I'm An Alcoholic

[Dewey 3286]

The Betty Ford of the east coast, his YouTube vids were a huge part of my recovery, still are, whenever I rewatch one of them. Funny, puts it down in black and white. Drunks and sobers get a clear understanding from what he says.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

On 12/27/2018 at 1:22 PM, Kennythetiger said:

I think so, too.  I don't see how they could be the least bit enjoyable to one of us.  To each their own, though!  Whatever works.

This. This is all I meant. I don't know what's right or best for anyone else. I know I can't drink NA beer the same way I can't indulge in righteous anger or harbor minor resentments. None of that works for me.

[BBQ2Bayou 807]

I wrote about some early tests. Funeral, wedding, getting stress being around family, etc. Made it through all that without a problem,  then go have Xmas brunch with all my family at an assisted living place that does a buffet thing. One the end of each buffet table is a big pour container of OJ, I get a cup and take a big gulp, it's a fucking mimosa. Unmarked container next to the breakfast buffet for any kid or adult to self serve. 

I thought maybe it was non alcoholic sparkling wine or something because who leaves that shit out like that without a sign or employee serving it. Just took a couple minutes until I got the sweats and got irritable because my body and brain thought we were back open for business. But just that little bit of discomfort and no urge to sneak away to the store for a bottle. So a small win I guess. Maybe a big one,  I dunno. But I'm not going to reset my tracker because of it and consider today day 235 alcohol free. 

 

Hope you all had and are having a great  holiday. 

[TwiceHorn 31457]

28 minutes ago, BBQ2Bayou said:

I wrote about some early tests. Funeral, wedding, getting stress being around family, etc. Made it through all that without a problem,  then go have Xmas brunch with all my family at an assisted living place that does a buffet thing. One the end of each buffet table is a big pour container of OJ, I get a cup and take a big gulp, it's a fucking mimosa. Unmarked container next to the breakfast buffet for any kid or adult to self serve. 

I thought maybe it was non alcoholic sparkling wine or something because who leaves that shit out like that without a sign or employee serving it. Just took a couple minutes until I got the sweats and got irritable because my body and brain thought we were back open for business. But just that little bit of discomfort and no urge to sneak away to the store for a bottle. So a small win I guess. Maybe a big one,  I dunno. But I'm not going to reset my tracker because of it and consider today day 235 alcohol free. 

 

Hope you all had and are having a great  holiday. 

Yikes. I have not at least as far as I know accidentally ingested any mood altering substance besides caffeine, nicotine, and otc pain relievers during my abstinence. 

 

I am a firm believer that lighting up those pathways can be a danger even if not consciously buzzed, but really don't want to find out. 

[Dewey 3286]

My recent experience was a neighbor so proud of his cocktail making, that he sat me down and made me a virgin cocktail of his liking. So proud, he talked about how he discovered the recipe, on and on, then he gave me a cigar and started bullshiting with me. I had to ge the fuck out of there. Felt like old times and those old times arent so far away from me.

I can say I certainly miss some of it, the drinking and bullshiting and smoking... but I do remember clear as day what I was like later on, after many drinks. Thanked them for watching my dog while I was at work, said merry Christmas and took the cigar home.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

57 minutes ago, Dewey said:

My recent experience was a neighbor so proud of his cocktail making, that he sat me down and made me a virgin cocktail of his liking. So proud, he talked about how he discovered the recipe, on and on, then he gave me a cigar and started bullshiting with me. I had to ge the fuck out of there. Felt like old times and those old times arent so far away from me.

I can say I certainly miss some of it, the drinking and bullshiting and smoking... but I do remember clear as day what I was like later on, after many drinks. Thanked them for watching my dog while I was at work, said merry Christmas and took the cigar home.

Shit, I miss all of the good parts of it. But I can't get the good parts back by picking up a drink. They're gone. For this alcoholic, drinking was fun, then fun with problems, and then just problems. I don't say this as a whistling-past-the-graveyard thing, I say it because of a history of relapse. It simply can't be fun for me anymore. "I drank all the fun out m'whiskey," an old-timer will say, and he's not just tying to sound clever via cliche. He means it and I know what he means. 

This is similar to an analogy I made a few pages back, but my reminiscing positively over the happy, high times as a younger drinker is like a former high school football player deciding that his senior year was the best time of his life and showing up at his old high school on September 1 to enroll. Man, good fuckin' luck with that.

Two more thoughts-- I spend almost no time thinking about the good drinking times. As long as I'm going to meetings and staying right with my higher power, those memories don't matter to me. And, my life is immeasurably better now than it was during my drinking days, good or bad. 

[BearSchlong 8087]

Well that certainly explains a lot.

Just spent 2 hours with a sponsor, he is going to give me my 8 year chip next month. And I'm giving him his 1 year.

