bad cops and did.....nothing.  Want to keep counting?  You sure about that, Baba?

[bolverk 29,392]

2 minutes ago, drt said:

Correct me if I'm wrong Lou, but you can't riot from your own front porch.

Those cops should be arrested for assault.

[BabaYaga 15,205]

1 minute ago, bolverk said:

That wasn't a riot situation, and I know you're not. But how is possible for a good cop to shoot peaceful chicks standing on their own front porch? It's kind of dark video, but it did look like the MAJORITY stopped, aimed, and fired.

It was in the context of the riots, in a part of the city where there was no rioting but they were patrolling.  Use a battle space analogy.  They were dialed/amped up to a "ten" with guns out. 

[drt 637]

Just now, BabaYaga said:

It was in the context of the riots, in a part of the city where there was no rioting but they were patrolling.  Use a battle space analogy.  They were dialed/amped up to a "ten" with guns out. 

They're cops.  Not an occupying army.  How hard is that to draw the line between?

[Brisketexan 104,534]

Just now, BabaYaga said:

It was in the context of the riots, in a part of the city where there was no rioting but they were patrolling.  Use a battle space analogy.  They were dialed/amped up to a "ten" with guns out. 

Got it.  So, so long as the job is difficult in a particular moment, we should give them a pass for doing really bad shit.

Do you apply the same standard to pilots of a plane that has an engine fail?  Because I bet they are plenty stressed and amped up when that happens.

[bolverk 29,392]

1 minute ago, BabaYaga said:

It was in the context of the riots, in a part of the city where there was no rioting but they were patrolling.  Use a battle space analogy.  They were dialed/amped up to a "ten" with guns out. 

So it was a crime of passion then? Is that the excuse, but it was definitely a crime.

[Brisketexan 104,534]

Just now, drt said:

They're cops.  Not an occupying army.  How hard is that to draw the line between?

It's not just difficult to draw, it's UNREASONABLE for us to even try to hold them to a standard that would draw that line.

Look, when a cop is amped up, he gets to violate your rights, okay?  That's just the way it is.

[BabaYaga 15,205]

6 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

48 cops.  48.  Not one good one in the bunch.  Think about what the odds must be for that to happen WITHOUT the vast majority of cops being type 2 bad cops?

Yep.  48 cops.  Over three decades.  48.  Tens of millions of officers that have gone their entire careers without ever even drawing their weapon.  Billions of daily interactions.  48.....

[BabaYaga 15,205]

5 minutes ago, bolverk said:

So it was a crime of passion then? Is that the excuse, but it was definitely a crime.

No, no excuse - addressing the "it was not a riot" statement.  100% something they need to be accountable for.  

[Brisketexan 104,534]

7 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Yep.  48 cops.  Over three decades.  48.  Tens of millions of officers that have gone their entire careers without ever even drawing their weapon.  Billions of daily interactions.  48.....

ALL 48.  

You don't know if a cop is type 2 bad or not until he's confronted with wrongdoing in front of him.  48 cops had a chance to do the right thing.  All 48 chose not to.

Should we pull up the stories of evidence planting....the hundreds (yes, hundreds) of other videos that have happened just in the past couple of weeks?  Statistical sampling, man.  If most cops are good, we would expect these videos with other cops present showing those good cops stopping the bad cop....but we don't.  Over, and over, and over....we don't.

It's not 48 cops.  It's no a few hundred.  If we stack up all the known incidents, it's thousands upon thousands who, when duty required them to stop a crime committed by their fellow officer.....let him do it.

And again with the "billions of interactions."  Please cite for me a single rape case where it was a valid legal defense of "hey, I had sex with women hundreds of times WITH their consent!" worked.

EDIT -- guys, on one of these threads, someone posted a thread that is a collection of all of the police violence just during the last couple of weeks.  Can someone link that for us?  Baba seems to think it's just TERRIBLE bad luck that the videos we're pointing to just happen to have the cops going 0 for 60 on "cops who do the right thing."

Edited June 5, 2020 by Brisketexan

[NeverMarryAStripper 21,781]

Give it up.  You could have a video of every LEO in America doing something illegal and would still be just that one time out of all their interactions so they would be good cops 99.9% of the time.

[BabaYaga 15,205]

2 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

And again with the "billions of interactions."  Please cite for me a single rape case where it was a valid legal defense of "hey, I had sex with women hundreds of times WITH their consent!" worked.

Funny how this works for a SINGLE person, but not so much with tens of millions of DIFFERENT PEOPLE.....or what we like to call, "a profession"; where statistical incident rates are used all the fucking time.  

