I'm An Alcoholic

[YGIFS 19449]

That's fantastic, 19 months is nothing to sneeze at.  Congratulations.  '

Like you, my mind just naturally will wander a few times a week to "what could responsible consumption look like down the road for me?"  It's just human nature ,the subconscious goes where it wants to go.  But I usually nip it in the bud and just focus on finishing out that day on a sober note and shit tends to fall into place after that.  But it's totally normal to wonder about that and limits and all that.  I've talked to guys in meetings about whether they can handle N/A beer, or communion wine, or rum cake and all I can think of is, "I'll take shit I didn't even think was an option for $300, Alex."  Biologically speaking, it would take pounds of that shit to have an "Alcohol" effect on me.  But for now, it's just try and avoid it all and maybe sort that all out down the road.  

I was probably 6-7 years of heavier-side drinking.  Not daily, not blackout, but quite frequent.  Had a big workup done before oldest was born about that time and doctor said he's not gonna tell me to quit based on numbers but that we'd likely have that conversation one day down the road.  Like you, it ramped up during Covid due to stress and ease of use.  But as I've stated, it was the severity of the withdrawals that finally woke me up.  I dunno.  Glad you're here and joining the thread.  It's helped me immensely.  

[Mikey4 2476]

2 minutes ago, YGIFS said:

That's fantastic, 19 months is nothing to sneeze at.  Congratulations.  '

Like you, my mind just naturally will wander a few times a week to "what could responsible consumption look like down the road for me?"  It's just human nature ,the subconscious goes where it wants to go.  But I usually nip it in the bud and just focus on finishing out that day on a sober note and shit tends to fall into place after that.  But it's totally normal to wonder about that and limits and all that.  I've talked to guys in meetings about whether they can handle N/A beer, or communion wine, or rum cake and all I can think of is, "I'll take shit I didn't even think was an option for $300, Alex."  Biologically speaking, it would take pounds of that shit to have an "Alcohol" effect on me.  But for now, it's just try and avoid it all and maybe sort that all out down the road.  

I was probably 6-7 years of heavier-side drinking.  Not daily, not blackout, but quite frequent.  Had a big workup done before oldest was born about that time and doctor said he's not gonna tell me to quit based on numbers but that we'd likely have that conversation one day down the road.  Like you, it ramped up during Covid due to stress and ease of use.  But as I've stated, it was the severity of the withdrawals that finally woke me up.  I dunno.  Glad you're here and joining the thread.  It's helped me immensely.  

Man, the withdrawals were bad, especially the cravings.  I don't ever want to go back there. Now, I drink N/A beer regularly. Normally one or two a day. It's not a slippery slope for me, but it makes me feel somewhat normal I guess.

[YGIFS 19449]

I've been thinking about giving N/A beer a shot, but by the time I think about it, I've already ordered a tea or whatever.  I need to find a low-THC gummy product for when I'm stressed out.  

The cravings were a funny thing for me, still are but in a different kinda way from others I talk to at meetings.  You'd read those "how to drink responsibly" articles about how if you drink again with a hangover to make it go away, you're just masking the problem.  And I would laugh to myself, "Yeah, that's the fucking point.  I don't want to deal with the hangover right now."  so there'd be some Saturdays I'd wake up and if the hangover persisted past lunch, I'd knock a few back.  And by Sunday, could soft-land the plane just fine.  And I'd stop for a week here or a month there and be okay.  But last summer, when I'd stop for multiple days, everything got weird.  and I realized that now if I was drinking to mask the shakes or nauseau or blood pressure spikes, it wasn't just a day-long band-aid, I could easily end up  hospitalized.  So the cravings weren't really so much the sitting at the open bar event, tempted to order a nice bourbon or wine and quietly slam a few while nobody is looking.  Mine was more, "I know I can't have anymore, but I gotta ween off this cheese-grater because I'm 10 minutes away from asking my wife to go to emergent care and once I ask her-that cat is outta the bag."  Those were tough battles to go through, toughest of my life.  It's what led to my bad relapse to close out 2022/open 2023.  And sure enough had horrible withdrawal symptoms that lasted days.  

As you say, "I don't ever want to go back there."  I'm doing pretty well at events (games, concerts, receptions, fundraisers where that shit flows like water).  And I'm doing well at bars and restaurants.  But it's just those shitty times when I'm alone and my "time machine" to fast forward another tough evening at home is not available to me.  Those are the cravings I guess.  /rant, thanks for listening.