Words fail to describe the monumental change this man has experienced in the last 11.8 months. I've been his sponsor for about 4 years, even though he spent the years prior to 1/11/18 basically using and committing felonies.

A year ago if he called me my very first instinct would be to ask myself "what's the angle? Wheres the con? Who is he fucking over this time? What crimes are being committed?" I'd usually give him a few bucks and empty my deep freeze of leftovers for him to eat, not expecting anything other than the inevitable day I'd hear he died of organ failure. He got inexplicably released from county one time and he thought the court did him a solid. My grand sponsor called his buddy the judge to get the real story and it turns out the jail was so worried for his health that they cut him loose to avoid liability.

This man not only has been gainfully employed with a reputable company doing honest labor, but has been in sober living for almost a year. He's worked the steps and is sponsoring men. The biggest thing have been his amends. . .he showed up one day with several hundred bucks and took responsibility, and then did the same thing with the other half dozen or so AA members from whom he'd borrowed over the years.
Everytime my skepticism arises I'm confronted with the fact that he is demonstrating what it means to be a sober member of AA.

[BearSchlong 8087]

Well that certainly explains a lot.

Just spent 2 hours with a sponsor, he is going to give me my 8 year chip next month. And I'm giving him his 1 year.

Words fail to describe the monumental change this man has experienced in the last 11.8 months. I've been his sponsor for about 4 years, even though he spent the years prior to 1/11/18 basically using and committing felonies.

A year ago if he called me my very first instinct would be to ask myself "what's the angle? Wheres the con? Who is he fucking over this time? What crimes are being committed?" I'd usually give him a few bucks and empty my deep freeze of leftovers for him to eat, not expecting anything other than the inevitable day I'd hear he died of organ failure. He got inexplicably released from county one time and he thought the court did him a solid. My grand sponsor called his buddy the judge to get the real story and it turns out the jail was so worried for his health that they cut him loose to avoid liability.

This man not only has been gainfully employed with a reputable company doing honest labor, but has been in sober living for almost a year. He's worked the steps and is sponsoring men. The biggest thing have been his amends. . .he showed up one day with several hundred bucks and took responsibility, and then did the same thing with the other half dozen or so AA members from whom he'd borrowed over the years.
Everytime my skepticism arises I'm confronted with the fact that he is demonstrating what it means to be a sober member of AA.

Sponsee. Damned tapa.

Anyway, I've got a highly sensitive bullshit detector and it's just such a miracle that a man I thought devoid of honesty and integrity is my most meaningful sober relationship in 2018.

[pch 1259]

Just got back from Sundance Square ringing in the new year.  Nice band playing big band music and energetic crowd.  Finished my first Topo with Lime for the new year and am going to bed and wake up with the same sobriety date I went to bed with-the #1 resolution I commit to every year for the past twenty.  Will be at the 7am to start the day off right and focus on what I can do to help the alcoholic who still suffers in the days ahead.  Thanks for being here for me-without help, it is too much for us.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

waking up on New Year's Day and knowing what year it is without having to think about it is pretty cool

[BBQ2Bayou 807]

First no hangover new year day for me in probably 25 years and I didn't even like going out nye when I was drinking, but I sure did love watching all the stuff on TV by myself with a bottle. It's amazing how many little excuses we can come up with to get drunk and that was always a great one and then as life mattered less from going through it drunk, there was no need for excuses, but you still try to use them with yourself for no sensible reason. 

Time to hit 2019 full speed and feeling good. 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13511]

I’m an adult child of a recovering (right term?) alcoholic so I like to read your stories to understand more about the disease.   Trust me that everyone in your life likes and loves you so much more when you’re sober.  

Im naturally a tough love type of person.  When I see someone with self destructive behavior, I will eventually tell them what I’m seeing but I won’t continue to be around to see them if they don’t change.   Lost relationships over it but it’s their fault not mine.

[El Diablo 4232]

^^^Being around active alcoholics requires firm boundaries that each individual has to set for their own peace of mind. And consequences for the alcoholic are the only thing that I know of that can provide the impetus for change.

Glad to hear you have a sober parent and Happy New Year!

[XYZ 2154]

Has anybody here tried ibogaine-assisted therapy to treat alcohol addiction?

[Celery Man 20942]

Happy New Years you bastids. It’s fun to have a variety of choices for a resolution.

[Reagan1k 3024]

2 hours ago, XYZ said:

Has anybody here tried ibogaine-assisted therapy to treat alcohol addiction?

From what I’ve read it can help break the mental obsession for alcohol/drugs in the short term but long term relapse rates are incredibly high because nothing else changes.  

To me it sounds like a way to manage withdrawals rather than treat the disease.

It doesn’t change the allergy nor reverse the alcoholic condition where once the man takes a drink,  the drink starts drinking.  