[AUS-97HORN 11,668]

god dammit you two   stop fucking responding to each other.   Neither of you is making a point with the other and the rest of us are forced to reread the same shit you both have been posting for the last 2 pages now.

if you want to keep this up :

and get back to the cloakroom

[Brisketexan 104,534]

Just now, BabaYaga said:

Funny how this works for a SINGLE person, but not so much with tens of millions of DIFFERENT PEOPLE.....or what we like to call, "a profession"; where statistical incident rates are used all the fucking time.  

And again, statistically, you would think that out of 60 cops in the videos we're looking at, ONE would be good.  At least ONE.  All I'm asking for is ONE.....but we don't get that.  What are the odds?  Again, what are the odds?  Just terrible bad luck, I guess.

Statistical sampling says that if what you say is true, MULTIPLE COPS in those four incidents would have stepped up.  None did.  None.

[OU Sucks 8,745]

24 minutes ago, bolverk said:

These cops marched down a quiet residential street (i.e. not a riot), unlawfully barking orders at residents to get inside their homes. When they didn't, one cop orders the others to "light 'em up."

Help me identify one good cop in this video.

 

iF tHey DiDn't wAnT tO gEt sHot aT, thEy sHoULd haVe fOlLowEd oRders!

[Brisketexan 104,534]

1 minute ago, AUS-97HORN said:

god dammit you two   stop fucking responding to each other.   Neither of you is making a point with the other and the rest of us are forced to reread the same shit you both have been posting for the last 2 pages now.

if you want to keep this up :

and get back to the cloakroom

Fair enough.  It's just fucking maddening.

[C-Man 27,023]

14 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

It was in the context of the riots, in a part of the city where there was no rioting but they were patrolling.  Use a battle space analogy.  They were dialed/amped up to a "ten" with guns out. 

It was irresponsible at the very least. I don't care that these are non-lethal rounds and charges (supposedly) you don't use them unless necessary. That wasn't necessary. The guys lighting up the dude's car in Denver with pepper bullets or whatever probably because they thought it was funny is irresponsible behavior at best. There's a guy in Dallas who was at a peaceful protest looking for his friend when he got blasted in the face with a rubber bullet. He lost an eye and had serious damage done to his face.

[Guest Lobo]

^
I've been meaning to ask you.  Is that dude in your avatar the dorky guy from "Better Call Saul" that gets involved in the underground drug trade and has to get Mike to get back his baseball cards?  

[SHOOTER12 8,787]

27 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Okay.  So, you really want us to pull up all of the recorded instances of cops abusing citizens, and no cop stopping them?  I mean, give me a few hours tonight, and you know I'm going to longcat the FUCK out of this post.  Come on.  I can do it.  You really, really don't want me to.

I started with Rodney King to show that this is a CONTINUING problem.  

Seriously, what are the odds that out of those 48 cops, not ONE was good?  And as for "in the middle of a riot," watch the goddamned video.  There was no riot there.  There were no bottles flying or any of that shit.  The area they were in was peaceful.

And please DO raise the fact that all four of George Floyd's murderers are going to jail.  That's the point.  They are going to jail NOT because a cop reported the murder, but because members of the public saw it happening and recording it.  THAT MAKES THE POINT.  If the public hadn't recorded that, do you think the rest of the world would have even known it happened?  Or would those cops all have filed CYA reports lying about what happened.

What I love most is that you won't let go of the logical fallacy of "there's lots of times they DON'T break the law."  That's fucking amazing.  I'm serious.  Every single criminal in the world can use that defense equally well.  "I've shopped thousands of times without stealing anything -- why are you freaking out because I lifted that necklace?"  It's that stupid, and the fact that you continue to hang onto it just makes you look absurd.

48 cops.  48.  Not one good one in the bunch.  Think about what the odds must be for that to happen WITHOUT the vast majority of cops being type 2 bad cops?

Do it.gif

[Fondren & Main 6,665]

Seems to me that there have been a few instances of good cops posted on this very thread via Twatter.

There was also the Sheriff's dept from Flint, Michigan.

I listened to JRE's podcast w/ Saagar and Krystal today.  Saagar brought up an interesting point about the Flint case.  Those police live in that community and were affected by the damage done by the tainted water situation.

Maybe the solution is for more of these police to live where they patrol.  I think someone brought that up already many many pages ago.  May have even been @Brisketexan.