[TwiceHorn 31440]

The thing about NA beer is that it almost always contains some alcohol.  Drink enough of them, you'll catch a buzz.

And, if you are the kind of alky I am, you don't want to take any chances with "buzzing" those neurological pathways, even if you don't catch a buzz.

[Chips O'Toole 1322]

Yeah, I have tried NA beers and there are some decent ones, but I don't really enjoy them all that much. What I find really hits the spot for a gameday or whatever are hoppy sparkling waters that some breweries are making. They are basically just dry hopped so you get the bubbles and the good floral hop aroma and flavor but not any of the beer and malt flavor or bitterness.  Lagunitas Hoppy Refresher is my favorite.  

My wife never liked IPAs at all, but she likes the hop waters a lot. 

[Celery Man 20933]

Closest I'm comfortable with getting is a ginger beer. and I will drink the shit out of one of those silver cans of goslings ginger beer with the little seal on it. It's got a bite, it's got a snap, it's got some spice, it's good really cold in the can, and it is definitely just a fucking soda. I have a bottle of listerine under the sink and some shaoxing wine in the pantry so I guess there's a line I'm comfortable with, but my kinda powerlessness over alcohol could not withstand a game of just the tip.

[Kennythetiger 9376]

10 hours ago, Celery Man said:

Closest I'm comfortable with getting is a ginger beer. and I will drink the shit out of one of those silver cans of goslings ginger beer with the little seal on it. It's got a bite, it's got a snap, it's got some spice, it's good really cold in the can, and it is definitely just a fucking soda. I have a bottle of listerine under the sink and some shaoxing wine in the pantry so I guess there's a line I'm comfortable with, but my kinda powerlessness over alcohol could not withstand a game of just the tip.

I like them when they’re strong enough to make my nose run and eyes water. Tried a few at restaurants but it doesn’t seem like ginger beer has the same bite there. Maybe because it’s over ice?  

[BearSchlong 8083]

Out liquor was but a symptom. So we had to get down to the underlying causes and conditions.

Just not drinking is hell on Earth.

[Reagan1k 3024]

12 hours ago, Celery Man said:

Closest I'm comfortable with getting is a ginger beer. and I will drink the shit out of one of those silver cans of goslings ginger beer with the little seal on it. It's got a bite, it's got a snap, it's got some spice, it's good really cold in the can, and it is definitely just a fucking soda. I have a bottle of listerine under the sink and some shaoxing wine in the pantry so I guess there's a line I'm comfortable with, but my kinda powerlessness over alcohol could not withstand a game of just the tip.

I don't want to fuck around and find out, either.  I'm sure there is a line I could inch toward without danger, but for me, the juice isn't worth the squeeze.

Accidentally drinking someone else's drink is nightmare fuel for me, so consciously choosing to drink or eat something that would put alcohol in my system is a non-starter for this drunk.

In my way of thinking, non-alcoholic beer is for non-alcoholics, and I've surrendered the right to dance around the edges of alcohol consumption.  Same with THC - I'm not willing to take the chance that it might alter my perception and allow me to think a drink is a good idea.  Some people might do fine on the marijuana maintenance plan, but I'm not willing to be a crash test dummy since a do-over isn't guaranteed.

[Mikey4 2476]

17 hours ago, YGIFS said:

I've been thinking about giving N/A beer a shot, but by the time I think about it, I've already ordered a tea or whatever.  I need to find a low-THC gummy product for when I'm stressed out.  

Well I'm not here to advocate anything, but for me personally, gummies were hugely helpful in dropping the alcohol. For about 2 weeks, I took one every night and timed it to kick in when the cravings would start. It mellowed me out enough that I got through it. Now I take them as needed, usually a few times a week, but I never have cravings for them. Part of the issue, I think, is that I genuinely enjoy over-consuming alcohol, whereas I do not enjoy over-consuming THC.

[Mikey4 2476]

17 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

The thing about NA beer is that it almost always contains some alcohol.  Drink enough of them, you'll catch a buzz.

And, if you are the kind of alky I am, you don't want to take any chances with "buzzing" those neurological pathways, even if you don't catch a buzz.

Totally get it. It's funny how different things affect people differently. I've been drinking NA beers for long enough to know that they're safe for me. I drink 1 or 2 and don't feel a thing, but they help me fit in for social situations.

