I'm An Alcoholic

[TwiceHorn 31471]

It really has been my observation that those who don't have a problem, even the ones that have been burned by prior recovery attempts, are supportive, while those that do are not.

[Dertyberd 394]

My experience has always been that the folks who are shitty about someone trying to get sober are folks that should be in the rooms of AA or narcissists who probably have some other mental health issue.  Normal people aren't dicks about people trying to make their life better.

Heard a small pearl last night from a speaker and came to share.  Daughter was asking her alcoholic mother if she was going to grow up to be an alcoholic.  Mother has to unfortunately say there is no way to say if you will or won't.  "You have drink to know if you have a problem, then when you do, you will try like hell not to believe it."  Never heard it put that way before, but damn if it ain't the truth.  Much love, happy days.  

[Dewey 3286]

I knew for a long time that I was an alcoholic, I never tried not believing it, but I was delusional in how I thought I controlled it. I was the better drunk so to speak, everyone knows that guy is drunk, but they have no idea I am!. Come to find out a lot of friends and family knew, probably strangers I met in passing as well.

 

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[TwiceHorn 31471]

49 minutes ago, Dertyberd said:

My experience has always been that the folks who are shitty about someone trying to get sober are folks that should be in the rooms of AA or narcissists who probably have some other mental health issue.  Normal people aren't dicks about people trying to make their life better.

Heard a small pearl last night from a speaker and came to share.  Daughter was asking her alcoholic mother if she was going to grow up to be an alcoholic.  Mother has to unfortunately say there is no way to say if you will or won't.  "You have drink to know if you have a problem, then when you do, you will try like hell not to believe it."  Never heard it put that way before, but damn if it ain't the truth.  Much love, happy days.  

That's a good one.  Over the years, I have dealt with recovering people with issues that survived recovery (often called "dual diagnosis") and some folks without addiction issues, but with mental health issues.  It seems really common for people with depression and bipolar and so on to be "treatment resistant."  That is, they don't want to take their meds or go to therapy or quit once they start.  So it isn't just our 'ism that tells us we aren't sick or don't have a problem or there's some easier way.

 

I can't imagine the heartbreak associated with watching your children struggle with addiction.  It's a main reason I don't have kids.  My drinking consumed my prime marriage and "childbearing" years and then I was skittish about relationships for a while, and then all the stories of struggling kids you hear in the rooms, plus my age, meant kids weren't in the cards for me.  Not to mention that self-centered streak I battle constantly.

Edited May 4, 2018 by TwiceHorn

[Reagan1k 3024]

I knew I was an alcoholic as well, but fancied myself as a functional alcoholic - One that could control it - imagine that - I can't not drink but I can control my drinking....fucking stupid, but that's how my alcoholic mind works.  

I decided I'd be that highly successful gentleman drunk - just sipping bourbon each night.  What I was missing is that all of those nights started at 3:00 on weekdays and 9am on the weekends.  I couldn't not drink in any setting.  I went years without a single dry day...ever.  I was 100% dependent on alcohol and scared to death to go a day without. 

I'd rationalize and compromise and compare myself to other drunks and always had a way to tell myself its not that bad. 

I too had delusions that no one else knew I was drinking.  My Sonic Route 44 cup of "tea" was always in my hand and always full of bourbon.  Little did I know it was the biggest open secret among all my friends and family.

When I finally came clean to a sober friend (turned out he was in AA and I never knew it) and said I have a problem, his reaction was very a compassionate -"no shit Sherlock".

Anyway - turns out I was delusional on all accounts - the control, the secret, the manageability.

I've received nothing but grace from those around me in the 3 years since I stopped.  If someone is uncomfortable with my not drinking I just remind myself that their opinion of me and my choices is none of my business and move on.  

Keep keeping on my friends - All we have is today to stay sober and seek to do God's will while helping others.

 

[El Diablo 4232]

3 hours ago, Dertyberd said:

My experience has always been that the folks who are shitty about someone trying to get sober are folks that should be in the rooms of AA or narcissists who probably have some other mental health issue.  Normal people aren't dicks about people trying to make their life better.