[XYZ 2154]

39 minutes ago, Reagan1k said:

From what I’ve read it can help break the mental obsession for alcohol/drugs in the short term but long term relapse rates are incredibly high because nothing else changes.  

To me it sounds like a way to manage withdrawals rather than treat the disease.

It doesn’t change the allergy nor reverse the alcoholic condition where once the man takes a drink,  the drink starts drinking.  

Thanks. What do you mean by “the allergy”?

[Reagan1k 3024]

An allergy is a chronic condition involving an abnormal reaction to an ordinary substance.  (Cedar, shellfish, or in my case alcohol)

If you are an alcoholic like me, when we drink we have an allergic reaction a normal drinker will not experience.  

Normal drinkers can take a drink or 2 or 4 but then leave it alone without a second thought.  They have what they want and are done/satisfied. 

I develop the phenomenon of craving-  I have an allergic reaction that makes my body and mind crave more and more, even if I set out to only have one drink.  Once I start I can’t control how much I drink, or if I am “controlling it” I am miserable, restless, and discontent because I’m denying my body/mind what the allergy causes it to crave.... more alcohol. 

Ibogaine can’t fix that and make me a normal drinker.   I’m a pickle and can’t turn back into a cucumber.

[JohnnyRage 1617]

'Allergy' was a a lazy medical catch-all 100 years ago for the cycle of addiction.

I'm in pain and realize that I'm asking for more.

 

 

[TwiceHorn 31457]

Addiction is a weird combination of physiological and psychological (we are also beginning to understand that psychological factors of all kinds may be more physiological than ever previously thought) factors that make certain people react badly to addictive substances.  To date, there is no medication known to man that can address the combination of things. All of the known meds address a small facet of the problem. 

 

At the time of the creation of AA and the writing of the big book, the condition was described as "an allergy of the body and an obsession of the mind."  I think it remains fairly apt. 

I have been sober for 21 years, in that time, at least half a dozen miracle drugs have come and gone. The only one that has some limited utility is naltrexone.  Ibogaine sounds like quackery and dangerous to boot. 

Edited January 2, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[BearSchlong 8087]

3 hours ago, XYZ said:

Thanks. What do you mean by “the allergy”?

Twice, Johnny, and Reagan pretty much nailed it - but here's how we came to this understanding.  Twice and I usually agree but true to our personalities we describe things differently. (he's more analytical than me).

The book "Alcoholics Anonymous" is, by overwhelming consensus, recovery's most important and impactful volume.  It starts out with some observations by Dr. William Silkworth, a physician who worked in a NY hospital specializing in alcoholic treatment.

He was the first to describe alcoholism as an "allergy," i.e. a substance causing an abnormal response.  The "allergy" is interchangable with the "Phenomenon of craving" as described in the following:

Quote

 

WE OF Alcoholics Anonymous believe that the reader will be interested in the medical estimate of the plan of recovery described in this book. Convincing testimony must surely come from medical men who have had experience with the sufferings of our members and have witnessed our return to health. A well-known doctor, chief physician at a nationally prominent hospital specializing in alcoholic and drug addiction, gave Alcoholics Anonymous this letter:

To Whom It May Concern: 
    I have specialized in the treatment of alcoholism for many years. 
    In late 1934 I attended a patient who, though he had been a competent businessman of good earning capacity, was an alcoholic of a type I had come to regard as hopeless. 
    In the course of his third treatment he acquired certain ideas concerning a possible means of recovery. As part of his rehabilitation he commenced to present his conceptions to other alcoholics, impressing upon them that they must do likewise with still others. This has become the basis of a rapidly growing fellowship of these men and their families. This man and over one hundred others appear to have recovered. 
    I personally know scores of cases who were of the type with whom other methods had failed completely. 
    These facts appear to be of extreme medical importance; because of the extraordinary possibilities of rapid growth inherent in this group they may mark a new epoch in the annals of alcoholism. These men may well have a remedy for thousands of such situations. 
    You may rely absolutely on anything they say about themselves. 
            Very truly yours, 
            William D. Silkworth, M.D.

    The physician who, at our request, gave us this letter, has been kind enough to enlarge upon his views in another statement which follows. In this statement he confirms what we who have suffered alcoholic torture must believe-that the body of the alcoholic is quite as abnormal as his mind. It did not satisfy us to be told that we could not control our drinking just because we were maladjusted to life, that we were in full flight from reality, or were outright mental defectives. These things were true to some extent, in fact, to a considerable extent with some of us. But we are sure that our bodies were sickened as well. In our belief, any picture of the alcoholic which leaves out this physical factor is incomplete. 
    The doctor's theory that we have an allergy to alcohol interests us. As laymen, our opinion as to its soundness may, of course, mean little. But as ex-problem drinkers, we can say that his explanation makes good sense. It explains many things for which we cannot otherwise account. 
    Though we work out our solution on the spiritual as well as an altruistic plane, we favor hospitalization for the alcoholic who is very jittery or befogged. More often than not, it is imperative that a man's brain be cleared before he is approached, as he has then a better chance of understanding and accepting what we have to offer.