[Kennythetiger 9376]

2 minutes ago, Mikey4 said:

I genuinely enjoy over-consuming alcohol

Nice. 😊

[Mikey4 2476]

1 minute ago, Kennythetiger said:

Nice. 😊

I guess I'm in good company, lol

[Celery Man 20933]

8 hours ago, Kennythetiger said:

I like them when they’re strong enough to make my nose run and eyes water. Tried a few at restaurants but it doesn’t seem like ginger beer has the same bite there. Maybe because it’s over ice?  

i'm so goddamn irritated with the nearby Wegmans that carries Vernors 12 packs, diet Vernors in 2L bottles, but won't carry Diet Vernors 12 packs despite my pledge to buy two a week if they start. If HEB still carries them (assuming you're in Austin), give Vernors a try - it's ginger ale, but fairly spicy and a lot of flavor. It's a big thing in Detroit.

[Frank Drebin 5661]

22 hours ago, YGIFS said:

I've been thinking about giving N/A beer a shot, but by the time I think about it, I've already ordered a tea or whatever.  I need to find a low-THC gummy product for when I'm stressed out.  

The cravings were a funny thing for me, still are but in a different kinda way from others I talk to at meetings.  You'd read those "how to drink responsibly" articles about how if you drink again with a hangover to make it go away, you're just masking the problem.  And I would laugh to myself, "Yeah, that's the fucking point.  I don't want to deal with the hangover right now."  so there'd be some Saturdays I'd wake up and if the hangover persisted past lunch, I'd knock a few back.  And by Sunday, could soft-land the plane just fine.  And I'd stop for a week here or a month there and be okay.  But last summer, when I'd stop for multiple days, everything got weird.  and I realized that now if I was drinking to mask the shakes or nauseau or blood pressure spikes, it wasn't just a day-long band-aid, I could easily end up  hospitalized.  So the cravings weren't really so much the sitting at the open bar event, tempted to order a nice bourbon or wine and quietly slam a few while nobody is looking.  Mine was more, "I know I can't have anymore, but I gotta ween off this cheese-grater because I'm 10 minutes away from asking my wife to go to emergent care and once I ask her-that cat is outta the bag."  Those were tough battles to go through, toughest of my life.  It's what led to my bad relapse to close out 2022/open 2023.  And sure enough had horrible withdrawal symptoms that lasted days.  

As you say, "I don't ever want to go back there."  I'm doing pretty well at events (games, concerts, receptions, fundraisers where that shit flows like water).  And I'm doing well at bars and restaurants.  But it's just those shitty times when I'm alone and my "time machine" to fast forward another tough evening at home is not available to me.  Those are the cravings I guess.  /rant, thanks for listening.

Try these

 

[hornbri 1396]

1 hour ago, Celery Man said:

i'm so goddamn irritated with the nearby Wegmans that carries Vernors 12 packs, diet Vernors in 2L bottles, but won't carry Diet Vernors 12 packs despite my pledge to buy two a week if they start. If HEB still carries them (assuming you're in Austin), give Vernors a try - it's ginger ale, but fairly spicy and a lot of flavor. It's a big thing in Detroit.

HEB does carry it in Austin, I like all the ginger ale varieties HEB carries. I am with you, I get annoyed when you can only get the 2L bottles and not the cans.

For a wild twist I get a 12 pack of Fresca! 

[Kennythetiger 9376]

9 hours ago, Mikey4 said:

I guess I'm in good company, lol

No. I enjoyed the first, second, and third. 
Everything after that was an obligation. 

[YGIFS 19449]

^

Good way to put it.  First two were actually enjoyable.  Would anticipate, savor, and nurse 'em.  After that, it was quantity in the short time I was given with little regard for taste or even bothering to mix/pour sometimes.  

[Loop 1604 227]

101 days since relapse. Recently picked up my second 3 month chip in less than a year. 

God willing, I pray it will be my last.

One day at at a time. 

Edited February 21, 2023 by Loop 1604

[YGIFS 19449]

I'm literally half-way behind you from my relapse.  I don't know the lingo for you knocking out 2 3-month stints in less than a year, but it sure as shit demonstrates something good.  You gotta "-" in your sobriety dates, but you ain't got one on your tombstone yet.  