Normal people aren't usually intimately involved with drunks either. There's frequently a lot of anger in those close to the drunk. But you're right, there probably is some curious mental issue at work with those people, some need that keeps them tied to the alkie.

Young girl in my home group was talking a week or two ago and said that she had been sober for a little while (and let me preface this by saying that I don't know how many times she had tried sobriety prior) and she asked her mother what her expectations were for her. Her mothers reply? "I expect you to be a drunk and an addict". Pretty hurtful but completely understandable too.

Now in the case of the casual drinking bud, yeah, there's something else at play there most likely.

[BearSchlong 8094]

Yay tapa is working.

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[El Diablo 4232]

I recently saw a flyer for this event: August 10th-12th at the DoubleTree.

http://capitaloftexasconference.org/

[Dertyberd 394]

On 5/4/2018 at 11:07 AM, El Diablo said:

Young girl in my home group was talking a week or two ago and said that she had been sober for a little while (and let me preface this by saying that I don't know how many times she had tried sobriety prior) and she asked her mother what her expectations were for her. Her mothers reply? "I expect you to be a drunk and an addict". Pretty hurtful but completely understandable too.

 

Damn that stings, but hey, low expectations aren't horrible in recovery.  The lonely bottom is not much fun, but I've found it helps with the getting sober for myself part of the process.    

[BearSchlong 8094]

I recently saw a flyer for this event: August 10th-12th at the DoubleTree.
http://capitaloftexasconference.org/

I might have to go to that one to hear Karl M. speak. It's not like I haven't heard him 50 times before. I owe that guy so much. If you haven't heard him I recommend it. Just Google Karl M. AA speaker tape.

I'm sure the other speakers will be great also.

[Celery Man 20949]

Just checking in cause it’s been awhile. More good promises stuff for me these days. It’s incredible how much simply being balanced, even, and practiced at listening to other people gets chalked up to emotional intelligence. And how much perspective coming back from a real bottom grants you when going through shit that’s simply challenging or unpleasant.

[Dewey 3286]

I spent today inside my head, then I realized how self.centered I was being. That quickly led to an ease and calmness and realizing my problems are not that bad.

I really had no idea I was doing so, but when I'm so tired, I have to lay down mid day. Fuck.

Lots of reading and self analysis helped, it came to the rescue.

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[BearSchlong 8094]

Amen Celery and Dewey.

We focus so hard on what's wrong we can't even comprehend that most things are actually right.

My goodness we are actually so blessed!

[Dewey 3286]

Widen our perspectives, helps.

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[El Diablo 4232]

Wednesday night meeting is book study. We're on the 12th Step and I love it. It's where the rubber meets the road. If this thing didn't work for all that life throws at me I'd just go drink again or jump off a bridge.

[troph 24798]

is the "spouse of..." thread on surly yet?  figured y'all would know.

Edited May 10, 2018 by troph

[TwiceHorn 31471]

Don't believe it is.

[El Diablo 4232]

For the sake of accuracy the thread might ought to be titled "Hostages of".

[Dewey 3286]

Speaking of spouses, had a good talk with my ex, she told.me I didn't have the tools to deal with my emotions at the time I was burning everything to the ground. I told her I didn't have any tools at all, to which she reminded me that I had a sledge hammer.

Gut punch and I needed it.

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[ernest_t_bass 1196]

Serenity now.  Stressful day of dealing with people on the phone, and this disease demands answers (to my questions) NOW, DAMMIT!

[BearSchlong 8094]

I'm right there with you.  I want shit done to my specifications, right now.

[Dertyberd 394]

Strange day all around.  I am unmotivated and lost down a rabbit hole on a big project today.  Self doubt and loathing crept in for a few hours this afternoon.  Fuck it, I've made it through the work day and have a meeting tonight to celebrate 5 birthdays, 2 of which have quiet a few years in my home group.  Very happy occasion for some really good people who helped save my life.  We'll have Adam D. coming up I-35 to God's country from the Glass House FW speaking tonight.  Not sure if he's the same cat I knew from when I went to treatment down there, but he's a solid guy and can make the room dusty.  Always a pleasure to have these celebrations to look forward to after a shit day.  One more day sober is a beautiful thing.  