The doctor writes:

    The subject presented in this book seems to me to be of paramount importance to those afflicted with alcoholic addiction. 
    I say this after many years’ experience as Medical Director of one of the oldest hospitals in the country treating alcoholic and drug addiction. 
    There was, therefore, a sense of real satisfaction when I was asked to contribute a few words on a subject which is covered in such masterly detail in these pages. 
    We doctors have realized for a long time that some form of moral psychology was of urgent importance to alcoholics, but its application presented difficulties beyond our conception. What with our ultra-modern standards, our scientific approach to everything, we are perhaps not well equipped to apply the powers of good that lie outside our synthetic knowledge. 
    Many years ago one of the leading contributors to this book came under our care in this hospital and while here he acquired some ideas which he put into practical application at once. 
    Later, he requested the privilege of being allowed to tell his story to other patients here and with some misgiving, we consented. The cases we have followed through have been most interesting; in fact, many of them are amazing. The unselfishness of these men as we have come to know them, the entire absence of profit motive, and their community spirit, is indeed inspiring to one who has labored long and wearily in this alcoholic field. They believe in themselves, and still more in the Power which pulls chronic alcoholics back from the gates of death. 
    Of course an alcoholic ought to be freed from his physical craving for liquor, and this often requires a definite hospital procedure, before psychological measures can be of maximum benefit. 
    We believe, and so suggested a few years ago, that the action of alcohol on these chronic alcoholics is a manifestation of an allergy; that the phenomenon of craving is limited to this class and never occurs in the average temperate drinker. These allergic types can never safely use alcohol in any form at all; and once having formed the habit and found they cannot break it, once having lost their self-confidence, their reliance upon things human, their problems pile up on them and become astonishingly difficult to solve. 
    Frothy emotional appeal seldom suffices. The message which can interest and hold these alcoholic people must have depth and weight. In nearly all cases, their ideals must be grounded in a power greater than themselves, if they are to re-create their lives. 
    If any feel that as psychiatrists directing a hospital for alcoholics we appear somewhat sentimental, let them stand with us a while on the firing line, see the tragedies, the despairing wives, the little children; let the solving of these problems become a part of their daily work, and even of their sleeping moments, and the most cynical will not wonder that we have accepted and encouraged this movement. We feel, after many years of experience, that we have found nothing which has contributed more to the rehabilitation of these men than the altruistic movement now growing up among them. 
    Men and women drink essentially because they like the effect produced by alcohol. The sensation is so elusive that, while they admit it is injurious, they cannot after a time differentiate the true from the false. To them, their alcoholic life seems the only normal one. They are restless, irritable and discontented, unless they can again experience the sense of ease and comfort which comes at once by taking a few drinks-drinks which they see others taking with impunity. After they have succumbed to the desire again, as so many do, and the phenomenon of craving develops, they pass through the well-known stages of a spree, emerging remorseful, with a firm resolution not to drink again. This is repeated over and over, and unless this person can experience an entire psychic change there is very little hope of his recovery. 
    On the other hand-and strange as this may seem to those who do not understand-once a psychic change has occurred, the very same person who seemed doomed, who had so many problems he despaired of ever solving them, suddenly finds himself easily able to control his desire for alcohol, the only effort necessary being that required to follow a few simple rules. 
    Men have cried out to me in sincere and despairing appeal: "Doctor, I cannot go on like this! I have everything to live for! I must stop, but I cannot! You must help me!" 
    Faced with this problem, if a doctor is honest with himself, he must sometimes feel his own inadequacy. Although he gives all that is in him, it often is not enough. One feels that something more than human power is needed to produce the essential psychic change. Though the aggregate of recoveries resulting from psychiatric effort is considerable, we physicians must admit we have made little impression upon the problem as a whole. Many types do not respond to the ordinary psychological approach. 
    I do not hold with those who believe that alcoholism is entirely a problem of mental control. I have had many men who had, for example, worked a period of months on some problem or business deal which was to be settled on a certain date, favorably to them. They took a drink a day or so prior to the date, and then the phenomenon of craving at once became paramount to all other interests so that the important appointment was not met. These men were not drinking to escape; they were drinking to overcome a craving beyond their mental control. 
    There are many situations which arise out of the phenomenon of craving which cause men to make the supreme sacrifice rather than continue to fight. 
    The classification of alcoholics seems most difficult, and in much detail is outside the scope of this book. There are, of course, the psychopaths who are emotionally unstable. We are all familiar with this type. They are always "going on the wagon for keeps." They are over-remorseful and make many resolutions, but never a decision. 
    There is the type of man who is unwilling to admit that he cannot take a drink. He plans various ways of drinking. He changes his brand or his environment. There is the type who always believes that after being entirely free from alcohol for a period of time he can take a drink without danger. There is the manic-depressive type, who is, perhaps, the least understood by his friends, and about whom a whole chapter could be written. 
    Then there are types entirely normal in every respect except in the effect alcohol has upon them. They are often able, intelligent, friendly people. 
    All these, and many others, have one symptom in common: they cannot start drinking without developing the phenomenon of craving. This phenomenon, as we have suggested, may be the manifestation of an allergy which differentiates these people, and sets them apart as a distinct entity. It has never been, by any treatment with which we are familiar, permanently eradicated. The only relief we have to suggest is entire abstinence. 
    This immediately precipitates us into a seething caldron of debate. Much has been written pro and con, but among physicians, the general opinion seems to be that most chronic alcoholics are doomed. 
    What is the solution? Perhaps I can best answer this by relating one of my experiences. 
    About one year prior to this experience a man was brought in to be treated for chronic alcoholism. He had but partially recovered from a gastric hemorrhage and seemed to be a case of pathological mental deterioration. He had lost everything worthwhile in life and was only living, one might say, to drink. He frankly admitted and believed that for him there was no hope. Following the elimination of alcohol, there was found to be no permanent brain injury. He accepted the plan outlined in this book. One year later he called to see me, and I experienced a very strange sensation. I knew the man by name, and partly recognized his features, but there all resemblance ended. From a trembling, despairing, nervous wreck, had emerged a man brimming over with self-reliance and contentment. I talked with him for some time, but was not able to bring myself to feel that I had known him before. To me he was a stranger, and so he left me. A long time has passed with no return to alcohol. 
    When I need a mental uplift, I often think of another case brought in by a physician prominent in New York. The patient had made his own diagnosis, and deciding his situation hopeless, had hidden in a deserted barn determined to die. He was rescued by a searching party, and, in desperate condition, brought to me. Following his physical rehabilitation, he had a talk with me in which he frankly stated he thought the treatment a waste of effort, unless I could assure him, which no one ever had, that in the future he would have the "will power" to resist the impulse to drink. 
    His alcoholic problem was so complex, and his depression so great, that we felt his only hope would be through what we then called "moral psychology," and we doubted if even that would have any effect. 
    However, he did become "sold" on the ideas contained in this book. He has not had a drink for a great many years. I see him now and then and he is as fine a specimen of manhood as one could wish to meet. 
    I earnestly advise every alcoholic to read this book through, and though perhaps he came to scoff, he may remain to pray.