[C-Man 27,023]

15 minutes ago, C-Man said:

It was irresponsible at the very least. I don't care that these are non-lethal rounds and charges (supposedly) you don't use them unless necessary. That wasn't necessary. The guys lighting up the dude's car in Denver with pepper bullets or whatever probably because they thought it was funny is irresponsible behavior at best. There's a guy in Dallas who was at a peaceful protest looking for his friend when he got blasted in the face with a rubber bullet. He lost an eye and had serious damage done to his face.

I don't know if he's in Better Call Saul as I'm way behind on that show. This is Colin Robinson, the energy vampire from the hilarious hit comedy show WHAT WE DO IN THE SHADOWS, which airs on FX on Wednesday nights. 😆

In a recent Colin-centric episode he referred to himself as "C-Man."

[Brisketexan 104,534]

Okay, sure, I should disengage....but this is just too rich.

Buffalo PD shoves an old man, causing serious injury.  Buffalo cop prevents another from even rendering aid.  30 other cops walk on by, letting it all happen.  Buffalo PD issues false statement that he "tripped and fell."

City of Buffalo suspends the two cops who participated.

So, what is the response of the BPD response team that was there?  You know, the cops who surely now know that they should do the right thing?  Oh, it's deliciously perfect:

Quote

BUFFALO, N.Y. (WIVB)–News 4 has learned the entire Buffalo Police Department Emergency Response Team has resigned from the team.

That’s a total of 57 officers.

We’re told this is a show of support for the officers who are suspended without pay after shoving 75-year-old Martin Gugino.

They are still employed, but no longer on ERT.

Mayor Byron Brown responded saying the city is aware of these resignations.

Here’s his full statement below:

“The City of Buffalo is aware of developments related to the work assignments of certain members of the Buffalo police force.  At this time, we can confirm that contingency plans are in place to maintain police services and ensure public safety within our community. The Buffalo police continue  to actively work with the New York State Police and other cooperating agencies.”

“If they resigned, I’m exceptionally disappointed by it because it indicates to me that they did not see anything wrong with the actions last night,” Poloncarz said after being asked about the ERT Team resigning:

Blue wall, baby.  Blue wall.

Edited June 5, 2020 by Brisketexan

[Bozo_Casanova 26,269]

Just now, Brisketexan said:

Okay, sure, I should disengage....but this is just too rich.

Buffalo PD shoves an old man, causing serious injury.  Buffalo cop prevents another from even rendering aid.  30 other cops walk on by, letting it all happen.  Buffalo PD issues false statement that he "tripped and fell."

City of Buffalo suspends the two cops who participated.

So, what is the response of the BPD response team that was there?  You know, the cops who surely now know that they should do the right thing?  Oh, it's deliciously perfect:

Blue wall, baby.  Blue wall.

Wellbye.gif

[Bruh Man 3,160]

Edited June 5, 2020 by Bruh Man

[Message Board User 12,389]

 

[NeverMarryAStripper 21,781]

9 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Okay, sure, I should disengage....but this is just too rich.

Buffalo PD shoves an old man, causing serious injury.  Buffalo cop prevents another from even rendering aid.  30 other cops walk on by, letting it all happen.  Buffalo PD issues false statement that he "tripped and fell."

City of Buffalo suspends the two cops who participated.

So, what is the response of the BPD response team that was there?  You know, the cops who surely now know that they should do the right thing?  Oh, it's deliciously perfect:

Blue wall, baby.  Blue wall.

Is that like their SWAT?  If so, good.  57 less jacked up military wannabes.

[Parliament 14,121]

1 hour ago, mdmost said:

Just a few bad apples huh? The good ones will call out the bad ones. Right?

 

So they're turning in their badges and paychecks and everything?  It's a good start.

[Message Board User 12,389]

 

[OU Sucks 8,745]

Don't know if anyone has posted an update on the douche biker in Maryland, but the MD AG is saying it's not the guy everyone was pointing to yesterday (and the police are saying it's not the ex-cop either).  But sounds like they may have the guy ID'd:

 

Edited June 5, 2020 by OU Sucks

[mdmost 42,825]

2 minutes ago, Parliament said:

So they're turning in their badges and paychecks and everything?  It's a good start.

No, they're still PD. They're just not part of the Emergency Response Team that goes out when called.

[John Lawrence 244]

10 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

Wellbye.gif

World needs plenty of bartenders.

[Brisketexan 104,534]

1 minute ago, John Lawrence said:

World needs plenty of bartenders.

Not a big fan of bartenders who will either 1) clock me over the head with a whiskey bottle for no reason, or 2) support some other asshole in the bar who does.