[BearSchlong 8094]

Man that's where I am today. . .got my manager flying in to town this morning for our regular monthly face to face and I'm just unmotivated, in self pity, negative self dialogue, and just all around bad juju.

At least I've got enough program to realize that feelings aren't fact, that fear is false events appearing real, or fuck everything and run.  My go-to strategy now is to just slow down and work on what is right in front of me.

My company merged and I've just got so much unmanageability right now in my daily work, I just need to take all the emotion and resentment out of it and do what I can do and realize the things I can't do.  I'm the director on page 60-63 and that's not working for me.  I just want to break free of my own agenda and become effective.

I was driving to work on Friday, meditating about each of the 12 steps and I got to step 3 and started laughing at the absurdity that I'll hold on to the perception that I'm in control and that it's hilarious that I have to make a decision that in effect has already been made. . .I guess like everything else if it becomes an affirmative action and "my" idea then it goes down smoother.

Anyway, y'all have a great sober week on our road to happy destiny.

[Dewey 3286]

You cannot control what happens to you in life, but you can always control what you will feel and do about what happens to you

~ Viktor Frankl

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[El Diablo 4232]

4 hours ago, Dewey said:

You cannot control what happens to you in life, but you can always control what you will feel and do about what happens to you

~ Viktor Frankl

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I disagree on the controlling what we feel. Emotions happen for a lot of internal and external reasons, many of those reasons we have no control over. If we can't control the physical world outside of us and frequently our own internal physical conditions we can't stop the resultant autoresponses that emotions are. We're pretty hardwired for certain emotional responses to a wide variety of stimuli. Now, what we do with those emotions IS entirely within our ability. But I am going to feel certain ways at times, often against my own wishes as there can be a moral component associated with those emotions. There was a little bit of discussion on this and racism in Pancho Negro's thread about white folks calling the po-po on blacks who aren't up to anything.

[BearSchlong 8094]

On 5/14/2018 at 8:47 AM, Dewey said:

You cannot control what happens to you in life, but you can always control what you will feel and do about what happens to you

~ Viktor Frankl

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I like this a lot, Man's search for meaning is one of my favorite recovery oriented books.

It all boils down to acceptance and emotional maturity.

[Dewey 3286]

It's a fascinating book, what we as alcoholics go through on a daily basis is tiny compared to what Frankl and many others went through, and to still have that self preservation is amazing.



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[Reagan1k 3024]

Yeah - Was just talking to a lady I know who has decades of good sobriety and I was telling her how I seem to slip into fear this time of year because of a seasonal thing I guess - anniversary of something upsetting in my past. 

She reminded me that our disease can manifest itself as fear just hanging around looking for something to grab on to like a parasite.  It grabs something and takes on a life of its own...building strength unless we plug in to our higher power and work to detach the two.  She said it a lot more eloquently than that but it made sense to me.  

I can't always stop fear from grabbing onto a feeling or event, but I can damn sure tap into a higher power and work to detach the two once I recognize it.  Hopefully with continue growth it is nipped in the bud more quickly each passing day.

[BearSchlong 8094]

Having a little bit of an al anon episode which shines a very bright spotlight on something that I think it's important for alcoholics to realize, and that's how many of us terrorized our families.

So many times in meetings we talk about how we stopped drinking, got relief, worked the steps, made some generally welcomed amends, and experienced the 9th step promises. Circuit speakers often emphasize in emotional detail specific wreckage they caused in their family of origin, and the dramatic gestures they made sweeping their side of the street - miraculous stories.  "It's a miracle! I once took out a second mortgage on my unsuspecting parent's house to finance my using - I paid it all back and now they trust me with a key to that very house!"

Fiance's cousin is terrorizing his family.  Alcoholic insanity, but the rest of the family keeps setting him up to fail by preventing him from hitting his bottom.  He's specifically making his 90+ yr old grandparents, his parents, his aunt and uncle, his fiance, and his 5 siblings and their mates miserable. . .someone in the family said "I've got it, we have a sober dude in the family, paging BearSchlong!!!"