Essentially, if I have a drink, I want another, and another, and another, and another, until I'm wasted, or passed out.  This isn't the normal response of most people who can have one or a few drinks but stop drinking if they begin to "feel it" - they just don't enjoy being drunk, at least on a regular basis.  In an alcoholic, the phenomenon of craving occurs once a drink is imbibed.

This goes hand in hand with the alcoholic's other great passion, that is, the "mental obsession" that the next time we drink it's going to be the most amazing experience of our lives.

For an alcoholic, time is one huge cycle between the mental obsession that it's gonna be awesome, followed by the first drink that kicks the allergy, i.e. phenomenon of craving, followed by being "dangerously anti-social" drunk, followed by a hangover, and then the full circle mental obsession that "ok last time sucked, but this time I'm going to do it right"

Eventually we get honest with ourselves and find help, or we don't and die of what is generally considered a progressive, fatal illness.

A well known AA keynote speaker summarizes the allergy as "the more I drink, the thirstier I get" - which makes total sense to me.

Edited January 2, 2019 by BearSchlong

[BearSchlong 8087]

6 hours ago, Celery Man said:

Happy New Years you bastids. It’s fun to have a variety of choices for a resolution.

You too, friend.  It's a good day to be sober, safe, and reasonably sane.

It's a hell of a lot better than NYE 2010, when my friends had to go to any lengths to prevent my arrest for drunk/disorderly/take your pick of insane alcoholic behavior.

On Sunday I shared a church pew with my friend the Police Chief and my 1st cousin the alcohol/drug crimes prosecutor - grateful that the probability of me seeing them in a professional setting is low if I only follow a few simple suggestions. Clean house, trust God, and help another Alcoholic.

Edited January 2, 2019 by BearSchlong

[Celery Man 20942]

Watched "Beautiful Boy" on Amazon Prime last night.  Steve Carrell and a pretty good actor as his addict son.  I don't think the movie really came completely together and would give it maybe a B as a movie (buoyed by the strength of the two lead performances) but it was worth watching I think.  From the perspective of a dad helpless to save his son, based on the memoirs of a writer and said son.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

When I travel sober, my suit jacket pockets are no longer wonderlands of mystery the next morning. It was different before. Where did this fantastic item come from? Wait when was I in Boston? Hmmm, I spent $600 on.... what?