Didn't quite make it all of January, thanks for a fucktastic start.  And February ain't over yet.  So a few folks close to me who are quite religious asked if I could go all of Lent without alcohol?  Fair question since many Catholics (I am not) I know try that.  But I just smiled and nodded.  Thinking to myself, "Motherfucka, if I could just 'plan'  to go 40 days with no drinking on a whim according to the lunar cycle, you think I'd still be white-knuckling every single fucking day, one day at a time?"  They meant well, but holy shit, if I just make the sign of the cross and will myself to 40 days sobriety, I wouldn't fucking be in A.A.  40 days is a superpower.  I'm a dude pacing around my house in an oval wondering if my latest blood pressure spike is still withdrawals or if it's me being nervous about being nervous or me being overly-critical on wanting to drink again today or just my new normal or sugar spikes from too many substitute carbs or just stress in general that I am now overly-aware of due to sobriety and not pouring denial smiles on my cranium.  But yeah, best of luck with that Fat Tuesday thing.  Holy shit, halleluajah, where's the tylenol.

[Texzilla58 4732]

HEB does carry it in Austin, I like all the ginger ale varieties HEB carries. I am with you, I get annoyed when you can only get the 2L bottles and not the cans.
For a wild twist I get a 12 pack of Fresca! 

I drink too many soft drinks and have tried switching more to tea but if you like Fresca give Squirt a try. Nice grapefruit soda, great fizz, in both diet and regular.

Sorry Pepsi I’m not ordering a Starry.

[Basil 754]

On 2/20/2023 at 7:52 AM, BearSchlong said:

Out liquor was but a symptom. So we had to get down to the underlying causes and conditions.

Just not drinking is hell on Earth.

I'm only 80-something days in and have heard this repeated at meeting but is it necessarily true?  I can't find any underlying cause or condition to my drinking.  I just like being a little bit drunk every night.  I enjoyed the last night I drank before saying adios on December 2.  

[DallasHorn26 586]

22 hours ago, Basil said:

I'm only 80-something days in and have heard this repeated at meeting but is it necessarily true?  I can't find any underlying cause or condition to my drinking.  I just like being a little bit drunk every night.  I enjoyed the last night I drank before saying adios on December 2.  

In my experience, it rings very true. I enjoyed drinking until I didn't. I reached the point where it became a necessity over luxury. Sure, I could string together brief periods of sobriety ranging anywhere from a few days to a few months, however,  I'm not one to just be able to put the plug in the jug and feel fine. Even if life is going perfect by all accounts, I'm eventually going to need relief, and until I got down to causes and conditions, that relief came from the first drink, which led to more drinks.

I didn't understand causes and conditions until I worked the steps with a sponsor. Through that process, my character defects became obvious and I learned how to build my defense against the first drink.

[BearSchlong 8083]

I'm only 80-something days in and have heard this repeated at meeting but is it necessarily true?  I can't find any underlying cause or condition to my drinking.  I just like being a little bit drunk every night.  I enjoyed the last night I drank before saying adios on December 2.  

It depends on if one buys into the disease concept, and the 12 steps as framed by the big book.

Put another way, normal people don’t seem to have a spiritual sickness that requires intense personal inventory, but I do.

[TwiceHorn 31440]

I am not aware of any particular trigger to my drinking, either.  But I do know that in my early abortive attempts at sobriety, I pretty inexplicably just fell off the wagon, and hard.  I didn't just resume drinking, I resumed getting fuckfaced.

Empirically, I don't think its the amount you drink, or the difficulty you have stopping that makes you an AA-type alcoholic.  It is trouble staying stopped, even after several months or years of abstinence.

It goes back to the notion that there are hard drinkers and AA-type alcoholics.  Both are susceptible to tolerance and withdrawal, all humans are. AA-type alkies just have a built-in maladaptive reaction to life that makes them want to be fucked up all the time, the spiritual sickness.  AA provides not only psychological tools for overcoming this reaction, but a fairly "rote," at the beginning, and ongoing program of recalibrating your thinking and your place in the world that helps ward off that ever-present desire to run away from it all.

[YGIFS 19449]

29 minutes ago, BearSchlong said:

It depends on if one buys into the disease concept, and the 12 steps as framed by the big book.

Put another way, normal people don’t seem to have a spiritual sickness that requires intense personal inventory, but I do.

