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Thread of Statue Removals

Hugo Stiglitz

By Hugo Stiglitz
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Chad Fuck

Chad Fuck 18092

Posted
Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, 4th&Five said:

i'll cross post this here as well...

 

Good gawd.   

Now we KNOW we have to rename them.  

Bottom line here:  There are probably ten-thousand American soldiers from across our history whom these bases could be named after who should be revered for their sacrifices to lift up America and all Americans - not just some.

The original sin of our country continues to fester via this ignoramus.  

Edited by Chad Fuck
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Bateshorn

Bateshorn 9989

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Much like putting Andrew Jackson on fiat money,  the decision to name a major armed institution  after Braxton Bragg just blows the mind.

It’s actually hilarious if you remove the context.

 

How about we start by naming a base after Chesty Puller.

Edited by Bateshorn
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Mole

Mole 4338

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1 hour ago, formermav43 said:

When I think of Winning, Victory, and Freedom, I always think of Braxton Bragg.

This is a great paragraph from Wikipedia:

Bragg is generally considered among the worst generals of the Civil War. Most of the battles in which he engaged ended in defeats. Bragg was extremely unpopular with both the men and the officers of his command, who criticized him for numerous perceived faults, including poor battlefield strategy, a quick temper, and overzealous discipline. Bragg has a generally poor reputation with historians, while some point towards the failures of Bragg's subordinates, especially Leonidas Polk, a close ally of Davis and known enemy of Bragg, as more significant factors in the many Confederate defeats at which Bragg commanded. The losses which Bragg suffered are cited as principal factors in the ultimate defeat of the Confederacy.

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Mrs Whiggins

Mrs Whiggins 13050

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People rename things all the time. Many place names across America have been changed. Many tribes prefer to be called by their original names that they used and not the Anglicized ones. Ho-Chunk Nation no longer go by Winnebago, although in Nebraska they do. At some point there has to be some understanding that the rift in our nation will continue if we do not acknowledge that many of these place names and monuments were efforts to continue the past white supremacist culture and idealize it, not honor those that lost their lives. For those, there are Confederate soldier cemeteries or perhaps museums, where such memorials belong.

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SimonBolivar

SimonBolivar 11036

Posted
Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, mdmost said:

NASCAR announced they are banning Confederate flags at their races. 

Well there goes their remaining 15 fans. I wonder how many more truck beds will be flying confederate flags in rural Texas this week? I bet it'll be in the thousands...by the way when did it becomes a thing to fly flags from the bed of your truck?

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9083

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Just now, SimonBolivar said:

Well there goes their remaining 15 fans. Also I wonder how many truck beds will be flying confederate flags in rural Texas this week. I bet it'll be in the thousands...by the way when did it becomes a thing to fly flags from the bed of your truck?

When pick up trucks started costing  $30k and more ?

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relapse98

relapse98 634

Posted
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9 hours ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

Also, apparently the Sullivan Ross (sp?) statue at Texas A&M was defaced last night and those folks are NOT happy

Yep. They were warned this would happen. The sensible thing would be to put it in a building where it can be defended much easier. Leave it out in the open, and you risk it being destroyed, dragged behind a car, dropped in a lake, etc.  Alas, people are so dug in that they can't even think straight. It's like the freaking trashy Alamo Cenotaph "I'll be damned if it moves 1 inch". To be on the defense, you have to be alert 100% of the time. To be on the offense, you just have to find 1 chink in the armor - like in the summer when all the classes are remote and most staff is still teleworking so there it literally not a soul on campus at night except for a handful. I was told Yesterday, after suggesting maybe moving it somewhere safe so it doesn't get destroyed, that "oh, there will be more of us than them, so we'll win that battle". Dumbass.

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I seem to remember a number of years ago reading an article in the paper about students there wanting to erect a statue of an African-American legislator who supported A&M and they couldn't ever raise enough money or get any support.