[TwiceHorn 31457]

3 minutes ago, SwanderedTalent said:

When I travel sober, my suit jacket pockets are no longer wonderlands of mystery the next morning. It was different before. Where did this fantastic item come from? Wait when was I in Boston? Hmmm, I spent $600 on.... what?

So many small freedoms like that come with being sober.  Not having to kind of freak out every time you see a cop . . . the list goes on.

[Reagan1k 3024]

Whew!  I guess normal drinkers don't have "well thought out plans" about what they are going to do WHEN the DUI stop happens.

That and my recovery from mental fatigue were my 1st glimpses of freedom. 

Until I had been sober for a couple of weeks I had no concept of the mental energy I was spending each and every day to plan, hide, and execute my drinking.  I never knew how exhausting it was playing the game until I got free from it.

The obsession had become the new normal and freedom from that was incredible.  I had all this energy and free time because it wasn't being eaten up by my efforts to "manage" my drinking. 

Drinking had become a 24/7/365 job and when I retired from that career it was amazing. 

[Dewey 3286]

A year ago today, my sponsor drove my drunk ass to treatment for the second time in a 40 or 50 day span. Tomorrow, on my 1 year, I'll be driving him to the hospital so doctors can switch out his bad hip for a new one.

[El Diablo 4232]

Lots of people who aren't alcoholic could enjoy a better quality of life if they chose to give up the booze. Vast majority of folks who drink have no issues. It's poison for me.

[BearSchlong 8087]

A year ago today, my sponsor drove my drunk ass to treatment for the second time in a 40 or 50 day span. Tomorrow, on my 1 year, I'll be driving him to the hospital so doctors can switch out his bad hip for a new one.

Good man, you.

I gotta tell on myself. This really belongs in the wives thread but those folks wouldn't understand the context.

My wife has a huge resentment, actually a whole bunch of them. She chirped for an hour about a whole lot of trivial bullshit, just all kinds of self pity and fear based shit.

We go to dinner and when we get back I retreated to the couch with my video game in a deliberate attempt to detach with love and stay in my own hula hoop.

She walks in and says what ya doing, sees me on the couch, and does an about face into the bedroom hallway. I take this to mean she wants to continue griping and is miffed I'm not participating in the sickness.

So I go into the bedroom and proceed to take her inventory pretty bad. Hell, I almost threw a 12 and 12 (page 90) and a BBOAA (page 417, page 67) at her. I spin around and head across the house to my home office and start answering work emails. Not a good look for me but I needed to establish that I can't expend emotional energy on things that aren't worth wasting a precious fuck over.

About half an hour later she comes in and tells me she is sorry for being bitchy and that she is between sponsors - in fact she has her first meeting to get started on the steps with her new sponsor this upcoming weekend.

So were in the bedroom laying on top of the comforter having our usual post arguement mea culpa conversation (thank God for amends, amirite?) and she's talking about how she really needs a 4th step on some people.

I start laughing and tell her "yeah I almost called your new sponsor to beg her to fix you." How ridiculous is that?

Tone.

Seriously, I'm happy about her new sponsor, shes a double winner and a black belt alanon. Very no bullshit tell it like it is woman. She and her wife have been through just about everything and I'm excited to see how she can help my wife grow spiritually, I adore wifes last sponsor too but she is too nice.

This tale's point is that relationships are awesome when both participants work the steps and have good sponsorship. Me in AA, her in Al Anon family group. I'm unable to have healthy relationships without the steps, and the last 8 years have shown that someone like me can in fact become equipped to be a decent husband.

Shes never seen me drunk, as I'm not her qualifying alcoholic. And she doesn't have the common decency to drink like a professional, the doggone normie!

Inevitably, I'm going to have to get a new sponsor too as mine has terminal illness and I need someone who will not cosign my bullshit and will challenge me.

At this point it's all about emotional sobriety and just plain growing the hell up. Progress not perfection.

[BBQ2Bayou 807]

I'm sure this is normal, as I know drinking is terrible for people with anxiety issues, but has anyone that has stopped for an extended amount of time noticed significant changes in their anxiety, for the better? The older I got, the more intense my fear of heights became. To the point where I could barely watch someone on TV that was inside a conference room in a tall building. Just being able to see through that window, through my TV from my couch made me really uncomfortable and jumpy. I don't have any of those feelings any more. 

I was up on a rooftop hotel not long ago and I didn't have any sort of fear looking out and down. To the point where I'm actually thinking about skydiving sometime soon. I'm not sure what else I've noticed as far as anxiety is concerned, but I'm sure there are things that aren't bothering me as much, but they just aren't as pronounced to notice them. I'd be interested to hear what others have noticed with their own anxiety. 

 

247 days. 

[Celery Man 20942]

I don't think I had anything like a specific phobia diminish, but I didn't have any classic phobias anyways.