Yeah I talked to the guy and he ain't ready, the insanity is strong with that one.  He's convinced that I will welcome him into my home to put him through some kind of magical boot camp and we will connect on some spiritual level and I'll return him to his family of origin all healed up.

Had a family conference call yesterday where I told the highlights of what I did to get sober. "Realized it wasn't a tremendously long run of bad luck, but rather a drinking problem.  Spent thousands of hours in AA and actual 12 step work. Continue to spend lots of time every week working with my 8 or so pigeons, dragging them from the halfway house to meetings etc., yes I love you guys too and I'm so happy to now be in the circle of trust and the token spiritually enlightened sober alcoholic in your huge coonass family, here's a link to all the meetings in and around SW LA, it's simple but hard, just go to meetings, STFU and listen."

They're fucking around with trying to impose their own will on him.  Hopefully they'll just drop him off at the homeless shelter and get a TRO to keep him away from anyone in his family.  It's hard explaining all this to someone who has the willingness and means to spend limitless money on his son's sobriety.

tl;dr - I'm laughing at myself because I'm powerless over another man's alcoholism and the very contagious soul sickness he's spread to a large family.  Grateful to be sober today.

[BearSchlong 8094]

Bumping because jesus christ addicts take hostages.

I've said my piece, get a protective order and call LEO if he shows up.

Fucker is stealing and snorting his grandmothers lexapro.

[Dewey 3286]

What were you like before you got sober?

[BearSchlong 8094]

Touche. That's what's so infuriating.

 

But I didn't snort prescription medication.

 

Yet.

[El Diablo 4232]

Yet.  Love ya man. I got a nephew that may or may not have the disease and thank God my BIL and sister won't put up with his shit. It's still killing them though, they're raising his son. Not exactly how they envisioned spending their retirement years. God bless the drunk who still suffers and those around him.

[JohnnyRage 1617]

On a lighter note. Soda Stream has saved me hundreds of dollars and counting on mineral water.

1) buy used Soda Stream machines with canister at Goodwill $5-8

2) Use a long 15/16th open-end wrench to remove head

3) Pound Dry Ice into snow, use a funnel and rod to push into container

4) ??? *

5) Play with excess dry ice, Profit!

 

*(sounds dangerous, probably isn't, might be)

Edited May 23, 2018 by JohnnyRage

[Guest]

Haven’t been to a meeting in a while, but think about the mercy and grace I’ve been given daily and it’s when I string a day or two together where I’m not fanatically grateful, I get in to some trouble.

[BearSchlong 8094]

On 5/22/2018 at 9:49 PM, El Diablo said:

Yet.  Love ya man. I got a nephew that may or may not have the disease and thank God my BIL and sister won't put up with his shit. It's still killing them though, they're raising his son. Not exactly how they envisioned spending their retirement years. God bless the drunk who still suffers and those around him.

not sure if I mentioned it but in an effort to distract everyone from his antics "my family addict" went and bought a dog - a mix between a Yorkie and a Pomeranian.  Little fucker weighs about 1.25 lbs, and that's being generous, and for once that's no hyperbole.  Now that he's been relegated to sleazy hotel rooms and his "lady" relocated to the women's shelter, guess whose rugs are getting shit on?

And now I have to shuffle my feet like I'm in stingray infested waters otherwise that little guy gets punted.

[Kennythetiger 9382]

But for the grace of God, there go you.

[El Diablo 4232]

4 hours ago, Kennythetiger said:

But for the grace of God, there go you.

Yep. Somewhere there's some poor bastard who'd be grateful for the chance to live in a house where he could punt a puppy regularly.  

[Pam Cummings 9641]

Good thread. I've been off the booze since Feb 3. My drinking led me to an incident that scared the absolute shit out of me. I realized that the drinking has either caused or made me unable to deal with a lot of problems in my life and I'd like to give it up for good. I recently started going to AA and it's been a positive experience. I haven't done the getting a chip bit because I've smoked pot since then and I don't feel like it would be an honest thing to do.

 

Anyway, the part about keeping it simple and taking it a day at a time really resonates with me. I play a lot of golf and it applies there too. And ever since I've been dry I've been a lot better at controlling myself on the course. Mistakes are made but the biggest regret you can have is not doing every single thing in your power to make sure that the next shot is a good one.