Tell me you don't know any "normal" people without telling me you don't know any "normal" people.  We're all fucking diseased.  My giveaway was the bottle next to me.  But just because there's nothing in your right hand doesn't mean you don't have a spiritual sickness.  Religion, politics, smoking, drugs, booze, lottery, porn...we're a fucking cursed animal pack.  Only reason I love you fuckers is because we're trying to help one another, rest of society trying to burn one another down for their own cause.  I want to be better for me and my family, that's it.  Philanthropy and service are in my bones, a remnant from another generation I never knew that I am blessed to have occurred.  Beyond that, it's shit.  It's all shit.  They're all sick, nobody wants to take stock of themselves, and we're not better than anyone else---drunk, sober, or otherwise.  Only difference is at least we acknowledge that.  I'm not worse, better, or indifferent-I'm just human in need of a crutch.  And the crutch goes both ways, I need to help people and I need help.  Or we don't get out alive.  

[Homercles 10205]

I’ll throw in my $.02 though it seems I’m not an actual alcoholic but more of a person inclined to self medication…to which alcohol was the drug of choice for a few years.  

I can tell you where it started for me…the birth of my daughter, kiddo #2.  It wasn’t her fault, but she was a very hard baby with digestive issues that affected her sleep and she cried A LOT.  In addition I was already in grad school at the time, the added stress from not sleeping, and ultimately adjusting from ‘couple with a cute kiddo’ to ‘all hands on deck just to survive’ drove me to solace in a bottle.  

My wife made some serious comments and a semi-ultimatum, which got my attention and drove me to therapy.  There I learned I have codependent tendencies and look for self worth through others (especially my wife) too much.  I’m still that way but I’ve learned to (mostly) brush off the worst days without ‘rewarding’ myself with secret drinking.  

I still drink, so try to mostly stay away from this thread so I don’t dilute the awesomeness here, but nothing like I was and…more importantly…the reason that I drink when I choose to.  

My marriage has returned to as normal as can be with two full time working parents with two young kids, and thus my root problem was addressed.  The ‘will I / won’t I’ voice is gone, and I can enjoy a few drinks socially without ‘well I started so let’s push it’ voice urging me on…I can have a glass of wine with dinner and not keep going once we get home. 

To Twice’s point: that’s what seems to separate problem drinkers from alcoholics.  I was able to moderate after severe enough consequences.  Now I still don’t consider myself a ‘normie’ as all these thoughts are always in the back of my mind, but I’m able to work through the trials of life without considering an alcohol escape  as a ‘solution’ and having a drink isn’t a gateway to getting drunk 100% of the time…so for ME, I consider that victory over it.  Your mileage may vary.  

[closetohumping 17437]

5 minutes ago, Homercles said:

I’ll throw in my $.02 though it seems I’m not an actual alcoholic but more of a person inclined to self medication…to which alcohol was the drug of choice for a few years.  

I can tell you where it started for me…the birth of my daughter, kiddo #2.  It wasn’t her fault, but she was a very hard baby with digestive issues that affected her sleep and she cried A LOT.  In addition I was already in grad school at the time, the added stress from not sleeping, and ultimately adjusting from ‘couple with a cute kiddo’ to ‘all hands on deck just to survive’ drove me to solace in a bottle.  

My wife made some serious comments and a semi-ultimatum, which got my attention and drove me to therapy.  There I learned I have codependent tendencies and look for self worth through others (especially my wife) too much.  I’m still that way but I’ve learned to (mostly) brush off the worst days without ‘rewarding’ myself with secret drinking.  

I still drink, so try to mostly stay away from this thread so I don’t dilute the awesomeness here, but nothing like I was and…more importantly…the reason that I drink when I choose to.  

My marriage has returned to as normal as can be with two full time working parents with two young kids, and thus my root problem was addressed.  The ‘will I / won’t I’ voice is gone, and I can enjoy a few drinks socially without ‘well I started so let’s push it’ voice urging me on…I can have a glass of wine with dinner and not keep going once we get home. 

To Twice’s point: that’s what seems to separate problem drinkers from alcoholics.  I was able to moderate after severe enough consequences.  Now I still don’t consider myself a ‘normie’ as all these thoughts are always in the back of my mind, but I’m able to work through the trials of life without considering an alcohol escape  as a ‘solution’ and having a drink isn’t a gateway to getting drunk 100% of the time…so for ME, I consider that victory over it.  Your mileage may vary.  

I'm not there yet, but inching closer to just weekend moderation not binge drinking.  Though, on social gatherings, admittedly I do throw caution to the wind.  Trying...