I would say I had an enormous amount of anxiety about sleeping and/or waking up.  I couldn't sleep without being drunk, it takes a certain amount of time to get drunk, if I'm drunk I'm going to need x number of hours to sleep it off, I might get too drunk, and sleep past whatever thing, I might not get drunk enough and be up all night, I might not be able to get drunk, someone might see me getting drunk, etc.  Being able to sleep is the greatest thing in the world.  I still find myself getting a little anxious about unusually early mornings, but I think that's probably normal (just has an extra oomph too it since it harkens back to the bad times).

In the end times I had a ton of anxiety related to physical dependence on alcohol.  The emotional impact of my situation but also just what was going on with my chemistry.

I do definitely not worry in the same way I used to worry about everything.  Like whatever movie trope where the 3rd grader gets a B and thinks he's ruined his life - I think I was a bit paralyzed by a lot of that kind of fear, which gave me a lot of emotional paralysis.  And now I'm like a guy at the table who pushes his last chips in and wins a big pot.  That's not a perfect analogy, but I think if I got hit by a bus tomorrow and looked down at my crushed body, I'd be thinking in terms of how good it was that I got bonus years rather than how bad it was that my life was cut short.

I think the closest I had to what you describe was that I couldn't watch medical shows.  But that was based in a fairly rational fear that I was going to very soon experience my body giving out in some dramatic fashion.

[El Diablo 4232]

The whole drinking thing was a high wire act. I was up there juggling cats, spinning plates, reciting passages from encyclopedias (backwards), standing on first one foot and then the other... So yeah, I had some anxiety associated with my drinking.

First thing I did that helped reduce my anxiety was getting off the wire. Then I put down the cats, dropped the plates from my act, stopped quoting encyclopedias, quit hopping around... It took some time.

I exercised yesterday, slept like a rock last night and now I'm up and thinking about where I want to walk to today. Both feet on the ground.

[Reagan1k 3024]

Celery and Diablo nailed it.  We don't drink in a vacuum and the depressive effects along with the anxiety of managing the high wire act (as stated above) bleed into all aspects of our lives both consciously and subconsciously.

I can't speak to a specific phobia, but I can tell you my experience is that anything I was naturally anxious about was magnified when I was drinking.

It's pretty amazing how many people who are riddled with depression and anxiety see those symptoms wane dramatically once the drink is removed.

 

[Texas St. Armadillos 1381]

Doing Dry January.  Been going well.  Noticed my sugar cravings have spiked, and I'm not a sweets guy.  Any good ideas to handle them without giving in and eliminating the potential weight loss?

[Dewey 3286]

Dont ask me, I'm known to down up to 8 reese's peanutbutter cups and a pint of icecream... after a meal.

[Reagan1k 3024]

Atkins makes some good low carb/sugar deserts that I have used.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

Stopping drinking stops the chemical processes that exacerbate the fucked up parts of your brain. Working the steps can change the thinking and eliminate the behaviors that come from the fucked up parts of your brain. 

But the only thing that cures a fucked up brain is death. That's why we stay in the program. 

[El Diablo 4232]

53 minutes ago, Reagan1k said:

Atkins makes some good low carb/sugar deserts that I have used.

My diabetic SIL always had sugar free candies around. The hard candies are pretty damn good, I couldn't really tell any difference.

[BBQ2Bayou 807]

My sugar cravings have subsided some, but they're still really strong and I was never a sweets guy either. The sugar free jolly ranchers are my go to. Werthers do the trick, too. I also chew on a lot of sugar free, fruity tasting gum. 

[TwiceHorn 31457]

18 minutes ago, BBQ2Bayou said:

My sugar cravings have subsided some, but they're still really strong and I was never a sweets guy either. The sugar free jolly ranchers are my go to. Werthers do the trick, too. I also chew on a lot of sugar free, fruity tasting gum. 

If you are not aware, careful with that stuff or you'll end up in the shart thread.

As I understand it, alcohol and sugar are metabolized the same way. Your system is primed to metabolize a lot of alcohol and bitches when it doesn't get enough. Hence the sugar cravings.

Edited January 10, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[BBQ2Bayou 807]

I've heard the horror stories. I don't throw down whole bags of sugar free jellie bellies or anything. I'm sure a flavored water or something is probably better, but I haven't really looked all that closely into the healthier way to curb the sugar cravings. I'll deal with that shit when I'm more comfortable with not drinking and have had some more time under my belt. 

[TwiceHorn 31457]

5 minutes ago, BBQ2Bayou said:

I've heard the horror stories. I don't throw down whole bags of sugar free jellie bellies or anything. I'm sure a flavored water or something is probably better, but I haven't really looked all that closely into the healthier way to curb the sugar cravings. I'll deal with that shit when I'm more comfortable with not drinking and have had some more time under my belt. 