 

 I've also noticed that the amount of alcohol consumed by some of my golf buddies is pretty crazy. I was the same way. I don't say anything though, I just want myself dry and if they have any questions I at least have some resources for them.

[Dewey 3286]

Keep a calm mind, know any urge to drink is just like everything else, it comes and goes, it will not.park on your front lawn and bug you for the rest of your life, unless you let it.

Good for you

[El Diablo 4232]

18 minutes ago, Dewey said:

Keep a calm mind, know any urge to drink is just like everything else, it comes and goes, it will not.park on your front lawn and bug you for the rest of your life, unless you let it.

Good for you

This is true. It's been my experience though that it WILL hide in the bushes and wait for the day when you come out of the front door grumbling and then say "Hey little buddy! How about we have a chat, for old times sake!".  Cunning, baffling and powerful. 

[Pam Cummings 9641]

45 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

This is true. It's been my experience though that it WILL hide in the bushes and wait for the day when you come out of the front door grumbling and then say "Hey little buddy! How about we have a chat, for old times sake!".  Cunning, baffling and powerful. 

The dreams are the worst. The ones where you're drinking and you know you shouldn't be and you have all this regret and sadness over it. Then you wake up and realize it was all a dream and wonder why your stupid mind couldn't just dream about anything else. This stuff just never leaves you.

[Dewey 3286]

Alcoholic dreams usually dont fuck with me, but I had one that staid with me for 4 or 5 days, couldn't shake it. Something about going to jail that just fucks with a guy.

[Sparky 149]

I started having bad alcohol dreams (nightmares) after getting back home from rehab when I first got sober.  Never had them in rehab but when they started they were so vivid I would wake up full of regret for letting myself down and thought I had actually drank.  It would ruin my day from the start and still will when I have the random one. 

[Guest]

I suffered from those dreams too, for the first two years I’d say. Ugh

[gasman 114]

While I do agree that they suck, I really appreciate them. They let me experience the emotional consequences of going back out with out having to deal with the real ones. I am sharply reminded of exactly what will happen if I make the choice to not participate daily in this program. Truth is, most of my growth has been because pain has directed me to a different path. Some day I may be able to fear pain less and desire humility more than ever, but on most days, I fear pain. 

[BearSchlong 8094]

I need al anon.

Active addict's 89 yr old grandmother is in the hospital, largely because the addict was stealing her medications. Snorting her lexapro. (Wut really????) And giving her way more stress than she can handle.

Grandma lives in a large, very nice house where there is a detached garage and then a covered carport that is attached to the house. There is an attic above the carport with a pull down ladder.

Addict, who was banished from the house, decided that the attic "did not count as part of the house" and snuck up there to sleep (I'm chortling at addict logic because I've been there - not living in the attic logic but that totally fucked up logic about stuff - "I'm not hurting anyone!!!!11!!")

Sheriff's department had to pull him out of the attic earlier today and then tried to have him committed to a psych ward but of course he talked his way out.

Earlier tonight I told the family "if it was me I'd put an unloaded gun to his head, pull the trigger, and tell him that if he ever came around again then the next time the gun wouldn't be empty." So now they probably think I'm a psychopath.

I fucking hate addiction, probably more so because I've been relieved of the insanity and I know exactly what I am.

[JohnnyRage 1617]

My job is so physically demanding that I slept in till 12:45 P.M. I can't engage with my young son until I get my house (physical and mental) in order.

What began as a simple Amazon search for a used copy of 'A.A. Comes Of Age' has turned into a 2 hour internet wormhole:

• - Amazon Audible
• - The Belladonna Treatment
• - Ebby Thatcher
• - Rowland Hazzard III
• - Emanuel Movement
• - The Oxford Group

I never even made it to my initial tangent which was Bill Wilson's LSD experience.

It's weird how my life can be very different but so very much the same. Saturday mornings used to be my favorite. I would get started early messing with alcohol, music, and my computer. As it was then, my place is a mess and I should be doing other constructive things. But reading and education has it's place so long as I eventually get out of my own head space.