Matthew Gaines

I would like more information on his ties to Texas A&M. I've read the legislative record for the 12th legislature, and I know he voted for the bill that created A&M, I would like more information (that may not exist) of how involved he was, or is he being used somewhat as a 'token'. They said it would need 350k, it's raised 200k (I asked the A&M Foundation the other day). Once I get the more information, then I'll either back off of the Gaines idea or charge forward. I'm not currently sure how to get that info.

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Mrs Whiggins

Mrs Whiggins 13050

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2 minutes ago, relapse98 said:

Yep. They were warned this would happen. The sensible thing would be to put it in a building where it can be defended much easier. Leave it out in the open, and you risk it being destroyed, dragged behind a car, dropped in a lake, etc.  Alas, people are so dug in that they can't even think straight. It's like the freaking trashy Alamo Cenotaph "I'll be damned if it moves 1 inch". To be on the defense, you have to be alert 100% of the time. To be on the offense, you just have to find 1 chink in the armor - like in the summer when all the classes are remote and most staff is still teleworking so there it literally not a soul on campus at night except for a handful. I was told Yesterday, after suggesting maybe moving it somewhere safe so it doesn't get destroyed, that "oh, there will be more of us than them, so we'll win that battle". Dumbass.

Matthew Gaines

I would like more information on his ties to Texas A&M. I've read the legislative record for the 12th legislature, and I know he voted for the bill that created A&M, I would like more information (that may not exist) of how involved he was, or is he being used somewhat as a 'token'. They said it would need 350k, it's raised 200k (I asked the A&M Foundation the other day). Once I get the more information, then I'll either back off of the Gaines idea or charge forward. I'm not currently sure how to get that info.

Regarding Matthew Gaines. One of the issues for under-represented voices is that the historical record can be so spotty because....reasons. As you pointed out, that information may not exist. He might have been a real go-getter and then virtually silenced by omission other than specific historical records here and there. I'm not telling you anything you don't know already.

If those folks opposing it had donated and helped get the statue built back when the idea was first proposed then having a dedicated area with two men who worked on behalf of the school had the potential to be a slight more unifying symbol of overcoming the painful history and would have existed for a longer time than today's "ACK!!  CHANGE!! WE CAN'T HAVE CHANGE! message.

 

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StassneyHorn

StassneyHorn 6755

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21 minutes ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

Regarding Matthew Gaines. One of the issues for under-represented voices is that the historical record can be so spotty because....reasons. As you pointed out, that information may not exist. He might have been a real go-getter and then virtually silenced by omission other than specific historical records here and there. I'm not telling you anything you don't know already.

If those folks opposing it had donated and helped get the statue built back when the idea was first proposed then having a dedicated area with two men who worked on behalf of the school had the potential to be a slight more unifying symbol of overcoming the painful history and would have existed for a longer time than today's "ACK!!  CHANGE!! WE CAN'T HAVE CHANGE! message.

 

Article from ‘04

https://www.chron.com/opinion/outlook/article/Cement-an-honor-to-one-of-Texas-first-Aggies-1493236.php

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UpperWestside

UpperWestside 6263

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Posted
3 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

 

That one in Columbus Circle is definitely getting moved now. I think the city will act to remove it before protestors get a chance to do so. Remove all traces of him and his disgraceful name from that area and follow Mayor Bowser's example down here and name that circle after the BLM movement.

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Paul Wesley

Paul Wesley 3313

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8 hours ago, mdmost said:

NASCAR announced they are banning Confederate flags at their races. 

I was born in the south, grew up in the south, and I am "of" the south.  From early childhood, I heard the heritage/history arguments in favor of the Confederate flag.

But lately it occurs to me that this country isn't going to get to where it needs to be until the average southern man sees the stars and bars along the same lines as he sees Nazi flags.  They're symbols of people who fought in favor of genocide, slavery, and murder.  I don't think there's much of a distinction between the systems they represent. 

I'm kind of shocked that NASCAR (!!) would take such a step.... but it gives me hope.   

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