It's just that mannitol and sorbitol, common sweeteners, are also laxatives and it can really sneak up on you.  I still have a sweet tooth 20 years later that I never had before. Moderation helps as does fruit if you find something you like and can snack on like apples or bananas.

 

And yeah, first things first, absolutely.

Edited January 10, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[gasman 114]

2 hours ago, Texas St. Armadillos said:

Doing Dry January.  Been going well.  Noticed my sugar cravings have spiked, and I'm not a sweets guy.  Any good ideas to handle them without giving in and eliminating the potential weight loss?

Quality dark chocolate 70-85% usually 1-2 squares is satisfying enough to not want to eat the whole bar. I like Theo's

[Texas St. Armadillos 1381]

Thanks for the tips, fellas.

[Reagan1k 3024]

Bingo - I could go months without having anything sweet most of my life and especially those decades when I was drunk.  When I sobered up I thought I was losing my mind once the sweet tooth kicked in.

My sponsor reminded me no one ever went to jail for eating cookies and ice cream and told me to give myself a break.  Given time, the body balances out.

I think Bear or Kyrie once suggested buying a few of those mini blizzards from DQ to keep on hand.  I've shared that advice with more than one newcomer.

[JohnnyRage 1617]

For those not fully pickled yet, in regards to sugar or cravings in general, I think the healthiest solution is to acknowledge and embrace those feelings. But don’t act upon them. 

That’s the type of restraint that I had been lacking my whole life. It started with sugar followed by short term choices, masturbation, arguing, drugs, sex, money etc.

Unable to acknowledge my desire to drink all the time and the consequences of that, I eventually trained my mind and body to suffer from a chemical and psychological imbalance that was addiction.

My recent experience with Time Restricted Eating (a shortened window of eating, the rest of the day I’m fasting) has given me some hope about not giving into some of those weaknesses and putting that energy into something more healthful.

However, I missed the window in regards to alcohol. I think consistent ‘hair of the dog’ was that jumping off point. I don’t have a time machine to go back 15 years.

[TwiceHorn 31457]

2 minutes ago, JohnnyRage said:

For those not fully pickled yet, in regards to sugar or cravings in general, I think the healthiest solution is to acknowledge and embrace those feelings. But don’t act upon them. 

That’s the type of restraint that I had been lacking my whole life. It started with sugar followed by short term choices, masturbation, arguing, drugs, sex, money etc.

Unable to acknowledge my desire to drink all the time and the consequences of that, I eventually trained my mind and body to suffer from a chemical and psychological imbalance that was addiction.

My recent experience with Time Restricted Eating (a shortened window of eating, the rest of the day I’m fasting) has given me some hope about not giving into some of those weaknesses and putting that energy into something more healthful.

However, I missed the window in regards to alcohol. I think consistent ‘hair of the dog’ was that jumping off point. I don’t have a time machine to go back 15 years.

It is very true that sugar craving and other food cravings can turn pretty easily into compulsive eating. Really, we can get compulsive and pretty fucking unhealthy about just about anything.

[BBQ2Bayou 807]

I've put on 25 pounds since I quit drinking 3000 calories a day in booze. Go figure. Funny thing is, I didn't realize it for a while because I was laid up for weeks just wearing athletic shorts with elastic and my face got skinnier than it's been since high school. Then after I recovered from a couple months of hell from detoxing and a severe case of shingles where I couldn't walk, I had to put on some big boy pants to start getting out. Those fuckers didn't even come close to fitting. 

I'm still 25 pounds over where I want to be and it seems like it's harder then ever to shed pounds no matter what I try. I don't know if my metabolism and body is just royally fucked up from all the years of alcohol abuse and then all of a sudden there's none. I hope I can start getting it to come off, but being at a weight I'm not happy with is better than being in a life I'm not happy with. 

[Celery Man 20942]

I have no idea what the sugar content is, but I (after annihilating thousands of haribo gummy bears) have settled on gin gins and chimes as my sweet tooth fix. The ginger chews, though the hard candies are also good. Spicy and sweet and last a long time if you don’t chew them. I feel like they help me stay awake during boring meetings.

[ztejas 43419]

As a still skinny youngin I've always found that skipping meals or straight up not giving into the craving of eating is one of the best ways to keep the lbs off. I mean it's really amazing what skipping lunch (or having something much lighter like a salad/smoothie) and then not giving into late night cravings will do to keeping your gut in shape. 

Then again, I'm pretty narcissistic and would rather be hungry 10 hours a day than getting rounder around the edges. To each their own. 

Also - if you are still drinking, drink smarter. Lighter beers. Clear liquor with soda. If the only sugar you put in your body is alcohol-based without any sugary mixers or calorie dense beers it can help keep your figure a bit more trim. 

And I'm def a fan of ginger chews as @Celery Man recd. That, diet sodas, gum, mints can all help.

Edited January 11, 2019 by ztejas