[BearSchlong 8083]

Tell me you don't know any "normal" people without telling me you don't know any "normal" people.  We're all fucking diseased.  My giveaway was the bottle next to me.  But just because there's nothing in your right hand doesn't mean you don't have a spiritual sickness.  Religion, politics, smoking, drugs, booze, lottery, porn...we're a fucking cursed animal pack.  Only reason I love you fuckers is because we're trying to help one another, rest of society trying to burn one another down for their own cause.  I want to be better for me and my family, that's it.  Philanthropy and service are in my bones, a remnant from another generation I never knew that I am blessed to have occurred.  Beyond that, it's shit.  It's all shit.  They're all sick, nobody wants to take stock of themselves, and we're not better than anyone else---drunk, sober, or otherwise.  Only difference is at least we acknowledge that.  I'm not worse, better, or indifferent-I'm just human in need of a crutch.  And the crutch goes both ways, I need to help people and I need help.  Or we don't get out alive.  

Stay sober for a few years, and I’ll bet your perspective will change dramatically.

[TwiceHorn 31440]

18 minutes ago, BearSchlong said:

Stay sober for a few years, and I’ll bet your perspective will change dramatically.

On the one hand, he's right.  On the other, we have a special sort of sickness.

[Macanudo 12976]

Lack of success in the job hunt has me in a shitty mood these days but my year mark was earlier this month.    Still replacing alcohol with too damn much sugary food but I still feel good every morning and don't have to worry about "what I did last night".

Here's to year two.  

[YGIFS 19449]

Man, i don't know what it is about saturdays lately.  But couldn't sleep this morning, blood pressure is back up, stress is way too damn high, no appetite.  kinda hard to not cope and mask with alcohol today.  I've been bragging about how I do pretty well at events with flowing booze.  Well, I don't trust myself tonight.  Got invited to a fundraiser with open bar and one of the table hosts is a guy who's been very supportive of me but also just orders drinks for people without even thinking about it.  If I wasn't so otherwise jammed up right now, I think I could do it, but I had to back out.  Every fucking week, either my body is screaming out and the mind is fine, or vice-versa.  Talking with a sponsor later today, hopefully that'll help.   Thanks for listening,

[JohnnyRage 1617]

On 2/21/2023 at 9:00 AM, Basil said:

I can't find any underlying cause or condition to my drinking.  I just like being feeling chemically different in my brain rather than the way that I am feeling right now every night.  I enjoyed the last night I drank before saying adios on December 2.  

5 foot view, rather than the 1000 foot view.

It's not immoral or wrong to drink. Nobody wants you to not enjoy drinking, have consequences, or be one of us. But if my small rearranging of words puts an Eastern philosophical spin signaling a seeming desire for things to be different than exactly how they are now, then maybe, there is something underneath making your want to change the way you feel. Maybe what Bear says makes some sense on some notable level. Or maybe it doesn't, non of our business.

 

[YGIFS 19449]

Appreciate you folks more than you know.  Godspeed.  

[ocugolf 1214]

I'm overweight.  Like 6'5" and 320lbs on January 1, 2023.  Did the dry january thing and decided to keep going.  Cut out all cokes, sweets, and fried stuff too.  Riding the bike some, too for cardio.  Just weighed in at 287.  Being sober around drunk people is the biggest adjustment.  I certainly feel and sleep better than I have in quite a while.  

[Guest]

I have a friend that has an issue with alcohol (and has for a long time). He's going through a very rough patch right now personally. I can tell he's hitting it hard to help cope.

The first and only time I mentioned the issue to him was briefly yesterday, and in a friendly, non-judgmental way to bring it up without him getting defensive or beating himself up.

I know that any sort of change will have to come from within himself, but wondering if y'all had any insight on what a friend can do to help? I honestly feel like there's not much I can do, but it hurts to see it happening.

[BearSchlong 8083]

I'm overweight.  Like 6'5" and 320lbs on January 1, 2023.  Did the dry january thing and decided to keep going.  Cut out all cokes, sweets, and fried stuff too.  Riding the bike some, too for cardio.  Just weighed in at 287.  Being sober around drunk people is the biggest adjustment.  I certainly feel and sleep better than I have in quite a while.  

Planning a presidential run? I kid, I kid.

Just remember that when others are a drink or two in, you’re suddenly the sharpest tack in the drawer.

[BearSchlong 8083]

I have a friend that has an issue with alcohol (and has for a long time). He's going through a very rough patch right now personally. I can tell he's hitting it hard to help cope.
The first and only time I mentioned the issue to him was briefly yesterday, and in a friendly, non-judgmental way to bring it up without him getting defensive or beating himself up.