That is why I am grateful that it is Birthday Night at my home group. They do speeches in ascending month-by-month celebrations. I've given a one-year 'speech' before, so I ain't dumb enough to to stand on my soap box. But there is a casual friend that I hope shows up celebrating one year. She's still searching for happy, joyous, and free. But aren't we all?  For some of us, talking about 5, 10, 20 years of sobriety you might as well be talking about outer-space. But one year? That's something within reach and doable.

Socialization still can be a struggle both in general and around that much accrued sobriety, but it is a resource. A huge part of recovery is being humble enough to reach out to others even if just to exist in the same gathering. Plus there is free food and I can get my attendance sheet signed. Sadly comical is when needing a meeting on a Saturday night and re-convincing oneself that it is the next right thing to do...and unexpectedly walking into a birthday night celebration...FUCK!

 

If you are out there, we are here. You don't have to live in such pain and misery. Once you've crossed the Rubicon of deception it is not near the fun it once was - if it is even still fun at all. You are loved.

Edited May 26, 2018 by JohnnyRage

[TwiceHorn 31471]

18 hours ago, gasman said:

While I do agree that they suck, I really appreciate them. They let me experience the emotional consequences of going back out with out having to deal with the real ones. I am sharply reminded of exactly what will happen if I make the choice to not participate daily in this program. Truth is, most of my growth has been because pain has directed me to a different path. Some day I may be able to fear pain less and desire humility more than ever, but on most days, I fear pain. 

Very much so.  I'm 20 years in and still have them and they still freak me out, but the relief of having not actually gone out when I awaken is immense.

[El Diablo 4232]

16 minutes ago, JohnnyRage said:

My job is so physically demanding that I slept in till 12:45 P.M. I can't engage with my young son until I get my house (physical and mental) in order.

What began as a simple Amazon search for a used copy of 'A.A. Comes Of Age' has turned into a 2 hour internet wormhole:

• - Amazon Audible
• - The Belladonna Treatment
• - Ebby Thatcher
• - Rowland Hazzard III
• - Emanuel Movement
• - The Oxford Group

I never even made it to my initial tangent which was Bill Wilson's LSD experience.

It's weird how my life can be very different but so very much the same. Saturday mornings used to be my favorite. I would get started early messing with alcohol, music, and my computer. As it was then, my place is a mess and I should be doing other constructive things. But reading and education has it's place so long as I eventually get out of my own head space.

That is why I am grateful that it is Birthday Night at my home group. They do speeches in ascending month-by-month celebrations. I've given a one-year 'speech' before, so I ain't dumb enough to to stand on my soap box. But there is a casual friend that I hope shows up celebrating one year. She's still searching for happy, joyous, and free. But aren't we all?  For some of us, talking about 5, 10, 20 years of sobriety you might as well be talking about outer-space. But one year? That's something within reach and doable.

Socialization still can be a struggle both in general and around that much accrued sobriety, but it is a resource. A huge part of recovery is being humble enough to reach out to others even if just to exist in the same gathering. Plus there is free food and I can get my attendance sheet signed. Sadly comical is when needing a meeting on a Saturday night and re-convincing oneself that it is the next right thing to do...and unexpectedly walking into a birthday night celebration...FUCK!

 

If you are out there, we are here. You don't have to live in such pain and misery. Once you've crossed the Rubicon of deception it is not near the fun it once was - if it is even still fun at all. You are loved.

Damn you and your Saturdays, lol. It's like you've been secretly videotaping me. The internet wormholes, the whole thing. I didn't sleep well last night, or maybe I just didn't need much sleep, who knows? I was up at 5:30 this morning though and I've been productive ever since. Yes, the house is the usual wreck but I've had a project that has gotten my attention and I've been making progress. If you had any idea of how long it has been since I could do that you'd appreciate that I've done anything at all today. Years have gone by since I was interested in really anything. Internet wormholes was about all I COULD do and that doesn't take any real effort. I've actually got an interest in something that is going to take some time and patience to come to fruition and so far I'm sticking with it. As I have been with my diet. And there might be a female entering the picture in the near future. Not sure about that but whatever. Might be is a start. Keep coming back, y'all.