I know that any sort of change will have to come from within himself, but wondering if y'all had any insight on what a friend can do to help? I honestly feel like there's not much I can do, but it hurts to see it happening.

Don’t tiptoe around it. If you really love him, tell him the truth. “Look dude, you may not realize it but you don’t drink like a normal person, and it’s probably contributing to your other difficulties. I know a lot of people that were like that and they stopped and their lives improved. I will support you but I want you to know I care more about your life than I do your feelings.”

Let him know that he is NOT alone, and that getting help is a lot more heroic and respectable than continuing a downward slide. That’s the power move. And if he asks for help, tell him to use the googles to find a close AA meeting and just go listen. He can even make up a name if he wants to. All the cool kids are doing it. Hell, go with him as an observer, it’s usually more entertaining than Netflix, as long as what you hear there stays there.

The worst thing you can do is to modify your behavior to accommodate his drinking, or make excuses. “I thought you were an alcoholic maniac but I didn’t want to be rude” is a common sentiment that I wish people would avoid, but it’s not our polite nature to call people out.

In hindsight, I wish people would have addressed my drinking in a direct manner rather than playing it off as something else.

Just my 2 cents, YMMV.

[TwiceHorn 31440]

42 minutes ago, BearSchlong said:

Don’t tiptoe around it. If you really love him, tell him the truth. “Look dude, you may not realize it but you don’t drink like a normal person, and it’s probably contributing to your other difficulties. I know a lot of people that were like that and they stopped and their lives improved. I will support you but I want you to know I care more about your life than I do your feelings.”

Let him know that he is NOT alone, and that getting help is a lot more heroic and respectable than continuing a downward slide. That’s the power move. And if he asks for help, tell him to use the googles to find a close AA meeting and just go listen. He can even make up a name if he wants to. All the cool kids are doing it. Hell, go with him as an observer, it’s usually more entertaining than Netflix, as long as what you hear there stays there.

The worst thing you can do is to modify your behavior to accommodate his drinking, or make excuses. “I thought you were an alcoholic maniac but I didn’t want to be rude” is a common sentiment that I wish people would avoid, but it’s not our polite nature to call people out.

In hindsight, I wish people would have addressed my drinking in a direct manner rather than playing it off as something else.

Just my 2 cents, YMMV.

Stated another way, they way most addicts are compelled to find the gumption to quit, is by suffering consequences.  One of those consequences, albeit a mild one, is the judgment of friends and family.  Let em know.  Don't mince words.

Honest truth is, if they bow up and get all resentful, your friendship is probably not going to last much longer, at least at short range.

[BearSchlong 8083]

And some of the most meaningful direct amends I was able to make were to a few relatives who did their best to help me.

“Mind your own business” became “hey, I remember your gesture and even though I was a real ass at the time, I’ll always cherish your concern for my well being.”

[YGIFS 19449]

You're greeting card ideas are the fucking worst.  

[Basil 754]

5 foot view, rather than the 1000 foot view.
It's not immoral or wrong to drink. Nobody wants you to not enjoy drinking, have consequences, or be one of us. But if my small rearranging of words puts an Eastern philosophical spin signaling a seeming desire for things to be different than exactly how they are now, then maybe, there is something underneath making your want to change the way you feel. Maybe what Bear says makes some sense on some notable level. Or maybe it doesn't, non of our business.
 

Thanks for the insight. I appreciate it as I’m still trying to figure out where I stand with my drink problem. I typed out two longer responses but deleted them because I find the messaging on this subject a bit difficult.

At this point, I don’t want to drink, am not tempted to drink, don’t have triggers, do not need to “take it day by day” or need to utilize a number list because I’m having some sort of drink-related meltdown. My stress level is down from a constant 9 to a 1-2 and that alone is well worth giving up booze.

I realize I may relapse, fall into old drinking habits and be miserable again. I’ve certainly read and heard many such stories. So for now I’m just going to keep on being sober and keep on trying to figure things out. Thanks for coming to my TedTalk.

[TwiceHorn 31440]

10 minutes ago, Basil said:

Thanks for the insight. I appreciate it as I’m still trying to figure out where I stand with my drink problem. I typed out two longer responses but deleted them because I find the messaging on this subject a bit difficult.

At this point, I don’t want to drink, am not tempted to drink, don’t have triggers, do not need to “take it day by day” or need to utilize a number list because I’m having some sort of drink-related meltdown. My stress level is down from a constant 9 to a 1-2 and that alone is well worth giving up booze.

I realize I may relapse, fall into old drinking habits and be miserable again. I’ve certainly read and heard many such stories. So for now I’m just going to keep on being sober and keep on trying to figure things out. Thanks for coming to my TedTalk.

That's about all you can do, except force yourself through the steps.  Any human being alive would benefit from it, many more or less already do, sub- or fully consciously, employ many of the principles.  It's also scary as shit.

But, you may find first that the overall serenity of the past few months subsides into something much less comfortable and "itchy."  And then you may find yourself back in it, and deep.  Like as bad or worse than it's ever been, and you're not even totally sure wtf happened.  "I was so content and then blam."

Then you have a pretty good idea what to do.  And, if you're like a lot of us, you'll have to rinse and repeat a few times before you actually do it.  Field experimentation.

Hopefully not, because that field experimentation tends to pack a lifetime's worth of drinking misery into a few months or years.

Edited March 2, 2023 by TwiceHorn

[Basil 754]

Thanks - that's certainly one of the main concerns bouncing through my head.  Like all of us, I've heard and read dozens of stories of folks relapsing after significant sober periods, often time measured in years.  And I wonder what changes in their heads to make them do that?  And then I wonder how prevalent these relapses are in the population of recovering alcoholics.  I wonder if I have something like just waiting in the future for the right conditions to suddenly grow.  And then I wonder if I drank one night would I even relapse, in the sense of again losing my control over alcohol.  These types of questions confirm my hypothesis that I don't know shit.

 

[Not that Bob 735]

Gratitude. Stay for the prayer at 2:11

 

[BearSchlong 8083]

You're greeting card ideas are the fucking worst.  

Lol.

That says a lot when the best Hallmark can come up with is “happy Father’s Day, you fat, beer swilling, golf attempting, smelly fart and BO producing asshole!”

I hate greeting cards.

[BearSchlong 8083]

Thanks - that's certainly one of the main concerns bouncing through my head.  Like all of us, I've heard and read dozens of stories of folks relapsing after significant sober periods, often time measured in years.  And I wonder what changes in their heads to make them do that?  And then I wonder how prevalent these relapses are in the population of recovering alcoholics.  I wonder if I have something like just waiting in the future for the right conditions to suddenly grow.  And then I wonder if I drank one night would I even relapse, in the sense of again losing my control over alcohol.  These types of questions confirm my hypothesis that I don't know shit.
 

When you know, you know. That’s when you join the cult for real and intertwine it into your life.

[TwiceHorn 31440]

On 3/2/2023 at 9:31 AM, Basil said:

Thanks - that's certainly one of the main concerns bouncing through my head.  Like all of us, I've heard and read dozens of stories of folks relapsing after significant sober periods, often time measured in years.  And I wonder what changes in their heads to make them do that?  And then I wonder how prevalent these relapses are in the population of recovering alcoholics.  I wonder if I have something like just waiting in the future for the right conditions to suddenly grow.  And then I wonder if I drank one night would I even relapse, in the sense of again losing my control over alcohol.  These types of questions confirm my hypothesis that I don't know shit.

 

No one really does. All we seem to have is this empirical knowledge that if you work the steps and intetmalize it, you can stop worrying about these things. 

[BearSchlong 8083]

Had a guy call me last night who was in town visiting his wife who just got released into the local halfway house from TDC. I gave him some meeting info and we chatted for a bit. He had gotten my number from a guy in Austin.

His mom was a stripper, he would sleep in the car in the parking lot and she taught him how to do bumps of cocaine to wake up and go to school. At 8 years old. Now my mom definitely didn’t teach me those life skills, and tbh I was a little envious.

I woke up at 5 am to start cooking lunch for my church, because that’s the multi generational parental modeling I had. Yet that guy is my people, I love me some addicts.

I invited that dude and his lady, it would make my day if they stopped in for a BearschlongBurger, which sadly, is probably inferior to a DerkaDog.

[BearSchlong 8083]

No one really does. All we seem to have is this empirical knowledge that if you work the steps and intetmalize it, you can stop worrying about these things. 

I wonder how many times Tom Brady mentally retired and unretired before his old lady divorced him and he gave it another go and finally said “welp, I’m done”

Some go to AA, other go to the broadcast booth. #compulsions.